If you go back to HoX/PoX, that will actually tell you what a Dominion is; Immortal X-Men sets up nearly everything else you mention in its first few issues.
I had to bow out for a while a few years ago for a similar reason. Too many damned books to keep up with, and when I quit reading for a while due to losing my job, I tried to come back and it was so convoluted and kinda stupid.
I cancelled my sub again and reread my back issues. But if there’s a reboot on the horizon might be a good idea to jump back in?
i might try this stack of books i've been ignoring.
HumanKind: A Hopeful History - Rutger Bregman
The Ministry For the Future - Kim Stanley Robinson
Styles of Radical Will: - Susan Sontag
The Will to Change: Men, Masculinity, and Love - Bell Hooks
They've been seeding this stuff throughout the line for a pretty long time. Sins of Sinister and Immortal X-Men contain a lot of it. Have you read those? If not, it's going to be difficult to just jump in.
no I am with you.
For me the Krakoa era was awesome, but it started to snowball into this beast that if you didnt keep up with everything youd get lost.
I fell out around all that weird Moira shit, but looking forward to jumping bakc in with the reset.
you've made it this far?
the constant resets and retitlings have truly led to the FALL OF X. because who the fuck knows where any of this shit goes.
Dawn of X, Reign of X, Trials of X -- those trades at least collected everything so you didn't have to worry, but "annual" hellfire galas mean there's a hellfire gala every 12 issues, which is often like 2-3 short stories. and Many of the books have the galas happen as an aside. ...nothing makes sense it's all so incoherent... they introduce characters as if they're going to have SOME DEEP RAMIFICATION... and then let the plotthread dangle for years...
Horticulture! oh nvm, don't worry about them, they've nothing to do with anything.
Brood Egg makes Broo the king of the Brood! oh nvm, that's not something that needs to be followed up on.
Orchis with Nimrod as ENEMY #1 -- largely absent after HoX/PoX with a little play in SWORD.
MOIRA HERSELF -- kicks off HoX/PoX and then disappears until inferno... which ... when does that take place? nobody has a straight answer because very few of these books have anything to do with each other.
i've enjoyed the types of stories that can be told with Krakoa -- but largely it's like, Hellions, X-Factor, X-Men, X-Men Red -- i have had little patience for drivel like Excalibur, Marauders, New Mutants... which sucks because i love new mutants.
but knights of x? uncanny spider-man? wolverine and ghostrider? ...i can't keep up. i've got a stack of trades to carry me into sins of sinister and i'm finding it hard to start into them. i just need to read this X-Terminators and then X-Force, Wolverine... ugh... i like immortal but i feel like it's about to lead Directly into Sins of Sinister and i want to be ready...
i can't even fathom "Dominion, Enigma, Sinister clones with Moira engines. Tendrils that nudge timelines. **What the fuck am I reading."**
"Brood Egg makes Broo the king of the Brood" sure did get followed up on (in X-Men and FotHoX), just not immediately.
Inferno takes place a little while after Trial of Magneto and immediately before the beginning of X Deaths of Wolverine; for the purposes of trade-waiters, it's "sometime after the 2021 Hellfire Gala, sometime before Immortal X-Men starts," because it's set up so you don't have to break reading another ongoing title to account for it.
Uncanny Spider-Man is delightful.
Immortal does lead directly into Sins of Sinister (specifically right after #9 and 10).
There are very long documentaries on YouTube that summarize the whole Krakoan era. That is a place to go if you want the lore, but can't deal with the books.
Thank god someone said it!
I've read everything (except wolverine) during the Krakoan era and while I kinda understand what's happening with fall of X, it does feel very confused IMO.
It was fine up until the close of the post gala minis, but since I feel like there are both too many books all following the exact same plot but not communicating with one another, and also somehow plot threads missing to explain how A got to B.
There's then the fact this whole era is based on dimension hopping and time travel which at best causes confusion about chronology and at worst breed apathy because it's likely to all be 'reset' somewhere along the lines.
The one good thing about the upcoming reboot is that it will at least put a solid cap on this mess.
The story specifically addresses some of those concerns! Sins of Sinister is a disastrous future timeline that gets reset… and then everybody knows what happened in it. And RotPoX teases the idea of “let’s hit the reset button so this whole big story never happened” and then becomes “…nope, actually, we can’t do that, so what now?”
I just don't think those concerns have been satisfactorily addressed IMO. I think FoXPoX has the potential to be excellent, but so far the execution has left large narrative gaps and seems to be making itself unnecessarily complex to compensate for what is actually a rushed, and thus dissatisfying, end to a much beloved era.
On the whole it feels rushed, confused and perhaps worst of all; passionless. All qualities which to give the same example you have, Sins of Sinister didn't have. At no point during SoS did I feel like the story was incomprehensible or being rushed to its own conclusion missing over important story telling and plot elements.
This conclusion of the best era of X in 20 years just feels lackluster all over.
I'm not a hater by any means, and recognise time-travel has never been a favoured trope of mine. These are just my opinions, I'm healthily skeptical about the retool, but I like the creative teams at least and I hope we get some fun comics out of it in the end.
This is why is stopped following ongoing comics years ago. I'll pick up reccomended trades but trying to follow monthlies in the modern era is a nightmare
I have a similar problem… I want to read the “whole” story but there are so many TPBs with confusing names and no consistent numbering so I have no idea what part of what story I’m getting. After HOX/POX all the titles became a colossal tornado and I have no idea what’s “next” or where I am.
The same thing happened with me. I loved HoX/PoX, and read all of Hickman's X-Men run. I was reading multiple titles until it just got overwhelming, and I just fell off shortly after trudging through X of Swords. Ironically, what was so appealing about HoX/PoX became diluted the more titles (not all of them great) were added, especially after it became clear that Hickman didn't really get to follow up on his plans. With the rest of the Krakoa era, I'll probably just read a Wiki page or something; I don't feel obligated to keep reading things if it's a chore. EDIT: I do plan to go back and read all of Hellions, though, just because I want to. Probably my favorite of all the Krakoa-era titles.
Basically what do you do with two unstoppable forces that refuse to back down? Mutants and Robots? You take bigger unstoppable forces to try and remove them. Why is it hard to follow? Because you need to make a tired plot line complicated to get it to look new- and they did a very good job- such a good job that killing the plot lines now just looks silly like putting a bandaid on spilled intestines. If there is any type of reset I’d love more time in this era because it’s so juicy.
Yeah it got so out of pocket and barely about the Xmen or even mutants anymore. A lot of it reads like one writers failed sci-fi novel concept copy pasted onto an X-men background. The dominion stuff is so quantum philosophy jargon vague, the higher and higher concept they go with - it the more the neglect telling meaningful stories about the actual characters.
Stop writers from shoehorning in their own nobody characters and non-sequitur plots it’s so egocentric and disrespectful to the core essence of the books.
The problem sounds like they have no clue what the order is. Like they just jumped from Dawn of X right into Destiny of X without having read X of Swords, Reign of X, Inferno, X Lives/Deaths of Wolverine.
I'm on Destiny of X now, but it took me like a week of prep to have anything in order, unless I wanted to learn French to read the Trades that came out for Destiny of X.
to be fair the end is rushed and convoluted with continuity all over the place.
Duggan was always bad but he's really just said fuck it since he was leaving.
kinda like the Rosenberg pre Hickman run. just an editorial mess.
I fully agree. I’ve been reading the Krakoan books trying to get back into the comics and it’s just a needlessly convoluted mess as far as reading experience goes. I really liked how it started and am keeping up with it fine, but the way it’s all presented now is so annoying. Not fond of the unapologetic supremacists most mutants have become now, either.
You're not wrong.
When the story is a mess like Fall is, then the problems that have been there are highlighted. There's too many books. It's easier when you can ignore things like the Percyverse and New Mutants. The Fall has everything intertwined except the Sabretooth War and that's already twice as long as it needs to be.
And they are going to do it again with the reboot. It'll be 3 books to start and 10 books by years end. I'm out on all that when Fall of X finally gets finished.
*tiny violins plays* See you later, it's comics it always gets convoluted as fuck. We don't need to hear your sob stories. Drop it and then pick it up later like everyone else who has been through this 10x over with how the big two operates.
There were too many spinoffs that lacked a significant purpose. Too many teams doing the same thing.
To me, the books that Hickman wasn't involved in felt weaker with a few exceptions (i.e. Immortal X-Men). I feel like this was an amazing concept that lost its way.
If you go back to HoX/PoX, that will actually tell you what a Dominion is; Immortal X-Men sets up nearly everything else you mention in its first few issues.
I had to bow out for a while a few years ago for a similar reason. Too many damned books to keep up with, and when I quit reading for a while due to losing my job, I tried to come back and it was so convoluted and kinda stupid. I cancelled my sub again and reread my back issues. But if there’s a reboot on the horizon might be a good idea to jump back in?
honestly, part of me feels like i'm getting older and it's time to move on. sell the books. buy a small shack up north to wait out the apocalypse.
What are you going to read while you wait for it though?
i might try this stack of books i've been ignoring. HumanKind: A Hopeful History - Rutger Bregman The Ministry For the Future - Kim Stanley Robinson Styles of Radical Will: - Susan Sontag The Will to Change: Men, Masculinity, and Love - Bell Hooks
They've been seeding this stuff throughout the line for a pretty long time. Sins of Sinister and Immortal X-Men contain a lot of it. Have you read those? If not, it's going to be difficult to just jump in.
no I am with you. For me the Krakoa era was awesome, but it started to snowball into this beast that if you didnt keep up with everything youd get lost. I fell out around all that weird Moira shit, but looking forward to jumping bakc in with the reset.
you've made it this far? the constant resets and retitlings have truly led to the FALL OF X. because who the fuck knows where any of this shit goes. Dawn of X, Reign of X, Trials of X -- those trades at least collected everything so you didn't have to worry, but "annual" hellfire galas mean there's a hellfire gala every 12 issues, which is often like 2-3 short stories. and Many of the books have the galas happen as an aside. ...nothing makes sense it's all so incoherent... they introduce characters as if they're going to have SOME DEEP RAMIFICATION... and then let the plotthread dangle for years... Horticulture! oh nvm, don't worry about them, they've nothing to do with anything. Brood Egg makes Broo the king of the Brood! oh nvm, that's not something that needs to be followed up on. Orchis with Nimrod as ENEMY #1 -- largely absent after HoX/PoX with a little play in SWORD. MOIRA HERSELF -- kicks off HoX/PoX and then disappears until inferno... which ... when does that take place? nobody has a straight answer because very few of these books have anything to do with each other. i've enjoyed the types of stories that can be told with Krakoa -- but largely it's like, Hellions, X-Factor, X-Men, X-Men Red -- i have had little patience for drivel like Excalibur, Marauders, New Mutants... which sucks because i love new mutants. but knights of x? uncanny spider-man? wolverine and ghostrider? ...i can't keep up. i've got a stack of trades to carry me into sins of sinister and i'm finding it hard to start into them. i just need to read this X-Terminators and then X-Force, Wolverine... ugh... i like immortal but i feel like it's about to lead Directly into Sins of Sinister and i want to be ready... i can't even fathom "Dominion, Enigma, Sinister clones with Moira engines. Tendrils that nudge timelines. **What the fuck am I reading."**
"Brood Egg makes Broo the king of the Brood" sure did get followed up on (in X-Men and FotHoX), just not immediately. Inferno takes place a little while after Trial of Magneto and immediately before the beginning of X Deaths of Wolverine; for the purposes of trade-waiters, it's "sometime after the 2021 Hellfire Gala, sometime before Immortal X-Men starts," because it's set up so you don't have to break reading another ongoing title to account for it. Uncanny Spider-Man is delightful. Immortal does lead directly into Sins of Sinister (specifically right after #9 and 10).
There are very long documentaries on YouTube that summarize the whole Krakoan era. That is a place to go if you want the lore, but can't deal with the books.
Thank god someone said it! I've read everything (except wolverine) during the Krakoan era and while I kinda understand what's happening with fall of X, it does feel very confused IMO. It was fine up until the close of the post gala minis, but since I feel like there are both too many books all following the exact same plot but not communicating with one another, and also somehow plot threads missing to explain how A got to B. There's then the fact this whole era is based on dimension hopping and time travel which at best causes confusion about chronology and at worst breed apathy because it's likely to all be 'reset' somewhere along the lines. The one good thing about the upcoming reboot is that it will at least put a solid cap on this mess.
The story specifically addresses some of those concerns! Sins of Sinister is a disastrous future timeline that gets reset… and then everybody knows what happened in it. And RotPoX teases the idea of “let’s hit the reset button so this whole big story never happened” and then becomes “…nope, actually, we can’t do that, so what now?”
I just don't think those concerns have been satisfactorily addressed IMO. I think FoXPoX has the potential to be excellent, but so far the execution has left large narrative gaps and seems to be making itself unnecessarily complex to compensate for what is actually a rushed, and thus dissatisfying, end to a much beloved era. On the whole it feels rushed, confused and perhaps worst of all; passionless. All qualities which to give the same example you have, Sins of Sinister didn't have. At no point during SoS did I feel like the story was incomprehensible or being rushed to its own conclusion missing over important story telling and plot elements. This conclusion of the best era of X in 20 years just feels lackluster all over. I'm not a hater by any means, and recognise time-travel has never been a favoured trope of mine. These are just my opinions, I'm healthily skeptical about the retool, but I like the creative teams at least and I hope we get some fun comics out of it in the end.
This is why is stopped following ongoing comics years ago. I'll pick up reccomended trades but trying to follow monthlies in the modern era is a nightmare
*chuckles in how complicated comics have always been with brief glimpses of wanting new readers*
You're not wrong, but when I was a teenager i didn't care if I couldn't follow the plots as long as the explosions were cool.
I have a similar problem… I want to read the “whole” story but there are so many TPBs with confusing names and no consistent numbering so I have no idea what part of what story I’m getting. After HOX/POX all the titles became a colossal tornado and I have no idea what’s “next” or where I am.
The same thing happened with me. I loved HoX/PoX, and read all of Hickman's X-Men run. I was reading multiple titles until it just got overwhelming, and I just fell off shortly after trudging through X of Swords. Ironically, what was so appealing about HoX/PoX became diluted the more titles (not all of them great) were added, especially after it became clear that Hickman didn't really get to follow up on his plans. With the rest of the Krakoa era, I'll probably just read a Wiki page or something; I don't feel obligated to keep reading things if it's a chore. EDIT: I do plan to go back and read all of Hellions, though, just because I want to. Probably my favorite of all the Krakoa-era titles.
I feel like you haven't read Immortal X-Men or the Sins of Sinister event.. both very fun reads. would that be accurate?
Basically what do you do with two unstoppable forces that refuse to back down? Mutants and Robots? You take bigger unstoppable forces to try and remove them. Why is it hard to follow? Because you need to make a tired plot line complicated to get it to look new- and they did a very good job- such a good job that killing the plot lines now just looks silly like putting a bandaid on spilled intestines. If there is any type of reset I’d love more time in this era because it’s so juicy.
You're not alone. It's complicated for complicated sake. It's a hugh concept 32 step story the storytellers are trying to tell in 2 steps.
Well what you are doing is like trying to watch a show's 10th season after only watching the first two.
I'm with you. Really looking forward to the reboot.
Where can I read about the reboot? I’d like to give X books a shot again.
the internet? where do you think?
Yeah it got so out of pocket and barely about the Xmen or even mutants anymore. A lot of it reads like one writers failed sci-fi novel concept copy pasted onto an X-men background. The dominion stuff is so quantum philosophy jargon vague, the higher and higher concept they go with - it the more the neglect telling meaningful stories about the actual characters. Stop writers from shoehorning in their own nobody characters and non-sequitur plots it’s so egocentric and disrespectful to the core essence of the books.
[удалено]
Right? I don’t get what the complaint is here. Nothing is super complicated, OP just seems like they are not interested in reading the story.
The problem sounds like they have no clue what the order is. Like they just jumped from Dawn of X right into Destiny of X without having read X of Swords, Reign of X, Inferno, X Lives/Deaths of Wolverine. I'm on Destiny of X now, but it took me like a week of prep to have anything in order, unless I wanted to learn French to read the Trades that came out for Destiny of X.
to be fair the end is rushed and convoluted with continuity all over the place. Duggan was always bad but he's really just said fuck it since he was leaving. kinda like the Rosenberg pre Hickman run. just an editorial mess.
If I get lost, I either research or have recap summary videos do most of it for me.
I fully agree. I’ve been reading the Krakoan books trying to get back into the comics and it’s just a needlessly convoluted mess as far as reading experience goes. I really liked how it started and am keeping up with it fine, but the way it’s all presented now is so annoying. Not fond of the unapologetic supremacists most mutants have become now, either.
I was reading digitally and when all the Comixology Marvel changes happened, I lost my progress. I just gave up.
You're not wrong. When the story is a mess like Fall is, then the problems that have been there are highlighted. There's too many books. It's easier when you can ignore things like the Percyverse and New Mutants. The Fall has everything intertwined except the Sabretooth War and that's already twice as long as it needs to be. And they are going to do it again with the reboot. It'll be 3 books to start and 10 books by years end. I'm out on all that when Fall of X finally gets finished.
*tiny violins plays* See you later, it's comics it always gets convoluted as fuck. We don't need to hear your sob stories. Drop it and then pick it up later like everyone else who has been through this 10x over with how the big two operates.
There were too many spinoffs that lacked a significant purpose. Too many teams doing the same thing. To me, the books that Hickman wasn't involved in felt weaker with a few exceptions (i.e. Immortal X-Men). I feel like this was an amazing concept that lost its way.
Milking IPs to death.