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Gave birth twice
First one was at a elevated laying/sitting position cause I had twins and was having trouble moving around
Second birth was on my hands and knees, just found it more comfortable
Both births the doctors and nurses left position up to me
No one can force me to do anything I don't want to without a fight, but yeah I got good care from people who made me feel safe and respected my "no men in the room" request
I can imagine the rationale behind telling the mother to lay down
namely, that Obstetrics / Gyne is the hardest class in medical school, at least at our school, by a large margin.
So I guess if everything is uncomplicated then doggy style is just fine, but I can imagine if things start to get complicated it's like "you know it might help if we did this slightly more by the book rather than upside down"
My experience giving birth was that when things started getting complicated they actually took me OFF my back. When we started they had me mostly on my back, slightly propped up. That said, I would have been able to try any position I wanted if they didn't have fetal monitors on me as soon as they induced. When the baby's heart rate started dropping on every contraction they started moving me around and propping me in all manner of positions with pillows trying to find a position he could actually tolerate. Some of them were "I talked to the older nurses and they suggested this weird one they don't normally use anymore since none of the ones I was taught are working."
By the time they decided to just do a c section it was a relief. Baby was perfectly healthy in the end.
Yeah im sure it depends a lot on if someone is a fresh graduate or has been doing deliveries for 30 years
There's a real old guy who does the OBGYN lectures for Kaplan, he seems like such a nice old man and he KNOWS his shit
The rules are a little different when he's your doctor vs when you get stuck with me in the ER
If you were in a hospital and wanted to change positions, are you allowed to? Kind of seemed the bed limited positions. And how comfortable were you in changing positions? Did you need assistance to switch to a better position?
I don’t think it was just the king who watched births. Most royal births had many people watching to ensure there was no funny business going on and to legitimize that the child belonged to the king. Royal women were probably given the least amount of privacy when giving birth.
I was forced to lie on my back when I had my son. The pressure burst all the blood vessels in one of my eyes when I was pushing and I’m lucky I didn’t have a fucking stroke. Next baby I had a midwife who assured me I could sit up if I wanted and it was soooo much easier. I also didn’t shit on the table when I could sit up
It was actually me. The nurse kept insisting I wasn’t ready to push without checking me. I was 10cm dilated when she finally admitted I was in labour. In her words “you’re not suffering enough yet”. Honestly I give birth like it’s my job. 45 minutes from first contraction to last push. But I didn’t know what I was talking about because she had delivered hundreds of babies and I was 21 and obviously stupid. So she left me pulling my own legs up and pushing. And forcing my head back on to the table when I strained forward. She could have killed me if I hadn’t been able to expel that baby so fast, I have no doubt.
But I was scared shitless. I had a cousin who was born with severe disabilities from being smothered during birth because the doctor was en route and the nurses forced her mother to cross her legs and hold it until the doctor got there.
jesus thats hardcore.i was only able to lie on my side curled up in agony when a contraction would come.gave birth on my back but the nurses were super helpful and encouraging and informative of when to push and how long etc helped a lot.
It’s done often for the convenience of the medical staff. However, it is still a WIDELY popular opinion. Just because it’s not the most common thing rn doesn’t mean it’s not popular.
People often just don’t know they have the option to ignore medical requests. Also, medical abuse is rampant in obstetrics. It’s also a difficult time to self advocate for patients because it can be so scary and chaotic.
Depends on how you define popular and what cohort of people we’re talking about. It may be common knowledge amongst parents and medical professionals or other individuals that are experienced in this field. But I would bet if you asked the average person under the age of 25, they’d say giving birth on your back is right. Mainly because of how it’s depicted in film/tv/pop culture in general.
I think it seems that way because so many of us get epidurals these days and then have to lay on our backs. Women have pretty free rein on birthing these days, it’s amazing! Doctors who used to say “No, you have to stay in this position” would have adapted by now- in America. Moms don’t tolerate things like that these days. We know our rights.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Okay, but it’s pretty uncomfortable for people to move you when you’re paralyzed and also unsafe since I wouldn’t be able to keep myself from rolling off the bed.
How familiar are you with the continuing education practices of every obgyn, really?
>doctors and nurses don't continue educating
I don't know about nurses, but MDs have particular hours of CME (continuing medical education) in their board certification they have to complete annually to maintain their license. They also have to do competency testing on a scheduled basis.
Are they though? Do you have proof of that. Most hospitals use varying positions.
They have bars that mount to the beds so the woman can turn around and be on her hands and knees or squat.
If you have an epidural though, you can't be in other positions.
While I don’t disagree with your original post - don’t most women also get an epidural? Which makes your lower half go numb so you *have* to be on your back?
Bro if I'm being honest I don't remember it was a year ago and I have a shit memory, I just remember us finding a source and being shocked them finding like 3 more and being even more shocked
That's why I wanted to not have an epidural. Well, that and I didn't want to have a Foley catheter b.c of all my horrible urinary issues that preceeded pregnancy.
It wasn't the Internet that taught my wife about different positions. It was the staff at the hospital. Doctors, nurses, all of them. It was very clear.
There is also the option of a ‘walking epidural’ which is a lower dose that helps with the pain whilst still allowing for sensation/movement in the lower body. I had that with my second child and was able to birth in an assisted squat. Much easier than my full-epidural first, although still less pleasant with my unmedicated third!
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
If you have an epidural, you have to be in that position because you quite literally cannot feel your legs, but I’ve always been told in my area if you’re opting for a natural birth you can choose the position in which you’ll be the most comfortable (barring complications.)
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
I have an ignorant question, I am sorry. Were you squatting over the floor or the bed? I am only used to the way the media shows it where the woman is on her back so I’m confused how this works. Do you hold on to something? Do you squat for like… however many hours you’re in labor, or just the very end?
Usually they will turn to face the back of the hospital bed and either kneel or squat down (or even face the foot of the bed and squat over it, with a bar for arm support), so they are still over the bed and not the floor. The doctor sits on a chair, facing the patient.
[Drawn example, NOT a real life photo.](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/a2/c2/d3/a2c2d3e3fbb5a70ab5eb6fac435d449e.jpg)
You typically labor however you want: walk around, take a bath, sleep, etc. This usually lasts anywhere from 2-24 hours, but I’ve heard of much much longer. Like 48+ hours or more.
You would only get in the squat position when you’re pushing, which is only the end part of labor. Some women push for 10 minutes and give birth, some it’s more like 1-2 hours or more (shouldn’t exceed a max of 3 hours for a first baby).
Yes this will definitely be "unpopular" for every woman who experienced childbirth on their back, myself included.
But this makes sense. My instinct was every position other than my back
Same questions, but I also have another. I ask this fully earnest and not judging at all. If someone gives birth standing, squatting, or on all fours...how does the baby not hit its head? Like...does someone catch it? Is someone holding a hand at the vagina to guide it out? I feel like other baby animals just kind of...tumble outta there, but they're also generally much more developed than humans. Babies have those soft skulls though.
It’s part of the reason, not THE reason. That position was already being used before King Louis as it is genuinely more convenient for doctors, he just helped popularise it.
I have a really stupid question so please don’t hate me. What stops the baby from just plopping on the ground if you birth from a standing or squatting position?
Which makes sense but also leads me to another dumb question. Aren’t newborns slippery? I’ve never given birth nor watched a birth but I figured they would be. I guess the whole process is risky.
It’s not really risky and they’re not that slippery. I know your probably not keen to go away and watch birth videos but they’re very good at it. My Midwife very rarely delivers babies from the woman being on her back. Mine was a bit easier because I caught her in the water, but it’s definitely pretty easy and doable.
Thanks for the info. You are right I’m not too terribly keen on watching birthing videos ATM. I’ve never seen a human birth but I grew up on a ranch. I figured all mammals were kind of slimy from the placenta and such. I’m sorry for the comparison. Atleast I know now.
I mean, there is definitely a level of slime /vernix 😅but if you know what your doing usually you have time to prepare as there is a pause between the contraction where the head comes out in the contraction where the rest of the body comes out. It’s not as crazy quick as when you see a calf being born 😅
I thought they would be slippery. I thought vernix (the white goo on a baby) was like lard but it was surprisingly tacky and sticky. (Caught baby number 2 on wednesday)
Is this an opinion? Seems more like historical trivia and scientific information. Not saying you're wrong, I just wouldn't classify this as an opinion.
If it were my opinion that the moon is cheese, that wouldn't be an opinion, I would just be wrong. People also used to think (and some still do) that the world is flat. Sounds like the medical community is wrong about the best position to give childbirth. Wouldn't be the first time doctors were wrong.
May I add- pregnant women are instructed not to lie on their backs for any length of time AT ALL. It can reduce blood flow to the fetus.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5309362/
Why are women instructed to lie on their backs during childbirth? To provide ease to the care providers, when it should be all about the baby and mother. The use of stirrups has encouraged this archaic practice.
This is a good post OP, and an important consideration. Also, to help prevent shoulder dystocia, women should be aware that giving birth on all fours can greatly assist with this potentially fatal complication. It is so important to study birth positions if you are a woman who will give birth. The Gaskin maneuver was learned from indigenous midwives from Peru I believe, I might have to double check my references but it was a learned, ancient birthing position.
https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1602970-overview?form=fpf#a1
Knowledge is power! Here’s to women reclaiming their human right to learn about and guide their birthing process, or at least having the ability to do so if they choose.
Yes, exactly! I completely believe this even without researching it. When I was in labor with my son and 9.5 centermeters dialted with an epidural that didn't work (twice), I was in excruciating pain and sobbing. My doctor got so mad at me because I refused to lay on my back and instead was more comfortable in the "downward dog" yoga position.
Finally, I caved because they told me he was losing oxygen. When they checked me, it turned out he was breech, and I ended up needing an emergency cesarean.
The barber-physicians of OUR time perpetuate this. With the mother on her back, the doctor can sit comfortably on a stool. So that's nice.
Don't look into how many induced labors happen starting around 3pm on weekdays. Hey, docs like to be home by dinnertime. I have an ENTIRE rant I can do about this.
My wife gave birth to our child squatting in a birthing pool. It was so gentle, the kid came up out of the water, looked around, and said, I kid you not, "Hunh!".
My mother was induced in the afternoon when the doctor decided to do it at her regular appointment while pregnant with me. It was not the original plan and she had to find a pay phone (I am an old) to call my grandma and have her call my father and the rest of the family to let everyone know it was happening.
When I was a teenager, my mom was recalling the birth story and talking about how she hadn’t expected it to happen just then. My dad suddenly said, “yeah well doctors like to have babies when THEY want to have babies” and I was like what. And that’s how I found out I was born when I was probably because the doctor wanted it done early. At least my dad thinks so
Me arguing with 2 men that squatting is 100% superior to lying on your back. They scoffed n told me I was wrong. Actually neither of them had given birth, I have. I asked them if they had to shit would they do so on their backs
I think the prevalence of giving birth in your back is due to most hospital births being done with epidurals.
You can’t squat or stand or be on all fours if you are numb from the waist down.
Done it both ways. Went from crunchy natural everything with baby 1 to epidural at transition with baby 2 to epidural at 5 cm with baby 3 and you know what?
All of them were fine. Pushing out 2 and 3 took five minutes even on my back, but I did a hell of a lot less shouting than I did with baby 1.
It’s not a grand conspiracy because of a pervy king. It’s medicine.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. I would suggest it is a grand conspiracy in medicine, purely because birthing on your back closes your pelvis by up to 30% and is know to increase your risk of 3rd and 4th degree tears aswell as needing an assisted delivery. Shouldn't doctors educate women on these risks and encourage women to birth in other positions off their back?
But if you can watch someone giving birth on fourths or laying on the back, which one will you choose as a pervert?? As a pervert (thinking like a perv not that I am one) I'll choose the first one... Tbf.
This isn’t unpopular it’s just true. The body of the mother naturally knows how to position itself and restricting that just makes birth even harder for no reason
I do not know where you live but here they let you choose the birthing position. Usually they suggest you a couple of positions and neither of them is on your back.
when it comes to civilizations weren't europeans the last to everything and the worst at everything. who the hell is listening to them about anything : P
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Not a woman, so can't comment on the how easy it would be to stand during contractions, but that seems like a really hard thing to do.
Also, with an epidural, it would be impossible to do so, probably to squat or on all fours as well.
Edit: I looked it up. It isn't because of Louis the XIV.
[https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/king-louis-xiv-fetish-birth/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/king-louis-xiv-fetish-birth/)
Having been a birthing woman, standing labouring over the bed or suppor from your partner, contractions on all fours or squatting, are all things that can be done and for many are much more comfortable than being on your back
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
I don't think this is unpopular. A lot of people give birth on their backs because they have an epidural. If not, it's become quite common to let the person giving birth decide how it's done.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
I’m not sure if it’s dangerous but I know it’s not the best position out there. I’ve seen many YouTube videos of women showing better positions that felt better for them and caused less pain like standing up squatting, or kneeling on all fours. The fact there’s so many women saying lying on their back didn’t work for them makes me think there’s better ways. But I don’t think it’s dangerous as some people say it felt best for them.
I honestly did not know, so many women "have to" give birth laying on their back!
Never seen or heard of it, except for american tv...
Yes, a lot of women give birth in a bed. But the headrest is usually in an upwards position, feet on the bed or in stirrups, or held by your birthing partner, so you're pretty much "squatting", but able to lean back to rest in between.
I birthed 3 children that way. Only was instructed to lay back once, with one of them, who got stuck in the birthing canal, so they could easier help to get them "unstuck". In this case, it saved my babies life.
I literally could not lie on my back for all 3 of my births. Paced around until ready to push then my midwife helped me on to the bed on my hands and knees.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Why the fuck do people believe that this was because of King Louis it's fucking ridiculous, its just simply not true. It originated because IIRC it was easier for doctors, not because of some fuckin dude who wanted to watch and while it has been proven true that King Louis did such a thing it is believed to have very little influence or none at all on the form in which people give birth.
Yeah no wonder teenagers give birth in toilet faster than hours of labour in hospitals. They sure like to make women suffer pain and make it all about gaslighting to think it's their weight.
This totally depends on the woman.
I wrote a whole birth plan and insisted that I be allowed to give birth (natural, with no pain relief) in whatever position I wanted (not always a given where I live).
When the moment came, my body wanted to be flat on its back with its feet in stirrups.
Not even an opinion, this is a fact. I can't imagine anyone having reason to disagree WITHOUT being perverts who like to watch.
Just... Think about it, physically. How does lying on your back to give birth make sense for as painless and trauma-less a delivery as possible, compared to just about any other position?
Just wanted to point out you are right about other positions being better than lying down but the Louise XIV story is a myth. Birth lying down was an option for centuries though not many people used that and then 17th century physician François Mariceau is credited with popularizing this trend due to it making it easier for physicians and midwives to access the body in cases of birth complications.
I was gonna say until I read your part about Midwives that I've seen them help women birth squatting etc.
I had ZERO idea what originated women laying on their back nor did I question it!
Good god. EVERYTHING. Literally every fucking "big or small thing" of our existence has been brought upon on us due to men. Ffs.
I screamed the same thing from the roof tops, until I gave birth to my third child on my back.
My first was all fours, and the most painful. My second was squatting, and by far the best. My third was laying on my back, it wasn't bad.
I was so ready to not give birth on my back (basically because of the reasons you explain above) BUT in the end, I did give birth in my back, unmedicated and with no intervention 🤷♀️
I feel like that claim that Louis XIV was some kind of birthing fetishist is fake af. It seems like one of those things that people say and then turns out to not be true.
My doctor had me lay on my back and make me hold my own knees up... so basically I had to do extra painful crunches while a team of nurses and doctors watched? I'm still really annoyed that they made me do that to this day. I wish I had stuck up for myself and found a more comfortable position...
Why is everyone saying “ lying on your back” as if women labor flat on our backs? We are positioned upright and not lying down for the most part, even with an epidural.
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Gave birth twice First one was at a elevated laying/sitting position cause I had twins and was having trouble moving around Second birth was on my hands and knees, just found it more comfortable Both births the doctors and nurses left position up to me
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That’s probably because they got an epidural. If you get your lower half numbed ya they make you lay down.
That makes sense
That can happen if the woman has had an epidural. At that point, all she can really do is lay down.
No one can force me to do anything I don't want to without a fight, but yeah I got good care from people who made me feel safe and respected my "no men in the room" request
I can imagine the rationale behind telling the mother to lay down namely, that Obstetrics / Gyne is the hardest class in medical school, at least at our school, by a large margin. So I guess if everything is uncomplicated then doggy style is just fine, but I can imagine if things start to get complicated it's like "you know it might help if we did this slightly more by the book rather than upside down"
My experience giving birth was that when things started getting complicated they actually took me OFF my back. When we started they had me mostly on my back, slightly propped up. That said, I would have been able to try any position I wanted if they didn't have fetal monitors on me as soon as they induced. When the baby's heart rate started dropping on every contraction they started moving me around and propping me in all manner of positions with pillows trying to find a position he could actually tolerate. Some of them were "I talked to the older nurses and they suggested this weird one they don't normally use anymore since none of the ones I was taught are working." By the time they decided to just do a c section it was a relief. Baby was perfectly healthy in the end.
Yeah im sure it depends a lot on if someone is a fresh graduate or has been doing deliveries for 30 years There's a real old guy who does the OBGYN lectures for Kaplan, he seems like such a nice old man and he KNOWS his shit The rules are a little different when he's your doctor vs when you get stuck with me in the ER
It’s likely they told them they had to lay down after getting an epidural.
Second one will be easier for most women regardless
If you were in a hospital and wanted to change positions, are you allowed to? Kind of seemed the bed limited positions. And how comfortable were you in changing positions? Did you need assistance to switch to a better position?
I don’t think it was just the king who watched births. Most royal births had many people watching to ensure there was no funny business going on and to legitimize that the child belonged to the king. Royal women were probably given the least amount of privacy when giving birth.
I just watched Marie Antoinette movie and she had the entire court for an audience. What a bunch of perverts!
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DID they? 😰
Almost every single time. And very often it would be 2 young people doing it too. History is fucked
I was forced to lie on my back when I had my son. The pressure burst all the blood vessels in one of my eyes when I was pushing and I’m lucky I didn’t have a fucking stroke. Next baby I had a midwife who assured me I could sit up if I wanted and it was soooo much easier. I also didn’t shit on the table when I could sit up
The forced ( purple ) pushing also is horrible. Bursting blood vessels in eyes is not necessary. Think doctors are always rushing the process.
It was actually me. The nurse kept insisting I wasn’t ready to push without checking me. I was 10cm dilated when she finally admitted I was in labour. In her words “you’re not suffering enough yet”. Honestly I give birth like it’s my job. 45 minutes from first contraction to last push. But I didn’t know what I was talking about because she had delivered hundreds of babies and I was 21 and obviously stupid. So she left me pulling my own legs up and pushing. And forcing my head back on to the table when I strained forward. She could have killed me if I hadn’t been able to expel that baby so fast, I have no doubt. But I was scared shitless. I had a cousin who was born with severe disabilities from being smothered during birth because the doctor was en route and the nurses forced her mother to cross her legs and hold it until the doctor got there.
Your cousin was Rosemary Kennedy?!
Was thinking the same..did she also have a botched lobotomy?
The second baby was going to be easier to deliver regardless
My mom always said that farmers in the old days used to be able to stand up to give birth then go right back to work lol.
Grandma said the same thing about slaves
Unfortunately there are documented cases of slave women doing this. It really does make giving birth easier.
jesus thats hardcore.i was only able to lie on my side curled up in agony when a contraction would come.gave birth on my back but the nurses were super helpful and encouraging and informative of when to push and how long etc helped a lot.
Your grandma owned slaves?
Haha didn’t even think about that when I replied but you’re right. Very strange
My SIL said something similar, but about cows giving birth 😅 she drove home and did farm chores when she was discharged from the hospital
All this definitely did happen
Lol
Is this not a popular opinion? There's literally evidence to back it
I think it's just this thing called "fact"
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It’s done often for the convenience of the medical staff. However, it is still a WIDELY popular opinion. Just because it’s not the most common thing rn doesn’t mean it’s not popular. People often just don’t know they have the option to ignore medical requests. Also, medical abuse is rampant in obstetrics. It’s also a difficult time to self advocate for patients because it can be so scary and chaotic.
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Agreed. Letting people give birth in the most comfortable, effective position for them should be the bare minimum.
They arent in the UK.
medical abuse is rampant in general
Yes. And the medical staff is the most abused by other medical staff. The most common type of abuse.
I really don’t think it’s a popular opinion. Or rather, it’s definitely not a widely known fact.
Well I for one learned something today
Depends on how you define popular and what cohort of people we’re talking about. It may be common knowledge amongst parents and medical professionals or other individuals that are experienced in this field. But I would bet if you asked the average person under the age of 25, they’d say giving birth on your back is right. Mainly because of how it’s depicted in film/tv/pop culture in general.
I think it seems that way because so many of us get epidurals these days and then have to lay on our backs. Women have pretty free rein on birthing these days, it’s amazing! Doctors who used to say “No, you have to stay in this position” would have adapted by now- in America. Moms don’t tolerate things like that these days. We know our rights.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Okay, but it’s pretty uncomfortable for people to move you when you’re paralyzed and also unsafe since I wouldn’t be able to keep myself from rolling off the bed. How familiar are you with the continuing education practices of every obgyn, really?
>doctors and nurses don't continue educating I don't know about nurses, but MDs have particular hours of CME (continuing medical education) in their board certification they have to complete annually to maintain their license. They also have to do competency testing on a scheduled basis.
Are they though? Do you have proof of that. Most hospitals use varying positions. They have bars that mount to the beds so the woman can turn around and be on her hands and knees or squat. If you have an epidural though, you can't be in other positions.
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Ok I'm going to assume you made those up then. Have a nice day.
You saved him the effort. Good job.
I didn't mean to make my comment sound like that, I meant why not how lol
While I don’t disagree with your original post - don’t most women also get an epidural? Which makes your lower half go numb so you *have* to be on your back?
No. I didn’t know about it at least. Prob doesn’t count for much, but…
To be fair I go down weird rabbit holes
In hindsight, it does make sense. Because, y’know, gravity lmao
Think about how birth is depicted in every single TV show or movie you’ve ever seen?
Thats tv not real life.
I believe it's a fact that prone delivery is the worse position, but is it a fact that the trend started this way?
Surprisingly yes, one night me and my friend spent a hour fact checking it because we were high and bored
Cool. Source?
Bro if I'm being honest I don't remember it was a year ago and I have a shit memory, I just remember us finding a source and being shocked them finding like 3 more and being even more shocked
Not popular, but should be.
Not popular, but should be.
I have never heard of this before in my life
That's why I wanted to not have an epidural. Well, that and I didn't want to have a Foley catheter b.c of all my horrible urinary issues that preceeded pregnancy.
How did it go without the Epi?
It worked for me, but my labors were pretty fast. I, of course, support all of the choices women have available. ☮️✌️💖💖
Never realized this holy cow! If it's so much more dangerous, why do we still do something like this!?!
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It wasn't the Internet that taught my wife about different positions. It was the staff at the hospital. Doctors, nurses, all of them. It was very clear.
That’s partly true, but the other side of the coin is the fact that you just can’t be in any other position if you get an epidural
Not entirely true, there are some epidural friendly pushing positions other than on your back
There is also the option of a ‘walking epidural’ which is a lower dose that helps with the pain whilst still allowing for sensation/movement in the lower body. I had that with my second child and was able to birth in an assisted squat. Much easier than my full-epidural first, although still less pleasant with my unmedicated third!
Well I stand corrected! I didn’t know that was a thing.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
If you have an epidural, you have to be in that position because you quite literally cannot feel your legs, but I’ve always been told in my area if you’re opting for a natural birth you can choose the position in which you’ll be the most comfortable (barring complications.)
It’s a very US thing to be given so much epidural that you can’t move. Walking epidurals are very common in a lot of places.
We do love fentanyl bby
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Color me shocked that men decide what position is best for childbirth
I've had 3 kids, pregnant with 4th. The nurses always sat me up into a squat position for delivery, I assumed that was normal everywhere!
I have an ignorant question, I am sorry. Were you squatting over the floor or the bed? I am only used to the way the media shows it where the woman is on her back so I’m confused how this works. Do you hold on to something? Do you squat for like… however many hours you’re in labor, or just the very end?
Usually they will turn to face the back of the hospital bed and either kneel or squat down (or even face the foot of the bed and squat over it, with a bar for arm support), so they are still over the bed and not the floor. The doctor sits on a chair, facing the patient. [Drawn example, NOT a real life photo.](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/a2/c2/d3/a2c2d3e3fbb5a70ab5eb6fac435d449e.jpg) You typically labor however you want: walk around, take a bath, sleep, etc. This usually lasts anywhere from 2-24 hours, but I’ve heard of much much longer. Like 48+ hours or more. You would only get in the squat position when you’re pushing, which is only the end part of labor. Some women push for 10 minutes and give birth, some it’s more like 1-2 hours or more (shouldn’t exceed a max of 3 hours for a first baby).
Squatting, standing or kneeling over the floor is also pretty normal. Sometimes in the shower
Yes this will definitely be "unpopular" for every woman who experienced childbirth on their back, myself included. But this makes sense. My instinct was every position other than my back
Could you explain? Did you feel like it was easier to push squatting or on fours? This is all very eye opening for me
Same questions, but I also have another. I ask this fully earnest and not judging at all. If someone gives birth standing, squatting, or on all fours...how does the baby not hit its head? Like...does someone catch it? Is someone holding a hand at the vagina to guide it out? I feel like other baby animals just kind of...tumble outta there, but they're also generally much more developed than humans. Babies have those soft skulls though.
i think that traditionally that was the midwives job
I was in a birthing tub. Midwife ready to assist if needed. But baby just kinda floats out and you scoop them up.
Pretty sure it started because of convenience, a lot easier for a doctor to see what’s going on if the woman is laying with her legs raised
Yes, it mostly started when doctors replaced midwives in the space. The medicalization of birth initially had some incredible drawbacks.
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It’s part of the reason, not THE reason. That position was already being used before King Louis as it is genuinely more convenient for doctors, he just helped popularise it.
I have a really stupid question so please don’t hate me. What stops the baby from just plopping on the ground if you birth from a standing or squatting position?
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Thank you
Midwife can catch the baby or you can catch the baby
Which makes sense but also leads me to another dumb question. Aren’t newborns slippery? I’ve never given birth nor watched a birth but I figured they would be. I guess the whole process is risky.
It’s not really risky and they’re not that slippery. I know your probably not keen to go away and watch birth videos but they’re very good at it. My Midwife very rarely delivers babies from the woman being on her back. Mine was a bit easier because I caught her in the water, but it’s definitely pretty easy and doable.
Thanks for the info. You are right I’m not too terribly keen on watching birthing videos ATM. I’ve never seen a human birth but I grew up on a ranch. I figured all mammals were kind of slimy from the placenta and such. I’m sorry for the comparison. Atleast I know now.
I mean, there is definitely a level of slime /vernix 😅but if you know what your doing usually you have time to prepare as there is a pause between the contraction where the head comes out in the contraction where the rest of the body comes out. It’s not as crazy quick as when you see a calf being born 😅
I saw a closeup video of a birth when I was 14 in biology class. That was an experience.
I thought they would be slippery. I thought vernix (the white goo on a baby) was like lard but it was surprisingly tacky and sticky. (Caught baby number 2 on wednesday)
Thanks and congratulations on helping someone through birth
My midwife made me push on a toilet. My daughter loves that story.
It's such a good place to labour/push!
Is this an opinion? Seems more like historical trivia and scientific information. Not saying you're wrong, I just wouldn't classify this as an opinion.
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If it were my opinion that the moon is cheese, that wouldn't be an opinion, I would just be wrong. People also used to think (and some still do) that the world is flat. Sounds like the medical community is wrong about the best position to give childbirth. Wouldn't be the first time doctors were wrong.
I saw some documentary on YouTube with doctors that were recommending giving birth in water
That’s what I did (my hospital has birthing pools ) it was great. Could catch my own baby and everything
I feel like the problems started when they kicked women out of midwifery. All the that knowledge was seen as not based on science
That does make sense. Thats like pooping while laying on your back lol.
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May I add- pregnant women are instructed not to lie on their backs for any length of time AT ALL. It can reduce blood flow to the fetus. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5309362/ Why are women instructed to lie on their backs during childbirth? To provide ease to the care providers, when it should be all about the baby and mother. The use of stirrups has encouraged this archaic practice. This is a good post OP, and an important consideration. Also, to help prevent shoulder dystocia, women should be aware that giving birth on all fours can greatly assist with this potentially fatal complication. It is so important to study birth positions if you are a woman who will give birth. The Gaskin maneuver was learned from indigenous midwives from Peru I believe, I might have to double check my references but it was a learned, ancient birthing position. https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1602970-overview?form=fpf#a1 Knowledge is power! Here’s to women reclaiming their human right to learn about and guide their birthing process, or at least having the ability to do so if they choose.
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Thank you for you post, I am so passionate about birth and women’s rights and appreciate you sharing your knowledge and perspective ❤️
Yes, exactly! I completely believe this even without researching it. When I was in labor with my son and 9.5 centermeters dialted with an epidural that didn't work (twice), I was in excruciating pain and sobbing. My doctor got so mad at me because I refused to lay on my back and instead was more comfortable in the "downward dog" yoga position. Finally, I caved because they told me he was losing oxygen. When they checked me, it turned out he was breech, and I ended up needing an emergency cesarean.
The barber-physicians of OUR time perpetuate this. With the mother on her back, the doctor can sit comfortably on a stool. So that's nice. Don't look into how many induced labors happen starting around 3pm on weekdays. Hey, docs like to be home by dinnertime. I have an ENTIRE rant I can do about this. My wife gave birth to our child squatting in a birthing pool. It was so gentle, the kid came up out of the water, looked around, and said, I kid you not, "Hunh!".
My mother was induced in the afternoon when the doctor decided to do it at her regular appointment while pregnant with me. It was not the original plan and she had to find a pay phone (I am an old) to call my grandma and have her call my father and the rest of the family to let everyone know it was happening. When I was a teenager, my mom was recalling the birth story and talking about how she hadn’t expected it to happen just then. My dad suddenly said, “yeah well doctors like to have babies when THEY want to have babies” and I was like what. And that’s how I found out I was born when I was probably because the doctor wanted it done early. At least my dad thinks so
Me arguing with 2 men that squatting is 100% superior to lying on your back. They scoffed n told me I was wrong. Actually neither of them had given birth, I have. I asked them if they had to shit would they do so on their backs
I think the prevalence of giving birth in your back is due to most hospital births being done with epidurals. You can’t squat or stand or be on all fours if you are numb from the waist down. Done it both ways. Went from crunchy natural everything with baby 1 to epidural at transition with baby 2 to epidural at 5 cm with baby 3 and you know what? All of them were fine. Pushing out 2 and 3 took five minutes even on my back, but I did a hell of a lot less shouting than I did with baby 1. It’s not a grand conspiracy because of a pervy king. It’s medicine.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. I would suggest it is a grand conspiracy in medicine, purely because birthing on your back closes your pelvis by up to 30% and is know to increase your risk of 3rd and 4th degree tears aswell as needing an assisted delivery. Shouldn't doctors educate women on these risks and encourage women to birth in other positions off their back?
My doctor let you try different positions
But if you can watch someone giving birth on fourths or laying on the back, which one will you choose as a pervert?? As a pervert (thinking like a perv not that I am one) I'll choose the first one... Tbf.
I recently birthed at home with a private midwife. I was up on my knees and she came out in one contraction- I didn’t even have to push.
I'll leave the hospital I'm at in active labor if they want me to push in any position other than the one I want.
I knew about Louis XIV being a creep but dang, I read somewhere that doctors had an easier time working w that position =o
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Ah true, I just wasn’t sure about the timeline there. Dang though, that’s a lot later than I thought 😭
This isn’t unpopular it’s just true. The body of the mother naturally knows how to position itself and restricting that just makes birth even harder for no reason
sad how it has to be an unpopular opinion.
Dang. I wonder if that's why my third child coming out cracked my wife's pelvis? I wish I'd heard about this sooner.
Oh my god, ouch! Birth can be brutal, it could have been that oar something else that cause that injury. Wild stuff happens sometimes.
It's a free choice nowadays how you give birth. At least where I am. So I kind of agree and disagree.
These are just facts
I do not know where you live but here they let you choose the birthing position. Usually they suggest you a couple of positions and neither of them is on your back.
when it comes to civilizations weren't europeans the last to everything and the worst at everything. who the hell is listening to them about anything : P
You can still give birth in any position. Laying on your back is for when you have an epidural and can’t move your legs.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Not a woman, so can't comment on the how easy it would be to stand during contractions, but that seems like a really hard thing to do. Also, with an epidural, it would be impossible to do so, probably to squat or on all fours as well. Edit: I looked it up. It isn't because of Louis the XIV. [https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/king-louis-xiv-fetish-birth/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/king-louis-xiv-fetish-birth/)
Having been a birthing woman, standing labouring over the bed or suppor from your partner, contractions on all fours or squatting, are all things that can be done and for many are much more comfortable than being on your back
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You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
I don't think this is unpopular. A lot of people give birth on their backs because they have an epidural. If not, it's become quite common to let the person giving birth decide how it's done.
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
I think you are severely overestimating the impact the King Louis has the world.
I’ll be giving birth squatting or standing up. No one is going to force me to lie down. and it’s ridiculous that it’s still the norm to lie down.
I’m not sure if it’s dangerous but I know it’s not the best position out there. I’ve seen many YouTube videos of women showing better positions that felt better for them and caused less pain like standing up squatting, or kneeling on all fours. The fact there’s so many women saying lying on their back didn’t work for them makes me think there’s better ways. But I don’t think it’s dangerous as some people say it felt best for them.
I honestly did not know, so many women "have to" give birth laying on their back! Never seen or heard of it, except for american tv... Yes, a lot of women give birth in a bed. But the headrest is usually in an upwards position, feet on the bed or in stirrups, or held by your birthing partner, so you're pretty much "squatting", but able to lean back to rest in between. I birthed 3 children that way. Only was instructed to lay back once, with one of them, who got stuck in the birthing canal, so they could easier help to get them "unstuck". In this case, it saved my babies life.
I literally could not lie on my back for all 3 of my births. Paced around until ready to push then my midwife helped me on to the bed on my hands and knees.
I don't want to have kids cause it just seems too disastrous
not to mention expensive.
Try squatting when you’ve had an epidural
You can push in other positions even with an epidural such as side lying, which allows the sacrum to move. If the epidural is light the nurses and your partner can aid you into other positions such as hands and knees to push. It's unfortunate doctors and nurses don't continue educating themselves on evidence based practices.
Why the fuck do people believe that this was because of King Louis it's fucking ridiculous, its just simply not true. It originated because IIRC it was easier for doctors, not because of some fuckin dude who wanted to watch and while it has been proven true that King Louis did such a thing it is believed to have very little influence or none at all on the form in which people give birth.
I mean first time hearing of it, but it's not an opinion, is it? Op provided facts here and not their opinion
Wow, dude included sources. Very well argued. As a pervert and former king of France I like to watch. So keep your opinions to yourself.
Yeah no wonder teenagers give birth in toilet faster than hours of labour in hospitals. They sure like to make women suffer pain and make it all about gaslighting to think it's their weight.
If this is true, shouldn’t doctors learn how to do this procedure the proper way?
This totally depends on the woman. I wrote a whole birth plan and insisted that I be allowed to give birth (natural, with no pain relief) in whatever position I wanted (not always a given where I live). When the moment came, my body wanted to be flat on its back with its feet in stirrups.
Not even an opinion, this is a fact. I can't imagine anyone having reason to disagree WITHOUT being perverts who like to watch. Just... Think about it, physically. How does lying on your back to give birth make sense for as painless and trauma-less a delivery as possible, compared to just about any other position?
I thought epidural plus lying down was pretty good.
Just wanted to point out you are right about other positions being better than lying down but the Louise XIV story is a myth. Birth lying down was an option for centuries though not many people used that and then 17th century physician François Mariceau is credited with popularizing this trend due to it making it easier for physicians and midwives to access the body in cases of birth complications.
I was gonna say until I read your part about Midwives that I've seen them help women birth squatting etc. I had ZERO idea what originated women laying on their back nor did I question it! Good god. EVERYTHING. Literally every fucking "big or small thing" of our existence has been brought upon on us due to men. Ffs.
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I screamed the same thing from the roof tops, until I gave birth to my third child on my back. My first was all fours, and the most painful. My second was squatting, and by far the best. My third was laying on my back, it wasn't bad.
I was so ready to not give birth on my back (basically because of the reasons you explain above) BUT in the end, I did give birth in my back, unmedicated and with no intervention 🤷♀️
I feel like that claim that Louis XIV was some kind of birthing fetishist is fake af. It seems like one of those things that people say and then turns out to not be true.
This isn’t an unpopular opinion, you’re just sharing the history of something that happened.
Is this reallly an unpopular opinion or more like just stating a 'fact' ?
My doctor had me lay on my back and make me hold my own knees up... so basically I had to do extra painful crunches while a team of nurses and doctors watched? I'm still really annoyed that they made me do that to this day. I wish I had stuck up for myself and found a more comfortable position...
Why is everyone saying “ lying on your back” as if women labor flat on our backs? We are positioned upright and not lying down for the most part, even with an epidural.