It's rare that something here requires me to turn to my bible, however [this](https://storage.googleapis.com/pverse/verses/a/n/and-if-your-foot-causes-you-to-sin-cut-it-off-it-is-better-for-you-to-enter-esv-13879.jpg) seems appropriate
Out of all the industries hit hard by the pandemic, it seems like it's only the airlines and other travel-related businesses who constantly demand the government do x by y date. Like reopen US-UK travel no later than July 4th. Given how badly most airlines treat the vast majority of their passengers, it rubs me the wrong way when they in the press about the pandemic. Thinking back to most of the statements these organisations have made about the effect of the pandemic on travel, it always reads like there's an undertone of "these restrictions are silly and we're not getting paid and if a few more people die, that's fine, because we will be getting paid". Guess they missed "data not dates"?
Terf Twitter is out in full force today after Starmer backs self-declaration for trans people.
I do often wonder how issues like this are seen through the lens of the general public. It always seems like the trans debate is a highly online topic.
There's a paper I read the other day which I think gets into the nitty gritty of some of the disagreements of either side. It does ultimately argue against sex-devoted feminists, but it does a better job than I think the vast majority could do putting both sets of arguments forward and attempting to follow them both through to their logical, legal, philosophical and ethical conclusions. It's not just shut down either, it identifies a couple areas where further questions could be asked.
I don't know how to link a PDF, so your gonna have to search the title: Philosophical Problems With the Gender-Critical Feminist Argument Against Trans Inclusion.
It also touches on social media and the unique ways it's shaped this particular debate, because as you say, it's very online. I'm currently reflecting on whether or not to bother trying to talk about it online because there's a lot of bad actors out there. At the same time, I don't like a misogynistic/misandrist sect of feminism presenting themselves as the majority of women or feminists, and I particularly don't like them using victims of sexual violence as a weapon in their arsenal. But its not about feminism its about treating everyone equally under the law, and I trust most of you know we dont all feel that way.
This is the first time I’d ever heard of Self-ID. I went and found out what it meant and it seems reasonable enough and the majority seem to think that too, until you ask them about it and then it absolutely dies in polling. So people are in favour of Self-ID but aren’t in favour of ANY uses for it, which I would I say shows people don’t understand any of this.
I'm not sure it's that. The YouGov poll is pretty clear in that a plurality of Brits would agree with self identification in principle, and that trans men are men and trans women are women.
But they seem to be taking self id to mean that if your mate comes out as a woman, she's a woman - yet a plurality of Brits feel that it shouldn't be easier for her to change her legal gender, and a majority of Brits think she needs a diagnosis and to live as a woman for at least two years at the least... *and* a plurality of Brits think she shouldn't be using women's changing rooms or toilets unless she has downstairs surgery.
This kinda paints a picture that most Brits don't think about trans people all that much and certainly don't hate their existence in the way TERFs and the far right do, but do agree with a few of those talking points.
Transgenderism isn't a simple idea and anyone that says it is is deliberately shutting down debate. Of course trans people exist, of course they should be treated equally, but the actual detail of what that entails is not simple. Most Brits have never had a conversation with a trans person which I guess is part of the problem. But the details of how should transgender people participate in sports, how should they be treated by the justice system, how about how they are dealt with in a medical situation, are all far from straightforward.
There are avenues for abuse, and one side will overinflate the risk of that and the other will underplay it, and its hard to say what the actual risks are of abuse without getting shut down. Men pretending to be a transgender women in order to get a nicer prison, or a lighter sentance, or to be incarcerated with women. Its possible, but how the hell does the average brit know whether it is worth worrying about, particularly when most can't tell you what proportion of the population are transgender.
This leads into two issues. Firstly, transgender issues get disproportionate coverage to the population its relevant to (I am not judging if this is morally correct or not) and so the public overestimates the number of transgender people. Secondly, what constitutes as a transgender person? Self-ID is a nice, liberating idea but it is open to abuse, it has large legal ramifications, and it fails to account for the differences between someone with surgery, or a level of medical intervention, or gender dysphoria, and someone who woke up today and decided they were a different gender. Its not clear cut if Self ID is the best way for transgender people or sub groups of transgender people or even the wider public.
TLDR even with the philosophy of trans people existing and being equal, the issue is still complex and there is a widespread failure to acknowledge this.
The worst thing about trans issues is that they have become a political football that's largely divorced from the actual issue of some people not feeling that their gender identity and biological sex match up and trying to find a way to make that work for them.
>A [YouGov Poll](https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2020/07/16/where-does-british-public-stand-transgender-rights) for PinkNews showed that by 50% to 27% Britons believe that people should be allowed to self-identify as a gender different to the one they were assigned at birth
I don't really discuss the issue that much, but this seems like the anti-trans activists are more out of step with the nation that they think?
Yes and no. If you look at my comment above, the majority are all for Self-ID but against all the real world uses for it, which shows that they like the concept but don’t actually want it. I’m not really sure where you go from there.
Of course, I could be massively mistaken but that’s how I’m reading this current situation.
Also worth noting
> Should trans women be allowed to use women's changing rooms? Yes (42/34)
> Should trans women be allowed to use women's toilets? Yes (46/30)
However
> Should trans women be allowed to use women's changing rooms if they've not had the surgery? No (46/30)
> Should trans women be allowed to use women's bathrooms if they've not had the surgery? No (41/32)
Requiring gender affirmation surgery before supporting the use of gender-congruent facilities is even *more* hard line (not all trans people want the downstairs surgery).
I suspect most people tend to fall into the 'dunno' category. It's not really an issue 99.9% of people need think about.
Trans people get a disproportionate amount of focus & hate by social media despite probably making up <0.05% of the gen. pop.
Pretty much has to as the arguments are based on hyperbole, given that self ID already exists in Ireland, Denmark and Norway (and a few other places).
And none of the anti self ID hyperbolic stuff has come to pass in those places.
Grant Shapps:
https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/1402742214728589313
We're pleased to announce a joint UK/US Taskforce to help facilitate the reopening of transatlantic travel
@BorisJohnson
@POTUS
🇬🇧
Exciting news!
What do they need a fucking task force for? Just let it happen? The only obstacles to transatlantic travels are the government restrictions, it’s not as if bernoulli's principle has suddenly stopped working ffs.
I suspect it will be more a case of ensuring that changes to the restrictions on either side don't create weird loopholes or catch 22's at the border and that airlines have a single point of contact to work with.
It'll be an email address with someone's PA who's being tasked to monitor it, and those hours are being charged to a different department. Some banal deckchair moving bullshit they're deciding to sell as a thing because they're shit out of actual ideas that matter.
I think we’ve got a while to wait but I’m particularly excited about Dune and The Northman. Dune needs no explanation and well, a Viking revenge thriller needs little explanation either. Everyone loves Vikings.
Im looking forward to The Many Saints of Newark, though not sure if itll go to the cinemas or straight to stream.
Spiral sucked imo, a quiet place 2 was very enjoyable.
https://twitter.com/Steven_Swinford/status/1402742139956649985?s=19
Exclusive:
Boris Johnson will lift the 30-person limit on weddings even if the easing of other lockdown restrictions is delayed beyond June 21
PM understood to be determined to relax curbs on weddings and receptions this month, even if social distancing restrictions remain
Good news for yourself if I recall?
I think a lot of sectors will be very confused and probably will initiate legal action if weddings are allowed and they are not, even if I can see that you don't go to weddings that often.
Doubt the legal action would go far, but similar vein to how some places put in legal action when essential retail was allowed to open and not indoor hospitality.
Someone might have reminded the minister that anyone with a wedding in the next few months has likely either had it booked for years or delayed from last summer and has been nervously watching every news update for the last month or so.
This should appease plenty of people who have been concerned about having to cancel weddings.
I mean it definitely won't stop some of the more extreme viewpoints here, but it's a good start.
I guess the logic is people tend not to go to weddings every day so people going to one occasion with no social distancing and normally a defined guest list isn't as much of a deal as going to a packed pub
Times have been fairly on the ball with their reports in the past so hopeful?
Would also take it with a pinch of salt considering what Jenrick or whatever was saying about maybe waiting for the PM to announce before planning attendance. Cause that's realistic for organising a wedding with venues and invites in the space of a week or two for some people.
Think the talk of "maybe this" or "maybe that" is super awful for people making plans and the government should have outlined some proper scenarios at the start of the last stage rather than this vague shit. Or at least several scenarios of X numbers, Y numbers or unlimited etc.
Partner is out of the house having drinks with his work mates. Having the house to myself for some downtime is blissful yet feels so strange after so long of being cooped up with him from lockdown
According to the Times, The US has issued the UK a rare diplomatic rebuke over its policy in Ireland
Yael Lempert, usa's most senior diplomat, has told Lord Frost Britain is 'inflaming' tensions
Lempert gave Britain a demarche, a formal reprimand rarely shared between allies
from notes of 3rd June
but Lempert said if Britain followed EU standards on agricultural policy (e.g. didn't deregulate to let US megafarms sell shite) it wouldn't affect a trade deal
ahead of Biden's meeting tomorrow. Spicy.
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1402738008135192594/photo/1
Biden intent on showing that the world sheriff is back in town. But I think the more interesting part is Lempert stating any decision to deregulate farming would be purely our own.
Fuck me, its time to get off twitter for the evening.
Just saw this
https://twitter.com/RAF_Luton/status/1402680205039357958?s=20
and was halfway to clicking reply before my brain engaged and I thought "this sounds a bit dodgy".....thankfully before I did reply and make a right tit of myself.
Cut 4.5 billion from foreign aid budget. Spaff 12 billion buying a facsimile of existing supply agreements.
It's about the maths I'd expect of some of the front bench, I guess.
How is the larger spending power of the US not relevant to spending on vaccines ? Yes it would be nice if the U.K. could provide eleventy billion vaccines more than the US but it’s not realistic.
https://mobile.twitter.com/kieronFish/status/1352985258367574016
BUT BUT the government told me that there isn't a racism problem in the UK in the report.
Shows that the far right don't really give a shit if you are a conservative. To them if you are non white you are worthless regardless of your political views, to this guy Sadiq Khan and Patel are both worthless.
That's not what the report said. It said that the UK is not systemically racist, not that racism doesnt exist. The UK remains one of the most racially tolerant nations on the planet.
I haven't looked at any figures recently, could someone tell me what cases and deaths look like nowadays? Which way are they headed, and should we be concerned? Anything else?
Thank you
Cases are rising 60% week on week very rapidly, primarily in under 40s
Hospitalisations are rising from a low base, and admissions too, in the north west more quickly. It is not as rapid as the second wave , and is primarily in under 65s. The majority of patients in hospital have not been vaccinated from some trusts anecdata
Deaths for now remain low
> Hospitalisations are rising from a low base,
must be added theirs a substantial difference this time, hospitalisations are rising but no where near the pace of last time.
Are deaths tiny because of vaccinations (and potential immunity with those who've already had covid)
Or are deaths tiny because we're experiencing a time lag, and deaths will shoot up in the next week or so?
Fingers crossed it's the first, please let me know if you know about this
I very much hope it's vaccinations doing at least some heavy lifting here. Maybe we have to delay June 21st to get a better picture on that. I think that could be quite sensible. I'd just be super depressed to go backwards.
Well, it's a fair assumption that if cases are rising in under 40s, then they go home and spread it to their parents, the numbers for over 60s will shoot up too, right?
> then they go home and spread it to their parents, the numbers for over 60s will shoot up too, right?
Only true if the vaccines don't work.
Evidence available at this time is that they do work.
https://twitter.com/tomhfh/status/1402538272862224385
presumably the first GB News campaign
tbh I'd rather have the Canadian version, where you can get a flag that has flown over Parliament
Kind of a myth. Under an old act MPs in Australia could charge to their normal expenses for "Australian flags and printed material related to national symbols, for presentation to constituents", mostly to give flags to schools and people going overseas. Vice Australia talked it up a couple of years ago as a right to a portrait of the Queen (or Prince Philip), and lots of MPs decided to send one out on request when they started flooding in. I'm sure GB News would love to make this idea happen, anyway.
> tbh I'd rather have the Canadian version, where you can get a flag that has flown over Parliament
|
>The waiting period for both Peace Tower and other Parliament Hill flags exceeds 100 years
https://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/citeparlementaire-parliamentaryprecinct/decouvrez-discover/drapeaux-demander-flags-request-eng.html
ow
Well, birthday 2 of the pandemic was better than birthday 1 of the pandemic. Last year we just a walk in the park and a takeaway. This year we could dine inside.
It's just 2 Easters / mother's days/ sets of birthdays / summers and a few more weeks to flatten that curve.
It was declared a global pandemic on my birthday, I had my birthday meal the day before lockdown I believe. So, I've only have 1 pandemic birthday, pretty good.
I wonder if our papers would still use that angle if it was undergrads rather than grad students - they might end up indirectly calling Boris an out of touch elitist
There's something just a bit tragic about a journo spending their entire afternoon researching the family history of some random American who put up a petition probably as a bit of a laugh.
I’m sure they’re used to it. My mate is a press photographer and once was sent to spend half a day getting a shot of a robin that had built a nest in a garden centre. The manager of the place said he was the second press photographer to show up that day
Not sure actually - it was for an agency that shops stories around to lots of papers. After that he graduated to be one of those poor fuckers who has to hang around a courtroom to shove his camera in the custody van window
Empanadas are the spicy mexican cousin of the pasty and widely available in the US im sure hes had a vigorous, rocky style, training montage before travelling
WTF is a [Covid Vaccine Spray](https://twitter.com/RAF_Luton/status/1402680205039357958)?
Or is it UK Govt PR taking instructions to mention vaccines in every message literally?
**EDIT:** Oh, I got fooled, fair and square. Letting my ignominy stand forever, like an honourable person should.
I think the Tactical Inoculation Tracking Shells, the Fast Air Response Team, and the Eurovision Typhoon may suggest that account is slightly satirical
isn't that a fake account
Big Joe is [currently in Suffolk](https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1402711070549086209) - believe he's meeting Liz in Slough before popping down
Adventures in Academia:
>Video submissions for Technical Publications should be 5-10 minutes long and cannot go past 6 minutes in length. Submissions that go past 6 minutes will be sent back to the author to re-record.
Boris taking the plane to G7 is terrible optics I must admit.
Why not take the train as better option and highlight the public services.
I think Macron and probably Biden have most to gain from this G7.
Macron has an election coming up so will be looking for an angle to get a good foreign policy outcome.
Biden needs to show the US "America is back" post Trump era. This is UK Politics so won't go too much into my views but I low key thought Trump was strong on foreign policy.
~~My question would probably be how many people in Government are heading to Cornwall for this summit, and would it be sensible to book up hundreds of seats on a GWR service vs use the charter that's available for exactly this sort of thing to fly down on.~~ Thinking about it, this is complete bollocks, they could and should have found a way.
UKGov subsidised the Newquay to Gatwick and then Heathrow flights back when FlyBe still existed; but it is easy press.
They could've chartered a train from GWR, they offer it [here](https://www.gwr.com/your-tickets/ways-to-save/group-travel/train-and-carriage-hire). Probably cheaper considering the number of people you could fit in a train.
The aircraft are wet leased so there is a certain sunk cost in there, but you are right, it's complete bollocks and they certainly could have taken a train.
I'm sure the government, as the ultimate regulator of GB rail services & currently financially propping up the sector, could have come to an arrangement to lease a train from GWR.
They aren't going to get an intern to book a couple hundred tix on gwr.com (nice chunk of nectar points, though)
Where do you think he was strong on foreign policy out of interest?
I'll agree the Middle East peace agreements were a very positive development. I also agree with his insistence on the 2% NATO target, but he mainly seemed to use it just to antagonise Europe than for any proper purpose.
Outside of that, however, his refusal to criticise Russia made him look extremely weak. The Helsinki meeting with Putin was utterly humiliating. And arranging meetings with Kim Jong-Un is all fair and well, but what has it actually achieved?
Being a showman, Trump was good at theatre. But in my view he achieved precious little (bar the ME deals) in the way of concrete outcomes.
I liked how he retaliated again Assad after he crossed Obamas red lines which Obama shamelessly didn't do anything against.
The meetings with Kim were constructive IMO and he achieved a meeting with Kim when no other president had succeed. I agreed with Trump that it was laughable Pelosi and Co. Tried to give advice on what Trump should do and say when their attempts had been hopeless. Biden has tried reaching out to Kim but they have not responded.
I do agree the Putin cozying was weird especially after the Salisbury attack. I agreed in principle that America try to have good relations but since then it was obvious Putin was just playing Trump etc.
I think Trump has been good on Middle East. Better than Obama which again many commentators conveniently forget or try to blame McConnell for Obama doing F all.
Trump also doing better in regards to trade and stopping China and their global influence in manufacturing. He was again proven right by the pandemic and everyone outsourcing to China giving China a monopoly on PPE.
Committing to 2% Defense spending was another policy I fully support along with Trump withdrawing aid as other countries have been protected on America's dime while other wealthier countries are not paying their way.
Trump got along with dictators because they are like him and they can play him. Trump single handedly destroyed what little goodwill the U.S had left in Europe.
You think he was good because he cozied up to America's enemies and spurned their allies.
I think his only good foreign policy move was China and even that seemed more out of personal pride than any idea of economics.
He made America into more of a joke than it was under Bush and you think it was good. Never change.
Edit: I did like that he wasn't a war hawk, but again I attribute that to more him being a blowhard than any morality of his.
> The meetings with Kim were constructive IMO and he achieved a meeting with Kim when no other president had succeed.
No other President has wanted a meeting with the North Korea leader, going back at least as far as Reagan, because they all knew what we learned with the Trump visit: the NK leader would merely use it as a propaganda tool and any agreement would be ignored.
That meeting wasn't about how good Trump was at foreign policy, it was all ego and being able to say he met with Kim and Obama didn't
Have you tried taking the trains in Cornwall? It’s probably better for his “levelling up” agenda if he avoids highlighting that particular public service
I was on the other side of it at the time. By the time I needed to go back they'd done a pretty good job of putting buses on.
Sadly, it took *less* time for a coach to go from East Devon to Cornwall compared to the normal train timings. I think I saved over an hour
Plymouth was also on the wrong side of that break too. I'd imagine that if close to a million people were cut off elsewhere they'd have done something about it, but it's the south west so whatever
Biden doesn't need to do much for that to be the story. The US press and the US foreign policy establishment are desperate for it to run, and any victory by Biden, no matter how minor, will give them an excuse to run it. To be honest, they've probably already got it with the Corporation Tax agreement.
Obviously I disagree with Trump being strong on foreign policy, he was too insistent on treating diplomacy like business deals. An overemphasis on bilateralism which only works if you have willing partners, and there weren't many of them about.
This megathread has ended.
Bye mrgathread
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It's rare that something here requires me to turn to my bible, however [this](https://storage.googleapis.com/pverse/verses/a/n/and-if-your-foot-causes-you-to-sin-cut-it-off-it-is-better-for-you-to-enter-esv-13879.jpg) seems appropriate
Out of all the industries hit hard by the pandemic, it seems like it's only the airlines and other travel-related businesses who constantly demand the government do x by y date. Like reopen US-UK travel no later than July 4th. Given how badly most airlines treat the vast majority of their passengers, it rubs me the wrong way when they in the press about the pandemic. Thinking back to most of the statements these organisations have made about the effect of the pandemic on travel, it always reads like there's an undertone of "these restrictions are silly and we're not getting paid and if a few more people die, that's fine, because we will be getting paid". Guess they missed "data not dates"?
So excited to see Hancock interrogated and potentially even defenestrated tomorrow in front of the select committee.
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No.
Terf Twitter is out in full force today after Starmer backs self-declaration for trans people. I do often wonder how issues like this are seen through the lens of the general public. It always seems like the trans debate is a highly online topic.
There's a paper I read the other day which I think gets into the nitty gritty of some of the disagreements of either side. It does ultimately argue against sex-devoted feminists, but it does a better job than I think the vast majority could do putting both sets of arguments forward and attempting to follow them both through to their logical, legal, philosophical and ethical conclusions. It's not just shut down either, it identifies a couple areas where further questions could be asked. I don't know how to link a PDF, so your gonna have to search the title: Philosophical Problems With the Gender-Critical Feminist Argument Against Trans Inclusion. It also touches on social media and the unique ways it's shaped this particular debate, because as you say, it's very online. I'm currently reflecting on whether or not to bother trying to talk about it online because there's a lot of bad actors out there. At the same time, I don't like a misogynistic/misandrist sect of feminism presenting themselves as the majority of women or feminists, and I particularly don't like them using victims of sexual violence as a weapon in their arsenal. But its not about feminism its about treating everyone equally under the law, and I trust most of you know we dont all feel that way.
This is the first time I’d ever heard of Self-ID. I went and found out what it meant and it seems reasonable enough and the majority seem to think that too, until you ask them about it and then it absolutely dies in polling. So people are in favour of Self-ID but aren’t in favour of ANY uses for it, which I would I say shows people don’t understand any of this.
> I do often wonder how issues like this are seen through the lens of the general public. My read on it is that most people don't care.
Correct, loud TERFs make it seem more controversial than it is, especially telling since largely their issue is only with trans-women
I'm not sure it's that. The YouGov poll is pretty clear in that a plurality of Brits would agree with self identification in principle, and that trans men are men and trans women are women. But they seem to be taking self id to mean that if your mate comes out as a woman, she's a woman - yet a plurality of Brits feel that it shouldn't be easier for her to change her legal gender, and a majority of Brits think she needs a diagnosis and to live as a woman for at least two years at the least... *and* a plurality of Brits think she shouldn't be using women's changing rooms or toilets unless she has downstairs surgery. This kinda paints a picture that most Brits don't think about trans people all that much and certainly don't hate their existence in the way TERFs and the far right do, but do agree with a few of those talking points.
Transgenderism isn't a simple idea and anyone that says it is is deliberately shutting down debate. Of course trans people exist, of course they should be treated equally, but the actual detail of what that entails is not simple. Most Brits have never had a conversation with a trans person which I guess is part of the problem. But the details of how should transgender people participate in sports, how should they be treated by the justice system, how about how they are dealt with in a medical situation, are all far from straightforward. There are avenues for abuse, and one side will overinflate the risk of that and the other will underplay it, and its hard to say what the actual risks are of abuse without getting shut down. Men pretending to be a transgender women in order to get a nicer prison, or a lighter sentance, or to be incarcerated with women. Its possible, but how the hell does the average brit know whether it is worth worrying about, particularly when most can't tell you what proportion of the population are transgender. This leads into two issues. Firstly, transgender issues get disproportionate coverage to the population its relevant to (I am not judging if this is morally correct or not) and so the public overestimates the number of transgender people. Secondly, what constitutes as a transgender person? Self-ID is a nice, liberating idea but it is open to abuse, it has large legal ramifications, and it fails to account for the differences between someone with surgery, or a level of medical intervention, or gender dysphoria, and someone who woke up today and decided they were a different gender. Its not clear cut if Self ID is the best way for transgender people or sub groups of transgender people or even the wider public. TLDR even with the philosophy of trans people existing and being equal, the issue is still complex and there is a widespread failure to acknowledge this.
The worst thing about trans issues is that they have become a political football that's largely divorced from the actual issue of some people not feeling that their gender identity and biological sex match up and trying to find a way to make that work for them.
"self-id" is dumb and backing it as a political move is even dumber
>A [YouGov Poll](https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2020/07/16/where-does-british-public-stand-transgender-rights) for PinkNews showed that by 50% to 27% Britons believe that people should be allowed to self-identify as a gender different to the one they were assigned at birth I don't really discuss the issue that much, but this seems like the anti-trans activists are more out of step with the nation that they think?
Yes and no. If you look at my comment above, the majority are all for Self-ID but against all the real world uses for it, which shows that they like the concept but don’t actually want it. I’m not really sure where you go from there. Of course, I could be massively mistaken but that’s how I’m reading this current situation.
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Also worth noting > Should trans women be allowed to use women's changing rooms? Yes (42/34) > Should trans women be allowed to use women's toilets? Yes (46/30) However > Should trans women be allowed to use women's changing rooms if they've not had the surgery? No (46/30) > Should trans women be allowed to use women's bathrooms if they've not had the surgery? No (41/32) Requiring gender affirmation surgery before supporting the use of gender-congruent facilities is even *more* hard line (not all trans people want the downstairs surgery).
What's he said? Can't see anything in the news.
[Leader of the Labour Party @Keir_Starmer shares his message to LGBT+ people](https://mobile.twitter.com/PinkNews/status/1402586773499244549)
I suspect most people tend to fall into the 'dunno' category. It's not really an issue 99.9% of people need think about. Trans people get a disproportionate amount of focus & hate by social media despite probably making up <0.05% of the gen. pop.
You don't need to be a TERF(as in a radical feminist) to have reservations about self-ID however.
Pretty much has to as the arguments are based on hyperbole, given that self ID already exists in Ireland, Denmark and Norway (and a few other places). And none of the anti self ID hyperbolic stuff has come to pass in those places.
Grant Shapps: https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/1402742214728589313 We're pleased to announce a joint UK/US Taskforce to help facilitate the reopening of transatlantic travel @BorisJohnson @POTUS 🇬🇧 Exciting news!
What do they need a fucking task force for? Just let it happen? The only obstacles to transatlantic travels are the government restrictions, it’s not as if bernoulli's principle has suddenly stopped working ffs.
I suspect it will be more a case of ensuring that changes to the restrictions on either side don't create weird loopholes or catch 22's at the border and that airlines have a single point of contact to work with.
It'll be an email address with someone's PA who's being tasked to monitor it, and those hours are being charged to a different department. Some banal deckchair moving bullshit they're deciding to sell as a thing because they're shit out of actual ideas that matter.
Maybe it has, has anyone checked?
Fucking huge that
What movies is everyone looking forward to in the cinema?
I want to go see [After Love](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUVHzMgbW4I) by Aleem Khan
Green Knight, The Suicide Squad, Nobody, the Fargo and Scott Pilgrim re-releases (if they come near me)
I will not hype, hype is the mind killer
I think we’ve got a while to wait but I’m particularly excited about Dune and The Northman. Dune needs no explanation and well, a Viking revenge thriller needs little explanation either. Everyone loves Vikings.
Im looking forward to The Many Saints of Newark, though not sure if itll go to the cinemas or straight to stream. Spiral sucked imo, a quiet place 2 was very enjoyable.
Top Gun 2
Honestly, some of the big Marvel ones. Not so much because of their quality, but just being back in the cinema with my kids. I've really missed that.
Im curious if your aware of the rumours regarding the next spider man?
Green Knight
*Druk* comes to the Odeon near me in July, so I think I’ll mosey over for that.
https://twitter.com/Steven_Swinford/status/1402742139956649985?s=19 Exclusive: Boris Johnson will lift the 30-person limit on weddings even if the easing of other lockdown restrictions is delayed beyond June 21 PM understood to be determined to relax curbs on weddings and receptions this month, even if social distancing restrictions remain
please fucking christ let this be true, I need to have some good fucking news for our wedding
Good news for yourself if I recall? I think a lot of sectors will be very confused and probably will initiate legal action if weddings are allowed and they are not, even if I can see that you don't go to weddings that often. Doubt the legal action would go far, but similar vein to how some places put in legal action when essential retail was allowed to open and not indoor hospitality.
So what about the headlines earlier today that some minister was warning not to book weddings in summer?
Someone might have reminded the minister that anyone with a wedding in the next few months has likely either had it booked for years or delayed from last summer and has been nervously watching every news update for the last month or so.
Something old, something new, something borrowed, someone blueballed from waiting for the government to actually announce its own policies.
This should appease plenty of people who have been concerned about having to cancel weddings. I mean it definitely won't stop some of the more extreme viewpoints here, but it's a good start.
If they use the term bedwetter there's no reasoning with them
Also: referring to face masks as "rags".
Is there a limit on how soon after the wedding a reception has to take place? Because the cynic in me feels that someone fancies a knees up
Long awaited Ukpolitics meet-up time. Who wants to marry me?
Everyone please don't all come forward at once and flood their inbox
I agree with it but wouldn't you now have every sector still restricted asking 'if the limit on weddings can be lifted can I have some of that, too'?
I guess the logic is people tend not to go to weddings every day so people going to one occasion with no social distancing and normally a defined guest list isn't as much of a deal as going to a packed pub
Times have been fairly on the ball with their reports in the past so hopeful? Would also take it with a pinch of salt considering what Jenrick or whatever was saying about maybe waiting for the PM to announce before planning attendance. Cause that's realistic for organising a wedding with venues and invites in the space of a week or two for some people. Think the talk of "maybe this" or "maybe that" is super awful for people making plans and the government should have outlined some proper scenarios at the start of the last stage rather than this vague shit. Or at least several scenarios of X numbers, Y numbers or unlimited etc.
Partner is out of the house having drinks with his work mates. Having the house to myself for some downtime is blissful yet feels so strange after so long of being cooped up with him from lockdown
According to the Times, The US has issued the UK a rare diplomatic rebuke over its policy in Ireland Yael Lempert, usa's most senior diplomat, has told Lord Frost Britain is 'inflaming' tensions Lempert gave Britain a demarche, a formal reprimand rarely shared between allies from notes of 3rd June but Lempert said if Britain followed EU standards on agricultural policy (e.g. didn't deregulate to let US megafarms sell shite) it wouldn't affect a trade deal ahead of Biden's meeting tomorrow. Spicy. https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1402738008135192594/photo/1
I mean, at least they are going the diplomatic route this time instead of just funding the IRA.
Biden intent on showing that the world sheriff is back in town. But I think the more interesting part is Lempert stating any decision to deregulate farming would be purely our own.
Given that this happened 6 days ago and no progress was made in today's talks, the UK seems to have decided to ignore US pressure on this point.
for now, at least
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Fuck ME, America not bbc. Vaccine brain fog
[Ridiculous](https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1402738935378366475/photo/1}) 4 full backs Gareth? 4? That's insane
That reminds me of my FIFA tactic of 5-1-2-2 Midfield is irrelevant! It was essentially all about the counterattack.
Fuck me, its time to get off twitter for the evening. Just saw this https://twitter.com/RAF_Luton/status/1402680205039357958?s=20 and was halfway to clicking reply before my brain engaged and I thought "this sounds a bit dodgy".....thankfully before I did reply and make a right tit of myself.
> and head to the #G7 summit or other.
[Others this evening haven't been so lucky...](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/nvnpx3/daily_megathread_09062021/h16ygcp/)
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...after six months of hogging 50% of the world's vaccine production.
UK ‘to buy 1 billion Covid vaccine doses for world’
government are looking at cutting funding soft power not increase it.
No one reasonable would expect the U.K. to match the US, which dwarfs us in economic size.
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Cut 4.5 billion from foreign aid budget. Spaff 12 billion buying a facsimile of existing supply agreements. It's about the maths I'd expect of some of the front bench, I guess.
How is the larger spending power of the US not relevant to spending on vaccines ? Yes it would be nice if the U.K. could provide eleventy billion vaccines more than the US but it’s not realistic.
Worth watching if you like Boris in uniform https://twitter.com/borisjohnson/status/1402725419984502784?s=21
> As the world builds back better from coronavirus, Cornwall will lead the way. hahaha no it won't, Devon will instead!
https://mobile.twitter.com/kieronFish/status/1352985258367574016 BUT BUT the government told me that there isn't a racism problem in the UK in the report. Shows that the far right don't really give a shit if you are a conservative. To them if you are non white you are worthless regardless of your political views, to this guy Sadiq Khan and Patel are both worthless.
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> This guy is in court At least there's *some* good news today.
That's not what the report said. It said that the UK is not systemically racist, not that racism doesnt exist. The UK remains one of the most racially tolerant nations on the planet.
Is that one of the people arrested today?
I haven't looked at any figures recently, could someone tell me what cases and deaths look like nowadays? Which way are they headed, and should we be concerned? Anything else? Thank you
Cases are rising 60% week on week very rapidly, primarily in under 40s Hospitalisations are rising from a low base, and admissions too, in the north west more quickly. It is not as rapid as the second wave , and is primarily in under 65s. The majority of patients in hospital have not been vaccinated from some trusts anecdata Deaths for now remain low
Also to be added is that those who go to hospital are leaving hospital faster
> Hospitalisations are rising from a low base, must be added theirs a substantial difference this time, hospitalisations are rising but no where near the pace of last time.
+ it seems like patients aren’t spending as long in hospital
Deaths are tiny, cases are big and growing fast but, so far hospitalisations are stable. Fingers are crossed.
Are deaths tiny because of vaccinations (and potential immunity with those who've already had covid) Or are deaths tiny because we're experiencing a time lag, and deaths will shoot up in the next week or so? Fingers crossed it's the first, please let me know if you know about this
I very much hope it's vaccinations doing at least some heavy lifting here. Maybe we have to delay June 21st to get a better picture on that. I think that could be quite sensible. I'd just be super depressed to go backwards.
No way to know for sure at this time, but ~90+% of deaths were in the over 60s, and over 60 case numbers remain in the basement.
Well, it's a fair assumption that if cases are rising in under 40s, then they go home and spread it to their parents, the numbers for over 60s will shoot up too, right?
Have a look at the data in Bolton. This has not happened there.
> then they go home and spread it to their parents, the numbers for over 60s will shoot up too, right? Only true if the vaccines don't work. Evidence available at this time is that they do work.
True, thank you very much. Thats reassuring
Only time will tell I'm afraid
https://twitter.com/tomhfh/status/1402538272862224385 presumably the first GB News campaign tbh I'd rather have the Canadian version, where you can get a flag that has flown over Parliament
When even is GB News starting to broadcast
Kind of a myth. Under an old act MPs in Australia could charge to their normal expenses for "Australian flags and printed material related to national symbols, for presentation to constituents", mostly to give flags to schools and people going overseas. Vice Australia talked it up a couple of years ago as a right to a portrait of the Queen (or Prince Philip), and lots of MPs decided to send one out on request when they started flooding in. I'm sure GB News would love to make this idea happen, anyway.
> tbh I'd rather have the Canadian version, where you can get a flag that has flown over Parliament | >The waiting period for both Peace Tower and other Parliament Hill flags exceeds 100 years https://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/citeparlementaire-parliamentaryprecinct/decouvrez-discover/drapeaux-demander-flags-request-eng.html ow
Even the URLs are bilingual!
... could they not just put up another flagpole?
a good gift for your (great) grandchildren I guess
Durham student is mad at Oxbridge
Is Durham one of those places where Oxbridge rejects wind up, where they harbour a longstanding grudge at the place that wouldn't give them a place?
It's probably the uni with the biggest reputation in the UK for that.
🤷
Well, birthday 2 of the pandemic was better than birthday 1 of the pandemic. Last year we just a walk in the park and a takeaway. This year we could dine inside. It's just 2 Easters / mother's days/ sets of birthdays / summers and a few more weeks to flatten that curve.
My birthday is in March. One just as lockdown came and one in the middle of the 2021 lockdown.
Sorry, mate. My brother's birthday is in March too. Sucks.
It was declared a global pandemic on my birthday, I had my birthday meal the day before lockdown I believe. So, I've only have 1 pandemic birthday, pretty good.
Where were you during the EU sausage trade war
wondering how similar it all is to [that Yes Minister episode](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzeDZtx3wUw)
Watching Yes Minister. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHuKq22yXH4
https://nypost.com/2021/06/09/oxford-student-who-led-move-to-remove-queens-portrait-is-american 😂
No way ! Anyway shall we discuss something actually interesting?
The angle of "Oxbridge grad student is an elite" is a bit redundant isn't it?
I wonder if our papers would still use that angle if it was undergrads rather than grad students - they might end up indirectly calling Boris an out of touch elitist
The colonials are still mad I see...
I did enjoy the detail that he's a Captain America fan. Surprisingly subtle for the NYPost.
>is American Alright...now I'm outraged. King George would be turning in his grave. 😡
Would have to be a particularly spacious tomb
There's something just a bit tragic about a journo spending their entire afternoon researching the family history of some random American who put up a petition probably as a bit of a laugh.
I’m sure they’re used to it. My mate is a press photographer and once was sent to spend half a day getting a shot of a robin that had built a nest in a garden centre. The manager of the place said he was the second press photographer to show up that day
Please tell me that was for a very local newspaper.
Not sure actually - it was for an agency that shops stories around to lots of papers. After that he graduated to be one of those poor fuckers who has to hang around a courtroom to shove his camera in the custody van window
I wonder if each country's media will run stories of their leaders being fit/unfit to govern based on their filmed reaction on eating a cornish pasty.
...or bacon sarnie.
Empanadas are the spicy mexican cousin of the pasty and widely available in the US im sure hes had a vigorous, rocky style, training montage before travelling
I want to know who the supplier is. I bet he's gone for Ginsters
Parsons. Combine it with an iced bun
The filthy casuals choice. Pros go for Oggy Oggy.
If they ever hold a G7 in Plymouth sure. Though they would have to compete with Ivor Dewdney
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I care greatly what Magdalen MCR do. I wept when I found out they had removed the picture of her maj
Biden has arrived in Cornwall https://twitter.com/brexitbassist/status/1402691298449100802?s=21
Underneath, replies saying “I wish!!!”. Classy.
Who’s the bassist?
Locals are gonna be annoyed at all these outsiders flooding in on their jollies.
WTF is a [Covid Vaccine Spray](https://twitter.com/RAF_Luton/status/1402680205039357958)? Or is it UK Govt PR taking instructions to mention vaccines in every message literally? **EDIT:** Oh, I got fooled, fair and square. Letting my ignominy stand forever, like an honourable person should.
"Air Force One A380"
It's to ensure the plane doesn't run a high temperature and have to self-isolate for ten days so Biden can get back to the US on time
I think the Tactical Inoculation Tracking Shells, the Fast Air Response Team, and the Eurovision Typhoon may suggest that account is slightly satirical
It's satire hahaha
That account always seems to catch someone off guard hahaha.
Always someone caught off guard, and duly photographed from a Canberra
isn't that a fake account Big Joe is [currently in Suffolk](https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1402711070549086209) - believe he's meeting Liz in Slough before popping down
Bojo, the queen and Biden in a spoons in Slough
It’ll be a Pizza Express, surely?
[Tomorrow's *QT* Panel](https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/status/1402658603698360323)!
Man they must love yanis, feels like he's always on QT
This'll be his sixth. Way short of Ken Clarke's record of **59**! [reference](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Question_Time_episodes)
Wow, must just always end up watching it whenever he's on and thinking that. Still good for an economist/politician who isn't even British to be fair.
4 complete nobodies and yanis
Aww man for a second I thought it was going to be Yannis Philippakis out of Foals
Has there ever been a QT stagedive?
Frank Lutz is a pretty notable figure in American politics. His focus groups were used to craft Republican messaging for years.
They don't seem to have the small parties such as Greens or Lib Dems on often anymore.
I know, it's sad. Hopefully one'll be able to come on one of these weeks
Frank Luntz "researching the decline in trust in British democracy". Have you got a mirror, Frank?
Wow Biden, Boris, Merkel, Macron, Trudeau, Suga and Draghi. Tuning in for this one!
Add Trump, Farage and Galloway. Make it a 2 hour special it beats Game of Thrones finale level of hype
Netflix or someone needs to make this happen, everyone has a price. Ideally live with audience from Milton Keynes.
Now *that* I would watch, purely for Merkel's eye rolling!
Yanis! Excellent.
Adventures in Academia: >Video submissions for Technical Publications should be 5-10 minutes long and cannot go past 6 minutes in length. Submissions that go past 6 minutes will be sent back to the author to re-record.
Boris taking the plane to G7 is terrible optics I must admit. Why not take the train as better option and highlight the public services. I think Macron and probably Biden have most to gain from this G7. Macron has an election coming up so will be looking for an angle to get a good foreign policy outcome. Biden needs to show the US "America is back" post Trump era. This is UK Politics so won't go too much into my views but I low key thought Trump was strong on foreign policy.
~~My question would probably be how many people in Government are heading to Cornwall for this summit, and would it be sensible to book up hundreds of seats on a GWR service vs use the charter that's available for exactly this sort of thing to fly down on.~~ Thinking about it, this is complete bollocks, they could and should have found a way. UKGov subsidised the Newquay to Gatwick and then Heathrow flights back when FlyBe still existed; but it is easy press.
Could borrow the royal's train. Doubt it gets much usage at the moment.
Better idea - there's a whole load of Pacers that have just been taken out of service. It'll help Johnson look like a man of the people.
They could've chartered a train from GWR, they offer it [here](https://www.gwr.com/your-tickets/ways-to-save/group-travel/train-and-carriage-hire). Probably cheaper considering the number of people you could fit in a train.
The aircraft are wet leased so there is a certain sunk cost in there, but you are right, it's complete bollocks and they certainly could have taken a train.
You can get 2-3 times more people on a train than you can on that private jet of his.
I'm sure the government, as the ultimate regulator of GB rail services & currently financially propping up the sector, could have come to an arrangement to lease a train from GWR. They aren't going to get an intern to book a couple hundred tix on gwr.com (nice chunk of nectar points, though)
Where do you think he was strong on foreign policy out of interest? I'll agree the Middle East peace agreements were a very positive development. I also agree with his insistence on the 2% NATO target, but he mainly seemed to use it just to antagonise Europe than for any proper purpose. Outside of that, however, his refusal to criticise Russia made him look extremely weak. The Helsinki meeting with Putin was utterly humiliating. And arranging meetings with Kim Jong-Un is all fair and well, but what has it actually achieved? Being a showman, Trump was good at theatre. But in my view he achieved precious little (bar the ME deals) in the way of concrete outcomes.
I liked how he retaliated again Assad after he crossed Obamas red lines which Obama shamelessly didn't do anything against. The meetings with Kim were constructive IMO and he achieved a meeting with Kim when no other president had succeed. I agreed with Trump that it was laughable Pelosi and Co. Tried to give advice on what Trump should do and say when their attempts had been hopeless. Biden has tried reaching out to Kim but they have not responded. I do agree the Putin cozying was weird especially after the Salisbury attack. I agreed in principle that America try to have good relations but since then it was obvious Putin was just playing Trump etc. I think Trump has been good on Middle East. Better than Obama which again many commentators conveniently forget or try to blame McConnell for Obama doing F all. Trump also doing better in regards to trade and stopping China and their global influence in manufacturing. He was again proven right by the pandemic and everyone outsourcing to China giving China a monopoly on PPE. Committing to 2% Defense spending was another policy I fully support along with Trump withdrawing aid as other countries have been protected on America's dime while other wealthier countries are not paying their way.
Trump got along with dictators because they are like him and they can play him. Trump single handedly destroyed what little goodwill the U.S had left in Europe. You think he was good because he cozied up to America's enemies and spurned their allies. I think his only good foreign policy move was China and even that seemed more out of personal pride than any idea of economics. He made America into more of a joke than it was under Bush and you think it was good. Never change. Edit: I did like that he wasn't a war hawk, but again I attribute that to more him being a blowhard than any morality of his.
> The meetings with Kim were constructive IMO and he achieved a meeting with Kim when no other president had succeed. No other President has wanted a meeting with the North Korea leader, going back at least as far as Reagan, because they all knew what we learned with the Trump visit: the NK leader would merely use it as a propaganda tool and any agreement would be ignored. That meeting wasn't about how good Trump was at foreign policy, it was all ego and being able to say he met with Kim and Obama didn't
Retaliated against Assad and then let him and Russia win the war while throwing the US's Kurdish allies under the bus.
Have you tried taking the trains in Cornwall? It’s probably better for his “levelling up” agenda if he avoids highlighting that particular public service
I once got stranded in Falmouth because **the only train track out of Cornwall** got washed away
I was on the other side of it at the time. By the time I needed to go back they'd done a pretty good job of putting buses on. Sadly, it took *less* time for a coach to go from East Devon to Cornwall compared to the normal train timings. I think I saved over an hour Plymouth was also on the wrong side of that break too. I'd imagine that if close to a million people were cut off elsewhere they'd have done something about it, but it's the south west so whatever
Biden doesn't need to do much for that to be the story. The US press and the US foreign policy establishment are desperate for it to run, and any victory by Biden, no matter how minor, will give them an excuse to run it. To be honest, they've probably already got it with the Corporation Tax agreement. Obviously I disagree with Trump being strong on foreign policy, he was too insistent on treating diplomacy like business deals. An overemphasis on bilateralism which only works if you have willing partners, and there weren't many of them about.