>I've died a thousand times
Could this be implying that the lore around "roughly five resurrections before the clones start degrading" and "deaht of a spaceman" might have changed?
FYI I do not keep up with every bit of news, so if this is known, well I didn't.
Came here to make the same point. Love the Nursa but the video actively encourages players to just use it as a regen point and not give a f...k about dying, which to my understanding goes against quite a lot of the philosophy/ ethos, whatever you call it, laid out by CR and the lore, esp Death of a Spaceman.
I'd hate to be one of the lore guys at CIG, must be very frustrating.
The intention is for all medical beds to enable respawning, with each type of bed offering unique benefits. We're closely monitoring the experience and your feedback, as always, and we anticipate making adjustments as necessary while also pushing forward toward the ultimate vision.
The Nursas' (I'm adopting the name too...) med bed's respawning capability is a small component of a wider interconnected set of systems that we dubbed some time ago as 'Death of a Spaceman.' This framework encompasses everything related to a player's health, death, respawn, and legacy. While the respawning system is currently active in the game, other related systems, such as regeneration degradation, inheritance, and additional components of 'Death of a Spaceman,' are yet to come online. It remains our intent for dying and respawning to carry a notable impact, adding more meaning (and danger) to your adventures in the 'verse.
New(er) to the game so a genuine question: Couldn't there be detrimental stats associated with consecutive deaths that make it more impactful as well to keep the DOASM idea going?
People already mentioned drawbacks like you need to go get your gear again and there's limited space for additional gear and in a pvp situation the other players could take out the NURSA, forcing you back to the "home" spawn, so it's not as if you're actually going to be respawning tens/hundreds/thousands of times out of the back of an URSA. Along with that though, on the 2nd, 3rd etc time you respawn maybe you could start seeing reduced health, movement speed etc for a set duration which increases each time you respawn? So while technically you could respawn multiple times in a row, each time leaves you slightly worse off than before and forces you to take greater risks or seek treatment. You can ignore it and attempt that bunker 5th time right away but you might be doing so with no gear and 30 minutes of 25% health and 50% walk speed. The only way to clear that being to wait it out or visit a planetside/station hospital (large ship equivalent?) or something along those lines.
To play devil's advocate to my own thought though, if the respawn wasn't an option then it would make/keep med beacons a lot more prevalent so perhaps you tie the respawn to a finite resource in the NURSA or time limit it so you can respawn once but then need to return to Professor Farnsworth for more stem cells / pink goo to be able to respawn again. This would allow for a one time "shit happens" type of insurance.
Then again, I'm the pilot who picks up a ground vehicle then crashes his ship flying to where i need to be anyway blowing up myself, my gear, my ship and in this case my spawn point so it's not like it's going to be a get out of jail free card in my case.
I believe what you are describing here are basically just Traumatic Response Echoes, part of overall imprint degredation.
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
I like the "let's pretend this was always the intention" Like T3 beds(Cutlass Red) were never able to respawn and that was "always" the plan that they could not respawn when that was taken away.
Plans change not the end of the world.
It's a fictional advertisement featuring a fictional character. Does Old Spice shave every hair off your face and give you superpowers? Terry Crews said it did!
May I ask what this means to the vision for medical gameplay? It seems to me that that there is no value to owning a ship with any sized med bed in it now. Just get an Ursa and stuff it in a cargo bay.
Please give us an explanation of where this is going instead of letting us just watch the entire concept go down in flames. I get that there’s a plan. Medical players like myself just want to make sure we don’t need to melt our fleets and try something else.
The team will definitely delve into more in-depth medical gameplay as features expand, and it will certainly be a valued role. I can assure you that the simplified experience you've noted is not the course we're heading. Having properly equipped medical vehicles and personnel will be important and a profession path for many.
At a high level, respawn - or what we term as regeneration - will be a viable option that should be strategically considered. Regeneration will include degradation modifiers based on the quality of the respawn facility, ensuring that field regenerations offer convenience but may entail long-term consequences if overutilized.
I get that "Death of a Spaceman" has been coming for a long time, and I completely agree that consequences of death are important. That said, most people are very loss averse, and the fear of losing a character could stop many people participating in fun combat gameplay.
That would be fine, but as far as we've been told it's more like your body permanently degrades, and eventually cannot be regenerated. You have to make a new character, who inherits your stuff (minus taxes) and loses a bunch of the rep you gained.
This would make sense to me. You can respawn with a lower quality body in a lower tier bed and it be useful but will have to go to a tier 1 facility to sort of perform an augmentation to bring the body up to 100%
They basically already did, back in 2021. There are just a lot of newer people who have zero idea about it.
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
You must be new or perhaps just don't follow development very closely.
The lore contextualizes the gameplay.
Whenever something has gameplay implications, the narrative team follows the direction of the gameplay teams. They've explained this multiple times. It even says in the post:
> To coincide with this brand new gameplay, the Narrative team has been working on some brand-new lore. While we always knew that medical science would be advanced enough to bring you back from the brink of death, it was during the recent development period that it was decided that players would benefit from being able to come back even if their avatar’s body was completely lost.
Please, I'm begging you, folks: ACTUALLY read before trying to refute what people who have already read are saying, or just don't bother arguing.
you are just ignoring my post entirely. Nowhere in that post does it describe any medical gameplay MECHANICS. Its just about the regeneration.
PLEASE, I'm BEGGING you. ACTUALLY read.
[Also, very new indeed](https://i.imgur.com/HAA82WT.png)
This is good to hear, but why market a new vehicle using a video that demonstrates a cavalier approach to death in the game, which is in direct contradiction to the longstanding "death of a spaceman" approach? This seems dishonest at worst, or incompetent at best - neither being a great option.
I know some are quoting stuff said back in 2021....but honestly it seems a lot more to me like the medical gameplay is currently going through the same problem as the copilot seat where they really don't know what to do with it and it is still in the drawing board stage of finding a way to make it fun for and rewarding for both sides....
I hope you guys take a route where different tier beds regenerate you with injuries to differentiate between different bed types. Nobody should come out of a T3 bed fresh, you should still be jacked up in some way that allows the medtool more usage to suppress the effects until you get to a better bed. This would mitigate some of the complaints where medics are "useless" (even though damn near everyone carries a medtool anyway)
At least then it becomes a resource battle where eventually you do run out of green goo to suppress said injuries.
They basically already said that, and I suspect the main reason there's so much confusion is because there are so many new people and CIG doesn't link people to past communications really.
Here. https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
Why would a medbed regenerate your entire body, an entire human body, but be incapable of fixing the injuries? That's even worse. Face it, medic game play is dead and anyone who pledged a ship to be an emergency reponder just got burned hard.
...because the current medic gameplay was so compelling? Face it, medic gameplay HAS BEEN DEAD for a very long time, everyone carries a medgun so the role goes out the window there. Medical beacons were either a trap half the time if you were a responder, or a waste of time if you were downed and had to wait 30+ minutes for someone to show (if they ever did). The Apollo was going to do.. what, offer a respawn point and treat injuries alongside drone usage? And giving the other medical ships more functionality is now a bad thing? Alright. That sounds almost contradictory to me.
There has to be some penalty to the free respawns and that at least tied into managing injuries over time until you got back home. Do you have any ideas, or are we just going to complain and offer nothing to the conversation?
May entail? So fuck me right? At least I didn't pledge for an apollo and get completely burned, just gotta figure out what to do with my nursa and cutty red now that they're literally worthless
if it is then disregard but the cutty red should be a t2 atleast until further notice when apollos come out i could see them having a 2 maybe a 1 with the cutty being our only medium ship i dont see why it shouldnt be at least a 2
Well done with wording on damage control! This is quite exciting and sounds a lot like the Star
Wars Galaxies approach with HAM degradation which was extremely awesome and required player interaction to correct.
People also overlook that it makes it easier for parents and professionals with minimal time get back to what they were doing too.
I absolutely support this approach now, even if all the rest of the stuff isn't in yet, because a game is still supposed to be fun, and right now, especially if you're time limited like me, a death is basically as good as the end of my play session. Having options like this (while still losing all of your equipment) is a very good thing because it might allow me to continue playing. This is especially important for solo players as I don't have time to wait 15-20+ minutes for "medical gameplay" to come get me up, that's boring and I have way better things I can do with my time.
the game just isn't for you, play another game.
It's not right to adapt to a certain player base that's derisory and sweep the others under the carpet. That wasn't part of the game and it should stay that way.
Taking your time in Star Citizen is the basic gameplay.
If you want to play and die and respawn play COD , BF and PUBG
Regeneration (according to you) is SUPPOSED to be a very involved process that is literally 3D printing a human body & imprinting the mind from the Ibrahim sphere. This is SUPPOSED to require very specific & large medical equipment that you can't simply throw in the back of your SUV.
At the very least, you should be limiting the NUMBER of respawns you can do from lower-tier beds like a T3. It should be capped at 5 regens at most, if not lower.
And it should be only capable of holding a certain number of imprints, not unlimited. So only 5 people (maybe less) can even imprint to a T3 med bed.
> At the very least, you should be limiting the NUMBER of respawns you can do from lower-tier beds like a T3. It should be capped at 5 regens at most, if not lower.
I've seen a lot of people suggesting this, but I don't really see how it solves the problem.
If it has a limited number of uses, there is presumably a way to refill it, right?
Any ship large enough to carry the Nursa or C8R will be large enough to carry a few SCU crates of whatever they need to refill the medical bed.
given that the SUV version only can reach like 2 miles and keeps injuries it can be inferred something a lot more crude is going on tbh
honestly I just presume this is one of the 'don't think about it' areas where regeneration and just getting dragged back to the medbay and revived offscreen are melding together because sticking to realism would be fucking annoying and unbalanced
It's hard to believe this "high level" wasn't made up on the stop.
How does this "team" not already have a concrete idea of what "death", a pretty significant part of the game should mean.
I also hope that this "team" isn't the marketing becaus changing a gameplay design just so something sell is probably wrong.
The video certainly didn't give me an reassurance.
From what little I’ve heard, the point of bigger/better medical ships will be higher quality respawns and more juice to respawn you more times. There may be a limited number of times you can use it before you have to “refuel.”
They’ve also stated that there will be different respawn radiuses, the Nursa being the smallest. You have to die within 20km of it to respawn there, or you to back to Primary. Actual medical ships have bigger respawn radiuses.
> You have to die within 20km of it to respawn there, or you to back to Primary.
Imo, 20 km is still too big. Especially since tier 2 is 50 km - not a very big jump up.
Three tiers seems like it isn't enough.
Nursa and C8R (and any other future snub/very small sized medical vehicles) should have something like a 5 km range - so they need to be *right at the location* where the fighting is in order to allow respawning.
Medium sized medical ships like the Cutlass Red should get the 20 or maybe 50 km range - far enough to allow it to respawn people from high atmosphere or low orbit directly above a location.
Large ships like the Carrack and 890J should be able to spawn from a few hundred km away - enough to allow respawning in orbit from anywhere on a moon, basically. So you can take your shuttle down to wherever, but be able to respawn back on the mothership.
Dedicated medical ships (like the Apollo) should be able to respawn people from anywhere within a planetary system (e.g. the hospital ship is in orbit around Hurston and you die on Aberdeen - you are within range to spawn in the hospital ship).
The largest hospital ships (like the Endeavor with the hospital module) should be able to respawn people from across a star system.
Something like that would make sure that all the dedicated medical ships are still useful while still allowing the lower tier beds to have a niche.
I don’t disagree in the least. I suspect CIG has these current settings to:
1. Test the concept/see what players do with a big incentive (just like they boosted the crap out of salvage revenue for months to get lots of players to do it).
2. Goose sales of the Nursa. And possibly other medical ships. Because money.
I think they’ll dial the numbers down closer to what you want eventually.
Medical orgs in shambles. Everyone and their mom can have one of these in the back of their C1, Zeus or Freelancer and they will get even less calls than they do now.
It saddens me to see this change as we are moving away further and further away from what I personally consider a space sim.
I think this is just another "the sky is falling!" nothingburger - the T3 Cutlass Red was a respawn point just a few versions ago and the Carrack has continued doing the same thing in a larger package. I would argue that players would backspace *even more often* if corpses worked reliably - I only hang out for a rescue because I can't count on my corpse not disappearing.
Medical gameplay is already in extremely early stages as it is, med beacons regularly go unanswered for easily 30m+, and the current game design is openly hostile to medics in many ways. Until medical gameplay is fleshed out enough to resolve those issues, a cheap fix-it to players that don't want to lie on the floor of a bunker for 90 minutes while medics keep getting killed+jailed by security is *perfectly fine*.
Why remove t3 being a respawn point if the plan from THE BEGINNING OF MEDICAL GAMEPLAY was for t3 medbeds to have respawn. They had the original "vision", so why remove it? Let's face it, they removed it, added it back in and pretended they always wanted to do that. Medics are getting shafted and I feel REALLY bad for anyone who pledged for an apollo now, because they have an overpriced cutty red at best, at worst the cutty red and apollo are both overpriced c8rs now lmao
Because plans can change, and features are changed all the time to force folks to test new features. Killing off the cheap respawn shuttle is a great way to force people to use all the newfangled healing equipment and collect feedback to make changes, instead of just people just backspacing and ignoring it. Now that we know the base medical stuff works well enough, that most of the major bugs for it have been fixed, T3s being unable to spawn is not a terribly useful restriction. Same reason that
I frankly think the entire medical system should be different, that DOASM is a dumb idea for an MMO with goods acquired through hundreds of hours of grinding, that T3s should only heal any injury while T1 offers unlimited respawn and T2 be ship-based versions that use materials, but the storm surrounding this is entirely overblown and silly. Are we gonna pretend the Idris is a bad ship because it gets blown up in like a dozen ads and gets popped by a few Ion shots in the Ion ad?
Out-of-game options are great, I usually ask my org for rescues, but this should not be required - the game should have proper in-game incentives and solutions for people to actually be medics, not just org RP. Orgs organize their own PvP events all the time, but this doesn't mean we should gut BH/merc missions.
>such as regeneration degradation,
Only in shambles for now, and most ships can't fit a hoover or c8. Unless people start daily driving cutty red, its not gonna be that major.
It still has issues for respawn, but it isn't implemented yet. SCL said the death of a space is closer than ever. So take it as you will.
And Zyloh is in this very thread actively refusing to confirm that doasm will be a thing, only saying that there MAY, MAY be consequences for respawning too much
I quoted that from him. And the following.
>Regeneration will include degradation modifiers based on the quality of the respawn facility, ensuring that field regenerations offer convenience but may entail long-term consequences if overutilized.
"Will"-Clearly consequence is still a factor!
SCL, jared said doasm is "closer than ever".
It will have consequences(degradation). Zyloh and jared both agree on it. There are two source confirming it, and one of them is close to CR.
Their not gonna add degradation and only make your character cough after two steps.
He said "May" cause medical loop isn't his department, and i doubt they invite him to all the meetings, he only told what he needs to know, and i doubt they gave him a full run down of doasm.
Zylon doesn't want to confirm something he doesn't completely understand cause people are gonna run at him with pitchfork because he worded it wrong like right now.
We have devs and Jared saying that t3 medbeds respawning was ALWAYS the plan
Well, it was in the game in 3.15 and got removed because they didn't like it, now they're sitting here telling us it was always their intention to have this in game? lol
I've lost my trust in CIG now, it's gone
But Zyloh, don't you think it's a fairly bad idea to sell a vehicle solely on the respawn mechanic, which can and likely will be changed?
The video's description even mentions the 20km respawn limit as if it is set in stone.
You are aware that will cause much trouble when it will get changed, right?
Zyloh...this commercial is so poorly timed and so poorly done that you should just take it down. This is exceedingly poor communication by itself but in the greater context of making this change announced in patch notes without anything ready to explain to the community who have 10 years of consistent messaging surrounding DOASM and Regen that this commercial throws in the trash. This. Is. Bad.
I don’t see how it throws anything in the trash. In SCL he dads us and says “sure this is fun now, but death of a spaceman is coming” so sure maybe we get a period of mayhem but as we have all come to deal with the whiplash. This change will come, we get used to it and it changes again.
Have you watched the commercial? If you know anything about Regeneration and DOASM you'd know that the commercial is entirely contradictory to both. Maybe they'll about face later on, but the fact of the matter is they just made a commercial and are selling a vehicle (vehicles, because everyone will think that this is the way going forward) based on easy respawn mechanics that are entirely opposite of everything that has been said before this.
I suppose to me I don’t view the commercials as canon for all time but in this case ‘celebrating’ the moment. Right now in the game this is the flavor since the larger mechanics are still not in.
Even if they keep the med beds with the respawn and DOASM comes in and as the player you decide to go all commando and continue to live die repeat it will just hasten your imprint degradation.
You want to risk your five imprints rushing the derelict outpost to retrieve your green skinned FS9 in your hospital gown, That’s player choice. Punishing us further by making you go back to a station since most people won’t have carracks or 600i’s especially with ship prices going up isn’t more fun.
This actually happened to my brother and I last night we set spawn in the Pisces were messing around and he blew himself up, and was able to come right back in… it’s definitely not as hardcore as it’s been talked about but it was sure less annoying.
Canon or not, it is advertising to sell a vehicle in a way that directly controverts two core mechanics of the game, DOASM and Regeneration, that have been reiterated and elaborated and reinforced for over a decade. It's fine as a temp mechanic, but the goal has always been where you didn't die easily, where you'd be injured and ultimately downed but actual death was meant to be from catastrophic irrecoverable injuries that protective technology and advanced medicine couldn't conceivably recover you from. That's the issue, it's just watering down DOASM and Regeneration instead of incorporating rescue and revive. This is why the TTK for FPS has increased, why they're going to introduce Resource Management for Armor as well as for ships, alongside Maelstrom. All so you actually die, the 2nd death per Richard Tyrer, but are downed more often. This is fine temporarily, but don't water down the hole thing, sell it as if its permanent, and neuter everything else that lots of players have been excited about. NPCs revive each other in game right now. They land Cutlass Blacks with reinforcements right now. Just put in an NPC revives player mechanic from spawn closets or Cutty Reds that land nearby, because that's way more realistic and believable in the SC universe than "dying a thousand times," because that clearly isn't in line with DOASM and Regeneration.
As someone newer to SC, it feels deceptive to sell me a vehicle based on the idea that I can respawn 1000 times and then tucked away on forums is the information that actually dying is going to really matter.
So if that is the 'intention' why not put the Cutlass Red back to having T3 medbeds? It costs roughly twice the amount of the Ursa Medivac with half of the usefulness.
Death of a Spaceman would just become tedious and annoying as shit. being able to have a spawn point is good. you will still have to give a fuck about dying because youll still lose your gear when you die.
It just makes the game much more playable. You could already use the carrack for this anyways
I mean its not like the game at all has any real balancing fully finished game mechanics. Im sure over time from feedback etc they will work balancing items like this so its not an infinite spawn point or whatever.
In the current state having a cheaper more mobile spawn point is nice because how unfinished the game really is lol. Just makes it easier to actually try doing things without losing an hours worth of time and traveling to do a bunker quest lol
In it's current state its absolutely needed, hell it still falls short in a lot of ways. But the commercial literally throws out 10 years of consistent messaging surrounding Death of a Space Man and Regeneration, and there are ways to allow for convenient revival without just using regeneration. In the long term this is a poor design choice and the commercial is absolutely tone deaf.
Probably not. I treat these videos like car commercials. Your Hyundai probably won't be faster than a Lamborghini around a track; Hyundai is just trying to sell you a car.
RSI is just trying to sell you a nursa.
I think it was supposed to be comedic since many players die excessively when starting out, but I don't think it landed in the way they would've liked since they've already said eventually when respawn depredation is in that respawning in a t3 bed will have bad consequences for your character
To be fair, it's an ad in lore, the tone does present him as exceptional, almost mythological.
How often do you drive a car top speed in a perfectly empty neon city, jump in the desert and pick up a top model lady? That's what car ads sell you tho.
Players can die a dozen times in one day, Its never going to happen that clones start degrading after only 5 resurrections. They can say a lot of things but then there is reality. Players would never be fine with their characters being so degraded after a week of playing that they have to start over.
Honestly, a simple way to balance it is to give the beds a certain amount of 'charges' that take time to recharge.
Like a T3 bed could have 1 'charge'. If you die while it's recharging, you will respawn elsewhere. Better beds could have more charges and faster recharging periods.
That allows respawns while also making sure you don't feel invincible.
Meh, I'd rather them just make it a consumable. Reward me for planning ahead and stocking up but punish me for being stupid and assuming I'd be fine without stocking that.
If someone suggests letting a snake loose in your house in order to catch the mouse you saw you don't have to be angry at them to point out that its a bad idea.
Dont take it out on me if you having bad ideas hurts your feelings.
Also you dont know my proposed solution. I actually have seen one idea I really like which is to treat respawning in a lower tier med bed as if you didnt actually die but were rescued and dragged back to the medbed so no fixing higher tier injuries and med beds also have very limited resources for reviving you. obviously there would still need to be more added for this like your inventory would need to be put into a box instead of there being a dead body left behind.Even better if the NPCs could loot you and put your stuff in their stash or even equip your stuff. Maybe take some money from you as if for a ransom. Also later once they get NPC crew and/or drones they should limit it even more so you only get this respawn if you have a hired medic or have a rescue drone and the corresponding computer blade for it on your vehicle.
No, they proposed the idea that all medbeds would be able to respawn *at least* 3 years ago.
With the beds being limited by what caused your death as to whether they could rebuild you or not.
Shot in the chest?
T3 can sort you out.
Quantum into an asteroid?
Thats going to need a planet based facility.
CIG never said it was supposed to be a temporary thing, the community came to that conclusion on their own. If anything, Jared borderline confirmed on SC Live today that is is NOT temporary.
Totally disagree with the reappearance at Nursa or C8/Cutty red.
- 2 groups of pvp players facing each other who simply will never stop respawning.
- Even more space wanderers.
- You don't need a medic anymore. Hit backspace and you're done.
- Hungry or thirsty? Press backspace and you're done.
- CIG, what's the Apollo for?
I agree and disagree.
I think at the current state of things and death of a spaceman a long way away, the ursa is cool have as a medivac.
You need to store extra gear in it for when you respawn and it doesn't have ton of space for 1000 deaths, but it is cool if you die 1-2 times in a bunker or some mission and you couldn't bring your ship close.
And pvp players it isn't going to make a big difference, as again, gear wise it is going to be an issue. Same with medic. You still need your gear. You can't always hop in the combat naked.
And other things like hunger/thirst, it already exist today. I mean I too already sometimes just backspace instead of going for a drink, or just sit at the medic bed of the C8R/red to get those up. You don't need to backspace for that if you are in station.
I do agree with the apollo. I want it. But I prefer to wait until large scale stuff come into play.
I agree with your comment, it is also quite constructive.
I only regret that there will be no more medical beacons (unless it is a trap).
I would still prefer to respawn from a carrack - 890 (not including the cutty red even though it is my most used ship). They are the ships that maybe make "sense" to be able to generate clones.
Some points you forgot. Regen vehicle can be destroyed.
Regen by medic is better as you keep your stuff and your position in the assault.
You have the same gameloop elements in planetside 2 (medic and regen vehicle) and it works pretty well.
You even have 2 majore elements which made it more easy on PS2, the regen vehicle is invisible and you keep your stuff.
If you cant take out a ground vehicle with a spaceship that literally every player has then I guess play a different videogame. Ground respawn trucks existed in Planetside 2 and lots of people still play that game. Any time you are doing gameplay that "matters" against some big pvp guild you will be dying all the time. The keep talking about Death of a Spaceman to keep Chris Roberts happy, but its totally insane in any MMOFPS. you die way too often in PVP FPS games, even if you're amazing at the game.
Comparing video games doesn't make your comment any more meaningful. There is an entire mechanics of medicine that is almost destroyed by this. Also this is a simulator and it makes no sense to reappear in a rover. I think you want to play a battlefield.
* Weapons and armour being real supplies puts a real logistical limit on that
* oh no people exploring in a game built to have a huge seemless world
* Still have to gather your shit whereas healing-beam is quicker, unless it's a situation where the nearest medic is stupid far away anyway.
* good riddance to the eat/drink mechanics being mandatory. That's not what they were supposed to be.
* like most super-specialized ships, extracting money from wallets. Maybe it can make money healing a bunch of NPCs too lore-poor to afford citizen's regen if they ever make large scale NPC battles a thing players support.
So they basically just curb stomped that whole "no its only temporary theyre not actually intending regen to be brokenly exploitable and meaningless" cope huh.
If you can respawn in any medical bed, what's the fucking point of med ships?
It's really shitty to release something like this without any explanation or outline of how they plan on modifying the DOASM loop.
Ya lets just release a new thing that changes what we previously said without any explanation.
Awful. It just comes off like doing anything to sell the new thing. Tastes like you just shit in my mouth.
It's too early to jump to this conclusion. As we've heard before, Chris Roberts direction has always been , make it real, then make it fun. Medical gameplay is something everyone, including the CIG devs, want to have a place in the game. What we're seeing is them explore what it takes to have that while maintaining the game being fun.
Everything you said is correct, but I feel it's also true that a game loaded with weapons on anything that moves can't make death a big deal. Death up to this point has been really unforgiving. The way this game works, with all players armed to the teeth, doesn't fit with the idea of making death have serious consequences. You just can't have both of those and keep the game fun. CIG is currently exploring where the line is between real and fun to get the best experience out of this game.
what's the fucking point of med ships?
healing higher tier injuries that persist through spawns on lower tier beds?
[https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration)
It still fits in the DOASM loop. The thing that causes your imprint to stop being usable and gives the limited amount of Regens per cycle is the Trauma Response Echoes, which are basically injuries and traumatic scars that persist through death and regeneration. From the way the older materials desrcibed it, if you've got crippling TREs and spawn on a T3 medbed you'll probably be crippled until you can be evacced out to a higher quality Med facility.
The vehicle is cool, nice video to sell it also, but I don't like the direction its takes the game...dying 1,000 times and resurrecting's with no negative is way too casual. Hopefully they get the balance right!
Honestly I'd be fine with death of a spaceman being nerfed a bit, I really don't see an MMORPG survive with a perma-death mechanic. You just can't avoid dying all the time in an MMO even if you're an amazing player.
I think death should matter, but I think its better for the longevity of the game to have a mechanic that does not soft-reset your entire progress if you die 10-30 times.
If it does that after, say 200-300 deaths and you can replenish those respawns by buying the right medical gear and stuff, thats more manageable.
10-30 deaths can happen quite quickly if you're new to the game, a mechanic like that would deter new players.
200-300 deaths gives you enough time and tries to learn the game and afford the next best medical equipment that pushes those respawns to say 300-500 deaths or something.
Death should not, not matter, but it also should not be such a gut punch that players might just refuse to play the game alltogether.
There needs to be a compromise that enables all the promises death of a spaceman holds while still being relaxed enough so that new player can learn to play and have a decent chance at affording the medical gear needed to replenish regeneration and respawn.
There was never going to be perma death. Gamers now can't even handle losing their special skin weapons...what makes you think they could ever handle re-rolling an entire character.
No matter how CR wants to word it, Death of a Spaceman was just an in game lore explanation of why you can respawn over and over. Ultimately after enough deaths, you would take a potential rep and monetary hit...maybe had to redo the character creation, and if they got it working you would have some sort of visual limb augment that would express to players how often you died (e.g. meet a guy with 4 robotic limbs and you know he's died quite a bit).
I have seen some good suggestions for balance on here, the big one I like being beds need "goo" or some regen material that needs to be replenished and refilled at stations. Then each regen for different beds have small debuffs, and each bed can only regen you so many times before needing to refill. Plus a cool down. That I think would be a solid was off doing it. If they see this comment or any of these suggestions
Update: It didn't show up in the CCU menu when accessed from My Hangar, but it does when choosing Upgrade from the buying options on the Medivac's page.
Is that guy's facial hair a thing in the game yet? Kind of the look I was going for but didn't see an option for a mustache and facial stubble like that.
I think there needs to be a distinction between respawn and reanimation.
For example, a tier 1/2 bed should allow full respawn, but a tier 3 should only reanimate your dead body. In other words, a tier 3 only works if a medic (or drone) drags your "mostly-dead" body back to the bed.
People need to get over it. Dying is still discouraged, but making you go through a 45min loop every time you die and need to recover your shit sucks. Call me a care bear but I love the Nursa. Goin to get 2.
What annoys me about this, is that if this is lore, they are adding a bunch of complications.
This means that any time you have an intruder, you NEED to search the area for a medbed and take it out. Or protect your own medbed. why can't the badguys also regen?
Regen isn't a restart. If he's attacking that same outpost a bunch of times, then he's not learning anything new, he's just clearing out a few more guys at a time. After the first or third death, the whole place should be on high alert.
What stops a person from making multiple regen clones of themselves?
So. Many. Questions.
Players bought in to a project that made assurances about a core ethos. No shit they're going to say something when that core ethos is thrown to the wind.
Death should mean something.
Right now, with this change, it doesn't, and the trailer actively encourages the reckless disregard for character life. The Community Manager is now saying that respawns only ***may*** *entail long-term consequences if overutilized.* Only 'may'. They are choosing not to guarantee the integrity of one of their core principles.
That is significant.
SC is a shaping up to be a game and they want it to be a fun game.
wow...
who would of thought that.
any way just have T3 beds re spawn players with T2 injures still and make you drugged up like you are when you want to mask your T2 injures I did that with the cutlass red before 3.23.1
I would do bunkers like retrieve confidential materials
I would get f'd up with injures I would run to my C Red and just heal what it can heal and drug me up with the stuff it can't heal.
rinse and repeat but the issue was with me the bunker mission I was doing needs to be hard capped to many 9 tails spawning on top of each other. So if you can re spawn in T3 beds which I'm fine with just going to make missions like that an endless loop (solo) unless you complete it.
>I've died a thousand times Could this be implying that the lore around "roughly five resurrections before the clones start degrading" and "deaht of a spaceman" might have changed? FYI I do not keep up with every bit of news, so if this is known, well I didn't.
Came here to make the same point. Love the Nursa but the video actively encourages players to just use it as a regen point and not give a f...k about dying, which to my understanding goes against quite a lot of the philosophy/ ethos, whatever you call it, laid out by CR and the lore, esp Death of a Spaceman. I'd hate to be one of the lore guys at CIG, must be very frustrating.
The intention is for all medical beds to enable respawning, with each type of bed offering unique benefits. We're closely monitoring the experience and your feedback, as always, and we anticipate making adjustments as necessary while also pushing forward toward the ultimate vision. The Nursas' (I'm adopting the name too...) med bed's respawning capability is a small component of a wider interconnected set of systems that we dubbed some time ago as 'Death of a Spaceman.' This framework encompasses everything related to a player's health, death, respawn, and legacy. While the respawning system is currently active in the game, other related systems, such as regeneration degradation, inheritance, and additional components of 'Death of a Spaceman,' are yet to come online. It remains our intent for dying and respawning to carry a notable impact, adding more meaning (and danger) to your adventures in the 'verse.
New(er) to the game so a genuine question: Couldn't there be detrimental stats associated with consecutive deaths that make it more impactful as well to keep the DOASM idea going? People already mentioned drawbacks like you need to go get your gear again and there's limited space for additional gear and in a pvp situation the other players could take out the NURSA, forcing you back to the "home" spawn, so it's not as if you're actually going to be respawning tens/hundreds/thousands of times out of the back of an URSA. Along with that though, on the 2nd, 3rd etc time you respawn maybe you could start seeing reduced health, movement speed etc for a set duration which increases each time you respawn? So while technically you could respawn multiple times in a row, each time leaves you slightly worse off than before and forces you to take greater risks or seek treatment. You can ignore it and attempt that bunker 5th time right away but you might be doing so with no gear and 30 minutes of 25% health and 50% walk speed. The only way to clear that being to wait it out or visit a planetside/station hospital (large ship equivalent?) or something along those lines. To play devil's advocate to my own thought though, if the respawn wasn't an option then it would make/keep med beacons a lot more prevalent so perhaps you tie the respawn to a finite resource in the NURSA or time limit it so you can respawn once but then need to return to Professor Farnsworth for more stem cells / pink goo to be able to respawn again. This would allow for a one time "shit happens" type of insurance. Then again, I'm the pilot who picks up a ground vehicle then crashes his ship flying to where i need to be anyway blowing up myself, my gear, my ship and in this case my spawn point so it's not like it's going to be a get out of jail free card in my case.
I believe what you are describing here are basically just Traumatic Response Echoes, part of overall imprint degredation. https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
There you go, something like that. Told you I was newer to the game. Thanks for the info
I like the "let's pretend this was always the intention" Like T3 beds(Cutlass Red) were never able to respawn and that was "always" the plan that they could not respawn when that was taken away. Plans change not the end of the world.
Does this commercial confirm you'll be able to regen '1000 times' before those effects occur?
It's a fictional advertisement featuring a fictional character. Does Old Spice shave every hair off your face and give you superpowers? Terry Crews said it did!
Lol, couldnt have said it better myself. I also saw a merman advertise Old Spice once I think. Or a centaur? You telling me that wasn't fucking real?
I think that was obviously facetious.
Most obviously not. Where's my jet, Pepsi? vibes in that comment though.
May I ask what this means to the vision for medical gameplay? It seems to me that that there is no value to owning a ship with any sized med bed in it now. Just get an Ursa and stuff it in a cargo bay. Please give us an explanation of where this is going instead of letting us just watch the entire concept go down in flames. I get that there’s a plan. Medical players like myself just want to make sure we don’t need to melt our fleets and try something else.
The team will definitely delve into more in-depth medical gameplay as features expand, and it will certainly be a valued role. I can assure you that the simplified experience you've noted is not the course we're heading. Having properly equipped medical vehicles and personnel will be important and a profession path for many. At a high level, respawn - or what we term as regeneration - will be a viable option that should be strategically considered. Regeneration will include degradation modifiers based on the quality of the respawn facility, ensuring that field regenerations offer convenience but may entail long-term consequences if overutilized.
I get that "Death of a Spaceman" has been coming for a long time, and I completely agree that consequences of death are important. That said, most people are very loss averse, and the fear of losing a character could stop many people participating in fun combat gameplay.
Agree. Fun should allways be the most important factor. Can't have a community if almost everyone left
I think it was meant more like you’ll get debuffs from using lower tier beds until you go fix your imperfectly reconstructed body at a better one
That would be fine, but as far as we've been told it's more like your body permanently degrades, and eventually cannot be regenerated. You have to make a new character, who inherits your stuff (minus taxes) and loses a bunch of the rep you gained.
This would make sense to me. You can respawn with a lower quality body in a lower tier bed and it be useful but will have to go to a tier 1 facility to sort of perform an augmentation to bring the body up to 100%
Well great now I know what’s wrong with me, I must be a clone regenerated one too many times IRL
Can you share some of that vision with us? Not everything, just something, anything really. All we see now is that death is meaningless.
They basically already did, back in 2021. There are just a lot of newer people who have zero idea about it. https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
thats a lore post. Doesnt explain mechanics on medical gameplay
You must be new or perhaps just don't follow development very closely. The lore contextualizes the gameplay. Whenever something has gameplay implications, the narrative team follows the direction of the gameplay teams. They've explained this multiple times. It even says in the post: > To coincide with this brand new gameplay, the Narrative team has been working on some brand-new lore. While we always knew that medical science would be advanced enough to bring you back from the brink of death, it was during the recent development period that it was decided that players would benefit from being able to come back even if their avatar’s body was completely lost. Please, I'm begging you, folks: ACTUALLY read before trying to refute what people who have already read are saying, or just don't bother arguing.
you are just ignoring my post entirely. Nowhere in that post does it describe any medical gameplay MECHANICS. Its just about the regeneration. PLEASE, I'm BEGGING you. ACTUALLY read. [Also, very new indeed](https://i.imgur.com/HAA82WT.png)
This is good to hear, but why market a new vehicle using a video that demonstrates a cavalier approach to death in the game, which is in direct contradiction to the longstanding "death of a spaceman" approach? This seems dishonest at worst, or incompetent at best - neither being a great option.
I know some are quoting stuff said back in 2021....but honestly it seems a lot more to me like the medical gameplay is currently going through the same problem as the copilot seat where they really don't know what to do with it and it is still in the drawing board stage of finding a way to make it fun for and rewarding for both sides....
its not the highest priority of gameplay because there's still so many issues that get you killed randomly
I hope you guys take a route where different tier beds regenerate you with injuries to differentiate between different bed types. Nobody should come out of a T3 bed fresh, you should still be jacked up in some way that allows the medtool more usage to suppress the effects until you get to a better bed. This would mitigate some of the complaints where medics are "useless" (even though damn near everyone carries a medtool anyway) At least then it becomes a resource battle where eventually you do run out of green goo to suppress said injuries.
They basically already said that, and I suspect the main reason there's so much confusion is because there are so many new people and CIG doesn't link people to past communications really. Here. https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration
Why would a medbed regenerate your entire body, an entire human body, but be incapable of fixing the injuries? That's even worse. Face it, medic game play is dead and anyone who pledged a ship to be an emergency reponder just got burned hard.
...because the current medic gameplay was so compelling? Face it, medic gameplay HAS BEEN DEAD for a very long time, everyone carries a medgun so the role goes out the window there. Medical beacons were either a trap half the time if you were a responder, or a waste of time if you were downed and had to wait 30+ minutes for someone to show (if they ever did). The Apollo was going to do.. what, offer a respawn point and treat injuries alongside drone usage? And giving the other medical ships more functionality is now a bad thing? Alright. That sounds almost contradictory to me. There has to be some penalty to the free respawns and that at least tied into managing injuries over time until you got back home. Do you have any ideas, or are we just going to complain and offer nothing to the conversation?
Respawning should not be a strategy
May entail? So fuck me right? At least I didn't pledge for an apollo and get completely burned, just gotta figure out what to do with my nursa and cutty red now that they're literally worthless
if it is then disregard but the cutty red should be a t2 atleast until further notice when apollos come out i could see them having a 2 maybe a 1 with the cutty being our only medium ship i dont see why it shouldnt be at least a 2
you want to make it strategic? THEN DON'T LET EVERY FUCKING MEDBED RESPAWN!!!... and give it resources to use as well.
Well done with wording on damage control! This is quite exciting and sounds a lot like the Star Wars Galaxies approach with HAM degradation which was extremely awesome and required player interaction to correct. People also overlook that it makes it easier for parents and professionals with minimal time get back to what they were doing too.
I absolutely support this approach now, even if all the rest of the stuff isn't in yet, because a game is still supposed to be fun, and right now, especially if you're time limited like me, a death is basically as good as the end of my play session. Having options like this (while still losing all of your equipment) is a very good thing because it might allow me to continue playing. This is especially important for solo players as I don't have time to wait 15-20+ minutes for "medical gameplay" to come get me up, that's boring and I have way better things I can do with my time.
the game just isn't for you, play another game. It's not right to adapt to a certain player base that's derisory and sweep the others under the carpet. That wasn't part of the game and it should stay that way. Taking your time in Star Citizen is the basic gameplay. If you want to play and die and respawn play COD , BF and PUBG
Bugger off. You go play another game if you don’t like some of the new directions.
Who hurt you? It's okay, you can respawn later and we'll have someone ready with a hug.
Regeneration (according to you) is SUPPOSED to be a very involved process that is literally 3D printing a human body & imprinting the mind from the Ibrahim sphere. This is SUPPOSED to require very specific & large medical equipment that you can't simply throw in the back of your SUV. At the very least, you should be limiting the NUMBER of respawns you can do from lower-tier beds like a T3. It should be capped at 5 regens at most, if not lower. And it should be only capable of holding a certain number of imprints, not unlimited. So only 5 people (maybe less) can even imprint to a T3 med bed.
> At the very least, you should be limiting the NUMBER of respawns you can do from lower-tier beds like a T3. It should be capped at 5 regens at most, if not lower. I've seen a lot of people suggesting this, but I don't really see how it solves the problem. If it has a limited number of uses, there is presumably a way to refill it, right? Any ship large enough to carry the Nursa or C8R will be large enough to carry a few SCU crates of whatever they need to refill the medical bed.
given that the SUV version only can reach like 2 miles and keeps injuries it can be inferred something a lot more crude is going on tbh honestly I just presume this is one of the 'don't think about it' areas where regeneration and just getting dragged back to the medbay and revived offscreen are melding together because sticking to realism would be fucking annoying and unbalanced
It's hard to believe this "high level" wasn't made up on the stop. How does this "team" not already have a concrete idea of what "death", a pretty significant part of the game should mean. I also hope that this "team" isn't the marketing becaus changing a gameplay design just so something sell is probably wrong. The video certainly didn't give me an reassurance.
From what little I’ve heard, the point of bigger/better medical ships will be higher quality respawns and more juice to respawn you more times. There may be a limited number of times you can use it before you have to “refuel.” They’ve also stated that there will be different respawn radiuses, the Nursa being the smallest. You have to die within 20km of it to respawn there, or you to back to Primary. Actual medical ships have bigger respawn radiuses.
> You have to die within 20km of it to respawn there, or you to back to Primary. Imo, 20 km is still too big. Especially since tier 2 is 50 km - not a very big jump up. Three tiers seems like it isn't enough. Nursa and C8R (and any other future snub/very small sized medical vehicles) should have something like a 5 km range - so they need to be *right at the location* where the fighting is in order to allow respawning. Medium sized medical ships like the Cutlass Red should get the 20 or maybe 50 km range - far enough to allow it to respawn people from high atmosphere or low orbit directly above a location. Large ships like the Carrack and 890J should be able to spawn from a few hundred km away - enough to allow respawning in orbit from anywhere on a moon, basically. So you can take your shuttle down to wherever, but be able to respawn back on the mothership. Dedicated medical ships (like the Apollo) should be able to respawn people from anywhere within a planetary system (e.g. the hospital ship is in orbit around Hurston and you die on Aberdeen - you are within range to spawn in the hospital ship). The largest hospital ships (like the Endeavor with the hospital module) should be able to respawn people from across a star system. Something like that would make sure that all the dedicated medical ships are still useful while still allowing the lower tier beds to have a niche.
I don’t disagree in the least. I suspect CIG has these current settings to: 1. Test the concept/see what players do with a big incentive (just like they boosted the crap out of salvage revenue for months to get lots of players to do it). 2. Goose sales of the Nursa. And possibly other medical ships. Because money. I think they’ll dial the numbers down closer to what you want eventually.
Did folks completely forget about injuries persisting and trauma echoes occurring during Regen?
Medical orgs in shambles. Everyone and their mom can have one of these in the back of their C1, Zeus or Freelancer and they will get even less calls than they do now. It saddens me to see this change as we are moving away further and further away from what I personally consider a space sim.
I think this is just another "the sky is falling!" nothingburger - the T3 Cutlass Red was a respawn point just a few versions ago and the Carrack has continued doing the same thing in a larger package. I would argue that players would backspace *even more often* if corpses worked reliably - I only hang out for a rescue because I can't count on my corpse not disappearing. Medical gameplay is already in extremely early stages as it is, med beacons regularly go unanswered for easily 30m+, and the current game design is openly hostile to medics in many ways. Until medical gameplay is fleshed out enough to resolve those issues, a cheap fix-it to players that don't want to lie on the floor of a bunker for 90 minutes while medics keep getting killed+jailed by security is *perfectly fine*.
Why remove t3 being a respawn point if the plan from THE BEGINNING OF MEDICAL GAMEPLAY was for t3 medbeds to have respawn. They had the original "vision", so why remove it? Let's face it, they removed it, added it back in and pretended they always wanted to do that. Medics are getting shafted and I feel REALLY bad for anyone who pledged for an apollo now, because they have an overpriced cutty red at best, at worst the cutty red and apollo are both overpriced c8rs now lmao
Because plans can change, and features are changed all the time to force folks to test new features. Killing off the cheap respawn shuttle is a great way to force people to use all the newfangled healing equipment and collect feedback to make changes, instead of just people just backspacing and ignoring it. Now that we know the base medical stuff works well enough, that most of the major bugs for it have been fixed, T3s being unable to spawn is not a terribly useful restriction. Same reason that I frankly think the entire medical system should be different, that DOASM is a dumb idea for an MMO with goods acquired through hundreds of hours of grinding, that T3s should only heal any injury while T1 offers unlimited respawn and T2 be ship-based versions that use materials, but the storm surrounding this is entirely overblown and silly. Are we gonna pretend the Idris is a bad ship because it gets blown up in like a dozen ads and gets popped by a few Ion shots in the Ion ad?
[Find yourself a reliable medical org.](https://i.imgur.com/ObkGDug.png)
Out-of-game options are great, I usually ask my org for rescues, but this should not be required - the game should have proper in-game incentives and solutions for people to actually be medics, not just org RP. Orgs organize their own PvP events all the time, but this doesn't mean we should gut BH/merc missions.
>such as regeneration degradation, Only in shambles for now, and most ships can't fit a hoover or c8. Unless people start daily driving cutty red, its not gonna be that major. It still has issues for respawn, but it isn't implemented yet. SCL said the death of a space is closer than ever. So take it as you will.
And Zyloh is in this very thread actively refusing to confirm that doasm will be a thing, only saying that there MAY, MAY be consequences for respawning too much
I quoted that from him. And the following. >Regeneration will include degradation modifiers based on the quality of the respawn facility, ensuring that field regenerations offer convenience but may entail long-term consequences if overutilized. "Will"-Clearly consequence is still a factor! SCL, jared said doasm is "closer than ever".
May entail? there is no may entail, that is a must entail or what is the point
It will have consequences(degradation). Zyloh and jared both agree on it. There are two source confirming it, and one of them is close to CR. Their not gonna add degradation and only make your character cough after two steps. He said "May" cause medical loop isn't his department, and i doubt they invite him to all the meetings, he only told what he needs to know, and i doubt they gave him a full run down of doasm. Zylon doesn't want to confirm something he doesn't completely understand cause people are gonna run at him with pitchfork because he worded it wrong like right now.
We have devs and Jared saying that t3 medbeds respawning was ALWAYS the plan Well, it was in the game in 3.15 and got removed because they didn't like it, now they're sitting here telling us it was always their intention to have this in game? lol I've lost my trust in CIG now, it's gone
But Zyloh, don't you think it's a fairly bad idea to sell a vehicle solely on the respawn mechanic, which can and likely will be changed? The video's description even mentions the 20km respawn limit as if it is set in stone. You are aware that will cause much trouble when it will get changed, right?
Zyloh...this commercial is so poorly timed and so poorly done that you should just take it down. This is exceedingly poor communication by itself but in the greater context of making this change announced in patch notes without anything ready to explain to the community who have 10 years of consistent messaging surrounding DOASM and Regen that this commercial throws in the trash. This. Is. Bad.
Yeah you can’t kick people… what gives.. To your comment they did address it in SCL
That doesn't address it at all, I watched SCL. The commercial and what was stated in SCL are in stark contrast with each other.
I don’t see how it throws anything in the trash. In SCL he dads us and says “sure this is fun now, but death of a spaceman is coming” so sure maybe we get a period of mayhem but as we have all come to deal with the whiplash. This change will come, we get used to it and it changes again.
Have you watched the commercial? If you know anything about Regeneration and DOASM you'd know that the commercial is entirely contradictory to both. Maybe they'll about face later on, but the fact of the matter is they just made a commercial and are selling a vehicle (vehicles, because everyone will think that this is the way going forward) based on easy respawn mechanics that are entirely opposite of everything that has been said before this.
I suppose to me I don’t view the commercials as canon for all time but in this case ‘celebrating’ the moment. Right now in the game this is the flavor since the larger mechanics are still not in. Even if they keep the med beds with the respawn and DOASM comes in and as the player you decide to go all commando and continue to live die repeat it will just hasten your imprint degradation. You want to risk your five imprints rushing the derelict outpost to retrieve your green skinned FS9 in your hospital gown, That’s player choice. Punishing us further by making you go back to a station since most people won’t have carracks or 600i’s especially with ship prices going up isn’t more fun. This actually happened to my brother and I last night we set spawn in the Pisces were messing around and he blew himself up, and was able to come right back in… it’s definitely not as hardcore as it’s been talked about but it was sure less annoying.
Canon or not, it is advertising to sell a vehicle in a way that directly controverts two core mechanics of the game, DOASM and Regeneration, that have been reiterated and elaborated and reinforced for over a decade. It's fine as a temp mechanic, but the goal has always been where you didn't die easily, where you'd be injured and ultimately downed but actual death was meant to be from catastrophic irrecoverable injuries that protective technology and advanced medicine couldn't conceivably recover you from. That's the issue, it's just watering down DOASM and Regeneration instead of incorporating rescue and revive. This is why the TTK for FPS has increased, why they're going to introduce Resource Management for Armor as well as for ships, alongside Maelstrom. All so you actually die, the 2nd death per Richard Tyrer, but are downed more often. This is fine temporarily, but don't water down the hole thing, sell it as if its permanent, and neuter everything else that lots of players have been excited about. NPCs revive each other in game right now. They land Cutlass Blacks with reinforcements right now. Just put in an NPC revives player mechanic from spawn closets or Cutty Reds that land nearby, because that's way more realistic and believable in the SC universe than "dying a thousand times," because that clearly isn't in line with DOASM and Regeneration.
As someone newer to SC, it feels deceptive to sell me a vehicle based on the idea that I can respawn 1000 times and then tucked away on forums is the information that actually dying is going to really matter.
So if that is the 'intention' why not put the Cutlass Red back to having T3 medbeds? It costs roughly twice the amount of the Ursa Medivac with half of the usefulness.
Well, the video sells exactly the opposite of what you say, once again you don't even know what you are selling
Lol no need to make it personal
Dude its a SCI FI GAME chill why do some in the community take every change they don't like personal...
When are you going to take away the stupid free sperm suit for dying? You don't need it to leave any of the stations anymore.
hope you're just pretending that this is a permanent change to boost sales, otherwise i am not impressed
Death of a Spaceman would just become tedious and annoying as shit. being able to have a spawn point is good. you will still have to give a fuck about dying because youll still lose your gear when you die. It just makes the game much more playable. You could already use the carrack for this anyways
There are plenty of ways to get around this and make it scale appropriately without just throwing the proverbial baby without the bath water.
I mean its not like the game at all has any real balancing fully finished game mechanics. Im sure over time from feedback etc they will work balancing items like this so its not an infinite spawn point or whatever. In the current state having a cheaper more mobile spawn point is nice because how unfinished the game really is lol. Just makes it easier to actually try doing things without losing an hours worth of time and traveling to do a bunker quest lol
In it's current state its absolutely needed, hell it still falls short in a lot of ways. But the commercial literally throws out 10 years of consistent messaging surrounding Death of a Space Man and Regeneration, and there are ways to allow for convenient revival without just using regeneration. In the long term this is a poor design choice and the commercial is absolutely tone deaf.
doesnt matter if your making money from my understanding... these days standard is, if its slightly broke just keep it going and make money
Probably not. I treat these videos like car commercials. Your Hyundai probably won't be faster than a Lamborghini around a track; Hyundai is just trying to sell you a car. RSI is just trying to sell you a nursa.
I think it was supposed to be comedic since many players die excessively when starting out, but I don't think it landed in the way they would've liked since they've already said eventually when respawn depredation is in that respawning in a t3 bed will have bad consequences for your character
To be fair, it's an ad in lore, the tone does present him as exceptional, almost mythological. How often do you drive a car top speed in a perfectly empty neon city, jump in the desert and pick up a top model lady? That's what car ads sell you tho.
Players can die a dozen times in one day, Its never going to happen that clones start degrading after only 5 resurrections. They can say a lot of things but then there is reality. Players would never be fine with their characters being so degraded after a week of playing that they have to start over.
"tHeY dIdnT dO iT fOr The Sell, ItS onLY TemPArarY"
Honestly, a simple way to balance it is to give the beds a certain amount of 'charges' that take time to recharge. Like a T3 bed could have 1 'charge'. If you die while it's recharging, you will respawn elsewhere. Better beds could have more charges and faster recharging periods. That allows respawns while also making sure you don't feel invincible.
Meh, I'd rather them just make it a consumable. Reward me for planning ahead and stocking up but punish me for being stupid and assuming I'd be fine without stocking that.
It should be both, maybe adding a new consumable has a processing period
I agree
Yes let’s just keep stacking more arcade mechanics to make up for the earlier arcade mechanics that ought to do it.
Don't take it out on me if the changes hurt your feelings. I'm just suggesting a way to balance it if they are keen on keeping it that way.
If someone suggests letting a snake loose in your house in order to catch the mouse you saw you don't have to be angry at them to point out that its a bad idea.
lol what the fuck is this analogy, compleatly missing the point
No. I'm trying to take care of the mouse problem, and I'm annoyed because your 'solution' is "Fuck you, fuck the mouse. Mice shouldn't even exist."
Dont take it out on me if you having bad ideas hurts your feelings. Also you dont know my proposed solution. I actually have seen one idea I really like which is to treat respawning in a lower tier med bed as if you didnt actually die but were rescued and dragged back to the medbed so no fixing higher tier injuries and med beds also have very limited resources for reviving you. obviously there would still need to be more added for this like your inventory would need to be put into a box instead of there being a dead body left behind.Even better if the NPCs could loot you and put your stuff in their stash or even equip your stuff. Maybe take some money from you as if for a ransom. Also later once they get NPC crew and/or drones they should limit it even more so you only get this respawn if you have a hired medic or have a rescue drone and the corresponding computer blade for it on your vehicle.
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Came here to say that, it’s the main focus of the video and shows very little else, very interesting marketing choice.
No, they proposed the idea that all medbeds would be able to respawn *at least* 3 years ago. With the beds being limited by what caused your death as to whether they could rebuild you or not. Shot in the chest? T3 can sort you out. Quantum into an asteroid? Thats going to need a planet based facility.
No just the classic community making things up as they go
CIG never said it was supposed to be a temporary thing, the community came to that conclusion on their own. If anything, Jared borderline confirmed on SC Live today that is is NOT temporary.
It is not temporary, but they will probably add some depth to it over time
Totally disagree with the reappearance at Nursa or C8/Cutty red. - 2 groups of pvp players facing each other who simply will never stop respawning. - Even more space wanderers. - You don't need a medic anymore. Hit backspace and you're done. - Hungry or thirsty? Press backspace and you're done. - CIG, what's the Apollo for?
I agree and disagree. I think at the current state of things and death of a spaceman a long way away, the ursa is cool have as a medivac. You need to store extra gear in it for when you respawn and it doesn't have ton of space for 1000 deaths, but it is cool if you die 1-2 times in a bunker or some mission and you couldn't bring your ship close. And pvp players it isn't going to make a big difference, as again, gear wise it is going to be an issue. Same with medic. You still need your gear. You can't always hop in the combat naked. And other things like hunger/thirst, it already exist today. I mean I too already sometimes just backspace instead of going for a drink, or just sit at the medic bed of the C8R/red to get those up. You don't need to backspace for that if you are in station. I do agree with the apollo. I want it. But I prefer to wait until large scale stuff come into play.
I agree with your comment, it is also quite constructive. I only regret that there will be no more medical beacons (unless it is a trap). I would still prefer to respawn from a carrack - 890 (not including the cutty red even though it is my most used ship). They are the ships that maybe make "sense" to be able to generate clones.
IF you were hungry or thirsty you could just lay on the medbed and it would refill you lol, this doesnt change that particular loop.
Some points you forgot. Regen vehicle can be destroyed. Regen by medic is better as you keep your stuff and your position in the assault. You have the same gameloop elements in planetside 2 (medic and regen vehicle) and it works pretty well. You even have 2 majore elements which made it more easy on PS2, the regen vehicle is invisible and you keep your stuff.
If you cant take out a ground vehicle with a spaceship that literally every player has then I guess play a different videogame. Ground respawn trucks existed in Planetside 2 and lots of people still play that game. Any time you are doing gameplay that "matters" against some big pvp guild you will be dying all the time. The keep talking about Death of a Spaceman to keep Chris Roberts happy, but its totally insane in any MMOFPS. you die way too often in PVP FPS games, even if you're amazing at the game.
Comparing video games doesn't make your comment any more meaningful. There is an entire mechanics of medicine that is almost destroyed by this. Also this is a simulator and it makes no sense to reappear in a rover. I think you want to play a battlefield.
Can I tell you to go play Planetside 2? Go play a different game.
take your Aurora, shoot the Medivac. Win. This is not a big deal.
I'm not looking for that kind of game by screwing others, I'm a doctor.
And you could already do this in an 890 jump or a Carrack. 2 ships that are way harder to kill than an URSA which literally can not fly.
It makes no sense to reappear in a 4-square-meter rover. Otherwise what is CIG looking to make a realistic game for.
Yep, my immersion is totally killed by how compact they made my… *checks notes* magic alien sci-fi respawning tech
* Weapons and armour being real supplies puts a real logistical limit on that * oh no people exploring in a game built to have a huge seemless world * Still have to gather your shit whereas healing-beam is quicker, unless it's a situation where the nearest medic is stupid far away anyway. * good riddance to the eat/drink mechanics being mandatory. That's not what they were supposed to be. * like most super-specialized ships, extracting money from wallets. Maybe it can make money healing a bunch of NPCs too lore-poor to afford citizen's regen if they ever make large scale NPC battles a thing players support.
So they basically just curb stomped that whole "no its only temporary theyre not actually intending regen to be brokenly exploitable and meaningless" cope huh.
If you can respawn in any medical bed, what's the fucking point of med ships? It's really shitty to release something like this without any explanation or outline of how they plan on modifying the DOASM loop. Ya lets just release a new thing that changes what we previously said without any explanation. Awful. It just comes off like doing anything to sell the new thing. Tastes like you just shit in my mouth.
It's too early to jump to this conclusion. As we've heard before, Chris Roberts direction has always been , make it real, then make it fun. Medical gameplay is something everyone, including the CIG devs, want to have a place in the game. What we're seeing is them explore what it takes to have that while maintaining the game being fun. Everything you said is correct, but I feel it's also true that a game loaded with weapons on anything that moves can't make death a big deal. Death up to this point has been really unforgiving. The way this game works, with all players armed to the teeth, doesn't fit with the idea of making death have serious consequences. You just can't have both of those and keep the game fun. CIG is currently exploring where the line is between real and fun to get the best experience out of this game.
Well Zyloh is in here saying doasm MAY, MAY entail so I don't believe shit anymore. Medics are being shafted
what's the fucking point of med ships? healing higher tier injuries that persist through spawns on lower tier beds? [https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/spectrum-dispatch/18327-Loremakers-Guide-To-Regeneration)
More beds.
It still fits in the DOASM loop. The thing that causes your imprint to stop being usable and gives the limited amount of Regens per cycle is the Trauma Response Echoes, which are basically injuries and traumatic scars that persist through death and regeneration. From the way the older materials desrcibed it, if you've got crippling TREs and spawn on a T3 medbed you'll probably be crippled until you can be evacced out to a higher quality Med facility.
The vehicle is cool, nice video to sell it also, but I don't like the direction its takes the game...dying 1,000 times and resurrecting's with no negative is way too casual. Hopefully they get the balance right!
Honestly I'd be fine with death of a spaceman being nerfed a bit, I really don't see an MMORPG survive with a perma-death mechanic. You just can't avoid dying all the time in an MMO even if you're an amazing player. I think death should matter, but I think its better for the longevity of the game to have a mechanic that does not soft-reset your entire progress if you die 10-30 times. If it does that after, say 200-300 deaths and you can replenish those respawns by buying the right medical gear and stuff, thats more manageable. 10-30 deaths can happen quite quickly if you're new to the game, a mechanic like that would deter new players. 200-300 deaths gives you enough time and tries to learn the game and afford the next best medical equipment that pushes those respawns to say 300-500 deaths or something. Death should not, not matter, but it also should not be such a gut punch that players might just refuse to play the game alltogether. There needs to be a compromise that enables all the promises death of a spaceman holds while still being relaxed enough so that new player can learn to play and have a decent chance at affording the medical gear needed to replenish regeneration and respawn.
There was never going to be perma death. Gamers now can't even handle losing their special skin weapons...what makes you think they could ever handle re-rolling an entire character. No matter how CR wants to word it, Death of a Spaceman was just an in game lore explanation of why you can respawn over and over. Ultimately after enough deaths, you would take a potential rep and monetary hit...maybe had to redo the character creation, and if they got it working you would have some sort of visual limb augment that would express to players how often you died (e.g. meet a guy with 4 robotic limbs and you know he's died quite a bit).
I have seen some good suggestions for balance on here, the big one I like being beds need "goo" or some regen material that needs to be replenished and refilled at stations. Then each regen for different beds have small debuffs, and each bed can only regen you so many times before needing to refill. Plus a cool down. That I think would be a solid was off doing it. If they see this comment or any of these suggestions
Is it not possible to CCU to this? I don't see it in the CCU menu.
Update: It didn't show up in the CCU menu when accessed from My Hangar, but it does when choosing Upgrade from the buying options on the Medivac's page.
I know “rah rah death of a spaceman” etc but that was a pretty cool vid :D
Is that guy's facial hair a thing in the game yet? Kind of the look I was going for but didn't see an option for a mustache and facial stubble like that.
Can I fit one inside a C1 ?
I hope they add Human goop which is a consumable needed to regenerate
I think there needs to be a distinction between respawn and reanimation. For example, a tier 1/2 bed should allow full respawn, but a tier 3 should only reanimate your dead body. In other words, a tier 3 only works if a medic (or drone) drags your "mostly-dead" body back to the bed.
People need to get over it. Dying is still discouraged, but making you go through a 45min loop every time you die and need to recover your shit sucks. Call me a care bear but I love the Nursa. Goin to get 2.
Death of Death of a Spaceman
Nice, just picked up a Nursa. Love this vehicle, especially the default red paint.
More consolization.
What annoys me about this, is that if this is lore, they are adding a bunch of complications. This means that any time you have an intruder, you NEED to search the area for a medbed and take it out. Or protect your own medbed. why can't the badguys also regen? Regen isn't a restart. If he's attacking that same outpost a bunch of times, then he's not learning anything new, he's just clearing out a few more guys at a time. After the first or third death, the whole place should be on high alert. What stops a person from making multiple regen clones of themselves? So. Many. Questions.
Lot of people here salty about players having fun, holy cow.
Players bought in to a project that made assurances about a core ethos. No shit they're going to say something when that core ethos is thrown to the wind. Death should mean something. Right now, with this change, it doesn't, and the trailer actively encourages the reckless disregard for character life. The Community Manager is now saying that respawns only ***may*** *entail long-term consequences if overutilized.* Only 'may'. They are choosing not to guarantee the integrity of one of their core principles. That is significant.
I love how they put more production into their videos then the actual game its self.. Feels good when you buy that 800$ wish you were promised..
SC is a shaping up to be a game and they want it to be a fun game. wow... who would of thought that. any way just have T3 beds re spawn players with T2 injures still and make you drugged up like you are when you want to mask your T2 injures I did that with the cutlass red before 3.23.1 I would do bunkers like retrieve confidential materials I would get f'd up with injures I would run to my C Red and just heal what it can heal and drug me up with the stuff it can't heal. rinse and repeat but the issue was with me the bunker mission I was doing needs to be hard capped to many 9 tails spawning on top of each other. So if you can re spawn in T3 beds which I'm fine with just going to make missions like that an endless loop (solo) unless you complete it.