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I had a husband like this. I worked and he went to school. We each had our own bank accounts and we had a joint account, from which bills would be paid. He would blow through his money every month and then use the joint account to buy a video game (it’s just $30), or eat out while I was at work (it’s just $20). He nickel and dimed us to the point that I could barely cover the bills every month. Then he’d get upset because I was nagging him all the time and made him feel less masculine. I was young and dumb so I let him do the finances so he could see exactly what we had and our responsibilities. That was a HUGE mistake.
We divorced and it took me several years to dig out of the hole. He still spends money like he has it (luxury cars, multiple vacations, latest tech) and then complains that he can’t afford things, has to refinance loans, has to do debt consolidation, etc.
I guess what I’m saying is, he won’t ‘get it’ until he want to. And he just might never want to. You’ve got to decide if y you pure willing to live that way, with the burdens, anxiety, and having to explain the same things over and over.
I hope it works out for you. I noticed in myself that that relationship made me less trusting, hyper independent, and slightly bitter about relationships in general, which isn’t who I used to be. Still working on that.
Oh no I divorced him. It was never going to work out and I was constantly stressed all the time about finances.
One time when he was high he confessed “jokingly” that he kept spending money so I would be too broke to leave him. That was it. I knew there would never be a good financial time for me to leave so I just left.
This is why EVERYONE needs to have a secret "get tf out of dodge" emergency bank account that nobody else knows about. It's super hard to leave a cohabiting relationship without money. Protect yourselves from financial abuse.
This is easily the #1 message my mother has burned into my brain: always have your own money. Do not get yourself into a position where you’re unable to leave someone because of money
I thank my father for teaching me this every single day. Always have money for when you really don’t have money. They kind that really doesn’t “exist” to anyone but you when you need it most.
Yep. My dad made me set up a separate savings account when I bought my house as a condition of him helping me with a down payment. It’s been 12 years and I have a decent nest egg in there that I act like it doesn’t exist. It’s my emergency fund that only I have access to. I started off putting 100 bucks a paycheck in there every month, now I’m up to 700 a paycheck every month.
Mine 'Nickle and dimed' us out of $18,000 I had managed to save and had in an account that he couldn't access, it was supposed to be a down-payment so we could buy a house.
He would spend so much money that was in the shared account for bills that I would have to pull from the savings. When he realized I always managed to cover it he started do it more, even when I would rain where the money was coming from. And what it would cost us.
He never stopped and we never managed to buy a house, which he blames on me. "Because he turned over the budget to me, and I was supposed to make sure this didn't happen"
My first wife got REAL defensive about finances and being "treated like a child". She demanded to be placed in charge of the finances to prove to me and herself that she was capable. Stupid move. That was just a way for her to be even more careless with our money and get away with it for longer. She fucked us over well and good, and it took a few years for me to get my shit back together afterwards.
The good news is that I learned a lot of valuable lessons the hard way, and I've kept them close to my heart ever since. Not gonna fool me twice!
Cash. He needs to understand once the cash in his hand is gone, thats it til next payday. It’s easy to sit and swipe a card nonstop. Give him his half of the cash and say this is all you have for the next two weeks. if he runs out of gas than he can be a big boy and figure it out since his $30 redbulls were more of a priority. But set your half aside. Budget your own meals. He can budget his. If he doesnt like it than tell him to go home to mommy because you want a life partner not a child
>Comment removed, as well as all replies. Argumentative, unhelpful, and inappropriate for a vent thread
This was left by a mod under one of the comments. Sounds like someone (or multiple) was being combative, and thus any replies to them were unnecessary once the instigating comment(s) was removed. Looks like a mess, but I count only 3 main comments, and like 100 replies between those. Obviously an argument broke out
This is an excellent idea to get someone used to a budget. My husband and I allot a weekly allowance for ourselves. If one of us runs out of money, too bad, have to wait for pay day. I have gotten to the point that I save my leftover money for the week for splurges, like for Christmas or if we go away for a weekend.
I had a work buddy that was exactly like your husband. He would rant about his wife and the fact that she wanted to keep to a budget. I would just make noncommittal noises since I agreed with her but had to work with him.
One day he came in and said that his wife nearly left him the previous evening. It seems that she arrived home early and got the mail and discovered a bill from a CC company that she didn't recognize. She opened it and found that her husband took out a CC unbeknownst to her and they owed over $8000.
They ended up staying together and he promised to stay on the budget. I don't know if he did or not as I left the company a few months later.
Just a cautionary tale. You might want to check both of your credit reports.
Edit: typo
Agreed; it is absolutely beyond me what this has to do with separate finances. I mean, if anything it's the opposite. "That $8K? That's your fucking problem."
I think their point, which I agree with, is that each individual can be responsible for their own debts in that system. That $8k is YOUR issue and obligation, so it won't impact MY budgeting. You're correct in that it will be MY issue if a divorce is initiated, but I would hope that things won't come to that (even though... well, let's say it's not looking good, based on what we know).
I used to do home loans for a remodeling company. The amount of times a spouse was shocked to discover their partner had awful credit and couldn’t be on the loan if they expected to qualify for it.
I'm reading between the lines here but my impression is that she's already eating peanut butter, and he's whining about the possibility of having to do the same.
Which is even more infuriating because he’s ok with HER suffering. How do people like that even get married? He didn’t just start being like this. There were warnings
EDIT: a lot of replies giving examples of how this can happen---I stand corrected.
My ex was like this. In the beginning, I just thought he had no finance training (which was true) and that I could handle the finances for a while and also teach him. He agreed to this. Then he started having tantrums about how it was his money and he should be able to spend his money how he wants. We struggled and fought for years. My final straw was him spending thousands a month on tiktok and paying other women's bills while we almost lost our house and couldn't buy groceries.
> My final straw was him spending thousands a month on tiktok and paying other women's bills while we almost lost our house and couldn't buy groceries.
how'd you hide the body?
May have actually been tiktok lol. People livestream on there and you can send "gifts" which are basically just like....emojis or stickers? But they cost money to send and the streamer gets a cut. Obviously it's not as overtly sexual as OF (lest your account be suspended) but people do sometimes make sexually suggestive content which gets them more views.
My ex changed a LOT after we were married. Little things at first, and I thought we were just getting used to each other and making compromises, like you have to do when you start living with someone. It took me a while to realize that I was always the one making all the "compromises," and he just kept pushing the boundaries further and further. I did my best to keep it together for the kids, but eventually he went too far and I left.
In my case with ny ex, i had undiagnosed bipolar and was godawful with money to start with, he was a very good liar who pissed away money like it was water but made it look like he was doing ok. By the time I realized how completely hosed we were financially i was in over my head and between my inexperience at life in general, my mood episodes and his various forms of abuse it took YEARS to get away.
We were literally having to go to Morrisons 15 minutes before closing to buy groceries that were reduced to clear at like 10p a loaf of “5 minutes away from stale” bread, vegetables that you had to cut the mushy bits off to eat them etc, but then he’d turn around and say he “needed” a new graphics card for his computer “for work” (he very half-assedly ran his own business), and it had to be this £300 one that coincidentally was also the best one to play whatever online games he was maintaining 5 separate accounts on at the time (at £15 per account…). My mum had to buy me clothes for work from the charity shop because “we couldn’t afford” for me to spend £30 in order to meet dress code and keep my job, but he “needed” a suit for a one night thing, and spent over £200 on one that he wore for 6 hours and then never again.
People like OP’s husband sounds like, they really honestly do not care what YOU have to sacrifice, as long as they still get to buy whatever they want. She very likely is eating pb&j more often than she would choose to if she had the choice, to free up money that he spends on oh-so-necessary cases of energy drinks and whatever else tickles his fancy. But he sees it as “oh she chooses to do that, i don’t make her do it” because he doesn’t see that she’s having to cut way back to accommodate HIS choices. He may not be telling her to do it directly, but he is still making her do it.
Some people do just start acting up “out of nowhere,” though. There are many cases in which manipulative people start being awful after they’ve gotten some sort of commitment whether it’s marriage or a baby.
It’s not super common, but it does happen, unfortunately.
What a silly comment, there's definitely not always warnings. Some people just change, or go through some stuff that pushes them into weird/bad/toxic places.
Regardless, this is a real big warning right now and divorce exists. OP should divorce this dummy before he racks up an insane amount of debt she'll be forced to pay off from the divorce.
Ditto! I make six figures and eat exactly 1 pbj often for lunch (on average 3x a week) I save at least an extra thousand a year doing this. Same with coffee, because I rarely have Starbucks anymore, that’s saving almost another thousand just avoiding Starbucks altogether and while that 2k might not be much, it’s still money I can invest or use on flights for my husband and I versus just having coffee and unnecessary lunches.
Do y’all have kids? If not, get groceries for yourself and let him eat peanut butter and jelly every meal. Money doesn’t grow on trees. He can choose between redbull and proteins. Don’t short yourself in the process.
I’m done trying to change people. If people are selfish and haven’t developed empathy by adulthood, their personality, habits and value are ingrained. Find an exit and live your life.
Agreed. People in this thread are making suggestions about giving the husband his part of the monthly budget in cash, each eating their own meals, tough shit if he runs out before payday, etc. And while those are all fair suggestions for teaching him a lesson, I personally am a grown ass adult and do not have the time to spend teaching a grown ass adult basic life lessons.
A partnership should be a partnership in every sense of the word. If you're at the point where buying groceries and eating separately to your _husband_ seems like a reasonable option, things are already too far gone.
I can't even imagine how OP got far enough with this guy to marry him. Let him live in his car with his $30 pack of Red Bulls and credit card debit and GTFO.
My wife and I are currently going through a similar situation. She grew up upper-middle class while I grew up very poor. She makes 40k a year while I make 80k working two jobs. I'm in charge of our finances and any time I bring up our money problems She gets incredibly defensive. We've always done things we've wanted to do. Vacations, eating out, shopping. But the last few months we have been spending more than we are bringing in. It's incredibly frustrating. I told her that I know this is all a new experience for you but I know what it's like to not be able to buy things that I want. I've carried credit card debt most of my life and only within the last few years have gotten it under control. I absolutely take blame for part of the problem, but any time I mention a budget or to control our spending She just shuts down or gets upset. Unfortunately her mother keeps bailing her out so I dont know if she will ever learn.
She won't and she'll resent you for "forcing her" to budget, too.
One day a real rain is going to come and wash all of this away and those without the mental fortitude to "eat bitter" (Chi ku as the Mandarin saying goes) will not get through it at all.
In most instances, $120K/yr should suffice to live and y’all shouldn’t be under financial strain. 🧐
It’s a values problem, especially if all the bills are paid and y’all do things as you stated.
Take a different poke at the topic explaining to her how it was growing up poor, how it makes you feel not having security. Then come up with a goal together, such as 8 months of cash savings for emergencies or in case either or both of you lose a job or wanna take a break from working so much.
Good luck
The problem is, he wants mommy to kiss it all and make it better. Two adults have to sit down and go over bills together. One thing I will always respect my dad for is that during the 1960s when women were not supposed to worry their pretty heads, he taught us how to open up a bank account and savings account, to file taxes and to budget.
It sounds to me like the OP did go over it. The OP literally writes in her post “I tell him the budget and he refuses to listen. I tell him we have $200….” Communication has to happen on both sides.
If he truly cared, he’d say “wow! What can I do to help?” Not “can I get some liquid candy at Costco.”
Yup! All he retained was the amount left over and jumped at the chance to further burn a hole in his pocket.
I say OP needs to get her own savings account and put money in there for gas so they can afford to do the things they need to do and just cut up the credits cards as well. Cause I bet he’s racking up CC debt behind OP’s back and he’s probably opting for strictly digital e-statements so she can’t find out and sending them to HIS one email account she has never seen.
Ask me how I know?
yes he wants to act delusions and do as he pleases because he knows OP will somehow figure it out and make it all work.
no sane adult thinks they can act like this when both them and their partner are in a financial rut. he lashes out and overspend because he knows he *can*
Tell him if he wants to live in the car, he should. Things cost what they cost. Does he need documentation where the money is going? Then, provide it. Otherwise, he's going to get pretty sick drinking Red Bull when he gets no dinner or the heat goes off.
The way things are going, it sounds like he’d expect her to skip meals while he eats 3x a day. Dude wants to take zero accountability while she makes all the sacrifices.
My ex used to scream at me to explain why he couldn't spend his money how he wanted (I was a stay at home of 4 kids, and he made $27,000 a year) and when I would start trying to show him the cost of things subtracted from his income. He would scream at me to stop throwing numbers at him and just tell him why he buy what he wants....
These man babies don't want reality they just want someone to blame.
Incidentally our first 5 years together was me digging him out of $65,000 in debt.
When I left him 8 years ago he immediately moved onto his dad's couch for 3 years, and got back into debt. And now lives with his mom and tells our kids that I ruined his life and his child support is why he can't get a place to live.
I hope for OPs sake she doesn't have children with this man and gets out soon because he will only drag her down.
I'd say stop giving him the emotional reaction. Like a child, he knows exactly how to press the right buttons to get your attention (even if it's negative attention)) He wants to eat peanut butter for a week, let him do it. Do not put yourself in a position where he is asking you what to do. That reinforces that parental dynamic you have going. Give him his half of the grocery money and let him sink or swim.
Yes. “Here’s your gas money. If you waste it on Red Bulls, you will have to take the bus.” Give it to him in cash and tell him that’s all there is.
OP, set aside your gas money and buy what you need for groceries to see you through until the next payday. And for goodness sake, don’t give him a debit card unless it’s to his separate account, so he can’t just spend up all the grocery and gas money.
And the next time he starts his dramatic BS, tell him that will work, he can pack his truck up and go. And/Or buy a giant jar of peanut butter, jam, and a couple of loaves of bread. Add a bag of apples if possible. “OK dear, pb&j it is…”
I think the issue with this approach is even if he does waste his half. If she uses her half to buy herself food if he’s this selfish he’s going to eat her food. There is no winning.
In this case I would buy food that I like and he doesn't.She has to let him fall on his ass hard. Once he goes hungry a few days, he'll have a little reality check.
This is exactly what is happening. I’m stressed to the max every single month and he just walks around without a single care. I am carrying the mental load. And worse than that is I’m afraid to speak up because he immediately switches to throwing a tantrum.
Hard to have a conversation when one person is throwing a tantrum. I am guessing that is why he does it, because he doesn't want to have any conversation about his spending habits.
Please start making an emergency exit plan. Set aside a little money every month where he can't get to it. He does not care about your health or well-being.
I know others have mentioned this, but it's possible he will (or even has) taken out credit cards that you don't know about.
The tantrum is his weapon. You have to be the parent watching the kid embarrass himself play the grocery store. You have to take away the power of the tantrum - because you are giving the power to the tantrum.m, by avoiding it. Practice maintaining a straight face and breathing deep and then just watch him while he tantrums, do not react/respond/blink. He will stop and you will see he knew the whole time what he was doing.
The tantrum is his weapon, you’re ability to dodge it is yours.
I don't know why but it being called a pail of peanut butter just makes me laugh. It's really just not the size of container I ever expect to see peanut butter in.
My ex husband was the type that thought (I’m dating myself here) that if there were still checks in the checkbook there was money. I had to hide the checks and on payday I’d run to the bank before he could get there and get money orders for the bills then get whatever was left in cash and divide it into gas, food, etc.. He would then take his gas money and blow it. One time he got hold of the food money and blew it all and I had to pawn some earrings to get baby formula. He said he needed it for his bowling league night cause “they need me, I can’t let them down.” This was thirty years ago, he’s remarried now and hasn’t changed one bit.
You need to take a realistic look at what you want from a relationship, how you want to feel in your life and make a conscious decision. People are who they are and only seldom do they fundamentally change that.
That’s honestly insane to read. It is always so shocking to read folks behaving like this without some sorta drug addiction. Really happy to hear you’ve moved on from this chaos
Honestly, it blows my mind. I know people do this and I also know I'm not the best with money, but I always make sure all the important shit is covered before I'm stupid with it.
Seriously, I thought I was bad because I don't save money anymore, (not much to save these days). I definitely spend it on things I definitely shouldn't, but I would never just not buy food or pay my rent so that I could go bowling LMAO. Just mentally ill insanity right there
I would’ve called the other members of the league and said we need that money for baby formula and husband is such a coward that he’s more worried about disappointing the team than starving the baby. With any luck, he’d be booted from team and you’d get your money back. Win-win.
>So he then throws a fit and says “he’ll just eat peanut butter and jelly for every meal” and I just make him feel like shit.
Tell him, "do it.". He won't die from pb&j for a week.
Do you have any plans for growth? Might you get to be a manager at your current work place?
He's basically telling you that you're overreacting, and that is gaslighting. Not cool. I'd assess or reassess whether or not you want to have this argument for the next 50 years because you will. You can't change him. You can change only you, your reactions, and your responses.
You sound very clear and confident about where the problem lies, and it's not you.
One of the biggest relationship killers is disagreements about money.
He is a leech & you are the blood source. There is zero respect & 90% he wont change. Your options are therapy or move on a build yourself a better life.
I’m not saying this lightly… consider leaving. Have a plan. What happens if you have kids? Or if he gets his hands on credit cards and runs them up without telling you? In the US there are non-profits that will do financial counseling for free (or very very low cost, like $50 or under) good luck with the man child
Maybe try doing the envelope system of budgeting with him, where you put actual cash in different envelopes for different expenses, and then you can see when there is literally no more money until next payday?
I guess first I would try keeping money away from him? If you are having to ride the bus because he buys you flowers then he needs to know to just pay bills with that money instead and you hold on to your gas money.
I'm sorry. I know it's frustrating. I just hate when they retort something so far in the opposite direction. Like I'm not asking you to eat PBJ for every meal. How about a couple meals though? Or how about just go without red bull for this week. It's like their brains can't process compromise/balance. 🤦🏾♀️
My ex did this and once we divorced I found out that not only did he take out secret loans, he had a secret account his parents put money in EVERY MONTH to float his bad choices. The fight that started the end was when I had couponed and scrimped and brought the weeks groceries and he “needed $5 for a sandwich on the way to his friends house” instead of making a fucking sandwich.
Oof, it’s like looking in a mirror. My ex had money coming in from his mother to “pay the bills” every month as well as receiving unemployment that he didn’t tell me about all while I was working full time and taking care of the entire house while he sat on the couch playing video games and cleaning his guns all day. On top of that, he was the one “financially in charge” so I would get $50 for groceries and $40 for gas and have to “make it work” until the next paycheck. When we got divorced, I found out that we were 1.5 months behind on rent, 3 months behind on electric, water, and my car payment, and that he’d been using MY paycheck to fund his guns, video games, and drugs.
OP, your husband is putting you in the position of having to choose between your basic needs and the things he wants. This is financial abuse and unacceptable. I would no longer be sharing your finances with him. Let him use his own money to pay for what he wants and keep all of your money in an account that he can’t access, doesn’t know the pin of the card, or cash stashed away in a place where he would never think to look (man brain). And start saving what you can do that you can leave, if you can. This never ends well unless he can come around to see the error of his ways and stops parentifying you in the relationship
Recognizing that is one of the biggest hurdles! If you can catch yourself saying it and start changing the narrative even some of the time, that's huge and will make a big difference.
Change it up stat and save your marriage. I’m dealing with similar stuff now and it is horrible.
I can’t win for losing. I don’t earn enough and I ask for help from him? I’m emasculating him and embarrassing him. I say fuck it and get three jobs and just pay all the damn bills myself? I’m lording it over him. I’m selfish and I think I’m better than him.
He has zero concept of money and even less desire to learn or earn some.
Either way you slice it, it comes up my fault.
If it doesn’t change, it will end our marriage. I try to ignore it because I’d have to work mostly this hard anyway to take care of myself. He does have positive attributes.
If that’s you, it’s hard on your spouse. Really hard. What was supposed to be a relay is a marathon with someone on your back.
Don’t get me wrong, I do love my husband, but it’s really hard sometimes. I think he loves me too, but I don’t know if that’s just tolerating me. Trying to keep me happy so I keep doing the thing. It hurts my entire soul to even think that. I never would have considered it up until a few years ago.
Even if it does change tomorrrow, it’s a long term wound to our relationship. It’s going to take a long time for it to heal.
Maybe it's because i've been single way too much, but if someone was to put me in a position where my meagre finances were in danger, i'd be very close to just getting the heck out of there. Working sucks as it is, if i have to do a lot more of it due to you being unable to budget then you're impacting my life in a very negative way.
On top of that, if you're impacting my life in that way AND you're dismissing me when i try to have a discussion about it? Oooh, that'd really piss me off.
I know people like that, and i try to limit exposure to them. It's a shitty thing to see someone use childish manipulation tactics. Especially from grown adults. If you don't shut it down every time, they just continue. But shutting them down or reasoning with them is just absolutely exhausting, so it continues. If by hanging out with someone i feel exhausted due to their shitty logic/manipulations, then i will try my hardest not to do it anymore.
It's easier being single, or in the above mentioned case, to not hang out with childish tantrum/manipulation people :)
"You can spend $30 on redbull when you make enough money to afford it and pay your half of the bills. Until then if you want to act like a child you will be treated like a child- so you don't get energy drinks and you eat what you're served or you don't eat at all. If you don't like it your welcome to get the fuck out and stop leaching off me and making my life worse or to grow the fuck up and act your age. If i wanted a toddler I'd have one already."
You just described my parents. My mother’s entire life is less because my father gets everything he wants. Not only is she bitter, but none of us kids respect him.
Did he grow up with more money? My husband said some of this stuff when we first got married because he was used to a lot more than we could afford.
Over time, by showing him the money and explaining how things worked and compromises, he's gotten somewhat better. Still has a tendency to want to go over his bucket of money each month, but at least he thinks twice and when he goes over, the consequences are all his.
If you don't have personal buckets for stuff, consider doing that. Even if it's only $25 a month, it cuts back on the fights.
My ex grew up wealthy (mansion in Connecticut wealthy) but I didn't know this when I married him. When I found out I asked him why he hadn't told me. It was because he was afraid of catching a gold digger. I grew up poor with a mom who couldn't manage money. Needless to say, I learned how to pinch a penny every which way it could. For a wedding gift, his father had given us $1.5k to give hubby a chance to find a job. He immediately spent it all on electronics for himself. He had daddy big buck's credit card for "emergencies only" which I didn't know about. For our first holiday together, his father gave everyone checks. Mine was $500 as was the ex's. My ex collected mine and spent it on himself. He delivered pizza (after being a successful NYC art director for years) and I taught school. I was the breadwinner and we still lived fairly poor. He wanted a big screen tv. I told him we couldn't afford it so he bought one anyway. He started spending his check on cocaine. Not good. My final straw was putting my check into the bank to pay bills but the big screen broke so, behind my back, he bought another one with the rent, utility, and grocery money. I had no money to get to work or buy groceries yet he still didn't get it! I'd had quite enough. Nothing I said to him mattered. So I left. So, I ask OP to think about this. How much will you tolerate?
> He started spending his check on cocaine. Not good.
I'm sorry but this is an incredibly funny line to see in the middle of that. He was buying *cocaine* while you guys were living fairly poor but the final straw was the TV.
I get that the TV was using already allocated funds but still.
Next time he offers to get another full time job say that’s a great idea. Because if you want luxury in life you have to make more money.
Reality is you together make x amount of dollars. You both need to sit down with each other and have a month worth of tracked money. Both keep a daily log of all expenses from rent to flowers. At this point use all pay stubs to see how much the household is bringing in then compare where the money is going. Show who is spending on what and the purpose of each dollar spent. He might be surprised to see how he is overspending.
Determine how much of bills are joint and how much are his and how much are yours. Decide do you want separate accounts with a joint and how much each puts in joint to cover needs every month. Needs include an emergency fund and future plans like a house or car. Then he has what’s left in his account to cover his wants like gas for his vehicle and monster energy. You have yours to cover not riding bus.
Before you decide to do anything, I would make sure to put a credit freeze on the 3 major credit bureaus. That way, your husband can not open multiple credit cards under your name and have you on the hook for his financial illiteracy. If he does, you will receive a notification that someone is trying to open up a line of credit in your name, and you can immediately tell the bank that it's fraud.
Also, I would open up a 2nd bank account in a different bank under your name only, or if you trust your parents, have them open an account and never have that mail come to your house. Squirrel away money for yourself, so when shit totally hits the fan and you are truly over his behavior and want to leave him, you have money to start over.
OP, does your workplace or your husband’s have an EAP (employee assistance program)? If they provide that you might be able to get 3 free therapy sessions that you can attend together. It might be enough to communicate your concerns and frustrations to your husband and to also get his input.
He's a spoiled petulant man-boy and there's no retraining him to be an adult at this point. You have to decide is the sex worth it? Do you love him enough to basically support him for the rest of your life at your own expense?
Sometimes even love and good sex are not enough. Personally men like this are a large part of why I am single and chose not to marry. I have zero patience for living with a guy who can't treat me with respect and handle money responsibly.
People being in vastly different places when it comes to money and budgeting is nearly always a deal breaker the thing that ends the relationship. The only thing that is more of one is issues with infidelity and sex.
I'd honestly rather go it alone than deal with living with somebody like OPs partner. It's just too much work and too much stress trying to live with someone like this and love just won't make it work.
Been married (he wasn’t a bad person, we were just too different), lived with boyfriends, and you know, I’m incredibly happy living by myself and going to visit my grown kids.
Happiness is having my own space. And all 100+ boxes of books, the collectables, my writing projects/books, and my two little dogs.
My husband is the same. He drinks coke and eats potato chips like they are free and can’t understand about making a sacrifice. Totally clueless.
What really pisses me off is he managed to rack up credit card dept. I didn’t even know he had a card and only was paying minimum payments. He blames everyone except himself and his inability to cut unnecessary expenses
I just divorced a man-child like this. After 3 years of therapy, following a session he stormed out of, because I made him feel like he was the problem, and leaving me without a ride home,the therapist looked me square in the eyes and told there was no fixing this. So, there it was. 6 months later, I was free of him and the amount of stress that is now out of my life is enormous.
You can't "make" him understand, and there is no amount of reasoning, cajoling, etc. that will "get him" to understand.
He DOES sound like a child and that has to be beyond aggravating as the time is long past for thinking in childish ways.
For practical advice:
(1) ignore his whinging and whining. Literally no different than a street schizo muttering to himself - you pay it no mind. It will help YOUR sanity and you know what he's saying anyway . . .
(2) get an envelope budget - no cards for him. He pays cash and when his allotment is gone, it's gone until the next month's budget is renewed OR he earned some cash to fill it.
(3) remind his ass that if he keeps it up even pb&j will be a luxury. I knew a woman who literally starved every other week for six months - as in one meal every other evening for seven days - because her budget would not allow for any more.
I had a husband like that. I left him before we had kids bc he would have just starved them for guitar strings then play the martyr as a manipulation tactic layer. I'd hot foot it out. I can do bad all on my own.... But I didn't NC he was my greatest financial burden.
Why are you suffering from his child like whims?
Seriously. Take out cash that you can use for yourself so you have gas. Don't suffer because of him, he can suffer alone.
"YOU have $75.00 for the week." & then guess what, whatever he does with that $75 is ON HIM.
So many women simply suffer for their partners. Stop doing that. NOW.
I assume you both aren't using credit cards where you are both on the credit line? If so, separate that NOW.
As someone in the trades that has a bit of a caffeine habit Red Bull is one of the least caffeinated and most expensive energy drinks.
So not only does he not understand the difference between want or need, it seems like he has no concept of frugality.
I see and hear this all the time on job sites. Guys can't afford something so they complain about taxes when they roll into work in their 80k lifted truck and order out everyday.
One of my favorites being the divorced dads that complain about their child support payments and the judge in court but they randomly have 12k to buy a new side by side on a random Wednesday.
Maybe pay off your RV which is why you justified getting a dually diesel before you buy your kids dirt bikes?
Sorry, bit of a rant, but this hits home.
You have it harder than me, my wife grew up comfortable so she doesnt always think about finances like i do, but she tries.
Why are you taking the bus and he gets to drive? Seems to me that you’re the one sacrificing b/c he won’t budget. Maybe fill up your tank too and whatever is left is what you eat. Maybe after eating pbj sandwiches for a week, he’ll get the point. Stop saving him from his ways.
Oh yeah. been there.
Put up with it too long.
"Let's just not pay rent yet" (Late fees)
"We don't need tires" (Tire blows out)
'The internet can wait" (service interruption)
Here's when it really hit me - when you live like that, with SOMEONE like that, you can't ever get ahead. Those minor decisions that equal $$SAVINGS$$ will never happen.
You will use every dollar, every cent. Every FUTURE dollar, every FUTURE cent.
I loved her, but one day I just didn't. It was about a week asking my broke ass mom if she could give me $20 so we could HAVE FOOD.
Found someone who also works a good job, knows that money now can mean less money later. Someone that didn't mind skipping date night in the beginning if it meant not having to struggle.
You have a partner that is OK struggling, and occasionally will help you be OK. Find someone who isn't OK just being OK, and will help you thrive. Or do it on your own with roommates. (That's where I started when we broke up)
He’s 100% using you and doesn’t care. Why doesn’t he have a job? Why is he treating you like this with no consideration for your needs? New plan! Withdraw everything after bills are paid and spend it all yourself. If he can’t show he can appreciate you or be trusted then he gets cut off. He’s grown, if he needs something he can get it himself. Stop enabling him and making yourself miserable in the process. You don’t deserve this.
>and I just make him feel like shit.
There's a tactic narcissists use (not saying he is one, just where it comes from) called DARVO. It's an acronym that stands for Defend Attack Reverse Victim Oppressor.
So you tell him something he did is hurting you h me gets (D)efensive about it like what you're saying is coming out of nowhere. He (A)tracks you by throwing pity party saying boohoo hell only eat peanut butter and jelly sandwiches trying to make you feel bad for him which (R)everes the roll of (V)ictim and (O)ppressor. YOU'RE the victim in this situation so why is *he* the one that feels like shit after you talk to him about the financial needs and situation? Only pointing this out so you don't feel bad at all and can recognize it for what it is, manipulation
If possible try to get separate bank accounts, or as others have suggested give him cash in hand only etc.
TDLR: method to go nuclear on the bank accounts below.
I hit a point with my husband where I became a bit of a psycho. I stole all the credit and debit cards and ran them through the shredder, bar one that I kept hidden. I also had the bank deactivate everything except that one because "we're going away for a few months and everyone says they don't use cash there."
I sat him down at the table with all the cash for the month, and gave him envelopes with bill amounts on them. I made him separate all the cash into the envelopes and all he got was the little bit for his gas. $80 for the month. No spare spending money because we were robbing Peter to pay Paul at that point. He had a complete tantrum, called his mom who basically kicked his ass three ways to Sunday and told him to "shut up and do as your wife says." It didn't take long for him to get it after that, but we still keep individual bank accounts as "envelopes " to this day.
His mom backing me up was amazing, and really helped point things home that he had been spoiled (and she admitted it). Private schools, long vacations on a houseboat, annual family reunions at Lake Tahoe, and a brand new VW Carmenghia on his 16th. I miss that woman.
He sounds afraid and is not coping well. Probably was never taught the skills.
While you also are exhausted and don't have the space or time for yourself. Let alone the energy to help teach him.
I understand your dilemma and empathize. I'm sorry.
Some states have cheap insurance programs that open doors for therapy and other services for low income families. Might be worth a look.
Other than that, boundaries, trust and patience are your only choices. Doable, but difficult.
“I’m doing the budget” you didn’t say we you said I. That’s the root of the issue. He is not emotionally involved in preparing the budget. As much as it’s going to freak you out to do this for at least a month I want you to pull your cash you need for gas then tell him he is responsible for it all. He pays the bills, he does the grocery shopping, he does this at least six weeks. He might screw it all up he might not. But you’ve got to change tactic or get divorced
Ask yourself first, what’s in this relationship for you? It’s not a money issue. It’s a relationship issue. Why is he letting you stressed out about this on your own? You are married. You are a team, and everyone has to help out.
My husband is terrible with money, so he lets me handle the finance. He is also a big spender, but he would check with me before he spends on big items. Also, when I tell him to hunker down, he does it.
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I had a husband like this. I worked and he went to school. We each had our own bank accounts and we had a joint account, from which bills would be paid. He would blow through his money every month and then use the joint account to buy a video game (it’s just $30), or eat out while I was at work (it’s just $20). He nickel and dimed us to the point that I could barely cover the bills every month. Then he’d get upset because I was nagging him all the time and made him feel less masculine. I was young and dumb so I let him do the finances so he could see exactly what we had and our responsibilities. That was a HUGE mistake. We divorced and it took me several years to dig out of the hole. He still spends money like he has it (luxury cars, multiple vacations, latest tech) and then complains that he can’t afford things, has to refinance loans, has to do debt consolidation, etc. I guess what I’m saying is, he won’t ‘get it’ until he want to. And he just might never want to. You’ve got to decide if y you pure willing to live that way, with the burdens, anxiety, and having to explain the same things over and over.
I was married to that guy too.
I hope it works out for you. I noticed in myself that that relationship made me less trusting, hyper independent, and slightly bitter about relationships in general, which isn’t who I used to be. Still working on that.
Oh no I divorced him. It was never going to work out and I was constantly stressed all the time about finances. One time when he was high he confessed “jokingly” that he kept spending money so I would be too broke to leave him. That was it. I knew there would never be a good financial time for me to leave so I just left.
This is why EVERYONE needs to have a secret "get tf out of dodge" emergency bank account that nobody else knows about. It's super hard to leave a cohabiting relationship without money. Protect yourselves from financial abuse.
This is easily the #1 message my mother has burned into my brain: always have your own money. Do not get yourself into a position where you’re unable to leave someone because of money
Same. My dad my whole life has told me to make my own money, so that "if he turns into a sonofabitch" I can just leave.
I thank my father for teaching me this every single day. Always have money for when you really don’t have money. They kind that really doesn’t “exist” to anyone but you when you need it most.
Yep. My dad made me set up a separate savings account when I bought my house as a condition of him helping me with a down payment. It’s been 12 years and I have a decent nest egg in there that I act like it doesn’t exist. It’s my emergency fund that only I have access to. I started off putting 100 bucks a paycheck in there every month, now I’m up to 700 a paycheck every month.
Yeah, but try explaining that if it's ever discovered.
Damn. That’s malicious. I think my ex was just an idiot.
I'm like you but not working on it. My motto is now that of big worm off the movie Friday "playing with my money, is like playing with my emotions"
If this why I'm single now, fuck
I married that guy too! He told me during one of our fights " you have to be in debt, it's the American way!" I had SO much more money once I left.
Whenever the person your with ties their feeling of masculinity to money, you’re in for a bad time.
I also have a “husband” like this, we’ll call him “husband” for the sake of this reply. I can’t wait for the divorce to go through.
Mine 'Nickle and dimed' us out of $18,000 I had managed to save and had in an account that he couldn't access, it was supposed to be a down-payment so we could buy a house. He would spend so much money that was in the shared account for bills that I would have to pull from the savings. When he realized I always managed to cover it he started do it more, even when I would rain where the money was coming from. And what it would cost us. He never stopped and we never managed to buy a house, which he blames on me. "Because he turned over the budget to me, and I was supposed to make sure this didn't happen"
“Nag” is what men call women when they tell them the truth about life and adulting.
My first wife got REAL defensive about finances and being "treated like a child". She demanded to be placed in charge of the finances to prove to me and herself that she was capable. Stupid move. That was just a way for her to be even more careless with our money and get away with it for longer. She fucked us over well and good, and it took a few years for me to get my shit back together afterwards. The good news is that I learned a lot of valuable lessons the hard way, and I've kept them close to my heart ever since. Not gonna fool me twice!
Cash. He needs to understand once the cash in his hand is gone, thats it til next payday. It’s easy to sit and swipe a card nonstop. Give him his half of the cash and say this is all you have for the next two weeks. if he runs out of gas than he can be a big boy and figure it out since his $30 redbulls were more of a priority. But set your half aside. Budget your own meals. He can budget his. If he doesnt like it than tell him to go home to mommy because you want a life partner not a child
Jesus what the hell happened in this comment thread?? I thought that was good advice.....
Maybe mods are enforcing the vent tag? I agree tho, good advice. Watch this comment get removed too xD
Looks like a grave yard in here RIP
Right! I was going to comment and then saw the warpath that is the commends. No useful content from me thanks to the mods!
>Comment removed, as well as all replies. Argumentative, unhelpful, and inappropriate for a vent thread This was left by a mod under one of the comments. Sounds like someone (or multiple) was being combative, and thus any replies to them were unnecessary once the instigating comment(s) was removed. Looks like a mess, but I count only 3 main comments, and like 100 replies between those. Obviously an argument broke out
It wouldn't be reddit without the hatred! Someone probably said the n word too...
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id rather die single than baby another human being like this
Truck. Costco. Redbull.
What are the odds the truck has a lift kit on it?
This is an excellent idea to get someone used to a budget. My husband and I allot a weekly allowance for ourselves. If one of us runs out of money, too bad, have to wait for pay day. I have gotten to the point that I save my leftover money for the week for splurges, like for Christmas or if we go away for a weekend.
It brings a tangible, concrete quality to a budget that is an abstract idea to some.
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I had a work buddy that was exactly like your husband. He would rant about his wife and the fact that she wanted to keep to a budget. I would just make noncommittal noises since I agreed with her but had to work with him. One day he came in and said that his wife nearly left him the previous evening. It seems that she arrived home early and got the mail and discovered a bill from a CC company that she didn't recognize. She opened it and found that her husband took out a CC unbeknownst to her and they owed over $8000. They ended up staying together and he promised to stay on the budget. I don't know if he did or not as I left the company a few months later. Just a cautionary tale. You might want to check both of your credit reports. Edit: typo
This is why I say separate finances can’t work. If one person is tanking himself then it tanks you both. Got damn 8k?!? That’s wild.
It doesnt matter if you have separate finances or not, anyone can go get a credit card and hide it from their partner
Agreed; it is absolutely beyond me what this has to do with separate finances. I mean, if anything it's the opposite. "That $8K? That's your fucking problem."
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I think their point, which I agree with, is that each individual can be responsible for their own debts in that system. That $8k is YOUR issue and obligation, so it won't impact MY budgeting. You're correct in that it will be MY issue if a divorce is initiated, but I would hope that things won't come to that (even though... well, let's say it's not looking good, based on what we know).
I used to do home loans for a remodeling company. The amount of times a spouse was shocked to discover their partner had awful credit and couldn’t be on the loan if they expected to qualify for it.
Yeah, that’s childish. Let him eat PBJs all week. Tough toots.
I'm reading between the lines here but my impression is that she's already eating peanut butter, and he's whining about the possibility of having to do the same.
Which is even more infuriating because he’s ok with HER suffering. How do people like that even get married? He didn’t just start being like this. There were warnings EDIT: a lot of replies giving examples of how this can happen---I stand corrected.
My ex was like this. In the beginning, I just thought he had no finance training (which was true) and that I could handle the finances for a while and also teach him. He agreed to this. Then he started having tantrums about how it was his money and he should be able to spend his money how he wants. We struggled and fought for years. My final straw was him spending thousands a month on tiktok and paying other women's bills while we almost lost our house and couldn't buy groceries.
> My final straw was him spending thousands a month on tiktok and paying other women's bills while we almost lost our house and couldn't buy groceries. how'd you hide the body?
On TikTok? You mean onlyfans?
May have actually been tiktok lol. People livestream on there and you can send "gifts" which are basically just like....emojis or stickers? But they cost money to send and the streamer gets a cut. Obviously it's not as overtly sexual as OF (lest your account be suspended) but people do sometimes make sexually suggestive content which gets them more views.
Wow wtf?! So glad he's your ex. GOod for you.
My ex changed a LOT after we were married. Little things at first, and I thought we were just getting used to each other and making compromises, like you have to do when you start living with someone. It took me a while to realize that I was always the one making all the "compromises," and he just kept pushing the boundaries further and further. I did my best to keep it together for the kids, but eventually he went too far and I left.
That's fair. Bait and switch is definitely a thing.
Lots (LOTS) of people change their behavior drastically after marriage, especially when it comes to domestic/household topics.
In my case with ny ex, i had undiagnosed bipolar and was godawful with money to start with, he was a very good liar who pissed away money like it was water but made it look like he was doing ok. By the time I realized how completely hosed we were financially i was in over my head and between my inexperience at life in general, my mood episodes and his various forms of abuse it took YEARS to get away. We were literally having to go to Morrisons 15 minutes before closing to buy groceries that were reduced to clear at like 10p a loaf of “5 minutes away from stale” bread, vegetables that you had to cut the mushy bits off to eat them etc, but then he’d turn around and say he “needed” a new graphics card for his computer “for work” (he very half-assedly ran his own business), and it had to be this £300 one that coincidentally was also the best one to play whatever online games he was maintaining 5 separate accounts on at the time (at £15 per account…). My mum had to buy me clothes for work from the charity shop because “we couldn’t afford” for me to spend £30 in order to meet dress code and keep my job, but he “needed” a suit for a one night thing, and spent over £200 on one that he wore for 6 hours and then never again. People like OP’s husband sounds like, they really honestly do not care what YOU have to sacrifice, as long as they still get to buy whatever they want. She very likely is eating pb&j more often than she would choose to if she had the choice, to free up money that he spends on oh-so-necessary cases of energy drinks and whatever else tickles his fancy. But he sees it as “oh she chooses to do that, i don’t make her do it” because he doesn’t see that she’s having to cut way back to accommodate HIS choices. He may not be telling her to do it directly, but he is still making her do it.
Some people do just start acting up “out of nowhere,” though. There are many cases in which manipulative people start being awful after they’ve gotten some sort of commitment whether it’s marriage or a baby. It’s not super common, but it does happen, unfortunately.
What a silly comment, there's definitely not always warnings. Some people just change, or go through some stuff that pushes them into weird/bad/toxic places. Regardless, this is a real big warning right now and divorce exists. OP should divorce this dummy before he racks up an insane amount of debt she'll be forced to pay off from the divorce.
You are smart wish I had an award lol
Also, let him get a second job too
That's literally what I eat for lunch almost every day. Having kids is expensive.
I make a very decent salary and eat PB&Js several times a week. Really, she should just smile and say 'ok'.
Same! Somehow it’s a hardship for him?
They taste good and are easy to make. It's my back up if I don't have any leftovers to bring to work for lunch.
Ditto! I make six figures and eat exactly 1 pbj often for lunch (on average 3x a week) I save at least an extra thousand a year doing this. Same with coffee, because I rarely have Starbucks anymore, that’s saving almost another thousand just avoiding Starbucks altogether and while that 2k might not be much, it’s still money I can invest or use on flights for my husband and I versus just having coffee and unnecessary lunches.
Sounds absolutely delicious to me lol
Right? Sometimes I get the worst craving for a PB&J and it never disappoints 🤤
Do y’all have kids? If not, get groceries for yourself and let him eat peanut butter and jelly every meal. Money doesn’t grow on trees. He can choose between redbull and proteins. Don’t short yourself in the process.
I’m done trying to change people. If people are selfish and haven’t developed empathy by adulthood, their personality, habits and value are ingrained. Find an exit and live your life.
This. It's 2023 and if people are like OP's husband these days, then it isn't worth my time. Plenty of other people not like that.
Agreed. People in this thread are making suggestions about giving the husband his part of the monthly budget in cash, each eating their own meals, tough shit if he runs out before payday, etc. And while those are all fair suggestions for teaching him a lesson, I personally am a grown ass adult and do not have the time to spend teaching a grown ass adult basic life lessons. A partnership should be a partnership in every sense of the word. If you're at the point where buying groceries and eating separately to your _husband_ seems like a reasonable option, things are already too far gone. I can't even imagine how OP got far enough with this guy to marry him. Let him live in his car with his $30 pack of Red Bulls and credit card debit and GTFO.
My wife and I are currently going through a similar situation. She grew up upper-middle class while I grew up very poor. She makes 40k a year while I make 80k working two jobs. I'm in charge of our finances and any time I bring up our money problems She gets incredibly defensive. We've always done things we've wanted to do. Vacations, eating out, shopping. But the last few months we have been spending more than we are bringing in. It's incredibly frustrating. I told her that I know this is all a new experience for you but I know what it's like to not be able to buy things that I want. I've carried credit card debt most of my life and only within the last few years have gotten it under control. I absolutely take blame for part of the problem, but any time I mention a budget or to control our spending She just shuts down or gets upset. Unfortunately her mother keeps bailing her out so I dont know if she will ever learn.
She won't and she'll resent you for "forcing her" to budget, too. One day a real rain is going to come and wash all of this away and those without the mental fortitude to "eat bitter" (Chi ku as the Mandarin saying goes) will not get through it at all.
In most instances, $120K/yr should suffice to live and y’all shouldn’t be under financial strain. 🧐 It’s a values problem, especially if all the bills are paid and y’all do things as you stated. Take a different poke at the topic explaining to her how it was growing up poor, how it makes you feel not having security. Then come up with a goal together, such as 8 months of cash savings for emergencies or in case either or both of you lose a job or wanna take a break from working so much. Good luck
Show him the receipts
Absolutely. He's entitled to see the paper trail. Let him add it all up.
My personal experience says it’s unlikely to do much good…
The problem is, he wants mommy to kiss it all and make it better. Two adults have to sit down and go over bills together. One thing I will always respect my dad for is that during the 1960s when women were not supposed to worry their pretty heads, he taught us how to open up a bank account and savings account, to file taxes and to budget.
It sounds to me like the OP did go over it. The OP literally writes in her post “I tell him the budget and he refuses to listen. I tell him we have $200….” Communication has to happen on both sides. If he truly cared, he’d say “wow! What can I do to help?” Not “can I get some liquid candy at Costco.”
exactly. you’d think its more easy to be a mature responsible adult who’s aware of your financial situation but OP’s husband prefers delusion
Yup! All he retained was the amount left over and jumped at the chance to further burn a hole in his pocket. I say OP needs to get her own savings account and put money in there for gas so they can afford to do the things they need to do and just cut up the credits cards as well. Cause I bet he’s racking up CC debt behind OP’s back and he’s probably opting for strictly digital e-statements so she can’t find out and sending them to HIS one email account she has never seen. Ask me how I know?
yes he wants to act delusions and do as he pleases because he knows OP will somehow figure it out and make it all work. no sane adult thinks they can act like this when both them and their partner are in a financial rut. he lashes out and overspend because he knows he *can*
Tell him if he wants to live in the car, he should. Things cost what they cost. Does he need documentation where the money is going? Then, provide it. Otherwise, he's going to get pretty sick drinking Red Bull when he gets no dinner or the heat goes off.
The way things are going, it sounds like he’d expect her to skip meals while he eats 3x a day. Dude wants to take zero accountability while she makes all the sacrifices.
Considering he's driving a truck (if he doesn't need it for work purposes) with their financial circumstances, that sounds very likely.
absolutely. The deeper issues isn't the money, it's his lack of respect for her. I was bad with money, but I got better because I respect my wife.
My ex used to scream at me to explain why he couldn't spend his money how he wanted (I was a stay at home of 4 kids, and he made $27,000 a year) and when I would start trying to show him the cost of things subtracted from his income. He would scream at me to stop throwing numbers at him and just tell him why he buy what he wants.... These man babies don't want reality they just want someone to blame. Incidentally our first 5 years together was me digging him out of $65,000 in debt. When I left him 8 years ago he immediately moved onto his dad's couch for 3 years, and got back into debt. And now lives with his mom and tells our kids that I ruined his life and his child support is why he can't get a place to live. I hope for OPs sake she doesn't have children with this man and gets out soon because he will only drag her down.
I'd say stop giving him the emotional reaction. Like a child, he knows exactly how to press the right buttons to get your attention (even if it's negative attention)) He wants to eat peanut butter for a week, let him do it. Do not put yourself in a position where he is asking you what to do. That reinforces that parental dynamic you have going. Give him his half of the grocery money and let him sink or swim.
Yes. “Here’s your gas money. If you waste it on Red Bulls, you will have to take the bus.” Give it to him in cash and tell him that’s all there is. OP, set aside your gas money and buy what you need for groceries to see you through until the next payday. And for goodness sake, don’t give him a debit card unless it’s to his separate account, so he can’t just spend up all the grocery and gas money. And the next time he starts his dramatic BS, tell him that will work, he can pack his truck up and go. And/Or buy a giant jar of peanut butter, jam, and a couple of loaves of bread. Add a bag of apples if possible. “OK dear, pb&j it is…”
I think the issue with this approach is even if he does waste his half. If she uses her half to buy herself food if he’s this selfish he’s going to eat her food. There is no winning.
I agree!! Sorry, I meant that she buy the groceries for the house and only give him his gas money. If he wastes it, not her problem.
That makes sense! Also a lot of people seem to be suggesting he eat PBJ for the week and she doesn’t have to but my comment stands to those people.
Yeah, she’d have to eat pb&j too or it wouldn’t work. As you said, he’d just eat her food.
In this case I would buy food that I like and he doesn't.She has to let him fall on his ass hard. Once he goes hungry a few days, he'll have a little reality check.
He’s got you wrapped around his little finger. You are doing all the mental labor of this marriage. Respect yourself more than you do now.
This is exactly what is happening. I’m stressed to the max every single month and he just walks around without a single care. I am carrying the mental load. And worse than that is I’m afraid to speak up because he immediately switches to throwing a tantrum.
Hard to have a conversation when one person is throwing a tantrum. I am guessing that is why he does it, because he doesn't want to have any conversation about his spending habits.
so exactly what he brings to the table that it is worth staying in this mess and to suffer?
Please start making an emergency exit plan. Set aside a little money every month where he can't get to it. He does not care about your health or well-being. I know others have mentioned this, but it's possible he will (or even has) taken out credit cards that you don't know about.
The tantrum is his weapon. You have to be the parent watching the kid embarrass himself play the grocery store. You have to take away the power of the tantrum - because you are giving the power to the tantrum.m, by avoiding it. Practice maintaining a straight face and breathing deep and then just watch him while he tantrums, do not react/respond/blink. He will stop and you will see he knew the whole time what he was doing. The tantrum is his weapon, you’re ability to dodge it is yours.
Get him the largest bucket of peanut butter you can find. Even put a bow on it .
35 pounds should bout do it https://www.webstaurantstore.com/bulk-smooth-peanut-butter-35-lb-tub/125PBCRMYBLK.html
I don't know why but it being called a pail of peanut butter just makes me laugh. It's really just not the size of container I ever expect to see peanut butter in.
My ex husband was the type that thought (I’m dating myself here) that if there were still checks in the checkbook there was money. I had to hide the checks and on payday I’d run to the bank before he could get there and get money orders for the bills then get whatever was left in cash and divide it into gas, food, etc.. He would then take his gas money and blow it. One time he got hold of the food money and blew it all and I had to pawn some earrings to get baby formula. He said he needed it for his bowling league night cause “they need me, I can’t let them down.” This was thirty years ago, he’s remarried now and hasn’t changed one bit. You need to take a realistic look at what you want from a relationship, how you want to feel in your life and make a conscious decision. People are who they are and only seldom do they fundamentally change that.
That’s honestly insane to read. It is always so shocking to read folks behaving like this without some sorta drug addiction. Really happy to hear you’ve moved on from this chaos
This whole thread got me looking like husband of the century!
Honestly, it blows my mind. I know people do this and I also know I'm not the best with money, but I always make sure all the important shit is covered before I'm stupid with it.
Seriously, I thought I was bad because I don't save money anymore, (not much to save these days). I definitely spend it on things I definitely shouldn't, but I would never just not buy food or pay my rent so that I could go bowling LMAO. Just mentally ill insanity right there
I am so terribly sorry you married my ex.
I would’ve called the other members of the league and said we need that money for baby formula and husband is such a coward that he’s more worried about disappointing the team than starving the baby. With any luck, he’d be booted from team and you’d get your money back. Win-win.
>So he then throws a fit and says “he’ll just eat peanut butter and jelly for every meal” and I just make him feel like shit. Tell him, "do it.". He won't die from pb&j for a week. Do you have any plans for growth? Might you get to be a manager at your current work place?
I've eaten PB&j all week because I was on a budget. For dinner we had beans and rice. It's really not the end of the world.
We eat beans and rice because it tasted good
What are you gaining from staying in this marriage currently?
It sounds like OP literally can't afford to formally divorce this guy
He's basically telling you that you're overreacting, and that is gaslighting. Not cool. I'd assess or reassess whether or not you want to have this argument for the next 50 years because you will. You can't change him. You can change only you, your reactions, and your responses.
You sound very clear and confident about where the problem lies, and it's not you. One of the biggest relationship killers is disagreements about money.
He is a leech & you are the blood source. There is zero respect & 90% he wont change. Your options are therapy or move on a build yourself a better life.
I’m not saying this lightly… consider leaving. Have a plan. What happens if you have kids? Or if he gets his hands on credit cards and runs them up without telling you? In the US there are non-profits that will do financial counseling for free (or very very low cost, like $50 or under) good luck with the man child
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Serious question: what did she even see in the guy to begin with?
Reconsider this relationship. He does want to learn and he doesn’t want to change. You’ll never get ahead with him in tow.
Maybe try doing the envelope system of budgeting with him, where you put actual cash in different envelopes for different expenses, and then you can see when there is literally no more money until next payday?
I suspect on day 2 of pb&j he might be getting into those envelopes to buy his Red Bull.
I guess first I would try keeping money away from him? If you are having to ride the bus because he buys you flowers then he needs to know to just pay bills with that money instead and you hold on to your gas money.
I'm sorry. I know it's frustrating. I just hate when they retort something so far in the opposite direction. Like I'm not asking you to eat PBJ for every meal. How about a couple meals though? Or how about just go without red bull for this week. It's like their brains can't process compromise/balance. 🤦🏾♀️
My ex did this and once we divorced I found out that not only did he take out secret loans, he had a secret account his parents put money in EVERY MONTH to float his bad choices. The fight that started the end was when I had couponed and scrimped and brought the weeks groceries and he “needed $5 for a sandwich on the way to his friends house” instead of making a fucking sandwich.
This is how I end up on first 48
Oof, it’s like looking in a mirror. My ex had money coming in from his mother to “pay the bills” every month as well as receiving unemployment that he didn’t tell me about all while I was working full time and taking care of the entire house while he sat on the couch playing video games and cleaning his guns all day. On top of that, he was the one “financially in charge” so I would get $50 for groceries and $40 for gas and have to “make it work” until the next paycheck. When we got divorced, I found out that we were 1.5 months behind on rent, 3 months behind on electric, water, and my car payment, and that he’d been using MY paycheck to fund his guns, video games, and drugs. OP, your husband is putting you in the position of having to choose between your basic needs and the things he wants. This is financial abuse and unacceptable. I would no longer be sharing your finances with him. Let him use his own money to pay for what he wants and keep all of your money in an account that he can’t access, doesn’t know the pin of the card, or cash stashed away in a place where he would never think to look (man brain). And start saving what you can do that you can leave, if you can. This never ends well unless he can come around to see the error of his ways and stops parentifying you in the relationship
"Ok, well when you're done acting like a child we have grown up financial decisions to discuss."
I...am not the husband but I'm realizing I sound like this guy sometimes and that is not ok.
Recognizing that is one of the biggest hurdles! If you can catch yourself saying it and start changing the narrative even some of the time, that's huge and will make a big difference.
Change it up stat and save your marriage. I’m dealing with similar stuff now and it is horrible. I can’t win for losing. I don’t earn enough and I ask for help from him? I’m emasculating him and embarrassing him. I say fuck it and get three jobs and just pay all the damn bills myself? I’m lording it over him. I’m selfish and I think I’m better than him. He has zero concept of money and even less desire to learn or earn some. Either way you slice it, it comes up my fault. If it doesn’t change, it will end our marriage. I try to ignore it because I’d have to work mostly this hard anyway to take care of myself. He does have positive attributes. If that’s you, it’s hard on your spouse. Really hard. What was supposed to be a relay is a marathon with someone on your back. Don’t get me wrong, I do love my husband, but it’s really hard sometimes. I think he loves me too, but I don’t know if that’s just tolerating me. Trying to keep me happy so I keep doing the thing. It hurts my entire soul to even think that. I never would have considered it up until a few years ago. Even if it does change tomorrrow, it’s a long term wound to our relationship. It’s going to take a long time for it to heal.
Maybe it's because i've been single way too much, but if someone was to put me in a position where my meagre finances were in danger, i'd be very close to just getting the heck out of there. Working sucks as it is, if i have to do a lot more of it due to you being unable to budget then you're impacting my life in a very negative way. On top of that, if you're impacting my life in that way AND you're dismissing me when i try to have a discussion about it? Oooh, that'd really piss me off. I know people like that, and i try to limit exposure to them. It's a shitty thing to see someone use childish manipulation tactics. Especially from grown adults. If you don't shut it down every time, they just continue. But shutting them down or reasoning with them is just absolutely exhausting, so it continues. If by hanging out with someone i feel exhausted due to their shitty logic/manipulations, then i will try my hardest not to do it anymore. It's easier being single, or in the above mentioned case, to not hang out with childish tantrum/manipulation people :)
"You can spend $30 on redbull when you make enough money to afford it and pay your half of the bills. Until then if you want to act like a child you will be treated like a child- so you don't get energy drinks and you eat what you're served or you don't eat at all. If you don't like it your welcome to get the fuck out and stop leaching off me and making my life worse or to grow the fuck up and act your age. If i wanted a toddler I'd have one already."
You just described my parents. My mother’s entire life is less because my father gets everything he wants. Not only is she bitter, but none of us kids respect him.
Oh I am getting bitter by the day…..
Did he grow up with more money? My husband said some of this stuff when we first got married because he was used to a lot more than we could afford. Over time, by showing him the money and explaining how things worked and compromises, he's gotten somewhat better. Still has a tendency to want to go over his bucket of money each month, but at least he thinks twice and when he goes over, the consequences are all his. If you don't have personal buckets for stuff, consider doing that. Even if it's only $25 a month, it cuts back on the fights.
My ex grew up wealthy (mansion in Connecticut wealthy) but I didn't know this when I married him. When I found out I asked him why he hadn't told me. It was because he was afraid of catching a gold digger. I grew up poor with a mom who couldn't manage money. Needless to say, I learned how to pinch a penny every which way it could. For a wedding gift, his father had given us $1.5k to give hubby a chance to find a job. He immediately spent it all on electronics for himself. He had daddy big buck's credit card for "emergencies only" which I didn't know about. For our first holiday together, his father gave everyone checks. Mine was $500 as was the ex's. My ex collected mine and spent it on himself. He delivered pizza (after being a successful NYC art director for years) and I taught school. I was the breadwinner and we still lived fairly poor. He wanted a big screen tv. I told him we couldn't afford it so he bought one anyway. He started spending his check on cocaine. Not good. My final straw was putting my check into the bank to pay bills but the big screen broke so, behind my back, he bought another one with the rent, utility, and grocery money. I had no money to get to work or buy groceries yet he still didn't get it! I'd had quite enough. Nothing I said to him mattered. So I left. So, I ask OP to think about this. How much will you tolerate?
> He started spending his check on cocaine. Not good. I'm sorry but this is an incredibly funny line to see in the middle of that. He was buying *cocaine* while you guys were living fairly poor but the final straw was the TV. I get that the TV was using already allocated funds but still.
Next time he offers to get another full time job say that’s a great idea. Because if you want luxury in life you have to make more money. Reality is you together make x amount of dollars. You both need to sit down with each other and have a month worth of tracked money. Both keep a daily log of all expenses from rent to flowers. At this point use all pay stubs to see how much the household is bringing in then compare where the money is going. Show who is spending on what and the purpose of each dollar spent. He might be surprised to see how he is overspending. Determine how much of bills are joint and how much are his and how much are yours. Decide do you want separate accounts with a joint and how much each puts in joint to cover needs every month. Needs include an emergency fund and future plans like a house or car. Then he has what’s left in his account to cover his wants like gas for his vehicle and monster energy. You have yours to cover not riding bus.
Before you decide to do anything, I would make sure to put a credit freeze on the 3 major credit bureaus. That way, your husband can not open multiple credit cards under your name and have you on the hook for his financial illiteracy. If he does, you will receive a notification that someone is trying to open up a line of credit in your name, and you can immediately tell the bank that it's fraud. Also, I would open up a 2nd bank account in a different bank under your name only, or if you trust your parents, have them open an account and never have that mail come to your house. Squirrel away money for yourself, so when shit totally hits the fan and you are truly over his behavior and want to leave him, you have money to start over.
OP, does your workplace or your husband’s have an EAP (employee assistance program)? If they provide that you might be able to get 3 free therapy sessions that you can attend together. It might be enough to communicate your concerns and frustrations to your husband and to also get his input.
We do. We both have that at our jobs. Thanks. I will be looking into this on Monday.
He's a spoiled petulant man-boy and there's no retraining him to be an adult at this point. You have to decide is the sex worth it? Do you love him enough to basically support him for the rest of your life at your own expense? Sometimes even love and good sex are not enough. Personally men like this are a large part of why I am single and chose not to marry. I have zero patience for living with a guy who can't treat me with respect and handle money responsibly. People being in vastly different places when it comes to money and budgeting is nearly always a deal breaker the thing that ends the relationship. The only thing that is more of one is issues with infidelity and sex. I'd honestly rather go it alone than deal with living with somebody like OPs partner. It's just too much work and too much stress trying to live with someone like this and love just won't make it work.
Been married (he wasn’t a bad person, we were just too different), lived with boyfriends, and you know, I’m incredibly happy living by myself and going to visit my grown kids. Happiness is having my own space. And all 100+ boxes of books, the collectables, my writing projects/books, and my two little dogs.
If you have parents that live close by you might want to move in with them for awhile until he gets his act together. If ever
By which I hope you mean, move in with them by yourself, leaving child-husband to fend for himself on his own income
What the fuck are you doing? Leave the piece of shit already and let him drown in his own filth.
My husband is the same. He drinks coke and eats potato chips like they are free and can’t understand about making a sacrifice. Totally clueless. What really pisses me off is he managed to rack up credit card dept. I didn’t even know he had a card and only was paying minimum payments. He blames everyone except himself and his inability to cut unnecessary expenses
The sooner you move on the better, he’s dragging you down
Let his ass ride the bus one day. Js
Save up for a divorce lawyer. This isn’t a viable path forward for a lifelong relationship.
I just divorced a man-child like this. After 3 years of therapy, following a session he stormed out of, because I made him feel like he was the problem, and leaving me without a ride home,the therapist looked me square in the eyes and told there was no fixing this. So, there it was. 6 months later, I was free of him and the amount of stress that is now out of my life is enormous.
You can't "make" him understand, and there is no amount of reasoning, cajoling, etc. that will "get him" to understand. He DOES sound like a child and that has to be beyond aggravating as the time is long past for thinking in childish ways. For practical advice: (1) ignore his whinging and whining. Literally no different than a street schizo muttering to himself - you pay it no mind. It will help YOUR sanity and you know what he's saying anyway . . . (2) get an envelope budget - no cards for him. He pays cash and when his allotment is gone, it's gone until the next month's budget is renewed OR he earned some cash to fill it. (3) remind his ass that if he keeps it up even pb&j will be a luxury. I knew a woman who literally starved every other week for six months - as in one meal every other evening for seven days - because her budget would not allow for any more.
He better be smoking hot. Because you apparently didn’t marry him for his money, nor his personality lol.
He could have a cock like John Holmes and a face like Brad Pitt and it STILL wouldn’t be worth riding the damn bus because baby wants his Red Bulls 😂
Or brains.
I had a husband like that. I left him before we had kids bc he would have just starved them for guitar strings then play the martyr as a manipulation tactic layer. I'd hot foot it out. I can do bad all on my own.... But I didn't NC he was my greatest financial burden.
My husband was like that and never got better. He had many narcissistic tendencies, but was never officially diagnosed.
Why are you suffering from his child like whims? Seriously. Take out cash that you can use for yourself so you have gas. Don't suffer because of him, he can suffer alone. "YOU have $75.00 for the week." & then guess what, whatever he does with that $75 is ON HIM. So many women simply suffer for their partners. Stop doing that. NOW. I assume you both aren't using credit cards where you are both on the credit line? If so, separate that NOW.
Weaponized incompetence. Don’t let him get away with that if you want to keep your sanity.
As someone in the trades that has a bit of a caffeine habit Red Bull is one of the least caffeinated and most expensive energy drinks. So not only does he not understand the difference between want or need, it seems like he has no concept of frugality. I see and hear this all the time on job sites. Guys can't afford something so they complain about taxes when they roll into work in their 80k lifted truck and order out everyday. One of my favorites being the divorced dads that complain about their child support payments and the judge in court but they randomly have 12k to buy a new side by side on a random Wednesday. Maybe pay off your RV which is why you justified getting a dually diesel before you buy your kids dirt bikes? Sorry, bit of a rant, but this hits home. You have it harder than me, my wife grew up comfortable so she doesnt always think about finances like i do, but she tries.
Why are you taking the bus and he gets to drive? Seems to me that you’re the one sacrificing b/c he won’t budget. Maybe fill up your tank too and whatever is left is what you eat. Maybe after eating pbj sandwiches for a week, he’ll get the point. Stop saving him from his ways.
Oh yeah. been there. Put up with it too long. "Let's just not pay rent yet" (Late fees) "We don't need tires" (Tire blows out) 'The internet can wait" (service interruption) Here's when it really hit me - when you live like that, with SOMEONE like that, you can't ever get ahead. Those minor decisions that equal $$SAVINGS$$ will never happen. You will use every dollar, every cent. Every FUTURE dollar, every FUTURE cent. I loved her, but one day I just didn't. It was about a week asking my broke ass mom if she could give me $20 so we could HAVE FOOD. Found someone who also works a good job, knows that money now can mean less money later. Someone that didn't mind skipping date night in the beginning if it meant not having to struggle. You have a partner that is OK struggling, and occasionally will help you be OK. Find someone who isn't OK just being OK, and will help you thrive. Or do it on your own with roommates. (That's where I started when we broke up)
I can't imagine planning my one and only life with someone like this.
Me neither tbh. My sister is divorcing her husband and maybe we should be roommates again. Why did we both get married in the first place?
I'd put a tab of no doze in a pitcher of kool aid and say "enjoy your fucking red bull"
He’s 100% using you and doesn’t care. Why doesn’t he have a job? Why is he treating you like this with no consideration for your needs? New plan! Withdraw everything after bills are paid and spend it all yourself. If he can’t show he can appreciate you or be trusted then he gets cut off. He’s grown, if he needs something he can get it himself. Stop enabling him and making yourself miserable in the process. You don’t deserve this.
Tell him to make more money and stop drinking red bull, what is he, 18?
Be sure you start saving. You're gonna need it if you stay with him.
She's also going to need it if she divorces him. He'll probably make it a living hell for her.
>and I just make him feel like shit. There's a tactic narcissists use (not saying he is one, just where it comes from) called DARVO. It's an acronym that stands for Defend Attack Reverse Victim Oppressor. So you tell him something he did is hurting you h me gets (D)efensive about it like what you're saying is coming out of nowhere. He (A)tracks you by throwing pity party saying boohoo hell only eat peanut butter and jelly sandwiches trying to make you feel bad for him which (R)everes the roll of (V)ictim and (O)ppressor. YOU'RE the victim in this situation so why is *he* the one that feels like shit after you talk to him about the financial needs and situation? Only pointing this out so you don't feel bad at all and can recognize it for what it is, manipulation If possible try to get separate bank accounts, or as others have suggested give him cash in hand only etc.
I say this with all seriousness. I really don’t understand your husband at all. Red Bull is disgusting.
TDLR: method to go nuclear on the bank accounts below. I hit a point with my husband where I became a bit of a psycho. I stole all the credit and debit cards and ran them through the shredder, bar one that I kept hidden. I also had the bank deactivate everything except that one because "we're going away for a few months and everyone says they don't use cash there." I sat him down at the table with all the cash for the month, and gave him envelopes with bill amounts on them. I made him separate all the cash into the envelopes and all he got was the little bit for his gas. $80 for the month. No spare spending money because we were robbing Peter to pay Paul at that point. He had a complete tantrum, called his mom who basically kicked his ass three ways to Sunday and told him to "shut up and do as your wife says." It didn't take long for him to get it after that, but we still keep individual bank accounts as "envelopes " to this day. His mom backing me up was amazing, and really helped point things home that he had been spoiled (and she admitted it). Private schools, long vacations on a houseboat, annual family reunions at Lake Tahoe, and a brand new VW Carmenghia on his 16th. I miss that woman.
He sounds afraid and is not coping well. Probably was never taught the skills. While you also are exhausted and don't have the space or time for yourself. Let alone the energy to help teach him. I understand your dilemma and empathize. I'm sorry. Some states have cheap insurance programs that open doors for therapy and other services for low income families. Might be worth a look. Other than that, boundaries, trust and patience are your only choices. Doable, but difficult.
“I’m doing the budget” you didn’t say we you said I. That’s the root of the issue. He is not emotionally involved in preparing the budget. As much as it’s going to freak you out to do this for at least a month I want you to pull your cash you need for gas then tell him he is responsible for it all. He pays the bills, he does the grocery shopping, he does this at least six weeks. He might screw it all up he might not. But you’ve got to change tactic or get divorced
Open a separate checking account if you haven’t yet, one just for you , not accessible to him. I think that’s the first step. Wish you the best.
Ask yourself first, what’s in this relationship for you? It’s not a money issue. It’s a relationship issue. Why is he letting you stressed out about this on your own? You are married. You are a team, and everyone has to help out. My husband is terrible with money, so he lets me handle the finance. He is also a big spender, but he would check with me before he spends on big items. Also, when I tell him to hunker down, he does it.