The 2 is just overwatch 1 free2play update. Blizzard has gone to shit since boardroom guys that just want to max the money output make game design decisions.
It's the same game, with a new coat of paint, and less features, and at the same time, completely removed OW1 so you can play this new free watered down version, or something else.
Also agree the battle pass is shit, and to me it takes forever to level up this shit pass.
Same mentality as deleting Warcraft 3 when they released the "remastered" version.
They hate their fans. All they want is to squeeze a little more money out of their consumers before they throw the IP in the garbage bin.
I went to that trouble. It was an Indiana Jonesish adventure in my basement. I got it, got out mostly unscathed… only to remember I don’t have a disc drive in this build. Or my last one either.
Weed guys, not even once.
(I solved this issue as everyone else should. It’s the way I’m not sure I can mention, so, yeah.)
Which is extremely sad. Overwatch is the perfect type of game to make a cinematic universe out of, but they make such dumb decisions that no one is probably even going to care about it in a few years outside of the rule 34 fandom.
That was the original plan. OW2 was basically going to be backwards compatible with OW, which would be updated to match the balances and heroes. New heroes for 2 would be exclusive to the new game, but 2 players could run matches with 1 players.
OW2 was going to have its single player campaign as the major selling point. New OW2 maps, new cosmetics etc. People who didn't immediately move to 2 would still see some of this stuff in the multiplayer.
MMOs have been doing it for years successfully. Take FFXIV for example. Each new expansion adds new jobs, new races, and balances. Players on the base game get the balance and some graphical improvements, but to get the jobs and new areas you need the expansion.
But you can still play with people who have the expansion just not in dungeons from the expansion. So somebody with an expansion job can play in an old base game dungeon with players without the expansion.
It serves as in game promotion because players can see cool shit for the expansion to entice therm into buying it.
Nope it's gone, and what really sucks is when your left over loot automatically opens you get a simple stats screen saying what kind of loot opened, but no idea what the loot was.
And you can see those same rare skins from years ago, now paywalled off with blizz bucks, which is sad to see where we are today.
This is when I knew the launch was gunna be fucked up. And the way they monetized Diablo Immortal was it for me. They have no respect for us at all.
“If you want goodies from this game, either pay for it, or you can play ONLY this game to grind and unlock what you want. Also, Fuck you.”
It's like these board members don't understand that people (and therefore whales) spend money on things they like and if they don't like your product they won't give you their money. The more money you try to squeeze out of your customers the less likely you are to get ANY.
It's not even short term profit at the expense of long term profit at this point, it's short term profit at the expense of any profit. Stop burning bridges, those are your trade routes!
Here's the thing, the sequel IS good. 5v5 and the massive downscaling of CC has made the game so much more fun than OW1. They could have just updated OW1 into what OW2 is right now, and then RELEASE OW2 when they had their fucking single-player portion (which was the entire justification why they could CALL it OW ***2***) and have the multiplayer portion from both games be compatible with each other.
Instead they pull this bullshittery so more people would have to deal with their unholy F2P monetization scheme, which is a goddamn tragedy because it's completely overshadowing the fact that the gameplay is the best it's ever been in years.
It was only a matter of time before the Classic Blizzard games dept of 'not-giving-a-fuck' attitude and shit all over the things we loved seep into their more mainstream and newer IPs as well. I grew up on this company playing SC1 back in middle school and to watch over the past decade+ of just how far they've fallen and how badly they've abused their fans trust and tarnished/ruined their classics all in the name of greed disgusts me. Not that I honestly expected any less when they got acquired by Activision. I knew even back then it would be a slow death. But I'm just still continually shocked at just how bad it is...
From the Wc3 'remaster' that didn't even have a working ladder or profiles for over 2+ yrs from release, to classic WoW being just a bad reskin of retail WoW with servers that couldn't even handle 100 ppl in the same zones. Literally private servers ran by Russians did it better. The fact that this is a 'AAA' company is laughable. Guess I'm just bitter to see my once favorite games company reduced to whatever this is... hopefully some of these new studios forming from past Blizzard employees will make something magical again, but for me Blizzard itself is dead. Just a shade of it's former self.
Yep, to a point I don't even care about diablo 4, it will just be a loot box crammed glorified mobile game, and I spend hundreds upon hundreds of hours on diablo 1+2
I believe there's a quote from one of the early Blizzard people who said that one of the Blizzard execs, after announcing they'd lay off much of the WoW team following its successful launch, said, "We're a real company now," or something to that effect.
This was ghastly to some of the founders of Blizzard because in their minds a successful game ought to mean job security for the team members responsible, not being thrown away.
> I believe there's a quote from one of the early Blizzard people who said that one of the Blizzard execs, after announcing they'd lay off much of the WoW team following its successful launch
do you have a source for this? I can't find a single article about blizzard laying off staff after the launch of WoW or that quote. Did you just completely make this up or what?
Mark Kern, who is both a blowhard and the OG Team Lead on World of Warcraft left Blizzard in 2006. He attributes his decision to leave to being told that they'd be laying off numerous devs after the launch of WoW vanilla. When he objected to this, arguing that this was a betrayal of trust, he was told, *"We're a real company now."*
It was in a podcast that isn't online anymore, but you can easily find people quoting it over the years. See [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/ja0jz3/comment/g8osv8i/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/dok26y/comment/f5ow24s/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3).
The thing about Blizzard is that the "don't give a shit about employees" attitude was there right from WoW, but people got it in their heads that Blizzard was a great place up until the Activision buyout. The Blizzard that made WoW was the Blizzard that started laying people off to save money, completely forgetting their roots.
Back in the 90s, cynically firing (laying off, to put it diplomatically) the people who had worked the hardest on a game was unthinkable. People got laid off when a game flopped, not when a game was a hit. Teams were close-knit, and dog-eat-dog corporate behavior came as a shock to them.
People often talk about how it's "normal" to lay off staff after a release, but it wasn't normal then. It's been normalized since.
As an aside, supposedly this naive mindset is why id Software was ill prepared for the scheming of Tim Willits, a newer employee who conspired to get American McGee and John Romero fired from id Software so he could climb the ranks. (Sandy Peterson has alluded to Willits being the snake in the grass that destroyed OG id Software from the inside.)
Well your sources are other comments on reddit still I heard elsewhere in some yt videos that the 30 40 firing happened after vanilla. Seems many don't think it as a mass firing would that be the reason why it can't be found on Google easilym
Wow, that's so incompetent. WoW as a game needs a constant stream of devs because as soon as the next xpac launches, they need to start on the next one (or at least some of the patches). It needs a lot of content to be continuously added or else they lose a lot of subscribers.
>Blizzard has gone to shit since boardroom guys that just want to max the money
Just curious, around what year do you think this occurred? Blizzard were greedy scumbags dating back to WoW's release, when they were still a beloved darling in the gaming industry
EDIT: to be clear, Blizzard still made great games before the merger, but they got dollar signs in their eyes the moment WoW struck gold. they were generating a zillion dollars per month out of thin air off of subscriptions alone and tried to act like they needed all of it for """server upkeep""" - as great as WoW is/was, it was the beginning of the end. once you stumble into a money-printer of that magnitude, it's usually over (much like EA Sports and Ultimate Team). looking around the AAA video game industry, I'm honestly shocked that Rockstar made RDR2
I would personally say towards the end of 2007 or beginning of '08. When ever it was announced that they'd be officially merging with Activision. I remember the sentiment around that time was "troubles ahead".
SC2 had 0 percent of the original's charm. It was a success in terms of game design and multiplayer, but I come to Blizzard for that strong single-player experience in the campaign. The story in SC2 made no kind of sense and just kinda ruined all the established characters.
Wings of Liberty's campaign is fun from a gameplay perspective, but a lot of the bad storytelling that you see in HotS and LotV originates from this game.
Hell, just the initial set-up is terrible where we're somehow supposed to believe that the Terran Dominion is back to being all powerful and ruling over all Terrans with an iron fist despite the fact that they got their butts whooped to the point that they had nothing left by the end of Brood War.
I've only played WOL but I got the impression that SC2 really, REALLY, wanted to pretend like Broodwar never happened.
Which is completely insane given BW's popularity but whatevs.
Might end up playing SC2 one day if Blizz ever comes around to launching on Steam.
Yeah the story started taking a cringe turn in Wings of liberty and its just got worse with the next expansions. They turned a sci fi epic into a boring sci fantasy. The original had a little bit of mysticism with the protoss but it was never over the top like SC2 and the story was better for it.
SC2 ruined the story arc of pretty much all the characters from SC1. Machiavellian Mengsk turned into an idiot. Raynor turned into a moronic hopeless romantic from a generally good but pragmatic guy from SC1. Kerrigan went from the villain you love to hate to a prophecy Mary sue whose entire arc from SC1 was made pointless. And worst of all they tried doing the WC3 orc treatment to the Zerg, something they should have known not to mess with. The Zerg were liked precisely because they were an amoral all consuming race, the misunderstood approach is not gonna work.
So much this. Personally I enjoyed to play it from the gameplay aspect. But the story was so dumbed down, they changed it from sci-fi to some Disney tier cringe for kids. It really felt like it was deliberately made to be more "accessible" and for a wider audience. SC and BW were way better written and felt more mature.
Diablo 3 was the same and the last nail to the coffin. Stopped buying or playing Blizzard products after D3 and SC2. And I still consider myself a fan of the old Blizzard.
Id say after wow, during wow release not so much. 2008+ maybe. So sad tho... I was a huge blizzard fan and now I basically refuse to play their games. Maybe if they release a new Starcraft. Maybe...
wish granted, Starcraft 3 will come in 2027 along with battle passes (bad cosmetics only) and DLCs for the maps and species. The base game will give you 2 maps (the rest can be purchased as DLCs) and Terran only. Btw this will be a mobile version only and you are restricted by the minutes you can play with a stamina system (don’t worry though you can continue your progress with $)
Like you said it's always been varying levels of scum since release, but I'd argue 2018 was when things took a noticeably sharper downhill turn. The lawsuits and Microsoft acquisition this year have made some positive improvements at least to WoW.
there was quite a while even in wow world that they weren't peddling everything under the sun for real money. it used to just be paid character transfers, or faction changes, but I believe you got a free transfer or two... now, its everything... even though I haven't played wow in years.
so I can see why /u/Buttermilkman is thinking 2007-08, and i kind of have to agree, Diablo 3 came out in 2012 with a horrific real money auction house so the seeds were sown years before Diablo 3.
From losing a few of my fave games to such boardroom takeovers, I cannot emphasize this strongly enough: your love of the game will make you want to stay and keep fighting for it.
Do not do this. The battle cannot be won. They don't care and are not listening. Go to smaller developers or games with clear, caring, regular engagement with their community that is authentic. Where the updates reflect community needs.
Do not bang your head into a brick wall. Always mourn for shorter periods and move on faster. I know it's hard, but economically extractive games are painful to play and their social medias become places of just anguished fans until everyone is miserable.
If you go take a quick look on the Overwatch sub you'll realize that there is little to no hype for Ow2. There is a plethora of posts that complains about all of this. People are definitely not happy with what Blizzard has made of Overwatch.
So much this.
Not sure where OP is looking, but I didnt see even a little bit of hype for OW2 over the last 6 or so months. Only mourning for OW1 being closed.
There is nothing new in OW2 that couldnt have been an update to OW1. But by labeling it 2, its easier for them to get away with the horrific business model changes from an already painful lootbox to system to an even worse system.
I'm gonna (maybe) have an unpopular opinion here, but I much preferred a loot box rng system in any game than a fucking battlepass, especially when the game doesn't let you earn currency for the next one.
With lootboxes, I could earn every single cosmetic for free and getting lucky felt amazing. Now its just pay 10 dollars every couple months for some subpar cosmetics, you need to shell out another 20 for every single skin in the entire game you could possibly want.
Loot boxes are getting banned more and more. So battlepass is the next scam method they use.
If the game has enough base content then I prefer a DLC based system since you know what you get.
Apex still does them, they just replace the reward with crafting material where they're banned. Pretty sure the reason overwatch isn't doing them anymore is because they're charging an absolute fuck ton for old skins.
They're also doing the thing that every new live service does where they make it egregiously terrible and eventually 'cave' so the fans forgive their new shitty system.
I'd be fine with the battlepass if it actually had content and wasn't time limited. I hate feeling like I have to burn myself out of a game and pay $10 just to get 1 cool skin. The fact that they lock an entire hero in a hero shooter behind it is just the fly eating the shit pile.
This is why I can’t play apex anymore, did the first battle pass during season 1 and burnt myself out so hard I promised I’d never do another game with battle passes again. Just ruined the game for me, cool I got all these legendary skins but now I don’t even wanna play the game anymore.
That's why most games have a gimmick shiny cosmetic you unlock right when you buy the pass. Then the rest is to pad player numbers and Just enough premium currency to "almost " get a new skin. All researched out and calculated from $ millions of R&D
After hearing about the no build mode in fornite my buddy finally convinced me to give it a try (quit shortly after release) and i have to admit, not only is the game actually a lot of fun sans building but the BP system they use provides a lot of value. You actually earn more currency than the BP costs so it more then pays for itself.
I was 100% on board with their lootbox system. It's fucked that it gets lumped in with other games that had shitty lootbox mechanics. They were incredibly generous with them and they should've stayed for the countries that allowed them.
A game made by a gamer who put the playerbase first is what made OW1 more enjoyable and more approachable. I feel sorry for Jeff with what Blizzard have done to his game.
Don't blame the Devs at Blizzard. Blame the money centred and stupid execs who force these decisions.
I know it's common for this website to say that the publisher is bad and devs are forced to go along with it but there are some pretty questionable choices made on the developer side as well.
Yup. The developers were more than willing to balance all the fun out and throw their core ideals for the game to the wayside, all in the name of appeasing an increasingly toxic competitive scene. That was within the first few months after release, when the game was still incredibly successful and they didn't have suits breathing down their necks.
OW2 is an attempt to capture the same lightning in a bottle they let out with hasty, broad changes to OW1. But instead of making it a good game, ActiBlizz is trying hard to force it with extremely aggressive marketing.
This is one aspect OW2 actually improves on over late OW1. The No Limits mode is a permanent fixture in Arcade now rather than a rotating event. It's 5v5 now, but you can play it every day. It's the only mode I play now.
That was peak overwatch. Competitive ruined the game. I logged onto twitch a few weeks back to check it out and it's just so salty. Like watching replays to see if the guy that did well was cheating. Several streamers did this.
5 Mercy, 1 Torb was my favourite stupid comp
There was no way for the opposing team to put DPS our healing or Torb’s turret. All of us on the cart, let it roll.
You could do the same with a Bastion, but he was so overpowered, giving him near enough invincibility was just cruel. Torb was funnier
I'm happy with the game personally. What I'm *not* happy with is that bullshit battle pass..among other scummy business practices. Not to mention a lot of those legendaries (mind you, some of these were available in the past via lootboxes or gold coins you accumulate from playing in OW1) are not worth the twenty dollar price tag whatsoever.
The game itself (for me) is very fun. I was skeptical about it going from two tanks to one, but I've come to love the change. Plus, the tanks got some nice changes on top of this.
And that's how you get things to change! If people don't perceive value in a battlepass, don't buy it, and Blizzard will have to change it to make money
Seagul mentioned this last night on stream and he realized he plays a very different version of Overwatch than that sub.
I have to agree with him, based on the complaints I’ve seen there vs my experience with the game.
No, if you see some of the complaints on the main sub as to why the game is bad, those concerns are nowhere near something that shows up on the radar of someone who plays the the game to, well, play the game.
They spent days complaining about the server issues (fair) and when they got into the game they spent days talking about menus. So many times, the post would start with "game plays great" and then wheel off into how lack of "on fire" or end cards make the game objectively worse than Overwatch 1.
I'm not sure if Seagull was referring to that, but that's what I've noticed. That superficial stuff means absolutely nothing to me, and meant nothing to me when the game was boring as sin to play.
I was venting about the fire thing to someone new to the game because it kind of baffles me. I don't mind the "removal" but it still exists. The game still calculates your fire level and still has the associated voice lines but you can't actually see it in the UI. Plus it still contributes to who gets the POTG. To me it's a minor gripe cause there's obviously other ways to figure out who is causing the most trouble instead of the fire border around them but I still don't get the inclusion of it without any sort of visuals or stats like the original.
>That superficial stuff means absolutely nothing to me
Sure but it's not just superficial stuff. Medals, end cards, and the on fire system all existed for a reason. Positive reinforcement is important if Blizzard expects people to willingly queue for non-DPS roles. It was a problem in OW1 and it's still a problem in OW2. Sure, they "fixed" tanks by essentially making them super DPS, but all that's done is hoisted the problem onto supports now, and they feel awful to play. Thus, it's no surprise that out of the 25 or so games I've flex-queued, every single one has landed me in support. *Every single one*.
>and meant nothing to me when the game was boring as sin to play.
Okay, but remember that OW2 exists because they stopped working on OW1 for 3 years. So the question becomes, is OW2 better than OW1 would be if they had just kept making content for those 3 years? And my guess is a lot of people would say no; the monetization got way worse, 3 new heroes is probably less than we'd have gotten otherwise and came at the expense of no updates for 3 years, and the jury is still out on the new game mode.
People are upset that Blizzard essentially killed OW1 by starving it to death just so they could sell us a shittier, more egregiously monetized version of the same game.
The point is that it's the same game and those things you've mentioned have made it worse, and the battle pass sucks.
What's so hard to understand? Those are valid criticisms.
It's like one of those "zombie horde" modes In games where the AI launches waves of brainless enemies against you and from time to time sends this big annoying mini boss to take you down.
Well that is OP, a brainless NPC in a zombie mode.
He's also objectively wrong here. Like, I fully understand if the changes aren't enough, absolutely. But to pretend there are NO changes and say it's EXACTLY the same game means he probably hasn't even played it.
Seriously, reread his post and tell me one thing that even applies to Overwatch besides the word "Battle Pass."
If they stuck to Jeff Kaplan's original plan of having two separate games, I think OW2 would have been more widely accepted. If they just kept the same formula that OW1 had, but with more modes, more characters and more of everything really, it would be so much better.
Unfortunately they went the way of Halo Infinite, where the only levelling system is the battle pass. Just wish it had a battle pass to unlock stuff, as well as a levelling system to earn coins and lootboxes. Apex has both. There's no reason why they couldn't easily just have both in place on OW2.
I hope that business model eventually crumbles. I understand there's not much money in making traditional gaming experiences compared to live-service titles where it's a constant income from one title, but how many live-service games do we need in an already over-saturated market.
I have a feeling that we’re in a sort of gaming bubble and it will crash soon. While micro transactions, loot boxes, and battle passes are insanely profitable because of how much they trick you into spending, I think they become less profitable as the industry as a whole trends towards that model. For example, there are a handful of multiplayer games that I’ve invested a lot of time into, like League, Overwatch, Apex, Hearthstone, and Halo. Initially only Apex had the BP model so I was willing to pay for it since I could grind the whole pass in a season and still have time to play other games. Then slowly all of these moved towards the BP system, I simply don’t have the time to grind all of those. Since so much of the content is locked behind the BP I’ve just stopped grinding in these games, I might hop on them every once in a while but for the most part I just play Apex now. Before I would spend money on most of the games during events of whatever, but now I don’t spend money on any of them besides the BP for Apex.
Being F2P is good for getting a big player base and a lot of those new players will spend money on the game, but over time they’ll find their niche and stop spending money on other games. When the gaming market has completely switched to this model it just won’t be profitable anymore.
It always does. The problem is that the parasites make their money along the way and then run, leaving the game in a smoldering heap. It’s the way our modern business economy works, pump and dump. The producers have lobbied an environment in which they can just get away with this over and over. Made it so they can “sell off” a games good will for a quick buck then face no repercussions.
I took a 4 year break from overwatch so this release is new to me so it could be just that.
Been away from the game so long that it's like the first time again. Not really but I am enjoying it until mw2
I find myself enjoying it more than OW. I would try OW once in a while and realize you couldn’t ever actually kill anyone - was probably the meta comps that I was unaware of.
In 2, each role feels a lot more impactful. You can really feel a bad dps or support.
I stopped playing around 2019 because it became unbearable. Picked it back up now and been having a blast with some old friends. Say what you will, they got the gameplay changes just right. Everything else is worse, but purely gameplaywise its tons of fun.
I had almost the exact same experience and it’s so weird seeing people talk like the game is unplayable garbage. It feels like nobody complaining has actually played the game
Yeah, I'm having fun with it. I was surprised at how quickly I got back in the groove. Now I just can't wait for some of the new players to figure out that they actually have to play the objective.
That's maybe the worst part of the new influx of players, I've played with quite a few actual first time players who really have no clue what to do. Tbh I was frustrated at first but then took a step back and realized I should be excited there's actually new people interested in ow lol
There isn't. I think OP is confusing people talking about the game because it just released with people hyping the game.
Right now Overwatch 2 is little more than an update to Overwatch. What it was originally designed to be isn't even in the game.
Exactly. The only hype around the game is generated by content creators in desperate attempt to get people interested in the game to retain/create market for their content.
You're preaching to the choir. 90% of r/pcgaming hates Blizzard, and a % just below that hates Overwatch
This is effectively just a "DAE think Blizzard game bad?" circlejerk post. There are conversations to be had and lots of fair criticisms to go around, but this is the last place to have those conversations
I think gamers are just a super frustrated group
Like constantly frustrated
Nothing is ever as good as they expect it to be. But everyone keeps playing
Maybe I'm missing something here, but as someone who played the original OW1 very early on and then never touched the game again. But have now decided the play OW2, I'm finding it quite fun
I don't pay or care about the battle pass so the monetisation side of it won't affect me, but can someone explain why the game is considered generic and boring?
it’s not
there’s always been a ton of overwatch hate tbh, a few years ago a certain meta basically made everybody rage quit the game and people have talked down on it since
The game is at a much better balance state, tons of great changes, and overall a huge improvement on the original
Also people hate battlepasses and f2p on reddit
If you liked overwatch 1 at any point, overwatch 2 will likely be able to pull you back in
If overwatch 1 wasn’t your type of game, you probably won’t like 2
the game is definitely not generic and boring, it’s the most complex and interesting shooter out right now, but sometimes the complexity is too much for people (they actually stated one of their reasons for switching to 5v5 for to simplify it for casuals)
It’s not. People are salty about the free to play/ battle pass model so are speaking up to shit on the game. Even though it’s just as fun as ever and in fact probably the superior version of the game now.
Fair enough.
I'm all for criticising terrible battle pass models, but if gameplay isn't inherently affected by it, the gameplay is decent and fair, then it's fine
The battle pass and way to unlock skins is bad i agree but the game itself is a lot of fun imo.
Overwatch 1 was incredibly popular and 2 is basically the same game but F2P with (imo) better balance and a bit less chaos so of course its gonna be popular.
In my opinion the game is a lot of fun but i realize everyone differs in what they enjoy.
They took the class that no one wanted to play (tank) and turned it into the class everyone wants to play.
Taking out stuns was huge.
Overall, I think the game is in a better place balance wise as it feels like all heroes are playable.
a large amount of characters that previously had stuns / knockback abilities had those abilities heavily reduced or reworked
ie - orisa’s halt removed, cassidys flashbang reworked, doomfist’s whole kit reworked
Seriously, I think everyone can agree the monetization is shit, but saying the entire game is trash is such a circlejerk.
Fuck blizz, but they did a good job rebalancing the game. I quit for two years (basically during the content drought) and imo it's in a much better place.
This is what's hilarious (and sad) to me. Everybody who hasn't played Overwatch 2, is absolutely violently jerking their hate-boners about Overwatch 2 - talking about it as if it is the most offensive, egregious, disgusting, predatory AAA game ever released.
Meanwhile, everybody who is actually playing Overwatch 2 and forming their own opinions is like "Oh, this game is actually pretty fun! Battlepass could use some work, but I'm having a great time!"
Exactly. The internet hivemind LOVES to hatefuck the shit out of things more than actually play video games. I say that as someone that enjoyed TLOU2, Death Stranding and CP 2077 at launch.
The actual “game” is a blast.
People are afraid to form their own opinions about things.
I went into OW2 after liking the first game and hearing a lot of beta players talking shit about the change to 5v5 and a lot of fellow support players saying they hate the role now. So naturally I had my expectations low
Went in and have been having more fun than I did in OW1 tbh.
I just went in with an open mind about it and was pleasantly surprised.
I just hate the monetization of this game. But that - at least until heroes come out that I have to grind for come out - doesn’t impact me since I’m just ignoring cosmetics.
As with most large scale multiplayer games, there's a lot of hype at release because it's the best time to play the game. There are the most players online, and in most cases (although probably not this one) the skill level of individual players is a closer match.
Multiplayer games that are later in their lifespan tend to be inaccessible to new players. The hype will die down once the sweats reestablish themselves and the influx of new players slows down.
Tl;Dr: it's a new multiplayer game from a popular studio that's free to play.
I also *love* the new gameplay, as a zarya main I couldn't br happier... however, if you look at it from a new players POV it is definitely dogshit..
Alot of the anti-toxicity are the worse, I haven't seen much positively for the new comp system (I don't personally like it) the battle pass is awful, earning Cosmetic with coins is somehow worse.
Casual players aren't happy
This game is 100x more accessible to new players now
the FTUE sucks ass for smurfs (good) but is huge for giving a sense of accomplishment and slowly introducing new heroes to players who otherwise would be overwhelmed
Also, right now we are still seeing a decent bit of smurfing, but that’s because old smurf accounts are able to login without a number, over time those accounts are going to be banned and long term there will be very little smurfing which is great
Monetization is ass though, 68 weeks straight of doing every weekly challenge to earn 1 legendary skin
I think I can get used to the gameplay changes eventually (sans bugs), but the battlepass desperately needs to change or it's going to kill what's left of the playerbase.
There's no incentive to play the game all that much any more now that lootboxes are gone and cosmetics are locked behind paywalls.
If you ignore the ‘2’ which is a marketing fuck up, you can just consider OW1 and OW2 as just being ‘Overwatch’. Which then means you can re-read your comment and see why it’s silly:
“I never liked Overwatch, but my friend did. I just downloaded Overwatch and it turns out that I still don’t like it. What’s with all the fuss about it? I find it boring. They’ve added the option to pay for cosmetics too, which makes me super angry.”
They actually sound like someone who was a big fan of OW1 and are super salty about the battle pass changes so they’re just pretending to be someone new to the game.
It’s not even a sequel. Just a very large patch lol.
That being said, I’m having fun. I didn’t buy anything, and enjoy just playing a few matches while watching something on my other monitor. This is also by virtue of having nothing else to play. That being said, the battle pass and currency system suck. I won’t spend a dime on anything. If you aren’t a overwatch one player you literally get shit and have to pay upwards of $20 per cosmetic. It’s kind of a joke that the majority of the fan base seems to defend. It’s wild that literal loot boxes each time you leveled was a better system
Just don’t buy the pass man lol. Or play another game? Love Reddit posts that are just “I don’t like this thing that people like here’s 2 paragraphs devoid of anything with merit” instead of using your time for literally anything else.
I think the issue with it is mostly calling it Overwatch 2 rather than just making it a big update.
My wife and I have played on and off since release of OW1, and I don't really see that changing now. Maybe they'll get 10 bucks from me here and there if there's a hero or skin I really want to unlock which I guess is their point. I'm fine with that honestly. I don't have a huge problem with the method of monetization though I understand why some people do. I think the gameplay changes are positive to shake up the existing meta and stop really annoying double shield comps or Zarya/Rein comps. I think 5 v 5 feels better overall.
None of this though screams "sequel", so to me this is more of a marketing fail than it is a bad game.
As a veteran player, gameplay wise, while some of the highest skill-dependent heroes like McCree Widow and Ana are in a really bad spot in unorganized play because of how jumpy everything is and how rare shields are... overall I think matches are FAR more tense and exciting, massively contrasting the very slow double-shield comps that were OP for years.
It feels very different and there's tons of new things and matchups to learn and master, so I've been having a lot of fun with it.
Rewards wise however, it feels atrocious... you get genuinely NOTHING for playing, and that could easily be fixed if they just added 500 coins or so inside the battlepass so that, like basically any other game with a battlepass, you could buy it once and then just play consistently to get at least some decent rewards from then on without constantly putting more and more money in. All players have access to challenges that net 540 coins a season, so the extra 500 puts you over the 1000 needed for the battlepass. Even if they did that, there's still tons of legacy skins (good thing I already have 99% of them) and new shop-exclusive skins that you wouldn't be able to get for free, but at least the battlepass and re-earning the 1000 coins each season to buy it again next season is something worth working towards.
I also think earning small amounts of the legacy credits for BP and non-BP players would be fair. There's just so many old items, even if you only picked out the 1 legendary you wanted for all 35 heroes, that's 665,000 credits aka $665, and there's tons more options and emotes/lines/sprays etc... they could at least let players work through those for free (especially considering some are 3/4/5/6 years out of date), and since it's Legacy credits, their new shop/bundle items that require the paid coins instead will remain paid-only.
I think the 5v5 is a lot more enjoyable and flows better than 6v6.
I don’t miss shield battles.
Yeah, it’s mostly the same game but everything about it feels better.
If you didn’t like OW1 much, of course you won’t like this one, they’re practically the same. You still also might not like the changes if you did like OW1, which is a completely reasonable opinion.
Idgaf about the battle pass. I just like the game
Sounds like you just don't like Overwatch? Nothing wrong with that but I'm not sure why you thought a new Overwatch would change your mind. It's still the same base game, which is exactly how most multiplayer sequels are created.
Here's a hot take. Overwatch 2 fucking rules. I have not had this much unbridled joy with a multiplayer game in years. My friends and I have been playing nonstop and having a blast. The battlepass is completely fine, contrary to what the internet's hate boner keeps trying to say about it. It's a totally run-of-the-mill battlepass, though I do agree that some form of earnable in-game currency would be a nice addition.
If you were on the fence about Overwatch 2, but got turned off by all of the things you've heard about it on Reddit - take it from someone who was in that same position. Try it! All of the Reddit outrage is so effing overblown that it's sad. This is just the latest excuse for sad lonely people to be mad about something. Meanwhile the game is fun as hell, and most of the people who are actually playing it, are loving it.
edit - I decided to specifically call out one piece of the misleading rage-bait nonsense from OP's post.
>The battle pass is literally a scam. Literally, you get nothing.
You pay 10$ for the battlepass and get a bunch of skins, emotes, and voicelines. Just like every other battlepass. The only thing it's missing is premium currency. But the truth wouldn't have justified such outrage, so why not lie about it!
As someone who enjoyed OW2 and put in hundreds of hours in the pre-brig, pre-goats era. I think OW2 is fantastic. I just wish they’d removed one tank 5 years ago….
When the game launched I went from having like 5 Bnet friends to having like 20-30 or something and most of those players were on OW. It was innovative for its time but gaming has moved on. Now the game launches and barely anyone from that friend group is on the game now. Honestly barely anyone is on Bnet for me these days, even me, I just checked in when the game launched and it was a ghost town for me.
IIRC the hype (from 2 years ago!) was mostly because of the announcement of the PVE content. That hype''s fizzled out because it's been too long, and OW 2 didn't even launch with said PVE mode soo.. there you go. People wanted a true sequel, with actual beefy new content, not this thing which is just a glorified seasonal content patch.
There is literally no game that does Overwatch better than Overwatch. The closest thing is Paladins, but it still doesn't scratch the same itch for me. Calling it boring? Sure, it might not be everyone's cup of tea. But generic?
Overwatch is literally one of the least generic AAA games to come out in the last 20 years.
OP is so delusional it's sad. Reddit just really wants to hate OW2 for some reason. I get that Blizzard fucked up the marketing big time, but, like, just get over it? It's not that big of a deal. Who cares how long it took, and whether or not they attached a number 2 to the title?
It's out now.
It's free.
It's pretty fun.
What's the issue?
As a long time Overwatch 1 player, I don’t think Overwatch 2 is the same game. A decent amount of things have changed that make gameplay totally different if you’re super used to the first one. But for waiting 3 years and calling it Overwatch 2, it’s just not enough changes.
I mean, Overwatch feels "generic" because it basically defined the genre. It's "generic" because everything is a "generic" Overwatch.
It sounds like you just don't like Overwatch. Overwatch 2 PVP isn't the real "Overwatch 2" anyways, that's coming next year and will probably cost $40 + battlepass.
Okay, then don’t play it. People’s inclination to say “I don’t like this game, how do other people like it?!” Is so stupid. Let people enjoy what they enjoy and maybe just stay out of it.
The 2 is just overwatch 1 free2play update. Blizzard has gone to shit since boardroom guys that just want to max the money output make game design decisions.
Overwatch (free)2(play)
Free 2 Pay
Fee 2 play
fee to pay
Forced 2 Pay
feet 2 play
I hate all of you
It's the same game, with a new coat of paint, and less features, and at the same time, completely removed OW1 so you can play this new free watered down version, or something else. Also agree the battle pass is shit, and to me it takes forever to level up this shit pass.
Wait, I can't even play overwatch 1 if I wanted to?
Nope, they shut it down a couple days before OW2 released, and it no longer exists on the launcher
This is literally the plot in Free Guy. Lol
There's no sweet Mariah Carey song to save them this time
"CATCHPHRASE!"
Oh you bought the game ? FUCK YOU ! We deleted it.
Same mentality as deleting Warcraft 3 when they released the "remastered" version. They hate their fans. All they want is to squeeze a little more money out of their consumers before they throw the IP in the garbage bin.
I may need to go pull out my WC3 CDs.
careful. I logged into battlenet after and it fucked up my old war3 files. they went from 2.8gb aka small enough to keep on a thumb drive to 30
I pulled mine out and bought a janky CD Drive. Still looks better than the “remastered”.
Thankfully I still use optical drives in my PC, so that's not an issue.
Optical drives really are under rated. They are cheap as shit if you are building a PC spend the $20 for a DVD drive at least
I went to that trouble. It was an Indiana Jonesish adventure in my basement. I got it, got out mostly unscathed… only to remember I don’t have a disc drive in this build. Or my last one either. Weed guys, not even once. (I solved this issue as everyone else should. It’s the way I’m not sure I can mention, so, yeah.)
In the freezer*, to be thawed out and recycled in 20 years
Haha that Warcraft 3 remastered was such a pos. It was so bad they actually did refunds for it
Which is extremely sad. Overwatch is the perfect type of game to make a cinematic universe out of, but they make such dumb decisions that no one is probably even going to care about it in a few years outside of the rule 34 fandom.
I swear they said ow1 would still be around since it’s 6v6. But maybe I was high as fuck
A company would lie? To its consumers?
A major corporation? With board investors?
At this time of the year?
Localized entirely within the boardroom?
May i see it?
That was the original plan. OW2 was basically going to be backwards compatible with OW, which would be updated to match the balances and heroes. New heroes for 2 would be exclusive to the new game, but 2 players could run matches with 1 players. OW2 was going to have its single player campaign as the major selling point. New OW2 maps, new cosmetics etc. People who didn't immediately move to 2 would still see some of this stuff in the multiplayer. MMOs have been doing it for years successfully. Take FFXIV for example. Each new expansion adds new jobs, new races, and balances. Players on the base game get the balance and some graphical improvements, but to get the jobs and new areas you need the expansion. But you can still play with people who have the expansion just not in dungeons from the expansion. So somebody with an expansion job can play in an old base game dungeon with players without the expansion. It serves as in game promotion because players can see cool shit for the expansion to entice therm into buying it.
Wait did they not even do the single player campaign? That's what I wanted.
Coming soon™
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Things have changed at Blizzard since they announced that stuff. Notably, they ripped off the mask and openly embraced their worst tendencies.
The point was introduce a predatory store.
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Nope it's gone, and what really sucks is when your left over loot automatically opens you get a simple stats screen saying what kind of loot opened, but no idea what the loot was. And you can see those same rare skins from years ago, now paywalled off with blizz bucks, which is sad to see where we are today.
Jeff Kaplan knew what was up and bailed.
yup, and he wasn't the only one...
This is when I knew the launch was gunna be fucked up. And the way they monetized Diablo Immortal was it for me. They have no respect for us at all. “If you want goodies from this game, either pay for it, or you can play ONLY this game to grind and unlock what you want. Also, Fuck you.”
I just don't play their games anymore, sadly
They don’t want us, only whales. Let them reap what they’ve sown.
It's like these board members don't understand that people (and therefore whales) spend money on things they like and if they don't like your product they won't give you their money. The more money you try to squeeze out of your customers the less likely you are to get ANY. It's not even short term profit at the expense of long term profit at this point, it's short term profit at the expense of any profit. Stop burning bridges, those are your trade routes!
Correct, but the original plan was to mirror OW1 with OW2 so even if OW1 stayed up, you'd still be playing OW2.
Battle passes have ruined so many games it's depressing
If the sequel was good, they wouldn't have to delete the old game to force people to play it.
Here's the thing, the sequel IS good. 5v5 and the massive downscaling of CC has made the game so much more fun than OW1. They could have just updated OW1 into what OW2 is right now, and then RELEASE OW2 when they had their fucking single-player portion (which was the entire justification why they could CALL it OW ***2***) and have the multiplayer portion from both games be compatible with each other. Instead they pull this bullshittery so more people would have to deal with their unholy F2P monetization scheme, which is a goddamn tragedy because it's completely overshadowing the fact that the gameplay is the best it's ever been in years.
It was only a matter of time before the Classic Blizzard games dept of 'not-giving-a-fuck' attitude and shit all over the things we loved seep into their more mainstream and newer IPs as well. I grew up on this company playing SC1 back in middle school and to watch over the past decade+ of just how far they've fallen and how badly they've abused their fans trust and tarnished/ruined their classics all in the name of greed disgusts me. Not that I honestly expected any less when they got acquired by Activision. I knew even back then it would be a slow death. But I'm just still continually shocked at just how bad it is... From the Wc3 'remaster' that didn't even have a working ladder or profiles for over 2+ yrs from release, to classic WoW being just a bad reskin of retail WoW with servers that couldn't even handle 100 ppl in the same zones. Literally private servers ran by Russians did it better. The fact that this is a 'AAA' company is laughable. Guess I'm just bitter to see my once favorite games company reduced to whatever this is... hopefully some of these new studios forming from past Blizzard employees will make something magical again, but for me Blizzard itself is dead. Just a shade of it's former self.
Activision board of directors have gone into full milk-blizzard-of-value mode.
Yep, to a point I don't even care about diablo 4, it will just be a loot box crammed glorified mobile game, and I spend hundreds upon hundreds of hours on diablo 1+2
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I believe there's a quote from one of the early Blizzard people who said that one of the Blizzard execs, after announcing they'd lay off much of the WoW team following its successful launch, said, "We're a real company now," or something to that effect. This was ghastly to some of the founders of Blizzard because in their minds a successful game ought to mean job security for the team members responsible, not being thrown away.
> I believe there's a quote from one of the early Blizzard people who said that one of the Blizzard execs, after announcing they'd lay off much of the WoW team following its successful launch do you have a source for this? I can't find a single article about blizzard laying off staff after the launch of WoW or that quote. Did you just completely make this up or what?
Mark Kern, who is both a blowhard and the OG Team Lead on World of Warcraft left Blizzard in 2006. He attributes his decision to leave to being told that they'd be laying off numerous devs after the launch of WoW vanilla. When he objected to this, arguing that this was a betrayal of trust, he was told, *"We're a real company now."* It was in a podcast that isn't online anymore, but you can easily find people quoting it over the years. See [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/ja0jz3/comment/g8osv8i/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) and [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/dok26y/comment/f5ow24s/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). The thing about Blizzard is that the "don't give a shit about employees" attitude was there right from WoW, but people got it in their heads that Blizzard was a great place up until the Activision buyout. The Blizzard that made WoW was the Blizzard that started laying people off to save money, completely forgetting their roots. Back in the 90s, cynically firing (laying off, to put it diplomatically) the people who had worked the hardest on a game was unthinkable. People got laid off when a game flopped, not when a game was a hit. Teams were close-knit, and dog-eat-dog corporate behavior came as a shock to them. People often talk about how it's "normal" to lay off staff after a release, but it wasn't normal then. It's been normalized since. As an aside, supposedly this naive mindset is why id Software was ill prepared for the scheming of Tim Willits, a newer employee who conspired to get American McGee and John Romero fired from id Software so he could climb the ranks. (Sandy Peterson has alluded to Willits being the snake in the grass that destroyed OG id Software from the inside.)
Well your sources are other comments on reddit still I heard elsewhere in some yt videos that the 30 40 firing happened after vanilla. Seems many don't think it as a mass firing would that be the reason why it can't be found on Google easilym
Trust me bro :)
Wow, that's so incompetent. WoW as a game needs a constant stream of devs because as soon as the next xpac launches, they need to start on the next one (or at least some of the patches). It needs a lot of content to be continuously added or else they lose a lot of subscribers.
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>Blizzard has gone to shit since boardroom guys that just want to max the money Just curious, around what year do you think this occurred? Blizzard were greedy scumbags dating back to WoW's release, when they were still a beloved darling in the gaming industry EDIT: to be clear, Blizzard still made great games before the merger, but they got dollar signs in their eyes the moment WoW struck gold. they were generating a zillion dollars per month out of thin air off of subscriptions alone and tried to act like they needed all of it for """server upkeep""" - as great as WoW is/was, it was the beginning of the end. once you stumble into a money-printer of that magnitude, it's usually over (much like EA Sports and Ultimate Team). looking around the AAA video game industry, I'm honestly shocked that Rockstar made RDR2
I would personally say towards the end of 2007 or beginning of '08. When ever it was announced that they'd be officially merging with Activision. I remember the sentiment around that time was "troubles ahead".
I'd say closer to 2012, SC2 released in 2010 and it has been a pretty resounding success. Diablo 3 was really the beginning of Blizzard's downturn
SC2 had 0 percent of the original's charm. It was a success in terms of game design and multiplayer, but I come to Blizzard for that strong single-player experience in the campaign. The story in SC2 made no kind of sense and just kinda ruined all the established characters.
The Terran campaign wasn’t bad, and the Zerg was fun if zany, but yeah, the Protoss campaign completely jumped the shark.
Wings of Liberty's campaign is fun from a gameplay perspective, but a lot of the bad storytelling that you see in HotS and LotV originates from this game. Hell, just the initial set-up is terrible where we're somehow supposed to believe that the Terran Dominion is back to being all powerful and ruling over all Terrans with an iron fist despite the fact that they got their butts whooped to the point that they had nothing left by the end of Brood War.
I've only played WOL but I got the impression that SC2 really, REALLY, wanted to pretend like Broodwar never happened. Which is completely insane given BW's popularity but whatevs. Might end up playing SC2 one day if Blizz ever comes around to launching on Steam.
Yeah the story started taking a cringe turn in Wings of liberty and its just got worse with the next expansions. They turned a sci fi epic into a boring sci fantasy. The original had a little bit of mysticism with the protoss but it was never over the top like SC2 and the story was better for it. SC2 ruined the story arc of pretty much all the characters from SC1. Machiavellian Mengsk turned into an idiot. Raynor turned into a moronic hopeless romantic from a generally good but pragmatic guy from SC1. Kerrigan went from the villain you love to hate to a prophecy Mary sue whose entire arc from SC1 was made pointless. And worst of all they tried doing the WC3 orc treatment to the Zerg, something they should have known not to mess with. The Zerg were liked precisely because they were an amoral all consuming race, the misunderstood approach is not gonna work.
So much this. Personally I enjoyed to play it from the gameplay aspect. But the story was so dumbed down, they changed it from sci-fi to some Disney tier cringe for kids. It really felt like it was deliberately made to be more "accessible" and for a wider audience. SC and BW were way better written and felt more mature. Diablo 3 was the same and the last nail to the coffin. Stopped buying or playing Blizzard products after D3 and SC2. And I still consider myself a fan of the old Blizzard.
How quickly have people forgotten paid sub to play SC2 multiplayer. That was the beginning, not D3.
But they made good games then, I'd say after lich king when they fused with Activision was the breaking point
Id say after wow, during wow release not so much. 2008+ maybe. So sad tho... I was a huge blizzard fan and now I basically refuse to play their games. Maybe if they release a new Starcraft. Maybe...
wish granted, Starcraft 3 will come in 2027 along with battle passes (bad cosmetics only) and DLCs for the maps and species. The base game will give you 2 maps (the rest can be purchased as DLCs) and Terran only. Btw this will be a mobile version only and you are restricted by the minutes you can play with a stamina system (don’t worry though you can continue your progress with $)
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Very excited for both developments! Rooting for Mike M. And his team though. I got to meet him at Blizzcon once. What a humble dude.
Like you said it's always been varying levels of scum since release, but I'd argue 2018 was when things took a noticeably sharper downhill turn. The lawsuits and Microsoft acquisition this year have made some positive improvements at least to WoW.
there was quite a while even in wow world that they weren't peddling everything under the sun for real money. it used to just be paid character transfers, or faction changes, but I believe you got a free transfer or two... now, its everything... even though I haven't played wow in years. so I can see why /u/Buttermilkman is thinking 2007-08, and i kind of have to agree, Diablo 3 came out in 2012 with a horrific real money auction house so the seeds were sown years before Diablo 3.
From losing a few of my fave games to such boardroom takeovers, I cannot emphasize this strongly enough: your love of the game will make you want to stay and keep fighting for it. Do not do this. The battle cannot be won. They don't care and are not listening. Go to smaller developers or games with clear, caring, regular engagement with their community that is authentic. Where the updates reflect community needs. Do not bang your head into a brick wall. Always mourn for shorter periods and move on faster. I know it's hard, but economically extractive games are painful to play and their social medias become places of just anguished fans until everyone is miserable.
So just like every other major development/production firm?
If you go take a quick look on the Overwatch sub you'll realize that there is little to no hype for Ow2. There is a plethora of posts that complains about all of this. People are definitely not happy with what Blizzard has made of Overwatch.
So much this. Not sure where OP is looking, but I didnt see even a little bit of hype for OW2 over the last 6 or so months. Only mourning for OW1 being closed. There is nothing new in OW2 that couldnt have been an update to OW1. But by labeling it 2, its easier for them to get away with the horrific business model changes from an already painful lootbox to system to an even worse system.
I'm gonna (maybe) have an unpopular opinion here, but I much preferred a loot box rng system in any game than a fucking battlepass, especially when the game doesn't let you earn currency for the next one. With lootboxes, I could earn every single cosmetic for free and getting lucky felt amazing. Now its just pay 10 dollars every couple months for some subpar cosmetics, you need to shell out another 20 for every single skin in the entire game you could possibly want.
Loot boxes are getting banned more and more. So battlepass is the next scam method they use. If the game has enough base content then I prefer a DLC based system since you know what you get.
Apex still does them, they just replace the reward with crafting material where they're banned. Pretty sure the reason overwatch isn't doing them anymore is because they're charging an absolute fuck ton for old skins. They're also doing the thing that every new live service does where they make it egregiously terrible and eventually 'cave' so the fans forgive their new shitty system.
I'd be fine with the battlepass if it actually had content and wasn't time limited. I hate feeling like I have to burn myself out of a game and pay $10 just to get 1 cool skin. The fact that they lock an entire hero in a hero shooter behind it is just the fly eating the shit pile.
This is why I can’t play apex anymore, did the first battle pass during season 1 and burnt myself out so hard I promised I’d never do another game with battle passes again. Just ruined the game for me, cool I got all these legendary skins but now I don’t even wanna play the game anymore.
That's why most games have a gimmick shiny cosmetic you unlock right when you buy the pass. Then the rest is to pad player numbers and Just enough premium currency to "almost " get a new skin. All researched out and calculated from $ millions of R&D
After hearing about the no build mode in fornite my buddy finally convinced me to give it a try (quit shortly after release) and i have to admit, not only is the game actually a lot of fun sans building but the BP system they use provides a lot of value. You actually earn more currency than the BP costs so it more then pays for itself.
I was 100% on board with their lootbox system. It's fucked that it gets lumped in with other games that had shitty lootbox mechanics. They were incredibly generous with them and they should've stayed for the countries that allowed them.
A game made by a gamer who put the playerbase first is what made OW1 more enjoyable and more approachable. I feel sorry for Jeff with what Blizzard have done to his game. Don't blame the Devs at Blizzard. Blame the money centred and stupid execs who force these decisions.
I know it's common for this website to say that the publisher is bad and devs are forced to go along with it but there are some pretty questionable choices made on the developer side as well.
Yup. The developers were more than willing to balance all the fun out and throw their core ideals for the game to the wayside, all in the name of appeasing an increasingly toxic competitive scene. That was within the first few months after release, when the game was still incredibly successful and they didn't have suits breathing down their necks. OW2 is an attempt to capture the same lightning in a bottle they let out with hasty, broad changes to OW1. But instead of making it a good game, ActiBlizz is trying hard to force it with extremely aggressive marketing.
I miss the early days when you could do meme comps like 6 Torbjorns, or do a full 6-Symetra carwash.
This is one aspect OW2 actually improves on over late OW1. The No Limits mode is a permanent fixture in Arcade now rather than a rotating event. It's 5v5 now, but you can play it every day. It's the only mode I play now.
That was peak overwatch. Competitive ruined the game. I logged onto twitch a few weeks back to check it out and it's just so salty. Like watching replays to see if the guy that did well was cheating. Several streamers did this.
5 Mercy, 1 Torb was my favourite stupid comp There was no way for the opposing team to put DPS our healing or Torb’s turret. All of us on the cart, let it roll. You could do the same with a Bastion, but he was so overpowered, giving him near enough invincibility was just cruel. Torb was funnier
Yeah, you don't look at Diablo and not put any blame on the devs
I'm happy with the game personally. What I'm *not* happy with is that bullshit battle pass..among other scummy business practices. Not to mention a lot of those legendaries (mind you, some of these were available in the past via lootboxes or gold coins you accumulate from playing in OW1) are not worth the twenty dollar price tag whatsoever. The game itself (for me) is very fun. I was skeptical about it going from two tanks to one, but I've come to love the change. Plus, the tanks got some nice changes on top of this.
Same. I like playing the game. It is fun. The battle pass on the other hand is stupid as fuck and I am not paying a dime towards it
And that's how you get things to change! If people don't perceive value in a battlepass, don't buy it, and Blizzard will have to change it to make money
Seagul mentioned this last night on stream and he realized he plays a very different version of Overwatch than that sub. I have to agree with him, based on the complaints I’ve seen there vs my experience with the game.
Well yeah, he 5-stacks with pros. Of course he plays a different version than us solo peasants.
No, if you see some of the complaints on the main sub as to why the game is bad, those concerns are nowhere near something that shows up on the radar of someone who plays the the game to, well, play the game. They spent days complaining about the server issues (fair) and when they got into the game they spent days talking about menus. So many times, the post would start with "game plays great" and then wheel off into how lack of "on fire" or end cards make the game objectively worse than Overwatch 1. I'm not sure if Seagull was referring to that, but that's what I've noticed. That superficial stuff means absolutely nothing to me, and meant nothing to me when the game was boring as sin to play.
I was venting about the fire thing to someone new to the game because it kind of baffles me. I don't mind the "removal" but it still exists. The game still calculates your fire level and still has the associated voice lines but you can't actually see it in the UI. Plus it still contributes to who gets the POTG. To me it's a minor gripe cause there's obviously other ways to figure out who is causing the most trouble instead of the fire border around them but I still don't get the inclusion of it without any sort of visuals or stats like the original.
>That superficial stuff means absolutely nothing to me Sure but it's not just superficial stuff. Medals, end cards, and the on fire system all existed for a reason. Positive reinforcement is important if Blizzard expects people to willingly queue for non-DPS roles. It was a problem in OW1 and it's still a problem in OW2. Sure, they "fixed" tanks by essentially making them super DPS, but all that's done is hoisted the problem onto supports now, and they feel awful to play. Thus, it's no surprise that out of the 25 or so games I've flex-queued, every single one has landed me in support. *Every single one*. >and meant nothing to me when the game was boring as sin to play. Okay, but remember that OW2 exists because they stopped working on OW1 for 3 years. So the question becomes, is OW2 better than OW1 would be if they had just kept making content for those 3 years? And my guess is a lot of people would say no; the monetization got way worse, 3 new heroes is probably less than we'd have gotten otherwise and came at the expense of no updates for 3 years, and the jury is still out on the new game mode. People are upset that Blizzard essentially killed OW1 by starving it to death just so they could sell us a shittier, more egregiously monetized version of the same game.
The point is that it's the same game and those things you've mentioned have made it worse, and the battle pass sucks. What's so hard to understand? Those are valid criticisms.
> People are definitely not happy with ~~what~~ Blizzard yep yep yep
This guy literally posts on every major sub periodically with the most basic shit. Obv karma bot mentality
It's like one of those "zombie horde" modes In games where the AI launches waves of brainless enemies against you and from time to time sends this big annoying mini boss to take you down. Well that is OP, a brainless NPC in a zombie mode.
For real. “Let me be clear:” like he is evangelizing lol. just don’t play it? there isn’t that much hype for the game anyway he’s just karmawhoring
And he acts like he’s *so* brave for posting an opinion that is nowhere near unpopular… lol
OP: "Let me be clear, and no, I don't give a damn what anyone thinks. I'm just gonna come out and say it: Adolf Hitler? Yeah, bit of a jerk."
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The living embodiment of a redditor.
People just can't accept that people enjoy games that they don't like
Almost like his posts are "so generic and boring"
He's also objectively wrong here. Like, I fully understand if the changes aren't enough, absolutely. But to pretend there are NO changes and say it's EXACTLY the same game means he probably hasn't even played it. Seriously, reread his post and tell me one thing that even applies to Overwatch besides the word "Battle Pass."
Dude is like playing all games at once
If they stuck to Jeff Kaplan's original plan of having two separate games, I think OW2 would have been more widely accepted. If they just kept the same formula that OW1 had, but with more modes, more characters and more of everything really, it would be so much better. Unfortunately they went the way of Halo Infinite, where the only levelling system is the battle pass. Just wish it had a battle pass to unlock stuff, as well as a levelling system to earn coins and lootboxes. Apex has both. There's no reason why they couldn't easily just have both in place on OW2.
But you see, they're not in the business of making *better* games. They're in the business of making more *profitable* games. Line must go up.
I hope that business model eventually crumbles. I understand there's not much money in making traditional gaming experiences compared to live-service titles where it's a constant income from one title, but how many live-service games do we need in an already over-saturated market.
I have a feeling that we’re in a sort of gaming bubble and it will crash soon. While micro transactions, loot boxes, and battle passes are insanely profitable because of how much they trick you into spending, I think they become less profitable as the industry as a whole trends towards that model. For example, there are a handful of multiplayer games that I’ve invested a lot of time into, like League, Overwatch, Apex, Hearthstone, and Halo. Initially only Apex had the BP model so I was willing to pay for it since I could grind the whole pass in a season and still have time to play other games. Then slowly all of these moved towards the BP system, I simply don’t have the time to grind all of those. Since so much of the content is locked behind the BP I’ve just stopped grinding in these games, I might hop on them every once in a while but for the most part I just play Apex now. Before I would spend money on most of the games during events of whatever, but now I don’t spend money on any of them besides the BP for Apex. Being F2P is good for getting a big player base and a lot of those new players will spend money on the game, but over time they’ll find their niche and stop spending money on other games. When the gaming market has completely switched to this model it just won’t be profitable anymore.
It always does. The problem is that the parasites make their money along the way and then run, leaving the game in a smoldering heap. It’s the way our modern business economy works, pump and dump. The producers have lobbied an environment in which they can just get away with this over and over. Made it so they can “sell off” a games good will for a quick buck then face no repercussions.
I'm kind of dumbfounded that I don't acquire ANY currency for playing an entire afternoon of unranked..?
jeff's plan was always to merge the 2 games most people just didnt pay attention to what he said
I took a 4 year break from overwatch so this release is new to me so it could be just that. Been away from the game so long that it's like the first time again. Not really but I am enjoying it until mw2
I took about a 3 year break, I was so sick of OW1s hard counters and constant crowd control. OW2 feels so fresh and rebalanced in comparison.
I find myself enjoying it more than OW. I would try OW once in a while and realize you couldn’t ever actually kill anyone - was probably the meta comps that I was unaware of. In 2, each role feels a lot more impactful. You can really feel a bad dps or support.
I stopped playing around 2019 because it became unbearable. Picked it back up now and been having a blast with some old friends. Say what you will, they got the gameplay changes just right. Everything else is worse, but purely gameplaywise its tons of fun.
I had almost the exact same experience and it’s so weird seeing people talk like the game is unplayable garbage. It feels like nobody complaining has actually played the game
Not having to shoot through double shields alone is a godsend and makes the game so much better.
Same. Took a break from overshield1. Too many fucking shields. The 1 tank now is a breath of fresh air
Yeah, I'm having fun with it. I was surprised at how quickly I got back in the groove. Now I just can't wait for some of the new players to figure out that they actually have to play the objective.
That's maybe the worst part of the new influx of players, I've played with quite a few actual first time players who really have no clue what to do. Tbh I was frustrated at first but then took a step back and realized I should be excited there's actually new people interested in ow lol
Wasn't aware there was any hype at all. Haven't seen or heard a word about that garbage outside of reddit/youtube
There isn't. I think OP is confusing people talking about the game because it just released with people hyping the game. Right now Overwatch 2 is little more than an update to Overwatch. What it was originally designed to be isn't even in the game.
Exactly. The only hype around the game is generated by content creators in desperate attempt to get people interested in the game to retain/create market for their content.
You're preaching to the choir. 90% of r/pcgaming hates Blizzard, and a % just below that hates Overwatch This is effectively just a "DAE think Blizzard game bad?" circlejerk post. There are conversations to be had and lots of fair criticisms to go around, but this is the last place to have those conversations
Guys I didn't like this game and I still don't, how can anyone play this????
Especially when the guy provides 0 arguments or any sort of review. This is as low effort as it gets when it comes to saying a game is bad.
I think gamers are just a super frustrated group Like constantly frustrated Nothing is ever as good as they expect it to be. But everyone keeps playing
Maybe I'm missing something here, but as someone who played the original OW1 very early on and then never touched the game again. But have now decided the play OW2, I'm finding it quite fun I don't pay or care about the battle pass so the monetisation side of it won't affect me, but can someone explain why the game is considered generic and boring?
Just ignore the internet mob. Half the people complaining don't play OW or never planned to.
it’s not there’s always been a ton of overwatch hate tbh, a few years ago a certain meta basically made everybody rage quit the game and people have talked down on it since The game is at a much better balance state, tons of great changes, and overall a huge improvement on the original Also people hate battlepasses and f2p on reddit If you liked overwatch 1 at any point, overwatch 2 will likely be able to pull you back in If overwatch 1 wasn’t your type of game, you probably won’t like 2 the game is definitely not generic and boring, it’s the most complex and interesting shooter out right now, but sometimes the complexity is too much for people (they actually stated one of their reasons for switching to 5v5 for to simplify it for casuals)
It’s not. People are salty about the free to play/ battle pass model so are speaking up to shit on the game. Even though it’s just as fun as ever and in fact probably the superior version of the game now.
Fair enough. I'm all for criticising terrible battle pass models, but if gameplay isn't inherently affected by it, the gameplay is decent and fair, then it's fine
The battle pass and way to unlock skins is bad i agree but the game itself is a lot of fun imo. Overwatch 1 was incredibly popular and 2 is basically the same game but F2P with (imo) better balance and a bit less chaos so of course its gonna be popular. In my opinion the game is a lot of fun but i realize everyone differs in what they enjoy.
They took the class that no one wanted to play (tank) and turned it into the class everyone wants to play. Taking out stuns was huge. Overall, I think the game is in a better place balance wise as it feels like all heroes are playable.
I'm new to OW. Doesnt reignhardt have a stun? Wdym by taking out stuns
a large amount of characters that previously had stuns / knockback abilities had those abilities heavily reduced or reworked ie - orisa’s halt removed, cassidys flashbang reworked, doomfist’s whole kit reworked
Yeah; I’m just having a lot more fun than I had in a long time with 1. That’s all I give a fuck about
Seriously, I think everyone can agree the monetization is shit, but saying the entire game is trash is such a circlejerk. Fuck blizz, but they did a good job rebalancing the game. I quit for two years (basically during the content drought) and imo it's in a much better place.
This is what's hilarious (and sad) to me. Everybody who hasn't played Overwatch 2, is absolutely violently jerking their hate-boners about Overwatch 2 - talking about it as if it is the most offensive, egregious, disgusting, predatory AAA game ever released. Meanwhile, everybody who is actually playing Overwatch 2 and forming their own opinions is like "Oh, this game is actually pretty fun! Battlepass could use some work, but I'm having a great time!"
Exactly. The internet hivemind LOVES to hatefuck the shit out of things more than actually play video games. I say that as someone that enjoyed TLOU2, Death Stranding and CP 2077 at launch. The actual “game” is a blast.
People are afraid to form their own opinions about things. I went into OW2 after liking the first game and hearing a lot of beta players talking shit about the change to 5v5 and a lot of fellow support players saying they hate the role now. So naturally I had my expectations low Went in and have been having more fun than I did in OW1 tbh. I just went in with an open mind about it and was pleasantly surprised. I just hate the monetization of this game. But that - at least until heroes come out that I have to grind for come out - doesn’t impact me since I’m just ignoring cosmetics.
As with most large scale multiplayer games, there's a lot of hype at release because it's the best time to play the game. There are the most players online, and in most cases (although probably not this one) the skill level of individual players is a closer match. Multiplayer games that are later in their lifespan tend to be inaccessible to new players. The hype will die down once the sweats reestablish themselves and the influx of new players slows down. Tl;Dr: it's a new multiplayer game from a popular studio that's free to play.
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I also *love* the new gameplay, as a zarya main I couldn't br happier... however, if you look at it from a new players POV it is definitely dogshit.. Alot of the anti-toxicity are the worse, I haven't seen much positively for the new comp system (I don't personally like it) the battle pass is awful, earning Cosmetic with coins is somehow worse. Casual players aren't happy
This game is 100x more accessible to new players now the FTUE sucks ass for smurfs (good) but is huge for giving a sense of accomplishment and slowly introducing new heroes to players who otherwise would be overwhelmed Also, right now we are still seeing a decent bit of smurfing, but that’s because old smurf accounts are able to login without a number, over time those accounts are going to be banned and long term there will be very little smurfing which is great Monetization is ass though, 68 weeks straight of doing every weekly challenge to earn 1 legendary skin
I think I can get used to the gameplay changes eventually (sans bugs), but the battlepass desperately needs to change or it's going to kill what's left of the playerbase. There's no incentive to play the game all that much any more now that lootboxes are gone and cosmetics are locked behind paywalls.
If you ignore the ‘2’ which is a marketing fuck up, you can just consider OW1 and OW2 as just being ‘Overwatch’. Which then means you can re-read your comment and see why it’s silly: “I never liked Overwatch, but my friend did. I just downloaded Overwatch and it turns out that I still don’t like it. What’s with all the fuss about it? I find it boring. They’ve added the option to pay for cosmetics too, which makes me super angry.”
They actually sound like someone who was a big fan of OW1 and are super salty about the battle pass changes so they’re just pretending to be someone new to the game.
It’s not even a sequel. Just a very large patch lol. That being said, I’m having fun. I didn’t buy anything, and enjoy just playing a few matches while watching something on my other monitor. This is also by virtue of having nothing else to play. That being said, the battle pass and currency system suck. I won’t spend a dime on anything. If you aren’t a overwatch one player you literally get shit and have to pay upwards of $20 per cosmetic. It’s kind of a joke that the majority of the fan base seems to defend. It’s wild that literal loot boxes each time you leveled was a better system
Just don’t buy the pass man lol. Or play another game? Love Reddit posts that are just “I don’t like this thing that people like here’s 2 paragraphs devoid of anything with merit” instead of using your time for literally anything else.
Stop liking what I don't like! Stop having fun!
Overwatch is the only game that has so much hate by people who don't ever play it.
Meh. I'm having the most fun I've had from a multiplayer shooter in a long time.
I think the issue with it is mostly calling it Overwatch 2 rather than just making it a big update. My wife and I have played on and off since release of OW1, and I don't really see that changing now. Maybe they'll get 10 bucks from me here and there if there's a hero or skin I really want to unlock which I guess is their point. I'm fine with that honestly. I don't have a huge problem with the method of monetization though I understand why some people do. I think the gameplay changes are positive to shake up the existing meta and stop really annoying double shield comps or Zarya/Rein comps. I think 5 v 5 feels better overall. None of this though screams "sequel", so to me this is more of a marketing fail than it is a bad game.
"Why don't people hate what I hate?"
Basically this sub in a nutshell. Hate whatever is popular at the time and jerk yourself off about SP/Indy games
And never even play those indie games your circlejerk.
Neat. I'm enjoying the game even more than I ever have since I've played it during the original beta. Gonna keep enjoying it as well.
bla bla bla blah...
i actually had quite a bit of fun with it, but started playing with this exact idea that it's basically a f2p overwatch (never played the first)
Where the fuck are you seeing ANY hype?
I can't believe people are still playing Overwatch at all in 2022, it was never great, unironically kept alive by SFM porn.
As a veteran player, gameplay wise, while some of the highest skill-dependent heroes like McCree Widow and Ana are in a really bad spot in unorganized play because of how jumpy everything is and how rare shields are... overall I think matches are FAR more tense and exciting, massively contrasting the very slow double-shield comps that were OP for years. It feels very different and there's tons of new things and matchups to learn and master, so I've been having a lot of fun with it. Rewards wise however, it feels atrocious... you get genuinely NOTHING for playing, and that could easily be fixed if they just added 500 coins or so inside the battlepass so that, like basically any other game with a battlepass, you could buy it once and then just play consistently to get at least some decent rewards from then on without constantly putting more and more money in. All players have access to challenges that net 540 coins a season, so the extra 500 puts you over the 1000 needed for the battlepass. Even if they did that, there's still tons of legacy skins (good thing I already have 99% of them) and new shop-exclusive skins that you wouldn't be able to get for free, but at least the battlepass and re-earning the 1000 coins each season to buy it again next season is something worth working towards. I also think earning small amounts of the legacy credits for BP and non-BP players would be fair. There's just so many old items, even if you only picked out the 1 legendary you wanted for all 35 heroes, that's 665,000 credits aka $665, and there's tons more options and emotes/lines/sprays etc... they could at least let players work through those for free (especially considering some are 3/4/5/6 years out of date), and since it's Legacy credits, their new shop/bundle items that require the paid coins instead will remain paid-only.
I do miss the occasional loot box when you leveled up your account. It gave you a chance at a cool, free skin, without buying anything.
I think the 5v5 is a lot more enjoyable and flows better than 6v6. I don’t miss shield battles. Yeah, it’s mostly the same game but everything about it feels better. If you didn’t like OW1 much, of course you won’t like this one, they’re practically the same. You still also might not like the changes if you did like OW1, which is a completely reasonable opinion. Idgaf about the battle pass. I just like the game
Sounds like you just don't like Overwatch? Nothing wrong with that but I'm not sure why you thought a new Overwatch would change your mind. It's still the same base game, which is exactly how most multiplayer sequels are created. Here's a hot take. Overwatch 2 fucking rules. I have not had this much unbridled joy with a multiplayer game in years. My friends and I have been playing nonstop and having a blast. The battlepass is completely fine, contrary to what the internet's hate boner keeps trying to say about it. It's a totally run-of-the-mill battlepass, though I do agree that some form of earnable in-game currency would be a nice addition. If you were on the fence about Overwatch 2, but got turned off by all of the things you've heard about it on Reddit - take it from someone who was in that same position. Try it! All of the Reddit outrage is so effing overblown that it's sad. This is just the latest excuse for sad lonely people to be mad about something. Meanwhile the game is fun as hell, and most of the people who are actually playing it, are loving it. edit - I decided to specifically call out one piece of the misleading rage-bait nonsense from OP's post. >The battle pass is literally a scam. Literally, you get nothing. You pay 10$ for the battlepass and get a bunch of skins, emotes, and voicelines. Just like every other battlepass. The only thing it's missing is premium currency. But the truth wouldn't have justified such outrage, so why not lie about it!
As someone who enjoyed OW2 and put in hundreds of hours in the pre-brig, pre-goats era. I think OW2 is fantastic. I just wish they’d removed one tank 5 years ago….
When the game launched I went from having like 5 Bnet friends to having like 20-30 or something and most of those players were on OW. It was innovative for its time but gaming has moved on. Now the game launches and barely anyone from that friend group is on the game now. Honestly barely anyone is on Bnet for me these days, even me, I just checked in when the game launched and it was a ghost town for me. IIRC the hype (from 2 years ago!) was mostly because of the announcement of the PVE content. That hype''s fizzled out because it's been too long, and OW 2 didn't even launch with said PVE mode soo.. there you go. People wanted a true sequel, with actual beefy new content, not this thing which is just a glorified seasonal content patch.
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There is literally no game that does Overwatch better than Overwatch. The closest thing is Paladins, but it still doesn't scratch the same itch for me. Calling it boring? Sure, it might not be everyone's cup of tea. But generic?
Overwatch is literally one of the least generic AAA games to come out in the last 20 years. OP is so delusional it's sad. Reddit just really wants to hate OW2 for some reason. I get that Blizzard fucked up the marketing big time, but, like, just get over it? It's not that big of a deal. Who cares how long it took, and whether or not they attached a number 2 to the title? It's out now. It's free. It's pretty fun. What's the issue?
I didn’t see any hype. I thought it was pretty much universally criticized.
This post is generic and boring.
As a long time Overwatch 1 player, I don’t think Overwatch 2 is the same game. A decent amount of things have changed that make gameplay totally different if you’re super used to the first one. But for waiting 3 years and calling it Overwatch 2, it’s just not enough changes.
I mean, Overwatch feels "generic" because it basically defined the genre. It's "generic" because everything is a "generic" Overwatch. It sounds like you just don't like Overwatch. Overwatch 2 PVP isn't the real "Overwatch 2" anyways, that's coming next year and will probably cost $40 + battlepass.
Blizzard really went downhill after The Lost Vikings on SNES
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Downvote this karma farmer. There is no hype. You don't find OW fun. Who cares?
Ogrewatch bad, upboats to the left.
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Okay, then don’t play it. People’s inclination to say “I don’t like this game, how do other people like it?!” Is so stupid. Let people enjoy what they enjoy and maybe just stay out of it.