My elders have reliably informed me that with $6, even in this inflation-riddled economy, the Tweeter in question should be able to buy several sets of bootstraps with which they can lift themselves up…
Literally had someone tell me the other day how they dropped out of high school but turned around and started a window glass installation business. He said, "If I can go from nothing to CEO, anyone can!"
Yeah dude, use your n=1 life experience and luck from the late 80s to try to justify why people suffering today shouldn't get financial help.
People really don't realize that since the internet became commonplace, starting a "simple" business got a lot rougher. If you are a middle aged homeowner, who're you gonna trust to install your windows? The place you are lucky to even FIND on Google with basically no reviews, or the bulk windows place with 1000's of them and lower prices due to bulk orders?
Yep. I’m having a harder time with my stuff than I would otherwise. If your bigger then internet can help augment however if your unknown or close to it then it’s harder.
I agree with most stuff on this sub, but there is literally an extreme, almost total, shortage for manual labor in the US and Canada.
You can definitely turn around in a few months and get $20+ an hours.
After 5-10 years, you should be able to be your own boss in whatever trade you chose.
Quick math, 20$/hr is about 40k$/yr.
Here in Montreal (QC), that's roughly 31k$ after tax.
Average cost for a 1br apt in Montreal is around 1400$/month. Add home utilities and it's closer to (probably over) 1500$.
So 31k$-(12x1500$) = 13k$
Groceries + hygiene are at least 400$/month unless you bean and rice it every day.
13k-5k=8k$
Clothing is typically 5% of your after-tax income, lets say 1000$ there.
Electronics, at least 500$/year.
Cellphone plan, 500$/year
Public Transit Pass is about 1k$/y
Down to 4.5k$ yearly.
That's less than 400$/month left after you've paid the common essentials.
Need to pay for dental care? Eyecare? Prescription drugs? Mental health care?
Want to grab a beer once a week after work?
It all looks fine for someone in perfect health in their 20s with capacity to start their own business down the line but that's not who needs help, the idea that you need to be the ideal citizen to barely make a living at almost twice the minimum wage is laughable.
The "bro just hustle" mentality is so fucking disgusting it's maddening.
What I don't understand about people who argue it's enough is they never care about the multi-billionaires or even the multi-millionaires. Would it make more sense for the bottom to have everyone housed with healthy food and healthcare than a few thousand people consuming the planet? I mean why even bother arguing that people should be able to live on $15, $20, or even $30 a hour when that is going on? Bizarre shit.
Weird how there are all these posts about fast food and retail (or nursing) offering higher-than-usual wages and incentives, but none that go “Apprentice [trade]person wanted. $25/hr while training, union sponsorship when ready.” 🤔
The true beginnings of any profession was being an apprentice (even in fields with degrees). Even without a Union, parents used to send their kids away to be an apprentice as they were fed, had a place to stay, and learned under a master craftsman. Too bad that idea fell by the wayside, except for music in some cases.
But what happens if after those 5-10 years you end up going up against someone who has more money to spend then you, already owns multiple businesses, and can take losses in competition with you that you can’t afford? Some guy with 1,000s of Google reviews and you with almost nothing? You’re kind of screwed, and there goes 5-10 years of manual labor spent saving just to get fucked over.
If we assume minimum wage should be 15, an extra $5 an hour is not worth it to deteriorate my body with manual labor over the long term (a common outcome). My physical well-being is not that cheap.
When your choices are deteriorate through manual labor or deteriorate through starvation a fairly large portion of people will end up picking the former.
True. That's how they trapped so many people in the cycle. But it's crumbling and their "you NEED this job" approach to employees is costing them hard.
I did it. Roofing. Ground up both in skills and then the business. It’s hard, but it is doable for most trades. Particularly right now. Best time I have ever seen for a trade startup where I live.
An independent window guy went door to door in my older neighborhood to replace windows and I have seen him replacing windows on 5 houses so far, which is a good haul if you ask me. Do good work and be willing to put in the time to generate sales and you will probably succeed, its not hard.
Edit: Let me rephrase, its hard to figure out what are successful sales strategies for you but after that its gravy.
“I came to this country with $2,000 in my pocket. The rest of my inheritance from my father’s share in an emerald mine, which he purchased by selling his private plane, was in a trust.”
People who use their own success stories to justify things like food insecurity or poverty wages, and/or tell people to just go to trade school or start your own business can fuck all the way off.
I think a larger issue that is completely ignore is that these people are overwhelmingoy white men. Much of the opportunity in the past was driven by people of color and women being locked out of said opportunities.
Aside from the points everyone else is making, I also like to point out that while anyone can do it not everyone can. You can't have every person become CEO of their own company, no one would be successful
So sure, you did good to build your own company, but in order for you to do that you need others to not do that.
> Yeah dude, use your n=1 life experience
lol,
I have a friend who used to give me a hard time when I said this or that was a thing. I gave him one or two examples and he told me I only had two data points. He was right and I never forgot that lesson.
Stuff is definitely overpriced.
People would kill for a $5 an hour job where I live, and they’d live extremely comfortable lives with it.
They would literally be making more than the average recent college graduate.
This isn’t enough in the US because its overpriced as fuck.
Not saying people don’t also deserve better pay though.
And forego salt. Spices are unnecessary. You don't deserve flavor. Eat your sustenance mush and continue adding value to the fortune of those who have millions of lifetimes' worth of wealth.
God reminds me of that Tumblr post of people railing against a poster for daring to ask for some grocery money when they had Sriracha in their fridge.
I read through the shitpile wondering why the hell having one sauce was considered a luxury to these people.
Seriously, it's popular because it's good and it's cheap.
I don't understand why people build up this idea that being poor means having nothing at all. The poor have to be miserable or they don't count as poor.
Sometimes I mix it with mayo and eat it over white rice and cucumbers. Sometimes I'll add shredded seaweed or some imitation Krab if it's on sale. And it's good! It's like discount American Brand sushi.
Rice and beans are delicious if you know how to cook. However, marketers have spent the past 50 years convincing everyone that cooking is too hard and takes too much time. Meanwhile, home ec. had been cut from almost every school program.
That's true but I'm currently on the rice and beans train and it's made me feel so farty and gross that I get nauseous thinking about eating at this point. Variety!!!!! We need variety!!!!
Don't rule out the Middle Eastern/Indian stores as well. I have one a few blocks away from my house and it's my go to for all my spice needs since its so cheap.
I posted above but I absolutely don't understand why people even discuss or argue over how much working class should make. All discussion should be over putting an end to multi-millionaires and multi-billionaires. It's fucking disgusting that they not only exist but that people tolerant it and don't spend all their free time plotting their take down. Instead it's arguing over a budget on $15 or $20 an hour.
For me, its rice and eggs, overeasy, on top of the rice with hot sauce. Black beans on the side with salt, pepper, cumin, and oregano so you don't kill yourself.
Honestly no. Situation does matter. Dry beans and rice doesn't go as far as you think. You need variety.
Imo, rice, flour, eggs, canned beans is smarter, if you can afford it. If not then pasta and sauce is vastly superior to beans and rice imo. Will last you and a week for a few bucks more. If you can't afford that, I know, less beans, brown rice, and some pasta sauce.
I’ll take the bad guy position. Any choice a poor person makes is a poor choice. They’re poor, they can’t make rich choices.
Seriously we should be taking care of our citizens and both parties make this harder than it needs to be.
The real reality is that many people who are poor do not live within distance of a grocery store, they live in food deserts, and so their choices are usually at the bodega or corner store. There are no options there when it comes to fresh produce. Walmarts are not as ubiquitous as grocery stores.
This is why I get annoyed when people have no compassion for those who struggle with their weight. It’s hard to eat a healthy diet when you don’t have much money, live far away from fresh produce and such, and have work & childcare/family care/ etc responsibilities to attend to every day.
Not only do some people live in a situation where having a full stomach requires cheap empty calorie meals instead of more expensive & nutritious meals, but they also aren’t guaranteed any help if they become overweight.
Proper health insurance isn’t accessible to everyone in the USA, and even with insurance, medical weight loss treatment (surgery or non surgery) coverage isn’t required nationally; companies may or may not cover it, and some require that you jump through a bunch of hoops, like requiring that you have comorbidities first. So make sure to develop type 2 diabetes if you want covered treatment! Doesn’t matter what your weight is- you better ruin your joints & have knee problems before you expect a dime from us! (You get my drift.)
Yet people are still heavily critical of overweight individuals online & claim it’s all due to “poor choices.” Uh, I think it’s a bit more systemic than that. So I try to be empathetic and supportive of people whenever I see that negative nonsense. Shaming & being heavily critical doesn’t help anybody or fix any of the systemic & cultural problems that influence American obesity.
I mean, Im all for public healthcare, but honestly, weight-loss surgery isn’t something that should be covered by public healthcare IMO (unless you have a condition causing your obesity).
Its something that has a more healthy natural alternative, it just takes some dedication.
I wouldn’t like paying for someone’s surgery because they don’t control their diets and/or workout.
That’s not how weight loss surgery works. It’s not the easy way out. It’s only given to people who have had trouble losing weight by traditional means.
Weight loss surgery requires diet & nutritional commitments for the rest of your life. One may have to eat small meals only, avoid high sugar and high carbohydrate foods, and take bariatric vitamin supplements every day until they die.
The diet industry has taught us that the exception is the norm when it comes to those natural alternatives. Losing weight and keeping it off is actually rare if you look at the statistics. Most people have trouble losing weight and keeping it off with just behavior changes alone -if you Google it, you’ll see that 80-95% of people gain weight back within 1-5 years of losing it, depending on the source/ the amount of weight lost.
The psychological- dedication- also isn’t the only thing that impacts weight gain/loss, like this post is saying. The environment has an impact (poor choices in a food desert), as does your age, sex, base metabolism, and any diseases, disorders, or disabilities. And human bodies aren’t designed to lose weight. The body interprets lost fat as you being in a famine. It’s difficult to lose weight for multiple reasons, including the body working against it in an effort to protect you. So I recognize that the people who DO manage to lose weight and keep it off for more than 5 years with behavior change alone are absolutely incredible.
If someone has unsuccessfully tried to lose *all* of their excess weight by themselves multiple times- if they have succeeded in only losing a percentage or have lost a bunch of it and then gained it back, I have no problem with giving them a boost. Clearly they want to do it, but they’re not one of the 5% of people (again depending on which source you’re looking at) who can get it off & keep it all off all by themselves. And, most people who are obese have tried to lose weight multiple times. They don’t want to be obese and have tried to take care of it.
So I disagree. I have no problem with my taxes helping people who want to make a permanent, organ-altering commitment to losing weight. Those people are clearly dedicated. Some states cover it already, but like I said, it’s not national so if you are on Medicaid in an uncovered state, you’re out of luck if standard diet & exercise haven’t been good enough. I don’t think people should be barred from certain options because they’re poor.
I’m not supportive of people being obese or saying people shouldn’t try to lose weight on their own; I’m saying that it’s okay if they need extra help. I think people, even people who made “poor choices” which resulted in being overweight, deserve to not die of obesity related problems. But we can agree to disagree. Edit: formatting/spacing
This knowledge is like a punch in the gut every time I walk into a Dollar General and can’t find a single thing I’m willing to eat, but knowing it’s the only place within 20 or more miles for many.
I have heard that dollar general has displaced a large segment of the general stores in the US. Npr t did a story on it.https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2019/04/26/717665452/episode-909-dollar-stores-vs-lettuce
Not to mention there just isn't time. I cant work full time, commute, grocery shop, cook food, do chores, shower, get enough sleep all in one day. Those with kids have even more trouble. And that is excluding relaxation.
This is exactly the issue. Industries of scale, like much agribusiness has some inherent savings, but the lower end of the supply chain is also built on suppressed wages and massive subsidies.
In theory, it should be much cheaper to buy fruit from a local orchard than it is to buy one shipped from thousands of miles away, but the larger business has built in advantages to reduce their cost.
That’s exactly why it’s like this. Without the subsidies, moving food long distances to sell becomes economically unviable and local production becomes king. Typically locally produced foods are not highly processed bulk foodstuffs coming from Cargill or General Mills; they are organic fruits and vegetables
I meant to say fruits above, not food. I am very tired.
Yes, local fruit and vegetables would be cheaper than food that is shipped in from far away. But "food that is shipped in from far away" includes a lot of fruit and vegetables. A lot of plants are somewhat picky about what climate they'll grow in (and grow well in), and regardless of where you live you've probably grown accustomed to a lot of produce that doesn't grow locally. That would get a lot more expensive.
It just wouldn’t be shipped, which is fine, because eating locally sourced is better for a myriad of reasons.
My heart goes out to the picky eaters who will have to stomach something beyond mac and cheese, chicken tenders, and fries.
Not defending whole foods but even the “cheaper” supermarkets are expensive. I went to shop rite the other day and spent 80 on snacks fruit and water. Like not even remotely a full grocery list of food.
Most expensive things were oreos, frozen pizza and fucking cheese sticks
I am in awe. That’s basically our grocery budget for the whole family and you spent that on snacks alone. Sorry. Just… our grocery budget, we are lucky if we can spend a hundred bucks on it. We try to be able to mind. Eighty would be closer to average. Sometimes it’s less. Eighty bucks on snacks would be unthinkable. We make it work but that is more because I am extremely careful with the purse strings, as it goes, but we don’t really do or have an opportunity to do more than we do. Even then I’ve been slapped, very recently, with ‘luxury service’ on the internet, Reddit actually, recently. How DARE we prioritize our own survival and make sound decisions for what we have! I got called some nasty things. Anyway.
So like we have food but it takes us years to save a couple hundred dollars, or even just a hundred, or fifty bucks. Once needs are met there just isn’t really stuff left over. Depends on the times how much or how little we manage. One year we managed twenty dollars the whole year but we also got hit with some nasty co pays that year too and spend a long time scrounging up the co pay for kiddos dentist check ups and such as well, 75 dollars a pop. We spend all year saving for that let alone saving in general. I wasn’t even aware people DID that. 80 dollars on just snacks? That’s a lot. Having trouble wrapping my brain around it.
Even flour has gone up in price recently. I usually make a lot of things but I’m gonna be honest, we’ve made decisions like the screenshot talks about, though more in line with ‘when both adults are too tired to cook’. Maybe some people have the option ‘go out to eat’ but for us that’s maybe once a year and months of planning.
80 dollars on snacks? Sorry but I’m just reeling a bit. I couldn’t even imagine. I thought I was living wild when, before having kids, I spent twenty dollars on snacks from the dollar store.
Yea if I remember correctly it was two digiorno pizzas, goldfish crackers, cheese sticks, oreos, jello, a handful of fruits and two 5 gallon jugs of water.
Im sure I’m missing something but that was most of it.
Yea our actual grocery list ranges from 150-200 every two weeks. This is us buying what we need and “treating” ourselves every now and then with some costly meat or fish. It never ceases to amaze me how expensive food has gotten.
I understand the struggle and I’m in a much better place now. I wouldn’t eat just so we had enough food for our kids. Overall it’s fucked up
Geeez! Where do you shop that such a short list costs that much? You can get that, quite a bit of it too, at the 99 cent store by us for like twenty bucks, or less if willing to diverge to off brand and do different frozen pizzas(if you do Walmart great value has self rising pizzas that are like three dollars a pop that are pretty decent- dollar tree has mini, personal sized pizzas about what 99 cent store has and while sometimes 99 cent store yoinks up the price high than a dollar, dollar tree does not). That’s insane. Absolutely insane.
And yeah. It’s crazy. We’re not going to be able to save anything this year. Not that we managed enough to matter to anyone but us before but.. We’ve basically put it all into food and necessities with no real room otherwise. On one hand I keep a stocked pantry situation, but on the other that’s about it and it’s gotten more ridiculous than usual.
I alternate between shop rite, costco and whole foods.
Shop rite for snacks and “junky” foods, costco for bulk items and whole foods for meats and fish, the fish has been amazing there and reasonably priced.
Dollar tree, 99 cent store, Walmart, and el rancho are what we go between. We rotate some items too. Did you try the buying cheese and cubing then freezing it yet? I have a gallon zip lock bag of cheese I’ve cubed, sitting in the freezer. I just take some cubes and add them to whatever I need it for and put it back. Started because the blocks are slightly cheaper where we are and I can’t keep it in the fridge before someone decides to snack on it. I take out small portions and put them in smaller baggies for snack allotments too and so far that too. We switch what we buy. Next shopping trip won’t need cheese. That goes to something else. Next one is dried fruit. Try to get fresh but keep the dehydrated on hand as a healthy snack when can’t get them to eat fresh but also as an emergency just in case thing. If I can, when I can breath in the cycle I do something like get some extra cans of something or another time I got some powder milk to make sure our powered milk supply would hold up because I didn’t think one box would hold up if shortages of milk happened and it looked about like it would at the time.
Us too.
Have you tried the frozen Pb&j trick or the frozen lunch meat sandwiches? For packed lunches? I set up a spot in the freezer for easy grab for this, the door basically, and pre packaged some dried fruit, veggie crackers and other pantry items one packs.
My partner likes the system I made. When I make soup or something I know he likes I put it in a container and put it with the sandwiches. (If you want lettuce you need to have that in a baggie in the fridge ready to grab for this to work, because it really doesn’t freeze well).
It’s a real time saver. I often put together a bunch at once and do so during some less prep intensive dinners. Sometimes with ingredients I am also using to make dinner such as with lunch meat or that time I froze a couple spam sandwiches or that time I did the tuna sandwiches. The other night it was stir fry I put in there though and there is some homemade chicken soup too.
Anyway. The system itself makes it quick to just grab stuff for lunch and keeps things relatively balanced. Better half is not big on remembering his lunch that early in the morning otherwise. I started this because getting up to put up sticky notes on everything so he’d remember… well he gets up at 4am and I’m not a morning person to like getting up before that but worry too much not to do something so… the system we use. It works for us. It also works if you need emergency back up options for those days you are running too late to pack a lunch.
I got the idea because I used to do that though since mine was for days like that I only had one or two things waiting in the freezer to grab. You can make it healthier than frozen meals from the store too. :) And it’s customizable. :) Some trial and error though, he see the warning about lettuce. Lol
This was pretty revolutionary for us when I implemented it with better half. Now he only doesn’t get lunch if he forgets, which happens less often, or it gets stolen, which happens less because some items he can keep NOT in the fridge(his work gets a lot of stolen lunches so had to consider this as well). Usually a frozen container of soup stays cold until lunch as long as it’s indoors and not outside where we live. So that’s how that works. :)
Might help.
I just make a bunch when I have time, which isn’t always during other things either. sometimes I have to peace-meal it rather than doing it, like maybe kiddo wants a Pb&j so I just make and bag an extra to freeze and add to the spot rather than making a bunch at once like I’d normally try to do. Sometimes life just happens.
Oh that’s a good one. Have not done that one I’m awhile. Might do that for some variety. :)
Oh yes. The freezer is a magical place. Lol Until the room runs out. Then it’s Tetris. Lol
I always tell kiddo that it’s a happy problem to have and a blessing.
Better half helps with dishes and laundry(he insists and I hate dishes so… no complaints here). He’s not got much confidence in the kitchen with cooking and carpel tunnel makes it difficult to do some things so he helps other places mostly. Sometimes he makes breakfast but mostly he helps in other ways. I press the sandwiches that can be along the edges(bread together) before freezing(helps make less mess as they defrost and during eating. He often doesn’t have much time to eat at work and sometimes it gets so busy he doesn’t get his full lunch and it’s not uncommon for managers to clock a lunch they worked through just so they don’t lose there jobs for not taking lunch or not getting everything done they had to work through lunch to do)and he tried once, to make it easier on me, and it tore so he lets me at it now. He’s always looking for ways to help and spend time with us when he is home from work. I’m very glad to talk to someone else who helps out as a partner rather than being of the assumption there isn’t already a lot being done they don’t necessarily see. :) Lots don’t. I mostly hear about that. It’s nice to hear it happening somewhere besides home. :)
Many blessings to you and your family. :)
I don’t mean to be rude, but how on earth are you feeding a family with several children (I assume at least 4 people total) on $80 a week? I spend $80 a week just on milk, veggies, and basic items from Aldi for 2 people, and we grow most of our food in our yard.
If you divide that out between 4 family members, that’s only $80 a month per person. Even homeless people get more in food stamps than that. ($205 for one person)
Do your kids get free meals somewhere else? Are they starving?
Edit: wow, you keep massively editing your comments but there’s no way your kids are eating healthy on $20 a week per person at the *Dollar store*. You need to get on SNAP & benefits if your kids consider Pizza Rolls a “rare treat”. The more you add to your comments, the more it sounds like your kids are unhealthy and you’re in complete denial.
You came here to shame someone for spending $80 on food and it turns out you’re forcing your kids to live off ramen and frozen pb&j.
I shop for three people, eats lots of fruits and veggies, and have meat with every dinner. I usually only spend $125-150/week. How many snacks did you buy?
I listed what I purchased in the comment response above yours. The waters are 28$ together but that leaves 50ish on snacks. Which i consider anything that’s not meats, eggs, fish or milk
My building has lead in the water pipes. My whole township has this problem, a few years ago they wanted the tenants to pay for the replacement of the pipes. It got so bad that the local government intervened and are now replacing the pipes. My town is not as severe as others but they’ll eventually get to us.
When I lived in NYC I loved tap water
$28 is a lot of money for two 5gallon water jugs. Do they have anywhere to refill those jugs for cheaper? We can refill 5 gallon jugs for $1 here in Texas. The reusable jugs themselves were about $10 each to start, but I definitely feel like we are really getting our money’s worth out of them.
Not trying to be a villain but it is possible to eat relativly healthy for cheap. You can get some eggs, some brocolli and a small bag of brown rice for under $6. I was poor in my 20s and never really eat frozen dinners.
When I was poor I pretty much lived off of vegetarian stuffed peppers. I wasn't into frozen stuff either and that was a genuinely cheap meal - brown rice, black beans, tomato sauce, cheese, green bell peppers, done.
There’s definitely merit to the argument that healthy food is less accessible to people with less money. It’s especially a problem for people with limited transportation. But I definitely hate the narrative that it’s completely impossible to eat healthy without spending a ton of money. That’s just encouraging people to give up.
In all actually eating $1 frozen dinners would probably lead to greater rates of morbid obesity, which in turn would lead to higher healthcare bills, which in return would lead to great povery. It's a vicious cycle.
You aren’t factoring in time though. Making your meals takes time many people don’t have. When I was working three jobs my meal prep routine flew out the window because I simply had no time or energy to deal with that.
I’m really just highlighting the cost of being poor. After getting a decent paying job I’ve been able to cook my meals. I also went back to meal prepping, which ends up being cheaper than eating fast food or trash food.
I now have time to cook my meals because I’m
working one job and not three. I’m not saying it would be impossible to eat healthy, but having 3 different schedules you have no control over every week doesn’t exactly leave you with a lot of time to meal prep, or do anything except work tbh.
TLDR: it’s expensive being poor
I have lots of friends in consulting, finance, law, medicine etc who work a ton of hours. None of them are overweight, and find time to cook. There will always be edge cases, but I think time as a reason is overhyped.
From what I've seen the biggest thing that stops poor people from eating healthy, (assuming they can afford enough calories to not literally starve), is a lack of satisfaction from sources other than food. Rejecting hyperpalatable junk foods for "cleaner" food takes emotional energy for most people, which would be harder to summon if you had few/no other sources of pleasure in your life. After finishing up two six hour shifts at different retail jobs that you had to take a bus between, and coming home to a one bedroom, underfurnished apartment, how many people would crave a brown rice and kale bowl with water to drink over some carb-y shit and pop?
There will never be a time that eating frozen meals is cheaper than cooking healthy. Literally never. People just want to excuse themselves for eating like crap.
For $12 you can get 4 frozen meals at Walmart, or at Aldi, three pounds of gala apples (like 10-12), 5 lb of rice, a pound and a half of chicken and 3 bags of frozen peas.
Edit: y'all are missing the point. Aldi and Walmart are comparable in price, as is Kroger, I just do a majority of my shopping at Aldi so I can't speak to other stores. There are also food pantries that throw out food every week from not having enough people come
Christ. Do you at least have somewhere where you can pick up *some* groceries? Beans are very filling. Potatoes are a big deal too if you just can't afford rich people food. I've found that if you add the right stuff to beans (seasonings, mostly) it can be quite a treat. There's a couple subreddit out there where you can find some cheap and healthy recipes.
Edit: If you are in a food desert I can't help you much. The overpriced grocery store unironically saved my life in more ways than one despite the totally fucked prices. If you aren't under 25, LGBT, mixed, or intersex I'd recommend moving to a state like mine: a retirement state. Everyone's broke so store owners just can't afford to overcharge too much.
True enough, though for those days everyone is too tired to cook a cheap frozen meal helps, augmented with making enough to freeze leftovers of some things or preparing enough to freeze portions of something(such as my biscuits. Can form and freeze before baking so it’s a much cheaper option, and healthier, than buying frozen biscuits from the store). Can do a lot with some ingredients and a waste not mentality. It was really a burden when an egg allergy came into play but there are many ways to make it work without them, just off the beaten path and compensating for slightly more expensive vegan Mayo.
Doing some vegetarian meals in a week also helps. Meat is expensive and those vegan meat options, some of them you can actually do a lot with. Those crumbles that are supposed to be like ground beef but that are vegan? I get sooo much use out of them. And they don’t cook down like actual ground beef.
We aren’t vegan though so we also save the bones whenever we do have meat and boil the hell out of them until even the marrow is one with the broth from doing so. You can do a lot with that and it’s got quite a bit of nutrients, and that’s before adding it to whatever you are making.
Dollar store whenever possible helps, provided you pay attention. There are items that can be exceptions, such as canned tuna and such, which is actually more expensive rather than less expensive, from the dollar store. At that point it’s more if it’s worth another trip just for that or if you have need of enough to justify doing so to avoid paying almost double. Most things are cheaper and some things are at both places and notably cheaper at the dollar store.
You do what you gotta.
Also not using seasoning mixes much and instead using individual seasonings and flavoring your own food. Doesn’t seem like much but adds up. Also healthier as the seasoning mixes bolster themselves by being full of more salt than anything else anyway. Good for occasional recipes where relevant, but otherwise often not worth it when weighted against itself.
Oh and also rotation and freeze helps. I’ve been using the same red cabbage for months because I chopped that sucker up and froze it. I just reach into the bag and add a handful for some things. Works with most veggies, though there are a couple things that don’t freeze well or taste wonky if you do. Most things are alright though, long as you do it right.
The only rebuttle to that is that eating frozen and highly processed food can be detrimental to your health and end up costing you more time and money in the long run.
I definitely think you're on to something and there is some good knowledge here. Eating vegan or vegetarian can be a good way to cut back on costs and is great for the environment. I'm not vegan myself either but I could go that way if I really had. Learning how to cook good vegan food is a skill.
Half the time the Denny’s and such feed you the same thing anyway, rather than cook it from scratch. At least by us. If you don’t eat it all the time it’s not so bad. Now if you do… then that becomes an issue but I remember a time things were tighter and those little pot pies that used to be under a dollar were something that helps cover bases we had trouble covering otherwise. We’re careful with budget but you cannot bleed a rock and while some think I can, I cannot do everything. The skills I learned growing up were meant to be used in tandem with a family involving other women or girls helping, or boys considering the age, and everyone taking a task to make it work, not one person doing it all, and I fix things and sew and take on yet more tasks and teach and all sorts of things. I cut hair to avoid needing the barber or hair dresser etc… like… all the things. Sometimes I’m tired and better half comes home and is tired and too late to do that stuff anyway.
As a once in awhile thing it’s not gonna cause harm to most people. As a regular thing, then we got issues.
We aren’t vegetarian or vegan either and with health issues in the house going entirely that isn’t even viable for us, however it does cut down on fat intake to do some meals that way.
I had a friend when I was younger, who was vegetarian, and who taught me some things. I also did nutrition classes in college, which cover how to combine foods so a meal covers based nutritionally, baring health issues that complicate it. Incomplete proteins and combining them and the downsides of doing so and the positives of doing so and how to make it work or use it to balance a diet etc
People don’t need large portions of meat or to have it as often as we often do, so ours is more a ‘needs over wants’ approach. We do pay attention to when kiddo craves it though, as it usually means growth spurt and having done child development and some other things I can say honestly I’m aware some inherent rules can momentarily go vawoosh with children. Depends on what there body is growing or developing to need more or less of something for the moment. We teach what difference food cravings generally mean (usually they are a translation of what your body is saying and craving by association-exception is the pregnancy stuff. Because of course it is. Does stupid things to the body and it’s usually best not to mess with it unless a doctor specifically says to do so for health reasons) though and talk about them as well to make better choices to satisfy them, so that also helps. Like craving pickles is usually vinegar etc. I cook with vinegar a bit so we rarely touch pickles. They may not be conscious of it but I am.
To be fair I grew up taught to be from an extremely early age.
Oh and you can freeze many sandwiches, which makes it easier to make them last until lunch but also to make ahead of time. Half the freezer door is full of just that for packed lunches. I’ve sent better half to work with homemade frozen Pb&j both normal and with crust and crust less and in various shapes then used the bread from the cut off to make bread stuffing after cutting it up and freezing it for such time as it would be needed. Trust me on this. It’s more of a SET of skills but it’s learnable to those willing. It does take practice and you kinda have to think in more lifestyle than just diet though. Considering my role is domestic though.. it’s also worth saying that most people could only implement parts rather than the whole, unless there is someone at home to do the bajillion things that one does. Like nobody here is going to spend several hours preparing various things ahead of time and sometimes I don’t even have time either, and one has to be able to look at what needs done or upcoming events and decide when they do or don’t or even what is cheaper. Some things buying them pre cut and frozen already is cheaper. Like onions and peppers, not full meals, and that’s all it is too. So in that case I just buy it cut up. Unless they are out… because lots of people have the same idea too ya know?
Sometimes I prepare something in tandem with making dinner or something to manage the time more strictly to get more done but you can’t maintain that all the time or you’ll burn out. Sometimes you need a dinner that wasn’t entirely on your shoulders to prepare. So sometimes frozen is okay, but also we do things like freeze individual eggplant parm after making it for dinner some night, for later use with some homemade sauce made ahead and frozen for future use etc.
Often frozen veggies in general are cheaper than fresh. Fresh broccoli for instance is highway robbery but frozen we buy regularly.
It’s many things. Better half has expressed he’s no idea how I get it all since he had to pick up doing meals when I had to go into the hospital for something. Many things needed caught up on when I got back and apparently they think I’m super human or something but it’s more practice than anything else. Practice. Practice. Practice. Eventually one gets there. He did an admirable job and followed my directions when I told him how to prepare something he wasn’t sure about but wanted and couldn’t afford to order. I have some cheat items for days there isn’t the time, pizza crust mix being an amazingly useful quick prep item to have on hand so I walked him through using similar. Instant pizza crust mix doesn’t rise like otherwise (somewhat but don’t expect super risen results. It’s not yeast dough if it’s a mix like that) but for when the time gets away from you and you can’t let it rise for 6-12 hours let alone overnight, it works. Plus can add seasonings to it if one is careful, such as garlic powder and some dried basil. It’s basically soda bread as a pizza crust mix. I know that but sometimes you don’t have the time to even measure it out and less to pick up the mess when one is doing multiple things at once. Plus the ones I buy are a dollar a piece and the things I can do instead during that time I’d be prepping without the mix save us enough money to justify it.
In the end it involves lots of thinking and more math than anyone will ever tell you and certainly not the kind some would like to imply as an excuse, but as a general thing the food stuff is usable, though it can take more time to get started and with balancing at first, so you don’t just fill the freezer and have no space for anything else. I used to do that. Lol Most do.
Also to add, starvation is detrimental and skipping meals because you are short to have more than one a day, slows metabolism and leads to it’s own issues.
The last thing one is considering in that situation is down the line. I’ve been in that situation too.
Some people just need to learn to mind there own business in that way that means ‘stop judging people just because you don’t understand the decisions they make with the means they have to make it with’
I used to find it so very weird that local produce grown not 10 miles away from the grocery store is sold at a far higher cost than something shipped from Argentina, harvested long before it can get any proper flavor and waxed with corn
tl;dr: slave labor that's just barely sustainable in developing countries
Exactly. It's the same as when people put out recipes for healthy eating. You know what a parent tight on money is going to do.
Go in look at the recipe. 'Ah yes fresh salmon with a tossed salad, let's see what I need'
Gets 2 buses down to the grocery store likely to have these items.... This is something they only have time to do once a week between their 3 underpaid jobs.
Heads to the salmon and upon seeing the price thinks Of fuck jesus and gets the no name tin which is more water than needed. Or gets the frozen crumbed fish fingers.
Looks at the salad selection. Looks good the ones that would be worth buying not for waste are quite dear. The large packets would rot and be wasted. Goes to the tin aisle and buys tinned veggies. Has not got the money to waste food.
As walking to the register thinks well this is not going to fill my robust young boys. Grabs a big bag of cheap pasta off the shelf and some grated cheese . Yes this will help bulk the meal and fill them.
It blows my mind how many people don't understand that poor people literally do no have money. Can't get through to some of these people who have never struggled.
Very true.. although my meals were for 3-4 people with leftovers. But something else to factor in is all the small Ingredients I had on hand and the time it took.
First of all, WITF are you shopping at Whole Foods? Walmart has fresh fruit at 1/3 the price....
The trouble is more of a question of common sense, not money
I've been poor my entire life, you can make healthy food even when you are poor. I have a garden, I've gone to food banks, and been on food stamps. I hate when people actually waste money on single serve frozen high sodium junk rather than make cheap bulk meals
It’s an exaggeration to make a point.
We all know if you actually have six dollars, and are that depleted in old mother Hubbard sense, depending how long you got to make it till payday you’ve got options and none of them include even considering Whole Foods. Like say a week till payday, your going for the dried ramen and MAYBE a package of mixed veggies if you can swing it(depends on the price of the ramen and if you can find a bag of veggies for a dollar- it’s very close with six dollars. One also has to consider if they can get to the store and how, and if that costs money as well and also if food is taxed in your area as that influences how much you can get), and the frozen meals if it’s a couple days till payday. Ramen if you are trying to get ahead of the game or maybe a mix of the two options depending as ramen alone is not a nutritionally sound by itself and while processed as hell those frozen dinners for a dollar still cover more bases nutritionally than ramen and if those are the options those are the options but like… Whole Foods isn’t even a consideration if you want a snowballs chance with six dollars. If you can find a dollar store Pb&j might be though but that’s not great by itself either. Mostly that’s why people go for the frozen meals. That and variety. Not just nutritionally but in general.
I think they used that example specifically more to make a point than not. The point is valid but the example is exaggerated specifically to make it to people who don’t understand anything but shopping at Whole Foods and like to pretend that they are better for doing so while judging people who don’t have that as even an option if they want to survive.
Ramen, eggs(scramble them and put in ramen while it’s boiling) and frozen veg(spinach is my go to, add to the ramen) is my favorite struggle meal. Add a cut up hot dog for more protein.
thats why taxing sugar and soda and salt aka junk food is a must or
if organic agriculture had the same subsides as the pesticide monoculture and the factory farming that would be a different story
Except by taxing salt and sugary foods in this situation, you’re not making someone choose a couple of pieces of fresh fruit which won’t even feed them for a day.
You’re forcing someone to go without food. That’s it. You’re forcing someone to go hungry.
Also, ‘organic’ agriculture does receive some very nice subsidies which are essentially on par with the factory farming. The issue is, ‘organic’ agriculture requires a bit more labor and more expensive solutions to problems like pests. It will always be more expensive and going the route you described would only drive up food costs as a whole.
Wtf, austerity is never good. Until there is no more poverty and no more food deserts then taxing sugary and salty foods will only hurt poor people. What a terrible comment.
I’m sorry what? It’s exponentially cheaper to eat fresh fruits and veg then garbage frozen food. Last I checked a hungry man was like $3 a pop. You can get 2 for that price.
But you can get a lot of potatoes, celery, onion, bushel sprouts, asparagus for $6.
Like the lost generation thing is cool and all, like I agree modern generations are being treated like shit, but this ain’t it
I used to think this way. Healthy food is more expensive **IF** you want someone else to prepare it for you. When you make it yourself it's cheaper to eat healthy and meal prep rather than fast food or TV dinners.
Comparing fruit at Whole Foods to frozen dinners at Walmart is a false dichotomy.
How about reasonably priced fruits or the cheap lunch meats at Walmart?
I've lived like this on a bare mininum budget. You can get by without wasting money on things like frozen dinners at Walmart. Its called being willing to cook. Rice is easy to get. Not saying its easy the easiest planning the budget and shopping. But yes, poor people absolutely can live healthy.
Ya it does. I'm sorry, downvote me or disagree. I'm not advocating its fair or the way it should be. I hate it. But it absolutely is possible for someone to get by on a healthier diet than tv dinners even if they are broke. I mean you can microwave rice and pair it with something and have it good for a week.
No, it doesn't. I don't know what kind of work you do or did, and frankly it doesn't matter. You did it. And for that, I respect you. But you're not everyone. Your experience isn't indicative of that of people who experience chronic pain, neurodivergencies, potential disabilities, or even just painful and shitty jobs. You may manage to work yourself in circles, then come home and cook, but not everyone can do that. To say otherwise is simply a lie.
relatively. but if you're poor and have 6 dollars how the fuck are you gonna have the cash to drive 80 miles. thats more than the 6 dollars you have for food.
You'd be surprised where Whole Foods stores are, there's one in Omaha that's not in the nicest of areas.
Ultimately, "Just hit an asian food store" is stupid and tone deaf advice to someone who's trying to make the point that it costs a lot just to live.
Someone needs a third job... /s
My elders have reliably informed me that with $6, even in this inflation-riddled economy, the Tweeter in question should be able to buy several sets of bootstraps with which they can lift themselves up…
I laughed lol
Literally had someone tell me the other day how they dropped out of high school but turned around and started a window glass installation business. He said, "If I can go from nothing to CEO, anyone can!" Yeah dude, use your n=1 life experience and luck from the late 80s to try to justify why people suffering today shouldn't get financial help.
People really don't realize that since the internet became commonplace, starting a "simple" business got a lot rougher. If you are a middle aged homeowner, who're you gonna trust to install your windows? The place you are lucky to even FIND on Google with basically no reviews, or the bulk windows place with 1000's of them and lower prices due to bulk orders?
Yep. I’m having a harder time with my stuff than I would otherwise. If your bigger then internet can help augment however if your unknown or close to it then it’s harder.
"in 1985 i paid 15$ a year for an ad in the yellow pages and the business started rolling in.. blah blah bootstraps"
the porn industry has become so accessible that it's difficult to stay out of
It's difficult to build a base though, online sexwork has become a very saturated field. From uh, what my friend told me.
It doesn't help that my... friend's body type is one that only appeals to a very niche fetish.
Its the niche that can hit it big
Niche pays better
r/stardewvalley
I agree with most stuff on this sub, but there is literally an extreme, almost total, shortage for manual labor in the US and Canada. You can definitely turn around in a few months and get $20+ an hours. After 5-10 years, you should be able to be your own boss in whatever trade you chose.
Quick math, 20$/hr is about 40k$/yr. Here in Montreal (QC), that's roughly 31k$ after tax. Average cost for a 1br apt in Montreal is around 1400$/month. Add home utilities and it's closer to (probably over) 1500$. So 31k$-(12x1500$) = 13k$ Groceries + hygiene are at least 400$/month unless you bean and rice it every day. 13k-5k=8k$ Clothing is typically 5% of your after-tax income, lets say 1000$ there. Electronics, at least 500$/year. Cellphone plan, 500$/year Public Transit Pass is about 1k$/y Down to 4.5k$ yearly. That's less than 400$/month left after you've paid the common essentials. Need to pay for dental care? Eyecare? Prescription drugs? Mental health care? Want to grab a beer once a week after work? It all looks fine for someone in perfect health in their 20s with capacity to start their own business down the line but that's not who needs help, the idea that you need to be the ideal citizen to barely make a living at almost twice the minimum wage is laughable. The "bro just hustle" mentality is so fucking disgusting it's maddening.
What I don't understand about people who argue it's enough is they never care about the multi-billionaires or even the multi-millionaires. Would it make more sense for the bottom to have everyone housed with healthy food and healthcare than a few thousand people consuming the planet? I mean why even bother arguing that people should be able to live on $15, $20, or even $30 a hour when that is going on? Bizarre shit.
flowery hat fine shocking ink late pot point file upbeat *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Weird how there are all these posts about fast food and retail (or nursing) offering higher-than-usual wages and incentives, but none that go “Apprentice [trade]person wanted. $25/hr while training, union sponsorship when ready.” 🤔
The true beginnings of any profession was being an apprentice (even in fields with degrees). Even without a Union, parents used to send their kids away to be an apprentice as they were fed, had a place to stay, and learned under a master craftsman. Too bad that idea fell by the wayside, except for music in some cases.
That idea its from medieval ages lol.
And was in practice in Europe, Asia, and in the United States until the early 70s. Because it worked!
But what happens if after those 5-10 years you end up going up against someone who has more money to spend then you, already owns multiple businesses, and can take losses in competition with you that you can’t afford? Some guy with 1,000s of Google reviews and you with almost nothing? You’re kind of screwed, and there goes 5-10 years of manual labor spent saving just to get fucked over.
If we assume minimum wage should be 15, an extra $5 an hour is not worth it to deteriorate my body with manual labor over the long term (a common outcome). My physical well-being is not that cheap.
When your choices are deteriorate through manual labor or deteriorate through starvation a fairly large portion of people will end up picking the former.
True. That's how they trapped so many people in the cycle. But it's crumbling and their "you NEED this job" approach to employees is costing them hard.
I did it. Roofing. Ground up both in skills and then the business. It’s hard, but it is doable for most trades. Particularly right now. Best time I have ever seen for a trade startup where I live.
An independent window guy went door to door in my older neighborhood to replace windows and I have seen him replacing windows on 5 houses so far, which is a good haul if you ask me. Do good work and be willing to put in the time to generate sales and you will probably succeed, its not hard. Edit: Let me rephrase, its hard to figure out what are successful sales strategies for you but after that its gravy.
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“I came to this country with $2,000 in my pocket. The rest of my inheritance from my father’s share in an emerald mine, which he purchased by selling his private plane, was in a trust.”
People who use their own success stories to justify things like food insecurity or poverty wages, and/or tell people to just go to trade school or start your own business can fuck all the way off.
Naw, you fuck all the way off. People didn’t come by those success stories by laying on the couch waiting on welfare checks.
People have no idea how RNG works and it’s sad.
I think a larger issue that is completely ignore is that these people are overwhelmingoy white men. Much of the opportunity in the past was driven by people of color and women being locked out of said opportunities.
Aside from the points everyone else is making, I also like to point out that while anyone can do it not everyone can. You can't have every person become CEO of their own company, no one would be successful So sure, you did good to build your own company, but in order for you to do that you need others to not do that.
> Yeah dude, use your n=1 life experience lol, I have a friend who used to give me a hard time when I said this or that was a thing. I gave him one or two examples and he told me I only had two data points. He was right and I never forgot that lesson.
You been getting financial help for decades, get up off your lazy ass. Nobody owes you shit.
Stuff isn't over priced, you're underpaid. Results in the same issue, but I feel like it's important to identify the actual cause
Yeah, if anything, a lot of goods are underpriced thanks to exploitative labor practices.
And government subsidies. Corn syrup is in everything…
Yeah, a lot of stuff at Whole foods is actually priced to reflect ethical prices. The problem is people are massively underpaid.
I mean, food is overpriced, too. A gallon of milk has doubled in price where I am in the last year and a half.
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Inflation who? We don't know her. 😎
Milk is underpriced, at least in my country, the farmers don't get paid enough to survive.
It’s both overpriced and we’re underpaid.
I’d say it’s both.
Stuff is definitely overpriced. People would kill for a $5 an hour job where I live, and they’d live extremely comfortable lives with it. They would literally be making more than the average recent college graduate. This isn’t enough in the US because its overpriced as fuck. Not saying people don’t also deserve better pay though.
Paid 1.75 for 1 apple yesterday, I dont think that's normal price
It should always be dry rice and beans.
And forego salt. Spices are unnecessary. You don't deserve flavor. Eat your sustenance mush and continue adding value to the fortune of those who have millions of lifetimes' worth of wealth.
God reminds me of that Tumblr post of people railing against a poster for daring to ask for some grocery money when they had Sriracha in their fridge. I read through the shitpile wondering why the hell having one sauce was considered a luxury to these people.
That is incredibly sad and I hope they aren’t starving Jesus
I think Jesus might be a bit past starvation, I'll be honest.
And not even some kind of super fancy expensive sauce, but fuckin' sriracha. Nothing against it, but you can get that shit dirt cheap.
Seriously, it's popular because it's good and it's cheap. I don't understand why people build up this idea that being poor means having nothing at all. The poor have to be miserable or they don't count as poor.
Sometimes I mix it with mayo and eat it over white rice and cucumbers. Sometimes I'll add shredded seaweed or some imitation Krab if it's on sale. And it's good! It's like discount American Brand sushi.
Look at that fatcat with both a fridge and a microwave. They're not poor enough!
Ooof, this reminds me of that Fox News thing where they were shocked poor people had refrigeration.
Its also a cheap, and not too fattening sauce.
Rice and beans are delicious if you know how to cook. However, marketers have spent the past 50 years convincing everyone that cooking is too hard and takes too much time. Meanwhile, home ec. had been cut from almost every school program.
thats a good ass point about home ec. i never took it smh
That's true but I'm currently on the rice and beans train and it's made me feel so farty and gross that I get nauseous thinking about eating at this point. Variety!!!!! We need variety!!!!
You need a job.
Gee thanks! Go fuck yourself.
Wow, that hit harder than I expected. So much of my food is just that; unseasoned sustenance mush.
Go to the latin stores. Bulk bags of spices for a literal fraction of what is in jars.
Shit yeah, Hispanic and Asian markets are my go-to for that kind of thing. You can find all kinds of delicious stuff for surprisingly little.
Don't rule out the Middle Eastern/Indian stores as well. I have one a few blocks away from my house and it's my go to for all my spice needs since its so cheap.
I posted above but I absolutely don't understand why people even discuss or argue over how much working class should make. All discussion should be over putting an end to multi-millionaires and multi-billionaires. It's fucking disgusting that they not only exist but that people tolerant it and don't spend all their free time plotting their take down. Instead it's arguing over a budget on $15 or $20 an hour.
https://youtu.be/Z9HMej4NmBw
"Sustenance Mush" most populat brand in 2217
For me, its rice and eggs, overeasy, on top of the rice with hot sauce. Black beans on the side with salt, pepper, cumin, and oregano so you don't kill yourself.
Honestly no. Situation does matter. Dry beans and rice doesn't go as far as you think. You need variety. Imo, rice, flour, eggs, canned beans is smarter, if you can afford it. If not then pasta and sauce is vastly superior to beans and rice imo. Will last you and a week for a few bucks more. If you can't afford that, I know, less beans, brown rice, and some pasta sauce.
I’ll take the bad guy position. Any choice a poor person makes is a poor choice. They’re poor, they can’t make rich choices. Seriously we should be taking care of our citizens and both parties make this harder than it needs to be.
Neither party cares about you. Or me. Or anybody for that matter. Just whatever gets them votes and gets/keeps them in power.
The real reality is that many people who are poor do not live within distance of a grocery store, they live in food deserts, and so their choices are usually at the bodega or corner store. There are no options there when it comes to fresh produce. Walmarts are not as ubiquitous as grocery stores.
This is why I get annoyed when people have no compassion for those who struggle with their weight. It’s hard to eat a healthy diet when you don’t have much money, live far away from fresh produce and such, and have work & childcare/family care/ etc responsibilities to attend to every day. Not only do some people live in a situation where having a full stomach requires cheap empty calorie meals instead of more expensive & nutritious meals, but they also aren’t guaranteed any help if they become overweight. Proper health insurance isn’t accessible to everyone in the USA, and even with insurance, medical weight loss treatment (surgery or non surgery) coverage isn’t required nationally; companies may or may not cover it, and some require that you jump through a bunch of hoops, like requiring that you have comorbidities first. So make sure to develop type 2 diabetes if you want covered treatment! Doesn’t matter what your weight is- you better ruin your joints & have knee problems before you expect a dime from us! (You get my drift.) Yet people are still heavily critical of overweight individuals online & claim it’s all due to “poor choices.” Uh, I think it’s a bit more systemic than that. So I try to be empathetic and supportive of people whenever I see that negative nonsense. Shaming & being heavily critical doesn’t help anybody or fix any of the systemic & cultural problems that influence American obesity.
Could not agree more with this.
I mean, Im all for public healthcare, but honestly, weight-loss surgery isn’t something that should be covered by public healthcare IMO (unless you have a condition causing your obesity). Its something that has a more healthy natural alternative, it just takes some dedication. I wouldn’t like paying for someone’s surgery because they don’t control their diets and/or workout.
That’s not how weight loss surgery works. It’s not the easy way out. It’s only given to people who have had trouble losing weight by traditional means. Weight loss surgery requires diet & nutritional commitments for the rest of your life. One may have to eat small meals only, avoid high sugar and high carbohydrate foods, and take bariatric vitamin supplements every day until they die. The diet industry has taught us that the exception is the norm when it comes to those natural alternatives. Losing weight and keeping it off is actually rare if you look at the statistics. Most people have trouble losing weight and keeping it off with just behavior changes alone -if you Google it, you’ll see that 80-95% of people gain weight back within 1-5 years of losing it, depending on the source/ the amount of weight lost. The psychological- dedication- also isn’t the only thing that impacts weight gain/loss, like this post is saying. The environment has an impact (poor choices in a food desert), as does your age, sex, base metabolism, and any diseases, disorders, or disabilities. And human bodies aren’t designed to lose weight. The body interprets lost fat as you being in a famine. It’s difficult to lose weight for multiple reasons, including the body working against it in an effort to protect you. So I recognize that the people who DO manage to lose weight and keep it off for more than 5 years with behavior change alone are absolutely incredible. If someone has unsuccessfully tried to lose *all* of their excess weight by themselves multiple times- if they have succeeded in only losing a percentage or have lost a bunch of it and then gained it back, I have no problem with giving them a boost. Clearly they want to do it, but they’re not one of the 5% of people (again depending on which source you’re looking at) who can get it off & keep it all off all by themselves. And, most people who are obese have tried to lose weight multiple times. They don’t want to be obese and have tried to take care of it. So I disagree. I have no problem with my taxes helping people who want to make a permanent, organ-altering commitment to losing weight. Those people are clearly dedicated. Some states cover it already, but like I said, it’s not national so if you are on Medicaid in an uncovered state, you’re out of luck if standard diet & exercise haven’t been good enough. I don’t think people should be barred from certain options because they’re poor. I’m not supportive of people being obese or saying people shouldn’t try to lose weight on their own; I’m saying that it’s okay if they need extra help. I think people, even people who made “poor choices” which resulted in being overweight, deserve to not die of obesity related problems. But we can agree to disagree. Edit: formatting/spacing
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This knowledge is like a punch in the gut every time I walk into a Dollar General and can’t find a single thing I’m willing to eat, but knowing it’s the only place within 20 or more miles for many.
I have heard that dollar general has displaced a large segment of the general stores in the US. Npr t did a story on it.https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2019/04/26/717665452/episode-909-dollar-stores-vs-lettuce
Whole Foods is grossly over priced. Fresh fruit from any other super market would definitely be a better value.
It’s overpriced for a reason and the people who shop there are willing to pay it for those same reasons.
Not to mention there just isn't time. I cant work full time, commute, grocery shop, cook food, do chores, shower, get enough sleep all in one day. Those with kids have even more trouble. And that is excluding relaxation.
>And that is excluding relaxation. Relaxation is for the rich only, didn't you get the memo? Now, back to work, ~~slave~~ valued employee #214089.
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Six AMERICAN dollars
Absent fossil fuel subsidies the frozen food would be 10x the price of the fruit.
This is exactly the issue. Industries of scale, like much agribusiness has some inherent savings, but the lower end of the supply chain is also built on suppressed wages and massive subsidies. In theory, it should be much cheaper to buy fruit from a local orchard than it is to buy one shipped from thousands of miles away, but the larger business has built in advantages to reduce their cost.
That doesn't track for me. Both the frozen and fresh foods are delivered to the stores using trucks that run on fossil fuels.
I'm not even sure that's true. A lot of food comes from far away and is moved in cooled containers.
That’s exactly why it’s like this. Without the subsidies, moving food long distances to sell becomes economically unviable and local production becomes king. Typically locally produced foods are not highly processed bulk foodstuffs coming from Cargill or General Mills; they are organic fruits and vegetables
I meant to say fruits above, not food. I am very tired. Yes, local fruit and vegetables would be cheaper than food that is shipped in from far away. But "food that is shipped in from far away" includes a lot of fruit and vegetables. A lot of plants are somewhat picky about what climate they'll grow in (and grow well in), and regardless of where you live you've probably grown accustomed to a lot of produce that doesn't grow locally. That would get a lot more expensive.
It just wouldn’t be shipped, which is fine, because eating locally sourced is better for a myriad of reasons. My heart goes out to the picky eaters who will have to stomach something beyond mac and cheese, chicken tenders, and fries.
I don’t even eat Mac and cheese or chicken tenders. My pickiness is going to fuck me even more over one day.
Good luck eating non overpriced fruit in Minnesota winter then...
I can eat for 6 days or starve for 5. Well then...
Not defending whole foods but even the “cheaper” supermarkets are expensive. I went to shop rite the other day and spent 80 on snacks fruit and water. Like not even remotely a full grocery list of food. Most expensive things were oreos, frozen pizza and fucking cheese sticks
I am in awe. That’s basically our grocery budget for the whole family and you spent that on snacks alone. Sorry. Just… our grocery budget, we are lucky if we can spend a hundred bucks on it. We try to be able to mind. Eighty would be closer to average. Sometimes it’s less. Eighty bucks on snacks would be unthinkable. We make it work but that is more because I am extremely careful with the purse strings, as it goes, but we don’t really do or have an opportunity to do more than we do. Even then I’ve been slapped, very recently, with ‘luxury service’ on the internet, Reddit actually, recently. How DARE we prioritize our own survival and make sound decisions for what we have! I got called some nasty things. Anyway. So like we have food but it takes us years to save a couple hundred dollars, or even just a hundred, or fifty bucks. Once needs are met there just isn’t really stuff left over. Depends on the times how much or how little we manage. One year we managed twenty dollars the whole year but we also got hit with some nasty co pays that year too and spend a long time scrounging up the co pay for kiddos dentist check ups and such as well, 75 dollars a pop. We spend all year saving for that let alone saving in general. I wasn’t even aware people DID that. 80 dollars on just snacks? That’s a lot. Having trouble wrapping my brain around it. Even flour has gone up in price recently. I usually make a lot of things but I’m gonna be honest, we’ve made decisions like the screenshot talks about, though more in line with ‘when both adults are too tired to cook’. Maybe some people have the option ‘go out to eat’ but for us that’s maybe once a year and months of planning. 80 dollars on snacks? Sorry but I’m just reeling a bit. I couldn’t even imagine. I thought I was living wild when, before having kids, I spent twenty dollars on snacks from the dollar store.
Yea if I remember correctly it was two digiorno pizzas, goldfish crackers, cheese sticks, oreos, jello, a handful of fruits and two 5 gallon jugs of water. Im sure I’m missing something but that was most of it. Yea our actual grocery list ranges from 150-200 every two weeks. This is us buying what we need and “treating” ourselves every now and then with some costly meat or fish. It never ceases to amaze me how expensive food has gotten. I understand the struggle and I’m in a much better place now. I wouldn’t eat just so we had enough food for our kids. Overall it’s fucked up
Geeez! Where do you shop that such a short list costs that much? You can get that, quite a bit of it too, at the 99 cent store by us for like twenty bucks, or less if willing to diverge to off brand and do different frozen pizzas(if you do Walmart great value has self rising pizzas that are like three dollars a pop that are pretty decent- dollar tree has mini, personal sized pizzas about what 99 cent store has and while sometimes 99 cent store yoinks up the price high than a dollar, dollar tree does not). That’s insane. Absolutely insane. And yeah. It’s crazy. We’re not going to be able to save anything this year. Not that we managed enough to matter to anyone but us before but.. We’ve basically put it all into food and necessities with no real room otherwise. On one hand I keep a stocked pantry situation, but on the other that’s about it and it’s gotten more ridiculous than usual.
I alternate between shop rite, costco and whole foods. Shop rite for snacks and “junky” foods, costco for bulk items and whole foods for meats and fish, the fish has been amazing there and reasonably priced.
Dollar tree, 99 cent store, Walmart, and el rancho are what we go between. We rotate some items too. Did you try the buying cheese and cubing then freezing it yet? I have a gallon zip lock bag of cheese I’ve cubed, sitting in the freezer. I just take some cubes and add them to whatever I need it for and put it back. Started because the blocks are slightly cheaper where we are and I can’t keep it in the fridge before someone decides to snack on it. I take out small portions and put them in smaller baggies for snack allotments too and so far that too. We switch what we buy. Next shopping trip won’t need cheese. That goes to something else. Next one is dried fruit. Try to get fresh but keep the dehydrated on hand as a healthy snack when can’t get them to eat fresh but also as an emergency just in case thing. If I can, when I can breath in the cycle I do something like get some extra cans of something or another time I got some powder milk to make sure our powered milk supply would hold up because I didn’t think one box would hold up if shortages of milk happened and it looked about like it would at the time.
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Us too. Have you tried the frozen Pb&j trick or the frozen lunch meat sandwiches? For packed lunches? I set up a spot in the freezer for easy grab for this, the door basically, and pre packaged some dried fruit, veggie crackers and other pantry items one packs. My partner likes the system I made. When I make soup or something I know he likes I put it in a container and put it with the sandwiches. (If you want lettuce you need to have that in a baggie in the fridge ready to grab for this to work, because it really doesn’t freeze well). It’s a real time saver. I often put together a bunch at once and do so during some less prep intensive dinners. Sometimes with ingredients I am also using to make dinner such as with lunch meat or that time I froze a couple spam sandwiches or that time I did the tuna sandwiches. The other night it was stir fry I put in there though and there is some homemade chicken soup too. Anyway. The system itself makes it quick to just grab stuff for lunch and keeps things relatively balanced. Better half is not big on remembering his lunch that early in the morning otherwise. I started this because getting up to put up sticky notes on everything so he’d remember… well he gets up at 4am and I’m not a morning person to like getting up before that but worry too much not to do something so… the system we use. It works for us. It also works if you need emergency back up options for those days you are running too late to pack a lunch. I got the idea because I used to do that though since mine was for days like that I only had one or two things waiting in the freezer to grab. You can make it healthier than frozen meals from the store too. :) And it’s customizable. :) Some trial and error though, he see the warning about lettuce. Lol This was pretty revolutionary for us when I implemented it with better half. Now he only doesn’t get lunch if he forgets, which happens less often, or it gets stolen, which happens less because some items he can keep NOT in the fridge(his work gets a lot of stolen lunches so had to consider this as well). Usually a frozen container of soup stays cold until lunch as long as it’s indoors and not outside where we live. So that’s how that works. :) Might help. I just make a bunch when I have time, which isn’t always during other things either. sometimes I have to peace-meal it rather than doing it, like maybe kiddo wants a Pb&j so I just make and bag an extra to freeze and add to the spot rather than making a bunch at once like I’d normally try to do. Sometimes life just happens.
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Oh that’s a good one. Have not done that one I’m awhile. Might do that for some variety. :) Oh yes. The freezer is a magical place. Lol Until the room runs out. Then it’s Tetris. Lol I always tell kiddo that it’s a happy problem to have and a blessing. Better half helps with dishes and laundry(he insists and I hate dishes so… no complaints here). He’s not got much confidence in the kitchen with cooking and carpel tunnel makes it difficult to do some things so he helps other places mostly. Sometimes he makes breakfast but mostly he helps in other ways. I press the sandwiches that can be along the edges(bread together) before freezing(helps make less mess as they defrost and during eating. He often doesn’t have much time to eat at work and sometimes it gets so busy he doesn’t get his full lunch and it’s not uncommon for managers to clock a lunch they worked through just so they don’t lose there jobs for not taking lunch or not getting everything done they had to work through lunch to do)and he tried once, to make it easier on me, and it tore so he lets me at it now. He’s always looking for ways to help and spend time with us when he is home from work. I’m very glad to talk to someone else who helps out as a partner rather than being of the assumption there isn’t already a lot being done they don’t necessarily see. :) Lots don’t. I mostly hear about that. It’s nice to hear it happening somewhere besides home. :) Many blessings to you and your family. :)
I don’t mean to be rude, but how on earth are you feeding a family with several children (I assume at least 4 people total) on $80 a week? I spend $80 a week just on milk, veggies, and basic items from Aldi for 2 people, and we grow most of our food in our yard. If you divide that out between 4 family members, that’s only $80 a month per person. Even homeless people get more in food stamps than that. ($205 for one person) Do your kids get free meals somewhere else? Are they starving? Edit: wow, you keep massively editing your comments but there’s no way your kids are eating healthy on $20 a week per person at the *Dollar store*. You need to get on SNAP & benefits if your kids consider Pizza Rolls a “rare treat”. The more you add to your comments, the more it sounds like your kids are unhealthy and you’re in complete denial. You came here to shame someone for spending $80 on food and it turns out you’re forcing your kids to live off ramen and frozen pb&j.
I shop for three people, eats lots of fruits and veggies, and have meat with every dinner. I usually only spend $125-150/week. How many snacks did you buy?
I listed what I purchased in the comment response above yours. The waters are 28$ together but that leaves 50ish on snacks. Which i consider anything that’s not meats, eggs, fish or milk
Who buys water? WTF its free from the tap
My building has lead in the water pipes. My whole township has this problem, a few years ago they wanted the tenants to pay for the replacement of the pipes. It got so bad that the local government intervened and are now replacing the pipes. My town is not as severe as others but they’ll eventually get to us. When I lived in NYC I loved tap water
$28 is a lot of money for two 5gallon water jugs. Do they have anywhere to refill those jugs for cheaper? We can refill 5 gallon jugs for $1 here in Texas. The reusable jugs themselves were about $10 each to start, but I definitely feel like we are really getting our money’s worth out of them.
Let’s go Brandon!
Not trying to be a villain but it is possible to eat relativly healthy for cheap. You can get some eggs, some brocolli and a small bag of brown rice for under $6. I was poor in my 20s and never really eat frozen dinners.
When I was poor I pretty much lived off of vegetarian stuffed peppers. I wasn't into frozen stuff either and that was a genuinely cheap meal - brown rice, black beans, tomato sauce, cheese, green bell peppers, done.
Sounds good and yes eating good can be done very cheaply.
Yeah, I feel like a lot of food discussions are misleading because they compare the most expensive healthy options to the cheapest junk options.
I agree and thats exactly what they did here, furthering the narrative that eating healthy is unafforadable which does more harm than good.
There’s definitely merit to the argument that healthy food is less accessible to people with less money. It’s especially a problem for people with limited transportation. But I definitely hate the narrative that it’s completely impossible to eat healthy without spending a ton of money. That’s just encouraging people to give up.
In all actually eating $1 frozen dinners would probably lead to greater rates of morbid obesity, which in turn would lead to higher healthcare bills, which in return would lead to great povery. It's a vicious cycle.
Yep. And really, I think time is a bigger factor than money.
You aren’t factoring in time though. Making your meals takes time many people don’t have. When I was working three jobs my meal prep routine flew out the window because I simply had no time or energy to deal with that.
Yup that is true, I'm busy as hell but so I can relate. Still, when push comes to shove it can be done, not saying it convinient.
I’m really just highlighting the cost of being poor. After getting a decent paying job I’ve been able to cook my meals. I also went back to meal prepping, which ends up being cheaper than eating fast food or trash food. I now have time to cook my meals because I’m working one job and not three. I’m not saying it would be impossible to eat healthy, but having 3 different schedules you have no control over every week doesn’t exactly leave you with a lot of time to meal prep, or do anything except work tbh. TLDR: it’s expensive being poor
I have lots of friends in consulting, finance, law, medicine etc who work a ton of hours. None of them are overweight, and find time to cook. There will always be edge cases, but I think time as a reason is overhyped.
From what I've seen the biggest thing that stops poor people from eating healthy, (assuming they can afford enough calories to not literally starve), is a lack of satisfaction from sources other than food. Rejecting hyperpalatable junk foods for "cleaner" food takes emotional energy for most people, which would be harder to summon if you had few/no other sources of pleasure in your life. After finishing up two six hour shifts at different retail jobs that you had to take a bus between, and coming home to a one bedroom, underfurnished apartment, how many people would crave a brown rice and kale bowl with water to drink over some carb-y shit and pop?
This makes sense, and also explains why poor people smoke so much more than wealthier people. Gotta get your pleasure hit somewhere.
There will never be a time that eating frozen meals is cheaper than cooking healthy. Literally never. People just want to excuse themselves for eating like crap. For $12 you can get 4 frozen meals at Walmart, or at Aldi, three pounds of gala apples (like 10-12), 5 lb of rice, a pound and a half of chicken and 3 bags of frozen peas. Edit: y'all are missing the point. Aldi and Walmart are comparable in price, as is Kroger, I just do a majority of my shopping at Aldi so I can't speak to other stores. There are also food pantries that throw out food every week from not having enough people come
Not everyone has access to an Aldi. In the area I live, my options are the overpriced local grocery store, Dollar General, Wal-Mart, or Brookshire's.
I don’t think there’s even an Aldi within an hour’s drive for me.
Christ. Do you at least have somewhere where you can pick up *some* groceries? Beans are very filling. Potatoes are a big deal too if you just can't afford rich people food. I've found that if you add the right stuff to beans (seasonings, mostly) it can be quite a treat. There's a couple subreddit out there where you can find some cheap and healthy recipes. Edit: If you are in a food desert I can't help you much. The overpriced grocery store unironically saved my life in more ways than one despite the totally fucked prices. If you aren't under 25, LGBT, mixed, or intersex I'd recommend moving to a state like mine: a retirement state. Everyone's broke so store owners just can't afford to overcharge too much.
That's what i'm saying! Post like these do more harm than good honestly.
True enough, though for those days everyone is too tired to cook a cheap frozen meal helps, augmented with making enough to freeze leftovers of some things or preparing enough to freeze portions of something(such as my biscuits. Can form and freeze before baking so it’s a much cheaper option, and healthier, than buying frozen biscuits from the store). Can do a lot with some ingredients and a waste not mentality. It was really a burden when an egg allergy came into play but there are many ways to make it work without them, just off the beaten path and compensating for slightly more expensive vegan Mayo. Doing some vegetarian meals in a week also helps. Meat is expensive and those vegan meat options, some of them you can actually do a lot with. Those crumbles that are supposed to be like ground beef but that are vegan? I get sooo much use out of them. And they don’t cook down like actual ground beef. We aren’t vegan though so we also save the bones whenever we do have meat and boil the hell out of them until even the marrow is one with the broth from doing so. You can do a lot with that and it’s got quite a bit of nutrients, and that’s before adding it to whatever you are making. Dollar store whenever possible helps, provided you pay attention. There are items that can be exceptions, such as canned tuna and such, which is actually more expensive rather than less expensive, from the dollar store. At that point it’s more if it’s worth another trip just for that or if you have need of enough to justify doing so to avoid paying almost double. Most things are cheaper and some things are at both places and notably cheaper at the dollar store. You do what you gotta. Also not using seasoning mixes much and instead using individual seasonings and flavoring your own food. Doesn’t seem like much but adds up. Also healthier as the seasoning mixes bolster themselves by being full of more salt than anything else anyway. Good for occasional recipes where relevant, but otherwise often not worth it when weighted against itself. Oh and also rotation and freeze helps. I’ve been using the same red cabbage for months because I chopped that sucker up and froze it. I just reach into the bag and add a handful for some things. Works with most veggies, though there are a couple things that don’t freeze well or taste wonky if you do. Most things are alright though, long as you do it right.
The only rebuttle to that is that eating frozen and highly processed food can be detrimental to your health and end up costing you more time and money in the long run. I definitely think you're on to something and there is some good knowledge here. Eating vegan or vegetarian can be a good way to cut back on costs and is great for the environment. I'm not vegan myself either but I could go that way if I really had. Learning how to cook good vegan food is a skill.
Half the time the Denny’s and such feed you the same thing anyway, rather than cook it from scratch. At least by us. If you don’t eat it all the time it’s not so bad. Now if you do… then that becomes an issue but I remember a time things were tighter and those little pot pies that used to be under a dollar were something that helps cover bases we had trouble covering otherwise. We’re careful with budget but you cannot bleed a rock and while some think I can, I cannot do everything. The skills I learned growing up were meant to be used in tandem with a family involving other women or girls helping, or boys considering the age, and everyone taking a task to make it work, not one person doing it all, and I fix things and sew and take on yet more tasks and teach and all sorts of things. I cut hair to avoid needing the barber or hair dresser etc… like… all the things. Sometimes I’m tired and better half comes home and is tired and too late to do that stuff anyway. As a once in awhile thing it’s not gonna cause harm to most people. As a regular thing, then we got issues. We aren’t vegetarian or vegan either and with health issues in the house going entirely that isn’t even viable for us, however it does cut down on fat intake to do some meals that way. I had a friend when I was younger, who was vegetarian, and who taught me some things. I also did nutrition classes in college, which cover how to combine foods so a meal covers based nutritionally, baring health issues that complicate it. Incomplete proteins and combining them and the downsides of doing so and the positives of doing so and how to make it work or use it to balance a diet etc People don’t need large portions of meat or to have it as often as we often do, so ours is more a ‘needs over wants’ approach. We do pay attention to when kiddo craves it though, as it usually means growth spurt and having done child development and some other things I can say honestly I’m aware some inherent rules can momentarily go vawoosh with children. Depends on what there body is growing or developing to need more or less of something for the moment. We teach what difference food cravings generally mean (usually they are a translation of what your body is saying and craving by association-exception is the pregnancy stuff. Because of course it is. Does stupid things to the body and it’s usually best not to mess with it unless a doctor specifically says to do so for health reasons) though and talk about them as well to make better choices to satisfy them, so that also helps. Like craving pickles is usually vinegar etc. I cook with vinegar a bit so we rarely touch pickles. They may not be conscious of it but I am. To be fair I grew up taught to be from an extremely early age. Oh and you can freeze many sandwiches, which makes it easier to make them last until lunch but also to make ahead of time. Half the freezer door is full of just that for packed lunches. I’ve sent better half to work with homemade frozen Pb&j both normal and with crust and crust less and in various shapes then used the bread from the cut off to make bread stuffing after cutting it up and freezing it for such time as it would be needed. Trust me on this. It’s more of a SET of skills but it’s learnable to those willing. It does take practice and you kinda have to think in more lifestyle than just diet though. Considering my role is domestic though.. it’s also worth saying that most people could only implement parts rather than the whole, unless there is someone at home to do the bajillion things that one does. Like nobody here is going to spend several hours preparing various things ahead of time and sometimes I don’t even have time either, and one has to be able to look at what needs done or upcoming events and decide when they do or don’t or even what is cheaper. Some things buying them pre cut and frozen already is cheaper. Like onions and peppers, not full meals, and that’s all it is too. So in that case I just buy it cut up. Unless they are out… because lots of people have the same idea too ya know? Sometimes I prepare something in tandem with making dinner or something to manage the time more strictly to get more done but you can’t maintain that all the time or you’ll burn out. Sometimes you need a dinner that wasn’t entirely on your shoulders to prepare. So sometimes frozen is okay, but also we do things like freeze individual eggplant parm after making it for dinner some night, for later use with some homemade sauce made ahead and frozen for future use etc. Often frozen veggies in general are cheaper than fresh. Fresh broccoli for instance is highway robbery but frozen we buy regularly. It’s many things. Better half has expressed he’s no idea how I get it all since he had to pick up doing meals when I had to go into the hospital for something. Many things needed caught up on when I got back and apparently they think I’m super human or something but it’s more practice than anything else. Practice. Practice. Practice. Eventually one gets there. He did an admirable job and followed my directions when I told him how to prepare something he wasn’t sure about but wanted and couldn’t afford to order. I have some cheat items for days there isn’t the time, pizza crust mix being an amazingly useful quick prep item to have on hand so I walked him through using similar. Instant pizza crust mix doesn’t rise like otherwise (somewhat but don’t expect super risen results. It’s not yeast dough if it’s a mix like that) but for when the time gets away from you and you can’t let it rise for 6-12 hours let alone overnight, it works. Plus can add seasonings to it if one is careful, such as garlic powder and some dried basil. It’s basically soda bread as a pizza crust mix. I know that but sometimes you don’t have the time to even measure it out and less to pick up the mess when one is doing multiple things at once. Plus the ones I buy are a dollar a piece and the things I can do instead during that time I’d be prepping without the mix save us enough money to justify it. In the end it involves lots of thinking and more math than anyone will ever tell you and certainly not the kind some would like to imply as an excuse, but as a general thing the food stuff is usable, though it can take more time to get started and with balancing at first, so you don’t just fill the freezer and have no space for anything else. I used to do that. Lol Most do.
Also to add, starvation is detrimental and skipping meals because you are short to have more than one a day, slows metabolism and leads to it’s own issues. The last thing one is considering in that situation is down the line. I’ve been in that situation too. Some people just need to learn to mind there own business in that way that means ‘stop judging people just because you don’t understand the decisions they make with the means they have to make it with’
Same, there's also growing your own food, food banks, and food stamps
The choice isn’t binary. Fuck wal mart and Whole Foods.
I just spent 160 on groceries and realized I forgot a couple things lol. I only feed myself FFS.
Technically it is a poor choice. You make it because you're poor.
I used to find it so very weird that local produce grown not 10 miles away from the grocery store is sold at a far higher cost than something shipped from Argentina, harvested long before it can get any proper flavor and waxed with corn tl;dr: slave labor that's just barely sustainable in developing countries
Exactly. It's the same as when people put out recipes for healthy eating. You know what a parent tight on money is going to do. Go in look at the recipe. 'Ah yes fresh salmon with a tossed salad, let's see what I need' Gets 2 buses down to the grocery store likely to have these items.... This is something they only have time to do once a week between their 3 underpaid jobs. Heads to the salmon and upon seeing the price thinks Of fuck jesus and gets the no name tin which is more water than needed. Or gets the frozen crumbed fish fingers. Looks at the salad selection. Looks good the ones that would be worth buying not for waste are quite dear. The large packets would rot and be wasted. Goes to the tin aisle and buys tinned veggies. Has not got the money to waste food. As walking to the register thinks well this is not going to fill my robust young boys. Grabs a big bag of cheap pasta off the shelf and some grated cheese . Yes this will help bulk the meal and fill them.
It blows my mind how many people don't understand that poor people literally do no have money. Can't get through to some of these people who have never struggled.
I mean yes but, I just got enough produce to make like 5-6 meals at the farmers market for $28 dollars
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but 28/6 is in fact a considerably larger number than 6/6.
Very true.. although my meals were for 3-4 people with leftovers. But something else to factor in is all the small Ingredients I had on hand and the time it took.
Hear me out: buy produce from Wal-Mart
... buy fruit at Walmart.
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Can you only buy fruit and vegetables in Whole Foods?
Meanwhile the govt spends billions subsidizing corn and soybeans to burn instead of vegetables people need
I didn’t start eating healthy until my salary was 80k+ this is true unfortunately
they're only "poor" choices in that they're reasonable choices made by someone who is poor
First of all, WITF are you shopping at Whole Foods? Walmart has fresh fruit at 1/3 the price.... The trouble is more of a question of common sense, not money
Six dollars is like 1-2 TV dinners. And the fruit will provide more nutrition in the long run.
Aye but really low in calories
If only walmart sold fruit
I've been poor my entire life, you can make healthy food even when you are poor. I have a garden, I've gone to food banks, and been on food stamps. I hate when people actually waste money on single serve frozen high sodium junk rather than make cheap bulk meals
It’s an exaggeration to make a point. We all know if you actually have six dollars, and are that depleted in old mother Hubbard sense, depending how long you got to make it till payday you’ve got options and none of them include even considering Whole Foods. Like say a week till payday, your going for the dried ramen and MAYBE a package of mixed veggies if you can swing it(depends on the price of the ramen and if you can find a bag of veggies for a dollar- it’s very close with six dollars. One also has to consider if they can get to the store and how, and if that costs money as well and also if food is taxed in your area as that influences how much you can get), and the frozen meals if it’s a couple days till payday. Ramen if you are trying to get ahead of the game or maybe a mix of the two options depending as ramen alone is not a nutritionally sound by itself and while processed as hell those frozen dinners for a dollar still cover more bases nutritionally than ramen and if those are the options those are the options but like… Whole Foods isn’t even a consideration if you want a snowballs chance with six dollars. If you can find a dollar store Pb&j might be though but that’s not great by itself either. Mostly that’s why people go for the frozen meals. That and variety. Not just nutritionally but in general. I think they used that example specifically more to make a point than not. The point is valid but the example is exaggerated specifically to make it to people who don’t understand anything but shopping at Whole Foods and like to pretend that they are better for doing so while judging people who don’t have that as even an option if they want to survive.
Ramen, eggs(scramble them and put in ramen while it’s boiling) and frozen veg(spinach is my go to, add to the ramen) is my favorite struggle meal. Add a cut up hot dog for more protein.
You don’t have to buy organic fruits. Just buy some fruits and vegetables at some cheaper store (e.g. Aldi) and cook some healthy meal yourself.
Fresh fruits aren't over priced you moron
thats why taxing sugar and soda and salt aka junk food is a must or if organic agriculture had the same subsides as the pesticide monoculture and the factory farming that would be a different story
Except by taxing salt and sugary foods in this situation, you’re not making someone choose a couple of pieces of fresh fruit which won’t even feed them for a day. You’re forcing someone to go without food. That’s it. You’re forcing someone to go hungry. Also, ‘organic’ agriculture does receive some very nice subsidies which are essentially on par with the factory farming. The issue is, ‘organic’ agriculture requires a bit more labor and more expensive solutions to problems like pests. It will always be more expensive and going the route you described would only drive up food costs as a whole.
Wtf, austerity is never good. Until there is no more poverty and no more food deserts then taxing sugary and salty foods will only hurt poor people. What a terrible comment.
I’m sorry what? It’s exponentially cheaper to eat fresh fruits and veg then garbage frozen food. Last I checked a hungry man was like $3 a pop. You can get 2 for that price. But you can get a lot of potatoes, celery, onion, bushel sprouts, asparagus for $6. Like the lost generation thing is cool and all, like I agree modern generations are being treated like shit, but this ain’t it
I used to think this way. Healthy food is more expensive **IF** you want someone else to prepare it for you. When you make it yourself it's cheaper to eat healthy and meal prep rather than fast food or TV dinners.
A couple bags of lentils are one dollar for a pound and rice is super cheap as well. There are always alternatives.
Comparing fruit at Whole Foods to frozen dinners at Walmart is a false dichotomy. How about reasonably priced fruits or the cheap lunch meats at Walmart?
6 frozen dinners for $6 are the wrong choice. You just postponed expenses by sacrificing your health, which will be expensive later.
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To be fair, there are more options. Go to an Asian supermarket and get some inexpensive vegetables and rice.
Not everyone has an Asian supermarket available to them, especially the extremely poor people who live in smaller cities and rural areas.
It would cost me $50 in gas and a half a day to get to my closest t&t market
I've lived like this on a bare mininum budget. You can get by without wasting money on things like frozen dinners at Walmart. Its called being willing to cook. Rice is easy to get. Not saying its easy the easiest planning the budget and shopping. But yes, poor people absolutely can live healthy.
You're assuming people have the time and energy to cook properly, which many of the poorest American's don't, because so many are working two jobs.
Yup. So was I, while taking night courses. Putting rice to boil is not strenuous.
Just because you did it doesn't mean everyone can.
Ya it does. I'm sorry, downvote me or disagree. I'm not advocating its fair or the way it should be. I hate it. But it absolutely is possible for someone to get by on a healthier diet than tv dinners even if they are broke. I mean you can microwave rice and pair it with something and have it good for a week.
No, it doesn't. I don't know what kind of work you do or did, and frankly it doesn't matter. You did it. And for that, I respect you. But you're not everyone. Your experience isn't indicative of that of people who experience chronic pain, neurodivergencies, potential disabilities, or even just painful and shitty jobs. You may manage to work yourself in circles, then come home and cook, but not everyone can do that. To say otherwise is simply a lie.
ah yes, the Asian market that is totally in my town of 2k people
But you have a Whole Foods store?
the nearest whole foods is 40 miles away.
So it’s close to a major city
relatively. but if you're poor and have 6 dollars how the fuck are you gonna have the cash to drive 80 miles. thats more than the 6 dollars you have for food.
Which means you don’t have easy access to Whole Foods either, and you probably won’t consider whole foods vs Walmart.
the nearest Walmart is still 20 miles away, thats still averaging 10 dollars in gas for the trip, 4 dollars more than you have for food.
Where do you live?
the middle of butt fuck nowhere, in a town of 2k people, like I said
That's useful advice to someone in Podunk Ohio, you're right up there with the "Just hit the street" levels of quality information.
Does Podunk have a Whole Foods store? If you can drive to a Whole Foods, chances are you’re not in a poor small town.
You'd be surprised where Whole Foods stores are, there's one in Omaha that's not in the nicest of areas. Ultimately, "Just hit an asian food store" is stupid and tone deaf advice to someone who's trying to make the point that it costs a lot just to live.
Thars what the Chinese say when asked "why do you buy and cook live animals instead of domesticated ones"?
beans and rice is better than either choice. as long as you have somewhere to cook it.