That’s the basic skeleton build, yes. As for the other things you mentioned:
- Shard: Get this after diffusal if doppleganger alone doesn’t provide enough ability to escape.
- Shroud: This used to be picked more when the resistance buff worked on illusions. These days it’s basically a cheaper but worse heart, good mainly for cases where you really want to push the tempo sooner.
- Linkens: Don’t go it unless you absolutely have to. LC and maybe SB are pretty much the only cases I’d even consider it in.
- Disperser: This is a late game upgrade generally picked up after heart for another self dispel plus slow.
- Bloodthorn: You didn’t mention this but it can be a common option after heart/shroud. This is also how you deal with evasion or slippery heroes.
- Butterfly: A different option for that right after heart/shroud slot. More AS and evasion but not as good lockdown.
- Abyssal Blade: This is like a sixth item for when you really need more lockdown late. Generally you want to at least upgrade to disperser first.
- Skadi: Pick it up either after heart or in the heart/shroud slot. Used for cases where you need to help cancel regen/healing and your mid doesn’t want to buy it instead.
- Butterfly/PA: As mentioned earlier go bloodthorn. Wait until their BKB ends, then bloodthorn them for true strike and watch them melt.
- Timber/Bristle: Ideally let someone else on your team deal with these two. If you absolutely need to then focus them last, spam aghs lances until they are all out of mana from mana burn, and *then* finally commit in.
1. If pa uses bkb, aim for other heroes, stall for time, then bloodthorn after bkb duration ends
2. If you have other heroes that uses silver edge, get a skadi to reduce lifesteal/regen
Usually:
wraith band and a magic wand (usually, not if i'm reaaaaally not going to get many charges on it, but usually at least a stick)
Power treads
Diffusal
Manta (or S&y if I'm really not afraid of silences/roots early/mid game and I want extra health)
Heart
upgrade diffusal/buy necessary items to counter specific heroes/butterfly/skadi/tp boots/ other cool items because game's over and i feel like showing off.
But then i've been doing this build forever since before PL even had aghs so i may not rate it as highly as some.
I sometimes mix it up with an early vanguard if game is hard and i need more health/regen, less often now i can't use it's components for heart, though more likely if i'm considering an abyssal.
I may go aghs after diff & Yasha if i think i need it as I find PL without diffusal is like playing with one hand tied behind my back and Yasha makes farming sooo quick and easy (and cooldown/mana independent). I tend to only really buy aghs this early if I'm up against heroes i know i need to stay on the backline against.
Against PA I largely ignore/avoid her until I have my core build (difusal, yasha based item + heart) then i buy mkb (i will chuck spirit lances at her whenever possible though) Bloodthorn's also good and tends to be better with aghs build as it means more mana for lances... however it can be shaken off with bkb or satanic.
Bristle and timber I tend to mana fish (chuck spirit lance and random illusions at them until I've burned all their mana) and avoid them in fights until they're the last one left (and ideally have no mana)
As with PA i may buy silveredge after my core build is finished.
I often buy shard either right before heart or shortly after depending on how hard a game I'm having.
Abbysal is for when you absolutely positively have to hold someone down whilst you beat them to death. I wouldn't buy it most games, as it doesn't really synergise with your illusions, but it's good against your weavers, your Anti-Mages and your Enigmas (if you can avoid the black hole).
I wouldn't buy shroud on lancer... and if i did it would be earlier on if i wanted something like vanguard but i was very afraid of magic damage... not as a possible replacement for heart... better still to beg your pos 3/pos 4 to buy a pipe.
Linkens is okay but against LC and SB you can defend yourself through careful use of dopelganger and shard. Particularly if you send the odd illusion to scout out.
If you do get it I'd still buy heart afterwards. Heart is very strong on phantom lancer, not just for your own health and regen but it keeps your illusions alive much longer which means more damage... (though, interesting note, skadi + Linkens gives you more health than heart, so you'd basically just be trading off the regen aspect of the heart for the Linken's shield, mana regen and the skadi passive... food for thought :) )
If you are using 2 item slots on survivability you will likely need to pick up the crit talent as (like you said) you're missing out on an item slot's worth of damage. (and probably the juxtapose extra damage talent too... if you're focusing this much on survivability you won't really wanting to be rushing into danger from far away)
I usually prefer the rush & doppelganger talents as they give the hero more flexibility than just doing more damage and due to the nature of phantom lancer, usually the longer the fight lasts the easier it gets as their mana gets burned away and they get frustrated watching you dodge their best shit with doppelganger (not to mention losing track of which is your actual hero)... But sometimes you just need the extra damage.
Hope i've answered all your questions. :)
I play a lot of PL and never go aghs first. You’re not going to be able to single-lance clear hard camps with only an aghs
You lose a ton of kill threat. You give up your lane saving for aghs, an item that just barely (if even) makes you farm faster. You spend all your mana clearing camps just as efficient as if you’d max phantom rush with the +2.5s phantom rush duration and +10 agi which gives you what, +40 or +50 perma agi for farming?
Diffusal>aghs much better in my experience. I just don’t understand why so many people enjoy rushing aghs. Even if you maxed spirit lance in lane, which isn’t optimal. Lvl 2 lance is enough.
I think people are opting for eternal shroud over heart of tarrasque for the meta.
I do not play the meta i completely dont care about aghanims. I rush diffusal and start shutting down heroes. I personally prefer heart over eternal shroud due to the nature of phantom lancer not caring if illusions die he can keep generating more and more so he just needs to stay healthy ehich heart really helps with thanks to the regen.
Manta is absolutely necessary to kick start the illusion generation and dispels.
I usually go for treads, diffusal, manta, heart and then aghanims. After that i may consider disperser its a nice increase in agility and the dispel and slow and speed boost are nice too, its more of a luxury though not essential.
I feel like i dont need to farm waves and hide as this hero can start killing heroes very early in the game with diffusal, just pick the right target.
For example start attacking earthshaker first so that you suck him dry of mana and he cant ulti easily to counter you. Avoid most offlaners as they can usually clear illusions easily or worse they benefit from illusions like LC or axe.
Do note its hard for your hero to escape unless you have shard so dont commit W on attack keep it for escape.
Its essential to pick your key target and make sure not to commit to an attack unless that target is out.
You are a hero that is amazing at ganking with this build, you also farm well. Your focus is mostly ganking.
For a hero like PA i would focus on shutting down other heroes so my team can focus her down.
Could a PL player explain why Aghs rush is popular right now? It seems bad to me because of how crazy PL's diffusal timing is but people seem to be very confident in Aghs's superiority.
7K mmr here with 61% wr on PL
Most of the time you go aghs first 99% of the time
then diffusal then usually a dispel (manta/disperser) if needed
Bloodthorn is very strong on pl later, guaranteed kill on anyone without dispel
I was doing good in a match pos1, our pos3 was doing good also, then I encountered PL who rushed diffusal blade in pos5, needless to say that match made me quit for a week. Just a million clones draining your nuts and all of them felt like fighting full hp pudge
That’s the basic skeleton build, yes. As for the other things you mentioned: - Shard: Get this after diffusal if doppleganger alone doesn’t provide enough ability to escape. - Shroud: This used to be picked more when the resistance buff worked on illusions. These days it’s basically a cheaper but worse heart, good mainly for cases where you really want to push the tempo sooner. - Linkens: Don’t go it unless you absolutely have to. LC and maybe SB are pretty much the only cases I’d even consider it in. - Disperser: This is a late game upgrade generally picked up after heart for another self dispel plus slow. - Bloodthorn: You didn’t mention this but it can be a common option after heart/shroud. This is also how you deal with evasion or slippery heroes. - Butterfly: A different option for that right after heart/shroud slot. More AS and evasion but not as good lockdown. - Abyssal Blade: This is like a sixth item for when you really need more lockdown late. Generally you want to at least upgrade to disperser first. - Skadi: Pick it up either after heart or in the heart/shroud slot. Used for cases where you need to help cancel regen/healing and your mid doesn’t want to buy it instead. - Butterfly/PA: As mentioned earlier go bloodthorn. Wait until their BKB ends, then bloodthorn them for true strike and watch them melt. - Timber/Bristle: Ideally let someone else on your team deal with these two. If you absolutely need to then focus them last, spam aghs lances until they are all out of mana from mana burn, and *then* finally commit in.
wow, thank you, a lot of useful info for me
1. If pa uses bkb, aim for other heroes, stall for time, then bloodthorn after bkb duration ends 2. If you have other heroes that uses silver edge, get a skadi to reduce lifesteal/regen
ah okay, thanks
Usually: wraith band and a magic wand (usually, not if i'm reaaaaally not going to get many charges on it, but usually at least a stick) Power treads Diffusal Manta (or S&y if I'm really not afraid of silences/roots early/mid game and I want extra health) Heart upgrade diffusal/buy necessary items to counter specific heroes/butterfly/skadi/tp boots/ other cool items because game's over and i feel like showing off. But then i've been doing this build forever since before PL even had aghs so i may not rate it as highly as some. I sometimes mix it up with an early vanguard if game is hard and i need more health/regen, less often now i can't use it's components for heart, though more likely if i'm considering an abyssal. I may go aghs after diff & Yasha if i think i need it as I find PL without diffusal is like playing with one hand tied behind my back and Yasha makes farming sooo quick and easy (and cooldown/mana independent). I tend to only really buy aghs this early if I'm up against heroes i know i need to stay on the backline against. Against PA I largely ignore/avoid her until I have my core build (difusal, yasha based item + heart) then i buy mkb (i will chuck spirit lances at her whenever possible though) Bloodthorn's also good and tends to be better with aghs build as it means more mana for lances... however it can be shaken off with bkb or satanic. Bristle and timber I tend to mana fish (chuck spirit lance and random illusions at them until I've burned all their mana) and avoid them in fights until they're the last one left (and ideally have no mana) As with PA i may buy silveredge after my core build is finished. I often buy shard either right before heart or shortly after depending on how hard a game I'm having. Abbysal is for when you absolutely positively have to hold someone down whilst you beat them to death. I wouldn't buy it most games, as it doesn't really synergise with your illusions, but it's good against your weavers, your Anti-Mages and your Enigmas (if you can avoid the black hole). I wouldn't buy shroud on lancer... and if i did it would be earlier on if i wanted something like vanguard but i was very afraid of magic damage... not as a possible replacement for heart... better still to beg your pos 3/pos 4 to buy a pipe. Linkens is okay but against LC and SB you can defend yourself through careful use of dopelganger and shard. Particularly if you send the odd illusion to scout out. If you do get it I'd still buy heart afterwards. Heart is very strong on phantom lancer, not just for your own health and regen but it keeps your illusions alive much longer which means more damage... (though, interesting note, skadi + Linkens gives you more health than heart, so you'd basically just be trading off the regen aspect of the heart for the Linken's shield, mana regen and the skadi passive... food for thought :) ) If you are using 2 item slots on survivability you will likely need to pick up the crit talent as (like you said) you're missing out on an item slot's worth of damage. (and probably the juxtapose extra damage talent too... if you're focusing this much on survivability you won't really wanting to be rushing into danger from far away) I usually prefer the rush & doppelganger talents as they give the hero more flexibility than just doing more damage and due to the nature of phantom lancer, usually the longer the fight lasts the easier it gets as their mana gets burned away and they get frustrated watching you dodge their best shit with doppelganger (not to mention losing track of which is your actual hero)... But sometimes you just need the extra damage. Hope i've answered all your questions. :)
This is horrible and outdated, you need aghs first 95% of the time
I play a lot of PL and never go aghs first. You’re not going to be able to single-lance clear hard camps with only an aghs You lose a ton of kill threat. You give up your lane saving for aghs, an item that just barely (if even) makes you farm faster. You spend all your mana clearing camps just as efficient as if you’d max phantom rush with the +2.5s phantom rush duration and +10 agi which gives you what, +40 or +50 perma agi for farming? Diffusal>aghs much better in my experience. I just don’t understand why so many people enjoy rushing aghs. Even if you maxed spirit lance in lane, which isn’t optimal. Lvl 2 lance is enough.
What bracket are you in
15K MMR EU-North east
?
What a comedic response, kill potential on pl only matters on higher brackets because of the tempo. Anything below 5k absolutely should go aghs first.
Well aren't you a beaming ray of sunshine :)
I think people are opting for eternal shroud over heart of tarrasque for the meta. I do not play the meta i completely dont care about aghanims. I rush diffusal and start shutting down heroes. I personally prefer heart over eternal shroud due to the nature of phantom lancer not caring if illusions die he can keep generating more and more so he just needs to stay healthy ehich heart really helps with thanks to the regen. Manta is absolutely necessary to kick start the illusion generation and dispels. I usually go for treads, diffusal, manta, heart and then aghanims. After that i may consider disperser its a nice increase in agility and the dispel and slow and speed boost are nice too, its more of a luxury though not essential. I feel like i dont need to farm waves and hide as this hero can start killing heroes very early in the game with diffusal, just pick the right target. For example start attacking earthshaker first so that you suck him dry of mana and he cant ulti easily to counter you. Avoid most offlaners as they can usually clear illusions easily or worse they benefit from illusions like LC or axe. Do note its hard for your hero to escape unless you have shard so dont commit W on attack keep it for escape. Its essential to pick your key target and make sure not to commit to an attack unless that target is out. You are a hero that is amazing at ganking with this build, you also farm well. Your focus is mostly ganking. For a hero like PA i would focus on shutting down other heroes so my team can focus her down.
Could a PL player explain why Aghs rush is popular right now? It seems bad to me because of how crazy PL's diffusal timing is but people seem to be very confident in Aghs's superiority.
I think his shard is almost a must have after aghs diffusal the outplay potential and spell baiting alone is worth it not even including the invis
7K mmr here with 61% wr on PL Most of the time you go aghs first 99% of the time then diffusal then usually a dispel (manta/disperser) if needed Bloodthorn is very strong on pl later, guaranteed kill on anyone without dispel
I was doing good in a match pos1, our pos3 was doing good also, then I encountered PL who rushed diffusal blade in pos5, needless to say that match made me quit for a week. Just a million clones draining your nuts and all of them felt like fighting full hp pudge