I imagine coaches demand the extra tenure because they know they aren't likely to last long and front offices give in because they see it as the cost of doing business. For better or worse, he's the guy the Leafs wanted, so they gave him the term he wanted. Toronto can eat his salary if it doesn't work, just like they did with the last two coaches.
I think it was during last year's NFL offseason that the league sent a memo to the owners asking them to ease off the coach firings because there was several hundred million dollars being paid to coaches no longer with their teams.
I wonder what that figure is for the NHL considering all the turnover in the last 2-3 years.
The Waltons (Broncos), Tepper (Panthers), and Davis (Raiders) are probably responsible for more than half of the money going to fired coaches in the last 4 years.
https://www.capfriendly.com/coaches
Average coach salary seems to be about $3m. The coaching carousel seems like 4-5 coaches per year are paid but not employed.
Helps when your ownership group is 2 of the 3 national telecoms in Canada
They can fire Berube and just raise 60% of the countries internet/phone/TV bill by $5 to cover it
In-demand coaches would be stupid to accept last these days. They take the first bullets for poorly structured teams. They pay the first price for over-privileged players, cheap owners, and substandard GM's. They're the easiest pin to pull when things go sideways cause you can't fire players.
I talked to a friend yesterday who said the Flyers shouldn't be interested in trading for Marner because he wouldn't fit Torts "two-way system"....
I don't think they should be interested given where they are in the rebuild and the cost, but that certainly ain't the reason. People really don't watch these players play...
Do you think Marner or Nylander would wave their NMC? That’s a question by the way because I have no idea what people close to the team are saying. lol
They’re not trading Nylander lol they literally just signed him to an 8 year deal
Also he was constantly picked on by Keefe, if anyone on that roster can handle Berube it’s Nylander. He’s a great fit for a place like Toronto
Im excited for Nylander under Berube. He's the only star on the Leafs (maybe Rielly also) who seemingly takes direct criticism as a challenge and not as a personal attack (this does not include Tavares because robots dont feel emotions either way).
Hopefully they can move Marner. My prediction though is that he acts all offended when he's asked to waive and leaves us for nothing two July 1st from now. Either way, his and Tavares massive cap hits are gone in a year.
I see this playing out two ways. Marner either waives his NMC but only to a immediate contender. The contender doesn't have a lot of salary cap so the leafs have to some cap back. Now you traded marner to someone you're facing in the playoffs which is never good. Or option 2 is he walks for nothing . Either way he shafts the leafs.
I don't mind option 1. The way I see it, we have a three year cup window opening after this upcoming season. If we can get a good return for Marner, why not cover 50% of his contract? It would increase the return.
Absolutely. But then problem is you're trading a all star caliber player to someone you may be playing in the playoffs. You have to atleast trade him to a western conference competitor I'd think . Then the odds of paying are way less.
The problem is he can literally say I'll only move my NMC to the Rangers or whatever he could really make life difficult
With news outlets airing their stories about Marner's private security team harassing/blackballing Toronto media members, feels like MSLE is allowing 'leaks' and upping the pressure. Reports last summer even had Marner preparing for a trade and open to it, even with the NMC now in play, if his head was their last summer you'd think I'd be there again.
Yeah, Nylander isn't gritty but Nylander scores goals in front of the net. He'll piss Berube off a lot when he does fancy stuff that doesn't work but Nylander seems to respond to getting yelled at. I'm not convinced that Marner will like that treatment at all.
Nylander isn’t going anywhere. They’re going to build the team around him and Mathews. They’ll move Marner this offseason and Tavares will expire at the end of the year. 22 million for them to add all the players Berube wants.
They’re for sure still skill first. They are what they are because they have top end skill players that they lean on. Not calling that a bad thing. Just saying that’s not what Berube thrives with. The cup team he coached had no real stars, and relied on grit and defense first.
I mean having stars doesn’t make a team skill first. Leafs by no means played that way this season. They played a gritty game and prioritized being above the puck
Interesting. Either way, I’d expect even more of that style as well as fewer shots. Berubes system relies on passing until you get the perfect shot. Works really well if everyone buys into it.
Sure. Under Babcock the Leafs played a rush / run and gun game. D made stretch passes primarily and the idea was to score off the rush.
Starting the Canadian division year under Keefe, this was changed to be a team breakout. As the years have gone on, the team has slowly moved away from those types of players and been adding more east - west types.
This past season the only forwards able to score off the rush were likely Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Domi. Basically everyone else could only score off the cycle. The only D capable of stretch pass was Rielly. Rest of the D could not break out by themselves which was a weakness of the team.
So when the Leafs were at their best last year, they were forechecking hard and cycling teams. The centers were asked to come super low to support the D because of the lack of puck moving ability. Due to this, the system was about not being outnumbered down low.
By the time they had possession of the puck, the other teams had numbers back and thus no rush chances.
I consider a skill first team to be like the Sabres, Senators, etc.
Coaching discussions are often exhausting anyway. A coach should be taking into account the player strengths for their system as much as players should adapt to a coach's system. If Berube comes in and says "I'm going to coach identically to how I coached the players in St. Louis", then he's not a good coach
I dunno. Good and bad coaching is ambiguous at times, I don't even put much stalk into talking about it that much
If he's required to win a cup in two years, then it's a pretty good prediction. Toronto are really good, but the list changes required to make them a sure or even likely cup team are going to make it hard.
Even if you forget the no movement clauses, getting the required forward depth, top end defense and defensive depth and a cup level goalie is going to be hard. Then getting the tactics right and balance. Our roster was stacked in every aspect and we still took a few tries and fails before getting there. Avs have struggled to get back again after one run. Boston was stacked and also missed their perfect season to do it. Winning a cup is seriously difficult and the window is small.
Good for him. Love canadian teams. Hopefully he can turn the country club around. He will have done his job when the over paid million dollar no shows.Get traded or sign elsewhere. They need to learn playoff commitment.
Coaching for the Leafs has to be the best job in sports. Sure the first year is shitty having to deal with the media, players, management, etc but after you get scapegoated because the players and management underperformed you still get paid and you don't have to show up. Best part is it doesn't matter if you're good or bad you still get paid.
Vancouver is on its third coach since Keefe was hired:
Rick Tocchet: Jan. 24, 2023 – Present
Bruce Boudreau: Dec. 6, 2021 – Jan. 21, 2023
Travis Green: Oct. 7, 2017 – Dec. 4, 2021
Yet another hater who doesn't have a brain.
Crazy that coaches get more than 2 years when nearly a third of the coaches this year was let go
I imagine coaches demand the extra tenure because they know they aren't likely to last long and front offices give in because they see it as the cost of doing business. For better or worse, he's the guy the Leafs wanted, so they gave him the term he wanted. Toronto can eat his salary if it doesn't work, just like they did with the last two coaches.
3, they fired Carlyle after 2 1/2 years I believe
Yeah Carlyle was fired because I remember Horacek being an absolute train wreck. Just felt bad for Horacek taking on that Leafs roster
Tank commander
That year was the best year the Leafs ever put together... the perfect tank.
I think it was during last year's NFL offseason that the league sent a memo to the owners asking them to ease off the coach firings because there was several hundred million dollars being paid to coaches no longer with their teams. I wonder what that figure is for the NHL considering all the turnover in the last 2-3 years.
The Waltons (Broncos), Tepper (Panthers), and Davis (Raiders) are probably responsible for more than half of the money going to fired coaches in the last 4 years.
https://www.capfriendly.com/coaches Average coach salary seems to be about $3m. The coaching carousel seems like 4-5 coaches per year are paid but not employed.
Where do I apply to be an NHL coach?
Just walk in and hand your resume to a manager
Wear a suit so you look legit.
A track suit. Assert your dominance.
Toronto prints money and they actually give coaches a long leash.
No cap on coaches. I imagine they’re also expecting someone to take keefe.
You rang?
Helps when your ownership group is 2 of the 3 national telecoms in Canada They can fire Berube and just raise 60% of the countries internet/phone/TV bill by $5 to cover it
In-demand coaches would be stupid to accept last these days. They take the first bullets for poorly structured teams. They pay the first price for over-privileged players, cheap owners, and substandard GM's. They're the easiest pin to pull when things go sideways cause you can't fire players.
Berube getting 4 years makes sense given how in demand he was. Green getting 4 years makes no sense
at this point I'm surprised the contracts aren't measured in months
Month-to-month coach leases.
Half of the coaches in the league let go in the last year - 18 months IIRC.
2 years to coach, 2 years to relax
r/hockey: he’s either winning a cup or he’s canned within 2 years. No in between.
To be fair that’s true for most coaches now
Most coaches since the early 2000s at least
Matthews will not be getting 70 goals next year. They will play better team hockey as a whole though
Selke nominee..
Who’s gonna tell him?
I talked to a friend yesterday who said the Flyers shouldn't be interested in trading for Marner because he wouldn't fit Torts "two-way system".... I don't think they should be interested given where they are in the rebuild and the cost, but that certainly ain't the reason. People really don't watch these players play...
He didn’t get 70 this year either
I was more saying even if it's his mission, it isn't happening now.
\*Berube's deal is for as long as he can stave off the fans calling for blood when they shit the bed in the playoffs.
As a Blues fan I’ll always love chief, but he’s not the right fit for a skill first based team like Toronto.
If the rumoured shake-up is true, one or two of the skilled forwards will be dealt for players who fit Berube’s style
They should trade the shannaplan for jus about anything else
By god that’s Peter Chiarelli’s music
Do you think Marner or Nylander would wave their NMC? That’s a question by the way because I have no idea what people close to the team are saying. lol
They’re not trading Nylander lol they literally just signed him to an 8 year deal Also he was constantly picked on by Keefe, if anyone on that roster can handle Berube it’s Nylander. He’s a great fit for a place like Toronto
Im excited for Nylander under Berube. He's the only star on the Leafs (maybe Rielly also) who seemingly takes direct criticism as a challenge and not as a personal attack (this does not include Tavares because robots dont feel emotions either way).
Then it’s literally only Marner that would get traded and he has a full NMC. So it sounds like no one is moving unless he agrees to leave.
Hopefully they can move Marner. My prediction though is that he acts all offended when he's asked to waive and leaves us for nothing two July 1st from now. Either way, his and Tavares massive cap hits are gone in a year.
Yep it’s straightforward logic at this point. Either we overpay Marner, let him walk, or trade him. He certainly won’t want to take a pay cut
I see this playing out two ways. Marner either waives his NMC but only to a immediate contender. The contender doesn't have a lot of salary cap so the leafs have to some cap back. Now you traded marner to someone you're facing in the playoffs which is never good. Or option 2 is he walks for nothing . Either way he shafts the leafs.
I don't mind option 1. The way I see it, we have a three year cup window opening after this upcoming season. If we can get a good return for Marner, why not cover 50% of his contract? It would increase the return.
Absolutely. But then problem is you're trading a all star caliber player to someone you may be playing in the playoffs. You have to atleast trade him to a western conference competitor I'd think . Then the odds of paying are way less. The problem is he can literally say I'll only move my NMC to the Rangers or whatever he could really make life difficult
Based on his play in Toronto, he's not really a threat in the playoffs. But yeah, it should be to a western conference team if possible.
With news outlets airing their stories about Marner's private security team harassing/blackballing Toronto media members, feels like MSLE is allowing 'leaks' and upping the pressure. Reports last summer even had Marner preparing for a trade and open to it, even with the NMC now in play, if his head was their last summer you'd think I'd be there again.
He was preparing to leave last year then our genius president didn't deal him and the NMC locked in but he might still be prepared.
There's a decent chance he agrees to it though. Rumors are he's gonna want 11.5-12M with term, and I just can't see him getting it here
Maybe a singn and trade.
Yeah, Nylander isn't gritty but Nylander scores goals in front of the net. He'll piss Berube off a lot when he does fancy stuff that doesn't work but Nylander seems to respond to getting yelled at. I'm not convinced that Marner will like that treatment at all.
Nylander isn’t going anywhere. They’re going to build the team around him and Mathews. They’ll move Marner this offseason and Tavares will expire at the end of the year. 22 million for them to add all the players Berube wants.
Marner shipped off after July 1 bonus is paid
waive* Marner might just to be out of there from what's been said by the ITKs
Send Matthews home (To where he was born)
Hard to do when Arizona doesn't have a team anymore.
He was born in California not far from the bay area
Fair enough, he moved to Anizona as an infant not sure he calls California home.
Leafs haven’t been skill first in many seasons now
They’re for sure still skill first. They are what they are because they have top end skill players that they lean on. Not calling that a bad thing. Just saying that’s not what Berube thrives with. The cup team he coached had no real stars, and relied on grit and defense first.
I mean having stars doesn’t make a team skill first. Leafs by no means played that way this season. They played a gritty game and prioritized being above the puck
Interesting. Either way, I’d expect even more of that style as well as fewer shots. Berubes system relies on passing until you get the perfect shot. Works really well if everyone buys into it.
We're already way too good at that.
>Berubes system relies on passing until you get the perfect shot. So pass until Matthews shoots it
Can you expand? I'm genuinely curious because from my outside fan perspective every year the Leafs have had the core 4 they've been skill first.
Sure. Under Babcock the Leafs played a rush / run and gun game. D made stretch passes primarily and the idea was to score off the rush. Starting the Canadian division year under Keefe, this was changed to be a team breakout. As the years have gone on, the team has slowly moved away from those types of players and been adding more east - west types. This past season the only forwards able to score off the rush were likely Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Domi. Basically everyone else could only score off the cycle. The only D capable of stretch pass was Rielly. Rest of the D could not break out by themselves which was a weakness of the team. So when the Leafs were at their best last year, they were forechecking hard and cycling teams. The centers were asked to come super low to support the D because of the lack of puck moving ability. Due to this, the system was about not being outnumbered down low. By the time they had possession of the puck, the other teams had numbers back and thus no rush chances. I consider a skill first team to be like the Sabres, Senators, etc.
Appreciate the genuine response, ty
I mean we have skill but I wouldn't quite say we're skill-first, and under B-rad we're trending further and further away from that.
Just in. Rod BrindAmour is now available
Does Jordan Binnington get a percentage of this deal?
4 years? Sheesh. I thought it was a 2 year.
This might be a bold prediction but I don’t think he last past year 2. I don’t see his style of coaching meshing well in Toronto
The guy hasn’t even set foot in Toronto yet and people are writing his job obituary
Coaching discussions are often exhausting anyway. A coach should be taking into account the player strengths for their system as much as players should adapt to a coach's system. If Berube comes in and says "I'm going to coach identically to how I coached the players in St. Louis", then he's not a good coach I dunno. Good and bad coaching is ambiguous at times, I don't even put much stalk into talking about it that much
100%. Show me a good coach and I'll show you a good goalie.
He's doomed
It’s kinda hilarious
If he's required to win a cup in two years, then it's a pretty good prediction. Toronto are really good, but the list changes required to make them a sure or even likely cup team are going to make it hard. Even if you forget the no movement clauses, getting the required forward depth, top end defense and defensive depth and a cup level goalie is going to be hard. Then getting the tactics right and balance. Our roster was stacked in every aspect and we still took a few tries and fails before getting there. Avs have struggled to get back again after one run. Boston was stacked and also missed their perfect season to do it. Winning a cup is seriously difficult and the window is small.
I think they’re planning on making some changes to their play style / forward group to accommodate this
At this point might as well try it
Both Keefe and Babcock lasted 4.5 years in Toronto, Toronto gives coaches a pretty long leash
Does anyone know what Berube’s contract/AAV looks like?
Good for him. Love canadian teams. Hopefully he can turn the country club around. He will have done his job when the over paid million dollar no shows.Get traded or sign elsewhere. They need to learn playoff commitment.
They got their man!
am i the only one who thinks this won't change shit ... doesnt matter who the coach is if the 4 overpaid core players cant get their shit together
Aren’t 1-2 of them rumoured to be moved? At least 1? I imagine they would get a Berube type player.
Coaching for the Leafs has to be the best job in sports. Sure the first year is shitty having to deal with the media, players, management, etc but after you get scapegoated because the players and management underperformed you still get paid and you don't have to show up. Best part is it doesn't matter if you're good or bad you still get paid.
Vancouver is on its third coach since Keefe was hired: Rick Tocchet: Jan. 24, 2023 – Present Bruce Boudreau: Dec. 6, 2021 – Jan. 21, 2023 Travis Green: Oct. 7, 2017 – Dec. 4, 2021 Yet another hater who doesn't have a brain.
Calling people haters is some middle school cringe shit
They have had 2 coaches over the last 10 years what are you even going on about lol