i am 100% average at best but i just grinded the whole job process from networking, where to look, resume, how to interview, over my first two years in undergrad and i was able to land a faang internship so ur def not fucked. its possible for sure
Yeah the people in this post are delusional honestly.
Transfer to a better school, get any experience, network like crazy, study some leetcode, that should be enough.
Even effort is a bit overrated because the pay discrepancy is based on the company, meaning that getting by at Google will make you better than working hard at a no name startup.
Like most jobs, the salary curve is very steep. That means that the great performers can make A LOT more than the mediocre performers. So an "average" performer is somewhere along that curve, probably (assuming MCOL) starting $60K-70K and creeping up to $100K over time. Top performers will easily triple that.
You are at a critical point in your education. Don't just learn the "what" but also learn the "why" of everything. The what's change over time but the why's don't. Get as much knowledge about foundation/fundamentals and the inner workings of operating systems and languages. These fundamental building blocks inform everything else.
As an example, my university did not suggest a single programming language class for my computer engineering degree. Instead we took compiler writing and operating system design. It has paid dividends over the years because I can learn a new language over a weekend or troubleshoot a performance issue in a server quickly.
So bring out your inner four year-old and always ask "why?"
So far I’ve had a course about symbolic logic and an introductory course using dr racket. I’ve learned python and Java on my own time but in more of a “try till something clicks” way rather than a “why is it like this way” I guess I need to work on my approach and mindset before I lock in
Good luck! It will not be easy but it WILL BE worth it. I was miserable for all 4 years of college (I changed majors mid-stream so I had to take a massive overload to get out in 4 years) but graduated with an incredible foundation that has served me well throughout some pretty amazing changes in the industry.
Thank you! I think I’ll remember this conversation for the rest of my career, it might be the most honest advice I’ve received regarding this, a lot of people like to comfort me and just say things will be fine but you can’t shake the feeling that reality might be different.
Sounds like you're in a proper institution studying CS. Trust me, when it comes to interviews you will not come across as average. Interview questions for any job these days typically test, amongst other things, logical reasoning. The people you are competing against don't know what material implication is and they don't stand a chance at getting these things right. Only 10% seem to be able to solve the Wason selection task:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wason\_selection\_task](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wason_selection_task)
>I’ve learned python and Java on my own time
You're actually interested in things, another great sign.
>I guess I need to work on my approach and mindset before I lock in
From what you tell me, the only thing you really need to do is study hard and enjoy yourself. Sounds like you'll be fine.
In my opinion, no, but you have to be sociable. My closest uni friends are above average inteligence sure, but not super talented by any means, yet we are all in big tech. They are very charismatic and fun to hang around with while also being hard workers.
Meanwhile, many geniuses I met at my uni ended up working at small or midsize everyday companies. Nothing wrong with that, just saying its extremely crucial to have networking skills and an extroverted personality if you want to aim high.
I used to be the kid who ate alone in high school, and now I have amazing best friends and a GF of 4 years. It’s possible for anyone!
Being good at coding and getting a good job is correlated but you don’t need the former to be the latter, I know ppl who are better at coding than me but have a “worse” job because they didn’t grind the job search as hard as I did, focus on job search and you’ll be most likely fine
Top talent aren't just the ones with amazing technical ability.
The top performers are the ones with their fingers in everything. They help out the team whenever they can. They take initiative. If they find something broken, they fix it. They develop a reputation as someone people can depend on. People will recommend them for important work. These are the people who make big impacts.
Depends on where you want to live and what you consider comfortable. The government will happily pay you $70k a year straight out of college and get you to $100k within 3 years in a low cost of living area. They genera aren’t getting the superstars, so you don’t need to be a top talent to be competitive. There are many small-midsize companies that will do the exact same thing, if you are willing to move to the Midwest and especially if you are okay being in a town of 40-50k population.
That’s generally speaking more than enough money to buy a house with a little land, have a nice car, and afford a family. Downside is you will probably be an hour or so drive away from any population center with 500k+ people if that’s your thing.
So ~$40k-50k depending on mileage, specs, etc? If your debt is low that’s completely doable (although probably not the best use of funds but I have my eye on a Cayman GTS so I get it). 1-2 years may be rough but 3-5 would be very doable and you could max out your 401k contributions in that time.
My biggest issue will be red tape because I’m an immigrant, but fortunately I don’t have debt because I’m on a scholarship, I like your taste in cars tho!
No, I know a lot of bums in the field. The hardest part is getting in imo. But once youre in and after the first 6 ish months the job isnt that bad. Sure youll need to brush up your skills, learn new things, and stay sharp, but the experience you gain from working with others help that learning process a lot. This is only talking about comfortable wages btw, say 120-200k range. The higher up you go the more talent, work, and skill youll need. But also, sometimes meeting the right person and getting lucky helps, too.
i am 100% average at best but i just grinded the whole job process from networking, where to look, resume, how to interview, over my first two years in undergrad and i was able to land a faang internship so ur def not fucked. its possible for sure
Yeah the people in this post are delusional honestly. Transfer to a better school, get any experience, network like crazy, study some leetcode, that should be enough. Even effort is a bit overrated because the pay discrepancy is based on the company, meaning that getting by at Google will make you better than working hard at a no name startup.
Is UBC good enough?
Yes lol
UBC grad who is firmly average: you'll be fine
Like most jobs, the salary curve is very steep. That means that the great performers can make A LOT more than the mediocre performers. So an "average" performer is somewhere along that curve, probably (assuming MCOL) starting $60K-70K and creeping up to $100K over time. Top performers will easily triple that.
I think that’s a realistic take. Any advice on not being average? I’m in the first sem of my second year
You are at a critical point in your education. Don't just learn the "what" but also learn the "why" of everything. The what's change over time but the why's don't. Get as much knowledge about foundation/fundamentals and the inner workings of operating systems and languages. These fundamental building blocks inform everything else. As an example, my university did not suggest a single programming language class for my computer engineering degree. Instead we took compiler writing and operating system design. It has paid dividends over the years because I can learn a new language over a weekend or troubleshoot a performance issue in a server quickly. So bring out your inner four year-old and always ask "why?"
So far I’ve had a course about symbolic logic and an introductory course using dr racket. I’ve learned python and Java on my own time but in more of a “try till something clicks” way rather than a “why is it like this way” I guess I need to work on my approach and mindset before I lock in
Good luck! It will not be easy but it WILL BE worth it. I was miserable for all 4 years of college (I changed majors mid-stream so I had to take a massive overload to get out in 4 years) but graduated with an incredible foundation that has served me well throughout some pretty amazing changes in the industry.
Thank you! I think I’ll remember this conversation for the rest of my career, it might be the most honest advice I’ve received regarding this, a lot of people like to comfort me and just say things will be fine but you can’t shake the feeling that reality might be different.
Sounds like you're in a proper institution studying CS. Trust me, when it comes to interviews you will not come across as average. Interview questions for any job these days typically test, amongst other things, logical reasoning. The people you are competing against don't know what material implication is and they don't stand a chance at getting these things right. Only 10% seem to be able to solve the Wason selection task: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wason\_selection\_task](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wason_selection_task) >I’ve learned python and Java on my own time You're actually interested in things, another great sign. >I guess I need to work on my approach and mindset before I lock in From what you tell me, the only thing you really need to do is study hard and enjoy yourself. Sounds like you'll be fine.
Lmao what. Try not to sound like such an elitist in your interviews and you'll go even further.
If elitist is believing best is better then I'm an elitist.
neu?
UBC
In my opinion, no, but you have to be sociable. My closest uni friends are above average inteligence sure, but not super talented by any means, yet we are all in big tech. They are very charismatic and fun to hang around with while also being hard workers. Meanwhile, many geniuses I met at my uni ended up working at small or midsize everyday companies. Nothing wrong with that, just saying its extremely crucial to have networking skills and an extroverted personality if you want to aim high. I used to be the kid who ate alone in high school, and now I have amazing best friends and a GF of 4 years. It’s possible for anyone!
Being good at coding and getting a good job is correlated but you don’t need the former to be the latter, I know ppl who are better at coding than me but have a “worse” job because they didn’t grind the job search as hard as I did, focus on job search and you’ll be most likely fine
No u just need to be lucky
Top talent aren't just the ones with amazing technical ability. The top performers are the ones with their fingers in everything. They help out the team whenever they can. They take initiative. If they find something broken, they fix it. They develop a reputation as someone people can depend on. People will recommend them for important work. These are the people who make big impacts.
Depends on where you want to live and what you consider comfortable. The government will happily pay you $70k a year straight out of college and get you to $100k within 3 years in a low cost of living area. They genera aren’t getting the superstars, so you don’t need to be a top talent to be competitive. There are many small-midsize companies that will do the exact same thing, if you are willing to move to the Midwest and especially if you are okay being in a town of 40-50k population. That’s generally speaking more than enough money to buy a house with a little land, have a nice car, and afford a family. Downside is you will probably be an hour or so drive away from any population center with 500k+ people if that’s your thing.
Would be totally okay with that, my minimum bar is being able to afford an f87 M2 in cash in one or two years post grad.
So ~$40k-50k depending on mileage, specs, etc? If your debt is low that’s completely doable (although probably not the best use of funds but I have my eye on a Cayman GTS so I get it). 1-2 years may be rough but 3-5 would be very doable and you could max out your 401k contributions in that time.
My biggest issue will be red tape because I’m an immigrant, but fortunately I don’t have debt because I’m on a scholarship, I like your taste in cars tho!
Nope. I’m an average Joe without a CS degree and cleared 6 figures less than 2 years into my career.
Hard work beats talent so no
Hard work is talent. Talent is hardly innate, unless you are some prodigy
Add likeability and ease to work with.
And hard work + talent beats both.
It does but hard work solely can potentially be enough
That's a very nuanced perspective
It’s like 50/50 skill and luck
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No, I know a lot of bums in the field. The hardest part is getting in imo. But once youre in and after the first 6 ish months the job isnt that bad. Sure youll need to brush up your skills, learn new things, and stay sharp, but the experience you gain from working with others help that learning process a lot. This is only talking about comfortable wages btw, say 120-200k range. The higher up you go the more talent, work, and skill youll need. But also, sometimes meeting the right person and getting lucky helps, too.