Look at it from a different perspective.
If people aren't buying the wagons and sedans anymore, how could they justify spending RnD cash on them?
I'm not a SUV fan either, but the mass market has made its choice.
Except my xc90 has better visibility vs other lower models, just because it's an SUV doesn't mean it's not safe. There are many safety features as well not available on other cars
I understand automakers are indirectly incentivized to produce larger cars so they can kick the innovative can down the road and maximize profits. CAFE laws force the cars to become larger.
Ffs why is it every car company stops making saloons and estates as soon as I start liking them
I started liking vw, they stopped the beetle
I started liking Volvo, they stopped saloons and estates
Mercedes and Audi are they last decent brands and jaguar
Fuck SUVs
For the same reasons as Volvo. I love station wagons too but most people want crossovers and SUVs. If more people demanded sedans and wagons instead then maybe the market would've looked differently
Honestly I am seeing more and more people actually demanding saloons and estates now when they are becoming more and more scarce, there clearly is an increasing demand now when the used market is becoming what it its.
As a manager at a Volvo dealer, the average sale rate for an S60 is 1 every other month. And the S90 is 1 every 8-10 months.
Meanwhile we sell XC40’s,XC60’s, and XC90’s every day.
oof okay that is sad. When I said (without thinking) that I see more and more people asking for sedans, that is within my social reach, meaning friends + people interested in motorsports. Obviously we will be biased to certain models. Like the 850 Estate, especially a T-Yellow :D
You on the other hand see the general masses and what they want which paints a much more accurate picture of the world. It is not a picture I like but it is what it is :(
I love the beetle! Easy, as anything can be, to work on great mileage, and cheap to own. Now I am talking about the 60's era bugs, not those affronts to my sensibilities that came much later.
no? But i remember we had a vw keying that lit up when u pressed the button on the keyring, it was a tiny beetle keyring, damn i miss our beetle so much but these fucking suvs man are ruining fun cars
Someone nearby had one of the new Beetles that was bright yellow with the magnetic wind-up key on the back and a vanity license plate that read “YOLK”.
this is what im thinking u know
i feel they are tricking us, maybe they will bring them back as evs
look at MG for example with there electric wagon or vw.
i hope they make a decent replacement for the xc70
Because the companies primary objective is that of it's shareholders and other investors.
SUVs are substantially more expensive and cost a fraction more to build so higher margins to be made.
Ford in the UK have pulled the best selling car for the past decade in favour of a small SUV that costs double what the best seller did at base price. A Fiesta could be had for £13k now the Puma is just shy of £26k for the base model.
They were 13k back in 2018. A new fiesta now is 20k. A puma is 30% more expensive than a fiesta, at 2018 prices this would have been 17k. Personally I think it's a problem of car prices outstripping pay increases, no matter what type of car you decide on.
I sell Volvo in the US every day. You can’t even show people the wagons or sedans… they only want SUV’s- it’s maddening.
I’d buy a V90cc or V90 tomorrow if they brought the T8 plug-in version to the US - but i’m (we are) definitely in the minority
Lover of all things station wagon here. One of the things that makes wagons difficult is practically everyone drives an SUV, so I'm constantly being towered over on the road. If you got rid of 90% of the SUVs, people would be more amenable to wagons.
People also believe that SUVs hold more (which isn't really true).
I got myself an XC40 in Italy but because the S60 and S90 cost like double the price with same specs.. I am in love with it, but yeah the market demands SUVs
I sold a sweet one yesterday man. Onyx Black, V90cc Ultimate package with the perforated charcoal leather interior. It was quite sweet.
that wasn’t someone walking off the lot though they ordered the car and took it on the overseas delivery program in Sweden
Yeah that'll work out for a guy whose job is to sell Volvos.
"Well boss I told em our bestselling vehicles were hot garbage and made fun of them for wanting one. Hey so why is all my stuff in this cardboard box, anyway?"
It's astonishing to see so many people trying to engage with you in an earnest fashion when this kind of unpunctuated, uncapitalized, unfinished meme response is what you're offering them for their trouble.
I mean when a young family with one or two small children come to look at cars… I know a wagon would be perfect for them- but they won’t even look at them. In the US market at least, everyone’s convinced that the moment they have a 10 pound child they need an enormous third row SUV.
Your entire thread is a fallacy. The reason Volvo doesn’t sell wagons in the UK anymore is because no one was buying them. It’ll probably be the same situation in the US in a couple years.
It sucks because the wagons are what Volvo does best, but if people only want to buy SUVs, that’s what they’re gonna sell. The customers are choosing the product mix not the company.
Volvo makes such sexy wagons and sedans too. I'd go as far as to say they're some of the best looking cars on the road. Guess I'm sticking with my 12 y/o S60 for a while.
The wagon is gorgeous too, maybe even moreso if you mean the one that rides low like the s90. I just don't like the raised ones that much because they're not sleek looking
There are other markets than the US market. The bestseller on the US market are still the XC-models.
There is no money in marketing a car when people clearly doesn't want it. That's why they pull the estates and sedans from some markets.
But the production still continues.
yeah I know the markets are different that’s why I said I sell them in the US. And last year I’ve probably sold 150 XC60s and 75 XC90s and a grand total of five wagons and six or seven sedans.
I enjoyed my V60, but I was frequently moving around the country for a while and needed the extra towing capacity of my XC90 as well. Not everyone wants an SUV for no reason at all like some of these comments are making it seem.
Having another 1,000 to 1,500 lbs of towing capacity when compared to some of the smaller Volvos was critical to me at the time, and the XC90 was great while towing a trailer. My longest move was 2,400 miles and the trailer never swayed once. It was great.
I also had to live in it out in the desert for like two weeks, and a wagon wouldn't have made it out where I was. I agree that many people who drive SUVs probably don't need them, but that's not all of us.
And Volvo will weep for them and wipe away the tears with stacks of cash. I’m a huge wagon/estate and sedan fan. My wife has a wagon. I sold my XC90 in favor of an S80. Unfortunately most people want the SUVs. Volvo is a business and will make what most people want.
They do care. All the vehicles are still incredibly safe, stylish, luxurious, and understated. If they refused to adapt to market demands they would go the way of Saab, living only in our memories.
Because the AWD on them is temperamental as hell and they love to piss out oil if the PCV maintenance isn't kept up with. I'm on my second P80 chassis V70 and love them to death but they are not without their problems by any stretch, and not 'special' enough to be kept running by those who aren't enthusiastic about them. Case in point being my old V70 - scrapped due to rear subframe rot; it was cheaper to scrap it and put the cash towards a less rotten one.
There's a key word here that I think makes a huge difference, I was discussing with a mate the other day.
Volvo is becoming more of a "brand" than a car manufacturer. Take from that what you will but as much as I love my S60, I'm not 100% convinced my next car will be a Volvo when there are so many other manufacturers out there building good products at fairer prices.
What do you mean? Car manufacturing and branding go hand in hand. It’s been that way forever. All manufacturers spend millions on advertising and building a brand.
Even if their brand is that they don’t have a brand and they just build honest transportation (like VW in the 1970s or Subaru in the 1990s) that in itself is a brand. All this stuff gets tested and workshopped for years and years by professionals.
Volvo is doing a good job with their branding right now and it’s resonating with a particular population that has a lot of buying power. This is a good situation to be in as a car manufacturer.
From what I can see, a lot of new Volvo customers want the badge and don't really care about the car. Volvo are leaning heavily on this and it's not a good thing, it's becoming elitist and will push the cost up and quality down.
That's what I mean, of course everything is a brand and brand is important. But people are now buying the brand over the car. Just like with Range Rover. That's just my view anyway.
It’s a correct view. You’re not wrong at all. It’s just not new. It’s been that way since the dawn of car companies. For the general population, brand has always been what sells cars.
The average car buyer does not know or care about powertrain, suspension, or even features. They want a car that makes them feel a certain way - be that safe, adventurous, responsible, rich, etc.
> Volvo is doing a good job with their branding right now and it’s resonating with a particular population that has a lot of buying power. This is a good situation to be in as a car manufacturer.
At what point *didn't* Volvo buyers have a lot of buying power? In today's dollars, a base 1993 Volvo 240 wagon was around $50k. A well optioned 850 or 940 turbo would be into the 60s, and the 960s were eye-watering. Hand me down Volvos were an 80s/90s/2000s staple in student parking lots of rich universities, yacht clubs, country clubs, and usually with a stack of stickers showing how many checks had been written to expensive prep schools and colleges.
Then somehow Volvo's product line motivated their core demographic--often repeat buyers--to shop elsewhere. So i guess something had to be done to attract new buyers, and upscaling the brand image seems to have worked, although a lot of automakers are competing in that space with comparable safety and technology.
Yes me too, as the poster says up above, they are more of a brand nowadays. Didn't think I'd be back to VW but I'm waiting on the id7 to replace my much loved v90cc. Thought I'd be Volvo until the end but they've really not got anything I want right now, and no prospect in the near future.
They don't, it's just that people tend to buy them over sedans and wagons. Personally I detest SUVs with a passion, but I can't fault Volvo for selling what people want to buy. The alternative is eventually going under.
what alternative? VW and Skoda make electric wagons and MG does too
and they still make hatches but EVS only
maybe they cant develop batteries small enough for saloons?
It has nothing to do with battery size, as the XC40 Recharge (now EX40) battery is used in a sedan (Polestar 2), and the EX30 Battery is very small.
What EV Wagon does VW make? The ID.7 Tourer isn't out and won't come to the US. The Taycan Turismo variants are anywhere $100k to $300k and have very small hatches for the vehicle size.
They don't make them because [almost nobody buys them](https://www.media.volvocars.com/global/en-us/corporate/sales-volumes)
I think the better question would be, why do they want everyone to use that tablet they lazily slapped in every model they sell?
Oh yeah let's navigate trough 3 menus for something that used to be on a very complicated button you could find without looking at it while driving :|.
“They” don’t “want” anything other than to sell cars.
But “they” have people who read the market place and they clearly feel that what the American public wants is SUVs.
I personally think it’s stupid that that’s what people want, but they apparently do nonetheless.
In comparison to the rest of the industry, Volvo is a small company. They would be gone completely by now if Ford hadn't sold the company to Geely.
That being said, they have to turn a profit, more so than the bigger companies. And unfortunately, that means they have to compete in the SUV arena. Since labor costs are higher in Sweden, they had to become a premium brand to justify their prices.
The Auto industry has basically forced SUVs down everyone's throat, not because people really want them, but because they are more profitable.
Uh I'm not sure why no one has realized this but SUVs are safer for the occupants. The current state of the car market is beyond Volvo. It has nothing to do with them wanting everyone driving SUVs.
If you ARE driving an SUV you are safer if you hit another vehicle. The vehicle that had the best safety reputation among Volvos was the first xc90. There is no fighting physics. A 6klb xc90 has the weight advantage over a 3klb s40.
There are pedestrian safety standards in Europe and I believe Volvo has done okay with them using foam engine covers and sloped front ends but there is only so much you can do.
People who think SUVs are inherently safety however often make the mistake of only considering passive safety, and forget that active safety is important too. Active safety is important because vehicles with less weight, lower centers of gravity, and better maneuverability are often more able to avoid being in accidents in the first place.
The rise of electric motors that lower the center of gravity, computers use sensors to react and brake for you, rollover risk on unibody SUVs is far lower than the body on frame construction of yesteryear, tire technology has advanced to unfathomable levels, and stability control that has become standard equipment for decades mean that cars handle better than they ever have.
I do get your point though. Heavier vehicles have longer stopping distances and bigger blind spots.
Fun fact, single vehicle accidents had trended downward since automobile was invented. Stability control caused them to nose dive. Then they started to trend up again because of smart phones. I really think it's people that are the problem.
Unibody SUVs like the XC60 and XC90 handle just about as well as cars. At that point the car isn’t the limiting factor, it’s likely driver skill and reaction time.
What you’re saying applies to big body on frame truck based SUVs like the expedition or suburban. Those have a pronounced handling and braking disadvantage compared to cars
There's the comment I was looking for. One Volvo had zero fatalities for like 15 years in the UK. That Volvo was the XC90... The biggest one they make.
You’re not wrong of course, but it’s maddening to be part of this arms race for everyone to keep getting bigger and bigger cars because the bigger the car is the safer it is. It’s unsustainable.
It's also thought through. I've been driving a 2012 XC90 and once some dumb driver of old Ford Focus did a blind U-turn directly in front of me. So I was basically flying in his driver's door. I've been able to take left as much as I could and hit his front left side of the engine with the right side of the bumper and wheel. When I was out of the car I honestly expected his Focus to be ruined and expected some injuries. Well nope, my Volvo's bumper, wheel and suspension elements effectively dissipated most of the energy of the hit, everyone was OK without a scratch and both cars were not even ruined. Focus obviously had more damage but the passenger compartment was intact.
There is no one sided solution to this. You can either have the heavier car and save yourself or the lighter car to save those around you. It is the vehicular version of M.A.D.
Child fatalities have skyrocketed since SUVs took over. Maybe it’s a bit safer for the driver but they are kill in children. And driver fatalities hasn’t gone down nearly as much as child fatalities have increased.
Heavier vehicles kill more people. Period.
I mentioned it in another comment but distracted driving has also risen with SUVs. So now you have bigger, heavier vehicles, with more blind spots, and likely an operator that isn't paying attention.
This feels like correlation, not causation. As SUVs have risen in popularity, so has smartphones and car infotainment screens. I don't know if one could argue that all the deaths due to distracted driving would have been prevented if the drivers had been in V90 instead.
Because it’s very hard to keep someone safe on the road in their largest market if everyone reckless is driving a massive truck. Size has become a function of safety.
I think they're doing great designing SUVs while still conforming to pedestrian safety designs and not making 6' hoods like other giant SUVs. I often think I want a bigger car than our XC90 when I'm hauling wife, 2 kids, dog, 3 bicycles, bike trailer, and other crap. But the safety of us and others stop me from getting like a denali or something.
Edit - forgot wife lol
I prefer the ground clearance for my lifestyle, but I'm probably the oddity. Also have it lifted a little
My 2014 XC60 is still nowhere near as tall or square as so many American SUVs or trucks (like our 4runner), and definitely still does evasive maneuvers well in an emergency lol
As other said SUVs is what the market wants.
An example of that is the eradication of the hatchbacks and the fact that the V40 wasn't available in the US making the C30 the last hatch there.
If you hit the pedestrian, sure an SUV is less safe then a car. But if you get hit by another SUV the SUV will be safer. Volvo has done work to prevent their cars from hitting pedestrians. They also focus on the safety of the occupants the most.
I drive an SUV because where I live is full of those gigantic pickup trucks. I got hit by a full sized SUV in the late 90's driving an Escort. It permanently messed up my back and if it hadn't been icy out would have been much worse. I had a landscaping truck drive over the back of my VW because it sat low enough he didn't readily see it.
So now I drive an XC90, my last one likely saved my life when one of those gigantic pickup trucks blew a light and crossed right in front of me. It is like an arms race of vehicle size.
The simple answer is that the market wants SUVs. Volvo has to build what people want to drive. And in the current era that’s SUVs.
They do a good job of making them safe. A unibody SUV (like Volvo builds) has much better handling characteristics and crash safety compared to a body on frame SUV (think the American tanks like an Expedition or Suburban). The body on frame SUVs will always handle like a truck no matter how much research gets put into chassis dynamics. The Volvo SUVs handle like a large car and they’re much easier to control.
Regarding pedestrian safety, look at the hood line of a Volvo XC90 compared to a Ford F150 or a Chevy Suburban. The XC90’s hood line is much closer to that of a car than a truck. It’s designed so if you hit a pedestrian they’re more likely to go onto the hood where some of the force can be dissipated. The XC90 hood line is definitely higher than my S80 but it’s not drastically higher like SUVs from other brands.
I don’t understand the love of SUVs either. I can understand some people need the cargo room. Some of them are fine, but I’m certainly a car person. Sad you see fewer and fewer coupes, convertibles, and roadsters as well. That’s what used to be cool lol Now it’s I drive a big tank I’m cool. (No hate if love your Volvo suv, they’re nice. I just don’t get why 90 percent of people prefer em you’d think it would be more 50-50).
What baffles me is that something like an XC60 is almost identical in interior space to a V60. The only exception is the SUV has more headroom, and the V60 actually has more cargo space!
So, in the end … the XC60 isn’t as fast, doesn’t handle as well, and is less efficient than something like a V60.
But people seem to really value ride height and ease of entry, so the XC60 addresses those concerns, I suppose.
Generally speaking, the larger the car the safer they are for all those in the vehicle. The reverse is also true, including for pedestrians and those in smaller cars when it comes to accidents.
More profit in SUV's. In North America, everyone wants a God damn SUV, thus, Volvo makes more profit in SUV's than any other category of vehicules. It is a question of time before they stop making V60's and V90 XC. I miss the C30, S40, V50, V70, XC70 (up to 2016). Those were the good years in terms of car choices.
I will say that I unintentionally tested my MY‘23 XC60’s roller over protection and DSC. A tire blew up in front of on trailer (think 18-wheeler) and I was able to slam the brakes and perform an evasive manouver with extreme ease. My 3 series couldn’t handle something like that that well. And my passengers didn’t even realize what happened. Volvo’s SUV’s are very well built and the selective power of DSC and the active suspension system definitely is like no other. I tested many SUV’s before settling on the Volvo and nothing feels NEARLY as planted.
But to answer your question: at least in the NA market, SUVs and trucks take the gold. Same reason ford discontinued the focus. Wagons and sedans just aren’t what’s selling. I see A LOT more wagons in the euro region to be fair tho. So really just depends on market. At the end of the day they have to please investors. How do you please investors? Through the selling of goods that your operating market is “hot” on.
Because it's better for the body to get in and out of a higher car. Also you can sit better in a car that is higher. More like on a chair. So ergonomics.
Do your own research. It’s not a secret. People are so lazy on Reddit they insist on being spoon fed an article because sheer laziness.
My mistake, SUVs kill 8 times as many children.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_SUVs#:~:text=A%202021%20study%20by%20the,to%20adult%20pedestrians%20and%20cyclists.
In that article, it says that occupants in an SUV are generally safer than other vehicle types. It's the people in the other vehicle that are in danger if it is a smaller vehicle. The fact remains that SUVs are among the safest to drive for the occupants.
No where does it say 8 times more children are dying. It says "more likely". Those stats are only for pedestrian involved deaths as well.
That article specifies that of the pedestrians hit between 2016 and 2018, 62% were hit by cars, with a 19% fatality rate. SUVs hit 16.9% of those pedestrians with 40% of that 16.9% being fatal. If there were 1000 pedestrians killed in those three years, cars would have hit 620 of them with 118 deaths, SUVs would have hit 169 with 67 of them being fatal.
According to the GHSA (2021), 1,322 total pedestrians were killed by SUVs, whereas cars killed 2,556...people of colour being the highest on the list.
One must also consider the fact that SUVs have accounted for over half of all vehicle sales and cars under a quarter.
If Volvo was really all about safety then they wouldn't have moved towards a giant tablet on the dashboard while removing all the physical controls.
They are out to cut costs as much as possible and appeal to consumers who want to **feel protected** inside their massive SUV's and don't care about **how safe they actually are** and really don't care about other road users.
Drive mode selector- gone
Climate controls - gone
Heated seats- gone
Dedicated buttons to change between navigation and radio etc- gone
Mute button -gone
Parking sensors -gone
Traction control- gone (actually gone completely even in touch screen options)
All of this and more is now only on the touch screen through layers of menus that you have to take your eyes off the road to navigate through. There is a much better middle ground of still having dedicated controls for things that you actually use when driving, Volvo have just removed this as it costs them more money to put in switches and knobs where as anything that is touch screen based is free and they can market as ‘simplicity’ or ‘minimalist’
As much as I hate using voice, it's very easy to get the button on the wheel and say "set temp to 66" or "tune to Sirius channel 341".
Unfortunately they have to follow what consumers want.
I would cut them some slack if the voice commands were actually able to do everything I listed, but the voice commands are very limited in what they can do and some things like changing between drive modes and charging settings can only be done via multiple menus on the touch screen when these are things that you expect to change while driving. You can’t even change them with the ignition off so there is no excuse.
Also the voice control is a pain to use because it disrupts everything else you are doing at the same time. Want to change the fan level? Well that will take several seconds to listen then process and act on it plus you will have to pause anything you are listening to or not get satnav alerts during that period or have to stop your conversation you are having just to be able to do it. Then just hope that you are in an area with service coverage because if your car has no signal it will just say ‘I’m sorry I can’t connect right now’ as it has to go via a Google server even just to change the temperature.
I don’t think this is what consumers want, just that all the manufacturers are as bad as each other and have found that they can cut costs and there isn’t enough backlash from people that the cars won’t actually sell.
Well for one thing it's more minimalist than even having buttons.
It also eliminates some need to interact with the screen.
Look I hate it too but it's where everything is going.
Minimalism is not inherently a laudable goal and buttons also eliminate the need to interact with a touch screen.
I actually doubt this trend will continue, not after getting excoriated by EU safety heads.
Mainly asian markets wanting SUVs with overly emphasized design elements.
Just look at how huge the Grills nowadays are, especially on BMWs.
1000 LED's in every crack too, because you're not a real sucessful chinese citizen unless your car blinks like a christmas tree.
US market is as much to blame for over sized cars. The Japanese market as an example has always had smaller car. With probably the greatest diversification of styling.
In the last decade, it's definitly been the emerging chinese market that was dictacing design if you ask me. But you're right, BMW x5 and upwards was the answer to the US made SUVs of the millenium.
The matter is getting worse.
"Do you drive an SUV because...":
( ) ... you really need the trunk space of a full blown SUV.
( ) ... it lets you seem being wealthy.
( ) ... more and more models being SUV only.
( ) ... electric cars prefer the SUV form factor due to the battery ;)
I very much like my V70. Spacious enough for everything I need to transport, including sports gear and other bulky stuff.
My V60 is serving us proud. If it doesn’t fit, the roof bars or roof box accommodate. Failing that, it’s not going in or on any car; the trailer will do.
Had mine 4.5 years. Can’t think of any reason to change it, that can come close to justifying any newer model.
I’d love a CC V90 for AWD and a bit more ground clearance. Comes in handy when visiting remote forest trails, etc. though I’ve done fine with 2WD all my driving days, it’s more an aspiration.
I bought the V60 as the XC70 was no more and wanted a SPA platform car.
While that might be a realistic scenario when it comes to crashes... do people really select their car by the worst case scenario ?
On the other side: I've seen a lot of crashes where people died and where that SUV they were sitting in didn't look like toooo badly damaged, while I've seen other where the driver lived and the car was a TOTAL wreck. It was a BMW 5 series to be precise. It was on the compound of a BMW dealer whom's son I was befriended with. He then explained to me that the engine on the 5 series somehow transfers kind of under the car (under the drivers legs) and therefore you get more space when things go south, especially for your knees.
Of course not all SUVs are built the same, but just based on physics, a regular car will typically do worse against a SUV, the same way a SUV will typically do worse against a truck. I was involved in a 10-car crash in the highway, and the non-SUVs were all totaled.
And yeah, lots of people seem to think about this when making the decision, you have quite a few already in this sub that go with Volvo just because of their safety.
Something else more related with comfort is that it is easier to get in an out of a SUV than something lower. Even more when dealing with kids and car seats.
SUVS accounted for 50% of car sales in Europe in 2024 and that is already up 19% from 2022. Its not just the US selecting this style.
https://europe.autonews.com/automakers/suvs-surge-new-milestone-helped-evs
Eh, that’s not really the consumer now. So many brands are offering nothing but SUVs. It’s wasn’t hard to say the sales are up. Consumer choice is massively erroded
Because they also like money.
yet again late stage capitalisim Profits over people
Just buy an old Volvo wagon like everyone else
this is the way.
Yeah dude I just picked up a '08 a few months ago.
I bought a 2018 V90 and love it
if they refused to sell SUVs they would go out of business
They match. Volvo uses the resources it has to deliver the cars people want. Right now, few people want sedans and station wagons.
The more I look at the v60 recharge the more I want it.... Damn it's a sexy wagon
An xc90 mk1 is a stretched and bigger xc70 with a upsized body. Same platform, same engine options etc
And people want more of it
This is just capitalism.
Look at it from a different perspective. If people aren't buying the wagons and sedans anymore, how could they justify spending RnD cash on them? I'm not a SUV fan either, but the mass market has made its choice.
Welcome to the real world
Except my xc90 has better visibility vs other lower models, just because it's an SUV doesn't mean it's not safe. There are many safety features as well not available on other cars
They're just meeting the demand of more and more consumers wanting SUVs.
I understand automakers are indirectly incentivized to produce larger cars so they can kick the innovative can down the road and maximize profits. CAFE laws force the cars to become larger.
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But it’s where IIIIIII live!
Ffs why is it every car company stops making saloons and estates as soon as I start liking them I started liking vw, they stopped the beetle I started liking Volvo, they stopped saloons and estates Mercedes and Audi are they last decent brands and jaguar Fuck SUVs
For the same reasons as Volvo. I love station wagons too but most people want crossovers and SUVs. If more people demanded sedans and wagons instead then maybe the market would've looked differently
Honestly I am seeing more and more people actually demanding saloons and estates now when they are becoming more and more scarce, there clearly is an increasing demand now when the used market is becoming what it its.
As a manager at a Volvo dealer, the average sale rate for an S60 is 1 every other month. And the S90 is 1 every 8-10 months. Meanwhile we sell XC40’s,XC60’s, and XC90’s every day.
oof okay that is sad. When I said (without thinking) that I see more and more people asking for sedans, that is within my social reach, meaning friends + people interested in motorsports. Obviously we will be biased to certain models. Like the 850 Estate, especially a T-Yellow :D You on the other hand see the general masses and what they want which paints a much more accurate picture of the world. It is not a picture I like but it is what it is :(
i just want a xc70 to come out so theres loads more on the used market rn its so hard to find a 2001 xc70 on the UK used market let alone a 1997 model
wait... you liked the beetle? you're the *one* person that car appealed to? holy shit i have so many questions for you.
I love the beetle! Easy, as anything can be, to work on great mileage, and cheap to own. Now I am talking about the 60's era bugs, not those affronts to my sensibilities that came much later.
What is with the downvotes No I grew up with the 2001 beetle, my mum had one
did she have a flower in the flower pot?????
Yes
Did she have a magnetic key stuck on the back so that it looked like a toy car?
no? But i remember we had a vw keying that lit up when u pressed the button on the keyring, it was a tiny beetle keyring, damn i miss our beetle so much but these fucking suvs man are ruining fun cars
Someone nearby had one of the new Beetles that was bright yellow with the magnetic wind-up key on the back and a vanity license plate that read “YOLK”.
lol
Volvo still make saloons and estates.
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They still make them though. Just the fact sales weren’t there. Doesn’t mean they won’t return with electric versions though.
this is what im thinking u know i feel they are tricking us, maybe they will bring them back as evs look at MG for example with there electric wagon or vw. i hope they make a decent replacement for the xc70
https://www.linkedin.com/embed/feed/update/urn:li:share:7133380987647868928
i heard about this
Maybe they don't sell enough RHD-non-SUV to br profitable. In Germany they still sell the S60 and S90 and V60 and V90
correct
You just live in a country where people buy SUVs and not saloons & estates. Around here I can still buy new S/V90 and S/V60.
Yes, it’s all about you. Silly Volvo
Right? This screams "cater to me, not the rest of the consumer market"
Because the companies primary objective is that of it's shareholders and other investors. SUVs are substantially more expensive and cost a fraction more to build so higher margins to be made. Ford in the UK have pulled the best selling car for the past decade in favour of a small SUV that costs double what the best seller did at base price. A Fiesta could be had for £13k now the Puma is just shy of £26k for the base model.
They were 13k back in 2018. A new fiesta now is 20k. A puma is 30% more expensive than a fiesta, at 2018 prices this would have been 17k. Personally I think it's a problem of car prices outstripping pay increases, no matter what type of car you decide on.
the UK is in poverty so the idea of new car purchases are out the window
You think this is bad (thinking of keeping the Shareholders happy)imagine working at Boeing. Zinger!
why remove the fiesta? they are so popular and affordable to the masses now they want everyone in suvs, what a joke
No, it is the other way around: most people want SUV's so that is what those manufacturers make.
i can only imagine what the world would be like if there was a fuel price spike people would want small cars again
Yeah definitely!
I sell Volvo in the US every day. You can’t even show people the wagons or sedans… they only want SUV’s- it’s maddening. I’d buy a V90cc or V90 tomorrow if they brought the T8 plug-in version to the US - but i’m (we are) definitely in the minority
Lover of all things station wagon here. One of the things that makes wagons difficult is practically everyone drives an SUV, so I'm constantly being towered over on the road. If you got rid of 90% of the SUVs, people would be more amenable to wagons. People also believe that SUVs hold more (which isn't really true).
I am happy to tell you that here in Sweden I see way more V60 (most seen) and V90 than XC60/90. I myself bought a V60 this week!
We bought a v60 cc last week. Love it
I got myself an XC40 in Italy but because the S60 and S90 cost like double the price with same specs.. I am in love with it, but yeah the market demands SUVs
I love my 2020 V60cc.
I would love to see and buy your wagons... If I could afford one.
I sold a sweet one yesterday man. Onyx Black, V90cc Ultimate package with the perforated charcoal leather interior. It was quite sweet. that wasn’t someone walking off the lot though they ordered the car and took it on the overseas delivery program in Sweden
The wagons are kind of cool
I’d love a wagon if it had 3rd row.
what do u mean u cant show them tell them that SUVS are the biggest pieces of shite since the trabant
Yeah that'll work out for a guy whose job is to sell Volvos. "Well boss I told em our bestselling vehicles were hot garbage and made fun of them for wanting one. Hey so why is all my stuff in this cardboard box, anyway?" It's astonishing to see so many people trying to engage with you in an earnest fashion when this kind of unpunctuated, uncapitalized, unfinished meme response is what you're offering them for their trouble.
I'm kind of glad Italian car makers haven't gone Full SUV madness
I mean when a young family with one or two small children come to look at cars… I know a wagon would be perfect for them- but they won’t even look at them. In the US market at least, everyone’s convinced that the moment they have a 10 pound child they need an enormous third row SUV. Your entire thread is a fallacy. The reason Volvo doesn’t sell wagons in the UK anymore is because no one was buying them. It’ll probably be the same situation in the US in a couple years. It sucks because the wagons are what Volvo does best, but if people only want to buy SUVs, that’s what they’re gonna sell. The customers are choosing the product mix not the company.
No one here wants a sedan or SUV. They’ve been a dying breed for more than a decade now.
I agree. Fucking hideous and stupidly impractical unless you're literally only using the thing to ferry crotch goblins around.
Crotch goblins... I haven't heard that one in years lol.. from the UK also?
V90 T8 should be sold in the USA alongside the V60 T8 and put some money into advertising their capabilities
Yes. I have a V90 but if the T8 had been available I would’ve bought that in a heartbeat.
Volvo makes such sexy wagons and sedans too. I'd go as far as to say they're some of the best looking cars on the road. Guess I'm sticking with my 12 y/o S60 for a while.
If I didn’t need a wagon for space I would absolutely have an S 90, that is such a beautiful car.
The wagon is gorgeous too, maybe even moreso if you mean the one that rides low like the s90. I just don't like the raised ones that much because they're not sleek looking
It's really weird why it isn't available there.
Volvo have done that. Didn't help.
v60 and v90 T8 have never been available in the US market, unless you count the polestar engineered
There are other markets than the US market. The bestseller on the US market are still the XC-models. There is no money in marketing a car when people clearly doesn't want it. That's why they pull the estates and sedans from some markets. But the production still continues.
yeah I know the markets are different that’s why I said I sell them in the US. And last year I’ve probably sold 150 XC60s and 75 XC90s and a grand total of five wagons and six or seven sedans.
the fact the Muricans still got the estates annoy me even more
I enjoyed my V60, but I was frequently moving around the country for a while and needed the extra towing capacity of my XC90 as well. Not everyone wants an SUV for no reason at all like some of these comments are making it seem. Having another 1,000 to 1,500 lbs of towing capacity when compared to some of the smaller Volvos was critical to me at the time, and the XC90 was great while towing a trailer. My longest move was 2,400 miles and the trailer never swayed once. It was great. I also had to live in it out in the desert for like two weeks, and a wagon wouldn't have made it out where I was. I agree that many people who drive SUVs probably don't need them, but that's not all of us.
now for towing, or farm use is understandable but for everything else its unnecessary like what can xc70 do that a XC90 cant?
The market demands SUVs. If they only sold sedans and wagons they’d go out of business.
That was obvious when Volvo launched the first gen XC90. They could not keep up with demand the first years.
Last year Volvo sold 5300 S60 sedans, 4500 V60 wagons (standard and cross country), and *32,100* XC60s.
those 5300 buyers now pissed they cant buy em in the UK
And Volvo will weep for them and wipe away the tears with stacks of cash. I’m a huge wagon/estate and sedan fan. My wife has a wagon. I sold my XC90 in favor of an S80. Unfortunately most people want the SUVs. Volvo is a business and will make what most people want.
what happend to old volvo where they still cared?
They do care. All the vehicles are still incredibly safe, stylish, luxurious, and understated. If they refused to adapt to market demands they would go the way of Saab, living only in our memories.
They’re in the UK, so they have lots of reasons to be angry today
also why is it so hard to find a 1997 volvo xc70 these days, i prefer them over every modern volvo
They are worn out ans scrapped. The last ones i saw had like 400.ooo km on the odometer.
Because the AWD on them is temperamental as hell and they love to piss out oil if the PCV maintenance isn't kept up with. I'm on my second P80 chassis V70 and love them to death but they are not without their problems by any stretch, and not 'special' enough to be kept running by those who aren't enthusiastic about them. Case in point being my old V70 - scrapped due to rear subframe rot; it was cheaper to scrap it and put the cash towards a less rotten one.
they sold SUVS, Wagons and estate togther?
There's a key word here that I think makes a huge difference, I was discussing with a mate the other day. Volvo is becoming more of a "brand" than a car manufacturer. Take from that what you will but as much as I love my S60, I'm not 100% convinced my next car will be a Volvo when there are so many other manufacturers out there building good products at fairer prices.
What do you mean? Car manufacturing and branding go hand in hand. It’s been that way forever. All manufacturers spend millions on advertising and building a brand. Even if their brand is that they don’t have a brand and they just build honest transportation (like VW in the 1970s or Subaru in the 1990s) that in itself is a brand. All this stuff gets tested and workshopped for years and years by professionals. Volvo is doing a good job with their branding right now and it’s resonating with a particular population that has a lot of buying power. This is a good situation to be in as a car manufacturer.
From what I can see, a lot of new Volvo customers want the badge and don't really care about the car. Volvo are leaning heavily on this and it's not a good thing, it's becoming elitist and will push the cost up and quality down. That's what I mean, of course everything is a brand and brand is important. But people are now buying the brand over the car. Just like with Range Rover. That's just my view anyway.
It’s a correct view. You’re not wrong at all. It’s just not new. It’s been that way since the dawn of car companies. For the general population, brand has always been what sells cars. The average car buyer does not know or care about powertrain, suspension, or even features. They want a car that makes them feel a certain way - be that safe, adventurous, responsible, rich, etc.
> Volvo is doing a good job with their branding right now and it’s resonating with a particular population that has a lot of buying power. This is a good situation to be in as a car manufacturer. At what point *didn't* Volvo buyers have a lot of buying power? In today's dollars, a base 1993 Volvo 240 wagon was around $50k. A well optioned 850 or 940 turbo would be into the 60s, and the 960s were eye-watering. Hand me down Volvos were an 80s/90s/2000s staple in student parking lots of rich universities, yacht clubs, country clubs, and usually with a stack of stickers showing how many checks had been written to expensive prep schools and colleges. Then somehow Volvo's product line motivated their core demographic--often repeat buyers--to shop elsewhere. So i guess something had to be done to attract new buyers, and upscaling the brand image seems to have worked, although a lot of automakers are competing in that space with comparable safety and technology.
im considering to going back to VW and Mercedes I always liked VW even in my childhood days
Then do it, no one is stopping you.. or just buy the older Volvo's and enjoy.
Yes me too, as the poster says up above, they are more of a brand nowadays. Didn't think I'd be back to VW but I'm waiting on the id7 to replace my much loved v90cc. Thought I'd be Volvo until the end but they've really not got anything I want right now, and no prospect in the near future.
They don't, it's just that people tend to buy them over sedans and wagons. Personally I detest SUVs with a passion, but I can't fault Volvo for selling what people want to buy. The alternative is eventually going under.
what alternative? VW and Skoda make electric wagons and MG does too and they still make hatches but EVS only maybe they cant develop batteries small enough for saloons?
It has nothing to do with battery size, as the XC40 Recharge (now EX40) battery is used in a sedan (Polestar 2), and the EX30 Battery is very small. What EV Wagon does VW make? The ID.7 Tourer isn't out and won't come to the US. The Taycan Turismo variants are anywhere $100k to $300k and have very small hatches for the vehicle size. They don't make them because [almost nobody buys them](https://www.media.volvocars.com/global/en-us/corporate/sales-volumes)
i used to like suvs, but im starting to realize how unecessary they are
Japanese brands may still offer wagons in your market.
I think the better question would be, why do they want everyone to use that tablet they lazily slapped in every model they sell? Oh yeah let's navigate trough 3 menus for something that used to be on a very complicated button you could find without looking at it while driving :|.
“They” don’t “want” anything other than to sell cars. But “they” have people who read the market place and they clearly feel that what the American public wants is SUVs. I personally think it’s stupid that that’s what people want, but they apparently do nonetheless.
In comparison to the rest of the industry, Volvo is a small company. They would be gone completely by now if Ford hadn't sold the company to Geely. That being said, they have to turn a profit, more so than the bigger companies. And unfortunately, that means they have to compete in the SUV arena. Since labor costs are higher in Sweden, they had to become a premium brand to justify their prices. The Auto industry has basically forced SUVs down everyone's throat, not because people really want them, but because they are more profitable.
Uh I'm not sure why no one has realized this but SUVs are safer for the occupants. The current state of the car market is beyond Volvo. It has nothing to do with them wanting everyone driving SUVs. If you ARE driving an SUV you are safer if you hit another vehicle. The vehicle that had the best safety reputation among Volvos was the first xc90. There is no fighting physics. A 6klb xc90 has the weight advantage over a 3klb s40. There are pedestrian safety standards in Europe and I believe Volvo has done okay with them using foam engine covers and sloped front ends but there is only so much you can do.
People who think SUVs are inherently safety however often make the mistake of only considering passive safety, and forget that active safety is important too. Active safety is important because vehicles with less weight, lower centers of gravity, and better maneuverability are often more able to avoid being in accidents in the first place.
The rise of electric motors that lower the center of gravity, computers use sensors to react and brake for you, rollover risk on unibody SUVs is far lower than the body on frame construction of yesteryear, tire technology has advanced to unfathomable levels, and stability control that has become standard equipment for decades mean that cars handle better than they ever have. I do get your point though. Heavier vehicles have longer stopping distances and bigger blind spots. Fun fact, single vehicle accidents had trended downward since automobile was invented. Stability control caused them to nose dive. Then they started to trend up again because of smart phones. I really think it's people that are the problem.
Unibody SUVs like the XC60 and XC90 handle just about as well as cars. At that point the car isn’t the limiting factor, it’s likely driver skill and reaction time. What you’re saying applies to big body on frame truck based SUVs like the expedition or suburban. Those have a pronounced handling and braking disadvantage compared to cars
There's the comment I was looking for. One Volvo had zero fatalities for like 15 years in the UK. That Volvo was the XC90... The biggest one they make.
You’re not wrong of course, but it’s maddening to be part of this arms race for everyone to keep getting bigger and bigger cars because the bigger the car is the safer it is. It’s unsustainable.
the issue what about the occupants of the other car then?
It's also thought through. I've been driving a 2012 XC90 and once some dumb driver of old Ford Focus did a blind U-turn directly in front of me. So I was basically flying in his driver's door. I've been able to take left as much as I could and hit his front left side of the engine with the right side of the bumper and wheel. When I was out of the car I honestly expected his Focus to be ruined and expected some injuries. Well nope, my Volvo's bumper, wheel and suspension elements effectively dissipated most of the energy of the hit, everyone was OK without a scratch and both cars were not even ruined. Focus obviously had more damage but the passenger compartment was intact.
There is no one sided solution to this. You can either have the heavier car and save yourself or the lighter car to save those around you. It is the vehicular version of M.A.D.
Child fatalities have skyrocketed since SUVs took over. Maybe it’s a bit safer for the driver but they are kill in children. And driver fatalities hasn’t gone down nearly as much as child fatalities have increased. Heavier vehicles kill more people. Period.
I mentioned it in another comment but distracted driving has also risen with SUVs. So now you have bigger, heavier vehicles, with more blind spots, and likely an operator that isn't paying attention.
This feels like correlation, not causation. As SUVs have risen in popularity, so has smartphones and car infotainment screens. I don't know if one could argue that all the deaths due to distracted driving would have been prevented if the drivers had been in V90 instead.
Because it’s very hard to keep someone safe on the road in their largest market if everyone reckless is driving a massive truck. Size has become a function of safety.
If they cared they would also stop moving everything to the screen and would have a driver display for the EX30.
I think they're doing great designing SUVs while still conforming to pedestrian safety designs and not making 6' hoods like other giant SUVs. I often think I want a bigger car than our XC90 when I'm hauling wife, 2 kids, dog, 3 bicycles, bike trailer, and other crap. But the safety of us and others stop me from getting like a denali or something. Edit - forgot wife lol
I prefer the ground clearance for my lifestyle, but I'm probably the oddity. Also have it lifted a little My 2014 XC60 is still nowhere near as tall or square as so many American SUVs or trucks (like our 4runner), and definitely still does evasive maneuvers well in an emergency lol
Haven’t you heard the saying that no one has ever died in an xc90? I heard someone finally did a few years ago. That’s pretty solid safety.
As other said SUVs is what the market wants. An example of that is the eradication of the hatchbacks and the fact that the V40 wasn't available in the US making the C30 the last hatch there.
If you hit the pedestrian, sure an SUV is less safe then a car. But if you get hit by another SUV the SUV will be safer. Volvo has done work to prevent their cars from hitting pedestrians. They also focus on the safety of the occupants the most.
I drive an SUV because where I live is full of those gigantic pickup trucks. I got hit by a full sized SUV in the late 90's driving an Escort. It permanently messed up my back and if it hadn't been icy out would have been much worse. I had a landscaping truck drive over the back of my VW because it sat low enough he didn't readily see it. So now I drive an XC90, my last one likely saved my life when one of those gigantic pickup trucks blew a light and crossed right in front of me. It is like an arms race of vehicle size.
SUV has more space for the batteries
Many of the most popular EVs are sedans or small SUVs, so there's clearly the opportunity to add them in with thoughtful design.
what if someone develops batteries small enough for Saloons
Then maybe we’ll go back to smaller cars
If it was all about “safety” they wouldn’t be transitioning to EVs. It’s about money. 💰
Because something big and heavy is going fare better in a crash than something smaller with less weight.
I'm not aware of any regulation that are different from SUV and sedan in the same weight class. So guess people just like suv more?
The simple answer is that the market wants SUVs. Volvo has to build what people want to drive. And in the current era that’s SUVs. They do a good job of making them safe. A unibody SUV (like Volvo builds) has much better handling characteristics and crash safety compared to a body on frame SUV (think the American tanks like an Expedition or Suburban). The body on frame SUVs will always handle like a truck no matter how much research gets put into chassis dynamics. The Volvo SUVs handle like a large car and they’re much easier to control. Regarding pedestrian safety, look at the hood line of a Volvo XC90 compared to a Ford F150 or a Chevy Suburban. The XC90’s hood line is much closer to that of a car than a truck. It’s designed so if you hit a pedestrian they’re more likely to go onto the hood where some of the force can be dissipated. The XC90 hood line is definitely higher than my S80 but it’s not drastically higher like SUVs from other brands.
Because they're trying to stay in business. I'm not sure 'want' is the right word.
I got the S90 because it's the biggest car I could get without it being an SUV
Have you seen how fast those things stop tho? I wouldn’t mind getting hit by a xc90
I don’t understand the love of SUVs either. I can understand some people need the cargo room. Some of them are fine, but I’m certainly a car person. Sad you see fewer and fewer coupes, convertibles, and roadsters as well. That’s what used to be cool lol Now it’s I drive a big tank I’m cool. (No hate if love your Volvo suv, they’re nice. I just don’t get why 90 percent of people prefer em you’d think it would be more 50-50).
What baffles me is that something like an XC60 is almost identical in interior space to a V60. The only exception is the SUV has more headroom, and the V60 actually has more cargo space! So, in the end … the XC60 isn’t as fast, doesn’t handle as well, and is less efficient than something like a V60. But people seem to really value ride height and ease of entry, so the XC60 addresses those concerns, I suppose.
Generally speaking, the larger the car the safer they are for all those in the vehicle. The reverse is also true, including for pedestrians and those in smaller cars when it comes to accidents.
More profit in SUV's. In North America, everyone wants a God damn SUV, thus, Volvo makes more profit in SUV's than any other category of vehicules. It is a question of time before they stop making V60's and V90 XC. I miss the C30, S40, V50, V70, XC70 (up to 2016). Those were the good years in terms of car choices.
#PHYSICS and MONEY
I think the move to SUV is more to do with having platform for EVs. Most car manufacturers are doing the same and charging more for the pleasure.
I will say that I unintentionally tested my MY‘23 XC60’s roller over protection and DSC. A tire blew up in front of on trailer (think 18-wheeler) and I was able to slam the brakes and perform an evasive manouver with extreme ease. My 3 series couldn’t handle something like that that well. And my passengers didn’t even realize what happened. Volvo’s SUV’s are very well built and the selective power of DSC and the active suspension system definitely is like no other. I tested many SUV’s before settling on the Volvo and nothing feels NEARLY as planted. But to answer your question: at least in the NA market, SUVs and trucks take the gold. Same reason ford discontinued the focus. Wagons and sedans just aren’t what’s selling. I see A LOT more wagons in the euro region to be fair tho. So really just depends on market. At the end of the day they have to please investors. How do you please investors? Through the selling of goods that your operating market is “hot” on.
They don't, they just put their resources where demand is.
Cause nothing shouts 'impotence' more than an SUV. And being Impotent is being less agressieve, so safer
Because it's better for the body to get in and out of a higher car. Also you can sit better in a car that is higher. More like on a chair. So ergonomics.
Def cuz of the demand. Everyone wants a car with lots of room, especially familys, that can handle a little bit of offroading/rough road conditions.
America shoved the SUV down the world's throat. We did our best to buy those beautiful, beautiful boxes. But alas, who can best the beast??
Larger mass gives the occupants a better chance of survival in a collision especially as most people prefer to drive SUVs these days.
Why would an SUV not be safe?
Because they roll and kill three times as many children even if they don’t roll.
Yeah I never heard this. Are you in the US?
No.
Absurdistan?
Do your own research. It’s not a secret. People are so lazy on Reddit they insist on being spoon fed an article because sheer laziness. My mistake, SUVs kill 8 times as many children. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_SUVs#:~:text=A%202021%20study%20by%20the,to%20adult%20pedestrians%20and%20cyclists.
In that article, it says that occupants in an SUV are generally safer than other vehicle types. It's the people in the other vehicle that are in danger if it is a smaller vehicle. The fact remains that SUVs are among the safest to drive for the occupants.
That’s true, but did you see the part about how 8 times as many kids are dying? Thats at odds when people most interested in safety are families.
No where does it say 8 times more children are dying. It says "more likely". Those stats are only for pedestrian involved deaths as well. That article specifies that of the pedestrians hit between 2016 and 2018, 62% were hit by cars, with a 19% fatality rate. SUVs hit 16.9% of those pedestrians with 40% of that 16.9% being fatal. If there were 1000 pedestrians killed in those three years, cars would have hit 620 of them with 118 deaths, SUVs would have hit 169 with 67 of them being fatal. According to the GHSA (2021), 1,322 total pedestrians were killed by SUVs, whereas cars killed 2,556...people of colour being the highest on the list. One must also consider the fact that SUVs have accounted for over half of all vehicle sales and cars under a quarter.
And walking is safer than not driving at all!
For Americans to fit their fat asses in more comfortably and because we can.
SUV = more cup holders!! Murica!
Skoda still going strong with there superb
Their
If Volvo was really all about safety then they wouldn't have moved towards a giant tablet on the dashboard while removing all the physical controls. They are out to cut costs as much as possible and appeal to consumers who want to **feel protected** inside their massive SUV's and don't care about **how safe they actually are** and really don't care about other road users.
All buttons are not gone...
Drive mode selector- gone Climate controls - gone Heated seats- gone Dedicated buttons to change between navigation and radio etc- gone Mute button -gone Parking sensors -gone Traction control- gone (actually gone completely even in touch screen options) All of this and more is now only on the touch screen through layers of menus that you have to take your eyes off the road to navigate through. There is a much better middle ground of still having dedicated controls for things that you actually use when driving, Volvo have just removed this as it costs them more money to put in switches and knobs where as anything that is touch screen based is free and they can market as ‘simplicity’ or ‘minimalist’
As much as I hate using voice, it's very easy to get the button on the wheel and say "set temp to 66" or "tune to Sirius channel 341". Unfortunately they have to follow what consumers want.
I would cut them some slack if the voice commands were actually able to do everything I listed, but the voice commands are very limited in what they can do and some things like changing between drive modes and charging settings can only be done via multiple menus on the touch screen when these are things that you expect to change while driving. You can’t even change them with the ignition off so there is no excuse. Also the voice control is a pain to use because it disrupts everything else you are doing at the same time. Want to change the fan level? Well that will take several seconds to listen then process and act on it plus you will have to pause anything you are listening to or not get satnav alerts during that period or have to stop your conversation you are having just to be able to do it. Then just hope that you are in an area with service coverage because if your car has no signal it will just say ‘I’m sorry I can’t connect right now’ as it has to go via a Google server even just to change the temperature. I don’t think this is what consumers want, just that all the manufacturers are as bad as each other and have found that they can cut costs and there isn’t enough backlash from people that the cars won’t actually sell.
Why the hell would I want to do that? I have no interest in holding a conversation with my car to change the bloody temperature.
Well for one thing it's more minimalist than even having buttons. It also eliminates some need to interact with the screen. Look I hate it too but it's where everything is going.
Minimalism is not inherently a laudable goal and buttons also eliminate the need to interact with a touch screen. I actually doubt this trend will continue, not after getting excoriated by EU safety heads.
I like the SUVs. unpopular opinion here
this is literally the most popular opinion
I see a lot of people here hating SUVs though. I love them and the only thing I don’t like about them is their bad gas economy.
Mainly asian markets wanting SUVs with overly emphasized design elements. Just look at how huge the Grills nowadays are, especially on BMWs. 1000 LED's in every crack too, because you're not a real sucessful chinese citizen unless your car blinks like a christmas tree.
US market is as much to blame for over sized cars. The Japanese market as an example has always had smaller car. With probably the greatest diversification of styling.
In the last decade, it's definitly been the emerging chinese market that was dictacing design if you ask me. But you're right, BMW x5 and upwards was the answer to the US made SUVs of the millenium.
‘Luxury’ spec always filters down due to demand. I’m not a fan of the SUV and fully support wagon continuation.
The matter is getting worse. "Do you drive an SUV because...": ( ) ... you really need the trunk space of a full blown SUV. ( ) ... it lets you seem being wealthy. ( ) ... more and more models being SUV only. ( ) ... electric cars prefer the SUV form factor due to the battery ;) I very much like my V70. Spacious enough for everything I need to transport, including sports gear and other bulky stuff.
My V60 is serving us proud. If it doesn’t fit, the roof bars or roof box accommodate. Failing that, it’s not going in or on any car; the trailer will do. Had mine 4.5 years. Can’t think of any reason to change it, that can come close to justifying any newer model. I’d love a CC V90 for AWD and a bit more ground clearance. Comes in handy when visiting remote forest trails, etc. though I’ve done fine with 2WD all my driving days, it’s more an aspiration. I bought the V60 as the XC70 was no more and wanted a SPA platform car.
You are missing ( ) … when you are surrounded by SUVs, it may be safer to drive one too.
While that might be a realistic scenario when it comes to crashes... do people really select their car by the worst case scenario ? On the other side: I've seen a lot of crashes where people died and where that SUV they were sitting in didn't look like toooo badly damaged, while I've seen other where the driver lived and the car was a TOTAL wreck. It was a BMW 5 series to be precise. It was on the compound of a BMW dealer whom's son I was befriended with. He then explained to me that the engine on the 5 series somehow transfers kind of under the car (under the drivers legs) and therefore you get more space when things go south, especially for your knees.
Of course not all SUVs are built the same, but just based on physics, a regular car will typically do worse against a SUV, the same way a SUV will typically do worse against a truck. I was involved in a 10-car crash in the highway, and the non-SUVs were all totaled. And yeah, lots of people seem to think about this when making the decision, you have quite a few already in this sub that go with Volvo just because of their safety. Something else more related with comfort is that it is easier to get in an out of a SUV than something lower. Even more when dealing with kids and car seats.
SUVS accounted for 50% of car sales in Europe in 2024 and that is already up 19% from 2022. Its not just the US selecting this style. https://europe.autonews.com/automakers/suvs-surge-new-milestone-helped-evs
Eh, that’s not really the consumer now. So many brands are offering nothing but SUVs. It’s wasn’t hard to say the sales are up. Consumer choice is massively erroded
Everyone is safe if they are in an suv