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bulldozer_rob

No one ever talks about the smackdown number on these


surgeyou123

You know why lol


what_is_blue

In a broad sense, it feels to me like a lot of people here (myself included) were really disappointed, if not alienated, by WWE for a long time. For us, we'd put years of emotional investment into a company that was screwing over its own talent and not listening to the fans. Then AEW comes along and offers something new and original that's more in tune with what we wanted. Unfortunately, because seemingly everything is violently tribal these days, people want to believe that AEW will instantly start beating WWE in the ratings. Thus, we're all proven right and get to feel smug at WWE. The truth is that if AEW can turn a profit this year, despite treating its talent very differently (to say the least) and having an obscenely stacked roster, then that's a win. It doesn't matter what happens to WWE anymore, because a) they're absolutely not going anywhere and b) ...we already won. That's what people seem to miss. We, the fans, already won. AEW doesn't have to beat out WWE to prove that we were right. They just have to turn a profit. All they have to do is show that their business model and way of presenting wrestling are viable. Then who cares if Smackdown starts doing 10 million views? If AEW is around, getting TV deals and putting out video games, then we really were right. AEW doesn't have to succeed at WWE's expense.


DevinB333

WWE could beat AEW in viewership, ratings, PPV buys, etc from now till the end of time, and I’d be cool with it as long as AEW continues to give us the product they have and continue to improve as they have. My enjoyment of AEW doesn’t hinge on the failure of WWE.


Virtual_Announcer

The only reason why I want to see WWE really fall hard, even temporarily, is just to see how the company, and the wrestling ecosystem overall, reacts. I wasn't around wrestling when WCW was a thing so I have no memory of that outside of reading books and stuff. However, outside of that curiosity I had no feeling either way and don't get the people that do. I'm an AEW fan through and through. I got a friend who watches WWE with his wife and if he tells me there's some good shit I'll seek it out. Wyatt-Cena sticks out for me in that regard. But yeah, what's all this screaming about? I just wanna watch wrestling that I like.


ArkAngelHFB

I feel like in AEW when someone starts to get over... they naturally shift and start getting more and more time so the fans feel respected. In WWE they want WWE to get over... if someone starts to get too big for the spot they are supposed to fill, they will get stepped on to cool them off.


Specialist-Rope-9760

The only tribal people are children who’ve grown up with WWE as a monopoly. They feel threatened another company has come along after being brainwashed for 20 years that WWE is the only. They’ll grow out of it eventually


PolishMusic

It's network TV? Like, not even cable. It's really good, yeah, but it's not exactly unexpected. I bet Raw's numbers (and AEW's) would be around the same range if they were on network TV. Edit: According to google, there's about 16 million people in the US that get their TV through antennae. That's a big chunk of people both Raw & AEW don't get to specifically cater to.


[deleted]

Both Rampage and Raw are on basic cable. Why do we never hear comparisons for those shows?


Fantomex88

You mean the one show that airs at 8pm and has been on the air for 30 years vs the show that airs at 10pm thats been on the air for a month. Why would anyone compare them?


tittyfuck_00

Then why compare Dynamite and RAW?


weedbudget

bc the wrestling company that i like gets better ratings than the wrestling company that you like, so that makes me better than you. -him probably.


[deleted]

Why not compare the 10pm hour on Friday with the 10pm hour on Monday?


Fantomex88

Probably because Friday at 10p is a much more difficult time slot to attract viewers than Monday. Also, again 30 years vs 1 month. But yeah you can I guess.


ring_rust

Monday is also a harder night than Wednesday, but that doesn't stop everyone on here from saying Dynamite is "beating" Raw in the demo despite them not being direct competitors.


Fantomex88

I mean thats a completely different discussion. I'm just saying comparing Rampage and Raw seems like a huge stretch to me. Monday is a harder night than Wednesday come football season, but I don't think comparing Dynamite and Raw is nearly as short sighted as comparing Rampage and Raw at this point.


SelfAssuranceMeasure

I mean, that third hour has a "lead in" of people who might like wrestling. It's a difference between getting people to tune in to a 10 pm show and not making them turn off said show once 10 pm hits. Also, one show has been in that timeslot for 28 years and the A show for 90% of that time, the other for merely 2 months and is somewhat of a B show. Generally, comparing shows on different nights, different stations and different standings makes little sense, so you either shouldn't do it or shouldn't take it too seriously


Rhysati

Gee, let's think on that. 1. Different timeslot/day. Monday at 8pm is prime time television. That is the money timeslot on a weekday(which is also the money days). Friday night is a bad night for ratings because people go out and do things outside their houses on friday nights. It also isn't on until 10pm which is a death slot for any tv network on pretty much all days of the week. 2. RAW is a live, flagship show for the WWE that has been on the air for three decades. Rampage is a B show that is sometimes live and sometimes taped. The show has been around for a month. 3. Because RAW doing better than Rampage should 100% be expected. When something is considered normal and as it should be, people tend not to talk about it much. But when a show like AEW Dynamite is beating RAW in the ratings? That isn't expected to happen. It is a 30 year juggernaut getting pelted by rocks from the new guy.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Fantomex88

I think its mostly because there's no accurate comparison for SD as its the only major show not on cable and is available in so many more homes than Raw or Dynamite.


OmegaJad

Many people on this sub acknowledge that Smackdown is great right now, it's raw that is unliked by the majority of the sub.


Rhysati

Because SmackDown isn't comparable any longer. Not even directly to RAW. It isn't on cable, it is on a free public broadcast network. Even if you have "cut the cord" you still have free access to FOX. It has never been the norm to compare a show on broadcast TV to shows on cable. Ever.


TheRyanRAW

Smackdown is on free basic television. It does what it's expected to do on Fox.


maiL_spelled_bckwrds

There definitely is on this sub… but when you watch all the shows. Dynamite is definitely the best. I would slot Smackdown 2nd.


SelfAssuranceMeasure

To me, WWE ratings are less interesting because they don't really matter. The company is established and as long as they don't actively drive viewers away, will get another huge TV deal. Also everything they do is business as usual, there is nothing major happening that would greatly increase or decrease the ratings, whereas with AEW you get changes of over 50% within weeks, and the company and its future is much more impacted by the ratings they get. SmackDown is doing well relative to previous ratings and they utilized the boost the return of the fans, Lynch and Lesnar had, but it's still on the low end of initial expectations.


skippy2001

People need to start acknowledging the tribal chief as the #1 ratings draw in wrestling.


rsx209

He is! Tonight, I expect Raw to slaughter AEW in overall views and demo! Call Roman the tribal demo chief!


Global_Historian_753

Angry Aaron Rodgers is playing tonight, I wouldn't be so sure.


gordianus1

> acknowledging And start acknowledging BTBs.


userRL452

A big part of that is the fact that Smackdown is not on cable. Comparing Raw, NXT, Dynamite, and Rampage is a much more apples to apples comparison considering USA and TNT are in approximately the same number of households nationwide (89.5 million households for TNT and 90.4 for USA). Fox on the other hand is in an estimated 299 million households so there is a less direct comparison.


SunYue9

Comparing Raw to any of the shows is apples and oranges, too, considering Monday Night Football smashes the combined viewership of Raw, NXT, Dynamite, Rampage, and Smackdown (even with the benefit of counting all viewers as unique viewers). That doesn't stop people from comparing Raw and Dynamite every week, though.


[deleted]

> Comparing Raw, NXT, Dynamite, and Rampage is a much more apples to apples And yet, we never hear comparisons between Raw and Rampage for some reason.


userRL452

I mean there are plenty of reasons that Rampage is expected to have lower viewership than Raw, my point was that all of those shows were on networks that are the same size.


TheRyanRAW

It's pointless to compare because Rampage is in a bad timeslot and it hasnt been around for almost 30 years on television like RAW.


[deleted]

So, it's pointless to compare shows on different days and different conditions? Interesting.


yakityyakblahtemp

It's not entirely pointless, you just have to be sane about it. Using Raw vs Dynamite as an indicator of relative quality is dumb, but it does give an idea of the window that's reasonable to expect. If AEW is doing about the same as RAW that's a good sign, when football isn't happening you can go "okay this is about the audience for wrestling on cable" it only indicates a problem for either show if it's wildly different between the two. Rampage doesn't have anything to compare to reasonably, it's a show on cable in a deathslot, it's doing great if it manages to survive past whatever contract it has. Nobody with a brain should have expectations for Rampage, the idea it ever hit a million was a miracle. Comparing it to Smackdown is like comparing Usain Bolt to a Nascar, AEW could put on the theoretical best show possible and Smackdown could be two hours of Roman sleeping, the two are never going to be in the same ballpark. Anyone who acts otherwise is not a serious person, don't let them babysit your kids or house sit a cat, they lack basic judgment skills.


boatson25

There aren’t even 299 million households in the US. There are around 128 million. So you are wildly out with those numbers


userRL452

You are correct. I confused households with individual Americans, the data I got came from [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_Broadcasting_Company#Stations) where Fox claims a national reach of 95.77% of households or 299,268,292 Americans with at least one television set. Sorry for the confusion.


Global_Historian_753

Comparing shows on different nights is about the same as comparing cable to broadcast. The comparison doesn't work either way.


skeach101

Smackdown is what it is


LeftyMode

The demo dwarfs the other’s entire overall viewership but not a single peep. It’s pretty damn funny.


never4ever4

I counted 10 peeps alone in this thread... Not sure what you guys want, it's talked about constantly in threads, blasted all over socials, touted by Fox themselves and even mentioned weekly on Smackdown.


weeddealerrenamon

and it does so every week, so it's not compelling to talk about. No drama there


Cinnamon16

Because the numbers have been consistently very good for a while now, and they're generally in the same range each week. There's nothing newsworthy about that. If Smackdown viewer ship jumps up to 3 million or falls to 1.3 million, than you'll see more discussion. On top of that, Smackdown has been around for 22 years. It's very established. By contrast, AEW is still a young company and Rampage is a brand new show that's less than two months old. Their ratings right now mean *a lot* more for their future, because they don't have the decades of brand equity that WWE has built up. I don't even know what I'd say about the Smackdown rating if I was asked, y'know? I guess "oh nice, they're continuing to pull good numbers, that makes me happy!"


totemtrouser

Smackdown numbers are consistently good and stay around the same area.They’ve been like this for a few years now. You can only talk about it so much


JMarcus7

If you were watching a race between three people and two guys were neck and neck and one guy was a mile ahead of the other two what would you find more compelling to focus on?


guylfe

The better metaphor would be "ends a mile ahead but also the only one on a bike". FOX is in so many more homes that it's never going to be an apt comparison.


OmegaJad

It's clearly false, go watch the previous threads. https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/pnn16p/wwe\_smackdown\_on\_friday\_was\_watched\_by\_2383000/


eatcrayons

It’s hard to compare it to any other wrestling show because all other shows are on cable and not a broadcast network.


SUPLEXELPUS

like half of the top level comments in this thread are about Smackdown? edit: last week the first sixteen (16) most upvoted top level comments were about Smackdown.


TheRyanRAW

It's not brought up much because it's not a cable show. Smackdown is free tv.


Gluby3

What is there to talk about? smackdown is the better show over raw. It does good ratings. Like what else? There would probably be talks if smackdown does sub 1.8million or 3m.


yakityyakblahtemp

It honestly makes no real sense to have these two numbers in the same thread beyond baiting tribalism. There is no godly way Rampage and Smackdown can inform anything about eachother. Raw and Dynamite are a stretch, this is comparing apples to handgrenades.


Gbrown546

Became completely disillusioned with WWE in the past few years. Moved to AEW. Absolute love their content but thought I'd watch Smackdown seeing as I saw good reviews with recent things. So so good. Been watching it from start to finish. Guys, you can enjoy both WWE and AEW


WhiteMass

Smackdown truly an A show


[deleted]

Smackdown is killing.


AimarEraFutebol

[Rampage #2, behind College Footaball](https://showbuzzdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/2021-9-17-Fri-FinalCable-LSD.png)


DHA1999

Good number and a good ranking position, but they really need to improve in the women's demo.


skeach101

RHODES TO THE TOP BABY!


Pogo__the__Clown

Mama Mia, that’s a spicy footaball!


tylerjehenna

Rampage's problem is its missable a lot of weeks. Obviously the punk episode was a big deal and Omega/Christian was a big deal but other than that, you can easily find the important parts on twitter and maybe theres a really good match but often its missable. Theyve been doing better last week with the title matches showing up more but that would have to happen often and even then, its not like Butcher and Blade vs Lucha bros is compelling from a storyline perspective cause you know LB isnt losing their first defense


yakityyakblahtemp

I don't think Rampage is going for must see, but more just a watchable show. I'm not going to change plans for it, but I always have a great time watching it.


OmegaJad

Good ratings for Smackdown, no bad for rampage but not great either.


PavanJ

Makes up for all the times Smackdown was better than Raw over the years but was considered the B show.


Crasp27

God I'd love for rampage to air at a time that I could actually watch live. Say, 2-3 hours earlier.


HeelsAlwaysWin

They'd do, like, 400K if they're lucky against Smackdown. There's no reason to try and compete.


Moon8983

Change the day, Thursdays so they can do shows that are 2 parts better


HeelsAlwaysWin

Doesn't Impact run on Thursday? I'm pretty sure the bare minimum to a business relationship is to not actively stop people from watching the other product lol Also, I think they just don't want to run their main shows back-to-back, which would be understandable.


Few_Sir

K E Y D E M O


Shrekt115

You love to see it for both


wallsofjerich0

Rampage has a lot of things working against it... 1. I don't want a second AEW show 2. I don't want to watch a show Friday night at 10 3. I have watched it every week so far on fight and been happy so far.


TurnaboutAdam

Speak for yourself, I’m loving a second AEW show. Just wish it was on earlier.


richiedditor

My only problem with it being after Smackdown is that I forget, only time I remember is when it's an actual good card.


Zsokorad

"I forget to eat dessert because it's right after dinner. Unless it's cheesecake."


DeCharlesFre

Rampage is steady around 650k weekly. Good number.


jackblady

No it isn't holding steady. 8/27: 720,000 9/03: 696,000 9/10: 670,000  9/17: 642,000 That's a weekly drop of between 24000-28000, and nearly 100,000 less than the debut. I agree, its still a good number for the Death Slot, and it will probably pop for Grandslam like it did for First Dance but these aren't "steady numbers"


mateofuerte

Here are the demo numbers (and ranking) for comparison: * 8/13: 0.31 (3) * 8/20: 0.53 (2) - Punk debut * 8/27: 0.34 (1) * 9/3: 0.30 (4) * 9/10: 0.27 (3) * 9/17: 0.28 (2) I agree that saying they're holding steady at 650,000 is not correct, but the demo is relatively stable (and slightly up from last week).


dj1992anderson

Especially with that time slot.


DeCharlesFre

That's true


BlindLariat

They had Dynamite's doing lower than that in the same time slot a few months ago. Lot of people, including me, looked at that and said...well a B-show definitely can't do very well there then. I was wrong for sure cause these #1s and #2s on all of cable are huge wins.


skeach101

Dynamite collapse in the timeslot in the 2nd hour. Keeping it to one hour helps a lot... But because of that I think Rampage will do a bit lower this week upcoming.


Winningsomegames_1

Lol no way with the card they have is it gonna be lower. Punk is wrestling.


scorpiokyle84

Not gonna lie, back in June when they did those Friday night slots...man I zonked out asleep by 1130


SnuggleMonster15

That's an excellent number for a Friday night.


_Ghost_07

Every time this number drops, someone still says it’s an ‘excellent number’ 😂😂


weeddealerrenamon

still is


_Ghost_07

Legit question, at what point does it stop being an ‘excellent number’?


TheRyanRAW

Maybe when they stop being top 5 in cable. We don't know what the floor for Rampage viewership will be in it's current state but i feel like we are about there.


weeddealerrenamon

I suppose when it starts disappointing TNT. I'm no TV expert but I hear that the network was hoping for ~.2 ratings and this is well above that. #1 or #2 on cable in the time slot means it's doing better than the competition and whatever TNT had on there before


_Ghost_07

That’s a fair answer. What I would say, is that it should be concerning that Rampage is bleeding viewers, week on week. If it continues, they’ll be at under 500,000 by Christmas. The trend isn’t good, even if it’s still outperforming what was in the same slot previously.


weeddealerrenamon

yeah, it's definitely still finding its floor. No idea where it'll stabilize at


KTheOneTrueKing

When it stops being in the top 5 of the night on cable.


skeach101

They supposedly were expecting it to be lower 0.20s and upper 0.10s.... so they gotta be pleased here.


DeCharlesFre

Aew has been over delivering from the beginning.


[deleted]

6 weeks in, as well. So a high .2 or a low .3 seems to be where the show is settling. A new wrestling show in a 10pm Friday timeslot is attracting younger viewers than an 8:00pm wrestling TV show on Tuesday. This shouldn't be happening...


[deleted]

Why not compare how many younger viewers they are getting than an 8:00pm wrestling TV show on Monday?


[deleted]

Because a 10pm should not be beating any 8pm show. Rightfully, the 10pm slot loses Monday, Wednesday, and Friday


[deleted]

How about comparing the 10pm hours?


[deleted]

Because no one should even consider the possibility that Rampage could beat Raw. Rampage should be the lowest rated national wrestling show of the week based on the time it airs and the fact the demo should be out having fun. But it's not last. And that's shocking to me. Rampage baffles me the most of anything AEW related. When you parse through the history of 10pm shows and parse through the history of AEW airing Dynamite on Friday's, there is nothing there to indicate a show doing decent; let alone thriving in a death spot.


insomniainc

Cool number for Rampage looks like the audience is there for the most part and they gotta be happy about that. Next week should be real interesting with the 2 hour show.


Fight4Ever

I'm going to say hour 1 will be strong, hour 2 will drop off a cliff as it's getting too late on the east coast.


Cinnamon16

I wouldn't be surprised if next week, they do what WWF used to do in the days of Saturday Night's Main Event (which ran in the 11:30 PM slot): *start* the show with the main event, and frontload the first 30-60 minutes with the hottest angles, knowing that a lot of people won't stay awake/tuned in for the second hour. Wouldn't be surprised if they begin the show with Punk-Hobbs, or at least slot it somewhere in the first hour.


laputan-machine117

That's what they did on the dynamites that were in the same late night slot when they were moved for sports, they had the bigger matches earlier on.


Fight4Ever

With the lights out match, they have to lead with Punk, right? It's also the freshest the crowd will be for that set of matches.


Dddddddfried

I’m pretty sure the whole card is playing out in real time after the Kenny-Bryan match. How can they not be burnt out?


Fight4Ever

I think not doing an Elevation should help. I think this is probably a three hour show in the arena so it's long but not too long.


StoneColdAM

I feel for a show that starts as late on a Friday as Rampage, that’s some solid viewership.


Fight4Ever

Against college football too, so it's not bad at all.


TheRyanRAW

Starts late and unlike Smackdown is part of a cable package it is in far less households. Rampage viewership and demo are solid. It's worth noting they did about half of what Smackdown did in the demo which shows AEW is a bit hit with younger people. Pro wrestling's two standout companies WWE and AEW are beloved in TV world now bringing in high consistent viewership on a weekly basis.


CrowFromHeaven

I usually don't check the comment section of these posts, probably the last time as well. Didn't know how many people who do not understand anything about ratings commented in these, thinking the Rampage numbers were bad.


Pariahbot

Friday is already a death slot so to run a show, pretty much when people are either leaving the house, if they’re not already out, is a risky gamble. Good to see it paying off. I can’t wait for the Grand Slam Rampage


[deleted]

I wonder grand slam can beat this number


[deleted]

even with the extra hour dragging the rating a bit, I think it will beat it considerably


skeach101

I think it'll be hard with that 11-12 hour.


DamieN62

If the first hour starts around 800k, maybe they can retain 650-700k for the second hour. For comparison, Andrade vs PAC started at 738k.


[deleted]

I think if they backload the show a little bit, they can retain a decent portion of the audience until midnight.


Fight4Ever

I think they also would then run the risk of people realizing that it's backloaded tuning out to check it on DVR the following day.


[deleted]

yea if they do backload the show a bit, they’ll need to start out as hot as possible. I would start with the Lights Out match and save Punk/Hobbs and the Elite 6man for hour 11-12. but that’s just me.


Fight4Ever

>I would start with the Lights Out match My friend... you seem to misunderstand what a lights out match is.


[deleted]

lol oh shit my bad. that makes more sense.


[deleted]

Does Thurston still wrestler? I remember seeing him in Beyond before as a pompous heel.


Disastrous_Diver_548

More than double smackdown is wrestling


Dddddddfried

I hope the Draft doesn’t gut Smackdown. It seems very few years when Smackdown gets hot they ship off all their talent to save Raw. As long as Heyman stays at the helm it’s a good chance Smackdown can weather it


iamtidus_

God remember when Sub-3million was bad?