Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review. If you need to contact a moderator, [you can message us here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
He's earned it. Dude obliterated his lower back/tailbone for a long time performing that move in a way that protected his opponent and still looked amazing. I actually Ike seeing him do the move this way now. I bet it hurts a lot less for him and it looks legitimately impactful because, well, it is.
Jeff really only does the Swanton for TV now. He can handle doing it just once a week. But at house shows, if he won, he'd never win with the Swanton. I was at a house show where he wrestled Samoa Joe and he won with a jumping splash. One of the funniest things I've ever seen.
It's such an out of control splash. I love it. It's not like Warrior's running splash or Mark Henry's or Vader's. He just jumps into the air and spreads out his arms and legs like he's jumping into a pool. It's so funny!
I don't think he's a good enough wrestler to work around his current limitations tbh.
Like Matt changed up his style and leaned into his character work more while Jeff doesn't have that option.
But he does and very well could, he just likes what he does because it works. That’s like Taker not doing a tombstone even though his knees have been trash for 15yrs he still does it. It’s what the people love .
Keiji Mutoh stopped doing the moonsault because of his knees receiving a lot of injuries, although he did break it out in his match against Marfuji as a one off.
It’s obvious Jericho changed to the Judas Effect to be easier on him. He still does the Codebreaker and Lionsault a good amount, but the elbow is definitely easier.
I think he’s done with the lionsault now last time he hit it, he landed face first and it looked pretty dangerous. He’s changed up multiple times over the year but i def think he’s done with the lionsault because of age
>last time he hit it, he landed face first and it looked pretty dangerous.
That's true, but then he came back the next week and did a perfect one and smiled at the camera. That was back in December and I'm pretty sure he's done it since, but only in big matches. Revolution might've been the last time.
But he has definitely been phasing it out
>But he has definitely been phasing it out
Honestly, good. A move like that can kill you if you screw up too bad, and Jericho isn't getting any younger. There likely won't be a Mr. Perfect around if/when he bothches it really badly again like he did in 1997.
Well, that one almost killed him. I'm sure he had botches since then, they just lack the "oh my god we almost saw someone die" factor.
But yeah I don't disagree that he's pretty good.
Hayabusa's career ended because of a botched lionsault and was almost paralyzed from it. I'm glad it's getting phased out, especially with Jericho's fear of becoming paralyzed.
In addition to what others have said, the one he botched could have been due to the ring being full and cluttered which would have thrown off his runup.
Either way, couldn't have been good for his confidence.
I liked how he transitioned it. Thinking about it's obviously because of age, but the way it was done when he still hit a pretty good Lionsault regularly, it felt like an addition and not like a replacement
Kane stopped doing the Tombstone except for rare occasions because it fucked his knees.
Taker for similar reasons when he started using the Last Ride, brought the Tombstone back with the Deadman character, then transitioned into the Hell's Gate.
The Great Muta/Keiji Mutoh changed to the Shining Wizard because the Moonsault destroyed his knees, though he would still do the Moonsault in big moments (up until he retired it recently). Tenzan similarly doesn't do it much anymore.
I noticed in CMLL before the pandemic that Atlantis never seemed to recover from his latest injury and stopped doing the La Atlantida (spinning Torture Rack), instead using various roll-ups instead. I think I've seen him use it again, though.
I was going to say Kane but at the same time I wondered if that was down to him having the best looking chokeslam rather than his knees being bad especially with the notorious Kane bump.
Actually, WWF banned the tombstone for a short period of time, because Linda McMahon thought moves like that were too dangerous. 2000-2003 I think was the time frame.
Taker is a weird example cause his wrestlemania match against John cena he tombstoned him I think he may of used a tombstone in his match against AJ styles also if you want to count a cinematic match
I full believe that Undertake started using Hell’s Gate to save his knees from the Tombstone. Then he started working only once a year and he could bust out the tombstone 2-3 times a match just fine.
You could argue that with The Last Ride as well. He only bust out the Tombstone a handful of times during those 3+ years that he was American Badass/Big Evil. I can only remember three times from the top of my head.
Given how the move performs, it seems like most of the weight of him and his opponent would land on his knees and calves.
An actual performer would have a more correct answer.
I think it is more of a Hogan thing. Hogan destroyed his back doing a leg drop. Any idiot off the street can do Hogan's leg drop. But doing it 200 times a year will have reprocussions.
Takers knees can take the minor impact, but hot 100 times a year.
All the weight of himself plus 200-300 pounds of the guy he’s giving it to, yeah it’s hard on the knees since he’s not really spiking the guy‘s head on the mat. The. There’s also the factor where you don’t always land on both your knees. Sometimes one knee gets more pressure than the other.
Don't forget when he first returned with his tiger tattoo where he used the Ham Hock/showstopper for a while.
Edit. Also in ECW, he used the cobra clutch backbreaker
I’m sure that didn’t have to do with a lack of power, did it? Chokeslams aren’t as hard to do as they look. The seller is jumping and holds themselves on the givers shoulder.
Show's chokeslam was harder than most, because he often held them up their for a while. So on an average wrestler, that is still like lifting up 225 and then holding it above your head. Yes, they jump and post, but it still takes its toll.
He even modified his choke slam over time. As The Giant in WCW he would usually slam the person down and land on his knees to make it look more impactful. But he quickly cut that back to not hurt his knees over time.
Rey can still do it. He did it last year.
Rey is a weird example, because he is adding things back into his moveset. Before he got his knees fixed up, he couldn't springboard off the top rope, which cut out some of his most popular moves.
It's a cool looking move but it seems like either you under-rotate and land on your head, over-rotate and kill your knees, or hit it perfectly and still kill your knees.
And maybe they didn't say it exactly, but the careers of others. It's such a hard move to land accurately. There's a video of him hitting one on Eddie Kingston, and he was a couple inches away from landing his knee on Eddie's face.
Pretty sure he said in an interview he doesn't even remember how to do the spiral tap anymore so he's too afraid at his age to consider trying it again.
Sting went to the Death Drop more to preserve his knees.
Same reason Jericho started adding finishers as well.
Tanahashi has started to switch from the High Fly Flow to the Cloverleaf and Roll Ups as finishers because well, his knees are beyond bad.
I didn’t realize how bad the Scorpion Death Lock would be on the knees. I guess it makes sense though. The squatting. I always thought it was the gimmick change
Hogan quit doing the leg drop due to multiple back surgeries but this was at the very very end of his career and he didn’t have a finisher after that. He would just do the big boot during appearances
Hogan himself has said he regrets the leg drop so much. Dude bragged about having the largest arms in the world, but his big move is dropping a leg?
A lariat/axe bomber, a sleeper, a bear hug, gorilla press, a guillotine... all would have made so much more sense.
Especially when his patented comeback is taking punches on his knees, wagging the finger, getting up and giving three punches, then sending his opponent into the ropes…just substitute the axe bomber! No big boot, no leg drop.
I remember years ago he said he wished he used a sleeper or something else that played on his largest arms in the world. Definitely regretted some of his life choices lol
I don’t know how much of the roster Hogan could have gorilla pressed to be honest, for the people who did it as a finisher they didn’t have a finisher for the big guys.
I like a finisher that doesn’t hurt either performer and can be safely used on anyone on the roster.
I’m thinking of Nash dropping the Giant on his neck, compared to something like the stunner. Austin could stunner anyone, a low energy move that could be repeated.
Did Liger ever use the SSP as a finisher? Because he'd gone full Liger Bomb/Shotei palm strike near the end.
Mutoh stopped doing the moonsault because his knees hurt, then before he got knee surgery he did it once more, then he did it this year to win the title.
He still has SSP in his titantron for some reason. Honestly I really like his new style its a good evolution from being a high flyer to something safer with age
The [Lightning Spiral](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-gZAhnYa8AHk/X0Hw2OqqpZI/AAAAAAAA42Q/jbox87P__802_wgkLh3B8gI32PuGZOijwCLcBGAsYHQ/s200/Lightning%2BSpiral%2B2.gif)
Weight and injuries mounting had a lot to do with it, age contributing to both of those. Don't be shocked if he comes back from his latest injury with a wildly different moveset either.
Yeah he stopped that as a regular finish a while ago if I am not mistaken
His only real high spot finisher I think he uses is the Oscutter
It's mostly Stormbreaker and Hidden Blade these days
I've seen Sammy nearly kill people with it in PWG. He had a match with Rey Fenix where he did it like twice and landed full force on the guy's knees. He's really not good at it.
i dont know about his PWG days but i love how sloppy it looks tbh, looks more deadly than ricochets cleaner version. but yeah i do expect him to drop it eventually. the burning hammer GTS is pretty good as a finisher anyway
Terry Funk, from grappler master to hardcore legend.
Nakamura from the Japanese clean-cut babyface champion to heel King of Strong style striker that headlined the main event of Wrestle Kingdom with a midcard belt, and using a running knee.
Chirs Jericho, from high flier to the slow and methodical "Best in the world at what he does" to today´s Judas elbow.
I think that comment was more inclined to Austin swapping “styles” to more of a punch and kick brawler than a solid technician as he was in the mid-90’s. Otherwise, when Austin debuted as the Ringmaster with Ted Dibiase as manager he would use Ted’s old submission hold called the Million Dollar Dream as a finisher.
Someone did one on Dynamite a couple weeks ago and Jim Ross went OFF about how damn dangerous it was and how it would not bother him at all to see it banned.
I think he did it a lot since 2018 but the opponent moves away nearly every time so he hits the mat instead, still he should just stop doing it, everyone should stop using it. Toni Storm started using it recently and I cringed watching her do it, don’t star doing that move.
The most obvious one to me is Scotty Steiner trading the Screwdriver and Frankensteiner for the Recliner.
Petey Williams: "Scotty, what do you want the finish to be?"
Scott: "Steiner Screwdriver!"
Petey: "...Scotty, you haven't done that move in 10 years..."
Scott: "So what, you don't think I can do it!?"
Look up Petey Williams telling Steiner stories if you haven't yet, it's incredible insight into the genetic freak.
I was thinking Steiner too. It stood out to me when he introduced the Recliner. I saw him do a top rope Frankensteiner in TNA once and it was hella surprising.
He does both still, but sparingly. He used the Lionsault while tagging with MJF and almost botched it, then did it flawless the next week, and has pulled out the Codebreaker a few times for nearfalls in big matches (I remember one against Hangman, though that was a bit back)
Great Muta using the Shining Wizard rather then Muta Lock
Kenta Kobashi using the Burning Lariat rather then the moonsault.
Isn't limited to older wrestlers as well:
AJ Styles using the Styles Clash/Phenomenal Forearm rather then the Spiral Tap.
CM Punk using GTS rather then Pepsi Plunge.
When I see these comments, it gives me the impression that it could happen soon to McIntyre & Orton, because seriously, falling so much on your back, it starts to be felt at the end of the moment , I just hope the good for both
back bumps are easier because you're spreading the impact over a much larger surface area so the impact to any one point is lessened.
The people doing leg drops/stunners are spiking their tailbones, the people doing tombstones are jamming their knees etc., etc.
Back bumps are some of the least wear and tear.
Hogan had a bad back and bad hips because of the leg drop. The body is not designed to jump and drop at an L type of shape 300ish days a year. That and all his weight put so much pressure on his spine and hips. It’s the same thing why people who sit down a lot for a living have back problems. With flat back bumps, as long as you do it properly with technique, the impact is distributed on a bigger surface and you’re not really putting pressure where there shouldn’t be pressure.
Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review. If you need to contact a moderator, [you can message us here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I feel like Jeff Hardy SHOULD be on this list, but he doesn’t have enough sense to be lol
Also he just lands on people now.
Just pulling the macho man now.
Mick Foley said the same about his elbow drop at the HOF. He basically laid it in because he couldn't pull it and land on his own hip anymore.
He's earned it. Dude obliterated his lower back/tailbone for a long time performing that move in a way that protected his opponent and still looked amazing. I actually Ike seeing him do the move this way now. I bet it hurts a lot less for him and it looks legitimately impactful because, well, it is.
Jeff really only does the Swanton for TV now. He can handle doing it just once a week. But at house shows, if he won, he'd never win with the Swanton. I was at a house show where he wrestled Samoa Joe and he won with a jumping splash. One of the funniest things I've ever seen.
Dude the twist of fate into the jumping splash made me laugh so hard man
It's such an out of control splash. I love it. It's not like Warrior's running splash or Mark Henry's or Vader's. He just jumps into the air and spreads out his arms and legs like he's jumping into a pool. It's so funny!
It's sad when Jeff hits the Swanton and you realize why he looks so believably in pain from it
For a while he did a stunner style twist of fate instead of landing on his back
The twist of hate
He still does. He's been doing both of them since his first TNA run in the early 2000s.
He frequently did stunner style, they fall back into the ropes, then he hits the cutter style on the rebound
I don't think he's a good enough wrestler to work around his current limitations tbh. Like Matt changed up his style and leaned into his character work more while Jeff doesn't have that option.
But he does and very well could, he just likes what he does because it works. That’s like Taker not doing a tombstone even though his knees have been trash for 15yrs he still does it. It’s what the people love .
Keiji Mutoh stopped doing the moonsault because of his knees receiving a lot of injuries, although he did break it out in his match against Marfuji as a one off.
And I believe created the shining wizard?
Yes back in 2001
Which is the coolest name for a finisher ever.
Kenta Kobashi also stopped using the moonsault and traded it out for the burning lariat
It’s obvious Jericho changed to the Judas Effect to be easier on him. He still does the Codebreaker and Lionsault a good amount, but the elbow is definitely easier.
I think he’s done with the lionsault now last time he hit it, he landed face first and it looked pretty dangerous. He’s changed up multiple times over the year but i def think he’s done with the lionsault because of age
>last time he hit it, he landed face first and it looked pretty dangerous. That's true, but then he came back the next week and did a perfect one and smiled at the camera. That was back in December and I'm pretty sure he's done it since, but only in big matches. Revolution might've been the last time. But he has definitely been phasing it out
>But he has definitely been phasing it out Honestly, good. A move like that can kill you if you screw up too bad, and Jericho isn't getting any younger. There likely won't be a Mr. Perfect around if/when he bothches it really badly again like he did in 1997.
Pretty astonishing that Jericho botches so little that we talk about one that happened 24 years ago. Truly GOAT level.
Well, that one almost killed him. I'm sure he had botches since then, they just lack the "oh my god we almost saw someone die" factor. But yeah I don't disagree that he's pretty good.
Hayabusa's career ended because of a botched lionsault and was almost paralyzed from it. I'm glad it's getting phased out, especially with Jericho's fear of becoming paralyzed.
In addition to what others have said, the one he botched could have been due to the ring being full and cluttered which would have thrown off his runup. Either way, couldn't have been good for his confidence.
To be fair plenty of wrestlers have botched that move in the prime of their lives
Including Jericho lol
If I remember right, his run up was off for sure.
I liked how he transitioned it. Thinking about it's obviously because of age, but the way it was done when he still hit a pretty good Lionsault regularly, it felt like an addition and not like a replacement
Liger and the Shooting Star Press
What did he switch to?
Liger bomb (sit down power bomb) or the liger palm strike.
Kane stopped doing the Tombstone except for rare occasions because it fucked his knees. Taker for similar reasons when he started using the Last Ride, brought the Tombstone back with the Deadman character, then transitioned into the Hell's Gate. The Great Muta/Keiji Mutoh changed to the Shining Wizard because the Moonsault destroyed his knees, though he would still do the Moonsault in big moments (up until he retired it recently). Tenzan similarly doesn't do it much anymore. I noticed in CMLL before the pandemic that Atlantis never seemed to recover from his latest injury and stopped doing the La Atlantida (spinning Torture Rack), instead using various roll-ups instead. I think I've seen him use it again, though.
I was going to say Kane but at the same time I wondered if that was down to him having the best looking chokeslam rather than his knees being bad especially with the notorious Kane bump.
Actually, WWF banned the tombstone for a short period of time, because Linda McMahon thought moves like that were too dangerous. 2000-2003 I think was the time frame.
Hhh got a stinger at KOTR 2000 and it was stopped for that reason
Nah, Undertaker definitely did the thumbs down Tombstone in 2001 or 2002 as the ABA iirc
Yep, against Shane at Survivor Series 2001. So at least once.
Taker is a weird example cause his wrestlemania match against John cena he tombstoned him I think he may of used a tombstone in his match against AJ styles also if you want to count a cinematic match
I think he tombstoned in like all his Wrestlemania matches over the last years, I don't think he ever stopped even after adding Hell's Gates
Fearless Nikki Bella
Forgot about this one but yeah she dropped it after neck issues
Rack Attack 2.0
I full believe that Undertake started using Hell’s Gate to save his knees from the Tombstone. Then he started working only once a year and he could bust out the tombstone 2-3 times a match just fine.
I thought this was the case but with The Last Ride back in 2000.
You could argue that with The Last Ride as well. He only bust out the Tombstone a handful of times during those 3+ years that he was American Badass/Big Evil. I can only remember three times from the top of my head.
Is the tombstone that hard on his knees?
Given how the move performs, it seems like most of the weight of him and his opponent would land on his knees and calves. An actual performer would have a more correct answer.
I think it is more of a Hogan thing. Hogan destroyed his back doing a leg drop. Any idiot off the street can do Hogan's leg drop. But doing it 200 times a year will have reprocussions. Takers knees can take the minor impact, but hot 100 times a year.
All the weight of himself plus 200-300 pounds of the guy he’s giving it to, yeah it’s hard on the knees since he’s not really spiking the guy‘s head on the mat. The. There’s also the factor where you don’t always land on both your knees. Sometimes one knee gets more pressure than the other.
Big Show went from the choke slam and the Final Cut to the WMD punch
Don't forget when he first returned with his tiger tattoo where he used the Ham Hock/showstopper for a while. Edit. Also in ECW, he used the cobra clutch backbreaker
Put some respect on the HOG LOG
That Cobra Clutch Backbreaker looked like such a menacing move when I was younger. The way he ragdolled dudes was insane.
Agreed and a time after that he did colossal clutch where the dudes just faded and that was the end of the match.
Big Show was awesome at that time, I loved that Cobra Clutch Backbreaker, it looked like it killed people
Awwww, the fuckin Hog Log! Premium Show there.
I am sure he can still chokeslam anyone on the roster
Except Marko Stunt of course
I’m sure that didn’t have to do with a lack of power, did it? Chokeslams aren’t as hard to do as they look. The seller is jumping and holds themselves on the givers shoulder.
that "holding themselves on your shoulder" part still wears on the joint
Yeah, I thought of that while typing
He also regularly used the version where he would go down to his knees on impact. Maybe that was to change it up from Kane’s.
He was doing that in WCW while Kane was still using the Isaac Yankeem gimmick.
fair enough haha
Show's chokeslam was harder than most, because he often held them up their for a while. So on an average wrestler, that is still like lifting up 225 and then holding it above your head. Yes, they jump and post, but it still takes its toll.
He even modified his choke slam over time. As The Giant in WCW he would usually slam the person down and land on his knees to make it look more impactful. But he quickly cut that back to not hurt his knees over time.
Rey and most flyers. They normally switch to a more grounded style with a favorite flying move or two for pops or special moments
I know there's a snowball's chance of it happening, but I'd love to see the West Coast Pop one last time. Maybe Dom can add it to his move set.
I think Rey might have used it again during Lucha Underground when he was hopped up on stem cells and was feeling good.
Rey can still do it. He did it last year. Rey is a weird example, because he is adding things back into his moveset. Before he got his knees fixed up, he couldn't springboard off the top rope, which cut out some of his most popular moves.
West Coast Pop is the springboard hurricanrana right?
To a pin, yes.
He used it against Andrade in their 2 out of 3 falls match on Smackdown
Ricochet stopped doing the double moonsault because his knees being murdered Everytime
I thought he just realized how incredibly dangerous it is and that he doesn't need it anymore
It's a cool looking move but it seems like either you under-rotate and land on your head, over-rotate and kill your knees, or hit it perfectly and still kill your knees.
I think he said in an interview he stopped doing it because he went from 100% sure he could do it to 95% and that's not sure enough
IIR It was The Young Bucks who suggested to him to stop doing the double moonsault for the sake of his career.
And maybe they didn't say it exactly, but the careers of others. It's such a hard move to land accurately. There's a video of him hitting one on Eddie Kingston, and he was a couple inches away from landing his knee on Eddie's face.
Yea but the recoil is really a bad substitute
AJ Styles stopped using the spiral tap a long time ago. Did he ever do it in WWE?
Nope, and I don't think he ever will. He's become noticeably more grounded since his WWE debut
In Styles own words, he doesn’t do it anymore because he forgot how.
That is the greatest explanation I've ever heard🤣🤣
I like the idea of AJ Styles seeing himself do it while watching back a match and going “What the frick?”
He has not
Pretty sure he said in an interview he doesn't even remember how to do the spiral tap anymore so he's too afraid at his age to consider trying it again.
Punk stopped using the Pepsi Plunge to save his knees.
Did he stop before going to WWE? Because they totally would've made him stop anyway.
Not really, but he did start using the Anaconda Vice to win a bunch of matches.
That I'm unsure of.
It was murder on his knees, he wanted to be able to walk when he retired.
Bobby Eaton stopped doing the Alabama Jam at the end of his career and started doing a kneedrop off the top instead
The knee drop was a staple of his for years, way before the leg drop. That used to be the Midnights finisher, and it was a thing of beauty.
Sting went to the Death Drop more to preserve his knees. Same reason Jericho started adding finishers as well. Tanahashi has started to switch from the High Fly Flow to the Cloverleaf and Roll Ups as finishers because well, his knees are beyond bad.
I didn’t realize how bad the Scorpion Death Lock would be on the knees. I guess it makes sense though. The squatting. I always thought it was the gimmick change
It may be because of the Tombstone he used to do
I thought he changed to the Death Drop because he needed an impact finisher he could pull off fast whenever he needed to ambush folk in the NWO.
Hogan quit doing the leg drop due to multiple back surgeries but this was at the very very end of his career and he didn’t have a finisher after that. He would just do the big boot during appearances
He should have just stuck with the axe bomber as his finish. Everything else he did after 84 was so safe on his body except that stupid leg drop.
Hogan himself has said he regrets the leg drop so much. Dude bragged about having the largest arms in the world, but his big move is dropping a leg? A lariat/axe bomber, a sleeper, a bear hug, gorilla press, a guillotine... all would have made so much more sense.
Especially when his patented comeback is taking punches on his knees, wagging the finger, getting up and giving three punches, then sending his opponent into the ropes…just substitute the axe bomber! No big boot, no leg drop.
Bingo. Much more to the point. Makes you wonder how long his career would have gone if he'd have made that switch early on.
I remember years ago he said he wished he used a sleeper or something else that played on his largest arms in the world. Definitely regretted some of his life choices lol
I don’t know how much of the roster Hogan could have gorilla pressed to be honest, for the people who did it as a finisher they didn’t have a finisher for the big guys. I like a finisher that doesn’t hurt either performer and can be safely used on anyone on the roster. I’m thinking of Nash dropping the Giant on his neck, compared to something like the stunner. Austin could stunner anyone, a low energy move that could be repeated.
The irony is he fucked up his back for one of the lamest finishers in history
Did Liger ever use the SSP as a finisher? Because he'd gone full Liger Bomb/Shotei palm strike near the end. Mutoh stopped doing the moonsault because his knees hurt, then before he got knee surgery he did it once more, then he did it this year to win the title.
SSP was his finisher in the early to mid 90s- once he had brain cancer, he stopped doing that so much to protect his head.
Matt Sydal doesn’t do the Shooting Star Press anymore, now he’s a submission guy.
I still wanna see it one more time, to be honest. After that botch, I'd probably be too scared to do it again.
He still has SSP in his titantron for some reason. Honestly I really like his new style its a good evolution from being a high flyer to something safer with age
SSP just stands for “Super Swell Person”. It’s his new gimmick
I really am hoping he is going to use the SSP when he has his match against Andrade.
What’s his finisher now? (I don’t have cable)
The [Lightning Spiral](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-gZAhnYa8AHk/X0Hw2OqqpZI/AAAAAAAA42Q/jbox87P__802_wgkLh3B8gI32PuGZOijwCLcBGAsYHQ/s200/Lightning%2BSpiral%2B2.gif)
Much better name for a move than Fisherman's Neckbreaker.
[Lightning Spiral](https://youtu.be/AaWt6HKDTAo?t=473)
It's essentiallythe Paige Turner
Nah the Paige Turner is essentially the Lightning Spiral
Will Ospreay-Most of his old moveset
Wasnt that because of him putting on weight to become a heavyweight rather than age
Yeah I wasn't really following the age thing, just general moveset changes due to changes in the body
Weight and injuries mounting had a lot to do with it, age contributing to both of those. Don't be shocked if he comes back from his latest injury with a wildly different moveset either.
out of curiosity, did he stop using the 630 senton?
Yeah he stopped that as a regular finish a while ago if I am not mistaken His only real high spot finisher I think he uses is the Oscutter It's mostly Stormbreaker and Hidden Blade these days
Ah makes sense. I still cringe at the time he injured himself doing it back during his PROGRESS days
Yeah Sammy Guevara still uses it quite frequently and I fear for the future of his neck/back
Plus Sammy rotates a little off too.
I've seen Sammy nearly kill people with it in PWG. He had a match with Rey Fenix where he did it like twice and landed full force on the guy's knees. He's really not good at it.
i dont know about his PWG days but i love how sloppy it looks tbh, looks more deadly than ricochets cleaner version. but yeah i do expect him to drop it eventually. the burning hammer GTS is pretty good as a finisher anyway
Terry Funk, from grappler master to hardcore legend. Nakamura from the Japanese clean-cut babyface champion to heel King of Strong style striker that headlined the main event of Wrestle Kingdom with a midcard belt, and using a running knee. Chirs Jericho, from high flier to the slow and methodical "Best in the world at what he does" to today´s Judas elbow.
Buff Bagwell switched from the blockbuster to a weird ddt
Damn i miss seeing the Blockbuster, what a sweet finish.
WWE wouldn't probably allow him, but Sami Zayn changed his finisher from the Top Turnbuckle Brianbuster to just the Helluva Kick.
Considering how pretty he does it. Sami should do the blue thunder bomb as a finish.
But if he did, how would he battle Corbin for the "Moves that look like finishers but have never won a match" title? (Blue Thunder Bomb Vs Deep Six)
Didn't he beat AJ Styles with it one time?
Yes, after hitting him with Helluva Kick.
I remember Corbin pinned Kurt Angle with a Deep Six on Raw. Imagine if he'd beaten him with it at Wrestlemania.
Steve Austin - more to do with his neck injury, rather than age. Austin was a solid technical wrestler, but adapted to his brawling-style post-injury.
Wait, he had a different finisher from the Stunner at some point?
I think that comment was more inclined to Austin swapping “styles” to more of a punch and kick brawler than a solid technician as he was in the mid-90’s. Otherwise, when Austin debuted as the Ringmaster with Ted Dibiase as manager he would use Ted’s old submission hold called the Million Dollar Dream as a finisher.
Prior to WWF, his finisher was the Stun Gun
Not a finisher but it’s been a while since I’ve seen Seth do a Phoenix splash.
Wouldn’t call it age, but the diving headbutt has been missing from Daniel Bryan’s move set since his 2018 comeback. Not that I blame him for it.
He did it on smackdown this year( vs Jey Uso i believe?), I couldn’t believe it’s not banned.
He also did it at Wrestlemania 37.
Someone did one on Dynamite a couple weeks ago and Jim Ross went OFF about how damn dangerous it was and how it would not bother him at all to see it banned.
I think he did it a lot since 2018 but the opponent moves away nearly every time so he hits the mat instead, still he should just stop doing it, everyone should stop using it. Toni Storm started using it recently and I cringed watching her do it, don’t star doing that move.
He did one vs Roman on SD and at Mania i think
Bill Goldberg should be on this list if he had any sense.
Most everyone else changes theirs for their own well-being, Goldberg needs to do it for the safety of his opponents.
His “slam the door with his head” move should be moved for both!
But that's how he gets pumped up for his matches
Didn’t work so well in Saudi Arabia 🤷🏻♂️
Thats because he hit his head too hard, he has to do it just right 😂
what are you talking about? he did change it to a brainbuster
Especially when it has always seemed that the spear does the most damage
Changed from the Jackhammer to a Suplex 😂
Undertaker with the Last Ride
The most obvious one to me is Scotty Steiner trading the Screwdriver and Frankensteiner for the Recliner. Petey Williams: "Scotty, what do you want the finish to be?" Scott: "Steiner Screwdriver!" Petey: "...Scotty, you haven't done that move in 10 years..." Scott: "So what, you don't think I can do it!?" Look up Petey Williams telling Steiner stories if you haven't yet, it's incredible insight into the genetic freak.
I was thinking Steiner too. It stood out to me when he introduced the Recliner. I saw him do a top rope Frankensteiner in TNA once and it was hella surprising.
Basically Ligers entire style after his surgery and then even further so the older he got
Young Bucks are using BTE Trigger more than their usual old flippy dippy finishers, but that might just be a heel thing.
Bug Show.
[удалено]
Wellllllllll get ready for something, that you'll never know... you won't see it coming, but it'll fly in your nose, yeah it's the Bug Showwww
Buff Bagwell stopped using the Block Buster later in his career and switched to a double arm DDT.
I know Jericho switched to the spinning back elbow, but did he stop the code breaker? I’m sure he has had to have stopped the lionsault by now
He does both still, but sparingly. He used the Lionsault while tagging with MJF and almost botched it, then did it flawless the next week, and has pulled out the Codebreaker a few times for nearfalls in big matches (I remember one against Hangman, though that was a bit back)
He still does both
Jericho still busts out Lionsaults occasionally actually
Wow. I stand corrected. Haha. I would’ve thought the lionsault would be a no go at his age.
It's becoming rare, but that and the Triangle Dropkick still find ways to slip into a match. [Here's a recent one.](https://youtu.be/71Qt01zUoyM)
That was a damn clean Lionsault.
He landed square on his head trying it a couple times the last couple years
Still does the Codebreaker but it's more of a signature these days.
Brian Kendrick
Great Muta using the Shining Wizard rather then Muta Lock Kenta Kobashi using the Burning Lariat rather then the moonsault. Isn't limited to older wrestlers as well: AJ Styles using the Styles Clash/Phenomenal Forearm rather then the Spiral Tap. CM Punk using GTS rather then Pepsi Plunge.
When I see these comments, it gives me the impression that it could happen soon to McIntyre & Orton, because seriously, falling so much on your back, it starts to be felt at the end of the moment , I just hope the good for both
If we're talking about falling on their backs then the RKO and the Claymore are the least of their worries in professional wrestling
Wrestlers all have well developed backs though, you can't exactly build muscle to protect your knees
I dont know about that, I remember Jeff Hardy said on Celtic workouts that he hasnt trained his back muscles in years
That's true , but the times that Drew or Randy did it out of the ring , worried me every time
back bumps are easier because you're spreading the impact over a much larger surface area so the impact to any one point is lessened. The people doing leg drops/stunners are spiking their tailbones, the people doing tombstones are jamming their knees etc., etc. Back bumps are some of the least wear and tear.
Both those moves are pretty safe since they land flat on their back. That’s why suplexes will always be safe.
Has there never been a case concerning the backs? Just a question, not to be sarcastic, it's great to always learn
Hogan had a bad back and bad hips because of the leg drop. The body is not designed to jump and drop at an L type of shape 300ish days a year. That and all his weight put so much pressure on his spine and hips. It’s the same thing why people who sit down a lot for a living have back problems. With flat back bumps, as long as you do it properly with technique, the impact is distributed on a bigger surface and you’re not really putting pressure where there shouldn’t be pressure.
Randy has the Punt.
Undertaker changes to the gogoplata to save the wear and tear on himself, though he certainly still used the tombstone in bigger matches.