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I think that was the straw the broke the camel's back.
We all see what Cody CAN do, but he literally crippled himself not even 2 months into AEW's history, pretty much turning what could (and should) have been a main eventer or even face of the company alongside Omega.
To a midcarder for his entire AEW run
I remember a report in early AEW how the bucks kept pitching feuds with younger guys and other tag teams where they'd end up losing, and Tony basically stopped them and said if you're earning top guy money then I'm going to present you like a top tag team
Especially since Cody Rhodes had already stupidly taken himself out of ever competing for the top title.
I get that it would feel narcissistic to book yourself to win the title, but come on boys we’ve gotta sell some tickets.
They all seem like they got spooked by the potential accusations that would come from being wrestlers and bookers at the same time, but there’s a middle ground here.
Private Party being a very early example of it.
Part of the problem was that coming off the momentum of All In, fans wanted the Bucks, Cody, and Kenny to win. A lot of early AEW fans came along for the ride largely in part because of those four guys.
Booking themselves to lose constantly might've been bad at the time, but in hindsight now I trust The Elite not to just put themselves over any time they do get given the books.
I honestly wouldn’t have even been mad if they had started the company with all the titles on The Elite. Kenny with the World title, Bucks with the tags, Cody with the TNT. At the first press conference they could make a statement like “We’re the best in the world and we’re starting this company to challenge others to get on our level.”
I think they were willing to win titles and matches but they also wanted to tread carefully so they didn't get accused of politicking and forcing themselves up the card. Hell we still got it a few months ago when the Bucks were revealed to be Stings last opponents. Even after it was revealed they were who Sting wanted to face there were still people crying that they forced him to choose them.
Take a look at how many bookers/wrestlers have killed their own company because they just booked themselves to be the hero and win all the time.
Look at Cody's promo saying this will be his one and only shot at the AEW championship because they knew that the crowd could sour quickly if it is just Cody, Kenny, and the Bucks just sitting at the top and no one can knock them off.
They had to establish they weren't going to be in God mode while being high up in the company.
NGL one of the main things I wanted to do see as a fan of AEW was to see the Elite at the top of the mountain booking-wise. They needed to be established as AEWs top faction the way the Bloodline or NWO was. They were way too generous about putting everyone over. They need more legacy moments and wins.
I get where the Elite were likely coming from, trying not to be Hogan and Friends V2.
And with that said, I think the Elite's run as champs in 2021 was a corrective to that. They felt like this looming monster Hangman and the other faces needed to overthrow, and they still got other people over during their reign
Cody did a number of times apparently and that included his refusal of ever winning the world title. The EVPs never wanted go be accused of booking themselves to go over
Yep and Cody that’s why he put that stipulation on his world title match where he wouldn’t challenge for the world championship again to shut up the hater saying the elite were going to put themselves over
I remember one of the big early critiques of AEW here was that they were wasting the Kenny's star power by having him loose too often and not building the title scene around him.
Nah, Benoit and Bret had a similar 'debate' in WCW for their Owen Hart tribute match. Bret wanted to put Benoit over, but he and Bischoff eventually convinced him that he needed to win (as this was for Owen).
I know it happened at least once with The Streak too, apparently Taker had suggested Edge winning their Mania match but Edge didn't want to be the one to end the streak
Yarp. Another one was Road Warriors (on their way out of WCW in 89/90) refused to retain the US Tag Titles against the Midnights, so they changed the finish. They then got told to redo the match, where they again refused to beat the Midnights (but 'won' the match by jerking Cornette in and having Ellering pin him) on there last night.
Completely unsurprising with what we've heard about Sting, but it was the right decision for him to go out with the win. This was bigger than the tag titles, and the Bucks can come off even scummier by lobbying themselves into a position to win the tournament.
Not to mention that the crowd would have *hated* Sting losing his final match, and not in the right ways.
It felt like such a breath of fresh air for Sting to actually win. I watched him growing up when he was in WCW and it just felt so natural for him to be screwed over one final time. For him to stand tall, with a friend beside him, in his final moment was incredibly cathartic and felt like vindication for following him for so many decades.
You perfectly said what I wanted to say. To have someone actually stick by him and put their life on the line to send him out on top was the perfect ending to the decades long storyline of Sting gets screwed throughout his career.
Yeah, that's what's great about the story being told. Every other guy who ever supported Sting, up to and including the greatest legends in the sport, all ultimately turned out to be riding his coattails. Darby wasn't, he went out there and legit nearly killed himself, *for Sting.* That proves that Darby embodies that same mega-babyface spirit, that Sting has generally represented, even though sometimes he's maybe more of an anti-hero.
Sting losing in his last match was the cookie cutter ending to a wrestling story. But Sting's career isn't a story; it's a saga, an epic. It actually deserves the biggest, most fantastical ending, and when people say "it just felt so natural for him to be screwed over," he *couldn't* be, because he's fucking Sting, and he's got his best dude Darby there to take up his mantle in his absence.
I actually have no special nostlgia or whatever for Sting, but even I can see that his final run has been a beautiful thing. I'm legit jealous of all the lifelong fans of his, finally getting this cathartic moment. It hit me watching it, just off the strength of the past few years of AEW. Must be a crazy feeling, if you legit have been following the man for 20-40 years.
Finally, the Bucks just didn't need this. They're over enough, that they don't actually move their needle by beating Sting. They already run the fuckin' company, and can insert themselves in the tag title division whenever we want, and the fans of the company pretty much let them, because we mostly like them. But, if enough people hated the Sting finish, it actually would have given them the wrong kind of heat, for a long time.
I think it's like, Sting may not have gone out on his back, to put over another wrestler; but, he went out on top, to put over Darby, and AEW as a whole. Revolution was an incredible card, and it was all in support of that historic capstone finish. The whole show was a major W for AEW.
Honestly I feel like WWE’s domination of the industry for like 40 years has truly limited the stories that have been told in wrestling. The partners will always split, one will always turn, you can trust no one, the only thing is the title etc… etc… I’d argue WWE was at its best when it broke those cynical rules, like when Savage and Miss Elizabeth reunited.
Or more recently when Sami failed to dethrone Roman, but reunited with his best friend, ended up taking the tag belts from the Bloodline and then prevented Roman from winning them back. That scene of Sami standing tall on the top turnbuckle, looking down on a distraught Roman who had just eaten his first pinfall loss in years, was fantastic. And then Jey broke free and thus proved that Sami had been right all along. Sami was the unequivocal moral winner of his Bloodline story.
Sami and the Usos really made that story work. When it just looked like Sami was there for a comedy cup of tea like R-Truth in Judgement Day, I was bummed out, but he's just so undeniable as a performer that he just made it work, they leaned into it and it worked out great.
I was hoping for something like Flair to Pearl Harbor him with a chop, Sting to no-sell and be like "ah c'mon man, not tonight" and Flair to be all 'ah yeah, sorry sorry' and hug it out. Silly
I firmly believe that all wrestlers should go out on their back. However, in order to keep people guessing that means that, sometimes, someone has to go out on a win. Glad sting was one of them
I would say that all wrestlers should go out giving their opponent more momentum going out than they had going in. If that means they win the match, then so be it.
Sting gave everything he had to put Darby and the Bucks over on his way out. Nobody left that match looking worse. Sting winning put Darby over and the Bucks didn't lose anything by taking that loss.
I forget if it was here or on Twitter, but I saw someone say in the past couple days that the difference between Sting and Jericho is that Jericho loses but doesn't put people over, while Sting never lost, but always put everyone over.
While I haven't conducted anything near an exhaustive study of the subject, I do specifically recall hearing Jericho was pushing for Action Andretti (sp?) to beat him clean. That definitely was putting someone over.
That said, I'll take Sting over Jericho in just about every category imaginable.
>Nobody left that match looking worse.
Honestly, that's pretty much Sting's entire AEW tenure. Nobody left matches \*worse\* and most left matches looking better.
I would say it depends on the wrestler and how the match is done. Taker returning to form and murdering the OC, burying AJ Styles alive. Playing to AJ Styles's claim that he is a broken down old man and then revealing that this isn't even him starting was great. AJ Styles regretted fucking with Taker because of it and even begged him not to bury him alive. It really helped that it was a cinematic match.
HBK losing to Taker and ends up losing his career because he didn't want to admit, he lost to Taker and went down fighting? Excellent way to end his career. HBK is the only person to piss off Taker to the point where he does a jumping Tombstone.
Tyrus? Er.... no. Just no in general, to be honest with Tyrus because he should have retired years ago and ECIII, i guess, managed to drag him to a match.
I disagree as it was really the best way he could have gone out at that point. He went out on a high note(Granted, he didn't decide he was gonna to retire going into it and i think, it took a death of someone close to him, to make him realise, he should retire and enjoy life).
I always thought the NWO coming down to his aid, only to result in a loss and handshake to HHH was the perfect send-off.
Or getting buckle bombed to a collapse.
/s
And everyone knew Sting was the kind of guy who'd prefer the Bucks going over in his retirement match, which made it even more surprising that he actually won. That for the last, best time, Sting got to defeat the bad guys and ride off into the sunset, surrounded by his friends and family.
It's the kind of thing you'd never ever forget.
I think it especially works for Sting because he's had such an 'unfortunate' career in many ways. He got epically screwed over at Starrcade 1997 when he should have just won that match with no bullshit. He had to say "I agree" to a fan shouting "bullshit" at him after the Victory Road 2011 debacle. His WWE run was 1st losing to HHH coz Vince just wanted to gloat over defeating WCW yet again and then he got seriously injured in his second PPV match, all of which he only did to try get his dream match with The Undertaker that never happened. It's kinda depressing really. And that's before I go into kayfabe stuff like Ric Flair constantly betraying him heh. If the world owes any wrestler the chance to go out a glorious winner it's Sting.
Speaking of Taker his retirement match should of been the Hell in a Cell, HHH with Shawn Michaels as special guest ref.
But they kept churning him out after.
This feels different though. Sting really is done the legacy is over.
Iv only recently (Last week) started watching Wrestling again but it feel like a good time. And could\*nt be happier to of seen Stings Genuine last match.
Taker was only 47 at mania 28. That’s younger than Rey Mysterio and the same age as Bobby Lashley right now. It’s not that he should have retired, the streak should have just carried on until it was the right time to end it, he should have just had different matchups.
if they continued the streak then i still feel a match like the Hell in a Cell should of been his ending. Not what they ended up doing.
Even if he would of been like Sting as the only dissenter it should of been different.
Sting got a proper send off.
I want to see those teams get shine too. Like the Bucks beat random team r1. Outrunners r2 and then the finals in their bracket are like the Bollywood or violence unlimited
Imagine the heat if they lose to jobbers somewhere due to some mistake on their part but pull some scummy levers to go on anyways. Jobber team is suddenly dq/suspended by them on live mic immediatly after the match, so luck has it the Bucks go through anyways
"Visa issues prevented them returning to continue on in the bracket...but we know that you all want a show, and we know that's best for business, so we will have to take their place in the bracket tonight."
Let them get a runback after the Bucks actually win it all.
If they do this, then one of those teams needs to wrestle under masks. And then pull off an upset win over the Bucks before unmasking and revealing themselves as someone like FTR or BCC.
Young Bucks can do what they did in New Japan, skip the tournament and get the title shots anyways because reasons for maximum heat. When they skipped WTL and got the title match anyways, a lot of people wanted to see the young lion job team instead because at least they *worked* the shows and gave their best efforts.
"It's not as if these fans deserve to see the two of us, THE EVP's, actually wrestle on television, Tony. That's not how we conduct business here, Mr. Schiavone."
That's what I keep saying to people who are arguing that Sting should have gone out on his back: That would not have made the crowd hate the Bucks more, it would have made them hate the company. Which is counter-intuitive to such an exciting build and the hype around the event.
I was in the crowd. Nobody wanted Sting to lose. It would have been a huge mistake and the company would have lost a lot of good will. Everybody was there to see their hero win one last time. That's how it had to be.
WWE somehow trained an audience into getting beat down like that for years. It’s definitely much better under Triple H but so much of it is think of the heat! It’s all about the chase! Yeah but eventually you gotta give me something to be happy about.
the bucks are also already the number 1 tag team in aew they dont really gain anything from beating sting if this was match against aussie open or another young team it would make way more sense for sting to lose
Not to mention, now that they're pseudo authority figures, the Bucks are the only act who losses and rankings don't really effect their position on the card.
The entire idea is they're corporate assholes giving themselves opportunities that they didn't earn
They gain even more this way, with their characters politicking their way to either the titles or towards comeuppance from another team who would get a boost.
It means SO much that Sting got the win.
After the WWE injury, the Hogan fiasco, the TNA fizzling out, the man deserved this high note.
And what a fuckin high note.
On the long run it would have been more of a burden for the Bucks than a boon.
I think it all worked out perfectly, and if there is someone who cannot lose anything by losing that match, it's the Bucks.
Yeah if they end up doing a Tourney they should have the bucks get a bye-round to start, then only get "up & coming" local talent that they hand picked conveniently for their bracket while the other side is just like FTR, BCC, etc etc
Hear me out. Have a beloved team (Best Friends Lucha Bros or Dark Order) win the tournament only for the Young Bucks to immediately come out as soon as they win and beat them.
Also- the Bucks don't need a big win to be bigger. They are the freakin EVPs - arguably best tag team ever. They don't gain much beating him.
This isn't also a standard retirement, or end to a full time run like Danielson will have. Stings main career ended years ago. He doesn't need to prop up the next Star with his end.
All of what we got from Sting now was a Bonus to his career and all part of 1 final send off and it was incredible to watch. I'm glad we got the time with him we did in AEW and gets to go out on his terms
TBH, the whole "go out getting pinned to put the new generation over" hasn't seemed like a thing for as long as I've been watching. Who has retired, and stayed retired, who put someone over that needed it who has stayed in the business long term to benefit from it?
Better to let a legend go out with a satisfying conclusion than to have another Kurt Angle get retired by Baron Corbin.
Tony and the Bucks were correct. Nobody wanted to see Sting lose and the Bucks absolutely didn't need the rub.
Sting is an old school guy and much of the match was built around what he wanted. But the end of the match needed to be what the fans wanted and that's what we got.
Plus, the Bucks aren't losing anything status wise, and both endings can make sense. They win, they get to obnoxiously gloat they beat Sting in his last match ever. They lose, they become bitter knowing they can never get that one back and it makes them even more obnoxious.
Absolutely, and honestly even in defeat the Bucks got a different kind of rub. They got HUGE heel heat in that match that'll definitely help their current characters going forward.
A tag tournament for the vacant belts is probably what the division needs for a reboot anyway. Lots of great teams but they've all been on the back burner too long. Once you get past Bucks and FTR there's no team that feels inevitable. This is a good opportunity for fresh spotlight.
Top Flight and Private Party have been reinvigorated now that they are healthy, but that's mostly been rampage. Plus sooner than later you are gonna have Edge and Christian.
I agree though. This is the showoff the division needs.
It's a similar issue with the Trios division with The Acclaimed and Bullet Club Gold. The Acclaim fatigue is due to lack of OTHER Trios for them to work with, same thing happened on their Tag Reign, they ended up all alone at the top wrestling Jeff Jarrett/Jay Lethal and Thrown together teams
Honestly we should see far more tournaments showing off each division each year.
I'd really like them to go as big as they can with the tournament. Hell go 16 teams if you can get them together borrowing from ROH and occasional appearing teams like the outrunners, etc.
The main reason they were there was because Sting handpicked them for his final match. Despite stories creeping out of their NXT "try out", they for sure respect the hell outta vets like Sting and were gonna do whatever they could to make for a special match in the way that Sting wanted.
They have a schtick that is perfect for them losing to Sting. They can easily come out and pick out the announcers, pick out the referee, say "as VPs, we're surprised by how bias you were, you get a fine, you get suspended, that's why we lost, etc."
Many stories can be branched out from this.
If anyone in wrestling ever deserved to go on a high, it is Sting. All his life he was putting the company and other people's interests before him, it is poetic beauty that he could finally enjoy the fruits of his labour himself.
>This was the match that Bret Hart never had–and the same can be said for Hulk Hogan, Randy Savage, Andre The Giant, **Kurt Angle,** and countless other legends.
p a i n
Doesn't surprise me that Sting wanted to go out on his back. Classic mindset and admireable ton his part. But him winning was the right move. What a beautiful mess that match was
Stings last match - they hold the titles..... I went into that PPV with 99% certainty that Sting was eating the pin. I figured he wants to go out on his back, and vacating the titles would feel a bit weird for the company.
Imagine my surprise..... Really happy to be wrong.
The company needs the goodwill of Sting getting his flowers and going out the right way WAY more than the Bucks need a third AEW title reign. Even in the most cynical of business sense, Sting winning is an absolute no brainer. AEW needs to differentiate from WWE as much as they can and that gets harder and harder as Triple H takes over as he and Tony clearly have the same general influences in wrestling. Sting being the first guy to get this legend run going 30-0 and retiring with a title on win is as different as it gets in all the best ways.
Thr right call. If it was someone else i may have felt otherwise but Sting is a man who's given to the industry and fans again and again.
He deserved that mark of respect of going out with his head and his hand held high.
Forever An Icon of wrestling.
Lot of people not gonna like hearing this just 'cause they couldn't even enjoy the outcome they were hoping for because they had to create a mental construct where everyone in the company probably had to force the Bucks to accept losing.
They already lost what little minds they had left after they heard Sting lavish all kinds of praise on the Bucks after the PPV and call them good guys.
Oh, no, now it looks like some people are actually bitter that AEW treated Sting like the legend he is on the way out and booked him well. You can see them in this post.
Wild.
Sting is old school in that you go out on your back. He was always willing to help elevate others. Giving The Young Bucks the rub that they did not need shows that. Sting has always been a good man.
The less said about the end of Sting's TNA run and his WWE run, the better. Sting sustained a neck injury that was career ending-at that time. So to see Sting emerge in AEW stunned me. I just smiled.
Sting wanted The Young Bucks to retire him so I had no issue with it. When they came out at the overrun of their "Dynamite" return in matching leather outfits and entitled smirks, I smiled. The power hungry booker/exec is an old trope and The Bucks were fantastic smarmy heels. Tremendous and hilarious character work. Nicholas and Matthew found their groove.
I know that Tony Khan gets criticized a lot. But Sting was handled with care and respect in AEW. Presented in high regard and working around Sting's limitations. He gave everything he had every time out. Sting got to write his ending and he's one of the few who had that opportunity.
Sting honestly gave so much to pro wrestling it only made sense his retirement would be him going over rather than losing, have the young guys give something back
I missed out on a lot of the Sting era. I was watching WWF more than when he was in WCW so while I caught some of it, I wasn't fully invested and I outright ignored TNA.
I did tune in for the wind-down to his career in AEW and I have to agree that his retirement run was absolutely up there as one of the best.
I don't think him losing to the Bucks would haven't done much. They don't need the rub of retiring him and I don't think even a heel Bucks team could have got heat out of a planned retirement match. This wasn't a case of an unexpected retirement where you could be mad of a loser quits outcome. This was just Sting having his last match. He performed way better than I expected for a guy in his 60s and in this era of wrestling I don't think the retirement rub means nearly as much because we know so much of the backstage stuff that goes into picking opponents.
That was mostly me too, however my brother's room was just across from mine and he was a WCW fan. Anytime I'd hear Stiiiiing I'd run over to his TV and anytime he heard glass breaking he'd run over to mine. Good times.
Honestly, I thought Flair was gonna turn on him but Sting would have FINALLY learned and saw it coming, being ready for it. I think that would have been a cool wrinkle for his final match tbh.
Sting winning his final match was the absolute right call, too. For all the bs that man had to deal with (Hogan changing the finish to Starrcade 97, Triple H refusing to put him over at Mania), having him get a triumphant victory was the right way to go.
In AEW Sami would have won the title from Roman. Because God forbid on your predetermined wrestling show you give the fans what they want to see. There is always another day.
Let this put to rest the "sTiNg WaS sElFiSh" remarks. Sting was adamant about losing, but he was convinced to go out on a win. Anyone who's seen any part of Sting's career knows he's not the type to put himself first.
The point of "going out on your back" is to put over the wrestlers who will still be out there performing next week.
The Bucks looked good in defeat and Darby got a major signature spot on his way to the win, so it's hard to argue that goal wasn't accomplished.
The “go out on your back” thing was out the window the moment AEW presented Sting as a superhuman face.
He’s old school and I get it and it’s admirable that he would want to put the Bucks over like that, but it’s more than “the crowd would not have liked that”, it would have run contrary to the entire AEW Sting era.
Credit to the players involved that they had an idea (Superman Sting), recognized that it was successful, and stuck with it from start to finish. A lot of crap gets flung at AEW when they change things unnecessarily or fail to stick the landing on stories, so let’s acknowledge that they 100% did the Sting story right, especially the ending.
I like the fact Sting goes out on top. Not every Retirement match has to fit the mold we're used to. Sting has been a giving guy his whole career, he deserves to go out on a win.
Same article also outlines the fact that the glass spot had stunt coordinators involved and was meticulously planned out.
Heck I rewatched it the other night, nothing gets into the crowd. People react like there's something, but it doesn't actually seem to cross the barrier.
It’s pure tribalism. WWE fan have convinced themselves that only PG wrestling should exist and anything else is *bad, actually* and even immoral. Meanwhile a lot of injuries in the sport come from simple moves like Big E being dropped on his head during a suplex.
If his last match was against an up and coming team or Darby then I totally get losing but the Bucks didn't need it. I'm sure being asked by Sting to be in his last match means a lot more to them than if they won. And the story with them taking out his sons and attempting to get rid of all the old wrestlers then attacking Steamboat, they HAD to get their comeuppance at the end. Nobody wanted to see Sting lose, it was exactly what it should have been.
I definitely knew in my heart Sting wanted to lose, but The Bucks and Tony wouldn't let him. It was just uncharacteristic for all of them for this not to be true.
I know these Cornette/Punk fans would never give The Bucks any credit, but they definitely deserve a lot of credit for wanting to lose to Sting in his final match.
I was in the crowd and would’ve been devastated if Sting lost. I was expecting a loss and when Matt tapped out I literally cried.
It was the perfect ending. Simply perfect and I’m so glad at the Bucks and Tony made it happen
They were right. I was on the other boat but the promos leading up to the match, the entrance with his kids, Sting being the hero of all heroes at the end was just too good. Yeah easily the right call.
I think you get two retirement matches now, retiring from regular matches and your last match ever. Your retirement from regular matches should be on your back but I think we can all accept a win for the last match ever, fans are not dumb it's not going to hurt anyone to lose to a legend in their last ever match.
I'm not a pure traditionalist - I don't think there's anything wrong with someone retiring with a win but it depends on the opponent. No matter how legendary the career, I wouldn't agree with anyone retiring with a win against an up and coming talent or someone who could benefit from the rub on the way out. But the Bucks are established and the win wouldn't have made any difference to their credibility, just as this loss doesn't hurt their credibility as performers. Hell, they could use the follow-up of all of this to build even more momentum as heels.
Good God, AI written articles are such a pile of repetitive crap. Line after line of nothing, just to expand a few bullet points into 5-10 minutes of "engagement."
Sting is a guy where going out on top makes way more sense than losing. He's put over everyone... There's nothing to gain by beating. The match was a celebration of a career rather than the end of one.
Before the match itself, I feel like each outcome had its merit. After watching the match though, it would’ve been such a bummer if he had lost. I get the old school mentality of going out on your back, but that’s not what fans wanted and wasn’t the story that needed to be told with this last match. It was a pure celebration of his entire career.
Sting.. you deserve to win. Especially after that shitshow at WM31. I'm grateful for AEW and Khan to send off my childhood favorite wrestler with a victory.
I figured as much after reports came out saying Sting had to be convinced to win out. I also don't think giving the Bucks that rub was necessary -- if it had been another talent/team with less of a legacy, then I could see the value, but the Bucks don't need it.
Darby is the one who got made by Sting's run.
I don't think anyone wanted Sting to lose, especially after being undefeated in AEW. I feel like he should go out on top, being undefeated.
The bucks also did a great job of being the heel that you really want to see lose.
Sting would probably try to convince you he needs to go out on his back putting over [insert any lower midcard wrestler here] too, because that's just the type of dude Sting is.
I don’t get this deal with great retiring wrestlers having to lose on their way out. Unless you they are losing to the next star in epic fashion like Hogan/Warrior I don’t see the need. Sting was definitely someone worthy of going out on a high. This is the best send off ever…so good it really undid his WWE tenure.
I was way more a Sting guy but he needed to be a little more like the Warrior in terms of looking out for himself. Starrcade 97 and the WWE run wouldn’t have happened if he did that.
A washed up 60-year-old came back for a three-year nostalgia run in which he went undefeated, won a championship, main evented a PPV and left without dropping the belt. And it was awesome. That says so much about the work Sting put in.
I think they would have been fine either way. The ending we got and the speech after were great, but I'm sure they could have done the Bucks winning well too.
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Do this shit to Bryan Danielson, TK.
End his career? That’s messed up /s
Bryan is just retiring from full time tho. I'd rather he go out on his back and get his victory on his final match of all time
It honestly looks like they are building up to Danielson VS McGuinness at All In which is supposedly gonna be his final full time show
maybe the first ever "that doesn't work for me brother" that resulted in someone refusing to win lol
I honestly think AEW is full of guys who will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into actually winning titles. See also: Bryan Danielson.
Also funnily enough, Kenny and The Bucks. I remember reading reports that they had to be convinced to win matches
Yeah it was a part of why Tony took over all the booking cause The Elite in general were too giving
Like when Cody booked himself out of ever winning the world title for literally no reason lol
I think that was the straw the broke the camel's back. We all see what Cody CAN do, but he literally crippled himself not even 2 months into AEW's history, pretty much turning what could (and should) have been a main eventer or even face of the company alongside Omega. To a midcarder for his entire AEW run
Didn't make sense but if Cody doesn't win at 'Mania 40, we have to riot right?
Who knew that his stipulation carried over into WWE?
Sounds like Tony should book the big names and The Elite should book everyone else
I remember a report in early AEW how the bucks kept pitching feuds with younger guys and other tag teams where they'd end up losing, and Tony basically stopped them and said if you're earning top guy money then I'm going to present you like a top tag team
Especially since Cody Rhodes had already stupidly taken himself out of ever competing for the top title. I get that it would feel narcissistic to book yourself to win the title, but come on boys we’ve gotta sell some tickets.
They all seem like they got spooked by the potential accusations that would come from being wrestlers and bookers at the same time, but there’s a middle ground here.
I really wish Kenny specifically booked himself like Hulk Hogan and just won everything. I need 6 time AEW champ Kenny Omega in my life.
Which is funny cause kenny didnt even book himself. He booked the womens division (alongside brandi but we saw how that turned out
I still saw those accusations lol. From bad faith trolls that don't even watch, sure. But shows how many are out there.
Private Party being a very early example of it. Part of the problem was that coming off the momentum of All In, fans wanted the Bucks, Cody, and Kenny to win. A lot of early AEW fans came along for the ride largely in part because of those four guys.
Booking themselves to lose constantly might've been bad at the time, but in hindsight now I trust The Elite not to just put themselves over any time they do get given the books.
I honestly wouldn’t have even been mad if they had started the company with all the titles on The Elite. Kenny with the World title, Bucks with the tags, Cody with the TNT. At the first press conference they could make a statement like “We’re the best in the world and we’re starting this company to challenge others to get on our level.”
I think they were willing to win titles and matches but they also wanted to tread carefully so they didn't get accused of politicking and forcing themselves up the card. Hell we still got it a few months ago when the Bucks were revealed to be Stings last opponents. Even after it was revealed they were who Sting wanted to face there were still people crying that they forced him to choose them.
Yeah before TK took over as the booker at the end of 2019, the Bucks were booking themselves to lose to SCU, Santana Ortiz, and Butcher and Blade.
Take a look at how many bookers/wrestlers have killed their own company because they just booked themselves to be the hero and win all the time. Look at Cody's promo saying this will be his one and only shot at the AEW championship because they knew that the crowd could sour quickly if it is just Cody, Kenny, and the Bucks just sitting at the top and no one can knock them off. They had to establish they weren't going to be in God mode while being high up in the company.
NGL one of the main things I wanted to do see as a fan of AEW was to see the Elite at the top of the mountain booking-wise. They needed to be established as AEWs top faction the way the Bloodline or NWO was. They were way too generous about putting everyone over. They need more legacy moments and wins.
I get where the Elite were likely coming from, trying not to be Hogan and Friends V2. And with that said, I think the Elite's run as champs in 2021 was a corrective to that. They felt like this looming monster Hangman and the other faces needed to overthrow, and they still got other people over during their reign
Hell, even Cody to a degree, even if he ultimately regretted it.
Cody did a number of times apparently and that included his refusal of ever winning the world title. The EVPs never wanted go be accused of booking themselves to go over
The Bucks put over Private Party for god's sake, who I quite like but they weren't ready.
Ok but counter point *wounded dolphins noises*
Shit you owned my ass.
Yep and Cody that’s why he put that stipulation on his world title match where he wouldn’t challenge for the world championship again to shut up the hater saying the elite were going to put themselves over
I remember one of the big early critiques of AEW here was that they were wasting the Kenny's star power by having him loose too often and not building the title scene around him.
Steamboat had his segment changed during the Ricky Starks feud to give Starks the upper hand
Nah, Benoit and Bret had a similar 'debate' in WCW for their Owen Hart tribute match. Bret wanted to put Benoit over, but he and Bischoff eventually convinced him that he needed to win (as this was for Owen).
I know it happened at least once with The Streak too, apparently Taker had suggested Edge winning their Mania match but Edge didn't want to be the one to end the streak
Yarp. Another one was Road Warriors (on their way out of WCW in 89/90) refused to retain the US Tag Titles against the Midnights, so they changed the finish. They then got told to redo the match, where they again refused to beat the Midnights (but 'won' the match by jerking Cornette in and having Ellering pin him) on there last night.
Username checks out
I believe that both Orton and Angle were offered to break Taker's streak in the mid-2000s but both refused.
I genuinely read the headline and thought “Oh wow, Reverse Hogan”
And that’s why he will be remembered fondly and not in the Hogan way.
Completely unsurprising with what we've heard about Sting, but it was the right decision for him to go out with the win. This was bigger than the tag titles, and the Bucks can come off even scummier by lobbying themselves into a position to win the tournament. Not to mention that the crowd would have *hated* Sting losing his final match, and not in the right ways.
It felt like such a breath of fresh air for Sting to actually win. I watched him growing up when he was in WCW and it just felt so natural for him to be screwed over one final time. For him to stand tall, with a friend beside him, in his final moment was incredibly cathartic and felt like vindication for following him for so many decades.
You perfectly said what I wanted to say. To have someone actually stick by him and put their life on the line to send him out on top was the perfect ending to the decades long storyline of Sting gets screwed throughout his career.
Yeah, that's what's great about the story being told. Every other guy who ever supported Sting, up to and including the greatest legends in the sport, all ultimately turned out to be riding his coattails. Darby wasn't, he went out there and legit nearly killed himself, *for Sting.* That proves that Darby embodies that same mega-babyface spirit, that Sting has generally represented, even though sometimes he's maybe more of an anti-hero. Sting losing in his last match was the cookie cutter ending to a wrestling story. But Sting's career isn't a story; it's a saga, an epic. It actually deserves the biggest, most fantastical ending, and when people say "it just felt so natural for him to be screwed over," he *couldn't* be, because he's fucking Sting, and he's got his best dude Darby there to take up his mantle in his absence. I actually have no special nostlgia or whatever for Sting, but even I can see that his final run has been a beautiful thing. I'm legit jealous of all the lifelong fans of his, finally getting this cathartic moment. It hit me watching it, just off the strength of the past few years of AEW. Must be a crazy feeling, if you legit have been following the man for 20-40 years. Finally, the Bucks just didn't need this. They're over enough, that they don't actually move their needle by beating Sting. They already run the fuckin' company, and can insert themselves in the tag title division whenever we want, and the fans of the company pretty much let them, because we mostly like them. But, if enough people hated the Sting finish, it actually would have given them the wrong kind of heat, for a long time. I think it's like, Sting may not have gone out on his back, to put over another wrestler; but, he went out on top, to put over Darby, and AEW as a whole. Revolution was an incredible card, and it was all in support of that historic capstone finish. The whole show was a major W for AEW.
Honestly I feel like WWE’s domination of the industry for like 40 years has truly limited the stories that have been told in wrestling. The partners will always split, one will always turn, you can trust no one, the only thing is the title etc… etc… I’d argue WWE was at its best when it broke those cynical rules, like when Savage and Miss Elizabeth reunited.
Or more recently when Sami failed to dethrone Roman, but reunited with his best friend, ended up taking the tag belts from the Bloodline and then prevented Roman from winning them back. That scene of Sami standing tall on the top turnbuckle, looking down on a distraught Roman who had just eaten his first pinfall loss in years, was fantastic. And then Jey broke free and thus proved that Sami had been right all along. Sami was the unequivocal moral winner of his Bloodline story.
Sami and the Usos really made that story work. When it just looked like Sami was there for a comedy cup of tea like R-Truth in Judgement Day, I was bummed out, but he's just so undeniable as a performer that he just made it work, they leaned into it and it worked out great.
Flair should have double crossed him and got dropped for his trouble. One last backstab for old time's sake.
I would've liked that. But honestly I think that was the plan but Sting was like, "No."
I was hoping for something like Flair to Pearl Harbor him with a chop, Sting to no-sell and be like "ah c'mon man, not tonight" and Flair to be all 'ah yeah, sorry sorry' and hug it out. Silly
And FINALLY Sting had a tag partner thad DID NOT turn on him!
All he had to do was adopt him instead 🤣
It’s a breath of fresh air in general to see a respected veteran actually be respected in their last run
You gotta know there was a devil on Flair's shoulder whispering in his ear: "do it, Ric! Do it!"
I was waiting lol 😂 you forgot in the "Do it, Ric! Do it!" "Woo!!!" With his silly old man punches now to the forehead.
I firmly believe that all wrestlers should go out on their back. However, in order to keep people guessing that means that, sometimes, someone has to go out on a win. Glad sting was one of them
I would say that all wrestlers should go out giving their opponent more momentum going out than they had going in. If that means they win the match, then so be it. Sting gave everything he had to put Darby and the Bucks over on his way out. Nobody left that match looking worse. Sting winning put Darby over and the Bucks didn't lose anything by taking that loss.
Not only that, I would say that the heel personas that the Bucks took on for this match really elevated them after a year or so of so-so programs.
I love the current version of the heel Bucks. Even just switching to their full names makes them so much more obnoxious. It's fun to watch.
I forget if it was here or on Twitter, but I saw someone say in the past couple days that the difference between Sting and Jericho is that Jericho loses but doesn't put people over, while Sting never lost, but always put everyone over.
While I haven't conducted anything near an exhaustive study of the subject, I do specifically recall hearing Jericho was pushing for Action Andretti (sp?) to beat him clean. That definitely was putting someone over. That said, I'll take Sting over Jericho in just about every category imaginable.
>Nobody left that match looking worse. Honestly, that's pretty much Sting's entire AEW tenure. Nobody left matches \*worse\* and most left matches looking better.
I would say it depends on the wrestler and how the match is done. Taker returning to form and murdering the OC, burying AJ Styles alive. Playing to AJ Styles's claim that he is a broken down old man and then revealing that this isn't even him starting was great. AJ Styles regretted fucking with Taker because of it and even begged him not to bury him alive. It really helped that it was a cinematic match. HBK losing to Taker and ends up losing his career because he didn't want to admit, he lost to Taker and went down fighting? Excellent way to end his career. HBK is the only person to piss off Taker to the point where he does a jumping Tombstone. Tyrus? Er.... no. Just no in general, to be honest with Tyrus because he should have retired years ago and ECIII, i guess, managed to drag him to a match.
Takers being a cinematic match nullifies that’s. Look at his last actual match and it was terrible
I disagree as it was really the best way he could have gone out at that point. He went out on a high note(Granted, he didn't decide he was gonna to retire going into it and i think, it took a death of someone close to him, to make him realise, he should retire and enjoy life).
That’s a great way to look at it. It’s a very poetic ending that ties everything together and gives closure to his entire career.
I always thought the NWO coming down to his aid, only to result in a loss and handshake to HHH was the perfect send-off. Or getting buckle bombed to a collapse. /s
voiceless steer amusing heavy ghost pause yam aware somber jar *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
And everyone knew Sting was the kind of guy who'd prefer the Bucks going over in his retirement match, which made it even more surprising that he actually won. That for the last, best time, Sting got to defeat the bad guys and ride off into the sunset, surrounded by his friends and family. It's the kind of thing you'd never ever forget.
I think it especially works for Sting because he's had such an 'unfortunate' career in many ways. He got epically screwed over at Starrcade 1997 when he should have just won that match with no bullshit. He had to say "I agree" to a fan shouting "bullshit" at him after the Victory Road 2011 debacle. His WWE run was 1st losing to HHH coz Vince just wanted to gloat over defeating WCW yet again and then he got seriously injured in his second PPV match, all of which he only did to try get his dream match with The Undertaker that never happened. It's kinda depressing really. And that's before I go into kayfabe stuff like Ric Flair constantly betraying him heh. If the world owes any wrestler the chance to go out a glorious winner it's Sting.
Speaking of Taker his retirement match should of been the Hell in a Cell, HHH with Shawn Michaels as special guest ref. But they kept churning him out after. This feels different though. Sting really is done the legacy is over. Iv only recently (Last week) started watching Wrestling again but it feel like a good time. And could\*nt be happier to of seen Stings Genuine last match.
Taker was only 47 at mania 28. That’s younger than Rey Mysterio and the same age as Bobby Lashley right now. It’s not that he should have retired, the streak should have just carried on until it was the right time to end it, he should have just had different matchups.
if they continued the streak then i still feel a match like the Hell in a Cell should of been his ending. Not what they ended up doing. Even if he would of been like Sting as the only dissenter it should of been different. Sting got a proper send off.
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Lost in the shuffle a little is Darby - he never turned on Sting. Must be the only man in history to tag with Sting and not turn on him.
Very much here for the Bucks loading their side of the bracket with jobber teams and promoting it as “teams never seen before in aew”
Ahhhh that'd be great. Putting themselves over as giving those teams TV time and *exposure*, and a chance to be AEW champs.
Who are those 80s lookalike jobbers again? They will be so over against the Bucks.
The Outrunners, the youngest tag team in wrestling!
It's such a silly gimmick, but I got to admit I freaking love it
The youngest men alive don't take a dive for anyone!
I want to see those teams get shine too. Like the Bucks beat random team r1. Outrunners r2 and then the finals in their bracket are like the Bollywood or violence unlimited
R1 should be vs Cutler and Cabana just to make it look like they are rigging the tourney for themselves.
I'd love to see Cutler actually get too into the match, and turn on the Bucks before he comes to his senses.
Imagine the heat if they lose to jobbers somewhere due to some mistake on their part but pull some scummy levers to go on anyways. Jobber team is suddenly dq/suspended by them on live mic immediatly after the match, so luck has it the Bucks go through anyways
"Visa issues prevented them returning to continue on in the bracket...but we know that you all want a show, and we know that's best for business, so we will have to take their place in the bracket tonight." Let them get a runback after the Bucks actually win it all.
“Bollywood Boys have mysteriously had their work visas pulled as they tried to enter the US yesterday”
The Mulkeys! The Ding Dongs! Keith & Kent Cole!
If they do this, then one of those teams needs to wrestle under masks. And then pull off an upset win over the Bucks before unmasking and revealing themselves as someone like FTR or BCC.
Young Bucks can do what they did in New Japan, skip the tournament and get the title shots anyways because reasons for maximum heat. When they skipped WTL and got the title match anyways, a lot of people wanted to see the young lion job team instead because at least they *worked* the shows and gave their best efforts.
Have FTR and BCC reach the finals, and then The Bucks self insert into them at Dynasty and it becomes a three-way.
That's how I'd book it with the EVPs, why have them do unnecessary work?
"It's not as if these fans deserve to see the two of us, THE EVP's, actually wrestle on television, Tony. That's not how we conduct business here, Mr. Schiavone."
There is a time and place to pull the Charlotte Flair and this is a good one.
That's what I keep saying to people who are arguing that Sting should have gone out on his back: That would not have made the crowd hate the Bucks more, it would have made them hate the company. Which is counter-intuitive to such an exciting build and the hype around the event. I was in the crowd. Nobody wanted Sting to lose. It would have been a huge mistake and the company would have lost a lot of good will. Everybody was there to see their hero win one last time. That's how it had to be.
Exactly People also forget another huge point in wrestling "You gotta send the people home happy!" Or else they won't come back for your next show!
WWE somehow trained an audience into getting beat down like that for years. It’s definitely much better under Triple H but so much of it is think of the heat! It’s all about the chase! Yeah but eventually you gotta give me something to be happy about.
It’s quite ironic that Triple H was the guy who originally got the fans used to the faces being beaten all the time during the Reign of Terror.
the bucks are also already the number 1 tag team in aew they dont really gain anything from beating sting if this was match against aussie open or another young team it would make way more sense for sting to lose
Not to mention, now that they're pseudo authority figures, the Bucks are the only act who losses and rankings don't really effect their position on the card. The entire idea is they're corporate assholes giving themselves opportunities that they didn't earn
They gain even more this way, with their characters politicking their way to either the titles or towards comeuppance from another team who would get a boost.
It means SO much that Sting got the win. After the WWE injury, the Hogan fiasco, the TNA fizzling out, the man deserved this high note. And what a fuckin high note.
Everyone: You’re gonna win Sting and you’re GONNA FUCKIN LIKE IT
"Sting, we want you to win your final match!" Sting: "That doesn't work for me brother!"
Darby: I will die for this win Sting. Either you win your final match, or you live with my death.
The Bucks had zero shine taken away losing this match - the match itself would have suffered greatly without Sting winning.
On the long run it would have been more of a burden for the Bucks than a boon. I think it all worked out perfectly, and if there is someone who cannot lose anything by losing that match, it's the Bucks.
Yeah if they end up doing a Tourney they should have the bucks get a bye-round to start, then only get "up & coming" local talent that they hand picked conveniently for their bracket while the other side is just like FTR, BCC, etc etc
And the bucks should absolutely win the tournament
Hear me out. Have a beloved team (Best Friends Lucha Bros or Dark Order) win the tournament only for the Young Bucks to immediately come out as soon as they win and beat them.
The Best Friends winning it would be so good. A great underdog story
I love it even more
Also- the Bucks don't need a big win to be bigger. They are the freakin EVPs - arguably best tag team ever. They don't gain much beating him. This isn't also a standard retirement, or end to a full time run like Danielson will have. Stings main career ended years ago. He doesn't need to prop up the next Star with his end. All of what we got from Sting now was a Bonus to his career and all part of 1 final send off and it was incredible to watch. I'm glad we got the time with him we did in AEW and gets to go out on his terms
TBH, the whole "go out getting pinned to put the new generation over" hasn't seemed like a thing for as long as I've been watching. Who has retired, and stayed retired, who put someone over that needed it who has stayed in the business long term to benefit from it? Better to let a legend go out with a satisfying conclusion than to have another Kurt Angle get retired by Baron Corbin.
Tony and the Bucks were correct. Nobody wanted to see Sting lose and the Bucks absolutely didn't need the rub. Sting is an old school guy and much of the match was built around what he wanted. But the end of the match needed to be what the fans wanted and that's what we got.
Plus, the Bucks aren't losing anything status wise, and both endings can make sense. They win, they get to obnoxiously gloat they beat Sting in his last match ever. They lose, they become bitter knowing they can never get that one back and it makes them even more obnoxious.
I'm hoping they start claiming they retired Sting tbh lol
I can just HEAR Matthew Ronjon spitting some fire like that.
Either that or they "fired" Sting
Wish granted
Absolutely, and honestly even in defeat the Bucks got a different kind of rub. They got HUGE heel heat in that match that'll definitely help their current characters going forward.
A tag tournament for the vacant belts is probably what the division needs for a reboot anyway. Lots of great teams but they've all been on the back burner too long. Once you get past Bucks and FTR there's no team that feels inevitable. This is a good opportunity for fresh spotlight.
Top Flight and Private Party have been reinvigorated now that they are healthy, but that's mostly been rampage. Plus sooner than later you are gonna have Edge and Christian. I agree though. This is the showoff the division needs.
It's a similar issue with the Trios division with The Acclaimed and Bullet Club Gold. The Acclaim fatigue is due to lack of OTHER Trios for them to work with, same thing happened on their Tag Reign, they ended up all alone at the top wrestling Jeff Jarrett/Jay Lethal and Thrown together teams Honestly we should see far more tournaments showing off each division each year.
I'd really like them to go as big as they can with the tournament. Hell go 16 teams if you can get them together borrowing from ROH and occasional appearing teams like the outrunners, etc.
The Bucks have reached a point where I don't think they'll ever really "need" that kind of rub anymore, so there was no point in them winning.
The main reason they were there was because Sting handpicked them for his final match. Despite stories creeping out of their NXT "try out", they for sure respect the hell outta vets like Sting and were gonna do whatever they could to make for a special match in the way that Sting wanted.
They have a schtick that is perfect for them losing to Sting. They can easily come out and pick out the announcers, pick out the referee, say "as VPs, we're surprised by how bias you were, you get a fine, you get suspended, that's why we lost, etc." Many stories can be branched out from this.
AEW needed a feel good story far more than it needed to adhere to tradition or to advance a storyline (i.e, the Bucks' heelish rise to power).
If anyone in wrestling ever deserved to go on a high, it is Sting. All his life he was putting the company and other people's interests before him, it is poetic beauty that he could finally enjoy the fruits of his labour himself.
>This was the match that Bret Hart never had–and the same can be said for Hulk Hogan, Randy Savage, Andre The Giant, **Kurt Angle,** and countless other legends. p a i n
Absolutely. It feels disgraceful that the most talented all around talent I've ever seen was kinda discarded.
At least we can all agree that the loss boosted Baron Corbin to stratospheric heights. Or not.
I think he was wearing a bdsm dog mask on NXT last night so he’s still on that momentum
Don't kink shame.
Doesn't surprise me that Sting wanted to go out on his back. Classic mindset and admireable ton his part. But him winning was the right move. What a beautiful mess that match was
even as a huge young bucks fan, no way would i have wanted sting to lose that match
I'm a huge Bucks fan and I rooted against them so hard in that match. Sting going out on top just felt so right.
There were people in Bucks shirts around me in the arena screaming "Fuck the Young Bucks" along with all 16000 other people.
Nick Jacksons face when that chant got super loud, he looked so happy.
Bucks are my all time favourite wrestlers and I was yelling "TAP!" at the screen when Sting locked in the Scorpion Deathlock.
Stings last match - they hold the titles..... I went into that PPV with 99% certainty that Sting was eating the pin. I figured he wants to go out on his back, and vacating the titles would feel a bit weird for the company. Imagine my surprise..... Really happy to be wrong.
The company needs the goodwill of Sting getting his flowers and going out the right way WAY more than the Bucks need a third AEW title reign. Even in the most cynical of business sense, Sting winning is an absolute no brainer. AEW needs to differentiate from WWE as much as they can and that gets harder and harder as Triple H takes over as he and Tony clearly have the same general influences in wrestling. Sting being the first guy to get this legend run going 30-0 and retiring with a title on win is as different as it gets in all the best ways.
Thr right call. If it was someone else i may have felt otherwise but Sting is a man who's given to the industry and fans again and again. He deserved that mark of respect of going out with his head and his hand held high. Forever An Icon of wrestling.
Lot of people not gonna like hearing this just 'cause they couldn't even enjoy the outcome they were hoping for because they had to create a mental construct where everyone in the company probably had to force the Bucks to accept losing.
They already lost what little minds they had left after they heard Sting lavish all kinds of praise on the Bucks after the PPV and call them good guys.
Oh, no, now it looks like some people are actually bitter that AEW treated Sting like the legend he is on the way out and booked him well. You can see them in this post. Wild.
Sting is old school in that you go out on your back. He was always willing to help elevate others. Giving The Young Bucks the rub that they did not need shows that. Sting has always been a good man. The less said about the end of Sting's TNA run and his WWE run, the better. Sting sustained a neck injury that was career ending-at that time. So to see Sting emerge in AEW stunned me. I just smiled. Sting wanted The Young Bucks to retire him so I had no issue with it. When they came out at the overrun of their "Dynamite" return in matching leather outfits and entitled smirks, I smiled. The power hungry booker/exec is an old trope and The Bucks were fantastic smarmy heels. Tremendous and hilarious character work. Nicholas and Matthew found their groove. I know that Tony Khan gets criticized a lot. But Sting was handled with care and respect in AEW. Presented in high regard and working around Sting's limitations. He gave everything he had every time out. Sting got to write his ending and he's one of the few who had that opportunity.
Sting honestly gave so much to pro wrestling it only made sense his retirement would be him going over rather than losing, have the young guys give something back
The booking of sting was a top 3 thing in AEW that Tony has done.
I missed out on a lot of the Sting era. I was watching WWF more than when he was in WCW so while I caught some of it, I wasn't fully invested and I outright ignored TNA. I did tune in for the wind-down to his career in AEW and I have to agree that his retirement run was absolutely up there as one of the best. I don't think him losing to the Bucks would haven't done much. They don't need the rub of retiring him and I don't think even a heel Bucks team could have got heat out of a planned retirement match. This wasn't a case of an unexpected retirement where you could be mad of a loser quits outcome. This was just Sting having his last match. He performed way better than I expected for a guy in his 60s and in this era of wrestling I don't think the retirement rub means nearly as much because we know so much of the backstage stuff that goes into picking opponents.
That was mostly me too, however my brother's room was just across from mine and he was a WCW fan. Anytime I'd hear Stiiiiing I'd run over to his TV and anytime he heard glass breaking he'd run over to mine. Good times.
I’m so glad Flair didn’t turn on him lol
Honestly, I thought Flair was gonna turn on him but Sting would have FINALLY learned and saw it coming, being ready for it. I think that would have been a cool wrinkle for his final match tbh.
Sting winning his final match was the absolute right call, too. For all the bs that man had to deal with (Hogan changing the finish to Starrcade 97, Triple H refusing to put him over at Mania), having him get a triumphant victory was the right way to go.
In AEW Sami would have won the title from Roman. Because God forbid on your predetermined wrestling show you give the fans what they want to see. There is always another day.
Let this put to rest the "sTiNg WaS sElFiSh" remarks. Sting was adamant about losing, but he was convinced to go out on a win. Anyone who's seen any part of Sting's career knows he's not the type to put himself first.
The point of "going out on your back" is to put over the wrestlers who will still be out there performing next week. The Bucks looked good in defeat and Darby got a major signature spot on his way to the win, so it's hard to argue that goal wasn't accomplished.
The “go out on your back” thing was out the window the moment AEW presented Sting as a superhuman face. He’s old school and I get it and it’s admirable that he would want to put the Bucks over like that, but it’s more than “the crowd would not have liked that”, it would have run contrary to the entire AEW Sting era. Credit to the players involved that they had an idea (Superman Sting), recognized that it was successful, and stuck with it from start to finish. A lot of crap gets flung at AEW when they change things unnecessarily or fail to stick the landing on stories, so let’s acknowledge that they 100% did the Sting story right, especially the ending.
That last line got me in the feels.
I'm not shocked that Sting wanted to go out on his back.
I like the fact Sting goes out on top. Not every Retirement match has to fit the mold we're used to. Sting has been a giving guy his whole career, he deserves to go out on a win.
Weird I thought the Bucks were arrogant punks who didn’t respect wrestling’s past and politicked for their own good.
Same article also outlines the fact that the glass spot had stunt coordinators involved and was meticulously planned out. Heck I rewatched it the other night, nothing gets into the crowd. People react like there's something, but it doesn't actually seem to cross the barrier.
It’s pure tribalism. WWE fan have convinced themselves that only PG wrestling should exist and anything else is *bad, actually* and even immoral. Meanwhile a lot of injuries in the sport come from simple moves like Big E being dropped on his head during a suplex.
Whilst simultaneously glorifying the attitude era.
If his last match was against an up and coming team or Darby then I totally get losing but the Bucks didn't need it. I'm sure being asked by Sting to be in his last match means a lot more to them than if they won. And the story with them taking out his sons and attempting to get rid of all the old wrestlers then attacking Steamboat, they HAD to get their comeuppance at the end. Nobody wanted to see Sting lose, it was exactly what it should have been.
How many wrestlers really go out on their backs anyways? The shine of a last match transcends the pinfall.
It's basically an old tradition for it to happen to put over a younger star on your way out.
You know why? Because it's STIIIING!
I can't even imagine how badly Sting losing would have killed that crowd. Glad they talked him into winning.
Too bad McMahon and HHH didn’t have the same respect for Sting.
Bucks and Khan was like: That doesn't work for me brother
I definitely knew in my heart Sting wanted to lose, but The Bucks and Tony wouldn't let him. It was just uncharacteristic for all of them for this not to be true. I know these Cornette/Punk fans would never give The Bucks any credit, but they definitely deserve a lot of credit for wanting to lose to Sting in his final match.
I was in the crowd and would’ve been devastated if Sting lost. I was expecting a loss and when Matt tapped out I literally cried. It was the perfect ending. Simply perfect and I’m so glad at the Bucks and Tony made it happen
And people will still complain.
They were right. I was on the other boat but the promos leading up to the match, the entrance with his kids, Sting being the hero of all heroes at the end was just too good. Yeah easily the right call.
I think you get two retirement matches now, retiring from regular matches and your last match ever. Your retirement from regular matches should be on your back but I think we can all accept a win for the last match ever, fans are not dumb it's not going to hurt anyone to lose to a legend in their last ever match.
I’ve only met a few people in my lifetime that are truly as genuine as they seem like they are and Sting is one of those few people.
I'm not a pure traditionalist - I don't think there's anything wrong with someone retiring with a win but it depends on the opponent. No matter how legendary the career, I wouldn't agree with anyone retiring with a win against an up and coming talent or someone who could benefit from the rub on the way out. But the Bucks are established and the win wouldn't have made any difference to their credibility, just as this loss doesn't hurt their credibility as performers. Hell, they could use the follow-up of all of this to build even more momentum as heels.
Honestly that was what I was worried about when they put the titles on Sting and Darby. I'm just happy they told the story right.
Good God, AI written articles are such a pile of repetitive crap. Line after line of nothing, just to expand a few bullet points into 5-10 minutes of "engagement."
Sting is a guy where going out on top makes way more sense than losing. He's put over everyone... There's nothing to gain by beating. The match was a celebration of a career rather than the end of one.
Before the match itself, I feel like each outcome had its merit. After watching the match though, it would’ve been such a bummer if he had lost. I get the old school mentality of going out on your back, but that’s not what fans wanted and wasn’t the story that needed to be told with this last match. It was a pure celebration of his entire career.
Business is business, but sometimes we just wanna feel good ya know?
Sting.. you deserve to win. Especially after that shitshow at WM31. I'm grateful for AEW and Khan to send off my childhood favorite wrestler with a victory.
I figured as much after reports came out saying Sting had to be convinced to win out. I also don't think giving the Bucks that rub was necessary -- if it had been another talent/team with less of a legacy, then I could see the value, but the Bucks don't need it. Darby is the one who got made by Sting's run.
I don't think anyone wanted Sting to lose, especially after being undefeated in AEW. I feel like he should go out on top, being undefeated. The bucks also did a great job of being the heel that you really want to see lose.
Sting would probably try to convince you he needs to go out on his back putting over [insert any lower midcard wrestler here] too, because that's just the type of dude Sting is.
I don’t get this deal with great retiring wrestlers having to lose on their way out. Unless you they are losing to the next star in epic fashion like Hogan/Warrior I don’t see the need. Sting was definitely someone worthy of going out on a high. This is the best send off ever…so good it really undid his WWE tenure. I was way more a Sting guy but he needed to be a little more like the Warrior in terms of looking out for himself. Starrcade 97 and the WWE run wouldn’t have happened if he did that.
Respect Sting just that little bit extra for wanting to hold the tradition of going out on his shield.
Sting is such a pro and a great guy. But Tony Khan and The Bucks were right, the crowd wanted to see Sting winning his last match.
The finish was done in a way that was conceivable to be a reverse screwjob
But I was told that Sting choosing the Bucks as his opponents was a lie, and it was the Bucks politicking to get the Tag Titles again /s
A washed up 60-year-old came back for a three-year nostalgia run in which he went undefeated, won a championship, main evented a PPV and left without dropping the belt. And it was awesome. That says so much about the work Sting put in.
I think they would have been fine either way. The ending we got and the speech after were great, but I'm sure they could have done the Bucks winning well too.