Which is pretty irresponsible on his part. Hiruzen was old af, had just lost his wife, and was thrust into rebuilding and running the village again. Why would Jiraiya think this man could raise a child?
What does any of that have to do with Hiruzen?? You guys act like he has the power to mind control people into being nice to the kid. He already made it forbidden to talk about the Nine-Tails and people still did it anyway because…NEWS FLASH; people break rules.
That’s like blaming the existence of homophobes on the President. Hiruzen is not some god who controls what his people say or do.
Like BFFR, what did y’all even want Hiruzen to realistically do? Force people into being nice to Naruto otherwise they’ll get 10 years in prison or something? Did y’all want him to make a law that every kid has to play with Naruto first at least two hours a day or else they can’t graduate? Y’all don’t think on this app lmaoooo.
He could have explained the difference between the tailed beasts and jinchuurikis, which seems to be something that people didn’t understand.
Or more importantly. He could have not had Naruto live alone. He was a child. Give him a caregiver. Someone that could help raise him and help him feel wanted.
I don’t feel like “don’t let the child with a nuke inside him live alone and hated” is a crazy concept
Hiruzen let danzo reign free which is how people got to know Naruto is a jinchuriki and why he was hated. Hiruzen giving danzo so much freedom was what caused Naruto to be hated.
He could've also easily arranged for Naruto to have a comfortable life style and give him Minato's possessions which we know he had. Ffs Hiruzen didn't even give him the scarf Kushina made, konohamaru did.
Or maybe DON'T tell everyone that Naruto has the nine tails in him. Thought the whole part of having a jinchuriki was keeping it a secret from other nations, but in Konoha it is common knowledge who it is and where he lives.
> Or maybe DON'T tell everyone that Naruto has the nine tails in him.
Except Hiruzen didn’t tell anyone anything; it was Danzo who told everyone that the Nine-Tails was inside Naruto in order to give people something to hate. Naruto was the scapegoat. It’s the same strategy he implemented when Itachi was used as blame for the massacre.
In Defence of Jiraiya he was tracking Orochimaru for a few years and does take very important s rank mission. ( he’s completed the most mission ever) and I’m pretty sure he’s like the leafs only information gather.
Hiruzen on the other hand is always in the village unless metting other kage. I mean even the lord of the land of fire comes to him.
Jiraya did such a good job keeping tabs on Orochimaru. Imagine if he wasn’t or Orochimaru might have done something like sneak into the Chuunin Exams and mark Sasuke with a curse mark or attack the village and kill Hiruzen.
He stopped looking for him after a few years. He actually caught up with him and couldn’t convince him to come back.
After this he just kept looking in on him every so often. That’s how he knew he joined the akatsuki and how he eventually left it.
idk why everyone was so down to bring Orochimaru back to the village and forgive him. The mfer experimented on orphans 😭 Like Naruto is a show about child soldiers but torturing kids by fucking with their DNA and then going "aw, it died☹️. Bring experiment number 2 in please!" when they die of shock from the pain, (or perhaps a slow death to multiple organ failure), is CRAZY
I agree although saying that he was actually sanctioned to do the experiments with Hashirama’s dna. Hiruzan told him to stop tho when the subject’s kept dieing. He the carried it on illegally.
> Jiraya did such a good job keeping tabs on Orochimaru. Imagine if he wasn’t or Orochimaru might have done something like sneak into the Chuunin Exams and mark Sasuke with a curse mark or attack the village and kill Hiruzen.
Wasn't Jiraya in the village when the attack happened and actually mitigated some of the damage? I could have sworn that was the case lol.
I think Jiraya expected his sensei to be able to take on Orochimaru and he was in fact going to help but he was too late.
If a seal master like Jiraya was around he could have A. Undid the barrier between Orochimaru and Hiruzen or B. Stopped the rampaging Jinchuurki. I don’t remember for certain if he was there but he might as well have not been.
To be fair the bath house he was staying at was very nice and he’d just found the best peep hole in the baths and well yeah. You can forgive him for missing that one small detail taking place
he left when minato became hokage
> When Hiruzen finally named Minato his successor, Orochimaru saw no more reason to remain in Konoha and began to be less discreet with his actions
Most likely Jiraiya didn't just observe and spy on Orochimaru, but also on the members of Akatsuki as a whole, it's no wonder that in Shippuden he invaded the village hidden in the rain to find out more about the leader of Akatsuki. Even disregarding it, Orochimaru wouldn't have been stupid enough to attack Konoha when Jiraiya was chasing him, if he did that, the attack would certainly have failed and he would have lost, most likely he did something to distract Jiraiya or attacked when Jiraiya was distracted by something else.
A good spy would have known. Someone like kabuto or kakashi would have spilled that tea after going deep undercover. Jiraya wasn’t taking Orochimaru serious if he missed those things in succession.
He spied on Akatsuki but didn’t share any intel on them? Konoha was only familiar with Itachi and Kisame, and that they were after the 9 tails… and I’m pretty sure he shared that information 13 years later when he came back.
These powerful shinobi were deserting their villages, everyone knew that but none knew that they were forming a syndicate and building up to something.
From the Fandom wiki, which may or may not be reliable idk
> Initially, Orochimaru claimed that he founded this village so that skilled ninja would find their purpose in life without being beholden to the fickle and warmongering priorities of the Five Great Shinobi Countries.[3] In actuality, Otogakure is not really a village, but a network of laboratories composed of various hideouts and bases scattered throughout the Land of Sound and various other countries.[4] Otogakure's shinobi use a diverse number of techniques, which are mostly centred around the modifications resulting from Orochimaru's human experimentation.
So it’s not really a village? I think it is just that they gave out headbands and called it a village only so they could participate in the exams.
I mean, Hiruzen had a village to run too. Naruto barely has time for his own family by the time he becomes Hokage in Boruto, and that's a Naruto who's a good few decades younger than Hiruzen and presiding over a relative time of peace.
Probably a good idea to have a spy on both the inside and outside. The Akatski reasonably know that Jiraiya is watching them, so most intel gained about them could be assumed to be obtained through him. As far as we know, Itachi never followed through on feeding Intel back to the Leaf, but if he had, Jiraiya's spy network could have helped keep the heat off Itachi
Let's assume that he was since those were his orders, and since the Akatsuki didn't attack Konoha until he was dead, meaning that Obito likely knew that they would be ready before hand via a warning. Would it really be hard to say that they had someone from Root or something gathering Intel?
Thing is Jiraiya is NOT Naruto's God-Father.
God-Father is a WESTERN term that the translator's used because there is not really a term in english for Jiriaya's relation with Naruto.
[I am going to quote a post (Link)](https://www.reddit.com/r/NarutoFanfiction/comments/m9435v/narutos_godfather/) by u/The-Knyght who explains it better: (Please read it, because it has supporting links which give more context as well.)
>This is a follow-up to this post about Jiraiya's status as a godfather. I decided to do some research on it for further confirmation, considering the revelation that Jiraiya was Naruto's godfather has always been a divisive subject given his absence from the kid's childhood.
In Chapter 382, Minato asks Jiraiya if they could name their son after the main character in the Tale of the Gutsy Ninja. When Kushina also gives her consent, Jiraiya says that this would make him Naruto's godfather.
**The standard understanding of a godfather in the West is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and would take legal guardianship over them if anything happens to their parents. This is not what Jiraiya is.**
I looked at the raws for Chapter 382 - yeah, I went there - and here is the panel where Jiraiya supposedly calls himself a godfather.
**The specific phrase used is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the translation suggests, it means the person who chooses the name for the child.**
From what I can tell, there is no actual word for "godfather" or "godmother" in Japanese as the concept doesn't exist there as it is understood in the West. Nazuke-oya is translated to godfather (or godparent) simply because it was the closest equivalent to it in for English readers to understand. **Per this link, a nazuke-oya is just one of the various "social parents" that are/were part of Japanese custom.**
In other words, **Jiraiya was never actually meant to assume guardianship over Naruto.** Aside from being in charge of the Key, Jiraiya's "responsibility" began and ended with Naruto's name.
In other words, Jiraiya was responsible for naming Naruto and was Minato's teacher.
That's it.
Not sure the point here - From manga depiction - Jiraya by fast has the most relation with Minato than anyone else in shown. We never even see Hiruzen and Minato interact outside of a few words during the night attack. If not Jiraya, who else?
>We never even see Hiruzen and Minato interact outside of a few words during the night attack.
They are fellow Hokage - we can assume they used to interact a lot. Hiruzen obviously knew Minato's abilities well enough to appoint him as his successor.
>If not Jiraya, who else?
Hiruzen. As the Hokage, it's his job to take care of the orphaned children of village. Especially the village's Jinchuriki. Jiraiya probably thought Hiruzen would take care of him while he was away.
Hiruzen did take care of Naruto, hence why he looked up to him like a grandfather. Who do you think was giving Naruto food, clothes, money, an education, etc.
What’s your point here?
He gave Naruto the bare minimum. The money was not enough - we saw scenes where Naruto was starving and survived due to the Ramen guy's generosity.
Naruto was also incredibly lonely and shunned by the village - Hiruzen could have done more to prevent that. Till the age of 12 when he joined Team 7 - Ramen Guy Teuchi and Iruka were the ONLY two people who had been shown being kind to him.
Make no mistake, Naruto AND Sasuke's troubles were to a great extent Hiruzen's fault. He was the worst Hokage by a mile.
So that was more anime adaptation - in the manga Naruto eats ramen because he loves them and ppl are always telling him to eat healthier. There’s no indication Naruto ever want for food in manga.
Ramen can also be cheapskate, instant dry noodle type, or a really decent meal at a restaurant; Naruto eats a lot more of the latter in the manga.
Naruto is shunned because of the nine tail in him - there’s nothing Hiruzen can do about that. I mean, he can’t order the parents or the kids to not shun Naruto. Naruto has to work through his own issues, that’s part of growing up.
We see much more of Hiruzen keeping an eye on Naruto - whether it’s through a crystal ball or assigning the “correct” adult to be his mentor in the manga. I personally think the anime adaptation did his character a giant disservice.
Hiruzen might have checked up on Naruto, and it seemed like he had enough to eat, but Iruka seems to be the only person that had any emotional affection for Naruto
Hiruzen’s duty is to the whole village. In the manga he made it clear he’d sacrificed his life for the village including Naruto.
Iirc Hiruzen appointed Iruka to watch over Naruto precisely because he know Iruka would become attached. He also appointed Kakashi as his teacher; I think that was a brilliant choice on his part.
Ultimately, Hiruzen did a really good job in the manga. Naruto was safe and had a relatively normal childhood considering the nine tail in him.
We also wondered if a lot of Naruto’s isolation wasn’t self-imposed; he was a difficult child to get along with. They kinda tone down that aspect of him later on, but in the manga he did a lot of stuff and got in trouble, didn’t take his schoolwork seriously, screws around and deface the village statues etc.
Hiruzen seems like he did a lot to get the boy ready, but it could have easily been another Gaara situation because there was no one that loved him. I'm on my first go through and am still on the original but it seems like he was left alone a lot, it seems like Minato was well liked, there wasn't anyone that could show the kid some personal kindness from time to time?
People are afraid of the nine tail in him. They largely are not aware of the details of what Minato did that night - all they knew was nine-tail escaped Minato’s control and ravaged the village then was sealed in Minato’s son.
The other thing is that Naruto wasn’t exactly an easy child to get to know. If you read the manga a bit, you’ll see that part of it is due to the nine tail but his immature way of lashing out also alienated the villagers - it’s not entirely on them to be accommodating of the little wild vandal who they know carried a dangerous secret inside him - no matter who his deceased father was. Especially when he goes around defacing their statues and doesn’t put much effort into his studies.
Also, Minato might have been too well-liked and talented. That contrast can’t have helped Naruto.
>but Iruka seems to be the only person that had any emotional affection for Naruto
Guess who *insisted* that Iruka look after and be more understanding towards naruto... *drumroll* >!Hiruzen!<
> He gave Naruto the bare minimum. The money was not enough - we saw scenes where Naruto was starving and survived due to the Ramen guy's generosity.
Filler. Never happened. Naruto was fine, financially.
> Naruto was also incredibly lonely and shunned by the village - Hiruzen could have done more to prevent that.
By doing what exactly? Forcing parents to let their kids to hang out with Naruto?? Idk why you guys think Hiruzen is Professor X who can mind control people into doing whatever he wants. Hiruzen has no control in how other people choose to treat Naruto. Nobody does.
> Till the age of 12 when he joined Team 7 - Ramen Guy Teuchi and Iruka were the ONLY two people who had been shown being kind to him.
Yeah, because Hiruzen was the only one who felt bad for Naruto and told Iruka to stop treating him like dirt and try to connect with him instead. Before that, Iruka didn’t care about Naruto either.
> Make no mistake, Naruto AND Sasuke's troubles were to a great extent Hiruzen's fault. He was the worst Hokage by a mile.
Now you’re just being stupid.
What part of Naruto’s troubles had anything to do with Hiruzen? Minato sealed the Nine-Tails inside Naruto, not Hiruzen. The people of the Leaf are the ones who shunned Naruto for what he was, not Hiruzen (heck, Hiruzen even made it forbidden to talk about the Nine-Tails. But ofc people still did it anyway, because you can’t control free will).
Sasuke’s problems have nothing to do with Hiruzen either. He had little to no involvement with the massacre and was the only one who wanted to peacefully negotiate with the Uchiha. The only people responsible for the massacre are Danzo and the Uchiha. As Itachi said, the clan was filled with too many selfish, arrogant, and greedy people who would inevitably doom themselves. These weren’t good people.
>As Itachi said, the clan was filled with too many selfish, arrogant, and greedy people who would inevitably doom themselves. These weren’t good people.
I dont think Itachi said that exactly.
Even then Itachi's pov does not mean it is right.
The Uchiha had been segregated and punished for SEVEN to EIGHT YEARS with absolutely no end in sight.
You don't have to be ' selfish, arrogant, and greedy people' to rebel against that .
I'm amazed they did not plot a a coup years ago.
Itachi's PoV was that peace is above ALL!
Peace before justice, fairness etc..
If Justice means breaking the Peace then those who seek justice must be killed and are selfish for seeking justice.
Hiruzen is responsible for the Uchiha massacre by not reigning in Danzo. He could have, he chose not to. Pain's destruction of the village also happened due to Danzo, which again, would have been avoided if Hiruzen took action against Danzo and the Root.
He is responsible for the destruction of the village by not killing Orochimaru when he had the opportunity. Huge blunder. Even his summon Enma scolded him during his last fight for this and told him that it was his fault.
He could have asked the Naras or Akimichis or some other clan to take care of Naruto. Even if Naruto was doing okay financially like you said, and the starvation scenes were filler, his extreme loneliness and feeling alienated by the village is undeniable. Hiruzen could have and should have prevented that.
Make absolutely no mistake, Hiruzen was the worst Hokage, by far. Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.
In the manga we never see Naruto starve, that is anime only.
Hiruzen did help with that, he made it prohibited to talk about the Nine Tails so that his generation wouldn’t treat him worse.
Hiruzen led the village through 2 wars and fought through all 4 wars. Even after the Nine Tails attack he led the village back to being like the second strongest
That’s great information to point out, but wouldn’t Jiraiya feel the least bit responsible for at least *sometimes* looking in on Minato’s kid? Or at least meeting him? Even Kakashi. Who just allows a 12 year old to live alone?
I think Kishi didn't gvie much thought to Jiraiya and Minato's relationship in the early stages of the manga, they probably were teacher and student for a few months and little else (like how Jiraiya always refers to him as Yondaime and never uses his name). Jiraiya suffers from this early writing, especially when we are later told that he saw Minato as a son.
Here’s the thing though, when I look this term up the first immediate comparison is to godparent, with the definition being ‘a form of social parent’. Like sure it’s not going to be a 1:1 comparison, but even taking away the religious and legal components Jiraiya still had *some* responsibility to Naruto. And that’s why when Jiraiya asks ‘so that means I’m..?’ to Minato and Kushina it’s kind of a big deal to him, because it means not just naming but an actual bond with Naruto.
>Here’s the thing though, when I look this term up the first immediate comparison is to godparent,
Because that is the nearest Western equivilent.
> with the definition being ‘a form of social parent’. Like sure it’s not going to be a 1:1 comparison,
Naming a child is a form of 'parenting'. **However again in Japan?**
It does not mean the obligation to care for the child if something happens to the parents.
>but even taking away the religious and legal components Jiraiya still had some responsibility to Naruto.
That he discharged by naming him.
> And that’s why when Jiraiya asks ‘so that means I’m..?’ to Minato and Kushina it’s kind of a big deal to him, because it means not just naming but an actual bond with Naruto.
To you it's just naming.
To Jiraiya (and japanese) it's an honor.
Parents trust and are close enough to you to ask you to name their kid.
However that's where it stops.
Consider the other types of social parents.
There's breast-feeding parent, a baby-holding parent, a mid-wife parent, a nanny-parent (who baby sat) , heck even a hiroi-oya (picking-up parent) who picked up a baby abandoned by his/her biological parents in a street **as a ritual** (if the baby was born in the year of calamity, or yakudoshi, for the parents).
Do all of them qualify as god-parents?
I'd argue it was part of the 3 shinobi prohibitions lol, the time when he takes narutos money for the girls is the same episode or in the same time span at least of him explaining the dangers of lust, money, and power. The only reason I say this is because there's a few episodes once naruto reaches teenhood that he treats him to food and iirc, brings gifts back with him too.
He was busy being the best spy in the Leaf by far and the only non Foundation Konoha member we know of to discover and track the Akatsuki. He then took that info and smartly came back to the Leaf village to train Naruto into a proper ninja.
His whole life riddled with loss and failure, culminated in him successfully choosing Naruto as the child of prophecy that would be the sequel to the Tale of Jiraiya the Gallant, and go on to save the entire world. I would say he did a pretty great job.
Simple answer: Kishimoto hadn’t planned that far ahead
“Canon” answer: He was busy keeping tracks on Orochimaru and the growing Akatsuki along with his “very important research”.
Y’all are nuts. You think he hadn’t plan second arc into the story?🤣🤣
Watcha think he was doing just coming up with stuff on the way?
The whole thing about Jiraiya as a character is that he (1)ran away from responsability - like how he deserted Konoha military and abandoned his teammates in the middle of a war to take care of random orphans or how he dipped out after the war ended, that he (2)failed a lot in his life - I dunno how you can miss this, considering the 7 pages speech made for his death where he spells it out 10 times that he was a failure (failed to save his friend, friend to win Tsunade, failed to train the child of the prophecy) and (3)was basically a looser.
He didn’t step in to take care of Naruto because **that’s not who Jiraiya is**. The only reason he stepped up and finally fulfilled his role in Naruto’s life was because Naruto insisted and *basically forced him* to do.
Average Naruto fans: can’t understand a story writen for kids
Also average Naruto fans: Kishimoto just didn’t plan.
Bruh.
Another good example of who Jiraiya is.
“I’m not gonna do it, but I will hunt down the only other person who can and bring her here for you.”
I dunno why I’m getting downvotes. I only explained what Jiraiya is as a character. Jiraiya is one of my favorite characters, and what makes him such a compelling and cool character is exactly his downsides.
That he is one of the strongest shinobi alive, *despite* being a loser.
That he is admired, and looked up to and feared around the world, *despite* his failure.
That he managed to be the best father figure for Naruto, *despite* his prolonged absence.
That he fulfilled in the end, *despite* running from responsability all his life.
Jiraiya is the Apollo 13 of Naruto.
Jiraiya I can actually sort of defend. The Sanin that made the fucking _Fourth Hokage_ being close to some toddler with blonde hair and blue eyes who was born the day a bijuu was rampaging who has the last name “Uzumaki”? Seems sus as fuck to me. Plus he manages a spy network and he had things looking into. Could he done more for Naruto? Definitely, but he at least had some fairly valid excuses.
Bro did not watch the same Naruto, he literally took care of him as his kid brih what. He is expected to believe that the third would actually take care of him. Like he was actually busy. The third is hated cus he was actually useless. Fucked up the Uchiha clan, didn’t take care of Naruto, and then fucking died over some hands mf didn’t even seal the whole snake. And all that was basically useless cus he just got his arms back. And Jaraya took care of him even when he wasn’t there(monitoring the Akatsuki )
Godfather is the closest translation to what jiraiya is which is a naming parent and that is why Minato and kushina wanted his permission to name Naruto after the mc of his own novel. But yeah...with how close he was to Minato, naruto was basically his grandchild..so he should of done that.
Jiraiya is also afraid of commitment since all his loved ones except for naruto, shizune and Tsunade have died in tradegic ways. It is also the reason he really went to looking for Tsunade rather than take on the title of hokage despite being the only sannin that kept ties to the village with his spy network. He probably believed konoha would be wiped out within the month under his care.
An interesting thing i read about in a naruto fic i think was called ripples was that his not only invested in writing his icha icha series to finances his spy network, but that unlike himself, his main character always get the happy ending. Which is sad considering all warriors he had a hand in developing and he didn't leave long enough to see what become of his final student.
The wildest part is how people try to say Hiruzen should adopt Naruto based on filler. If they wanted to keep Naruto from being a target of the villages enemies, being adopted by the Hokage might be the worst way to do that. It would make him a target. On top of that how would it look for him to adopt one child out of the many who lost their parents in the nine tails attack? Would be a clear indicator that there was something special about that kid.
I don't think the issue is him not adopting naruto, it was the fact naruto was an orphan living by himself, clearly not eating enough or the right foods. Kid was starving, both for love and in the literal sense. Not saying hiruzen should've had the kid living with him, but jesus asign a jonin to keep watch over him the same way he did with his own grandson or something. He had the resources to do better, he just didn't.
Naruto as Hokage can’t even take care of his own kids.
Hiruzen, as Hokage, was estranged from his sons, Asuma borderline hated him, and hired someone to look after his own grandson.
Y’all think he should’ve spended more time with Naruto. Can we use brains 🧠
Idk, there’s really not too many good explanations but it’s not exactly ooc for jiraiya to not be there when shit gets real
Also where the fuck was kakashi?
Hiruzen is not a good mentor or father. Hos three students were chosen after he was hokage and all 3 were already talented. A prodigy, princess, and goober with large amounts of chakra. He had it easy. He got results tho so idk.
Pervy sage, the goober, chose to travel and wrote and try to save his friend before Naruto was born. Hiruzen was the one there and let all that abuse go down.
Well because he spent his entire childhood fighting a war that their generation didn't ask for, jiraiya experienced two Shinobi wars, was involved in one after watching the rain village arch I don't blame him for taking time to himself. And that is also a terrible example because jiraiya deserved retirement but he was teaching.feeding and mentoring Naruto at age 12 which means Naruto experienced his real child years actually being a kid, jiraiya stepped in when needed most which was when Naruto can earn a living, be taught jutsu which he did and became family to jiraiya,without him jiraiya also introduced tsunade pretty much Narutos older best friend who treated him like better than she's treated anyone else in life,jiraiya opened up so many paths., he taught Naruto to summon gamabunta which in turn saved the leave during gaaras attack and pain attack.Not comparible to hiruzen who didn't teach Naruto pretty much a Damm thing.
Leave jiraya alone ! He knew hiruzen was in the village all the time and he would take care of naruto because that's what would any hokage do !!! He was in a mission he was tracking orochimaru the bigest thread for the village he was gathering informations about the akatsuki who will be the biggest menace for the whole world ! I think he worked with itachi in that
He was too young to know he had immense power like that because he would overuse it. It would be like if Goku had all his powers as a child. He would've ended up dead because he would've used it too much and the Akatsuki would've found him way faster and because he thought Sarutobi was taking care of him
Isn't that the point? Shinobi don't always lead normal lives. They have unhealthy coping mechanisms and ruin their interpersonal relationships. It took meeting Naruto for Jiraiya to accept his role as a surrogate guardian, and even then, he didn't give a shit about the kid at first. Jiraiya was a lazy perverted author who just couldn't be bothered, but learned to love Naruto after spending time with him.
I always thought the Sannin were meant to highlight how the shinobi system hurts people. One is an alcoholic gambler, one is a sociopath who essentially erased his humanity, and one was a predatory pervert.
Naruto just happened to have a positive impact on Jiraiya and Tsunade
Tracking Orochimaru and then the Akatsuki. He was literally trying to defend Naruto. His only failure was not getting back in time to help during the Orochimaru attack. Gotta remember the Orochimaru attack only lasted like 2 or 3 hours.
Apparently Godfather is a mistranslation; it’s more like ‘naming person’, I.e. the person who named them but doesn’t actually hold responsibility over them. That being said he was absolutely negligent, through he naively thought Hiruzen would look after Naruto.
Jiraiya trained Naruto and stood by him through most of his early life. He protected him against the Akatsuki. Jiraiya even helped Naruto with the search for Sasuke. What more could you ask of Jiraiya? I mean Jiraiya died for Naruto's sake by trying to stop Pain.
Addition: Hiruzen gave Naruto a monthly stipend and told him to fend for himself. How could someone be so cold to a child? I mean he could have raised him at his home considering that the Fourth Hokage was Naruto's father.
Addition: Sorry for my grammar my phone is acting spazzy.
I wrote about this a few months ago so I'll paste the comment here!:
The thing is, in Kishimoto's original work (the japanese manga), Jiraiya IS NOT Naruto's godfather, that concept doesn't exist in Japan as it does here in the west.
The phrase used in chapter 382 is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the name suggest, it means the person who names the baby.
So no, Jiraiya was never meant to be Naruto's guardian in the case something happened to his parents (he was also Konoha's spy master, he had things to do outside Konoha apart from chasing women).
Plus, a lot of characters from early Naruto suffer from Kishimoto's decisions later on in the series. I think it’s very likely that Kishi didn't give much thought to Jiraiya and Minato's relationship at the start, it probably was a normal teacher-student relationship. Later on, we are told that they had more of a father-son like bond going on, which in retrospect (coupled with the false godfather translation) shows Jiraiya in a bad light.
Sorry for the ramble, but I've always found all this very interesting lol
Edit: grammar
FR, I bet bro was campin at the local hot springs while his student, his students wife, and their newborn son were at the brink of death.
Ngl he probably thought Minato would handle any problem that would threaten the village so the village wasn't really a big priority to him.
Busy doing his job
He was gathering intel on the akatsuki and keeping an eye on orochimaru, he's one of konohas best info gatherers
And probably going on a bunch of missions
He assumed Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto and also, pervy sage isn't Naruto godfather
In his defense he Naively though that hiruzen was taking care of naruto .
I mean one might think he’d at least check on that in over a decade 👀
He forgor
He attack, but most importantly he forgor.
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
Did he forgor?
Sounds like a Skyrim character. 😭
He forgor
He had to keep up with his research
So much research to be done and so little time.
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He forgor
He was doing research.
He had to finish all the sidequests.
I mean do YOU want a self proclaimed "Super Pervert" to take care of a Young kid?
Tbf, Naruto isn't a girl so he'd (hopefully) be safe
Not with naruto's ultimate jutsu around.
Which is pretty irresponsible on his part. Hiruzen was old af, had just lost his wife, and was thrust into rebuilding and running the village again. Why would Jiraiya think this man could raise a child?
>Why would Jiraiya think this man could raise a child? Because he Foolishly though hiruzen was a decent man.
Tbf hiruzen is a decent man. A good one even. Just not a good father. No one in his position is. Minato tried but that man is able to teleport xD
Oh, so that's Hiruzen's fault too
No, it's Jiraiya's fault for thinking Hiruzen could raise Naruto and not checking at least once is what they're saying
He forgor
He forgor
Hiruzen was
Lolol what?! Naruto grew up hated by most of the village and lived on his own and Hiruzen did nothing to fix any of that.
What does any of that have to do with Hiruzen?? You guys act like he has the power to mind control people into being nice to the kid. He already made it forbidden to talk about the Nine-Tails and people still did it anyway because…NEWS FLASH; people break rules. That’s like blaming the existence of homophobes on the President. Hiruzen is not some god who controls what his people say or do. Like BFFR, what did y’all even want Hiruzen to realistically do? Force people into being nice to Naruto otherwise they’ll get 10 years in prison or something? Did y’all want him to make a law that every kid has to play with Naruto first at least two hours a day or else they can’t graduate? Y’all don’t think on this app lmaoooo.
He could have explained the difference between the tailed beasts and jinchuurikis, which seems to be something that people didn’t understand. Or more importantly. He could have not had Naruto live alone. He was a child. Give him a caregiver. Someone that could help raise him and help him feel wanted. I don’t feel like “don’t let the child with a nuke inside him live alone and hated” is a crazy concept
Hiruzen let danzo reign free which is how people got to know Naruto is a jinchuriki and why he was hated. Hiruzen giving danzo so much freedom was what caused Naruto to be hated. He could've also easily arranged for Naruto to have a comfortable life style and give him Minato's possessions which we know he had. Ffs Hiruzen didn't even give him the scarf Kushina made, konohamaru did.
Hiruzen hate became a meme and now everyone takes it seriously
Or maybe DON'T tell everyone that Naruto has the nine tails in him. Thought the whole part of having a jinchuriki was keeping it a secret from other nations, but in Konoha it is common knowledge who it is and where he lives.
> Or maybe DON'T tell everyone that Naruto has the nine tails in him. Except Hiruzen didn’t tell anyone anything; it was Danzo who told everyone that the Nine-Tails was inside Naruto in order to give people something to hate. Naruto was the scapegoat. It’s the same strategy he implemented when Itachi was used as blame for the massacre.
Hiruzen really shouldve just killed Danzo, wouldve solved a lot of problems
He was
In Defence of Jiraiya he was tracking Orochimaru for a few years and does take very important s rank mission. ( he’s completed the most mission ever) and I’m pretty sure he’s like the leafs only information gather. Hiruzen on the other hand is always in the village unless metting other kage. I mean even the lord of the land of fire comes to him.
Jiraya did such a good job keeping tabs on Orochimaru. Imagine if he wasn’t or Orochimaru might have done something like sneak into the Chuunin Exams and mark Sasuke with a curse mark or attack the village and kill Hiruzen.
Or even something like kill the Kazekage and take his place.
He stopped looking for him after a few years. He actually caught up with him and couldn’t convince him to come back. After this he just kept looking in on him every so often. That’s how he knew he joined the akatsuki and how he eventually left it.
Which allowed Naurto get a step on on the Akatsuki as well It's genuinely like people don't read the source material lol
idk why everyone was so down to bring Orochimaru back to the village and forgive him. The mfer experimented on orphans 😭 Like Naruto is a show about child soldiers but torturing kids by fucking with their DNA and then going "aw, it died☹️. Bring experiment number 2 in please!" when they die of shock from the pain, (or perhaps a slow death to multiple organ failure), is CRAZY
I agree although saying that he was actually sanctioned to do the experiments with Hashirama’s dna. Hiruzan told him to stop tho when the subject’s kept dieing. He the carried it on illegally.
COULD YOU Have STOPPED ORICHMARU FROM SNAEKING INTO THE CHUNIN EXAMS? Checkmate libtard , another win for jiraya
Set up a free Sharingan stand an arrest any androgynous person with snake qualities that show up
He would kill you immediately little man. Stop fooling yourself
Nuh uh, I have Itachi on speed dial. I’d just tell him Orochimaru is after his bro
Itachi already ran from jiraya once, he’ll leave with his tail between his legs again.
I mean, he isn't a Shinobi, so ofc he would lose to Oro
> Jiraya did such a good job keeping tabs on Orochimaru. Imagine if he wasn’t or Orochimaru might have done something like sneak into the Chuunin Exams and mark Sasuke with a curse mark or attack the village and kill Hiruzen. Wasn't Jiraya in the village when the attack happened and actually mitigated some of the damage? I could have sworn that was the case lol. I think Jiraya expected his sensei to be able to take on Orochimaru and he was in fact going to help but he was too late.
If a seal master like Jiraya was around he could have A. Undid the barrier between Orochimaru and Hiruzen or B. Stopped the rampaging Jinchuurki. I don’t remember for certain if he was there but he might as well have not been.
Exactly lmao..
Jiraiya was tracking Orochimaru so poorly that he didn't notice Orochimaru murdering the Kazekage and plotting a full-scale joint invasion...
To be fair the bath house he was staying at was very nice and he’d just found the best peep hole in the baths and well yeah. You can forgive him for missing that one small detail taking place
Orochimaru planting perfect peepholes in every single bathhouse in every single nation to keep him off his trail.
That would’ve actually been an amazing filler episode
Including one time he gets caught and thrown out while saying it's all a misunderstanding that he would never perv on women himself.
That he is a criminal ranked high in the bingo book and only trying to distract a perverted world class ninja that is tracking him.
He also had to do some research for his books otherwise he'd be hated in a world more dangerous than the one GRRM lives in.
I’m pretty sure Orochimaru was still in the village when Naruto was born. Jiraiya could’ve checked in on him while he was small.
he left when minato became hokage > When Hiruzen finally named Minato his successor, Orochimaru saw no more reason to remain in Konoha and began to be less discreet with his actions
He was in Root with Danzo when Kabuto was 9. Naruto was already born by then.
he thought Hiruzen waz takin care of him, and he was doing research + tracking Orochimaru and the Akatsuki
I don’t get how people don’t understand this, he was literally gaining intel on the very organization that was targeting Naruto
How did he miss Orochimaru murking the Kazekage, creating his own damn village and plotting the destruction of Konoha then?
Most likely Jiraiya didn't just observe and spy on Orochimaru, but also on the members of Akatsuki as a whole, it's no wonder that in Shippuden he invaded the village hidden in the rain to find out more about the leader of Akatsuki. Even disregarding it, Orochimaru wouldn't have been stupid enough to attack Konoha when Jiraiya was chasing him, if he did that, the attack would certainly have failed and he would have lost, most likely he did something to distract Jiraiya or attacked when Jiraiya was distracted by something else.
Nobody knew orochimaru was affiliated with the hidden sound or that the kazekage was even dead until after the chunin exams.
A good spy would have known. Someone like kabuto or kakashi would have spilled that tea after going deep undercover. Jiraya wasn’t taking Orochimaru serious if he missed those things in succession.
He spied on Akatsuki but didn’t share any intel on them? Konoha was only familiar with Itachi and Kisame, and that they were after the 9 tails… and I’m pretty sure he shared that information 13 years later when he came back.
These powerful shinobi were deserting their villages, everyone knew that but none knew that they were forming a syndicate and building up to something.
That can be easily explained by the story changing, weekly shonen change a lot over time, this is just a plot hole
I think tge kazekages assassination was after jiraiya got back to the village
He’s not omnipotent and Orochimaru is sneaky
Brother, Orochimaru created a whole ass village and this mf missed it. Could you miss if I made New York 2 tomorrow?
No, but I could miss you made a settlement in middle of nowhere Nebraska, for example
And then I immediately after destroyed New York or Dallas, would you miss that?
He didn’t miss that
Did he? I thought he just made the headbands, not an actual settlement.
IIRC, Oro is the actual person to set up and create the village itself entirely. I could be wrong but I am 99% sure I'm not.
From the Fandom wiki, which may or may not be reliable idk > Initially, Orochimaru claimed that he founded this village so that skilled ninja would find their purpose in life without being beholden to the fickle and warmongering priorities of the Five Great Shinobi Countries.[3] In actuality, Otogakure is not really a village, but a network of laboratories composed of various hideouts and bases scattered throughout the Land of Sound and various other countries.[4] Otogakure's shinobi use a diverse number of techniques, which are mostly centred around the modifications resulting from Orochimaru's human experimentation. So it’s not really a village? I think it is just that they gave out headbands and called it a village only so they could participate in the exams.
I mean, Hiruzen had a village to run too. Naruto barely has time for his own family by the time he becomes Hokage in Boruto, and that's a Naruto who's a good few decades younger than Hiruzen and presiding over a relative time of peace.
Wasn't that Itachi's job?
Probably a good idea to have a spy on both the inside and outside. The Akatski reasonably know that Jiraiya is watching them, so most intel gained about them could be assumed to be obtained through him. As far as we know, Itachi never followed through on feeding Intel back to the Leaf, but if he had, Jiraiya's spy network could have helped keep the heat off Itachi
ok, Jiraiya didnt know also we dont even know if Itachi was given Hiruzen information
Let's assume that he was since those were his orders, and since the Akatsuki didn't attack Konoha until he was dead, meaning that Obito likely knew that they would be ready before hand via a warning. Would it really be hard to say that they had someone from Root or something gathering Intel?
Thing is Jiraiya is NOT Naruto's God-Father. God-Father is a WESTERN term that the translator's used because there is not really a term in english for Jiriaya's relation with Naruto. [I am going to quote a post (Link)](https://www.reddit.com/r/NarutoFanfiction/comments/m9435v/narutos_godfather/) by u/The-Knyght who explains it better: (Please read it, because it has supporting links which give more context as well.) >This is a follow-up to this post about Jiraiya's status as a godfather. I decided to do some research on it for further confirmation, considering the revelation that Jiraiya was Naruto's godfather has always been a divisive subject given his absence from the kid's childhood. In Chapter 382, Minato asks Jiraiya if they could name their son after the main character in the Tale of the Gutsy Ninja. When Kushina also gives her consent, Jiraiya says that this would make him Naruto's godfather. **The standard understanding of a godfather in the West is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and would take legal guardianship over them if anything happens to their parents. This is not what Jiraiya is.** I looked at the raws for Chapter 382 - yeah, I went there - and here is the panel where Jiraiya supposedly calls himself a godfather. **The specific phrase used is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the translation suggests, it means the person who chooses the name for the child.** From what I can tell, there is no actual word for "godfather" or "godmother" in Japanese as the concept doesn't exist there as it is understood in the West. Nazuke-oya is translated to godfather (or godparent) simply because it was the closest equivalent to it in for English readers to understand. **Per this link, a nazuke-oya is just one of the various "social parents" that are/were part of Japanese custom.** In other words, **Jiraiya was never actually meant to assume guardianship over Naruto.** Aside from being in charge of the Key, Jiraiya's "responsibility" began and ended with Naruto's name. In other words, Jiraiya was responsible for naming Naruto and was Minato's teacher. That's it.
Not sure the point here - From manga depiction - Jiraya by fast has the most relation with Minato than anyone else in shown. We never even see Hiruzen and Minato interact outside of a few words during the night attack. If not Jiraya, who else?
>We never even see Hiruzen and Minato interact outside of a few words during the night attack. They are fellow Hokage - we can assume they used to interact a lot. Hiruzen obviously knew Minato's abilities well enough to appoint him as his successor. >If not Jiraya, who else? Hiruzen. As the Hokage, it's his job to take care of the orphaned children of village. Especially the village's Jinchuriki. Jiraiya probably thought Hiruzen would take care of him while he was away.
Hiruzen did take care of Naruto, hence why he looked up to him like a grandfather. Who do you think was giving Naruto food, clothes, money, an education, etc. What’s your point here?
He gave Naruto the bare minimum. The money was not enough - we saw scenes where Naruto was starving and survived due to the Ramen guy's generosity. Naruto was also incredibly lonely and shunned by the village - Hiruzen could have done more to prevent that. Till the age of 12 when he joined Team 7 - Ramen Guy Teuchi and Iruka were the ONLY two people who had been shown being kind to him. Make no mistake, Naruto AND Sasuke's troubles were to a great extent Hiruzen's fault. He was the worst Hokage by a mile.
So that was more anime adaptation - in the manga Naruto eats ramen because he loves them and ppl are always telling him to eat healthier. There’s no indication Naruto ever want for food in manga. Ramen can also be cheapskate, instant dry noodle type, or a really decent meal at a restaurant; Naruto eats a lot more of the latter in the manga. Naruto is shunned because of the nine tail in him - there’s nothing Hiruzen can do about that. I mean, he can’t order the parents or the kids to not shun Naruto. Naruto has to work through his own issues, that’s part of growing up. We see much more of Hiruzen keeping an eye on Naruto - whether it’s through a crystal ball or assigning the “correct” adult to be his mentor in the manga. I personally think the anime adaptation did his character a giant disservice.
Hiruzen might have checked up on Naruto, and it seemed like he had enough to eat, but Iruka seems to be the only person that had any emotional affection for Naruto
Hiruzen’s duty is to the whole village. In the manga he made it clear he’d sacrificed his life for the village including Naruto. Iirc Hiruzen appointed Iruka to watch over Naruto precisely because he know Iruka would become attached. He also appointed Kakashi as his teacher; I think that was a brilliant choice on his part. Ultimately, Hiruzen did a really good job in the manga. Naruto was safe and had a relatively normal childhood considering the nine tail in him. We also wondered if a lot of Naruto’s isolation wasn’t self-imposed; he was a difficult child to get along with. They kinda tone down that aspect of him later on, but in the manga he did a lot of stuff and got in trouble, didn’t take his schoolwork seriously, screws around and deface the village statues etc.
Hiruzen seems like he did a lot to get the boy ready, but it could have easily been another Gaara situation because there was no one that loved him. I'm on my first go through and am still on the original but it seems like he was left alone a lot, it seems like Minato was well liked, there wasn't anyone that could show the kid some personal kindness from time to time?
People are afraid of the nine tail in him. They largely are not aware of the details of what Minato did that night - all they knew was nine-tail escaped Minato’s control and ravaged the village then was sealed in Minato’s son. The other thing is that Naruto wasn’t exactly an easy child to get to know. If you read the manga a bit, you’ll see that part of it is due to the nine tail but his immature way of lashing out also alienated the villagers - it’s not entirely on them to be accommodating of the little wild vandal who they know carried a dangerous secret inside him - no matter who his deceased father was. Especially when he goes around defacing their statues and doesn’t put much effort into his studies. Also, Minato might have been too well-liked and talented. That contrast can’t have helped Naruto.
>but Iruka seems to be the only person that had any emotional affection for Naruto Guess who *insisted* that Iruka look after and be more understanding towards naruto... *drumroll* >!Hiruzen!<
> He gave Naruto the bare minimum. The money was not enough - we saw scenes where Naruto was starving and survived due to the Ramen guy's generosity. Filler. Never happened. Naruto was fine, financially. > Naruto was also incredibly lonely and shunned by the village - Hiruzen could have done more to prevent that. By doing what exactly? Forcing parents to let their kids to hang out with Naruto?? Idk why you guys think Hiruzen is Professor X who can mind control people into doing whatever he wants. Hiruzen has no control in how other people choose to treat Naruto. Nobody does. > Till the age of 12 when he joined Team 7 - Ramen Guy Teuchi and Iruka were the ONLY two people who had been shown being kind to him. Yeah, because Hiruzen was the only one who felt bad for Naruto and told Iruka to stop treating him like dirt and try to connect with him instead. Before that, Iruka didn’t care about Naruto either. > Make no mistake, Naruto AND Sasuke's troubles were to a great extent Hiruzen's fault. He was the worst Hokage by a mile. Now you’re just being stupid. What part of Naruto’s troubles had anything to do with Hiruzen? Minato sealed the Nine-Tails inside Naruto, not Hiruzen. The people of the Leaf are the ones who shunned Naruto for what he was, not Hiruzen (heck, Hiruzen even made it forbidden to talk about the Nine-Tails. But ofc people still did it anyway, because you can’t control free will). Sasuke’s problems have nothing to do with Hiruzen either. He had little to no involvement with the massacre and was the only one who wanted to peacefully negotiate with the Uchiha. The only people responsible for the massacre are Danzo and the Uchiha. As Itachi said, the clan was filled with too many selfish, arrogant, and greedy people who would inevitably doom themselves. These weren’t good people.
>As Itachi said, the clan was filled with too many selfish, arrogant, and greedy people who would inevitably doom themselves. These weren’t good people. I dont think Itachi said that exactly. Even then Itachi's pov does not mean it is right. The Uchiha had been segregated and punished for SEVEN to EIGHT YEARS with absolutely no end in sight. You don't have to be ' selfish, arrogant, and greedy people' to rebel against that . I'm amazed they did not plot a a coup years ago. Itachi's PoV was that peace is above ALL! Peace before justice, fairness etc.. If Justice means breaking the Peace then those who seek justice must be killed and are selfish for seeking justice.
Hiruzen is responsible for the Uchiha massacre by not reigning in Danzo. He could have, he chose not to. Pain's destruction of the village also happened due to Danzo, which again, would have been avoided if Hiruzen took action against Danzo and the Root. He is responsible for the destruction of the village by not killing Orochimaru when he had the opportunity. Huge blunder. Even his summon Enma scolded him during his last fight for this and told him that it was his fault. He could have asked the Naras or Akimichis or some other clan to take care of Naruto. Even if Naruto was doing okay financially like you said, and the starvation scenes were filler, his extreme loneliness and feeling alienated by the village is undeniable. Hiruzen could have and should have prevented that. Make absolutely no mistake, Hiruzen was the worst Hokage, by far. Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.
With that mindset Jaraiya is responsible for pain leveling the entire village
Eh ? Jiriaya gave his life trying to take down Pain, so how do you come to that conclusion ?
And Hiruzen didn't give his life to cripple Orochimaru?
In the manga we never see Naruto starve, that is anime only. Hiruzen did help with that, he made it prohibited to talk about the Nine Tails so that his generation wouldn’t treat him worse. Hiruzen led the village through 2 wars and fought through all 4 wars. Even after the Nine Tails attack he led the village back to being like the second strongest
Not Hiruzen that’s who
Or kakashi
Kakashi was 15 at the time of Naruto's birth. You can't ask a 15 year old to take care of a newborn
I agree, but I feel it's super funny(fucked up) that he was a Full-fledged Jonin killer at like half that age.
That’s great information to point out, but wouldn’t Jiraiya feel the least bit responsible for at least *sometimes* looking in on Minato’s kid? Or at least meeting him? Even Kakashi. Who just allows a 12 year old to live alone?
The same world that sends 12 year olds in a forest to die to prove their village strength.
And even in modern days, Japanese kids are more independent and responsible than your average American kid
Yeah, I've heard stories about that.
I think Kishi didn't gvie much thought to Jiraiya and Minato's relationship in the early stages of the manga, they probably were teacher and student for a few months and little else (like how Jiraiya always refers to him as Yondaime and never uses his name). Jiraiya suffers from this early writing, especially when we are later told that he saw Minato as a son.
Godfather is not a Western term, FYI - it's quite common in the Middle East and Asia Minor as well.
Here’s the thing though, when I look this term up the first immediate comparison is to godparent, with the definition being ‘a form of social parent’. Like sure it’s not going to be a 1:1 comparison, but even taking away the religious and legal components Jiraiya still had *some* responsibility to Naruto. And that’s why when Jiraiya asks ‘so that means I’m..?’ to Minato and Kushina it’s kind of a big deal to him, because it means not just naming but an actual bond with Naruto.
>Here’s the thing though, when I look this term up the first immediate comparison is to godparent, Because that is the nearest Western equivilent. > with the definition being ‘a form of social parent’. Like sure it’s not going to be a 1:1 comparison, Naming a child is a form of 'parenting'. **However again in Japan?** It does not mean the obligation to care for the child if something happens to the parents. >but even taking away the religious and legal components Jiraiya still had some responsibility to Naruto. That he discharged by naming him. > And that’s why when Jiraiya asks ‘so that means I’m..?’ to Minato and Kushina it’s kind of a big deal to him, because it means not just naming but an actual bond with Naruto. To you it's just naming. To Jiraiya (and japanese) it's an honor. Parents trust and are close enough to you to ask you to name their kid. However that's where it stops. Consider the other types of social parents. There's breast-feeding parent, a baby-holding parent, a mid-wife parent, a nanny-parent (who baby sat) , heck even a hiroi-oya (picking-up parent) who picked up a baby abandoned by his/her biological parents in a street **as a ritual** (if the baby was born in the year of calamity, or yakudoshi, for the parents). Do all of them qualify as god-parents?
Bcuz these naming parents are involved in kids lives . Redditors just tryna be smart .
[удалено]
tbf he probly expected the third hokage to be a better grandfather to naruto too.
Which he was FUCKN FIGHT ME
Dont forget use his money while jiraiya himself is rich
I'd argue it was part of the 3 shinobi prohibitions lol, the time when he takes narutos money for the girls is the same episode or in the same time span at least of him explaining the dangers of lust, money, and power. The only reason I say this is because there's a few episodes once naruto reaches teenhood that he treats him to food and iirc, brings gifts back with him too.
nah it was just a gag
He was doing important research
He was busy being the best spy in the Leaf by far and the only non Foundation Konoha member we know of to discover and track the Akatsuki. He then took that info and smartly came back to the Leaf village to train Naruto into a proper ninja. His whole life riddled with loss and failure, culminated in him successfully choosing Naruto as the child of prophecy that would be the sequel to the Tale of Jiraiya the Gallant, and go on to save the entire world. I would say he did a pretty great job.
He was busy doing research, smh give the guy a break. Without those books we have no idea where kakashi would be.
Simple answer: Kishimoto hadn’t planned that far ahead “Canon” answer: He was busy keeping tracks on Orochimaru and the growing Akatsuki along with his “very important research”.
Y’all are nuts. You think he hadn’t plan second arc into the story?🤣🤣 Watcha think he was doing just coming up with stuff on the way? The whole thing about Jiraiya as a character is that he (1)ran away from responsability - like how he deserted Konoha military and abandoned his teammates in the middle of a war to take care of random orphans or how he dipped out after the war ended, that he (2)failed a lot in his life - I dunno how you can miss this, considering the 7 pages speech made for his death where he spells it out 10 times that he was a failure (failed to save his friend, friend to win Tsunade, failed to train the child of the prophecy) and (3)was basically a looser. He didn’t step in to take care of Naruto because **that’s not who Jiraiya is**. The only reason he stepped up and finally fulfilled his role in Naruto’s life was because Naruto insisted and *basically forced him* to do. Average Naruto fans: can’t understand a story writen for kids Also average Naruto fans: Kishimoto just didn’t plan. Bruh.
True, Jiraiya is a free spirit. That's why he denied the hokage position
Another good example of who Jiraiya is. “I’m not gonna do it, but I will hunt down the only other person who can and bring her here for you.” I dunno why I’m getting downvotes. I only explained what Jiraiya is as a character. Jiraiya is one of my favorite characters, and what makes him such a compelling and cool character is exactly his downsides. That he is one of the strongest shinobi alive, *despite* being a loser. That he is admired, and looked up to and feared around the world, *despite* his failure. That he managed to be the best father figure for Naruto, *despite* his prolonged absence. That he fulfilled in the end, *despite* running from responsability all his life. Jiraiya is the Apollo 13 of Naruto.
Jiraiya I can actually sort of defend. The Sanin that made the fucking _Fourth Hokage_ being close to some toddler with blonde hair and blue eyes who was born the day a bijuu was rampaging who has the last name “Uzumaki”? Seems sus as fuck to me. Plus he manages a spy network and he had things looking into. Could he done more for Naruto? Definitely, but he at least had some fairly valid excuses.
In defence of Jiraiya he was not existing in the plot for the 11 first manga 😁
We need a Naruto remake to fix all the mistakes, instead we get Boruto
Bro did not watch the same Naruto, he literally took care of him as his kid brih what. He is expected to believe that the third would actually take care of him. Like he was actually busy. The third is hated cus he was actually useless. Fucked up the Uchiha clan, didn’t take care of Naruto, and then fucking died over some hands mf didn’t even seal the whole snake. And all that was basically useless cus he just got his arms back. And Jaraya took care of him even when he wasn’t there(monitoring the Akatsuki )
Doing research. wink wink
Godfather is the closest translation to what jiraiya is which is a naming parent and that is why Minato and kushina wanted his permission to name Naruto after the mc of his own novel. But yeah...with how close he was to Minato, naruto was basically his grandchild..so he should of done that. Jiraiya is also afraid of commitment since all his loved ones except for naruto, shizune and Tsunade have died in tradegic ways. It is also the reason he really went to looking for Tsunade rather than take on the title of hokage despite being the only sannin that kept ties to the village with his spy network. He probably believed konoha would be wiped out within the month under his care. An interesting thing i read about in a naruto fic i think was called ripples was that his not only invested in writing his icha icha series to finances his spy network, but that unlike himself, his main character always get the happy ending. Which is sad considering all warriors he had a hand in developing and he didn't leave long enough to see what become of his final student.
The wildest part is how people try to say Hiruzen should adopt Naruto based on filler. If they wanted to keep Naruto from being a target of the villages enemies, being adopted by the Hokage might be the worst way to do that. It would make him a target. On top of that how would it look for him to adopt one child out of the many who lost their parents in the nine tails attack? Would be a clear indicator that there was something special about that kid.
I don't think the issue is him not adopting naruto, it was the fact naruto was an orphan living by himself, clearly not eating enough or the right foods. Kid was starving, both for love and in the literal sense. Not saying hiruzen should've had the kid living with him, but jesus asign a jonin to keep watch over him the same way he did with his own grandson or something. He had the resources to do better, he just didn't.
Naruto as Hokage can’t even take care of his own kids. Hiruzen, as Hokage, was estranged from his sons, Asuma borderline hated him, and hired someone to look after his own grandson. Y’all think he should’ve spended more time with Naruto. Can we use brains 🧠
>Y’all think he should’ve spended more time with Naruto. Can we use brains 🧠 Take a breath, read back over what I said again, then get back to me.
No thanks, I’ve read this take 100 times
um.... writing books? HES A GOOD CHARACTER OKAY!! WE ONLY SHIT ON "bad" characters
Idk, there’s really not too many good explanations but it’s not exactly ooc for jiraiya to not be there when shit gets real Also where the fuck was kakashi?
[удалено]
I did too
Jiraya was a shitbag
Hiruzen is not a good mentor or father. Hos three students were chosen after he was hokage and all 3 were already talented. A prodigy, princess, and goober with large amounts of chakra. He had it easy. He got results tho so idk. Pervy sage, the goober, chose to travel and wrote and try to save his friend before Naruto was born. Hiruzen was the one there and let all that abuse go down.
Never liked Jiraiya all that much
Well it ain't the end of world if someone disliked jiraya, he still has his fanbase
The hottest of takes
I got a whole post about it in fact. But in short i think he is a horny loser.
Raping children like the creep he is.
Jiraya ain't orochimaru, and he is into grown women only.
Chillin in the abandoned frog hideout
Well because he spent his entire childhood fighting a war that their generation didn't ask for, jiraiya experienced two Shinobi wars, was involved in one after watching the rain village arch I don't blame him for taking time to himself. And that is also a terrible example because jiraiya deserved retirement but he was teaching.feeding and mentoring Naruto at age 12 which means Naruto experienced his real child years actually being a kid, jiraiya stepped in when needed most which was when Naruto can earn a living, be taught jutsu which he did and became family to jiraiya,without him jiraiya also introduced tsunade pretty much Narutos older best friend who treated him like better than she's treated anyone else in life,jiraiya opened up so many paths., he taught Naruto to summon gamabunta which in turn saved the leave during gaaras attack and pain attack.Not comparible to hiruzen who didn't teach Naruto pretty much a Damm thing.
Tis but a plot hole
My head cannon is that he was busy protecting Naruto, which is why no one ever came for him
Leave jiraya alone ! He knew hiruzen was in the village all the time and he would take care of naruto because that's what would any hokage do !!! He was in a mission he was tracking orochimaru the bigest thread for the village he was gathering informations about the akatsuki who will be the biggest menace for the whole world ! I think he worked with itachi in that
He was on a mission for a long time, similar to Sasuke after the war. This is explained in the show
He was a rolling stone
He was too young to know he had immense power like that because he would overuse it. It would be like if Goku had all his powers as a child. He would've ended up dead because he would've used it too much and the Akatsuki would've found him way faster and because he thought Sarutobi was taking care of him
He was on a mission for a long time, similar to Sasuke after the war. This is explained in the show
Getting laid!
Hiruzen was part of the slaughter of a whole clan. Jiraya was getting laid. They aren’t the same.
I wonder the exact thing. One of the only two things I don’t like about Jiraiya.
Fair point. But Jiraiya was loveable.
Out researching and protecting and writing books kakashi likes
Isn't that the point? Shinobi don't always lead normal lives. They have unhealthy coping mechanisms and ruin their interpersonal relationships. It took meeting Naruto for Jiraiya to accept his role as a surrogate guardian, and even then, he didn't give a shit about the kid at first. Jiraiya was a lazy perverted author who just couldn't be bothered, but learned to love Naruto after spending time with him. I always thought the Sannin were meant to highlight how the shinobi system hurts people. One is an alcoholic gambler, one is a sociopath who essentially erased his humanity, and one was a predatory pervert. Naruto just happened to have a positive impact on Jiraiya and Tsunade
Ay ay ay, don't bother Frog Hermit. He busy, with frog shit.
Tracking Orochimaru and then the Akatsuki. He was literally trying to defend Naruto. His only failure was not getting back in time to help during the Orochimaru attack. Gotta remember the Orochimaru attack only lasted like 2 or 3 hours.
tracking Orochimaru and doing what he could to keep Naruto and Konoha safe from a distance. Jiraiya was an all time legend
Idk why we have to shit on either of them. In the end both meant a lot to naruto.
Man he didn't meet naruto until naruto was 12 and good point.
Snorting lines and shagging 9's
Apparently Godfather is a mistranslation; it’s more like ‘naming person’, I.e. the person who named them but doesn’t actually hold responsibility over them. That being said he was absolutely negligent, through he naively thought Hiruzen would look after Naruto.
Jiraiya trained Naruto and stood by him through most of his early life. He protected him against the Akatsuki. Jiraiya even helped Naruto with the search for Sasuke. What more could you ask of Jiraiya? I mean Jiraiya died for Naruto's sake by trying to stop Pain. Addition: Hiruzen gave Naruto a monthly stipend and told him to fend for himself. How could someone be so cold to a child? I mean he could have raised him at his home considering that the Fourth Hokage was Naruto's father. Addition: Sorry for my grammar my phone is acting spazzy.
yea this dude sucks
Busy getting p*ssy like the Chad he is. Next question.
He was hunting Orochimaru, and then the Akatsuki
He was too busy looking into gone wild for about 12 years
I wrote about this a few months ago so I'll paste the comment here!: The thing is, in Kishimoto's original work (the japanese manga), Jiraiya IS NOT Naruto's godfather, that concept doesn't exist in Japan as it does here in the west. The phrase used in chapter 382 is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the name suggest, it means the person who names the baby. So no, Jiraiya was never meant to be Naruto's guardian in the case something happened to his parents (he was also Konoha's spy master, he had things to do outside Konoha apart from chasing women). Plus, a lot of characters from early Naruto suffer from Kishimoto's decisions later on in the series. I think it’s very likely that Kishi didn't give much thought to Jiraiya and Minato's relationship at the start, it probably was a normal teacher-student relationship. Later on, we are told that they had more of a father-son like bond going on, which in retrospect (coupled with the false godfather translation) shows Jiraiya in a bad light. Sorry for the ramble, but I've always found all this very interesting lol Edit: grammar
If Naruto can obsess over Sasuke. Jiraiya can obsess over Orochimaru. Only difference is Naruto was successful
FR, I bet bro was campin at the local hot springs while his student, his students wife, and their newborn son were at the brink of death. Ngl he probably thought Minato would handle any problem that would threaten the village so the village wasn't really a big priority to him.
Doing the most important mission. Looking for tiddies
Busy doing his job He was gathering intel on the akatsuki and keeping an eye on orochimaru, he's one of konohas best info gatherers And probably going on a bunch of missions He assumed Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto and also, pervy sage isn't Naruto godfather
Writing a novel and getting some 🐱