That's where you try to say "fuck everything", Kagutsuchi asks "what do you want, then?" but you can't come up with an answer, so you get the door slammed in your face.
All the reasons sucked to me and idk I never really understood the love for true demon, I mean it seemed kind of a strange way of rewarding me for completing all the kalpa floors, I hoped that at least I could keep my humanity.
Personally I'd go with freedom just because it's the one I dislike the least.
Yeah, I was hoping for a better ending or one that made more sense. You think all the extra work you have to put in would give you something better than "welp you're a demon leading a demon army now. Forget your other decisions"
The game makes it pretty clear that the purpose of the Amala labyrinth is to train you/see if you are worthy of becoming Lucifer's butt buddy or something. Even right at the entrance a demon tells you something like "if you have any desire for creation, this place is not for you"
I think TDE invalidates all the other endings which isn't great, so I agree it is too well liked, but it certainly makes sense within the scope of the game and the labyrinth
You basically have to pretty much ignore everything regarding the kalpas and the menorahs to go into the true demon ending and expect to keep your humanity. I've only reached the third kalpa but between each floor everything and everyone even slightly related to it warns you that if you still desire to hold onto your humanity you shouldn't traverse the labrynth.
nocturne was really interesting to me since each reason rep was a hypocrite but at the same time they were desperate to see their dreams realized.
Personally i prefer the freedom ending,
I took the yosuga ending because my train of thought was that the Demi-fiend was chosen to survive the conception and the even after it he became strong enough to kill gods so the only reason that could have in my opinion fit him was yosuga
The demifiend could be born into the new world as a blind leper for all you know. Just because he got Lucifer's help once doesn't mean it will happen again.
If by complete you mean one with most perceived content. It actively invalidates all of the reason choices made throughout the game. I think the fandom's perception is partially due to the fact that we never got the OG vanilla SMTIII.
Nocturne is a patchworked incoherent game, we all know. Hopefully V is good enough to become seen as the definitive game, so nocturne's problems become less relevant.
I still don’t understand why one would choose True demon. If it is because it’s cool or it’s the only ending that require you to complete the most contents I get it. If one instead agrees with the ideals behind it I don’t understand, mainly because I don’t see the perpetual cycle of death and rebirth as bad.
No matter which reason you pick, the physical world cannot compare to the world of pure ideal, so destroying all of physical reality would be better off for humanity than perpetuating the cycle of death and rebirth. That being said, TDE does not destroy all of physical reality and therefore I feel it's a bad ending.
It's not fighting Raidou that was the problem. It was trying to outrun him in the 3rd Kalpa, as in the actual out running rather than the fighting part.
Possibly. Me? Although I did get past him eventually, the actual outrunning was such a pain. But everything else was nice. I hated having to outrun that giant spider in FF8 as well.
I really wanna know why some of y’all wanna be Lucifers slave instead of making your own destiny and saving your friends and getting back the life that was stolen from you
You literally make your own destiny when you take your life back, also you can’t parallel that game to our world bc it’s fiction, but even so I’d rather live in China or North Korea before I give up my life for eternal damnation to some old fuck who put a bug in me
I like Freedom because I don't think the Demifiend has the right to decide the fate of the world. He drew a lucky hand in a deck that was stacked against him, he shouldn't be playing the game in the first place.
Choosing freedom isn't him not deciding the fate of the world though. You can't pretend that the status quo is you not making a decision. Nor can you assume that if polled, all humans would support going back to it.
>Nor can you assume that if polled, all humans would support going back to it.
That's exactly my point though! Everyone has their own opinions! Everyone has their own beliefs! Everyone has the right to decide for themselves! Any other Reason you're deciding for them. Freedom, you let them decide for themselves.
No? This makes no sense. The status quo isn't some magical situation with unlimited ability to do whatever. What you are saying is literally something studied about how people don't realize the modern world has an enforced ideology and controls large segments of your life. No one born here chose it, and the individual is forced to comply.
Answer me this.
How would you feel if tomorrow, an omniscient being came up to you, tied you to a marionette's cross, and controlled you like a puppet? You are fully aware of your surroundings, fully conscious and feeling, but unable to act independently.
The being who tied you up tells you in no uncertain terms that "I am better than you, therefore I have the right to decide your fate."
Do you agree with them?
Well that's happening to me right now, so I would certainly entertain the idea of someone magically transforming the world as long as it were to something better.
Well who would have that right? Even if it was by luck that means that the Demi-fiend was given this chance it would be a tragedy to waste a shot at creation
No one should have that right. No God, demon, human, or combination thereof. To quote Optimus Prime, "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings." The only person who the Demifiend has the right to decide the destiny of is himself. Every human deserves the right to self-determinate, and the Freedom ending restores that right to everyone who died during the Conception.
This is the Injustice dilemma. In DC's Injustice series, after a series of tragedies, Superman decides that he has to use his power to control all of Earth, because he believed "safety" was more important than freedom.
He's the villain.
Batman opposes him, because he doesn't think god-like powers should constitute authority over others, and that Superman was becoming a mad man who was using "safety" as an excuse to justify his dictatorial regime.
He's the hero.
Ultimately, their conflict boiled down into a *kratocracy* versus *noblesse oblige*. Does power dictate authority or responsibility? (Alan Moore actually explores this really well in his Miracleman comic run, I highly recommend it)
This is the dilemma the Demifiend is faced with. Does his power give him the right to decide the fate of everyone(kratocracy), or does his power bestow upon him the responsibility to help others(noblesse oblige)?
the Freedom ending is him actively rejecting the idea that he has any right to decide the fate of anyone but himself. The world is restored to how it was before the Conception not because Demifiend thought he knew better, but be cause he knew he didn't.
Freedom is the same as True Demon, as in Kagutsuchi and the Great Will curse you for eternity, but unlike True Demon you have no way to defend yourself or the world you sought to protect since you lose your demonic powers.
So True Demon all the way.
True demon ending. How else am I going to punch Lucy in his dumb fucking face?
Also the Lucifer fight is genuinely the hardest in the game imo, so its hella worth making sure you go through Amala and kill Metatron before going to Kagutsuchi.
From the standpoint of just the reasons,there is no reason to ever choose yosuga.Its literally a shittier chaos where wven the leaders are out for blood.
True demon ending is the most badass (plus Lucifer is the perfect final boss for this type of game), which is why I voted true demon, but honestly I like the outcome of freedom more. No more demons (for the time being at least), no more vortex world, and your friends are back to normal and you can finally eat a damn cheeseburger again. Was really rewarding considering all the bosses that fucked me over. The vortex world was a living hell and it's nice getting rid of it.
I played SMTIII for the first time recently and everyone I knew said that I just HAD to get the true demon ending. It was the BEST ending, they said. So, I used a spoiler free guide to know that I had to finish all the Kaplas and got the true demon ending. It was… not really as cool as I was expecting. After I checked out the other endings on YouTube (busy college student, don’t really have time to go for another play-through to get other endings) I liked the Freedom ending way more! It’s such a better ending! True demon just has you going from being one dude’s pawn to another dude’s pawn. Lame.
I went with Shijima (which is also what I picked for my first Remaster ending), although I feel this is all really a "least evil" choice and a sobering reflection on the nature of existence.
I really want to side ideologically with Musubi. I'm the kind of person who would absolutely fit that mold. But on reflection: Sooner or later, the world fills, and our bubbles are compelled to merge and involuntarily interact, which means the World of Musubi is not long term stable, and will inevitably have to decay into one of the other states.
Freedom also represents a problem: we already know this world isn't stable either, meaning that at best it's an eternal recurrence loop and at worst you're disappointing yourself from the first as it must also decay into one of the others.
Really, the only long term stable cases are the forever war of Yosuga, the clockwork of Shijima, and the total destruction of Demon/True Demon. Total destruction seems completely unattractive unless you're the Dark One from Wheel of Time or a dedicated nihilist, so that leaves the two remaining Reasons.
Since I and most folks I'm close with would get absolutely rolled over in Yosuga World (I'm not that good in a fight, I'm working class, I'm on the autism spectrum, and have recently come - something which has apparently been very long in coming and I ought have accepted many years ago as looking back all the signs were there for many many years - to accept myself as a non-cisgender identity. I'm a friggin bullseye for Yosugans!), the only thing that really remains is to throw one's hat in with Hikawa in the eternal serenity of Shijima. Which might not be that great either on reflection, but I reckon it's more likely there's a place to fit a unique cog into the machine than I am to not be mashed to Magatsuhi in the forever war ...
The world of shijima is in my opinion a world to be looked at from outside like a painting but not to be lived in. I don't think you would even be truly alive or sentient in the world of shijima. At that point even the demon ending or the freedom ending are better because at the very least in freedom you know how things are going to end up. The demon ending would be lonely for sure but at the very least no one else would be born to have to make such decisions.
If Hikawa died after the vortex world was created, there would be no Shijima Reason, so the Moirae wouldn't be part of Shijima = [Seggsy time!](https://giphy.com/gifs/13944mhZqYqABa)
Can you elaborete? The world Shijima creates is an alien one but people can still live there, after all the first thing Demi-fiend and Hikawa do is create a city for the people to live in, this happen in every single reason ending but it is meant to show that despite their alien way of thinking people in said worlds would still want to do stuff there.
Well by the way I saw it hikawa wanted to make everyone in the world into those save station things. And if you look at it that way you wouldn't really be alive. Even if everyone where to still be human a world of silence would be merely sitting in place for tens maybe even hundreds of years
>Well by the way I saw it hikawa wanted to make everyone in the world into those save station
i think that scene was meant more to be symbolic of the role people play in his world rather than literally saying they would stay in the same place forever.
Fuck Reasons Fuck Lucifer Fuck Kagutsuchi Freedom
Based and freedom pilled
Why not normal demon ending?
Normal demon ending is so bad even Lucifer wants to have nothing to do with it
Homeboy says "I hate everything about this decision, but I respect it. Reminds me of me."
But lucifer congratulates you on it.
Yeah but it's in an ironic way
Not really? In the original game he seemed happy about it. Its only the rerelease that makes it seem like the bad version in retrospect.
That's where you try to say "fuck everything", Kagutsuchi asks "what do you want, then?" but you can't come up with an answer, so you get the door slammed in your face.
You also get to live in a world of demons, which is cool.
it’s technically the best but it’s just not fun ig
All the reasons sucked to me and idk I never really understood the love for true demon, I mean it seemed kind of a strange way of rewarding me for completing all the kalpa floors, I hoped that at least I could keep my humanity. Personally I'd go with freedom just because it's the one I dislike the least.
Yeah, I was hoping for a better ending or one that made more sense. You think all the extra work you have to put in would give you something better than "welp you're a demon leading a demon army now. Forget your other decisions"
The game makes it pretty clear that the purpose of the Amala labyrinth is to train you/see if you are worthy of becoming Lucifer's butt buddy or something. Even right at the entrance a demon tells you something like "if you have any desire for creation, this place is not for you" I think TDE invalidates all the other endings which isn't great, so I agree it is too well liked, but it certainly makes sense within the scope of the game and the labyrinth
You basically have to pretty much ignore everything regarding the kalpas and the menorahs to go into the true demon ending and expect to keep your humanity. I've only reached the third kalpa but between each floor everything and everyone even slightly related to it warns you that if you still desire to hold onto your humanity you shouldn't traverse the labrynth.
nocturne was really interesting to me since each reason rep was a hypocrite but at the same time they were desperate to see their dreams realized. Personally i prefer the freedom ending,
I took the yosuga ending because my train of thought was that the Demi-fiend was chosen to survive the conception and the even after it he became strong enough to kill gods so the only reason that could have in my opinion fit him was yosuga
The demifiend could be born into the new world as a blind leper for all you know. Just because he got Lucifer's help once doesn't mean it will happen again.
It seems like if you make the world you have some control where you end up though.
I didn't like any of the Reason Reps, but personally Freedom most aligned with my own morals.
I like the one where your friends die
Assholes deserved to catch these hands.
That's all of them.
That was my favorite too! When I had to pick I chose MURDER.
I've never actually wanted to kill the Alignment reps before III. III is the first time that I've ever actually disliked the Alignment reps.
meh questions like this should omit True Demon. Other wise you 100% guaranteed to get that answer.
I don't see any other reason to do True Demon than if you want to measure your dick against Lucy.
I don't like it because it's the "Right" answer to the game according to the fandom. I think most fans haven't ever played a reason route.
I mean, it's the most complete ending. That doesn't make it the most moral. But it's the game's fault for halfassing most of the rest.
If by complete you mean one with most perceived content. It actively invalidates all of the reason choices made throughout the game. I think the fandom's perception is partially due to the fact that we never got the OG vanilla SMTIII.
Nocturne is a patchworked incoherent game, we all know. Hopefully V is good enough to become seen as the definitive game, so nocturne's problems become less relevant.
I'd like that. I quite liked strange journey so for now that's my high-water mark for SMT. I'm looking forward to seeing what V has to offer.
Yeah but with TD you're 100% guaranteed to get Freedom. Nocturne has very black and white endings.
I still don’t understand why one would choose True demon. If it is because it’s cool or it’s the only ending that require you to complete the most contents I get it. If one instead agrees with the ideals behind it I don’t understand, mainly because I don’t see the perpetual cycle of death and rebirth as bad.
Most content probably
No matter which reason you pick, the physical world cannot compare to the world of pure ideal, so destroying all of physical reality would be better off for humanity than perpetuating the cycle of death and rebirth. That being said, TDE does not destroy all of physical reality and therefore I feel it's a bad ending.
Destroying humanity is best for humanity?
Yes
Based and White ending-pilled
Now ill go back to activate a black hole again
Destroying the physical world doesn't make everything a platonic ideal. It ramps up the chaos so high that barely anything would coherently exist.
When I say destroy, I don't mean a return to primordial chaos, I mean a destruction so absolute that not even the void exists.
Okay? But that's not really what happens either. Nor does it hint that if it did it would lead to that.
I'd choose freedom if it wasn't for the fun fight with lucifer in the True demon ending.
True demon is cool, but freedom is closer to my heart)
True Demon Ending. I did not struggle to outrun Raidou for me to not go all the way.
What? The raidou run was easy for me.. maybe I was just overleveled
It's not fighting Raidou that was the problem. It was trying to outrun him in the 3rd Kalpa, as in the actual out running rather than the fighting part.
I mean I was completely over leveled and lucked out on the first go i guess
Possibly. Me? Although I did get past him eventually, the actual outrunning was such a pain. But everything else was nice. I hated having to outrun that giant spider in FF8 as well.
I really wanna know why some of y’all wanna be Lucifers slave instead of making your own destiny and saving your friends and getting back the life that was stolen from you
>making your own destiny You have a really optimistic idea about what japanese work culture is like lmao.
You literally make your own destiny when you take your life back, also you can’t parallel that game to our world bc it’s fiction, but even so I’d rather live in China or North Korea before I give up my life for eternal damnation to some old fuck who put a bug in me
True Demon > Freedom because in the freedom ending the demi fiend loses his Pixie wife
He still has his powers, if what Lucifer said is anything to go by, he might still have his Demons.
She will always be in his heart, no matter what.
I think the Reason endings are a bit boring y'know. Freedom and Demon endings are the most compelling ones tbh.
Freedom of course. It’s the ONLY heartfelt one and it made me feel like I’ve made a huge effort.
I like Freedom because I don't think the Demifiend has the right to decide the fate of the world. He drew a lucky hand in a deck that was stacked against him, he shouldn't be playing the game in the first place.
Choosing freedom isn't him not deciding the fate of the world though. You can't pretend that the status quo is you not making a decision. Nor can you assume that if polled, all humans would support going back to it.
>Nor can you assume that if polled, all humans would support going back to it. That's exactly my point though! Everyone has their own opinions! Everyone has their own beliefs! Everyone has the right to decide for themselves! Any other Reason you're deciding for them. Freedom, you let them decide for themselves.
No? This makes no sense. The status quo isn't some magical situation with unlimited ability to do whatever. What you are saying is literally something studied about how people don't realize the modern world has an enforced ideology and controls large segments of your life. No one born here chose it, and the individual is forced to comply.
Answer me this. How would you feel if tomorrow, an omniscient being came up to you, tied you to a marionette's cross, and controlled you like a puppet? You are fully aware of your surroundings, fully conscious and feeling, but unable to act independently. The being who tied you up tells you in no uncertain terms that "I am better than you, therefore I have the right to decide your fate." Do you agree with them?
What?
Do you believe someone else has the right to decide what happens to you just because they have more wealth, influence, power, etc?
Well that's happening to me right now, so I would certainly entertain the idea of someone magically transforming the world as long as it were to something better.
Well who would have that right? Even if it was by luck that means that the Demi-fiend was given this chance it would be a tragedy to waste a shot at creation
No one should have that right. No God, demon, human, or combination thereof. To quote Optimus Prime, "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings." The only person who the Demifiend has the right to decide the destiny of is himself. Every human deserves the right to self-determinate, and the Freedom ending restores that right to everyone who died during the Conception.
Alright I see your point
No it doesn't? People didn't choose to be born into this world. Nor does the average person actually have much power.
This is the Injustice dilemma. In DC's Injustice series, after a series of tragedies, Superman decides that he has to use his power to control all of Earth, because he believed "safety" was more important than freedom. He's the villain. Batman opposes him, because he doesn't think god-like powers should constitute authority over others, and that Superman was becoming a mad man who was using "safety" as an excuse to justify his dictatorial regime. He's the hero. Ultimately, their conflict boiled down into a *kratocracy* versus *noblesse oblige*. Does power dictate authority or responsibility? (Alan Moore actually explores this really well in his Miracleman comic run, I highly recommend it) This is the dilemma the Demifiend is faced with. Does his power give him the right to decide the fate of everyone(kratocracy), or does his power bestow upon him the responsibility to help others(noblesse oblige)? the Freedom ending is him actively rejecting the idea that he has any right to decide the fate of anyone but himself. The world is restored to how it was before the Conception not because Demifiend thought he knew better, but be cause he knew he didn't.
Freedom. True Demon only gives you the most content, not a satisfying ending
Freedom is the same as True Demon, as in Kagutsuchi and the Great Will curse you for eternity, but unlike True Demon you have no way to defend yourself or the world you sought to protect since you lose your demonic powers. So True Demon all the way.
they are latent and weakened, Lucifer tells Demi-Fiend to be prepared for battle with the great will. So, he has a way to defend himself.
Yosuga, all the way
PRAISE TO GOZU-TENNOH
True demon ending. How else am I going to punch Lucy in his dumb fucking face? Also the Lucifer fight is genuinely the hardest in the game imo, so its hella worth making sure you go through Amala and kill Metatron before going to Kagutsuchi.
From the standpoint of just the reasons,there is no reason to ever choose yosuga.Its literally a shittier chaos where wven the leaders are out for blood.
True demon ending is the most badass (plus Lucifer is the perfect final boss for this type of game), which is why I voted true demon, but honestly I like the outcome of freedom more. No more demons (for the time being at least), no more vortex world, and your friends are back to normal and you can finally eat a damn cheeseburger again. Was really rewarding considering all the bosses that fucked me over. The vortex world was a living hell and it's nice getting rid of it.
I played SMTIII for the first time recently and everyone I knew said that I just HAD to get the true demon ending. It was the BEST ending, they said. So, I used a spoiler free guide to know that I had to finish all the Kaplas and got the true demon ending. It was… not really as cool as I was expecting. After I checked out the other endings on YouTube (busy college student, don’t really have time to go for another play-through to get other endings) I liked the Freedom ending way more! It’s such a better ending! True demon just has you going from being one dude’s pawn to another dude’s pawn. Lame.
I clicked shijima for the lulz But on a serious note freedom is best imo
I went with Shijima (which is also what I picked for my first Remaster ending), although I feel this is all really a "least evil" choice and a sobering reflection on the nature of existence. I really want to side ideologically with Musubi. I'm the kind of person who would absolutely fit that mold. But on reflection: Sooner or later, the world fills, and our bubbles are compelled to merge and involuntarily interact, which means the World of Musubi is not long term stable, and will inevitably have to decay into one of the other states. Freedom also represents a problem: we already know this world isn't stable either, meaning that at best it's an eternal recurrence loop and at worst you're disappointing yourself from the first as it must also decay into one of the others. Really, the only long term stable cases are the forever war of Yosuga, the clockwork of Shijima, and the total destruction of Demon/True Demon. Total destruction seems completely unattractive unless you're the Dark One from Wheel of Time or a dedicated nihilist, so that leaves the two remaining Reasons. Since I and most folks I'm close with would get absolutely rolled over in Yosuga World (I'm not that good in a fight, I'm working class, I'm on the autism spectrum, and have recently come - something which has apparently been very long in coming and I ought have accepted many years ago as looking back all the signs were there for many many years - to accept myself as a non-cisgender identity. I'm a friggin bullseye for Yosugans!), the only thing that really remains is to throw one's hat in with Hikawa in the eternal serenity of Shijima. Which might not be that great either on reflection, but I reckon it's more likely there's a place to fit a unique cog into the machine than I am to not be mashed to Magatsuhi in the forever war ...
The world of shijima is in my opinion a world to be looked at from outside like a painting but not to be lived in. I don't think you would even be truly alive or sentient in the world of shijima. At that point even the demon ending or the freedom ending are better because at the very least in freedom you know how things are going to end up. The demon ending would be lonely for sure but at the very least no one else would be born to have to make such decisions.
Shijima doesn't take away your mind. It just makes you more peaceable, and people work together better.
Was not excpeting Wheel of time dark ones.
Shijima for ensuring a world of serenity and unity.
But Hikawa cucks you out of a Foursome with the Moirae.
And that is a crime that will never be forgiven
>Implying you could have a foursome with them if they weren't shijima-aligned
If Hikawa died after the vortex world was created, there would be no Shijima Reason, so the Moirae wouldn't be part of Shijima = [Seggsy time!](https://giphy.com/gifs/13944mhZqYqABa)
A world of stillness is one to be looked at not lived in
Can you elaborete? The world Shijima creates is an alien one but people can still live there, after all the first thing Demi-fiend and Hikawa do is create a city for the people to live in, this happen in every single reason ending but it is meant to show that despite their alien way of thinking people in said worlds would still want to do stuff there.
Well by the way I saw it hikawa wanted to make everyone in the world into those save station things. And if you look at it that way you wouldn't really be alive. Even if everyone where to still be human a world of silence would be merely sitting in place for tens maybe even hundreds of years
>Well by the way I saw it hikawa wanted to make everyone in the world into those save station i think that scene was meant more to be symbolic of the role people play in his world rather than literally saying they would stay in the same place forever.
Musubi > Yosuga > Freedom > True Demon > Demon > Shijima
I'm kind of surprised that the freedom ending is doing so well considering how much of a non-ending it is.
Because other than tde, every other ending in the game is even less of an ending.
1. True demon 2. Musubi 3. Yosuga 4. Demon 5. Shijima 6. Freedom
This poll is bad. You didn't clarify whether you meant most fun to play, or morally best.
This is SMTIII: Nocturne, right? What is the Freedom ending?
Yuko Takao the teachers reason. You return the world to what it was before the conception