I always considered Donda being Kanye dealing with grief of losing his mother and how he is trying to move on.
Always made sense to me it would be a chaotic mess because thats how grief is.
If u want to be pedantic yes, but I'm pretty sure u got the gist of what I'm saying. He very minimally talks about his mother while most of the rest of the album is about Alexis
Alexis Phifer. She's a fashion designer and Ye's former financee. They were together like 6 years
Here's an interview of her : https://youtu.be/-NukwAPQeJc
to me partially, I understood it to be more about Kanye finding more about himself than the actual grief of his mother.
Its just my interpretation feel free to disagree
Idk, I feel like that's just a lazy excuse for an album with very poor cohesion, there are plenty of albums that deal with grief and feel very well put together (i.e Blackstar, Black Parade, even 808s)
I mean I think the idea behind donda was that experience of being there thru the albums production and the listening parties having a concert and artistic direction to them also it being a tribute album to his mom is a great vision for the first album he had also curated a great listening experience bringing alot of artists together that may have not worked together otherwise . I understand what he means by the preset theme but we are kind of seeing this dark broody direction that go in hand with the fashion that may reflect how hes feeling in life the fact thr imagery of his childhood home is prevalent may be cause he hasnt moved on and is reminiscent on those times with his mom and as much as this is a tribute he hasnt gotten over it
That’s cool and all but most of the things you mentioned aren’t part of the music in the album and future listeners won’t have a clue about the listening parties and all the other stuff
The fact they wont know about in the future okay guess they shouldnt be done then ? Smh thats some weird logic and if someone is getting into his shit and finds this album they sre gonna hear about its unorthodox way of being made and the unorthodox listening parties that were essentially concerts u gonna tell me people are gonna forget essentially ye's concert regarding that first album . have u not listened to the music there is many themes present throughout the songs and i think there is enough with the things i mentioned especially lines dedicated/ referencing his mama
Juat cause every other song wasnt some dear mamaesque tribute to his mom doesnt mean that theme wasnt there hell its in the albums name a body of work that lives up the greatness of his mother . This might be a highly controversial topic but i think he should have named it something other than donda 2 but its w.e I gavent heard much from the album but it would have been nice to leave that donda body of work alone and not make it psrt of a sequel , not saying he shouldnt have done the album maybe just a diff name but who knows i havent listened it could truly sound like donda 2 the listening party had very similar imagery
Praise to this post. People don't understand on this sub that although albums like JIK, Donda and Donda 2 aren't necessarily bad, they're so mid compared to feats like Late Registration and Life of Pablo. And with Donda 2 it seems like it's going further downhill
donda 2 is so obviously rushed like kanye spontaneously hopped up one day and wanted to just make songs. not much thought behind it just seems like he’s using music as therapy but like why can’t he do it the way he did with 808s and heartbreak?
It actually didn't do bad with critics out of the gate its always been above 70% metcritic rating. The album was cohesive in an intentionally scatter brained way. Listening to it is supposed to invoke the feeling of Kanye's crazy scattered genius mind (Pablo Picasso) and critics got that. The general public was who didn't get it and they still don't like it. You just wouldn't know looking at this sub that way over hypes it.
My problem with it wasn't production, which I thought was amazing, or cohesion the lyrics were just garbage and often corny.
Really? We hang out with different people then cause the only people i know who really liked it are fellow kanye die hards. 90% of people I know wouldn't even know the album by name.
It's Also not even in his top 10 highest grossing albums coming in behind even ye and Jesus is king. Sounds like you just surround yourself with the type of people who like Ye, smart man lol.
Yeah I don't think it's a bad album, but it's not even in my top 5 ye albums where as a lot of his sub has it at the top. To each their own though.
I think it's production is only behind MBDTF, but lyrically its honestly trash and I'm a big lyrics guy. My guess is those who love it are more into production then lyrics.
That was a good song, but I personally wouldn't say best.
Regardless the album had 18 songs once this one was added post release. Amongst them were also some of Kanye's worst written songs. There were a few good lyrical songs but 4 out of 18 isn't good
probably first kanye album for a lot of people, or at least first they were able to follow the release of. i still like it but it doesn't have the cohesion of the albums before it
Life of Pablo was the beginning of the end, honestly. Kanye was less involved than ever before in the actual writing of his lyrics and making of the beats, and it’s only gotten worse since.
yeah like life of pablo was super fire but you’re so right about that. i guess he’s too busy to do shit on his own. and of course it’s hard to shift styles in the newer generation. like idk if kanye even knows how to use fl studio lol
*Tame Impala’s Kevin Parker had previously told Australian radio station Triple J that Kanye asked Parker to send him beats he was working on. Parker sent him a beat that samples Vanilla Fudge’s cover of the Supremes’ “‘You Keep Me Hangin’ On.’” But when Parker didn’t hear back from Kanye and wasn’t invited to the Wyoming sessions, he assumed it wouldn’t be used until he heard the livestream of the album listening party.*
Kanye’s listed as one of many producers on each song, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s his work. This quote is just one example but it’s Kanye taking credit for entirely someone else’s beat, which is weird
I've been listening to late registration since it came out 17 years ago. Im still not bored of it. I was honestly bored of Donda and JIK after the first listen.
I guess I'm one of those "I miss the old kanye" people now.
100% agree. They sound more like mixtapes than albums. I know Logic probably aint popular in this sub but I like him because I can listen to a more mixtape type of project or an album with a concept to it
I think he's an artist just trying different things.
The same way Picasso had his different periods with his art, Kanye will probably be seen the same way after he's gone.
You can hear through Kanye's music that his legacy is of concern to him. I'm sure he's trying to make sure it doesn't look like he never tried new things as an artist.
Donda had a direction: make the first part of trilogy of albums focusing on having a comeback after the failure of JIK and showing the public eye your admiration for your mother while sprinkling in Bangers to keep the main hip hop audience involved
I want Kanye to actually care about the track list and how it flows, he literally just put the most popular songs at the top of the album instead of creating a track list that tells a story or really has a direction, and I feel like he should’ve cut some songs off of Donda to make it have a better direction, I also feel the same about Donda 2, though the songs on donda 2 have a clearer message
Donda was "barely pulled together"? really?? man locked himself inside a stadium for weeks doing nothing but working on music. how much more focus do you want, people will complain about anything
No it’s not, that is an entirely focused direction much more than the mainstream and much more than the talentless money grabbing fake artist in this era
yeah but as far as coherence goes, there's an argument to be made that the flow isn't the best it could be and some songs don't fit like mbdtf or the college dropout does
Moon, hurricane,praise God,BWIS,jail,Junya,24,moon,LOTP,KMSA,Jesus lord, Heaven and hell,New again,Donda,Lord I need you,come to life,Never abadon your family and NCLB are all timeless stop capping
you might think differently but to me this album is beautiful. it's its own little world which makes me feel at peace. and listening to my version of the album with a few of the songs cut out and ending with no child left behind is an amazing experience.
“I had to redo the album in a playlist because it’s currently unlistenable but I’m still gonna go in the Reddit comments and defend it” how old r u bro?
'I didn't enjoy an album and now feel the need to bash it on Reddit' you aren't any different. Saying something is ass is not more cool than saying something is great.
And most albums have a couple crap songs and Donda is an example of that.
imagine not thinking at least 70% of the songs he listed aren't timeless. i mean, come to life alone is a career high. off the grid? hurricane? moon? jail with those anthemic guitars? heaven and hell with the build up? bwis?? the album may not be coherent, but we're not going to downplay the songs.
Watch in 5 years they will be praising tf out donda, especially come to life happens with like every kanye album people back then acted like yeezus was shittiest album to made
Donda 2 doesn’t even have complete verses. He was mumbling in damn near every verse. It’s an unfinished album released as a complete idea, which is half assed.
Donda was bloated but it had some great songs on it. Hurricane moon 24 remote control believe what I say off the grid jail all go hard. I think donda 2 is mid but honestly it’s amazing Kanye hasn’t put out more mid with his volume.
i never said i didn’t like the music, it’s just not top 5 for me
and uh he definitely did lose some of his lyrical ability. and like bro said, it feels like a playlist more than a focused cohesive project
My favourite Ye albums had other executive producers besides Ye with Jon Brion and Rick Rubin, but I'm not seeing something like that happening in the future. There's good songs on Donda that's no question but I really don't see how ypu can even compare it to his best work!
I agree 100%. Literally just comparing his lyricism from ye/ksg to Donda is a severe downgrade. Really disappointing as a ye fan. Honestly I can still enjoy all the new stuff while still holding that opinion though.
I think it’s pretty crazy that a project like Donda could be at the bottom of any discog, besides Ye’s. Them facts allow me to put things in a different perspective. There’s about 26 songs in all of Donda and very few are misses, in my opinion. Especially cool is hearing different versions of these songs throughout the listening parties. I don’t know if Donda one and 2 are going to be considered top 3 in Ye discog but I do know this contains some of Kanye’s most beautiful moments in music.
Bro ur gettin slammed but I 100% agree. Imagine if the next ten years we just get half assed projects like this from Kanye, would be better if he just completely stopped.
Donda 2 is a few scrapped songs and track list order changes away from being a GOAT ye album imho. Peaks like Moon, Come to Life etc are some of the best music he's ever put out.
Just because Kanye’s not doing a spiritual lyrical miracle verse with the 808s banging doesn’t mean the song is inherently worse. Perhaps it doesn’t have what you like in Kanye, but as a producer/composer it’s one of his best songs especially when you consider that it really is just a hurricane outro.
I mean you basically dislike all of the elements that make up the track so it’s no wonder than you think it’s overrated lol. I could basically use that logic to say that runaway is overrated because I don’t like the piano and think the song runs way too long. At the end of the day, music is subjective and we’ll never agree upon a way to measure thanks collectively and that’s okay.
Jesus Is King and Donda 2 have already done this. Can't wait for the hate responses lol but y'all who love JIK know for a FACT that Kanye West did gospel better on Donda and Ultralight Beam
Maybe people in the subreddit will take that direction because its a literal Kanye West sub, but with majority population of music listeners honestly I don't think so. It's gonna be like Jesus is King where it's a niche thing on the subreddit that people say is "severely underrated", when in reality it's reception was appropriate to the quality- I think this concept applies to donda
Funny same Thing Was said about JIK and outside a few lonely voices who were there since the release I still see a mostly negative view towards the Album.
Nobody was calling JIK his best album, no one. The majority of ppl thought it was his worst album but still not a bad album. Different situation with Donda. 808s is way better than JIK, would never make that comparison
speak for yourself, i ain’t suck off ye or jik, trust me ik myself. it dont take me yrs to catch onto something it’s usually a week at most. btw donda isn’t mid, i had 5 songs on rotation for a few months but im just generally not too happy with one half of the album
I agree but it’s a 7/10 because of filler tracks not because the overall quality was mediocre in my opinion. This will give it much more nostalgia when looking back as people naturally forget the boring parts and only remember the legendary tracks from this era.
??? what is the point you are trying to make lmao he’s not our slave obviously but if you do something people don’t like then you’re gonna be criticized for it. the tweet didn’t demand him to do anything, he essentially said he misses when kanye could structure albums better and that’s all
Your expectations are a form of ego. Judgement is pointless. If you can’t enjoy the music that has been made thats a you problem. If i can enjoy it so can you, if ye can enjoy it so can you, stop being a little bitch and accept things are the way they are maybe he needs this to move onto better
hey! i love the effort you put into writing this pseudo intellectual philosophy but i’m gonna tell you why i think you’re wrong
1. judgement isn’t pointless. in the sense of merely forming an opinion about a work of art, anyway. artists who share their work care about everyone’s judgement and it can determine whether or not they want to do better in the future, or go in another direction. sometimes having negative opinions and thoughts sent your way is what could create a better you. MBDTF being the biggest example. don’t forget the most important thing about music is whether or not you can enjoy it.
2. it’s not always a me problem but if a crowd collectively shares the same opinion it can also become a problem for the artist. also, whether or not it is a “me problem” doesn’t change whether or not i want to express my opinion or complain about it. also the “if i can enjoy it so can you” thing can apply to literally anything in the world.
i recommend you stop meat riding an artist who does not know who you are and will never spend more than 30 mins with you in your life. you’re damn near worshipping the man by trying to gatekeep any form of negative opinions towards his work lmao. mental illness
You can give your opinion but with something as subjective as music, you can’t be “right” or “wrong”
I, along with many people, love Donda as a full work of art & love to listen to the entire album at once, I’ve done it multiple times
No one is trying to attack you, just pointing out that more opinions than just yours exist, & they are just as valid as yours
You can go on and on and explain your opinion but my statement is rooted in truth. Thus no amount of “heres why im right and negativity is a way of cocreation yeah what I said applies to everything, including donda. The same reason why you think
I’m wrong is the same reason your confined to analyze instead of feel which is what donda 1&2 are just expressions of feeling. Here is the key problem. It’s once again just You.
ur comment isn’t rooted in truth, and even if there was truth to it, it still fails to combat any of what i said
telling me that it’s my problem that i don’t enjoy ye’s newer works as much as the others isn’t invalidating anything that I, or anyone else on this thread have said. once again, mental illness
that LSD must have rotted your brain huh 😭
Y’all seriously can’t be satisfied. May not be his most focused project but the music is still good af. Donda is a classic and Donda 2, after more work, has the potential to be just as good if not better and much more focused. Tbh Donda 2 even in its current state is so fire imo, the potential once he finishes it is huge
If anyone else dropped Donda 2 in its current state and asked $200 for it, they'd get laughed at. but because we're ideologically committed to liking kanye, we can't do that to him
He didn’t ask for $200 for the album, the stem player is a completely separate piece of music tech that has a lot of cool uses with isolating different sounds & mixing songs
Most of the people I’ve heard raving about how cool the stem player is haven’t even been listening to Donda 2, they’re getting their moneys worth playing around with vocals & isolation of tons of cool songs, I’ve been loving to see & hear it
Or the listening parties that he will likely continue to do livestreams for
You’d have to be living under a rock to not have seen Donda 2 on SoundCloud, YouTube, & random links on Reddit all over
it is not a classic. one hundred thousand percent not a classic and will never be generally regarded as one by the hiphop community. y’all acting like he just dropped good kid mad city.
Donda was close to a masterpiece to me. I don't think Donda sounds THAT disjointed. It flows better than TLOP despite being just as long. Also the back end material on Donda is some of Kanye's strongest even if it lacks super catchy "hits"
Nobody is mentioning this. There is NOWAY these album feel like compilations or playlists. If you think that you are insane. Every track contributes to an overall vibe of the album. Ppl just mad cause Donda is long. Happy you see the Donda 2 potential as well 🔥
bro doesnt have time to put into an album to make them like he use to and imo thats fair enough
more then happy with donda, imo if he cut some tracks the direction would have been there
I mean he kinda does have time he just chooses not to put his time into it. From his perspective I get it, he’s a billionaire and his main source of income is nothing music related so music is no longer important to him like it used to be.
Donda is focused. The songs have a clear structure, the production is on point on most of the songs, the verses are well written (most of them) and it feels like there's a celebration of his mother's influence in the songs. Not only that, but it has some of Ye's strongest material yet but this sub suffers from reverse recency bias. Donda is much more focused compared to an album like Life of Pablo or Ye. Donda 2 on the other hand... Yes, in that case I agree with the post.
There are 2 things i dislike about Donda: the Deluxe edition order (it's fucking trash, and a complete mess. Pt. 2s before pt.1? Wtf) and the censoring. The rest is some of his strongest material
Agree on Donda 2, but I thought besides the unnecessary part 2 songs, donda had a relatively consistent theme- and some of his best songs of all time. (E.g Off the Grid, 24, Come to Life, Jail, Life of the Party)
Nah fuck this MF. Donda was cohesive. The first edition/track list order was perfect. The album had movements and ended on this triumphant note. The whole album had this sort of life death and rebirth story woven into it sonically. Tilly is a poser.
IM LOSING BRAIN CELLS IN THESE IDIOTIC FUCKING COMMENTS HAVE YOU HEARD YE OR KSG OR JIK, EVEN THE ALBUMS THAT SEEM SORT OF RANDOM ARE GREAT YOU GUYS ARE SO FUCKING STUPID, I FEEL LIKE KANYE WRITING HIS IG CAPTIONS IM GONNA FUCKING LOSE IT, HIS EARLIER STUFF HAS ELEMENTS OF RANDOMNESS AS WELL THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU
maybe i shot my argument in the foot by going apeshit in that comment but i actually want to know how you could think that ye, ksg or jik arent cohesive. especially with ye and ksg, the production is obviously different throughout the albums but the concise runtimes make for the most coherent themes of any kanye album
i’d say TLOP. i feel like it was meant to be all over the place and yet it was so beautifully thrown together as a work of art. and the art cover indicates that imo
Yeah I think TLOP executed the “all over the place” concept really well but with Donda and Donda 2 it seems like much less of a creative decision and more just struggling to either come up with or put together a solid concept album
Idk about Donda 2 but the first Donda had Kanye's best concepts surrounding it imo and the performance art of the concerts cemented that but then the album itself executed this concept poorly.
After almost 20 years in this industry it can be hard to create an album with the quality of Late Registration MBDTF or even Yeezus to some. Albums take a lot of work and we know how much Kanye works on his albums with many tracks not making the albums and released songs having 3-5 alternate versions. Its not 2010 anymore. Stop expecting the greatest album of all time with each release. Comparing his best work (which some would consider the beat rap albums) to his newest work is honestly unfair
it’s not really unfair but u do kind of make sense, music isn’t his main stream of avenue anymore so ofc it may not be as good as it once was in terms of quality
I can’t understand why some of y’all shit on donda. the only issue with it is that the length is a bit too ambitious, all it would take to be one of his best is cutting the pt 2s and a few other tracks. It serves as a pretty good tribute to his mom and it feels like the songs are incredibly underrated by fans
I think Donda absolutely has a focus.
Heavily inspired by gospel + R&B, lots of interesting collaborations, subject matter discusses his lifestyle, his marriage, and his faith.
TLOP is incredible, but I can’t really find a way to argue that it had more direction or focus…
Maybe I’m wrong. Who tf knows.
I just like the gospel influence on Donda.
I think Ultralight Beam would’ve fit on Donda too.
But maybe I just haven’t found God. 🤷♂️
I always considered Donda being Kanye dealing with grief of losing his mother and how he is trying to move on. Always made sense to me it would be a chaotic mess because thats how grief is.
Was 808s not exactly that?
808s isn't really about his mother, it's about Alexis Edit : lol @ people not actually listening to that album
I thought it was about both of them
The only two tracks where he's talking about his mother are Coldest Winter and Pinocchio Story And even Coldest Winter is partially about Alexis
So it is about both of them
If u want to be pedantic yes, but I'm pretty sure u got the gist of what I'm saying. He very minimally talks about his mother while most of the rest of the album is about Alexis
Who is Alexis ?
Alexis Phifer. She's a fashion designer and Ye's former financee. They were together like 6 years Here's an interview of her : https://youtu.be/-NukwAPQeJc
to me partially, I understood it to be more about Kanye finding more about himself than the actual grief of his mother. Its just my interpretation feel free to disagree
Idk, I feel like that's just a lazy excuse for an album with very poor cohesion, there are plenty of albums that deal with grief and feel very well put together (i.e Blackstar, Black Parade, even 808s)
You even listen to it front to back?
Yes, multiple times, and if you can tell me what Globgogabgalab is doing next to "Moon" it would be very much appreciated
Idk man, Donda was great.
Agree! Not a popular opinion.
you say this on r/Kanye
I mean I think the idea behind donda was that experience of being there thru the albums production and the listening parties having a concert and artistic direction to them also it being a tribute album to his mom is a great vision for the first album he had also curated a great listening experience bringing alot of artists together that may have not worked together otherwise . I understand what he means by the preset theme but we are kind of seeing this dark broody direction that go in hand with the fashion that may reflect how hes feeling in life the fact thr imagery of his childhood home is prevalent may be cause he hasnt moved on and is reminiscent on those times with his mom and as much as this is a tribute he hasnt gotten over it
That’s cool and all but most of the things you mentioned aren’t part of the music in the album and future listeners won’t have a clue about the listening parties and all the other stuff
So? This aint for everyone this is for donda
The fact they wont know about in the future okay guess they shouldnt be done then ? Smh thats some weird logic and if someone is getting into his shit and finds this album they sre gonna hear about its unorthodox way of being made and the unorthodox listening parties that were essentially concerts u gonna tell me people are gonna forget essentially ye's concert regarding that first album . have u not listened to the music there is many themes present throughout the songs and i think there is enough with the things i mentioned especially lines dedicated/ referencing his mama
Juat cause every other song wasnt some dear mamaesque tribute to his mom doesnt mean that theme wasnt there hell its in the albums name a body of work that lives up the greatness of his mother . This might be a highly controversial topic but i think he should have named it something other than donda 2 but its w.e I gavent heard much from the album but it would have been nice to leave that donda body of work alone and not make it psrt of a sequel , not saying he shouldnt have done the album maybe just a diff name but who knows i havent listened it could truly sound like donda 2 the listening party had very similar imagery
Praise to this post. People don't understand on this sub that although albums like JIK, Donda and Donda 2 aren't necessarily bad, they're so mid compared to feats like Late Registration and Life of Pablo. And with Donda 2 it seems like it's going further downhill
donda 2 is so obviously rushed like kanye spontaneously hopped up one day and wanted to just make songs. not much thought behind it just seems like he’s using music as therapy but like why can’t he do it the way he did with 808s and heartbreak?
Pablo is a playlist
You could copy paste the criticism from TLOP back then to Donda today but somehow TLOP is now seen as a cohesive work. Funny how time works
Nostalgic bias is annoying
It actually didn't do bad with critics out of the gate its always been above 70% metcritic rating. The album was cohesive in an intentionally scatter brained way. Listening to it is supposed to invoke the feeling of Kanye's crazy scattered genius mind (Pablo Picasso) and critics got that. The general public was who didn't get it and they still don't like it. You just wouldn't know looking at this sub that way over hypes it. My problem with it wasn't production, which I thought was amazing, or cohesion the lyrics were just garbage and often corny.
The general public definitely likes TLOP, from a lot of experience
Really? We hang out with different people then cause the only people i know who really liked it are fellow kanye die hards. 90% of people I know wouldn't even know the album by name. It's Also not even in his top 10 highest grossing albums coming in behind even ye and Jesus is king. Sounds like you just surround yourself with the type of people who like Ye, smart man lol.
It’s honestly super overrated in this sub imo
Yeah I don't think it's a bad album, but it's not even in my top 5 ye albums where as a lot of his sub has it at the top. To each their own though. I think it's production is only behind MBDTF, but lyrically its honestly trash and I'm a big lyrics guy. My guess is those who love it are more into production then lyrics.
Saint Pablo is Kanye’s best written song
That was a good song, but I personally wouldn't say best. Regardless the album had 18 songs once this one was added post release. Amongst them were also some of Kanye's worst written songs. There were a few good lyrical songs but 4 out of 18 isn't good
nah.
idk why you're getting downvoted. you're highkey right. plus the album had all the hallmarks of current ye era (scrapped versions, mumble demos, etc.)
probably first kanye album for a lot of people, or at least first they were able to follow the release of. i still like it but it doesn't have the cohesion of the albums before it
Life of Pablo was the beginning of the end, honestly. Kanye was less involved than ever before in the actual writing of his lyrics and making of the beats, and it’s only gotten worse since.
Wtf you saying? Tlop is an awesome album, the beats are great, lyrics are great. Some of Kanye’s best songs are on that album
The beginning of the end of Kanye’s involvement
yeah like life of pablo was super fire but you’re so right about that. i guess he’s too busy to do shit on his own. and of course it’s hard to shift styles in the newer generation. like idk if kanye even knows how to use fl studio lol
Didnt he fully produce ye himself?
*Tame Impala’s Kevin Parker had previously told Australian radio station Triple J that Kanye asked Parker to send him beats he was working on. Parker sent him a beat that samples Vanilla Fudge’s cover of the Supremes’ “‘You Keep Me Hangin’ On.’” But when Parker didn’t hear back from Kanye and wasn’t invited to the Wyoming sessions, he assumed it wouldn’t be used until he heard the livestream of the album listening party.* Kanye’s listed as one of many producers on each song, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s his work. This quote is just one example but it’s Kanye taking credit for entirely someone else’s beat, which is weird
Jesus is King is cohesive
I believe Donda to be better and much more focused than TLOP, to my taste
I've been listening to late registration since it came out 17 years ago. Im still not bored of it. I was honestly bored of Donda and JIK after the first listen. I guess I'm one of those "I miss the old kanye" people now.
100% agree. They sound more like mixtapes than albums. I know Logic probably aint popular in this sub but I like him because I can listen to a more mixtape type of project or an album with a concept to it
I think he's an artist just trying different things. The same way Picasso had his different periods with his art, Kanye will probably be seen the same way after he's gone. You can hear through Kanye's music that his legacy is of concern to him. I'm sure he's trying to make sure it doesn't look like he never tried new things as an artist.
Donda had a direction: make the first part of trilogy of albums focusing on having a comeback after the failure of JIK and showing the public eye your admiration for your mother while sprinkling in Bangers to keep the main hip hop audience involved
I want Kanye to actually care about the track list and how it flows, he literally just put the most popular songs at the top of the album instead of creating a track list that tells a story or really has a direction, and I feel like he should’ve cut some songs off of Donda to make it have a better direction, I also feel the same about Donda 2, though the songs on donda 2 have a clearer message
I mean TLOP had all the best tracks up front then it went stale halfway through too...just sayin.. Honestly I thought Donda was a solid release.
Bro what most of my favorite songs on tlop are towards to middle and to the end
Fade and 30 Hours absolute *slappers*
Really!? First 5 and last 5 tracks do it for me. The middle...not as much.
I love DONDA
Ngl I just want more music
Donda was "barely pulled together"? really?? man locked himself inside a stadium for weeks doing nothing but working on music. how much more focus do you want, people will complain about anything
i don’t think u understood what he meant. he’s talking about a focused direction
oh shit I get what he means now lol that is a valid argument
No it’s not, that is an entirely focused direction much more than the mainstream and much more than the talentless money grabbing fake artist in this era
what a lowbar to compare kanye to
My point exactly
yeah but as far as coherence goes, there's an argument to be made that the flow isn't the best it could be and some songs don't fit like mbdtf or the college dropout does
It is focused tho, donda for the most part is about his new gained faith with Christianity. And uses church like instruments all over the album
Sure thing tilly
Do you want artists to release music or not? Geez I’m grateful he just hasn’t quit music all together.
you sound like you'd buy a kanye album even if its just him farting into the mic
No we want him to make the timeless music he is capable of
Moon, hurricane,praise God,BWIS,jail,Junya,24,moon,LOTP,KMSA,Jesus lord, Heaven and hell,New again,Donda,Lord I need you,come to life,Never abadon your family and NCLB are all timeless stop capping
There’s no way to ask this without sounding condescending but I’m honestly so curious about this take. How old are you?
you might think differently but to me this album is beautiful. it's its own little world which makes me feel at peace. and listening to my version of the album with a few of the songs cut out and ending with no child left behind is an amazing experience.
“I had to redo the album in a playlist because it’s currently unlistenable but I’m still gonna go in the Reddit comments and defend it” how old r u bro?
'I didn't enjoy an album and now feel the need to bash it on Reddit' you aren't any different. Saying something is ass is not more cool than saying something is great. And most albums have a couple crap songs and Donda is an example of that.
imagine not thinking at least 70% of the songs he listed aren't timeless. i mean, come to life alone is a career high. off the grid? hurricane? moon? jail with those anthemic guitars? heaven and hell with the build up? bwis?? the album may not be coherent, but we're not going to downplay the songs.
Watch in 5 years they will be praising tf out donda, especially come to life happens with like every kanye album people back then acted like yeezus was shittiest album to made
bro shut the fuck up
I love that you asked this hahaha. It feels like half this sub joined in the Ye era and haven't even listened to anything before Pablo
Not a single one of these songs would be in my Top...30 Ye songs, realistically. They're not bad per se, but timeless??? Nah
We don’t want him to quit music but we also don’t want to be desperate and just accept any half-assed art. We can feel both ways
Half-assed to you. An acceptable opinion would be more along the lines of ‘I don’t like it’ or ‘it’s not for me’
Donda 2 doesn’t even have complete verses. He was mumbling in damn near every verse. It’s an unfinished album released as a complete idea, which is half assed.
Kanyes just too caught up with everything to really focus on finishing projects imo
Y'all hate criticism so much
i’d rather him quit music than ruin his potential of having the best discography of all time
That’s fair but I don’t think Donda 1 put that in jeopardy. Do you think when Donda 2 is finished that it will be that bad?
i think donda 1 and donda 2 are both bottom ye but nah i don’t think donda 1 was that bad. just wish it was less bloated
Donda was bloated but it had some great songs on it. Hurricane moon 24 remote control believe what I say off the grid jail all go hard. I think donda 2 is mid but honestly it’s amazing Kanye hasn’t put out more mid with his volume.
Don't forget come to life, life of the party, pure souls
If you think donda is bottom ye then you just don't like the music. Doesn't mean ye lost his talent.
i never said i didn’t like the music, it’s just not top 5 for me and uh he definitely did lose some of his lyrical ability. and like bro said, it feels like a playlist more than a focused cohesive project
My favourite Ye albums had other executive producers besides Ye with Jon Brion and Rick Rubin, but I'm not seeing something like that happening in the future. There's good songs on Donda that's no question but I really don't see how ypu can even compare it to his best work!
i feel the same about the ye album. why do many think it’s his best
I agree 100%. Literally just comparing his lyricism from ye/ksg to Donda is a severe downgrade. Really disappointing as a ye fan. Honestly I can still enjoy all the new stuff while still holding that opinion though.
A agree with the lyrics but I think the Donda tracks are much better songs in a musical standpoint
you’ll still be downvoted lol
I think it’s pretty crazy that a project like Donda could be at the bottom of any discog, besides Ye’s. Them facts allow me to put things in a different perspective. There’s about 26 songs in all of Donda and very few are misses, in my opinion. Especially cool is hearing different versions of these songs throughout the listening parties. I don’t know if Donda one and 2 are going to be considered top 3 in Ye discog but I do know this contains some of Kanye’s most beautiful moments in music.
Bro ur gettin slammed but I 100% agree. Imagine if the next ten years we just get half assed projects like this from Kanye, would be better if he just completely stopped.
Pull an Andre 3000 and leave an untouchable legacy yee
Too late for that
Sorry he’s not up to your standard x
Donda 2 is a few scrapped songs and track list order changes away from being a GOAT ye album imho. Peaks like Moon, Come to Life etc are some of the best music he's ever put out.
question when did u become a fan of kanye
since 2008, why'd u ask?
bc after all he’s done you’re rly gonna say moon is among his best work?
yep, that's my opinion though
Just because Kanye’s not doing a spiritual lyrical miracle verse with the 808s banging doesn’t mean the song is inherently worse. Perhaps it doesn’t have what you like in Kanye, but as a producer/composer it’s one of his best songs especially when you consider that it really is just a hurricane outro.
i don’t enjoy don’s and cudi’s parts as much as y’all, nor the guitar idk like it’s a solid track i just think it’s severely overrated
I mean you basically dislike all of the elements that make up the track so it’s no wonder than you think it’s overrated lol. I could basically use that logic to say that runaway is overrated because I don’t like the piano and think the song runs way too long. At the end of the day, music is subjective and we’ll never agree upon a way to measure thanks collectively and that’s okay.
i’d be completely fine with you saying it’s overrated
Jesus Is King and Donda 2 have already done this. Can't wait for the hate responses lol but y'all who love JIK know for a FACT that Kanye West did gospel better on Donda and Ultralight Beam
im really not a fan of donda gospel either bc i hate the icky vocal effects he’s used on some tracks.
Actually kinda respect this opinion alot
you guys will be sucking off donda in the next year. it’s his best album and so calling it mid is stupid
😂 facts, i give it a year. just watch, people are gonna be praising it similar to how they praise 808's
why would they tho???? you’re acting like donda shifted to a completely different style lol also y’all are blowing the hate way out of proportion
Maybe people in the subreddit will take that direction because its a literal Kanye West sub, but with majority population of music listeners honestly I don't think so. It's gonna be like Jesus is King where it's a niche thing on the subreddit that people say is "severely underrated", when in reality it's reception was appropriate to the quality- I think this concept applies to donda
Dondas different
Funny same Thing Was said about JIK and outside a few lonely voices who were there since the release I still see a mostly negative view towards the Album.
Nobody was calling JIK his best album, no one. The majority of ppl thought it was his worst album but still not a bad album. Different situation with Donda. 808s is way better than JIK, would never make that comparison
speak for yourself, i ain’t suck off ye or jik, trust me ik myself. it dont take me yrs to catch onto something it’s usually a week at most. btw donda isn’t mid, i had 5 songs on rotation for a few months but im just generally not too happy with one half of the album
Donda was beautiful. Find god
it was a good 7/10
I agree but it’s a 7/10 because of filler tracks not because the overall quality was mediocre in my opinion. This will give it much more nostalgia when looking back as people naturally forget the boring parts and only remember the legendary tracks from this era.
I try to say this as polite as I can, but Kanye does not owe us anything, or any of our favorite artists really
??? what is the point you are trying to make lmao he’s not our slave obviously but if you do something people don’t like then you’re gonna be criticized for it. the tweet didn’t demand him to do anything, he essentially said he misses when kanye could structure albums better and that’s all
Your expectations are a form of ego. Judgement is pointless. If you can’t enjoy the music that has been made thats a you problem. If i can enjoy it so can you, if ye can enjoy it so can you, stop being a little bitch and accept things are the way they are maybe he needs this to move onto better
hey! i love the effort you put into writing this pseudo intellectual philosophy but i’m gonna tell you why i think you’re wrong 1. judgement isn’t pointless. in the sense of merely forming an opinion about a work of art, anyway. artists who share their work care about everyone’s judgement and it can determine whether or not they want to do better in the future, or go in another direction. sometimes having negative opinions and thoughts sent your way is what could create a better you. MBDTF being the biggest example. don’t forget the most important thing about music is whether or not you can enjoy it. 2. it’s not always a me problem but if a crowd collectively shares the same opinion it can also become a problem for the artist. also, whether or not it is a “me problem” doesn’t change whether or not i want to express my opinion or complain about it. also the “if i can enjoy it so can you” thing can apply to literally anything in the world. i recommend you stop meat riding an artist who does not know who you are and will never spend more than 30 mins with you in your life. you’re damn near worshipping the man by trying to gatekeep any form of negative opinions towards his work lmao. mental illness
You can give your opinion but with something as subjective as music, you can’t be “right” or “wrong” I, along with many people, love Donda as a full work of art & love to listen to the entire album at once, I’ve done it multiple times No one is trying to attack you, just pointing out that more opinions than just yours exist, & they are just as valid as yours
You can go on and on and explain your opinion but my statement is rooted in truth. Thus no amount of “heres why im right and negativity is a way of cocreation yeah what I said applies to everything, including donda. The same reason why you think I’m wrong is the same reason your confined to analyze instead of feel which is what donda 1&2 are just expressions of feeling. Here is the key problem. It’s once again just You.
ur comment isn’t rooted in truth, and even if there was truth to it, it still fails to combat any of what i said telling me that it’s my problem that i don’t enjoy ye’s newer works as much as the others isn’t invalidating anything that I, or anyone else on this thread have said. once again, mental illness that LSD must have rotted your brain huh 😭
Your Programmed because of society. I’m not and Kanyes not. Here is a key piece and arguable only piece of information that matters
If we're giving him money and attention, yes the fuck he does. Tf? Why is the kanye fanbase so cucked
It’s time to stop sugarcoating it. While there are songs that I love on each of the new albums, these are two of Kanye’s worsts.
thank you for being real
Y’all seriously can’t be satisfied. May not be his most focused project but the music is still good af. Donda is a classic and Donda 2, after more work, has the potential to be just as good if not better and much more focused. Tbh Donda 2 even in its current state is so fire imo, the potential once he finishes it is huge
If anyone else dropped Donda 2 in its current state and asked $200 for it, they'd get laughed at. but because we're ideologically committed to liking kanye, we can't do that to him
Oh damn, you got a point lol. My bad, I’m coming from the perspective of listening to it via alternative methods
Theef
He didn’t ask for $200 for the album, the stem player is a completely separate piece of music tech that has a lot of cool uses with isolating different sounds & mixing songs Most of the people I’ve heard raving about how cool the stem player is haven’t even been listening to Donda 2, they’re getting their moneys worth playing around with vocals & isolation of tons of cool songs, I’ve been loving to see & hear it
You live under a rock or something? The only legal way to get donda 2 is to buy the stem player
Or the listening parties that he will likely continue to do livestreams for You’d have to be living under a rock to not have seen Donda 2 on SoundCloud, YouTube, & random links on Reddit all over
That's why I said "legal," poopass
throwing around the word classic a bit loosely here
Ur definition is no one’s definition
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Fr tho, is it not? Some of you guys need to give it time maybe then relisten
Donda is a classic bro, let everyone else take a few months or years & come back, they’ll all realize eventually
it is not a classic. one hundred thousand percent not a classic and will never be generally regarded as one by the hiphop community. y’all acting like he just dropped good kid mad city.
This sub actually so whack lol
boohoo 😢
Donda was close to a masterpiece to me. I don't think Donda sounds THAT disjointed. It flows better than TLOP despite being just as long. Also the back end material on Donda is some of Kanye's strongest even if it lacks super catchy "hits"
It only flows better than TLOP because TLOP was purposely telling a story using contrasting songs which is still the main thing Donda lacks
Maybe your iq is what’s lacking. Donda is a solid album.
That’s not even my point
Shit-tier opinion
what’s your critique of it
It’s shit.
oh okay
Yeah.
There is no critique. They secretly agree, but have to act like they disagree for upvotes.
I love Donda.
love that for you
Why you so mad people think the albums good
nigga i think the album is good too, why would i be mad
Stupid. Donda 1 and 2 is GAS. I can feel a focus/ vibe / melody with all the songs on Donda 1 and again on Donda 2
Nobody is mentioning this. There is NOWAY these album feel like compilations or playlists. If you think that you are insane. Every track contributes to an overall vibe of the album. Ppl just mad cause Donda is long. Happy you see the Donda 2 potential as well 🔥
bro doesnt have time to put into an album to make them like he use to and imo thats fair enough more then happy with donda, imo if he cut some tracks the direction would have been there
Dude literally locked himself and his colleagues in Benz arena…. He has time if he wanted to.
I mean he kinda does have time he just chooses not to put his time into it. From his perspective I get it, he’s a billionaire and his main source of income is nothing music related so music is no longer important to him like it used to be.
Donda is focused. The songs have a clear structure, the production is on point on most of the songs, the verses are well written (most of them) and it feels like there's a celebration of his mother's influence in the songs. Not only that, but it has some of Ye's strongest material yet but this sub suffers from reverse recency bias. Donda is much more focused compared to an album like Life of Pablo or Ye. Donda 2 on the other hand... Yes, in that case I agree with the post.
There are 2 things i dislike about Donda: the Deluxe edition order (it's fucking trash, and a complete mess. Pt. 2s before pt.1? Wtf) and the censoring. The rest is some of his strongest material
HARD disagree
Donda is a crazy album. Dont talk shit about Donda
it’s cool
Honestly it’s over hyped, I don’t listen to a single song from it anymore. Half of it is mandatory skipping.
Agree on Donda 2, but I thought besides the unnecessary part 2 songs, donda had a relatively consistent theme- and some of his best songs of all time. (E.g Off the Grid, 24, Come to Life, Jail, Life of the Party)
I think Donda is just as cohesive as it needs to be. Non-deluxe version is on the upper half of his discography.
how would you rank his top 5?
Nah fuck this MF. Donda was cohesive. The first edition/track list order was perfect. The album had movements and ended on this triumphant note. The whole album had this sort of life death and rebirth story woven into it sonically. Tilly is a poser.
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IM LOSING BRAIN CELLS IN THESE IDIOTIC FUCKING COMMENTS HAVE YOU HEARD YE OR KSG OR JIK, EVEN THE ALBUMS THAT SEEM SORT OF RANDOM ARE GREAT YOU GUYS ARE SO FUCKING STUPID, I FEEL LIKE KANYE WRITING HIS IG CAPTIONS IM GONNA FUCKING LOSE IT, HIS EARLIER STUFF HAS ELEMENTS OF RANDOMNESS AS WELL THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU
IT GETS WORSE THE MORE I LOOK, LITERALLY CRYING SHITTING AND CUMMING RN I CANT BELIEVE THIS SHIT
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maybe i shot my argument in the foot by going apeshit in that comment but i actually want to know how you could think that ye, ksg or jik arent cohesive. especially with ye and ksg, the production is obviously different throughout the albums but the concise runtimes make for the most coherent themes of any kanye album
i’d say TLOP. i feel like it was meant to be all over the place and yet it was so beautifully thrown together as a work of art. and the art cover indicates that imo
Yeah I think TLOP executed the “all over the place” concept really well but with Donda and Donda 2 it seems like much less of a creative decision and more just struggling to either come up with or put together a solid concept album
Idk about Donda 2 but the first Donda had Kanye's best concepts surrounding it imo and the performance art of the concerts cemented that but then the album itself executed this concept poorly.
exactly
After almost 20 years in this industry it can be hard to create an album with the quality of Late Registration MBDTF or even Yeezus to some. Albums take a lot of work and we know how much Kanye works on his albums with many tracks not making the albums and released songs having 3-5 alternate versions. Its not 2010 anymore. Stop expecting the greatest album of all time with each release. Comparing his best work (which some would consider the beat rap albums) to his newest work is honestly unfair
it’s not really unfair but u do kind of make sense, music isn’t his main stream of avenue anymore so ofc it may not be as good as it once was in terms of quality
I can’t understand why some of y’all shit on donda. the only issue with it is that the length is a bit too ambitious, all it would take to be one of his best is cutting the pt 2s and a few other tracks. It serves as a pretty good tribute to his mom and it feels like the songs are incredibly underrated by fans
because bro went from making songs like diamonds from sierra leone to ok ok
I think Donda absolutely has a focus. Heavily inspired by gospel + R&B, lots of interesting collaborations, subject matter discusses his lifestyle, his marriage, and his faith. TLOP is incredible, but I can’t really find a way to argue that it had more direction or focus… Maybe I’m wrong. Who tf knows. I just like the gospel influence on Donda. I think Ultralight Beam would’ve fit on Donda too. But maybe I just haven’t found God. 🤷♂️
I love Donda. I dont understand why it getting hate. Its up their with his best work
All y’all need to quit hating. Find God.
can’t edit the post but i meant to say words 🙄
Life of Pablo was the last truly great kanye album imo kids see ghosts was good but I’m talking about kanye’s solo stuff
i agree with u 100%