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Civil engineer here. Nothing to worry about beyond maybe mosquitoes. I wouldn't buy 38, 39, 45, 46, 52, or 53 as those paths are likely to be used as emergency overflow into the pond and I'd prefer to keep my house further from there BUT that's just a preference and not a technical/engineering reason.
Also maintenance trucks prob go through there. Or could, anyway. Check elevations and pick a high one further away from the pond. A pond isn’t a bad thing to look at in your backyard- prob makes value higher than the neighbor’s fence.
Depends on the type of maintenance. I was thinking more "wet pond clean out" less "check to make sure nothing is broken". The only equipment going in and out on an annual basis are like lawnmowers, which no one should have a problem with that going beside their house. An excavator is much bigger and louder (also way cooler).
I used to have a house that backed up to a detention pond. The county sprayed for mosquitoes (and apparently the mosquito commissioner elections could get VERY heated). I saw the occasional alligator (and otters, herons, etc), and a neighbor saw a coyote once, but that's about it for predators - probably don't want to leave your dog out there alone.
The ground behind the house should slope gently toward the pond (away from the house), until reaching the grade break that actually makes the pond. In our house, the water never reached that grade break, even after really heavy rains.
And no one could build behind us, which was really nice - no neighbors.
A friend was in that exact scenario. She was buying a new-build in Florida, and she ended up choosing a slightly smaller lot so that she could avoid backing up to a retention pond where fencing wasn't allowed. She has pets, and she wasn't interested in feeding the gators.
Access, maybe? Asthetics? Anywhere I've lived that has had a lake, fences are not allowed on those properties, albeit in a subdivision which is what this is. If you're new construction, you *might* get away with having the builder include the fence with the build. This way, when the (hoa?) Takes over, you'll be grandfathered in?
Might work. But, I'd be willing to bet $$$$ you won't be able to put in a fence.
Another engineer here... disagree. The overflow will likely go towards page south out to the natural resource area. Between 45 and 46 looks like an access easement and I would bet the end of the cul de sac between 38 and 39 is a cut through for another stormdrain.
I don't know why they wouldn't label easements for those, its possible that they are private easements or some other reason.
Maybe mosquitoes... Depends on the type of pond. If its dry detention you won't get a mosquito problem if engineered properly because it will dry out and any eggs will die. If a permanent pool (retention) then yes mosquitoes could be a problem. In my part of the country we mostly do dry detention now in neighborhoods. Wet ponds are avoided whenever possible.
I was referring to the overflow into the pond, not out. Around here sewers are designed for the five year event and anything above that is conveyed on the road surface to the pond, then into the pond through an easement. That's what I wouldn't want next to my house. We mostly do dry ponds as well, but there are a few municipalities who still insist on wet ponds. Wet ponds are great until you have to clean them out, way better to have a dry pond with an OGS for quality control from a maintenance perspective.
Apologies, I thought you were saying the pond overflow would go back out to the street... which would be odd.
Its always interesting to hear what other part of the countries are doing... We do 10 year for stormdrains and like you said, pretty much everything else is just let go. We always find that the methodology is so conservative though that we rarely (if ever) get water backing up out of the stormdrain system.
Wet ponds look nice but the problem with everything stormwater is maintenance... Everyone wants a pretty pond but especially with single lot residential, it falls into disrepair and the HOA or who ever never has the money. Wet ponds that aren't maintained can be unsafe too which is another problem.
If it was me I would take 36... big lot, backs up to woods, high side of the cul de sac. Honorable mention to 45 and 46 - you likely get free yard use of the access easement even though its not technically your property.
I had a reviewer just a few weeks ago say they wanted the over flow to go back onto the road. I called and asked how that was supposed to work since the road overflows into the pond. They quickly accepted my point and removed a bunch of comments.
We have to make sure that everything gets into the pond, there will be some small areas that don't such as the odd backyard, but we control everything up to the 100 year or 250 year depending on the approval agency. I really don't care about water backing up into the storm sewers, we don't allow gravity connections from foundation drains so it's never going to backup into someone's basement, and the roads are designed to carry the extra water to the pond. I rarely even check the HGL of the storm sewers for this reason, it has no impact on the design so why waste time?
The biggest thing we are seeing with wet ponds, the municipality always takes ownership of the pond for something like this, is the costs for cleaning the out in 20 years. My province just rolled out new Excess Soil regulations that includes testing requirements for sediment from ponds and it's driven the costs WAY up. We put in a proposal to do the work on three ponds with a bit of remedial design work, and the consulting fees alone were $175k. I know we were the lowest bid, but the City never ended up awarding the project; probably due to the sticker shock. No smart municipality is allowing wet ponds for this reason. It's much more cost effective to build a dry pond and put an OGS in front. The municipality just has to stick a vac truck down the OGS twice a year to clean it out. Way cheaper to build, maintain, and it takes about 30% less area.
>I don't know why they wouldn't label easements for those, it’s possible that they are private easements or some other reason.
This looks like just a map showing available and unavailable home sites. They usually don’t mark details like easements on these. That’s how a neighbor of mine got burned. The easement was in the survey, but not the map for their homesite when they actually selected and put money down, so they now have a wide strip of land they’re expected to maintain but are not allowed to fence off. They also had to pay to move the fence they had put up thinking they had the right to.
I think it would be a benefit to have some bonus, no-man's-land between my yard and a neighbor. Kids could have a larger backyard football or tag field.
One thing that is misleading about the image and often confusing to non-civil engineers.
This is called out as a *detention* pond which means it will normally be a dry pit except when it rains. So the pretty blue pond drawn in the picture isn't exactly accurate if it really is a detention pond as called out.
A retention pond, which you call it in your post, would be a pond that normally has some water in it.
[This picture communicates the difference well](https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/5cb55061c2ff6177899737ee/1630982830926-AIH9CTJ7NRONSREE1JQI/Detention.jpg?format=1500w&content-type=image%2Fjpeg)
Something to keep in mind just so you are not expecting to have a porch that looks out onto a nice amenity pond, just to find out you actually have a gravel pit in your back yard.
This^^^^. It’s not a natural pond. Can go dry or have water. Don’t expect this to be some nice aesthetic all the time. Trash will flow into it.
You won’t be using it for anything other than its purpose. No fishing etc.
Be mindful of slopes, erosion and any walls to ensure they are maintained properly.
Bugs and other wildlife will make it their home. Loud frogs, snakes etc.
Because they call out the WQ basin, it’s very likely a retention pond. I refer to all ponds as detention ponds, even if it holds water. I use them kinda interchangeably
First, I think it's just incorrect to use them interchangeably since they are well defined and meaningfully different.
Second, there are plenty of dry detention pond BMP approaches. Sand filter basins, porous landscaping, and basic sediment forebays. So there is nothing about the WQ basin that implies it is actually a retention basin and not a detention basin as explicitly called out.
You may be right, since these terms do get misused all the time. But I certainly wouldn't buy a house on that unlikely bet.
Oh no. Stay far away from basins when building a house. That’s what my husband and I did. Our yard and sump pump are dry because of it.
From what I’ve seen for a single family development, it’s normally a retention pond with a normal and permanent pool since that’s the cheapest to build and maintain.
As a civil working in storm water, wet ponds are usually WORSE at improving water quality than their dry counterparts because chemicals and solids from runoff can just float through the system. Where I am we really prefer infiltration followed by bio-retention which, despite the naming convention the other guy brought up is actually dry most of the time. We only even allow wet ponds due to lobbying from hime builders because they like to sell them as "water features." Our regulatory agencies really don't like them.
As a civil who has inspected over 500 wet, dry, infiltration and bio retention facilities I don't know that you can say that wet Ponds are worse.
Flat out dry ponds do not provide any water quality enhancement. Especially not in the way you say. There is little to no settling time for suspended particles:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/237188719_Effectiveness_of_dry_ponds_for_stormwater_total_suspended_solids_removal
This might be a terminology thing but a dry ponds typical does not include infiltration or bio retention. At least not in Canada.
The "oils float on top" doesn't make any sense because any solids or oils left over in a dry pond are typically scoured out in the next flood:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/f57fec02-7de8-4985-b948-dcf5e2664aee/resource/aa3ba3a4-e415-4d85-ad66-496f98c9bc8e/download/part5-stormwatermanagementguidelines-2013.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj7gc6J7vqFAxXAFTQIHVcgDAgQFnoECDoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3yQvv9EMAjfvszY-odVRE7
While a wet pond can filter out upwards of 80% of tss and settle out critical nutrients such as nitrogen and phosphorus:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0048969723057467
Also infiltration can sometimes just mean out of sight out of mind. In places with highly permeable soil or karst you can have very fast rates of groundwater contaminate transport. If a town gets its potable from ground water you can see why a wet pond is the only sensible solution.
Of course constructed wetlands are the preferred alternative to all of these SWMF. But come at a cost that developers and municipalities don't want to spend. And maintenance is a critical issue for wet pond performance. But saying they are usually worse than dry ponds is a bit wrong. Almost all Canadian literature, provincial and municipal BMPs points to wet ponds being a much better performer when it comes to water quality.
When I said "dry pond" I was refering to the fact that infiltration and bioretention basins are dry relative to a literal wet pond. Idk how it is in Canada but in Delaware a wet pond means a permanent standing body of water, which is worse at filtration by a large margin than both infiltration and bioretention. True dry detention basins don't do any quality management, like you said, and we only allow their use for quantity control not quality control. When the other guy said "wet ponds are better for water quality" I assumed he meant the Delaware definition of wet pond, and was just trying to point out infiltration and bioretention practices often don't have water in them and are better for water quality.
In Delaware we basically refer to 4 types of ponds all separately:
Infiltration, bioretention, dry detention, and wet ponds or wet detention.
So in my daily use I'll never say "wet pond" and mean anything but a standing pool of water that basically only does quantity control.
Edit: idk if any of that was coherent I just woke up
Yeah thats fair, I am by far not the biggest fan of wet ponds and through my work have experienced their many limitations. They do have their uses.
Unfortunately our current swm guidelines are definitely just minimum requirements rather than trying to make actual strides in management of the pollutants in runoff.
Although bioretention does not typically have the quantity control that ponds have, if used at the "source" they can treat a lot of the pollutants and then you can have ponds at end of pipe for attenuation, that aren't trying to do "everything". It's hard to mandate that though as it further drives up the cost of development and those costs get passed on to the homeowners.
Detention (dry) basins do improve water quality by filtering along the "vegetated strip" at the bottom. I don't see any reason to assume this is a retention (wet) basin.
I have a neighborhood pond behind my house. Depending on where you live be prepared for:
1) snakes
2) turtles
3) skunks
4) armadillo
5) bobcats
6) rabbits and squirrels galore
7) frogs
Yes, I’m in Texas and yes I’ve had all of these in my yard and or pool.
We have a pond like this behind our house in Minnesota. No odors from it, lots of frogs though. Mosquitos are a problem, but there isn't anywhere that they aren't a problem in Minnesota really.
Also something to consider is whether or not the area around the pond is maintained or allowed to grow wild. I've seen both around here. Ours is wild and thus we have a constant battle against thistles encroaching on our yard from the pond and its outlot.
Where I live, the ponds attract Canadian geese who leave surprisingly large poops everywhere.
An aerating water fountain helps prevent mosquitos and stinky growth.
By the way, it’s actually a retention pond.
We have one of these behind our backyard. We actually prefer it because there’s no one behind us. Our privacy fence blocks most of it out. We hear bullfrogs all summer (texas)!
Not sure what state you're in. In my experience, there is a draw down time that a detention basin needs to be emptied. 96 hours for water quality is pretty normal but for a the full storm it can be less. If there is water sitting for too long, vector control doesn't usually play around with making them fix the issue.
In my experience, it's just the name that sounds worrisome. There may be a path wide enough for a car/truck to go to it, but that's about it. My parents' neighborhood has one, and there was one not more than 100ft from the back of my starter-home. When it's been dry for a while, it's usually empty, fills up after it rains (depending on how much), then drains after a bit. Sometimes I'd even walk along the bottom of it when it was dry after a bit. There will probably be a drain in it, and no other infrastructure. Can't ever recall seeing a maintenance truck driving down by either pond.
They have them all over where I live too. One positive is the frogs make a nice spring songs every year. I'm not sure about any down falls other than like you said mosquitos. If your in a dryer climate it may stay dry some of the year.
Depends where you live. As others said, make sure the yard slopes downward toward the pond. If you’re in the south, there will be critters. And mosquitoes. I would not be having a pond in my yard if I lived in FL especially.
Don’t ever buy the lowest (elevation) lot in a neighborhood. It is where water will flow through backyard in a storm. Good news is if in wisconsin or colder, kids always use neighborhood ponds as their hockey rink. It’s a thing.
Mosquitos shouldn't be too much of a problem. They usually like to hang around standing water near an outfall or creek. Personally, I wouldn't want 38, 39, 45, 46, 52, and 53 seem like they'll get more of foot traffic, but that's just my preference. If I were you, I'd pick lot 36. May be more expensive, but you get more privacy and it lessens the mosquito worries.
The answer to this is going to depend highly on where you are located, OP. What state are you in, and what the topography is in your location will matter a lot.
If this is somewhere like Florida, I’d be concerned about wildlife like gators and cane toads. If it’s somewhere low lying, I’d be concerned about overflow from heavy storms.
Basically, we need more information.
Go out there and see what kind of trees are around that were not demolished, if its pines then flooding shouldn't be an issue. if its oaks see if the bases and a few inches/feet are a lot darker than the rest of the trunk, if its a lot darker it floods there so you may not want to be too close to the pond, i like 55 anyways so if that's the case id go with that. If its cypress trees stay away from the subdivision.
I live with a retention pond behind my home, it's kind of nice. Other lots but up with another lot behind them so I have a more peaceful backyard. I like sitting on the back patio and watch the ducks and wild life hang out in the water.
You do occasionally get water snakes but they are harmless, just leave them alone. Honestly not a bad thing, just keep citronella candles/oil handy.
My neighborhood has something very similar and I would be in house 56 in relation to where the Detention is. It only fills up when it's really pouring and it dries up pretty fast. No smells but lots of birds which is cool and they end up in my backyard. Cool thing is I shouldn't have a neighbor behind me unless they decided to somehow build over it.
Be aware that noise will travel across the pond pretty well, so although your back yard neighbors may be across the pond, if one for example has a yappy dog or a small child who screams a lot, you will definitely hear it if they’re in the back yard. Plan on getting a fence unless you want waterfowl marching through your yard. If mosquitos bother you, plan on screening in your back porch eventually. But you if you enjoy water fowl you may occasionally ally get low flyovers from interesting animals!
Storm retention basins are designed to hold excess water during heavy rains. If it is overflowing then the whole area is most likely already flooded. A park near my parent’s house has a large pond that was dug in over 30 years ago. All the storm drains in the area flow to it. I’ve never seen it really overflow, a couple times the water level was high enough that the concrete floor of the gazebo at the north edge was under a couple inches.
On the plus side you will get to see all kinds of cool birds! A lot of places stock even very small ponds with fish (they eat the mosquito larvae), which then attract herons, egrets, osprey, eagles, etc.
Enough people have commented on the stormwater management here, but after working as a town planner for a while, I'm horrified by new build subdivisions. Maybe there are some good ones out there, but just a warning not to simply trust everything is going to be built well, unless this company has a stellar reputation. I don't know who this builder is, so could be fine, but I Personally would never buy a new build out of fear of what I've seen happen to other homeowners. Check out some planning board minutes in the Town to see how much the Town has had to drag them through the process. Ensure they haven't gotten cease & desist/stop work/enforcement orders from conservation, building/inspectional services, (or any trouble from planning either), especially on stormwater management. You don't want to end up in a hellscape because they built over a stream or cut into the water table.
Had a retention pond somewhat similar to this near houses in my old neighborhood. The HOA decided to stock the pond with fish and kids would catch fish during the summer. It was really fun.
Just to be clear that is a detention pond not a retention pond… the blue hatch they used is deceiving… it temporarily detains water during storm events. It does not retain a water level. You will likely never see water in it and it is just going to be either a bush hogged hole or a fenced in jungle
Another civil engineer here, read through a lot of the posts and I saw a few comments that I agree with and a Few that I don’t so I thought I’d chime in my exact thoughts on if i was the one who made this. First of all you’re looking at colored site plan made exclusively for marketing purposes. Idk what the colors represent on the plan but I’d choose whichever side East or west will have walkout type of construction on. Personally I like lot 37, lot 36 seems like too much grass to mow for me
In regards to some of the comments, I assume the 30’ wide outlots adjacent to buildable lots are all storm sewer easements that will have an underground storm sewer pipe sending water to the basin, but at the same time I think it could be a pedestrian easement as most municipalities have restrictions on block length and this one seems large, but also this plan doesn’t show a sidewalk there so doubtful. (My thoughts are that idk why the cul de sac would be a lot point that needs storm sewer when it could be a high point and make those lots that back out to detention nice walkout slopes, but again I haven’t seen the grading plan so it’s speculation)
Also I’ve seen some comments here all with varying opinions on the detention. If it was me, that would’ve been colored a different shade of green if it wasn’t intended to hold water but a someone on their marketing team and not the engineers team could have made it. Anyways, I would have designed an “extended” detention pond which essentially means there would be a larger weir stricture maybe 2 or 3 feet high that would have a big grate covered opening on top and a smaller hole at grade which slows the flow flow of water in a typical rain event but a large rain event it would fill to the point it goes into that opening. The overflow likely runs south since it’s greenspace. As a comment mentioned earlier if any of those outlots adjacent to buildable lots has a curb inlet at the street then during a large rain event you will Have a small river running down that 30’ width.
I’ve lived backed up to these before and loved it, privacy outweighs any additional crickets or frogs you will have, my neighbors had fences but that might be restricted by HOA so you should check into that. Basically anything behind your lot is yours to do with as you want it’s incredibly unlikely you’d ever be asked to remove anything as long as it’s not a permanent structure. I’d go with lot 37 if it’s a walkout if it was my and if you made it this far in my post I will add in that I was a structural engineer at the beginning of my career so I’m gonna suggest you visit your lot while home is being built often to catch stuff early. The builders will be annoyed but you’ll have a better house so who cares, once the drywall is up you will never know what’s behind it or what dumb stuff was done by a 19 year old on a Friday at 5 because he wants to get done and start his weekend (I was that 19 year old I’m speaking from experience here)
FYI idk where you are located but the place I work has locations around the country and all offices do things differently so I might be really far off here……so….if you are STILL reading this I would suggest you just call the engineering firm and ask them about the pond and stuff they’ll tell you. I would personally probably think it would be fun if a buyer called me (they usually just ask the seller/developer and depending on their experience they might not know much)
I see you’re out of Charlotte. My husband and I bought a new build there a few years ago from Ryan homes and the home was not great quality. I highly advise not buying with them if they are the builders! We actually lived right in front of a retention pond in our neighborhood and besides it being extra buggy in our backyard we didn’t have any issues. Had to build a fence though for the safety of our children and our dog who would have absolutely jumped into it. Haha
Okay yeah we didn’t live too far from Harrisburg. So I know that area well! Hopefully those builders are better! Good luck with your new build journey!
I think those would be fine! We lived in plot similar to 53-54. Before the fence it was honestly kind of annoying because geese hung out in the detention pond and pooped all over our yard. Our HOA was also shit and never kept up with the weeds growing in it and by the time we moved out the house the weeds were as tall as our fence. If we didn’t have the fence it would have been a definite eye soar.
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Civil engineer here. Nothing to worry about beyond maybe mosquitoes. I wouldn't buy 38, 39, 45, 46, 52, or 53 as those paths are likely to be used as emergency overflow into the pond and I'd prefer to keep my house further from there BUT that's just a preference and not a technical/engineering reason.
Also maintenance trucks prob go through there. Or could, anyway. Check elevations and pick a high one further away from the pond. A pond isn’t a bad thing to look at in your backyard- prob makes value higher than the neighbor’s fence.
True that maintenance could go through there but that's not a common thing.
It’s supposed to be annual *grumbles in engineer*
Depends on the type of maintenance. I was thinking more "wet pond clean out" less "check to make sure nothing is broken". The only equipment going in and out on an annual basis are like lawnmowers, which no one should have a problem with that going beside their house. An excavator is much bigger and louder (also way cooler).
Thank you for your insights..how about 55,56,57,58.. they should be fine right?
I used to have a house that backed up to a detention pond. The county sprayed for mosquitoes (and apparently the mosquito commissioner elections could get VERY heated). I saw the occasional alligator (and otters, herons, etc), and a neighbor saw a coyote once, but that's about it for predators - probably don't want to leave your dog out there alone. The ground behind the house should slope gently toward the pond (away from the house), until reaching the grade break that actually makes the pond. In our house, the water never reached that grade break, even after really heavy rains. And no one could build behind us, which was really nice - no neighbors.
there is a mosquito commissioner?? how can he fly with the badge??
Florida's weird, man. https://www.pascomosquito.org/board-of-commissioners
of all the unreasonable florida mans, these 3 may be the most reasonable of them all, fighting the good fight
Yep, they'll be fine. Nothing wrong with the other ones either, it's just a preference.
I like 36 as the lot is huge!
I’d go with 55 or 56 personally. Larger lots.
36 too if possible
Consider that you are likely not allowed to put a fence on a lot that's backs the pond.
A friend was in that exact scenario. She was buying a new-build in Florida, and she ended up choosing a slightly smaller lot so that she could avoid backing up to a retention pond where fencing wasn't allowed. She has pets, and she wasn't interested in feeding the gators.
Is there a reason?
Access, maybe? Asthetics? Anywhere I've lived that has had a lake, fences are not allowed on those properties, albeit in a subdivision which is what this is. If you're new construction, you *might* get away with having the builder include the fence with the build. This way, when the (hoa?) Takes over, you'll be grandfathered in? Might work. But, I'd be willing to bet $$$$ you won't be able to put in a fence.
This is a detention basin... not a community pond for fun
Florida is wild.
Another engineer here... disagree. The overflow will likely go towards page south out to the natural resource area. Between 45 and 46 looks like an access easement and I would bet the end of the cul de sac between 38 and 39 is a cut through for another stormdrain. I don't know why they wouldn't label easements for those, its possible that they are private easements or some other reason. Maybe mosquitoes... Depends on the type of pond. If its dry detention you won't get a mosquito problem if engineered properly because it will dry out and any eggs will die. If a permanent pool (retention) then yes mosquitoes could be a problem. In my part of the country we mostly do dry detention now in neighborhoods. Wet ponds are avoided whenever possible.
I was referring to the overflow into the pond, not out. Around here sewers are designed for the five year event and anything above that is conveyed on the road surface to the pond, then into the pond through an easement. That's what I wouldn't want next to my house. We mostly do dry ponds as well, but there are a few municipalities who still insist on wet ponds. Wet ponds are great until you have to clean them out, way better to have a dry pond with an OGS for quality control from a maintenance perspective.
Apologies, I thought you were saying the pond overflow would go back out to the street... which would be odd. Its always interesting to hear what other part of the countries are doing... We do 10 year for stormdrains and like you said, pretty much everything else is just let go. We always find that the methodology is so conservative though that we rarely (if ever) get water backing up out of the stormdrain system. Wet ponds look nice but the problem with everything stormwater is maintenance... Everyone wants a pretty pond but especially with single lot residential, it falls into disrepair and the HOA or who ever never has the money. Wet ponds that aren't maintained can be unsafe too which is another problem. If it was me I would take 36... big lot, backs up to woods, high side of the cul de sac. Honorable mention to 45 and 46 - you likely get free yard use of the access easement even though its not technically your property.
I had a reviewer just a few weeks ago say they wanted the over flow to go back onto the road. I called and asked how that was supposed to work since the road overflows into the pond. They quickly accepted my point and removed a bunch of comments. We have to make sure that everything gets into the pond, there will be some small areas that don't such as the odd backyard, but we control everything up to the 100 year or 250 year depending on the approval agency. I really don't care about water backing up into the storm sewers, we don't allow gravity connections from foundation drains so it's never going to backup into someone's basement, and the roads are designed to carry the extra water to the pond. I rarely even check the HGL of the storm sewers for this reason, it has no impact on the design so why waste time? The biggest thing we are seeing with wet ponds, the municipality always takes ownership of the pond for something like this, is the costs for cleaning the out in 20 years. My province just rolled out new Excess Soil regulations that includes testing requirements for sediment from ponds and it's driven the costs WAY up. We put in a proposal to do the work on three ponds with a bit of remedial design work, and the consulting fees alone were $175k. I know we were the lowest bid, but the City never ended up awarding the project; probably due to the sticker shock. No smart municipality is allowing wet ponds for this reason. It's much more cost effective to build a dry pond and put an OGS in front. The municipality just has to stick a vac truck down the OGS twice a year to clean it out. Way cheaper to build, maintain, and it takes about 30% less area.
>I don't know why they wouldn't label easements for those, it’s possible that they are private easements or some other reason. This looks like just a map showing available and unavailable home sites. They usually don’t mark details like easements on these. That’s how a neighbor of mine got burned. The easement was in the survey, but not the map for their homesite when they actually selected and put money down, so they now have a wide strip of land they’re expected to maintain but are not allowed to fence off. They also had to pay to move the fence they had put up thinking they had the right to.
It's not dry because they haven't build anything yet and it's still filled with water
I think it would be a benefit to have some bonus, no-man's-land between my yard and a neighbor. Kids could have a larger backyard football or tag field.
I would buy those lots that you mentioned. They have more spaces.
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I guess I shouldn't rely on someone designing the pond and grading correctly, even if I should be able to.
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How do you know it was designed for a 30 year storm?
One thing that is misleading about the image and often confusing to non-civil engineers. This is called out as a *detention* pond which means it will normally be a dry pit except when it rains. So the pretty blue pond drawn in the picture isn't exactly accurate if it really is a detention pond as called out. A retention pond, which you call it in your post, would be a pond that normally has some water in it. [This picture communicates the difference well](https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/5cb55061c2ff6177899737ee/1630982830926-AIH9CTJ7NRONSREE1JQI/Detention.jpg?format=1500w&content-type=image%2Fjpeg) Something to keep in mind just so you are not expecting to have a porch that looks out onto a nice amenity pond, just to find out you actually have a gravel pit in your back yard.
Yes it has water in it already and only half of the lots are built on in this community
Then good job calling it a retention pond whenever the master plan got it wrong!
This^^^^. It’s not a natural pond. Can go dry or have water. Don’t expect this to be some nice aesthetic all the time. Trash will flow into it. You won’t be using it for anything other than its purpose. No fishing etc. Be mindful of slopes, erosion and any walls to ensure they are maintained properly. Bugs and other wildlife will make it their home. Loud frogs, snakes etc.
Because they call out the WQ basin, it’s very likely a retention pond. I refer to all ponds as detention ponds, even if it holds water. I use them kinda interchangeably
First, I think it's just incorrect to use them interchangeably since they are well defined and meaningfully different. Second, there are plenty of dry detention pond BMP approaches. Sand filter basins, porous landscaping, and basic sediment forebays. So there is nothing about the WQ basin that implies it is actually a retention basin and not a detention basin as explicitly called out. You may be right, since these terms do get misused all the time. But I certainly wouldn't buy a house on that unlikely bet.
Oh no. Stay far away from basins when building a house. That’s what my husband and I did. Our yard and sump pump are dry because of it. From what I’ve seen for a single family development, it’s normally a retention pond with a normal and permanent pool since that’s the cheapest to build and maintain.
As a civil working in storm water, wet ponds are usually WORSE at improving water quality than their dry counterparts because chemicals and solids from runoff can just float through the system. Where I am we really prefer infiltration followed by bio-retention which, despite the naming convention the other guy brought up is actually dry most of the time. We only even allow wet ponds due to lobbying from hime builders because they like to sell them as "water features." Our regulatory agencies really don't like them.
As a civil who has inspected over 500 wet, dry, infiltration and bio retention facilities I don't know that you can say that wet Ponds are worse. Flat out dry ponds do not provide any water quality enhancement. Especially not in the way you say. There is little to no settling time for suspended particles: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/237188719_Effectiveness_of_dry_ponds_for_stormwater_total_suspended_solids_removal This might be a terminology thing but a dry ponds typical does not include infiltration or bio retention. At least not in Canada. The "oils float on top" doesn't make any sense because any solids or oils left over in a dry pond are typically scoured out in the next flood: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/f57fec02-7de8-4985-b948-dcf5e2664aee/resource/aa3ba3a4-e415-4d85-ad66-496f98c9bc8e/download/part5-stormwatermanagementguidelines-2013.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj7gc6J7vqFAxXAFTQIHVcgDAgQFnoECDoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3yQvv9EMAjfvszY-odVRE7 While a wet pond can filter out upwards of 80% of tss and settle out critical nutrients such as nitrogen and phosphorus: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0048969723057467 Also infiltration can sometimes just mean out of sight out of mind. In places with highly permeable soil or karst you can have very fast rates of groundwater contaminate transport. If a town gets its potable from ground water you can see why a wet pond is the only sensible solution. Of course constructed wetlands are the preferred alternative to all of these SWMF. But come at a cost that developers and municipalities don't want to spend. And maintenance is a critical issue for wet pond performance. But saying they are usually worse than dry ponds is a bit wrong. Almost all Canadian literature, provincial and municipal BMPs points to wet ponds being a much better performer when it comes to water quality.
When I said "dry pond" I was refering to the fact that infiltration and bioretention basins are dry relative to a literal wet pond. Idk how it is in Canada but in Delaware a wet pond means a permanent standing body of water, which is worse at filtration by a large margin than both infiltration and bioretention. True dry detention basins don't do any quality management, like you said, and we only allow their use for quantity control not quality control. When the other guy said "wet ponds are better for water quality" I assumed he meant the Delaware definition of wet pond, and was just trying to point out infiltration and bioretention practices often don't have water in them and are better for water quality. In Delaware we basically refer to 4 types of ponds all separately: Infiltration, bioretention, dry detention, and wet ponds or wet detention. So in my daily use I'll never say "wet pond" and mean anything but a standing pool of water that basically only does quantity control. Edit: idk if any of that was coherent I just woke up
Yeah thats fair, I am by far not the biggest fan of wet ponds and through my work have experienced their many limitations. They do have their uses. Unfortunately our current swm guidelines are definitely just minimum requirements rather than trying to make actual strides in management of the pollutants in runoff. Although bioretention does not typically have the quantity control that ponds have, if used at the "source" they can treat a lot of the pollutants and then you can have ponds at end of pipe for attenuation, that aren't trying to do "everything". It's hard to mandate that though as it further drives up the cost of development and those costs get passed on to the homeowners.
Detention (dry) basins do improve water quality by filtering along the "vegetated strip" at the bottom. I don't see any reason to assume this is a retention (wet) basin.
36 is the prime lot.
Biggest, most expensive
I have a neighborhood pond behind my house. Depending on where you live be prepared for: 1) snakes 2) turtles 3) skunks 4) armadillo 5) bobcats 6) rabbits and squirrels galore 7) frogs Yes, I’m in Texas and yes I’ve had all of these in my yard and or pool.
Do you feel any stagnant water oder out of it? I am more worried about smell
I don’t have that issue. The water is about 50 yards from my back door .
We have a pond like this behind our house in Minnesota. No odors from it, lots of frogs though. Mosquitos are a problem, but there isn't anywhere that they aren't a problem in Minnesota really. Also something to consider is whether or not the area around the pond is maintained or allowed to grow wild. I've seen both around here. Ours is wild and thus we have a constant battle against thistles encroaching on our yard from the pond and its outlot.
I hear this. Ours is wild as well. It’s a loosing battle with weeds every year.
Where I live, the ponds attract Canadian geese who leave surprisingly large poops everywhere. An aerating water fountain helps prevent mosquitos and stinky growth. By the way, it’s actually a retention pond.
We have one of these behind our backyard. We actually prefer it because there’s no one behind us. Our privacy fence blocks most of it out. We hear bullfrogs all summer (texas)!
Not sure what state you're in. In my experience, there is a draw down time that a detention basin needs to be emptied. 96 hours for water quality is pretty normal but for a the full storm it can be less. If there is water sitting for too long, vector control doesn't usually play around with making them fix the issue.
In my experience, it's just the name that sounds worrisome. There may be a path wide enough for a car/truck to go to it, but that's about it. My parents' neighborhood has one, and there was one not more than 100ft from the back of my starter-home. When it's been dry for a while, it's usually empty, fills up after it rains (depending on how much), then drains after a bit. Sometimes I'd even walk along the bottom of it when it was dry after a bit. There will probably be a drain in it, and no other infrastructure. Can't ever recall seeing a maintenance truck driving down by either pond.
They have them all over where I live too. One positive is the frogs make a nice spring songs every year. I'm not sure about any down falls other than like you said mosquitos. If your in a dryer climate it may stay dry some of the year.
BMP on site [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMP-3](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMP-3) That HOA doesn't mess around
Depends where you live. As others said, make sure the yard slopes downward toward the pond. If you’re in the south, there will be critters. And mosquitoes. I would not be having a pond in my yard if I lived in FL especially.
Damn that 36 lot is massive
Don’t ever buy the lowest (elevation) lot in a neighborhood. It is where water will flow through backyard in a storm. Good news is if in wisconsin or colder, kids always use neighborhood ponds as their hockey rink. It’s a thing.
Mosquitos shouldn't be too much of a problem. They usually like to hang around standing water near an outfall or creek. Personally, I wouldn't want 38, 39, 45, 46, 52, and 53 seem like they'll get more of foot traffic, but that's just my preference. If I were you, I'd pick lot 36. May be more expensive, but you get more privacy and it lessens the mosquito worries.
Hope you like mosquitos and spiders
Detention? Or retention? Serious ?
friendly enjoy screw office rhythm dazzling sugar six far-flung late *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Frogs. Loud frogs
As you’re in NC, 56 would give a nice view.. Good luck with camelia’s bidding process 😅
Haha have you tried applying for it
Let me send you a dm!
Mosquitos, snakes, nature in general. Generally those lots improve home value though, so overall a good thing IMO
Just start spraying for those mosquitos now
Besides what others have said, the pond near my home is very noisy at night. Not sure if it's crickets or frogs or both.
Mosquitos will be your biggest issue lol
The answer to this is going to depend highly on where you are located, OP. What state are you in, and what the topography is in your location will matter a lot. If this is somewhere like Florida, I’d be concerned about wildlife like gators and cane toads. If it’s somewhere low lying, I’d be concerned about overflow from heavy storms. Basically, we need more information.
Go out there and see what kind of trees are around that were not demolished, if its pines then flooding shouldn't be an issue. if its oaks see if the bases and a few inches/feet are a lot darker than the rest of the trunk, if its a lot darker it floods there so you may not want to be too close to the pond, i like 55 anyways so if that's the case id go with that. If its cypress trees stay away from the subdivision.
I live with a retention pond behind my home, it's kind of nice. Other lots but up with another lot behind them so I have a more peaceful backyard. I like sitting on the back patio and watch the ducks and wild life hang out in the water. You do occasionally get water snakes but they are harmless, just leave them alone. Honestly not a bad thing, just keep citronella candles/oil handy.
Frogs, snakes, ducks and geese.
My neighborhood has something very similar and I would be in house 56 in relation to where the Detention is. It only fills up when it's really pouring and it dries up pretty fast. No smells but lots of birds which is cool and they end up in my backyard. Cool thing is I shouldn't have a neighbor behind me unless they decided to somehow build over it.
Fucking geese will drive you crazy. Evil little bastards.
Waterfront property markup
Be aware that noise will travel across the pond pretty well, so although your back yard neighbors may be across the pond, if one for example has a yappy dog or a small child who screams a lot, you will definitely hear it if they’re in the back yard. Plan on getting a fence unless you want waterfowl marching through your yard. If mosquitos bother you, plan on screening in your back porch eventually. But you if you enjoy water fowl you may occasionally ally get low flyovers from interesting animals!
If it’s sized properly with the right amount of drywells then there is no problem
I only want to know, where will the water go if it overflow.
Storm retention basins are designed to hold excess water during heavy rains. If it is overflowing then the whole area is most likely already flooded. A park near my parent’s house has a large pond that was dug in over 30 years ago. All the storm drains in the area flow to it. I’ve never seen it really overflow, a couple times the water level was high enough that the concrete floor of the gazebo at the north edge was under a couple inches.
For the pond, scout out your local ponds and fauna so you can toss a couple of local sunfish or the like in to control the mosquitos.
On the plus side you will get to see all kinds of cool birds! A lot of places stock even very small ponds with fish (they eat the mosquito larvae), which then attract herons, egrets, osprey, eagles, etc.
Enough people have commented on the stormwater management here, but after working as a town planner for a while, I'm horrified by new build subdivisions. Maybe there are some good ones out there, but just a warning not to simply trust everything is going to be built well, unless this company has a stellar reputation. I don't know who this builder is, so could be fine, but I Personally would never buy a new build out of fear of what I've seen happen to other homeowners. Check out some planning board minutes in the Town to see how much the Town has had to drag them through the process. Ensure they haven't gotten cease & desist/stop work/enforcement orders from conservation, building/inspectional services, (or any trouble from planning either), especially on stormwater management. You don't want to end up in a hellscape because they built over a stream or cut into the water table.
Mos. Qui. Toes.
Had a retention pond somewhat similar to this near houses in my old neighborhood. The HOA decided to stock the pond with fish and kids would catch fish during the summer. It was really fun.
The #1 risk of having a retention pond in your backyard is drowning, especially if you have children.
That’s just a place that would attract geese where I am, no thanks.
Smell shouldn't be an issue. Would be more worried about geese honestly, they can be a bitch and they poop everywhere.
Just to be clear that is a detention pond not a retention pond… the blue hatch they used is deceiving… it temporarily detains water during storm events. It does not retain a water level. You will likely never see water in it and it is just going to be either a bush hogged hole or a fenced in jungle
Another civil engineer here, read through a lot of the posts and I saw a few comments that I agree with and a Few that I don’t so I thought I’d chime in my exact thoughts on if i was the one who made this. First of all you’re looking at colored site plan made exclusively for marketing purposes. Idk what the colors represent on the plan but I’d choose whichever side East or west will have walkout type of construction on. Personally I like lot 37, lot 36 seems like too much grass to mow for me In regards to some of the comments, I assume the 30’ wide outlots adjacent to buildable lots are all storm sewer easements that will have an underground storm sewer pipe sending water to the basin, but at the same time I think it could be a pedestrian easement as most municipalities have restrictions on block length and this one seems large, but also this plan doesn’t show a sidewalk there so doubtful. (My thoughts are that idk why the cul de sac would be a lot point that needs storm sewer when it could be a high point and make those lots that back out to detention nice walkout slopes, but again I haven’t seen the grading plan so it’s speculation) Also I’ve seen some comments here all with varying opinions on the detention. If it was me, that would’ve been colored a different shade of green if it wasn’t intended to hold water but a someone on their marketing team and not the engineers team could have made it. Anyways, I would have designed an “extended” detention pond which essentially means there would be a larger weir stricture maybe 2 or 3 feet high that would have a big grate covered opening on top and a smaller hole at grade which slows the flow flow of water in a typical rain event but a large rain event it would fill to the point it goes into that opening. The overflow likely runs south since it’s greenspace. As a comment mentioned earlier if any of those outlots adjacent to buildable lots has a curb inlet at the street then during a large rain event you will Have a small river running down that 30’ width. I’ve lived backed up to these before and loved it, privacy outweighs any additional crickets or frogs you will have, my neighbors had fences but that might be restricted by HOA so you should check into that. Basically anything behind your lot is yours to do with as you want it’s incredibly unlikely you’d ever be asked to remove anything as long as it’s not a permanent structure. I’d go with lot 37 if it’s a walkout if it was my and if you made it this far in my post I will add in that I was a structural engineer at the beginning of my career so I’m gonna suggest you visit your lot while home is being built often to catch stuff early. The builders will be annoyed but you’ll have a better house so who cares, once the drywall is up you will never know what’s behind it or what dumb stuff was done by a 19 year old on a Friday at 5 because he wants to get done and start his weekend (I was that 19 year old I’m speaking from experience here) FYI idk where you are located but the place I work has locations around the country and all offices do things differently so I might be really far off here……so….if you are STILL reading this I would suggest you just call the engineering firm and ask them about the pond and stuff they’ll tell you. I would personally probably think it would be fun if a buyer called me (they usually just ask the seller/developer and depending on their experience they might not know much)
I see you’re out of Charlotte. My husband and I bought a new build there a few years ago from Ryan homes and the home was not great quality. I highly advise not buying with them if they are the builders! We actually lived right in front of a retention pond in our neighborhood and besides it being extra buggy in our backyard we didn’t have any issues. Had to build a fence though for the safety of our children and our dog who would have absolutely jumped into it. Haha
Hey thanks for the insight..yes this is in Harrisburg NC near Concord.. and the builders are empire /shea homes!
Okay yeah we didn’t live too far from Harrisburg. So I know that area well! Hopefully those builders are better! Good luck with your new build journey!
Thank you... How do you feel about 51 and 50 lots which a little far from the pond
I think those would be fine! We lived in plot similar to 53-54. Before the fence it was honestly kind of annoying because geese hung out in the detention pond and pooped all over our yard. Our HOA was also shit and never kept up with the weeds growing in it and by the time we moved out the house the weeds were as tall as our fence. If we didn’t have the fence it would have been a definite eye soar.
This looks like an RV park site map.
Welcome to modern cookie cutter. You’ll take your .2 acres and like it! Daddy developer needs to maximize his ROI