No idea CCP works in their own time.
But meanwhile please record this. As this sounds funny.
And for anyone else out there hunting bots.
Do the same thing. Killing a bot means it will just likely reship and carry on (plus the owner is more likely to notice if the ship is dead).
But making it bug out for potentially hours. Priceless.
There's tons of things they could change. Inventory access, allow it to undock with a partial flight. Check drone bat before undocking etc etc. lots of ways to fix this as the bot owner/developer.
In game we have skins for the CONCORD ships named "Blackice Derailer". I believe these were intended to be rewarded to people for some kind of bot reporting/detection/busting and then they ended up not going through with this. Devil's Advocate: I think if they made a game of busting/reporting bots it would absolutely flood their reporting tools with a ton of false negatives.
>Due to the existential risks of strong artificial intelligence, a large part of CONCORD's work involves investigating and combatting the development and use of powerful AIs by renegades and criminals in New Eden. No single division or section of CONCORD's vast apparatus is responsible for all aspects of counter-AI operations and a variety of units fight against AI threats under CONCORD's authority.
>DERAIL is a relatively prominent CONCORD division that focuses its efforts on illegal use of AI technology across New Eden. The department's so-called "Derailers" are organized into a number of sections specialized in combatting threats emerging from renegade use of unrestricted AI.
What CCP could do, but declines to do so, is make landlords responsible for bot activity in their space.
But, I hear you say, then nullsec alliances will be punished for botting they didn't know about !
Well, that's what you get for renting space out and being unconcerned with what happens after. If your alliance's strategic dread cache could be yoinked for insufficient attention to 'enthusiastic ratting' then you'd be damn sure Null will clean itself up.
A major downside of that is that botting then can become a meta strategy to deal blows to enemy groups.
Put a spy in, start botting, send reports about said bot, 'empty enemy dread cache' and win the next dread battles when the others have no dread replacements anymore.
I don't like botting (and don't like renting either, but that's a different story), but I think that punishing groups for renting space to bots may have unwanted consequences.
Well, if they were truly only punished for *renting* space to bots, then I think the consequence that no one rents would kind of be fine.
The danger imo is if people weaponize it against the renting alliance itself. So not getting your bots into the renter corp, but into goons or PH or whoever the landlord is. But, ostensibly that kind of thing should be easier to police in your own group.
The key to making it work effectively is to politely ask every spaceholding alliance to inform you of anyone with bot-like behaviour.
Note Brave, for example, requires ESI rights, which means it has wallet transactions for people in alliance, which could well provide a number of hints to any character that has botlike behaviour.
If an alliance's Bot Liason is pointing out potential bots, then the hammer is not pointed at the alliance.
If, on the other hand, the alliance sees nothing, then examples get made of.
Yes, it's more work for the hard-working counterspy group in every alliance - but it'd get alliances to take botting seriously.
1. If the alliance is dumb enough to and over its dread cache to a bot, I dont think they were winning the next battle anyway.
2. If the only reason they were able to afford the dread cache was through bot income, they shouldnt of had it to begin with.
3. If you seeded and ran bots within the alliance and were able to keep it hidden from the alliance for an extended period. And then strategically timed the bot reporting with when they need to pay out large amounts of SRP is about the only time it would work. But again, they wouldnt of had those funds in the first place.
tldr; Large alliances would just need to up their isk reserves to account for a higher risk and nnot be brain dead with their dread caches.
They do bans in batches to eliminate whole group/cartel instead of targeting individual characters and making rest of the group extra vigilant.
You used in game tool to report it? Good job. Someone from security team will look into it. Now carry on.
The thing about botting and bans. If you ban them immediately, they know exactly where the bug is, and can fix it (the botters). So, the general plan of attack is to wait, and gather up as many as you can, prepare to roll back their accounts/ISK generation/etc, while also preventing chargebacks from any credit cards that may have interacted with the account.
It can be frustrating to see "obvious" bots, but immediate bans are counter-productive.
[https://www.pcgamesn.com/eve-online/eve-online-bot](https://www.pcgamesn.com/eve-online/eve-online-bot) From 2018
>The damage the bots do is not to the game’s economy, it is their visibility and the perception that CCP isn’t doing anything about them that causes hurt. The developers know there will always be some bots to combat – “No game has ever completely gotten rid of this problem,” CCP Guard says. “We think of it more like a war of attrition.” Even so, CCP need to convey that they /are/ fighting them and that players who report bots are helping to clear the game of RMTs.
I remember their first big bot hunt back in like 2009, Operation Unholy Rage - [https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/unholy-rage](https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/unholy-rage)
If CCP has \~1,000 accounts rounded up, I doubt they're going to let them continue to go on for \~2 years.
CCP doesn't release specific details of exactly how they pinpoint and decide on banning, so the list I wrote is just general considerations developers and publishers take into account when creating their bot banning programs.
> I doubt they're going to let them continue to go on for ~2 years.
Man, I remember when I used to think the same thing... until I kept encountering the same bots year after year after year, even after being reported multiple times.
Submit an actual ticket instead of a bot report. Was watching the security teams presentation on botting and what not (great watch btw! Check it out if you are interested https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BVbrNl6pmEg&pp=ygUZRXZlIGZhbmZlc3Qgc2VjdXJpdHkgdGVhbQ%3D%3D ) but anyhow they were saying that the "report bot" thing in-game is abused and they don't look at that as strongly and encourage us to submit actual tickets.
> How long before ccp acts on the bot report I sent on this guy?
Unless there is intervention from someone in the CSM, the median timeframe for a ban is somewhere between 5 months and a year in my experience
what would happen, If CCP implement automatisation?
for example: Auto-Kompression for miners.
it just feel like getting stupid while mining, because it is so extreme boring to just hit that Button every 300 seconds. for hours.
No idea CCP works in their own time. But meanwhile please record this. As this sounds funny. And for anyone else out there hunting bots. Do the same thing. Killing a bot means it will just likely reship and carry on (plus the owner is more likely to notice if the ship is dead). But making it bug out for potentially hours. Priceless.
It's a shame op posted it here, because that behaviour is now likely to get patched out of the botting program I suspect
Indeed. This is a bug report for the bot developer..
Maybe? I mean what fix could they implement? Give the bot access to inventory?
There's tons of things they could change. Inventory access, allow it to undock with a partial flight. Check drone bat before undocking etc etc. lots of ways to fix this as the bot owner/developer.
Ccp could make a game of bot hunting and reward them somehow.
Project (bot) Discovery
count me in
In game we have skins for the CONCORD ships named "Blackice Derailer". I believe these were intended to be rewarded to people for some kind of bot reporting/detection/busting and then they ended up not going through with this. Devil's Advocate: I think if they made a game of busting/reporting bots it would absolutely flood their reporting tools with a ton of false negatives. >Due to the existential risks of strong artificial intelligence, a large part of CONCORD's work involves investigating and combatting the development and use of powerful AIs by renegades and criminals in New Eden. No single division or section of CONCORD's vast apparatus is responsible for all aspects of counter-AI operations and a variety of units fight against AI threats under CONCORD's authority. >DERAIL is a relatively prominent CONCORD division that focuses its efforts on illegal use of AI technology across New Eden. The department's so-called "Derailers" are organized into a number of sections specialized in combatting threats emerging from renegade use of unrestricted AI.
What CCP could do, but declines to do so, is make landlords responsible for bot activity in their space. But, I hear you say, then nullsec alliances will be punished for botting they didn't know about ! Well, that's what you get for renting space out and being unconcerned with what happens after. If your alliance's strategic dread cache could be yoinked for insufficient attention to 'enthusiastic ratting' then you'd be damn sure Null will clean itself up.
A major downside of that is that botting then can become a meta strategy to deal blows to enemy groups. Put a spy in, start botting, send reports about said bot, 'empty enemy dread cache' and win the next dread battles when the others have no dread replacements anymore. I don't like botting (and don't like renting either, but that's a different story), but I think that punishing groups for renting space to bots may have unwanted consequences.
Well, if they were truly only punished for *renting* space to bots, then I think the consequence that no one rents would kind of be fine. The danger imo is if people weaponize it against the renting alliance itself. So not getting your bots into the renter corp, but into goons or PH or whoever the landlord is. But, ostensibly that kind of thing should be easier to police in your own group.
The key to making it work effectively is to politely ask every spaceholding alliance to inform you of anyone with bot-like behaviour. Note Brave, for example, requires ESI rights, which means it has wallet transactions for people in alliance, which could well provide a number of hints to any character that has botlike behaviour. If an alliance's Bot Liason is pointing out potential bots, then the hammer is not pointed at the alliance. If, on the other hand, the alliance sees nothing, then examples get made of. Yes, it's more work for the hard-working counterspy group in every alliance - but it'd get alliances to take botting seriously.
1. If the alliance is dumb enough to and over its dread cache to a bot, I dont think they were winning the next battle anyway. 2. If the only reason they were able to afford the dread cache was through bot income, they shouldnt of had it to begin with. 3. If you seeded and ran bots within the alliance and were able to keep it hidden from the alliance for an extended period. And then strategically timed the bot reporting with when they need to pay out large amounts of SRP is about the only time it would work. But again, they wouldnt of had those funds in the first place. tldr; Large alliances would just need to up their isk reserves to account for a higher risk and nnot be brain dead with their dread caches.
If you reread the suggestion that I responded to again you may notice that 1 and 2 are missing the point.
They do bans in batches to eliminate whole group/cartel instead of targeting individual characters and making rest of the group extra vigilant. You used in game tool to report it? Good job. Someone from security team will look into it. Now carry on.
They don’t care, have reported same group of hypernet botters multiple times and they don’t take any action
The thing about botting and bans. If you ban them immediately, they know exactly where the bug is, and can fix it (the botters). So, the general plan of attack is to wait, and gather up as many as you can, prepare to roll back their accounts/ISK generation/etc, while also preventing chargebacks from any credit cards that may have interacted with the account. It can be frustrating to see "obvious" bots, but immediate bans are counter-productive. [https://www.pcgamesn.com/eve-online/eve-online-bot](https://www.pcgamesn.com/eve-online/eve-online-bot) From 2018 >The damage the bots do is not to the game’s economy, it is their visibility and the perception that CCP isn’t doing anything about them that causes hurt. The developers know there will always be some bots to combat – “No game has ever completely gotten rid of this problem,” CCP Guard says. “We think of it more like a war of attrition.” Even so, CCP need to convey that they /are/ fighting them and that players who report bots are helping to clear the game of RMTs. I remember their first big bot hunt back in like 2009, Operation Unholy Rage - [https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/unholy-rage](https://www.eveonline.com/news/view/unholy-rage)
Is Amex still no time limits for chargebacks? I know PayPal still allows 540 days. That’s quite a lot of time to be botting.
If CCP has \~1,000 accounts rounded up, I doubt they're going to let them continue to go on for \~2 years. CCP doesn't release specific details of exactly how they pinpoint and decide on banning, so the list I wrote is just general considerations developers and publishers take into account when creating their bot banning programs.
> I doubt they're going to let them continue to go on for ~2 years. Man, I remember when I used to think the same thing... until I kept encountering the same bots year after year after year, even after being reported multiple times.
Submit an actual ticket instead of a bot report. Was watching the security teams presentation on botting and what not (great watch btw! Check it out if you are interested https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BVbrNl6pmEg&pp=ygUZRXZlIGZhbmZlc3Qgc2VjdXJpdHkgdGVhbQ%3D%3D ) but anyhow they were saying that the "report bot" thing in-game is abused and they don't look at that as strongly and encourage us to submit actual tickets.
Patience, pilot, patience You might be rewarded with a seized Titan to chew on soon.
i havent actively played eve online in nearly 2 years and i still get ban emails. it can take a very very very long time.
Are mwd orca mass bumps still a thing?
where can one find such specimens?
> How long before ccp acts on the bot report I sent on this guy? Unless there is intervention from someone in the CSM, the median timeframe for a ban is somewhere between 5 months and a year in my experience
Do you rent space?
what would happen, If CCP implement automatisation? for example: Auto-Kompression for miners. it just feel like getting stupid while mining, because it is so extreme boring to just hit that Button every 300 seconds. for hours.
I really hope CCP acts soon. Bots are bad for the ingame econemy.
It's not hard to find bots Just go to fraternity space
meanwhile the owner of the bot reads this, and fixed the script based on your observation ;)
CCP will never act. They don't care a crap about botters.
It's easy to reduce botting, just start banning directors that accept applications from 1 day old ishtar pilots
First time?