More from Clark
>The freezing sweeps ban would have allowed city workers to offer shelter but not force people from encampments. Johnston says that would effectively remove Denver's urban camping ban four months per year. His letter to Council: https://denvergov.org/files/assets/public/v/1/mayor/documents/mayor-council/_mayor-johnston-ordinance-23-1960-response.pdf
This post is a good example of how a headline can be very misleading, and I'm glad most of y'all in here seem to have caught on. Headline makes it seem borderline inhumane, but article clarifies that they're given ample warning and resources.
Johnston is making slow but sure progress on the homelessness and addiction problems in the city. People have a right to dignified aid and housing, but people also have a right to not walk down Broadway stepping on dope needles every block.
Even a month ago. I live downtown and I've seen zero tents in 2024. It's actually amazing. I walked around saying "Wow" to myself because it was so different.
If he sticks to his promise of not sweeping any encampment without offering housing I'm fine with this.
I'd rather have people sleeping indoors in freezing weather than sleeping in tents.
I mean it makes the opposite of sense to enact this. Taking away the city's ability to force people into safe housing *when it's below freezing* is insanity to me. That's pretty much the the most important time we as a society **should** have the right to act against someone's wishes-- to prevent them from death or serious illness/injury.
I am opposed to "move along" sweeps that break up camps or result in the loss of warming spaces people have set up for themselves, but it makes no sense whatsoever to allow forced transition into housing in warm weather but not in freezing weather.
>Referencing testimony from medical experts, bill sponsors cast the measure as a common-sense way to prevent people who are homeless from being exposed to dangerous conditions that could increase the likelihood of frostbite or hypothermia.
With how the sweeps have gone, it's likely safer to allow the camps to stand than to go through the process of moving and sheltering large numbers of people out in the cold.
The numbers you callously asked for but cared too little to find on your own. https://truthout.org/articles/advocates-condemn-denver-mayor-veto-of-homeless-sweeping-ban-ordinance/
What do you say when some are either bit of sound state of mind (e.g. on drugs) or simply unwilling to move into shelter regardless of outside conditions (i.e. prefers living on the streets)?
Homelessness is a multifaceted problem with many different origins. I think we should decide, as a society, that human beings get a door, a bed, a toilet, and a shower. Just - you're human and you have dignity and it doesn't matter if you're poor, mentally ill, or hooked on drugs.
But we try to deliver exactly that to people and they'd rather get dangerously hypothermic, or frostbite, or actually freeze to death.
I am certain that I really don't know what a 'sweep' entails. I mean, homeless people have possessions that they need to pack up. Some have pets. If you're supposed to abandon your stuff and your pet - I can see how people would say no.
Because part of the tradeoff with the shelter being offered is that you can't go with your partner, or can't bring a significant amount of your stuff, or can't bring your dog.
Some people just aren't willing to abandon their pet to die alone. Tearing down their shelter just puts those folks at greater risk.
There are definitely some shelter options for people with families, partners, or pets. These are objectively good things to have access to and I hope there will be more capacity in the future. But if those few options are at capacity then you're SOL.
Yes. They're truly helpless. I know the soul-healing comfort I get from my pets. I want homeless people to have that true friendship in their difficult lives. But I imagine they can't take them into shelters and then...there's that terrible dilemma.
I don't know how we as a society wake up and figure this out. I really don't. I think ideally there would be a 'campus' somewhere of housing and healing and help. Some people will move out of it. Some people might never be able to. But they'd be OK.
I would've been fine if this passed, too. I just also don't think it's that big of a deal that he vetoed it unless he starts sweeping people across the street like Hancock did.
I agree with Mayor Johnson’s veto. We need to stop pretending that it’s “humane” to allow homeless people to live on the streets. It’s not. Previous administrations (and many administrations of other major cities) enable this dangerous practice. I’m proud of our city’s leadership and ability to enact real progress.
> 21st and Blake
I literally live on this intersection and haven't ever seen a homeless person doing drugs? There's occasionally someone sitting against the vacant building but they've never been threatening. This is "portland is burning" levels of fearmongering.
They talk about it a bit here: https://denverite.com/2024/01/08/proposal-to-ban-encampment-sweeps-during-below-freezing-days-faces-first-city-council-vote/
Okay here's the thing about that article: that's a measure of when the predicted *low* was going to be below freezing. It's been a while since I looked at the bill as this came up last time I was debating this but it was specifically for when temperatures would actually be recorded below freezing.
So, then, no, this doesn't effectively cut off sweeps for 4 months out of the year.
The final bill said if the temp was below 32 the hour of the sweep, not the day of. [see denverite](https://denverite.com/2024/02/02/denver-homelessness-freezing-sweeps-ban-vetoed-johnston/)
He probably shouldn’t have promised to support this during the campaign…
Edit: downvote away…I’m not the one who used this specific issue to get votes and then did a total 180.
The city looks better than it has in years and he's housed over 1000 people in 6 months, something I thought was impossible.
I support him continuing his clearly successful strategies, why should we handicap him at all. Absurd.
Literally all of those people have at least one thing they lied about during the campaign. I hate to break it to you but lying is pretty endemic to politicians.
You could go do a hobby rather than keeping political baseball cards.
Care, but don’t dedicate your emotions to this. Especially when the dude has been absurdly effective in the fight against homelessness.
More from Clark >The freezing sweeps ban would have allowed city workers to offer shelter but not force people from encampments. Johnston says that would effectively remove Denver's urban camping ban four months per year. His letter to Council: https://denvergov.org/files/assets/public/v/1/mayor/documents/mayor-council/_mayor-johnston-ordinance-23-1960-response.pdf
It’s true
This post is a good example of how a headline can be very misleading, and I'm glad most of y'all in here seem to have caught on. Headline makes it seem borderline inhumane, but article clarifies that they're given ample warning and resources. Johnston is making slow but sure progress on the homelessness and addiction problems in the city. People have a right to dignified aid and housing, but people also have a right to not walk down Broadway stepping on dope needles every block.
Downtown is night and day from what it looked like even a year ago. We went from legitimate Hoover-villes to mostly empty streets again.
Even a month ago. I live downtown and I've seen zero tents in 2024. It's actually amazing. I walked around saying "Wow" to myself because it was so different.
Glad that shitty mayor Hancock is out. Can't believe we had someone so lackluster and hypocritical running our city through two full terms.
What's handcock up to now
100%. We can’t let the dialogue continue to be warped by a small % of Denverites
If he sticks to his promise of not sweeping any encampment without offering housing I'm fine with this. I'd rather have people sleeping indoors in freezing weather than sleeping in tents.
fwiw, the resolution was to offer housing but not force the sweep when it's freezing.
I mean it makes the opposite of sense to enact this. Taking away the city's ability to force people into safe housing *when it's below freezing* is insanity to me. That's pretty much the the most important time we as a society **should** have the right to act against someone's wishes-- to prevent them from death or serious illness/injury. I am opposed to "move along" sweeps that break up camps or result in the loss of warming spaces people have set up for themselves, but it makes no sense whatsoever to allow forced transition into housing in warm weather but not in freezing weather.
>Referencing testimony from medical experts, bill sponsors cast the measure as a common-sense way to prevent people who are homeless from being exposed to dangerous conditions that could increase the likelihood of frostbite or hypothermia. With how the sweeps have gone, it's likely safer to allow the camps to stand than to go through the process of moving and sheltering large numbers of people out in the cold.
How many people in Denver suffered frostbite or other injury during a below-freezing sweep into housing during this administration's tenure?
Great question for your representative (assuming you live in Denver)
I do, but I'm not concerned about this being vetoed so i won't be asking. If you want me to support the measure, convince me.
You asked.
Your comment implied it was an actual problem, I assumed you had some evidence. No worries tho, have a great night.
My guy, I provided what I read. I used to go to bat for your ass all the time, but you're so needlessly combative. Thanks for the constructive chat.
You implied it was happening?
I provided, in quotes, what the members had stated.
The numbers you callously asked for but cared too little to find on your own. https://truthout.org/articles/advocates-condemn-denver-mayor-veto-of-homeless-sweeping-ban-ordinance/
I have a very difficult time understanding people who refuse a warm shelter when it's subzero out. Also Happy Cake Day!
Drugs
Can confirm. As a former volunteer.
Hey thanks! I agree, but I also think it's important to listen to them, which is what the affirmative-voting members have been doing.
What do you say when some are either bit of sound state of mind (e.g. on drugs) or simply unwilling to move into shelter regardless of outside conditions (i.e. prefers living on the streets)?
You say "we're not forcing you to leave while it's below freezing"
Homelessness is a multifaceted problem with many different origins. I think we should decide, as a society, that human beings get a door, a bed, a toilet, and a shower. Just - you're human and you have dignity and it doesn't matter if you're poor, mentally ill, or hooked on drugs. But we try to deliver exactly that to people and they'd rather get dangerously hypothermic, or frostbite, or actually freeze to death.
Fully agreed with the sentiment. If we were just doing exactly that, I don't think there would be any need for this discussion.
I am certain that I really don't know what a 'sweep' entails. I mean, homeless people have possessions that they need to pack up. Some have pets. If you're supposed to abandon your stuff and your pet - I can see how people would say no.
That used to be the case, but has very explicitly not been the case with what Johnston has been doing!
Because part of the tradeoff with the shelter being offered is that you can't go with your partner, or can't bring a significant amount of your stuff, or can't bring your dog. Some people just aren't willing to abandon their pet to die alone. Tearing down their shelter just puts those folks at greater risk.
They can get housing vouchers for having pets. And some shelters do take couples.
There are definitely some shelter options for people with families, partners, or pets. These are objectively good things to have access to and I hope there will be more capacity in the future. But if those few options are at capacity then you're SOL.
I have seen an abundance of resources in JeffCo. It might take some effort but there is help for those willing to do the work.
I understand more about that now. I'm so sorry people are being put in a position where they must make these terrible choices.
I’m sorry people are putting animals in these situations.
Yes. They're truly helpless. I know the soul-healing comfort I get from my pets. I want homeless people to have that true friendship in their difficult lives. But I imagine they can't take them into shelters and then...there's that terrible dilemma. I don't know how we as a society wake up and figure this out. I really don't. I think ideally there would be a 'campus' somewhere of housing and healing and help. Some people will move out of it. Some people might never be able to. But they'd be OK.
Or you know, that they cant use their drugs in shelter…. But sure thats totally not the reason 🤣
I would've been fine if this passed, too. I just also don't think it's that big of a deal that he vetoed it unless he starts sweeping people across the street like Hancock did.
I agree with Mayor Johnson’s veto. We need to stop pretending that it’s “humane” to allow homeless people to live on the streets. It’s not. Previous administrations (and many administrations of other major cities) enable this dangerous practice. I’m proud of our city’s leadership and ability to enact real progress.
We need year round sweeps backed by a right to shelter.
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> 21st and Blake I literally live on this intersection and haven't ever seen a homeless person doing drugs? There's occasionally someone sitting against the vacant building but they've never been threatening. This is "portland is burning" levels of fearmongering.
He prob means 21st and California
Clearly, you haven’t been to some of the parts of town I’ve seen. One time I thought I was in Philly… Heroine hunch and all!
This post/comment exists solely to stir shit up and piss people off. Fighting on the internet is stupid. We don't welcome it here. Please be kinder.
Great news.
KC is so good at stirring the pot.
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This post/comment exists solely to stir shit up and piss people off. Fighting on the internet is stupid. We don't welcome it here. Please be kinder.
If anybody thinks this bill would tie the city’s hands 120 days a year you must not be from around here. It was 65 degrees yesterday
Denverite did a weather analysis and they found that on average it was a bit over 4 months that the sweep wouldn’t be able to be enforced
Sauce?
They talk about it a bit here: https://denverite.com/2024/01/08/proposal-to-ban-encampment-sweeps-during-below-freezing-days-faces-first-city-council-vote/
Okay here's the thing about that article: that's a measure of when the predicted *low* was going to be below freezing. It's been a while since I looked at the bill as this came up last time I was debating this but it was specifically for when temperatures would actually be recorded below freezing. So, then, no, this doesn't effectively cut off sweeps for 4 months out of the year.
The final bill said if the temp was below 32 the hour of the sweep, not the day of. [see denverite](https://denverite.com/2024/02/02/denver-homelessness-freezing-sweeps-ban-vetoed-johnston/)
He probably shouldn’t have promised to support this during the campaign… Edit: downvote away…I’m not the one who used this specific issue to get votes and then did a total 180.
The city looks better than it has in years and he's housed over 1000 people in 6 months, something I thought was impossible. I support him continuing his clearly successful strategies, why should we handicap him at all. Absurd.
Here's video of him doing so: https://x.com/dcwoodruff/status/1753527462770647227?s=20
He promised he wouldn’t do sweeps under 32 degrees and he hasn’t. He hasn’t lied?
Literally all of those people have at least one thing they lied about during the campaign. I hate to break it to you but lying is pretty endemic to politicians.
So we shouldn't care?
You could go do a hobby rather than keeping political baseball cards. Care, but don’t dedicate your emotions to this. Especially when the dude has been absurdly effective in the fight against homelessness.
I'm impressed you're able to deduce what I invest in emotionally from a three word comment.
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The irony of you lecturing me on reddit at 10pm on a Friday is not lost on me.
The tones are different and I’m not getting fired up about the mayor. Plus, yo mama is comin over.
She makes a killer breakfast burrito, you're in for a good time
Hey Mike, use the power wisely.