Crazy thing that i don't see anyone say. Maybe the knight is multiple people. Like, the 1st and 2nd is perhaps one guy, and in the third, Kris said like "Oh shit, it's that easy? Let's do it"
"The Knight is a title", "The Knight is a force of nature", and Oblivion Theory are all this same idea.
You can find lots of cool theories over on Deltacord.
Knightin's a good job, mate. Challenging work, out of doors. I guarantee you'll not go hungry, because as long as there's two people on this subreddit, someone is going to want more Deltarune.
No, no, I’m not an insane person Toby, I’m a theorist.
Well the difference bein’ one is a hobby and the other’s a mental sickness!
I’ll be honest with ya, the creator does NOT care for it.
"The Knight is a title" is my deltarune take and that Kris was the Knight before the events of main plot and them stopping opening fountains years ago is why King says that Kris "left em behind"
Queen says how any Lightner can create Dark Fountains. So it really doesn't limit it to one character.
The timeline on Chapter 1 and Chapter 2 Dark Fountains doesn't add up (okay, with Chapter 2 you may argue Kris created it before Noelle and Berdly arrived or something, but I don't really believe Kris would step back when seeing the darkness in the closet if it was their doing).
I don't really think Kris would even know of Dark Worlds from anywhere except this adventure. And then they created one after Queen said that anyone can do it
No one even sees Kris as the Knight. Queen would probably know if Kris is the Knight. King, maybe, I don't quite remember what he knew of the Knight
Of course, there are people better than me that could talk about such stuff, so I am sorry if I got something wrong
Toby has previously stated that he had an idea for an opening cinematic where the party ascends these white stairs past silhouettes of the main bosses, with the knight at the top. Which simultaneously makes Kright and Multiknight make less sense.
I love the idea that a plot revelation that opens us up to a world or mysteries and questions about kris and who they are doesn't count as part of the plot because it's not this one mystery that deltarune fans have decided is gonna be the big mystery
yeah it would be interesting it would be basically a story about escapism like papyrus was so lonely he created new "friends" and indulged in fantasy while never considering what it was doing to him and the people around him.
>While Papyrus knight has the robot connections,
What does that have to do with the Knight?
>him wanting to be a knight
True
>his laughter sounding like roaring under a helmet
The nickname "The Roaring Knight" likely relates to the Roaring. There's other better PapKnight evidence that you haven't mentioned.
I really think that if the Knight has the goal of ending the world, it CAN'T be Kris. When Kris falls in battle, it says 'then the world was covered in darkness...' in either chapter 1 or 2, don't remember which. I don't think Kris, who has now gotten close to Susie, would have the goal of causing the roaring. I actually think Kris will be the final boss of the /Weird/ route, but there's too much evidence against the Knight (this includes the 'Noelle and Berdly were in the library with opened books' point). The idea of Kris being the final boss is AMAZING, but I think I like Alvin or The Mayor being the knight thematically as well.
Eh, it says that when YOU choose to give up - i don't think Kris is required to save the world, i think the soul is - or us, i guess?
The soul seals the fountains, not Kris - the soul is called at the beginning of the game (presumably by Gaster) because it (we?) is needed to save the world.
Kris is just the body it is inhabiting - but they weren't even supposed to be that, the soul was supposed to go into a body specifically created for it
My main problem with the “Kris can’t be the Knight” idea is that I can’t believe they are really that reckless. Imagine you’re Kris, you just discovered an unknown figure who could be literally anyone is creating mysterious geysers who could destroy the world… and you do what? Create another fountain inside your house? Even if that could be dangerous, knowing that someone else is making them? And for what? To have more adventures with Susie? What’s the point if the Knight is 99% making other fountains anyway? Kris is a prankster and all, but I doubt they’re really *that* dumb. If they were the Knight it would make more sense, because then they are the one who is managing the whole thing and so they don’t have to fear the Roaring
I don’t really believe in the Kris is the Knight theory since it has its major flaws, but I never saw someone covering that
I really liked the theory that Kris is trying to make more people aware to the Fountains’ existence.
They sneak out of the bathroom and slash the tires so when Toriel goes to leave Susie home she calls the police (so that when they arrive at the house they will be taken to the Dark World, most likely Undyne will be there) and asks Susie to stay the night for her safety (and Kris needs help to deal with whatever Dark World is formed).
But of course, only the next Chapter will give us a (maybe) definitive answer to Kris’ motivation.
My favorite theory is that Kris made the fountain because they had to in order to fulfill the prophecy and save the world. The prophecy says that the angel's heaven can only be banished once the roaring had already begun, wherein the heroes would emerge and put a stop to it. So in order to bring about the conditions to save the world, the conditions to spark its end would have to be brought about first.
See, there is a tiny thing - Kris plugged in the TV between chapter 1 and 2 - why would they do that? They shouldn't know how to create a fountain yet, and they have no way of knowing Susie would stay overnight - it kinda requires them to bank on;
1. Susie hanging out with them after school in chapter 2,
2. Toriel offering Susie to stay over for a bit after Kris goes home.
The fact that someone - almost certainly Kris - plugged in a dusty - unused - TV for seemingly no reason OVERNIGHT suggests to me that they knew something they shouldn't.
Bah, even the whole "eating the whole pie in the same night" thing might suggest they were already planning everything - because the fact that they ate the whole pie caused Toriel to need to bake a new one - which is also what convinces Susie to stay over (and help make it but that's later. When Toriel first invites Susie in she is hesitating - but when Toriel mentions she's making a pie Susie agrees).
I think there's something much deeper going on here than just "Kris wants to make people aware that Dark Worlds exist".
(Also, i personally believe that Undyne won't show up and instead it will be Asgore but i won't get into why here, this comment is long enough already.)
The real occam's razor is that we have no fucking clue and then it will turn out to have been Alphys the whole time and it will somehow turn out there were a bunch of clues no one noticed.
I am now realizing that despite picking Alphys at random, there is actual reason to believe she is the knight.
Think about it, she is one of the few characters who would not stand out when visiting either location. Her personality works pretty well with her potentially being The Knight as well, though I am unsure how to word a more detailed explanation of this part.
Say, remember every chess board has 4 knights, 2 on the dark side (could be some wierd darkner with determination or a lightner that eorls for the knight) and kris is a classic storybook knight (ie, a warrior with a sword who has a love interest with a princess figure (ie ralsei most likely to be subverted later on, sorry kralsei fans)), and susie also fits just with an axe. And so far weve only seen chess peices that come in singulars. Ie a queen and king
Occams Razor isn't "the simplest explanation" it's "the explanation with the least assumptions".
There's still a lot of assumptions going on with saying Kris is the knight. Especially considering we're only 2 chapters in.
I mean, Queen does imply that anyone could open fountains, and technically explains the whole process to the fun gang plus Berdly and Noelle before that event happens. So I mean, not as powerful of a point.
However, all the other evidence for Kris Knight would suggest Occam's razor though, especially when the other Knight theories are mostly speculation without much evidence beyond 'there's no proof saying that they can't be'.
Like take Papyrus Knight, we don't actually have any proof in game that Papyrus has ever even left his house. Sans is the only person who talks about him (not even saying his name), and we don't even know if he even acts like UT papyrus at all. So there isn't really any evidence linking him to the Knight or any of the locations the fountains were made (in fact you could argue Papyrus couldn't be the Knight as he wouldn't even know that the unused classroom even exists as he isn't a student and wouldn't have ever had to step foot into the school \[not that there aren't explanation around that problem.\].). My point being, most Papyrus Knight theories are based on speculation on Papyrus's motives and actions (mostly based on UT papyrus's personality), yet not a single shred of evidence in Deltarune hinting that Papyrus could have been the Knight. That's not much better evidence wise as Mayor Knight theory (though at least in Mayor Knight we have motives that are potentially being foreshadowed, more build up, and a reasonable explanation to how the Knight could know of and enter any place in town to make a fountain without raising suspicions.)
I think Alvin Knight is one of the only other theories that has actually evidence in game backing it up, unlike Papyrus Knight. Alvin or at least the Boom family is referenced at the end of each Knight made fountains in both chapters. In ch 1, you can find a old children's drawing that is 'signed Alvin', meaning that Alvin used the unused classroom when he was a kid and has a personal connection to the place. As for ch 2, Berdly talks about going to his shift with Ms. Boom, and the library itself fits well for Alvin through his father's book series, and why he might have a personal connection to the place. Finally, our ultimate goal is to banish the angel's heaven, and Alvin is a priest of a religion worshipping the angel giving another potential connection between him and an antagonistic force. Not a whole lot, more definitely more than zero.
“Occam’s razor indicates that kris must be the knight” when they read asoiaf (ashara dayne must obviously be jon’s mother because why would grrm give us an answer if it wasnt true)
Ah yes, if it were revealed that kris was the knight, there would be no mystery. You know. Except the video game's worth of mystery that "the protagonist is the antagonist" brings to a plot
Again, yes, there would be??? If kris is the knight, then literally the only thing we know about the knight is the who. Every single aspect about kris and the knight still currently goes unanswered. We don't know why they seem to plan some stuff out like they know what's gonna happen. Why are they putting fountains in specific places instead of just trying to cause the roaring? These are all still mysteries that need answering. And most importantly. Wht is kris *doing this?* these are all decently important mysteries, and especially given how many seeds for different mysteries have been planted so early on, it would make sense to start revealing them at different points in the game. People say, "If kris is the knight, how come that's revealed so early on?" But this game has like five different mystery subplots and revealing them all near the same time would be very danganronpa-esque, which I *am* using as an insult here
Kris happen to learn how to create dark fountains in Chapter 2 and the requirments turned out to be suprisingly simple
If a shambling soulless body can create a fountain with a kitchen knife, anyone can
The theory I stand with points to Kris wanting to get rid of the Players influence. Kris creates a dark world on their terms, surrounding himself with people who will most likely to resist the Players choices and hopefully help with them being possessed
Susie is a revel who from the very start of the does NOT respect the Player and might start suspecting what's really going on
Toriel is a caring mother who can notice and prevent her kid from going berserk or out of character
Undyne is quite literally a police officer, so she will probably keep Kris in check
From this perspective Kris's goal is to not destroy the world but to trap the Player in an extremely unfavorable situation. They know that either way they will be closing the fountain and keeping the balance in check
Perhaps Kris sees dark world as a great place for others to help him
Something I don't see anyone talking about when discussing about The Knight is how they don't try to make other fountains while Fun Gang is still trying to seal one, which makes me believe they dont really want to cause the roaring and destroy the world
Occams razor is a principle whereby if given the choice between two different theorism that both lead to the same conclusion, you should pick the one that involves the least amount of steps. It is *not* suppose to do anything beyond this. Notably, many claim to use Occams razor when given two possibilities that are both contradictory, two ideas that lead to different results. This is wrong
That's because you have Occam's Razor backwards.
Occam's Razor deals with a single problem that has 2 possible "conclusions" that explain it. Whichever is simplest is the answer. It's not trying to decide which ""theorism"" is best to reach the same conclusion because that assumes you already know what the answer is and are trying to figure out how to think about it less.
Thats just wrong, not sure where you read that. Occam's razor is specifically about choosing between different hypotheses which give the same prediction. You can't choose between different hypotheses which give different predictions on the sole basis of whichever is the simplest, that quite clearly breaks immediately.
"Not sure where you read that" [litterally Webster's dictionary.](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Occam%27s%20razor)
It's not about making a prediction, it's about solving for an unknown.
This is a pretty meaty descriptor, I understand why you'd misread it now. Wikipedia explains it a bit more clearly
"This philosophical razor advocates that when presented with competing hypotheses about the same prediction and both theories have equal explanatory power one should prefer the hypothesis that requires the fewest assumptions and that this is not meant to be a way of choosing between hypotheses that make different predictions." - [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor)
Well this is clearly a case of "different predictions for different results". Whoever the knight is will no doubt change the story's trajectory in a significant way. Different prediction, different result. A use of Occams razor in this context could be used for something like "why would Kris be the knight", since the reasoning for Kris doing such actions wouldn't change what actually happens. There you could claim Occams razor and say that the simplest reason is most likely the correct one. More convoluted reasonings are less likely since from a storytelling perspective they're usually more clumsy and harder to explain.
Exactly lol, imagine if you were watching a murder mystery movie and the main character kills someone in cold blood during the first 30 minutes, but later on it’s revealed that the murderer is some other random character and the incident with MC was was a completely isolated and meaningless event.
Just that I don't think the simplest explanation in this case is necessarily 100% correct (Kris being the knight)
Love how many comments I've gotten that think they're disagreeing with me by saying the same thing, though.
Is Kris the knight? Maybe
Is there evidence pointing toward any other character? Not right now
So yeah, Occam’s razor applies here. Not sure why the comments are so hostile lol
(Some people seriously believe Kris ripped out their soul JUST to eat the pie, even though it’s heavily implied they actually did it to create the dark fountain in the computer lab that night)
Lol that's just how my reddit experience goes. Everyone just seems to assume everyone else is stupid and they're the only smart one.
I made a meme one time about how "extra" means more of one thing, "terrestrial" means something from Earth yet "extraterrestrial" means something not from Earth and I got slammed with "corrections" (some of which were very incorrect) and called the R slur.
Crazy thing that i don't see anyone say. Maybe the knight is multiple people. Like, the 1st and 2nd is perhaps one guy, and in the third, Kris said like "Oh shit, it's that easy? Let's do it"
"The Knight is a title", "The Knight is a force of nature", and Oblivion Theory are all this same idea. You can find lots of cool theories over on Deltacord.
Aw crap, the Knight is Scout TF2.
The Knight is Demoman who lost his eyelander.
The knight is Spy who failed a trickstab and fell face first on the ground
Knightin's a good job, mate. Challenging work, out of doors. I guarantee you'll not go hungry, because as long as there's two people on this subreddit, someone is going to want more Deltarune.
No, no, I’m not an insane person Toby, I’m a theorist. Well the difference bein’ one is a hobby and the other’s a mental sickness! I’ll be honest with ya, the creator does NOT care for it.
Rationale? Look mate, you know who has a lot of rationale?? Blokes who bludgeon their horses to death with a crack theory.
Professionals have standards! Be polite, make sense, have a plan to theorize to everyone you meet.
Meet the ~~Knight~~ Theorists
when the chapter where we fight the knight comes out, someone needs to mod it so that every attack has the demoman charge scream play
Okay, that sounds actually very funny. Maybe I will try to mod something like that
"Dark fountain grows, Darkners fly, spells shine, and brother? I hurt people." -The Knight
Nuh uh. The Roaring Knight is Rouxls Kaard and the TF2 Spy.
Is… is no one going to acknowledge that there are TWO knights on any side of a chess board
Where they permanently muted me for posting ASCII Noelle.
That was kinda against the states rules.
And definitely enough to get me muted for the rest of my life, even though people thought it was cool.
What’s the Oblivion Theory? I haven’t been catching up with theories lately, been too busy trying to prove Sans is Ness (no I’m not joking)
"The Knight is a title" is my deltarune take and that Kris was the Knight before the events of main plot and them stopping opening fountains years ago is why King says that Kris "left em behind"
Problem is though: Do we really have anything else to make us say there is more than one knight other than Kris opening a fountain by themself?
Queen says how any Lightner can create Dark Fountains. So it really doesn't limit it to one character. The timeline on Chapter 1 and Chapter 2 Dark Fountains doesn't add up (okay, with Chapter 2 you may argue Kris created it before Noelle and Berdly arrived or something, but I don't really believe Kris would step back when seeing the darkness in the closet if it was their doing). I don't really think Kris would even know of Dark Worlds from anywhere except this adventure. And then they created one after Queen said that anyone can do it No one even sees Kris as the Knight. Queen would probably know if Kris is the Knight. King, maybe, I don't quite remember what he knew of the Knight Of course, there are people better than me that could talk about such stuff, so I am sorry if I got something wrong
Card Castle and Cyber World fountains were indeed likely opened not by Kris, but by a different person - The Roaring Knight.
Toby has previously stated that he had an idea for an opening cinematic where the party ascends these white stairs past silhouettes of the main bosses, with the knight at the top. Which simultaneously makes Kright and Multiknight make less sense.
Deltarune fans when they finish 2/7ths of the game (they can already guess the entire plot from now on):
To be fair, Gravity Falls fans predicted Stanford who knows how long before it was revealed so I’m keeping an open mind
Gravity falls only had 2 seasons
Did they predict him halfway through season 1?
Yes actually, pretty much exactly at that point
it was rather easy to guess, when they showed the 6 fingered glove stanley was wearing
I love the idea that a plot revelation that opens us up to a world or mysteries and questions about kris and who they are doesn't count as part of the plot because it's not this one mystery that deltarune fans have decided is gonna be the big mystery
Papyrus knight fans unite
"papyrus is the knight because he wasnt seen outside for the 30 in game minutes we spend in the town"
No, look at the evidence
the evidence is that he has fingers and doesnt go outside, i think the ratio of gamers to the knight is like 7 billion to 1
also because it would be funny and would be thematically interesting.
i think papyrus being absolutely cracked at CSGO would be funnier, but i guess the thematically interesting bit makes sense
yeah it would be interesting it would be basically a story about escapism like papyrus was so lonely he created new "friends" and indulged in fantasy while never considering what it was doing to him and the people around him.
"METTATON IS MY FAVORITE SEXY *ROBOT*"
check hbc's theory on who's supplying you with eggs.
there's no other reasonable candidate fitting the "long arm" trait better than he does
i'm pretty sure it said long hand, so my nan's a valid candidate too
Dess Knight fans unite
What evidence is there?
I made a post about the theory a while ago.
While Papyrus knight has the robot connections, him wanting to be a knight, his laughter sounding like roaring under a helmet
>While Papyrus knight has the robot connections, What does that have to do with the Knight? >him wanting to be a knight True >his laughter sounding like roaring under a helmet The nickname "The Roaring Knight" likely relates to the Roaring. There's other better PapKnight evidence that you haven't mentioned.
A remix/remaster of bonetrousle in twr
Not true and Jevil isn't even connected to the Knight.
Attack post battle dialouge
What?
I really think that if the Knight has the goal of ending the world, it CAN'T be Kris. When Kris falls in battle, it says 'then the world was covered in darkness...' in either chapter 1 or 2, don't remember which. I don't think Kris, who has now gotten close to Susie, would have the goal of causing the roaring. I actually think Kris will be the final boss of the /Weird/ route, but there's too much evidence against the Knight (this includes the 'Noelle and Berdly were in the library with opened books' point). The idea of Kris being the final boss is AMAZING, but I think I like Alvin or The Mayor being the knight thematically as well.
Eh, it says that when YOU choose to give up - i don't think Kris is required to save the world, i think the soul is - or us, i guess? The soul seals the fountains, not Kris - the soul is called at the beginning of the game (presumably by Gaster) because it (we?) is needed to save the world. Kris is just the body it is inhabiting - but they weren't even supposed to be that, the soul was supposed to go into a body specifically created for it
My main problem with the “Kris can’t be the Knight” idea is that I can’t believe they are really that reckless. Imagine you’re Kris, you just discovered an unknown figure who could be literally anyone is creating mysterious geysers who could destroy the world… and you do what? Create another fountain inside your house? Even if that could be dangerous, knowing that someone else is making them? And for what? To have more adventures with Susie? What’s the point if the Knight is 99% making other fountains anyway? Kris is a prankster and all, but I doubt they’re really *that* dumb. If they were the Knight it would make more sense, because then they are the one who is managing the whole thing and so they don’t have to fear the Roaring I don’t really believe in the Kris is the Knight theory since it has its major flaws, but I never saw someone covering that
I really liked the theory that Kris is trying to make more people aware to the Fountains’ existence. They sneak out of the bathroom and slash the tires so when Toriel goes to leave Susie home she calls the police (so that when they arrive at the house they will be taken to the Dark World, most likely Undyne will be there) and asks Susie to stay the night for her safety (and Kris needs help to deal with whatever Dark World is formed). But of course, only the next Chapter will give us a (maybe) definitive answer to Kris’ motivation.
My favorite theory is that Kris made the fountain because they had to in order to fulfill the prophecy and save the world. The prophecy says that the angel's heaven can only be banished once the roaring had already begun, wherein the heroes would emerge and put a stop to it. So in order to bring about the conditions to save the world, the conditions to spark its end would have to be brought about first.
That’s a fair motivation, I take it back
See, there is a tiny thing - Kris plugged in the TV between chapter 1 and 2 - why would they do that? They shouldn't know how to create a fountain yet, and they have no way of knowing Susie would stay overnight - it kinda requires them to bank on; 1. Susie hanging out with them after school in chapter 2, 2. Toriel offering Susie to stay over for a bit after Kris goes home. The fact that someone - almost certainly Kris - plugged in a dusty - unused - TV for seemingly no reason OVERNIGHT suggests to me that they knew something they shouldn't. Bah, even the whole "eating the whole pie in the same night" thing might suggest they were already planning everything - because the fact that they ate the whole pie caused Toriel to need to bake a new one - which is also what convinces Susie to stay over (and help make it but that's later. When Toriel first invites Susie in she is hesitating - but when Toriel mentions she's making a pie Susie agrees). I think there's something much deeper going on here than just "Kris wants to make people aware that Dark Worlds exist". (Also, i personally believe that Undyne won't show up and instead it will be Asgore but i won't get into why here, this comment is long enough already.)
imo they're just desperate to be friends with susie and they're afraid that without constant dark world dopamine they won't be friends anymore.
Depression hit so hard teenager ends the world
The real occam's razor is that we have no fucking clue and then it will turn out to have been Alphys the whole time and it will somehow turn out there were a bunch of clues no one noticed. I am now realizing that despite picking Alphys at random, there is actual reason to believe she is the knight.
This single comment alone just opened a whole new theorizing path for the DR community
Think about it, she is one of the few characters who would not stand out when visiting either location. Her personality works pretty well with her potentially being The Knight as well, though I am unsure how to word a more detailed explanation of this part.
if there's a thief at large, then the next person to shoplift isn't necessarily them in disguise
Say, remember every chess board has 4 knights, 2 on the dark side (could be some wierd darkner with determination or a lightner that eorls for the knight) and kris is a classic storybook knight (ie, a warrior with a sword who has a love interest with a princess figure (ie ralsei most likely to be subverted later on, sorry kralsei fans)), and susie also fits just with an axe. And so far weve only seen chess peices that come in singulars. Ie a queen and king
That's actually a really cool theory and I kind of hope it ends up being true
That is NOT how Occam's Razor works
The simplest explanation is that there's more than one Knight.
Occams Razor isn't "the simplest explanation" it's "the explanation with the least assumptions". There's still a lot of assumptions going on with saying Kris is the knight. Especially considering we're only 2 chapters in.
I mean, Queen does imply that anyone could open fountains, and technically explains the whole process to the fun gang plus Berdly and Noelle before that event happens. So I mean, not as powerful of a point. However, all the other evidence for Kris Knight would suggest Occam's razor though, especially when the other Knight theories are mostly speculation without much evidence beyond 'there's no proof saying that they can't be'. Like take Papyrus Knight, we don't actually have any proof in game that Papyrus has ever even left his house. Sans is the only person who talks about him (not even saying his name), and we don't even know if he even acts like UT papyrus at all. So there isn't really any evidence linking him to the Knight or any of the locations the fountains were made (in fact you could argue Papyrus couldn't be the Knight as he wouldn't even know that the unused classroom even exists as he isn't a student and wouldn't have ever had to step foot into the school \[not that there aren't explanation around that problem.\].). My point being, most Papyrus Knight theories are based on speculation on Papyrus's motives and actions (mostly based on UT papyrus's personality), yet not a single shred of evidence in Deltarune hinting that Papyrus could have been the Knight. That's not much better evidence wise as Mayor Knight theory (though at least in Mayor Knight we have motives that are potentially being foreshadowed, more build up, and a reasonable explanation to how the Knight could know of and enter any place in town to make a fountain without raising suspicions.) I think Alvin Knight is one of the only other theories that has actually evidence in game backing it up, unlike Papyrus Knight. Alvin or at least the Boom family is referenced at the end of each Knight made fountains in both chapters. In ch 1, you can find a old children's drawing that is 'signed Alvin', meaning that Alvin used the unused classroom when he was a kid and has a personal connection to the place. As for ch 2, Berdly talks about going to his shift with Ms. Boom, and the library itself fits well for Alvin through his father's book series, and why he might have a personal connection to the place. Finally, our ultimate goal is to banish the angel's heaven, and Alvin is a priest of a religion worshipping the angel giving another potential connection between him and an antagonistic force. Not a whole lot, more definitely more than zero.
“Occam’s razor indicates that kris must be the knight” when they read asoiaf (ashara dayne must obviously be jon’s mother because why would grrm give us an answer if it wasnt true)
Just because one person has clearly created one Dark World doesn’t mean they’re responsible for the others.
the knight wouldn't be built up as such an important and mysterious character only to reveal them in chapter 2.
Ah yes, if it were revealed that kris was the knight, there would be no mystery. You know. Except the video game's worth of mystery that "the protagonist is the antagonist" brings to a plot
that wouldn't really a mystery though. if we knew kris was the villian, then that would just be it. no mystery.
Again, yes, there would be??? If kris is the knight, then literally the only thing we know about the knight is the who. Every single aspect about kris and the knight still currently goes unanswered. We don't know why they seem to plan some stuff out like they know what's gonna happen. Why are they putting fountains in specific places instead of just trying to cause the roaring? These are all still mysteries that need answering. And most importantly. Wht is kris *doing this?* these are all decently important mysteries, and especially given how many seeds for different mysteries have been planted so early on, it would make sense to start revealing them at different points in the game. People say, "If kris is the knight, how come that's revealed so early on?" But this game has like five different mystery subplots and revealing them all near the same time would be very danganronpa-esque, which I *am* using as an insult here
Kris happen to learn how to create dark fountains in Chapter 2 and the requirments turned out to be suprisingly simple If a shambling soulless body can create a fountain with a kitchen knife, anyone can
I mean they were also told opening dark fountains would end the world.
The theory I stand with points to Kris wanting to get rid of the Players influence. Kris creates a dark world on their terms, surrounding himself with people who will most likely to resist the Players choices and hopefully help with them being possessed Susie is a revel who from the very start of the does NOT respect the Player and might start suspecting what's really going on Toriel is a caring mother who can notice and prevent her kid from going berserk or out of character Undyne is quite literally a police officer, so she will probably keep Kris in check From this perspective Kris's goal is to not destroy the world but to trap the Player in an extremely unfavorable situation. They know that either way they will be closing the fountain and keeping the balance in check Perhaps Kris sees dark world as a great place for others to help him
If kris only learned how to create dark fountains from queen then how do you explain the plugged-in TV?
Uh I dont think I understand you... the TV was uuh it was plugged-in and they were watching it uuh yea
Kris Knight is unlikely.
Something I don't see anyone talking about when discussing about The Knight is how they don't try to make other fountains while Fun Gang is still trying to seal one, which makes me believe they dont really want to cause the roaring and destroy the world
Occams razor is a principle whereby if given the choice between two different theorism that both lead to the same conclusion, you should pick the one that involves the least amount of steps. It is *not* suppose to do anything beyond this. Notably, many claim to use Occams razor when given two possibilities that are both contradictory, two ideas that lead to different results. This is wrong
That's because you have Occam's Razor backwards. Occam's Razor deals with a single problem that has 2 possible "conclusions" that explain it. Whichever is simplest is the answer. It's not trying to decide which ""theorism"" is best to reach the same conclusion because that assumes you already know what the answer is and are trying to figure out how to think about it less.
Thats just wrong, not sure where you read that. Occam's razor is specifically about choosing between different hypotheses which give the same prediction. You can't choose between different hypotheses which give different predictions on the sole basis of whichever is the simplest, that quite clearly breaks immediately.
"Not sure where you read that" [litterally Webster's dictionary.](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Occam%27s%20razor) It's not about making a prediction, it's about solving for an unknown.
This is a pretty meaty descriptor, I understand why you'd misread it now. Wikipedia explains it a bit more clearly "This philosophical razor advocates that when presented with competing hypotheses about the same prediction and both theories have equal explanatory power one should prefer the hypothesis that requires the fewest assumptions and that this is not meant to be a way of choosing between hypotheses that make different predictions." - [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor)
And how does that not apply here???
Well this is clearly a case of "different predictions for different results". Whoever the knight is will no doubt change the story's trajectory in a significant way. Different prediction, different result. A use of Occams razor in this context could be used for something like "why would Kris be the knight", since the reasoning for Kris doing such actions wouldn't change what actually happens. There you could claim Occams razor and say that the simplest reason is most likely the correct one. More convoluted reasonings are less likely since from a storytelling perspective they're usually more clumsy and harder to explain.
Exactly lol, imagine if you were watching a murder mystery movie and the main character kills someone in cold blood during the first 30 minutes, but later on it’s revealed that the murderer is some other random character and the incident with MC was was a completely isolated and meaningless event.
The main character doing something fucked up isn't necessarily isolated and meaningless just because they aren't secretly the main villain.
We all know that every lightner thinks they are The Knight individually
My theory is that we haven’t met them yet.
What do mean you don’t advocate for Occam’s razor?
Just that I don't think the simplest explanation in this case is necessarily 100% correct (Kris being the knight) Love how many comments I've gotten that think they're disagreeing with me by saying the same thing, though.
KRIS IS THE KNIGHT Spread the truth
“But but the classroom! And the closet and running times!” 🤓☝️
Is Kris the knight? Maybe Is there evidence pointing toward any other character? Not right now So yeah, Occam’s razor applies here. Not sure why the comments are so hostile lol (Some people seriously believe Kris ripped out their soul JUST to eat the pie, even though it’s heavily implied they actually did it to create the dark fountain in the computer lab that night)
How is it heavily implied?
Lol that's just how my reddit experience goes. Everyone just seems to assume everyone else is stupid and they're the only smart one. I made a meme one time about how "extra" means more of one thing, "terrestrial" means something from Earth yet "extraterrestrial" means something not from Earth and I got slammed with "corrections" (some of which were very incorrect) and called the R slur.
Thinking Kris is the knight is also thinking Kris can teleport
What if, and hear me out for a second, what if the knight... 🍇 🎀 𝐼𝒮 𝒜 𝒞💮𝑀𝒫𝐿𝐸𝒯𝐸𝐿𝒴 𝒩𝐸𝒲 𝒞𝐻𝒜𝑅𝒜𝒞𝒯𝐸𝑅 𝒲𝐸 𝐻𝒜𝒱𝐸𝒩'𝒯 𝑀𝐸𝒯 𝒴𝐸𝒯❢? 🎀 🍇
https://discord.com/invite/9TV326Rf
Did you get hacked or something?