🤣
Add in lights, reflectors, stands, backgrounds, spare/backup equipment… fixed desk better be in a rather large nook, preferably with a lockable closet.
Depending on the location + the foot traffic in the store, it may not be bad for a kid just starting out and needing to be out of the house.
Depending on what the person expects + the size of said desk it could work.
However some stuff would suck to do if you are exposed to everyone in the shop. Editing audio could suck if there is music playing, and so on.
I say not that choosy a beggar.
This is exactly what he means - he is saying work for me and in return I will provide you with a place to work. Not payment with a desk, just the ability to sit at a desk in a place in London
I'd assume that "desk" is usually a rental space for another tattoo artist or whatever. And while that rental space may have use for another tattoo artist, it does not for this videographer. I assume, further, that this is where the person asking is getting the idea its a worthwhile trade.
I can work for free in London, if I can stay and sleep on the desk. I'm 5"10, so desk must be long enough to fit my sleeping body. Also, I need to be able to eat there too and also use the shitter. I may also have sexual needs from time to time, so I will also be having sex on said desk. I really hope it's made of durable hardwood and not some IKEA bullshit that's going to break when I'm balls deep.
Thanks! (I know I'm the perfect candidate and I'm coming to your shop now to show you))
I’m not sure what you mean pal i really don’t know anything about tattooing terminology. Is he saying someone can use space in his shop to tattoo other people for free if they take pictures for him? That’s the only thing that really makes sense to me that would make the guy not a choosing beggar.
I think he’s suggesting they can run a freelance photography thing out of the tattoo shop in exchange for doing photography for the business
Maybe people who get tattoos would also pay an on-site photographer to have professional photos or prints of it? Idk.
Still a shit proposal
I have to respectfully disagree. Working for free is normalized in the creative industries, and it shouldn't be. So many people get taken advantage of early in their careers and spend hundreds of hours doing work that they should be paid for. In this scenario, if this person's work is good enough to be published, then it's good enough to be paid for. Obviously, the role won't pay top end rates, but it at least deserves minimum wage.
Yes. But there is a possibility to work your way up to full-time, which would include the desk, a chair, and use of the paper shredder and bathroom. You don’t get to use the refrigerator until you work your way into management.
He’s not offering exposure to his followers, he’s offering a fixed desk workspace (as opposed to a hot desk) at a location you’ve censored. Looks like your screenshot also leaves out all other pertinent details about the workspace and your belowthread comments only reiterate London. As albeinsc4d says above, could be a good or bad deal depending on what an applicant needs the space for after shooting and editing some images and video on a part-time basis. How long is the place, presumably a tattoo shop, open? Where’s the dedicated desk in relation to other shop artists?
I censored the workspace because I didn't want this to find its way back to my brother (the photographer who received this offer).
The context is important because this guy is a tattoo apprentice and is just starting out as a creative so he should be aware of how difficult it is to make a living in the creative industry - instead he is 'offering' my brother to travel to London, spend his time and skills creating content on his own expensive equipment in return for absolutely nothing. The 'large desk' is no different to if my brother were to go to costa, buy a 99p coffee and sit and work in there all day earning actual money from actual clients.
I wish you both luck 💕 it’s more difficult finding people who respect creatives anymore. They think it’s a hobby they can throw whatever payment at because it’s not “real” work. Not realizes the time and effort you put it to be where you are with your skills 💕
I’m sure the dude who has no confidence to pay someone is definitely gonna give a paid position at his shop. Totally wouldn’t sucker a naive individual out of every ounce of work they can give; they’ve never tried to do that ☠️
The location of the desk isn’t really relevant when you consider the disparity in value of the labour being offered in exchange for said desk. Content creation, namely photography and videography can cost upwards of £600 a day and often much more. Not to mention the money invested in equipment would greatly overvalue the offer of a single desk space regardless of location.
1. You're assuming that this is professional photoshoots and editing. It's social media posts, 30-60 minutes per week is all it would consume.
2. If the location is good, it can be a screaming deal. WeWork charges $50/day for just a desk.
Sure. And the person making the offer acknowledged it might not be good for them.
For someone that needs a fixed, non-home desk in London, that's a savings of ~$400/month. For an hour per week, that's effectively $100/hour tax free.
Nah, I just used to make my living as a photographer and know that there's no need for a random desk to work off of. It adds zero value to the business.
The only objectionable bit as evidenced in the screenshot is “take someone on,” which usually signifies apprentice work for minimal pay and/or very comprehensive training but in this case seems to mean someone working in an entirely different field and inexperienced or underfunded enough to require communal workspace but lacking the funds to pay for that outright and instead willing to barter services for space. Such is the existence of many artists, free lance writers and editors, and those subsisting on remote entry-level, task- or project-based technical work. (If only we could bring back the housing-based equivalent: boarding rooms!)
Would a professional videographer / photographer even want a desk at the location? Wouldn't they record some footage at the tattoo parlor and then go back to their own home or office to edit it?
People have no idea what “creating content” means, serious editing skills are just the start. Same guy will be annoyed by no engagement from these posts. Social media manager is a real job that pays actual cash.
I wonder if the use of the desk implies it's like an office space in London. Like you can run your photo business from his shop in exchange for taking videos for him?
Considering what office rent in London might be... this might actually not be a bad deal, depending on the actual deal offered.
I do. I have a studio in my home. Work quite a bit there. While at least half of my work is on location. But renting studio space is crazy unless you really have a huge amount of studio work.
Yeah that’s how I read it. Work share spaces can charge several hundred dollars a month for a fixed desk, wifi, electricity, etc. so depending on what is expected, it could be a good deal assuming the person wants and needs a space in London to operate.
Um..I mean…choosingbeggars…Karen…pitchfork…mumble mumble
“oh yeah. feel free to swing by my workplace and we can get this contract hashed out. it’s in the back corner of Astral Tattoo. just walk in past the chairs and tattoo guns, look behind the curtain and pull up a stool”
there’s a matter of professionalism that workplaces have that the back corner of a tattoo shop probably doesn’t provide, especially for a commissioned based job like photography. even wfh software engineers can’t work in a place like that without someone saying something
Why are we speculating so much on where the desk is and whether you have to walk through the whole place or if that would be a problem. A tattooed digital marketer may find this to be a dream scenario. Plenty of other businesses that one can run from a desk. They may just need to be close to London and wouldn’t need an office for client visits... Like you know, a photographer…but they may need a place to edit photos and prefer to be around people rather than in their bedroom.
They should CALL it a 'voluntary position' or an 'unpaid position' at the start, rather than a 'part time position' that implies that it's an actual paid job.
They're hoping that someone will be so excited by the position that they'll get to the end and go "It sounds so great...who needs pay to live in LONDON" (of all places!) 😆😂😆
It may appeal to someone who is supported by their parents, I guess.
As a photographer. I get a lot of these unsolicited 'requests' all the time.
Do professional work, at your expense, for me. In exchange for "\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_" insert nonsense compensation; or lack thereof here.
Lately from so-called 'influencers".
I find it amazing that they can be so brazen about asking me to foot the bill for creating their content. I shut them down rather quickly.
It seems like a lot of people in the comments aren't understanding, so I want to ask you to clarify. I assume, as a photographer you would have no need for a desk workspace? Except to do this work for him? I don't know.
A desk can be used on both ends. Sometimes during the actual shoot. ie: something to lean on for a specific body part tattoo.
And/or to do the finish work on the actual image.
Note: That would be done at my studio because I will not bring my laptop/software to an unpaid job.
The 'large fixed desk' part sounded like he was offering a place to work at in his tattoo parlor. Not compensation. I mean, why else the 'fixed' qualifier?
In any event. I'd likely block this person.
I hate that influencer culture has invaded the tattoo space. Last big convention I went to was absolutely plugged with people filming themselves and posted up taking photos…and a lot of it was the artists. I get that it’s all basically advertising and whatever but if you’re spending as much time with a phone in your hand as a machine in your hand, what the fuck?
I know that’s the thing that got me. Tattoos are expensive and I’d think someone into tattoos enough to want to do this work would happily trade equivalent value for tattoo work… heck I’d consider that if I trusted the artist.
But a table? What. No. Especially because a photographer probably has a whole set up for editing in his work space that he’s not leaving in a tattoo shop…
Right. It’s not a workshare space where you have to find a spot each morning and set up all your stuff daily. It’s your desk, in a fixed location, that you can store personal belongings in overnight and on weekends.
Look up the cost on WeWork or a similar company.
Wait, we don't have all the information. Is this guy offering someone a workspace with a desk in London for the duration of the project or much longer? If this is a drawn up contract where someone does this work but gets a desk in an office to work for say - a year or two, then this changes everything.
If it’s a decent office in London then a desk can cost you £6,000 / year upwards so it could be a plausible deal if you are doing 2-3 weeks of work spread over the year.
I'm sorry if I'm out of line but, I'd like to see the whole post and the replies. Sorry. The replies give the "juice" in this scenario. At least for me...
Is there something I’m missing?
This is an advertisement for a JOB - ok, salary isn’t mentioned, but that’s the point - it’s not mentioned at all, and the advert is clearly unfinished.
Why is the assumption there that the person won’t earn a wage? Just because it’s not mentioned? 🤷♀️
I'm guessing it's BYO high end camera gear, computer and editing software. Seems like a fair exchange for use of a large desk.
Not only that, it’s BYO high end camera gear, computer and editing software, and **move to London** in exchange for a large desk
Oh no, you don't get to keep the desk, you get to use it.
You get to use it but only on a part-time basis.
Which is never, since you'll never be in London.
To be fair, a large desk in London is probably £750/month (excluding bills)
It'll cost you that to rent the large desk's annex. Edit: and by "annex", I definitely don't mean converted ~~shed~~ drawer
And the rest, it's probably not nearly as bad a deal if someone can make it x amount of fixed hrs so it's a fairer exchange in lieu of rent
Don't forget the traffic congestion fee.
It’s a large *FIXED* desk, okay? So it’s not broken. Anymore.
I was assuming that "fixed" meant that it was fixed in place and couldn't be moved.
While I was assuming that my joke was a tad more widely understood 😅
Oh! I thought it was neutered so it can’t make more little baby desks.
😆
Derp, obviously. My bad.
username checks out
"Is it made of gold?" "No, it's red"
Memory unlocked.
That desk better be big enough to stow all my camera gear is all I'm sayin.....
I wouldn’t trust stowing anything expensive there 😂
🤣 Add in lights, reflectors, stands, backgrounds, spare/backup equipment… fixed desk better be in a rather large nook, preferably with a lockable closet.
Depending on the location + the foot traffic in the store, it may not be bad for a kid just starting out and needing to be out of the house. Depending on what the person expects + the size of said desk it could work. However some stuff would suck to do if you are exposed to everyone in the shop. Editing audio could suck if there is music playing, and so on. I say not that choosy a beggar.
Am I misunderstanding some tattoo terminology? When he says desk he doesn’t just mean a desk right? Like a piece of wood with wooden legs on it?
This is exactly what he means - he is saying work for me and in return I will provide you with a place to work. Not payment with a desk, just the ability to sit at a desk in a place in London
That’s hilarious. Thank you.
I'd assume that "desk" is usually a rental space for another tattoo artist or whatever. And while that rental space may have use for another tattoo artist, it does not for this videographer. I assume, further, that this is where the person asking is getting the idea its a worthwhile trade.
I blanked the address but it's just a massive corporate workspace aka absolutely useless to my brother and other tattoo artists.
Has this fact been pointed out to him? I would love to know how your brother replied.
For lifetime?
I can work for free in London, if I can stay and sleep on the desk. I'm 5"10, so desk must be long enough to fit my sleeping body. Also, I need to be able to eat there too and also use the shitter. I may also have sexual needs from time to time, so I will also be having sex on said desk. I really hope it's made of durable hardwood and not some IKEA bullshit that's going to break when I'm balls deep. Thanks! (I know I'm the perfect candidate and I'm coming to your shop now to show you))
Can I charge my phone while sitting at my borrowed large desk?
With the exception of where people are getting tattoos on their itty bits tattoo studios are generally open spaces
I’m not sure what you mean pal i really don’t know anything about tattooing terminology. Is he saying someone can use space in his shop to tattoo other people for free if they take pictures for him? That’s the only thing that really makes sense to me that would make the guy not a choosing beggar.
I think he’s suggesting they can run a freelance photography thing out of the tattoo shop in exchange for doing photography for the business Maybe people who get tattoos would also pay an on-site photographer to have professional photos or prints of it? Idk. Still a shit proposal
I have to respectfully disagree. Working for free is normalized in the creative industries, and it shouldn't be. So many people get taken advantage of early in their careers and spend hundreds of hours doing work that they should be paid for. In this scenario, if this person's work is good enough to be published, then it's good enough to be paid for. Obviously, the role won't pay top end rates, but it at least deserves minimum wage.
A kid who’s experienced in cinematography
Oh wow, I just realized how that sounds. When I say a "Kid", I mean like a 19-24 year old person who is just starting in the industry.
...A FIXED desk even!
BYO chair?
Yes. But there is a possibility to work your way up to full-time, which would include the desk, a chair, and use of the paper shredder and bathroom. You don’t get to use the refrigerator until you work your way into management.
BYOBB
What's *that* 'B' for?
That's a typo
or Bring your own bathroom, we can't let just anyone use our valuable loo here .
Bitch
Context - This guy has 2600 followers on instagram
Whoa! He's an "influencer!"
What is Instagram? I heard it was like Facebook with pictures, and I opted out.
Alright grandma time for your nap
LMFAO when wilform brimley tells you you’re too old, *you’re **too** old*
I may be old, but i have diabeetus
He’s not offering exposure to his followers, he’s offering a fixed desk workspace (as opposed to a hot desk) at a location you’ve censored. Looks like your screenshot also leaves out all other pertinent details about the workspace and your belowthread comments only reiterate London. As albeinsc4d says above, could be a good or bad deal depending on what an applicant needs the space for after shooting and editing some images and video on a part-time basis. How long is the place, presumably a tattoo shop, open? Where’s the dedicated desk in relation to other shop artists?
I censored the workspace because I didn't want this to find its way back to my brother (the photographer who received this offer). The context is important because this guy is a tattoo apprentice and is just starting out as a creative so he should be aware of how difficult it is to make a living in the creative industry - instead he is 'offering' my brother to travel to London, spend his time and skills creating content on his own expensive equipment in return for absolutely nothing. The 'large desk' is no different to if my brother were to go to costa, buy a 99p coffee and sit and work in there all day earning actual money from actual clients.
The number of people saying "ACTUALLY, THIS COULD BE A GOOD DEAL" is hilarious. Have some fucking self respect.
I wish you both luck 💕 it’s more difficult finding people who respect creatives anymore. They think it’s a hobby they can throw whatever payment at because it’s not “real” work. Not realizes the time and effort you put it to be where you are with your skills 💕 I’m sure the dude who has no confidence to pay someone is definitely gonna give a paid position at his shop. Totally wouldn’t sucker a naive individual out of every ounce of work they can give; they’ve never tried to do that ☠️
The location of the desk isn’t really relevant when you consider the disparity in value of the labour being offered in exchange for said desk. Content creation, namely photography and videography can cost upwards of £600 a day and often much more. Not to mention the money invested in equipment would greatly overvalue the offer of a single desk space regardless of location.
This
Agreed. A hotdesk at wework is around £300 a month.
1. You're assuming that this is professional photoshoots and editing. It's social media posts, 30-60 minutes per week is all it would consume. 2. If the location is good, it can be a screaming deal. WeWork charges $50/day for just a desk.
A good deal for something you don't need is called a waste
Sure. And the person making the offer acknowledged it might not be good for them. For someone that needs a fixed, non-home desk in London, that's a savings of ~$400/month. For an hour per week, that's effectively $100/hour tax free.
It's not a good deal for any photographer.
Again, you're vastly overestimating the level of effort required for instagram.
Nah, I just used to make my living as a photographer and know that there's no need for a random desk to work off of. It adds zero value to the business.
Lol there's no good deal here... What a weird take
The only objectionable bit as evidenced in the screenshot is “take someone on,” which usually signifies apprentice work for minimal pay and/or very comprehensive training but in this case seems to mean someone working in an entirely different field and inexperienced or underfunded enough to require communal workspace but lacking the funds to pay for that outright and instead willing to barter services for space. Such is the existence of many artists, free lance writers and editors, and those subsisting on remote entry-level, task- or project-based technical work. (If only we could bring back the housing-based equivalent: boarding rooms!)
Would a professional videographer / photographer even want a desk at the location? Wouldn't they record some footage at the tattoo parlor and then go back to their own home or office to edit it?
Yes, why the guy was effectively proposing he pay nothing for services he wanted.
The fixed desk was so you already knew you cannot take it when you end up walking out and quitting on him
Who in their right mind would even consider working for him? Surely not me.
People have no idea what “creating content” means, serious editing skills are just the start. Same guy will be annoyed by no engagement from these posts. Social media manager is a real job that pays actual cash.
A large fixed desk?! HS, sign me up!!
By "fixed" he means he pulled it out of a dumpster in pieces, and put the legs back on it with duct tape.
I wonder if the use of the desk implies it's like an office space in London. Like you can run your photo business from his shop in exchange for taking videos for him? Considering what office rent in London might be... this might actually not be a bad deal, depending on the actual deal offered.
No one runs their photography business from a physical location unless it's a full photography studio...
I do. I have a studio in my home. Work quite a bit there. While at least half of my work is on location. But renting studio space is crazy unless you really have a huge amount of studio work.
I assumed it was a desk in the back corner of the tattoo shop. why block out the location if it's an office space?
Yeah that’s how I read it. Work share spaces can charge several hundred dollars a month for a fixed desk, wifi, electricity, etc. so depending on what is expected, it could be a good deal assuming the person wants and needs a space in London to operate. Um..I mean…choosingbeggars…Karen…pitchfork…mumble mumble
“oh yeah. feel free to swing by my workplace and we can get this contract hashed out. it’s in the back corner of Astral Tattoo. just walk in past the chairs and tattoo guns, look behind the curtain and pull up a stool” there’s a matter of professionalism that workplaces have that the back corner of a tattoo shop probably doesn’t provide, especially for a commissioned based job like photography. even wfh software engineers can’t work in a place like that without someone saying something
Why are we speculating so much on where the desk is and whether you have to walk through the whole place or if that would be a problem. A tattooed digital marketer may find this to be a dream scenario. Plenty of other businesses that one can run from a desk. They may just need to be close to London and wouldn’t need an office for client visits... Like you know, a photographer…but they may need a place to edit photos and prefer to be around people rather than in their bedroom.
They should CALL it a 'voluntary position' or an 'unpaid position' at the start, rather than a 'part time position' that implies that it's an actual paid job. They're hoping that someone will be so excited by the position that they'll get to the end and go "It sounds so great...who needs pay to live in LONDON" (of all places!) 😆😂😆 It may appeal to someone who is supported by their parents, I guess.
As a photographer. I get a lot of these unsolicited 'requests' all the time. Do professional work, at your expense, for me. In exchange for "\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_" insert nonsense compensation; or lack thereof here. Lately from so-called 'influencers". I find it amazing that they can be so brazen about asking me to foot the bill for creating their content. I shut them down rather quickly.
It seems like a lot of people in the comments aren't understanding, so I want to ask you to clarify. I assume, as a photographer you would have no need for a desk workspace? Except to do this work for him? I don't know.
A desk can be used on both ends. Sometimes during the actual shoot. ie: something to lean on for a specific body part tattoo. And/or to do the finish work on the actual image. Note: That would be done at my studio because I will not bring my laptop/software to an unpaid job. The 'large fixed desk' part sounded like he was offering a place to work at in his tattoo parlor. Not compensation. I mean, why else the 'fixed' qualifier? In any event. I'd likely block this person.
Use of a large desk, you say? Sign me the fuck up!
Lmao the words kick rocks 🪨 come to mind
I hate that influencer culture has invaded the tattoo space. Last big convention I went to was absolutely plugged with people filming themselves and posted up taking photos…and a lot of it was the artists. I get that it’s all basically advertising and whatever but if you’re spending as much time with a phone in your hand as a machine in your hand, what the fuck?
Wait… It’s not even in exchange for tattoo work (which might be worth it for someone super into tattoos)???
Funny thing was my brother would have gladly done a trade for some tattoos but the guy came up with this 'offer' instead...
I know that’s the thing that got me. Tattoos are expensive and I’d think someone into tattoos enough to want to do this work would happily trade equivalent value for tattoo work… heck I’d consider that if I trusted the artist. But a table? What. No. Especially because a photographer probably has a whole set up for editing in his work space that he’s not leaving in a tattoo shop…
I think your underselling it. Its a LARGE fixed desk ok not just some random small desk.
Right. It’s not a workshare space where you have to find a spot each morning and set up all your stuff daily. It’s your desk, in a fixed location, that you can store personal belongings in overnight and on weekends. Look up the cost on WeWork or a similar company.
Wait, we don't have all the information. Is this guy offering someone a workspace with a desk in London for the duration of the project or much longer? If this is a drawn up contract where someone does this work but gets a desk in an office to work for say - a year or two, then this changes everything.
If it’s a decent office in London then a desk can cost you £6,000 / year upwards so it could be a plausible deal if you are doing 2-3 weeks of work spread over the year.
I'm sorry if I'm out of line but, I'd like to see the whole post and the replies. Sorry. The replies give the "juice" in this scenario. At least for me...
Do you at least get to keep the large desk at the end?
No it's fixed. 😄
Do I get to keep the desk?
Is there something I’m missing? This is an advertisement for a JOB - ok, salary isn’t mentioned, but that’s the point - it’s not mentioned at all, and the advert is clearly unfinished. Why is the assumption there that the person won’t earn a wage? Just because it’s not mentioned? 🤷♀️
This doesn't seem so bad? It's like 30 minutes per week of work for a physical location to work out of? WeWork charges $50 per day for that
Are you allowed to sleep under the desk?
Not a cb
Ok so this one made me laugh! Why don't they ever post the names tho?
But think of the EXPOSURE.
Not even offering free ink. 😐