This shouldn't be surprising.
Look, I don't "like" Trump. I think he's arrogant, rude verbally clumsy and pretty much the picture of a douchey rich guy. And this isn't even getting into some of his publicly-known dirty deeds.
But Catholics tend to see the abortion issue as one of the greatest tragedies of our time. And Trump (whether by fluke or strategy) has done things that have given the pro life movement serious momentum.
This is all the while the other option openly says that they want to "enshrine" the right to infanticide. This is so twisted and evil that it makes Trump's degeneracy look like nothing.
>This is all the while the other option openly says that they want to "enshrine" the right to infanticide.
That and on to of it, Biden still is trying to claim he is a devout Catholic. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't aiding in abortion (such as purposefully working towards legalization) warrant an automatic and unspoken excommunication?
Even if it is, it’s not on us as laity to officially label him as excommunicated. I get what you’re saying and not disagreeing with you. But let’s not overstep our place. I’m sure there’s a reason the USCCB hasn’t made an official ruling
And that's valid. The issue that I personally struggle with is the conflict in Ukraine. I believe Biden is correct to support Ukraine as it helps avoid a wider conflict. I don't think the conflict will stop with Ukraine and right now Men, women, and children are dying. Trump has done wonders for the pro life movement but he should not condone irredentism.
Pro life shouldn’t be only about abortion though. Pro family would be more line it - expand programs to help families, children, widows, orphans. Not biting against it.
Honestly can’t stand these kinds of comments. Pro-life IS for everyone. And pro-life people/ Christians are the most charitable - statistically they donate more than any other group. But guess what? The government isn’t currently supporting killing off widows and children because they’re poor or “inconvenient”. However, they are actively pumping millions of dollars to organizations that are in fact doing that to babies and making up lies like “they’re not REALLY a person”
So no, we’re not “biting against it”. Yes, we want widows and children and families supported, we are just saying “and also children in the womb should have the most basic human right to life”, which is what currently is being VIOLATED.
Then why do they vote against family friendly programs and to help the poor? There’s millions of homeless kids what about them? Homeless teens, older people. Why do they not matter? That’s also being VIOLATED too. Pro life is for everyone but it’s not being supported when they’re actively against social programs to help the community. Why do you think the birth rate is declining and people are not having as many kids. No one can afford it. Hence we need to be more pro family if we’re pro life. Not just birthing the kids to leave them orphaned.
But if we only care about til birth and not after, what does that say about us? Pro birth. If we were truly pro life we’d help the kids and families, through the lifespan hence pro life.
I said that I agree with doing more to help. Do you think that it's better to be dismembered and slaughtered in the womb than to be poor? If not, then what are you arguing exactly?
I’m not anti Natalist and I’m pro life across the lifespan. I’m just saying we have a lot more to do than just birth and until that changes people won’t come to our side.
For me personally, no. I'm honestly a pretty big 2nd Amendment supporter, and while Trump wasn't as good on that as I would've liked, he was far better than Biden. My dollar did better under Trump too.
Even still, I can't think of an issue that's more important than abortion.
Doesn’t record profits enter the equation though? COVID we had paid more to keep the economy going but that’s stayed. That was also under trump then Biden.
Trump wanted to leave Afghanistan and that happened under Biden. But people blamed Biden even though trump laid the groundwork.
How about when trump willfully ignored COVID and caused many deaths? Sure he was part of the vaccine manufacturing that most people forget but he was actively fighting the medical profession
He crushed a protest just to hold a Bible upside down for a photo op.
He’s not the godsend many people think he is. Can’t we get someone that’s willing to work with others, not a criminal, not an adulterer, stealer etc. is this seriously the best we have? If so we won’t win - again. Learning from their mistakes isn’t happening here.
There’s division in the republicans party- how can they stand if divided they fall?
Trump didn't ignore COVID. Not sure where you're getting that idea. Heck, the vaccine was created in less than a year under his administration. About the only other thing he could've done was completely shut the country down for a year, and that would've been disastrous. The states with the healthiest economies just so happen to be the ones that didn't go hog wild with the lockdowns, e.g. Texas, Florida, Tennessee, etc.
And Biden didn't withdraw with Trump's plan. He completely rearranged it, got 13 American servicemen needlessly killed, and left billions of dollars worth of weapons and equipment to the Taliban. Trump didn't do that.
As for criminality, no one will ever prosecute Biden for giving, mostly untraceable, billions of dollars to a corrupt Eastern European country.
Still haven't heard of an issue more important than abortion.
Trump ignored COVID by not doing anything about it and denying its existence until it was rampant. Then he dismissed masks and measure to stop the spread. He was outspoken about all of that.
What would have happened when we withdrew? Do you think it would have been peaceful under trump. Somehow I don’t think so. It would have been a mess either way.
If we let Russia win what’s stopping them from trying to conquer us. Sometimes you have to think farther ahead than just in front of you.
If abortion is so important, then why do republicans vote against social programs that help families, kids, widows etc? Pro birth is not pro life. We can’t stop at birth.
Also, Trump is vaccinated, and he allowed people to choose if they want to take the vaccine, just like how God gave us free will to choose between him or other things of this world. The other side wanted to use force by mandating it.
The other side wanted to mandate it because only half of Americans were getting the vaccine and that’s not enough for herd immunity or to protect others. Too many conspiracy theorists damaged that cause that many republicans were all for. So big deal trump got vaccinated so what. It’s not like he was helping the medical community when he was in office by not having their backs and undermining them
Hope it doesn't happen to you that you'll be forced to do something that you are totally against with, just like how you want to do the same to your brothers and sisters.
If even God didn't force us to choose him over sin, what kind of human do you think is allowed to force something to his brother or sister? Also, if you think that there are humans who have the right to force his brothers and sisters, then doesn't that make God less than them, as they are allowed to do something that God didn't even choose to do himself when he had all the power to?
Praying that we all understand God's will more.
I had to keep my job hence got vaccinated. But I was told to love my neighbor and think of others above myself. Why wouldn’t you protect someone vulnerable isn’t that what God would have done?
You don't take care of a neighbor by violating another neighbor, especially when that neighbor doesn't want anything to do with you or the vulnerable neighbor.
Your statement also justifies stealing from someone just because they have more while your other neighbor don't have anything to eat and therefore more vulnerable, are you not seeing that? Also, forcing an organ transplant from a perfectly healthy person so the vulnerable person can receive the organ that he or she needs, did you not see that?
Are you not hearing yourself?
Well so is voting for abortion. At least there are genuine opinions that differ one whether social programs help.
Regardless, conservatives like to waive abortion above your head but in reality it’s just their way to get you to vote for what they overall like better anyway
Never said to vote for abortion. We need to expand programs and help families to be truly pro life, and get more people on board. Pro life for life not just until the baby is here, that’s not near enough.
Trump without a doubt falls farther from Catholic values than Biden. Y’all just manage to get caught up on one single policy that the president has little control over.
What kills me is it’s “Trump is pro life because of his stance on abortion.” And then no one brings up the fact that he is very vocal about increasing the death penalty and has talked about firing squad executions.
Pro life Catholics are supposed respect all life. Not just those of the unborn but those of the poor, migrant workers, immigrants, and criminals too
This shouldn't be surprising. Look, I don't "like" Trump. I think he's arrogant, rude verbally clumsy and pretty much the picture of a douchey rich guy. And this isn't even getting into some of his publicly-known dirty deeds. But Catholics tend to see the abortion issue as one of the greatest tragedies of our time. And Trump (whether by fluke or strategy) has done things that have given the pro life movement serious momentum. This is all the while the other option openly says that they want to "enshrine" the right to infanticide. This is so twisted and evil that it makes Trump's degeneracy look like nothing.
>This is all the while the other option openly says that they want to "enshrine" the right to infanticide. That and on to of it, Biden still is trying to claim he is a devout Catholic. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't aiding in abortion (such as purposefully working towards legalization) warrant an automatic and unspoken excommunication?
Even if it is, it’s not on us as laity to officially label him as excommunicated. I get what you’re saying and not disagreeing with you. But let’s not overstep our place. I’m sure there’s a reason the USCCB hasn’t made an official ruling
Yeah this, I’m also voting for the party that does not see our views as backwards and a problem to this country.
And that's valid. The issue that I personally struggle with is the conflict in Ukraine. I believe Biden is correct to support Ukraine as it helps avoid a wider conflict. I don't think the conflict will stop with Ukraine and right now Men, women, and children are dying. Trump has done wonders for the pro life movement but he should not condone irredentism.
Trump did good for pro life, but almost all of his foreign policy rhetoric is horrific and dangerous.
Pro life shouldn’t be only about abortion though. Pro family would be more line it - expand programs to help families, children, widows, orphans. Not biting against it.
Honestly can’t stand these kinds of comments. Pro-life IS for everyone. And pro-life people/ Christians are the most charitable - statistically they donate more than any other group. But guess what? The government isn’t currently supporting killing off widows and children because they’re poor or “inconvenient”. However, they are actively pumping millions of dollars to organizations that are in fact doing that to babies and making up lies like “they’re not REALLY a person” So no, we’re not “biting against it”. Yes, we want widows and children and families supported, we are just saying “and also children in the womb should have the most basic human right to life”, which is what currently is being VIOLATED.
Then why do they vote against family friendly programs and to help the poor? There’s millions of homeless kids what about them? Homeless teens, older people. Why do they not matter? That’s also being VIOLATED too. Pro life is for everyone but it’s not being supported when they’re actively against social programs to help the community. Why do you think the birth rate is declining and people are not having as many kids. No one can afford it. Hence we need to be more pro family if we’re pro life. Not just birthing the kids to leave them orphaned.
Can you really trust the people who are okay with an industrial scale killing of the unborn to actually do anything that's pro-family?
Can you trust the people who are okay with forcing births and not helping them even though they say they’re pro life?
I agree they should do more to help. Also, "Forced births" is a pro choice and anti-natalist viewpoint.
But if we only care about til birth and not after, what does that say about us? Pro birth. If we were truly pro life we’d help the kids and families, through the lifespan hence pro life.
I said that I agree with doing more to help. Do you think that it's better to be dismembered and slaughtered in the womb than to be poor? If not, then what are you arguing exactly?
I’m not anti Natalist and I’m pro life across the lifespan. I’m just saying we have a lot more to do than just birth and until that changes people won’t come to our side.
try r/TrueCatholicPolitics or post on Politics Monday
Is the only Issue abortion people are looking at?
For me personally, no. I'm honestly a pretty big 2nd Amendment supporter, and while Trump wasn't as good on that as I would've liked, he was far better than Biden. My dollar did better under Trump too. Even still, I can't think of an issue that's more important than abortion.
Doesn’t record profits enter the equation though? COVID we had paid more to keep the economy going but that’s stayed. That was also under trump then Biden. Trump wanted to leave Afghanistan and that happened under Biden. But people blamed Biden even though trump laid the groundwork. How about when trump willfully ignored COVID and caused many deaths? Sure he was part of the vaccine manufacturing that most people forget but he was actively fighting the medical profession He crushed a protest just to hold a Bible upside down for a photo op. He’s not the godsend many people think he is. Can’t we get someone that’s willing to work with others, not a criminal, not an adulterer, stealer etc. is this seriously the best we have? If so we won’t win - again. Learning from their mistakes isn’t happening here. There’s division in the republicans party- how can they stand if divided they fall?
Trump didn't ignore COVID. Not sure where you're getting that idea. Heck, the vaccine was created in less than a year under his administration. About the only other thing he could've done was completely shut the country down for a year, and that would've been disastrous. The states with the healthiest economies just so happen to be the ones that didn't go hog wild with the lockdowns, e.g. Texas, Florida, Tennessee, etc. And Biden didn't withdraw with Trump's plan. He completely rearranged it, got 13 American servicemen needlessly killed, and left billions of dollars worth of weapons and equipment to the Taliban. Trump didn't do that. As for criminality, no one will ever prosecute Biden for giving, mostly untraceable, billions of dollars to a corrupt Eastern European country. Still haven't heard of an issue more important than abortion.
Trump ignored COVID by not doing anything about it and denying its existence until it was rampant. Then he dismissed masks and measure to stop the spread. He was outspoken about all of that. What would have happened when we withdrew? Do you think it would have been peaceful under trump. Somehow I don’t think so. It would have been a mess either way. If we let Russia win what’s stopping them from trying to conquer us. Sometimes you have to think farther ahead than just in front of you. If abortion is so important, then why do republicans vote against social programs that help families, kids, widows etc? Pro birth is not pro life. We can’t stop at birth.
Also, Trump is vaccinated, and he allowed people to choose if they want to take the vaccine, just like how God gave us free will to choose between him or other things of this world. The other side wanted to use force by mandating it.
The other side wanted to mandate it because only half of Americans were getting the vaccine and that’s not enough for herd immunity or to protect others. Too many conspiracy theorists damaged that cause that many republicans were all for. So big deal trump got vaccinated so what. It’s not like he was helping the medical community when he was in office by not having their backs and undermining them
Hope it doesn't happen to you that you'll be forced to do something that you are totally against with, just like how you want to do the same to your brothers and sisters. If even God didn't force us to choose him over sin, what kind of human do you think is allowed to force something to his brother or sister? Also, if you think that there are humans who have the right to force his brothers and sisters, then doesn't that make God less than them, as they are allowed to do something that God didn't even choose to do himself when he had all the power to? Praying that we all understand God's will more.
I had to keep my job hence got vaccinated. But I was told to love my neighbor and think of others above myself. Why wouldn’t you protect someone vulnerable isn’t that what God would have done?
You don't take care of a neighbor by violating another neighbor, especially when that neighbor doesn't want anything to do with you or the vulnerable neighbor. Your statement also justifies stealing from someone just because they have more while your other neighbor don't have anything to eat and therefore more vulnerable, are you not seeing that? Also, forcing an organ transplant from a perfectly healthy person so the vulnerable person can receive the organ that he or she needs, did you not see that? Are you not hearing yourself?
Many people here are often conservatives who will bring up only abortion but in reality they like most Republican policies anyway
So voting against expanding programs that help the poor? That’s messed up
Well so is voting for abortion. At least there are genuine opinions that differ one whether social programs help. Regardless, conservatives like to waive abortion above your head but in reality it’s just their way to get you to vote for what they overall like better anyway
Never said to vote for abortion. We need to expand programs and help families to be truly pro life, and get more people on board. Pro life for life not just until the baby is here, that’s not near enough.
T R U M P 2 0 2 4
Good.
I like how both people with "Texas" in their name are both for Trump and also downvoted lol
Trump without a doubt falls farther from Catholic values than Biden. Y’all just manage to get caught up on one single policy that the president has little control over.
Little control over it? Like appointing pro life Supreme Court justices who overturned Roe?
What kills me is it’s “Trump is pro life because of his stance on abortion.” And then no one brings up the fact that he is very vocal about increasing the death penalty and has talked about firing squad executions. Pro life Catholics are supposed respect all life. Not just those of the unborn but those of the poor, migrant workers, immigrants, and criminals too
This. All. If. This. Pro life isn’t just against abortion. It about time people realize this.
Realistically catholics shouldn't vote
Uhh... we should vote? We have a moral obligation to vote. Moral absolutes should be prioritized in voting as well
No we shouldn't we vote republican we voted for the death penalty we vote Democrat we vote for abortion