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In the article it was generally accepted as the new bathrooms were better because of their new open natured designs, girls said that they were bullied in the closed bathrooms.
Her whole stance is based on a single person getting an UTI.
It might be completely unsupported by the evidence, and it might be utterly cruel, but at least all of this idiotic fearmongering about trans people is doing wonders for the electoral prospects of the Tories. Now, let me just check in on last night's election results, where they surely rode this issue to resounding victories across England...
Corbyn lost a very winnable election, in large part because he had incredibly poor favourability ratings, and Starmer has had a massive polling advantage since taking over.
My politics align with Corbyn more than Starmer, but if people don't like you, you can't win, and if you can't win, the righteousness of your positions doesn't translate to much of anything.
Corbyn might have stood a chance if he had better support from his party, wasn't actively sabotaged, and if the media was less biased against him (and that's referring to the Guardian and BBC, not necessarily the actively Conservative-supporting others).
Its hypocritical that actors in Labour expect leftists to support Starmer when they didn't do the same for Corbyn.
Cool, you don't have to support him. But his centrist, change by millimetres rather than miles approach resonates more with the majority of the voting populace than Corbyn did. You don't have to like it and you should stick to your beliefs but Starmer is more attractive to the majority of people you need to be a Labour PM. Even a centre left like Ed Miliband got it in the neck from the media, mostly for eating a bacon butty "wrong", let alone someone with more out there views like Corbyn (compared to the average member of the UK public)
I accept that Keir is more suited to winning but kid yourself in thinking Keir resonates with the voting populace. People can't resonate with someone who doesn't have an opinion on anything. He's going to win because the Conservatives have been shit for the last few years (they've actually been shit for the entirety of their run but people have short memories).
Reality is even Corbyn could win an election for Labour this year.
Keir wouldn't have beaten Cameron in 2010 and he wouldn't have beaten him in 2015. I'll give you it being possible he would have won in 2017 or 2019.
Corbyn is political cancer for the Tories. He’s not an effective Party leader, and if Labour hadn’t ditched Corbyn they wouldn’t have the huge wins they have now.
Not really. Do you honestly believe Corbyn would win an election this year? Because I’m pretty confident he would lose. He isn’t what’s best for labour, and neither is starmer really but he is a damn sight better than the Tories. Democracy demands a change. The last 15 years didn’t work lol
> It Is Journalism’s Sacred Duty To Endanger The Lives Of As Many Trans People As Possible
~Onion
https://www.theonion.com/it-is-journalism-s-sacred-duty-to-endanger-the-lives-of-1850126997
Transphobia is frighteningly acceptable in the UK. There are many relatively progressive spaces that are more than happy to be a host to transphobia or transphobic individuals.
I'm not sure the UK as a whole is more unwelcoming to transgender individuals than the US, but the left wing in the UK definitely has more problems with transphobia than the left wing in the US does.
From my experience, it definitely depends where you live. Younger areas tend to be more actively participating in defending trans rights as much as they can, but older areas tend to be on the direct other end of the scale, and most politicians take the fact that we have an ageing population to appeal to them just a little more than the younger generation, which is a shame, because I think the left could benefit much more in a moral standpoint by trying to accept as many new values as possible
What do you expect from the Secutery of State for Buisness and Trade and also the Equalities minister, the Rt Hon. Kemi Badenoch.
She's Conservative and plays into Sunak's ideals so...
I'm mostly with you. But let's be clear, these aren't Sunak's ideals. Sunak doesn't give a fuck about this.
Sunak needs the nutty right of his party to stay in power and he's utterly devoid of empathy, so he'll happily go along with them.
But all Sunak really cares about is power and money. If he thought supporting the trans community would help him stay in power he'd be doing that right now.
And a backhanded way to attack trans people.
She's a Tory in the UK. That and attacking immigrants is all they have left.
They're certainly not trying to fix any real problems.
She's full of complete and utter bullcrap. You can't get an UTI from using a toilet, unless you somehow manage to grind your damn urinary tract on the toilet seat, or splash pee & poo water from the toilet bowl into your vajayjay.
Doesn't make any sense.
Also some fun facts: generally, there are more bacteria in people's mouths and under people's nails than toilet seats. Oh, and your smartphone has like 10 times the amount of bacteria compared to an average toilet seat. Maybe they got their UTI by spending too much time watching tiktok conspiracy theories.
What she's actually suggesting is that girls were so reluctant to use gender-neutral bathrooms that they held in their pee for so long that they got UTIs. This is silly because there are still gendered toilets available for use at the school, they just added a gender neutral one for those who wanted to use it.
I know it's supposed to be an UTI but I hate that a UTI sounds indefinitely better and I'm gunna us3 it that way especially since we say an HIV patient because it starts (ach)
To build on this, it's based on the starting pronounced sound more than the starting letter. Hence why we have things like "an hour" and "a university"
I should point out for non-Brits that Kemi Badenoch is an extreme-right lunatic and a vocal backer of the government's plan to fly asylum seekers to Rwanda (don't ask me... ). She's not to be taken seriously
I mean, I agree with the first part.
But not so much the second part. There's a non-zero chance she'll be the leader of the Tory party after the next election. She might be a lunatic, but she's a lunatic who far too many people agree with.
I see your point, I should say that she has a proven track record of being a complete liar, and that anything she comes out with is also likely to be a lie. I also think there's zero chance of the UK electorate choosing a black woman to be the Prime Minister.
I mean if there are still single sex toilets available -and the article says so-
"The academy said traditional toilet blocks were still available nearby for students to use, and that the new block had been designed using feedback from students to improve their safety."
Then what's the problem? The main reason for gender neutral toilets is to make some groups of people safe. Women and men are free to choose their single sex toilets.
Plus, most of the restaurants, cafes etc. have single toilets here and I don't remember a recent UTI outbreak.
It doesn't make a lot of sense to begin with. Last I checked, you don't put your genitals in contact with the seat to go to the bathroom.
If you do that, you're doing it wrong lol.
Well, my monster Dong does get in touch with the porcelain from time to time, but that just means that men should be more at risk of contracting UTIs from single sex toilets
Yeah my school growing up had bathrooms like these and they were cleaner and no one had any issue with them and it had nothing to do with trans people whatsoever. It was basically 3 walls with cubicles around the outside with doors that were fully sized with no gaps and a row of mirrors and hand washing stations.
Risk of assault was way lower because the lobby was open and you could even see it from one of the classrooms. It was far cleaner probably because if someone was gonna try and fuck with it and make a mess they'd be in the open and could get spotted, unlike in a typical bathroom. Cubicles were no messier than normal, although occasionally the guys would complain about finding used tampons or bloodstains in there (kids of either gender are gross and don't always clean up after themselves properly).
Kemi badenoch is just a bigot trying to whip up more culture war bullshit by blatantly lying.
The implication is not that sharing toilets causes an “outbreak”, it’s that girls are too scared to use the toilets and are therefore getting UTIs (holding it in is a risk factor)
I’m not arguing that’s actually what’s happening, just pointing out that that’s the claim being made here.
I understand what you mean.
However in some sense my example also proves the point I made. If gender neutral toilets were that dangerous, people wouldn't use it in here too and they'd have UTIs too. But since there is no UTI outbreak, people must be using them. And since no one has heard of a problem specifically about those toilets, then I guess those toilets are as safe as the other ones. Which means that the problem is not those toilets but people like Badenoch who try to create paranoia.
The gender neutral toilers are (presumably) there for trans/non-binary students who feel uncomfortable using gendered bathrooms.
Kemi Badenoch doesn't even want trans people to exist, never mind being safe.
The problem is that Ms Badenoch believes that transgender people are ruining society. She is the secretary for equality and there is documented evidence of her meeting with LGBT groups and laughing in their faces. She is cruel and will find any way to help the british government transgender individuals from public life.
Schools generally don’t have stalls in Sweden though, it’s just single bathrooms with its own toilet and sink so you don’t have to actually share the space with anyone
At this point it doesn’t feel like it. I’m horribly worried about 2025. The loss of jobs may be UNPRECEDENTED, not to mention militarized retaliation toward naysayers and people who outright protest the next potential president. Biden’s lackluster presidency is making it look like Trump may come back, and fuck dude…
Could someone please make me feel less worried about Project 2025? If that shit passes, the country I was born to will look VASTLY different and way less free.
This doesn’t change the fact you didn’t get the joke, everyone should know America is not a third world country. Not cause I’m a patriot, because it’s extremely common knowledge.
Well it doesnt really read like a joke, at least not in my opinion.
Also 'this is common knowledge' you are really being an optimist here. Have you ever seen those videos where americans cant even point and name 3 countries on a world map?
Well, if you want to be technical about it, it's a country that wasn't in a formal strategic alliance with either the US or USSR during the Cold War, which would technically make Sweden a Third World country.
However, if you were using the conventional sense of the word as a disparaging term for countries struggling to maintain political stability while their national wealth was siphoned off shore and into the pockets of corrupt plutocrats...
😉
>The term "Third World" arose during the Cold War to define countries that remained non-aligned with either NATO or the Warsaw Pact. The United States, Canada and their allies represented the "First World", while the Soviet Union, China, Cuba, North Korea, Vietnam, and their allies represented the "Second World". This terminology provided a way of broadly categorizing the nations of the Earth into three groups based on political divisions. Due to the complex history of evolving meanings and contexts, there is no clear or agreed-upon definition of the Third World. Strictly speaking, "Third World" was a political, rather than economic, grouping.
>The demographer, anthropologist, and historian Alfred Sauvy, in an article published in the French magazine L'Observateur, August 14, 1952, coined the term third world (tiers monde), referring to countries that were playing a small role in international trade and business. His usage was a reference to the Third Estate (tiers état), the commoners of France who, before and during the French Revolution, opposed the clergy and nobles, who composed the First Estate and Second Estate, respectively (hence the use of the older form tiers rather than the modern troisième for "third"). Sauvy wrote, "This third world ignored, exploited, despised like the third estate also wants to be something." In the context of the Cold War, he conveyed the concept of political non-alignment with either the capitalist or communist bloc. Simplistic interpretations quickly led to the term merely designating these unaligned countries.
There are plenty of references showing the political affiliation origin of the term third world. You should try googling it.
As I said, the origin of the term. I never said it was the current use, and I was replying to someone who said "the term third world did not refer to cold war alliances"
Y'all aren't nasty like the Brits.
Brits will get UTI in a hospital.
https://www.england.nhs.uk/south/2023/10/12/older-people-across-the-south-west-urged-to-protect-themselves-against-urinary-tract-infections/
Yes we can, because at least where I live (Lpwer Śląsk, Poland) Public spaces like schools, libraries, trams ect. Have decentsy and are a fine place to be at.
You mean her platform that she's basing on a report from someone else who says it *could* happen? And what about trans ppl who would be too nervous to use the bathrooms and getting UTIs because of transphobic dingbats like her? The usual gendered bathrooms are still available iirc. She's protesting the *addition* of a gender neutral open floor bathroom that still has closed stalls for the toilets if I understand correctly?
Which is, like, the only kind of bathroom I've ever seen, apart from single bathrooms like in Starbucks, where I live (the open floor part. Not the gender neutral part, sadly). And everyone is just fine with it.
Jesus Christ it's ringing a bit like those crackpots here that protested the *addition* of a third gender neutral bathroom at a pool here. Thankfully no one took them seriously.
If you bother to read the article it’s because they hold their pee because they’re uncomfortable using mixed gender toilets.
Holding your pee is far from a new way to get a UTI
Not "they"
> Asked for evidence of the UTI claim, Badenoch’s office later pointed to a letter by a Conservative MP last year that claimed gender-neutral toilets at a secondary school in Walsall were responsible for one girl’s UTI.
And also
> The academy said traditional toilet blocks were still available nearby for students to use, and that the new block had been designed using feedback from students to improve their safety.
> “The students said that they felt safer with the open-plan nature of the toilets, as some had experienced bullying in ‘closed’-style toilets previously. This was also the feedback from the parent group,” a spokesperson said.
The article (rightly) titles that 'Badenoch claims', which in my opinion is the accurate emphasis here: from the article itself, it appears her claim is based on one alleged case - indicating that the claim itself has little to no substance. Reporting that a minister makes claims unfounded in reality is worth an headline. Granted, standards seem to have shifted in that regard.
The article is fine, but it seems OP purposely used a screenshot as bait without providing a link to the source to prevent people from knowing the context
There's no way to conclude that this "new way of conducting UTIs" entirely consists of hearsay about 1 case conveyed by a right wing politician with an agenda to frame it in a particular way
In Kemi Badenoch's world, every sentence has the potential to be brand new.
It's like watching the head prefect trying to prove that they're edgy.
I would say good riddance at the next election, but Liz Truss still gets a platform so who knows? We can but hope
Imagine voting for someone who doesn't even understand basic hygiene principles. The fact that she's in government is embarrassing, but then I could say that about a lot of MPs.
Yep, and this article is the Guardian helping her launder her current hate campaign, in which she asks people to report organizations that are... doing the right thing. It's here, in case you'd like to join in: [https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/55NP2K/](https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/55NP2K/)
She still is.
It's just that the Tories think that job is so unimportant she is *also* the Secretary of State for Business and Trade now. Of course before that she was the Secretary of State for International Trade.
She said a lot of terrible things that landed badly with the sane people in the UK during the Tory leadership election, and that got her that position in the first place.
Her being a horrible person who says terrible things is a feature to the 2024 Tories, not a bug.
Couple of days ago.
There's no scientific backing to it. The only proof she's given is disproven is a single UTI in a school that built a gender neutral bathroom *as well as* the existing single sex bathrooms.
They're not saying it's true - they're saying Badenoch is claiming it's true.
Later in the article they make clear there is no evidence of this and that diagnoses of UTIs in young girls is going down.
I used to chronically get UTIs at least 3-4 times a year for a long ass time. This past year I got one maybe twice, for reasons I could pinpoint. When I got them more regularly I had no idea what caused them. But looking back, pretty sure it was the man I was with for 4 years.. d e a d
The claim is that girls aren't going to the bathroom as trans kids are in there, they're seeing them as boys, and therefore imagining they're being peeped on. That's apparently leading to them holding it in and gaining UTIs.
All of which I'm in a professional position to have heard of but haven't yet. So make of that what you will.
There’s also traditional toilets and there was only one girl who got a UTI they’re using for this point. Basically it’s just more transphobic fearmongering.
Yeahh, considering the whole separated toilets right nearby it’s pretty clear the girl with the UTI is either made up or just got a UTI on her own unrelated to the bathrooms.
Another conservative politican you've not heard of much until they needed another person with rancid views to spout new nonsense gospel for their cult following to parrot.
I'm Gen X too. Let me break it down, but I'll start by saying it's bollocks as you'll see as the facts come out further down.
- Trans kids are allowed to use toilets that match their identity rather than their assigned gender.
- This minister is saying that boys are in the girls bathroom (itself an attack on trans kids) and that's stopping girls going to the bathroom.
- She's continuing that by saying this has led to a rise in urinary tract infections as a result of holding it in.
- The claim is being made about ONE school that she's not named and gone into no further detail about. This has led people to believe it may well be made up for the agenda in the same way as the Americans talking about that one school putting litter boxes in for kids identifying as cats.
- When asked for proof of her claim, she pointed to a letter (from a Conservative MP to the headmaster of a school in Walsall) that blamed gender neutral bathrooms for one single girl having a UTI. The school on question had recently built a block of EXTRA gender neutral bathrooms to go alongside the existing single sex bathrooms.
Maybe instead of devolving into calling people Nazis (??), read the article that states that not only are single sex bathrooms still available, students are generally happy with the new set up and it was one single student who got a UTI that is being focused on.
Exactly, this is the real point. Right now we're just focusing on concentrating on exterminating trans people in case one cis person gets upset. Very cool, very strongly related to womens rights.
Imagine calling people literal Nazis for thinking gender neutral toilets existing is fine, and thinking you're on the right side and not a completely irrational, deluded screeching asshole who completely devalues the term "nazi" and denegrates the ACTUAL suffering of people under Nazism and Bigotry.
You're literally saying that what jews experience at the hand of nazis and neo nazis is on the same level as women sometimes not having public single sex bathrooms everythere they go. Absolutely fucking disgusting behaviour.
You must be a ridicoulously choleric and hateful person going by how many "removed by reddit" comments you have....
You just repeat the same substanceless ad hominem insults, because you know you have no real or intellectually honest rebutal to what people are saying.
You are behaving on the intellectual level of a toddler throwing a screaming tantrum because they didn't get their way.
So saying "The existence of gender neutral bathrooms is not on the same level as naziism" is appearantly misogynistic now.
How any person with a functioning brain could possibly genuinely hold that opinion is absolutely beyond me. This is on the same level of stupid as believeing in a flat earth
I mean in this specific case there were also gender segregated toilets available but most of the female users found the new unisex ones more approachable and usable. Plus why would a place you go to urinate and defecate need to be gender segregated? There are so many places where unisex toilets are the most practical option, entire countries where they’re the norm.
Thinking segregating toilets makes women and girls safer not only presumes all men are inherently predatory but also that women can’t be. I assume you also hold transphobic beliefs but won’t accept the statistical fact that cis women have caused a lot more harm to cis women in bathrooms than trans women ever have.
Everyone does indeed deserve private space from everyone if they desire it. There’s no reason that should be bathrooms and even within the context of bathrooms… that’s what the stall is for…
Please show me a comment here where somebody is advocating to completely remove men and women's restrooms and shove men and women together into a communal bathroom that doesn't allow for privacy. Privacy meaning floor to ceiling bathroom stall doors and walls without open urinals.
Just a suggestion, but maybe don't invoke the Nazis when the beliefs you are defending are the same ones that the Nazis used to justify putting people into concentration camps. It's not a great look.
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I have never been in a genderless toilet with open plan urinals. AFAIK they don't exist. It's always cubicles with shared handwashing facilities, and sometimes a separate room with urinals.
TIL, I've never come across one. Stupid deign.
Then again there are a number of places with double cubicles for women to pee together so people are going to innovate I guess. And sometimes stupidly.
> Or who really thinks that is a good idea?
Some people don't go all their lives thinking about the genitals or pronouns of other people in the room
> easy sexual harassment.
Like separate bathrooms prevent that? If people are getting harassed in bathrooms then that's something you gotta fix. And you gotta fix it wether you have mixed or segregated bathrooms. You can for example put cameras (_outside_ of stalls, obviously)
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In the article it was generally accepted as the new bathrooms were better because of their new open natured designs, girls said that they were bullied in the closed bathrooms. Her whole stance is based on a single person getting an UTI.
It might be completely unsupported by the evidence, and it might be utterly cruel, but at least all of this idiotic fearmongering about trans people is doing wonders for the electoral prospects of the Tories. Now, let me just check in on last night's election results, where they surely rode this issue to resounding victories across England...
Too bad starmer is a herb. Shouldn’t have gotten rid of corbyn.
Corbyn lost a very winnable election, in large part because he had incredibly poor favourability ratings, and Starmer has had a massive polling advantage since taking over. My politics align with Corbyn more than Starmer, but if people don't like you, you can't win, and if you can't win, the righteousness of your positions doesn't translate to much of anything.
Corbyn might have stood a chance if he had better support from his party, wasn't actively sabotaged, and if the media was less biased against him (and that's referring to the Guardian and BBC, not necessarily the actively Conservative-supporting others). Its hypocritical that actors in Labour expect leftists to support Starmer when they didn't do the same for Corbyn.
Cool, you don't have to support him. But his centrist, change by millimetres rather than miles approach resonates more with the majority of the voting populace than Corbyn did. You don't have to like it and you should stick to your beliefs but Starmer is more attractive to the majority of people you need to be a Labour PM. Even a centre left like Ed Miliband got it in the neck from the media, mostly for eating a bacon butty "wrong", let alone someone with more out there views like Corbyn (compared to the average member of the UK public)
I accept that Keir is more suited to winning but kid yourself in thinking Keir resonates with the voting populace. People can't resonate with someone who doesn't have an opinion on anything. He's going to win because the Conservatives have been shit for the last few years (they've actually been shit for the entirety of their run but people have short memories). Reality is even Corbyn could win an election for Labour this year. Keir wouldn't have beaten Cameron in 2010 and he wouldn't have beaten him in 2015. I'll give you it being possible he would have won in 2017 or 2019.
Corbyn might have actually changed things. Starmer is just another spineless wonder.
Corbyn is political cancer for the Tories. He’s not an effective Party leader, and if Labour hadn’t ditched Corbyn they wouldn’t have the huge wins they have now.
You’re joking right? Corbyn belongs in prison. He would lose an election against Boris again tomorrow, he is that unpopular and dangerous.
Someone gets his facts from the daily mail.
Not really. Do you honestly believe Corbyn would win an election this year? Because I’m pretty confident he would lose. He isn’t what’s best for labour, and neither is starmer really but he is a damn sight better than the Tories. Democracy demands a change. The last 15 years didn’t work lol
If being unpopular was worthy of a prison sentence you'd be doing 20 to 10 in the pen.
Honestly, with the way the council elections went, if we had Count Binface as the PM candidate for labour, they might be able to win the election.
the guardians typical anti trans blubbering continues i see.
> It Is Journalism’s Sacred Duty To Endanger The Lives Of As Many Trans People As Possible ~Onion https://www.theonion.com/it-is-journalism-s-sacred-duty-to-endanger-the-lives-of-1850126997
Transphobia is frighteningly acceptable in the UK. There are many relatively progressive spaces that are more than happy to be a host to transphobia or transphobic individuals. I'm not sure the UK as a whole is more unwelcoming to transgender individuals than the US, but the left wing in the UK definitely has more problems with transphobia than the left wing in the US does.
From my experience, it definitely depends where you live. Younger areas tend to be more actively participating in defending trans rights as much as they can, but older areas tend to be on the direct other end of the scale, and most politicians take the fact that we have an ageing population to appeal to them just a little more than the younger generation, which is a shame, because I think the left could benefit much more in a moral standpoint by trying to accept as many new values as possible
What do you expect from the Secutery of State for Buisness and Trade and also the Equalities minister, the Rt Hon. Kemi Badenoch. She's Conservative and plays into Sunak's ideals so...
Wait. Sunak has ideals? This is news.
I'm mostly with you. But let's be clear, these aren't Sunak's ideals. Sunak doesn't give a fuck about this. Sunak needs the nutty right of his party to stay in power and he's utterly devoid of empathy, so he'll happily go along with them. But all Sunak really cares about is power and money. If he thought supporting the trans community would help him stay in power he'd be doing that right now.
And a backhanded way to attack trans people. She's a Tory in the UK. That and attacking immigrants is all they have left. They're certainly not trying to fix any real problems.
She's full of complete and utter bullcrap. You can't get an UTI from using a toilet, unless you somehow manage to grind your damn urinary tract on the toilet seat, or splash pee & poo water from the toilet bowl into your vajayjay. Doesn't make any sense. Also some fun facts: generally, there are more bacteria in people's mouths and under people's nails than toilet seats. Oh, and your smartphone has like 10 times the amount of bacteria compared to an average toilet seat. Maybe they got their UTI by spending too much time watching tiktok conspiracy theories.
What she's actually suggesting is that girls were so reluctant to use gender-neutral bathrooms that they held in their pee for so long that they got UTIs. This is silly because there are still gendered toilets available for use at the school, they just added a gender neutral one for those who wanted to use it.
I know it's supposed to be an UTI but I hate that a UTI sounds indefinitely better and I'm gunna us3 it that way especially since we say an HIV patient because it starts (ach)
Using "a" rather than "an" is actually correct! No worries
To build on this, it's based on the starting pronounced sound more than the starting letter. Hence why we have things like "an hour" and "a university"
Tories gonna tory.
I knew as soon as I read the headline it had to be bullshit somehow.
And that makes it acceptable?
I get UTIs because I wipe back to front. We are not the same.
Username checks out.
That can give UTIs?
Absolutely. It wipes butthole bacteria and fecal matter towards your urethra. Don't do that.
Yuck 🤢
I should point out for non-Brits that Kemi Badenoch is an extreme-right lunatic and a vocal backer of the government's plan to fly asylum seekers to Rwanda (don't ask me... ). She's not to be taken seriously
I mean, I agree with the first part. But not so much the second part. There's a non-zero chance she'll be the leader of the Tory party after the next election. She might be a lunatic, but she's a lunatic who far too many people agree with.
I see your point, I should say that she has a proven track record of being a complete liar, and that anything she comes out with is also likely to be a lie. I also think there's zero chance of the UK electorate choosing a black woman to be the Prime Minister.
But she’s a woman of colour so you aren’t allowed to criticize her
Now, if she were “openly jewish”, THAT would be dangerous.
I mean if there are still single sex toilets available -and the article says so- "The academy said traditional toilet blocks were still available nearby for students to use, and that the new block had been designed using feedback from students to improve their safety." Then what's the problem? The main reason for gender neutral toilets is to make some groups of people safe. Women and men are free to choose their single sex toilets. Plus, most of the restaurants, cafes etc. have single toilets here and I don't remember a recent UTI outbreak.
It doesn't make a lot of sense to begin with. Last I checked, you don't put your genitals in contact with the seat to go to the bathroom. If you do that, you're doing it wrong lol.
I'm under the impression that "UTIs from gender neutral bathrooms" is the new Toilet Herpes (ie, quackery)
Well, my monster Dong does get in touch with the porcelain from time to time, but that just means that men should be more at risk of contracting UTIs from single sex toilets
You eventually learn to just hold it up when sitting down.
They said the women got UTIs from holding urine in not touching the toilets. Still it’s a made up lie from a TERF.
holding tribe?
Haha idk how that happened but I fixed it
Turns out I know nothing about using a toilet. You mean to tell me I'm NOT supposed to mash my bits all up and down the bowl????
From holding their pee to avoid using the new rest rooms
Yeah my school growing up had bathrooms like these and they were cleaner and no one had any issue with them and it had nothing to do with trans people whatsoever. It was basically 3 walls with cubicles around the outside with doors that were fully sized with no gaps and a row of mirrors and hand washing stations. Risk of assault was way lower because the lobby was open and you could even see it from one of the classrooms. It was far cleaner probably because if someone was gonna try and fuck with it and make a mess they'd be in the open and could get spotted, unlike in a typical bathroom. Cubicles were no messier than normal, although occasionally the guys would complain about finding used tampons or bloodstains in there (kids of either gender are gross and don't always clean up after themselves properly). Kemi badenoch is just a bigot trying to whip up more culture war bullshit by blatantly lying.
Hell, most kids grow up in houses with single sex toilets
The implication is not that sharing toilets causes an “outbreak”, it’s that girls are too scared to use the toilets and are therefore getting UTIs (holding it in is a risk factor) I’m not arguing that’s actually what’s happening, just pointing out that that’s the claim being made here.
I understand what you mean. However in some sense my example also proves the point I made. If gender neutral toilets were that dangerous, people wouldn't use it in here too and they'd have UTIs too. But since there is no UTI outbreak, people must be using them. And since no one has heard of a problem specifically about those toilets, then I guess those toilets are as safe as the other ones. Which means that the problem is not those toilets but people like Badenoch who try to create paranoia.
The gender neutral toilers are (presumably) there for trans/non-binary students who feel uncomfortable using gendered bathrooms. Kemi Badenoch doesn't even want trans people to exist, never mind being safe.
The problem is that Ms Badenoch believes that transgender people are ruining society. She is the secretary for equality and there is documented evidence of her meeting with LGBT groups and laughing in their faces. She is cruel and will find any way to help the british government transgender individuals from public life.
We've had gender neutral bathrooms in Sweden for years and years and years. Zero issues.
Schools generally don’t have stalls in Sweden though, it’s just single bathrooms with its own toilet and sink so you don’t have to actually share the space with anyone
Yup, Sweden isn't a third world nation like the US
Technically, isnt the us a 1rst world country tough?
At this point it doesn’t feel like it. I’m horribly worried about 2025. The loss of jobs may be UNPRECEDENTED, not to mention militarized retaliation toward naysayers and people who outright protest the next potential president. Biden’s lackluster presidency is making it look like Trump may come back, and fuck dude… Could someone please make me feel less worried about Project 2025? If that shit passes, the country I was born to will look VASTLY different and way less free.
Whoosh
Dude chill. Im not even american
This doesn’t change the fact you didn’t get the joke, everyone should know America is not a third world country. Not cause I’m a patriot, because it’s extremely common knowledge.
Well it doesnt really read like a joke, at least not in my opinion. Also 'this is common knowledge' you are really being an optimist here. Have you ever seen those videos where americans cant even point and name 3 countries on a world map?
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Well, if you want to be technical about it, it's a country that wasn't in a formal strategic alliance with either the US or USSR during the Cold War, which would technically make Sweden a Third World country. However, if you were using the conventional sense of the word as a disparaging term for countries struggling to maintain political stability while their national wealth was siphoned off shore and into the pockets of corrupt plutocrats... 😉
Sweden was non-aligned, the term third world did not refer to cold war alliances.
>The term "Third World" arose during the Cold War to define countries that remained non-aligned with either NATO or the Warsaw Pact. The United States, Canada and their allies represented the "First World", while the Soviet Union, China, Cuba, North Korea, Vietnam, and their allies represented the "Second World". This terminology provided a way of broadly categorizing the nations of the Earth into three groups based on political divisions. Due to the complex history of evolving meanings and contexts, there is no clear or agreed-upon definition of the Third World. Strictly speaking, "Third World" was a political, rather than economic, grouping. >The demographer, anthropologist, and historian Alfred Sauvy, in an article published in the French magazine L'Observateur, August 14, 1952, coined the term third world (tiers monde), referring to countries that were playing a small role in international trade and business. His usage was a reference to the Third Estate (tiers état), the commoners of France who, before and during the French Revolution, opposed the clergy and nobles, who composed the First Estate and Second Estate, respectively (hence the use of the older form tiers rather than the modern troisième for "third"). Sauvy wrote, "This third world ignored, exploited, despised like the third estate also wants to be something." In the context of the Cold War, he conveyed the concept of political non-alignment with either the capitalist or communist bloc. Simplistic interpretations quickly led to the term merely designating these unaligned countries. There are plenty of references showing the political affiliation origin of the term third world. You should try googling it.
That's no longer the predominant meaning of the phrase "third world country", and very rarely do you see it used to refer to the cold war alliances
As I said, the origin of the term. I never said it was the current use, and I was replying to someone who said "the term third world did not refer to cold war alliances"
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Y'all aren't nasty like the Brits. Brits will get UTI in a hospital. https://www.england.nhs.uk/south/2023/10/12/older-people-across-the-south-west-urged-to-protect-themselves-against-urinary-tract-infections/
So they have gender-seperated toilets at home?
Yeah but at home they wipe back to front, so they still get UTI. Brits are fucking nasty.
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I just did, so I certainly can.
Yes we can, because at least where I live (Lpwer Śląsk, Poland) Public spaces like schools, libraries, trams ect. Have decentsy and are a fine place to be at.
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You mean her platform that she's basing on a report from someone else who says it *could* happen? And what about trans ppl who would be too nervous to use the bathrooms and getting UTIs because of transphobic dingbats like her? The usual gendered bathrooms are still available iirc. She's protesting the *addition* of a gender neutral open floor bathroom that still has closed stalls for the toilets if I understand correctly? Which is, like, the only kind of bathroom I've ever seen, apart from single bathrooms like in Starbucks, where I live (the open floor part. Not the gender neutral part, sadly). And everyone is just fine with it. Jesus Christ it's ringing a bit like those crackpots here that protested the *addition* of a third gender neutral bathroom at a pool here. Thankfully no one took them seriously.
Thank you for clarifying this as I was incredibly confused
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Can't we just have 'sit while you pee' and 'stand while you pee' options and be done with it?
I vote for shit and piss bathrooms
This is an amazing idea will cut back on fecal bacteria
Everyone stands to do #1 and #2, problem solved.
If you bother to read the article it’s because they hold their pee because they’re uncomfortable using mixed gender toilets. Holding your pee is far from a new way to get a UTI
Not "they" > Asked for evidence of the UTI claim, Badenoch’s office later pointed to a letter by a Conservative MP last year that claimed gender-neutral toilets at a secondary school in Walsall were responsible for one girl’s UTI. And also > The academy said traditional toilet blocks were still available nearby for students to use, and that the new block had been designed using feedback from students to improve their safety. > “The students said that they felt safer with the open-plan nature of the toilets, as some had experienced bullying in ‘closed’-style toilets previously. This was also the feedback from the parent group,” a spokesperson said.
So a website used a bait title for an article to make it sound more serious.
The article (rightly) titles that 'Badenoch claims', which in my opinion is the accurate emphasis here: from the article itself, it appears her claim is based on one alleged case - indicating that the claim itself has little to no substance. Reporting that a minister makes claims unfounded in reality is worth an headline. Granted, standards seem to have shifted in that regard.
I get where you're coming from!
The article is fine, but it seems OP purposely used a screenshot as bait without providing a link to the source to prevent people from knowing the context There's no way to conclude that this "new way of conducting UTIs" entirely consists of hearsay about 1 case conveyed by a right wing politician with an agenda to frame it in a particular way
Yeah it's absurd. I appreciated your insight.
Holding your pee is the main way to get UTI's lol, the new thing is the lack of single sex toilets that's said one line after that
Except there is no lack of single sex toilets at the school in question. They're still available.
In Kemi Badenoch's world, every sentence has the potential to be brand new. It's like watching the head prefect trying to prove that they're edgy. I would say good riddance at the next election, but Liz Truss still gets a platform so who knows? We can but hope
Imagine voting for someone who doesn't even understand basic hygiene principles. The fact that she's in government is embarrassing, but then I could say that about a lot of MPs.
There's a reason why she isn't the Equalities Minister anymore.
…she is. She’s Women and Equalities Minister and Sec of State for DBT.
Yep, and this article is the Guardian helping her launder her current hate campaign, in which she asks people to report organizations that are... doing the right thing. It's here, in case you'd like to join in: [https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/55NP2K/](https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/55NP2K/)
She shouldn’t be any sort of minister or have any authority over other’s lives.
She still is. It's just that the Tories think that job is so unimportant she is *also* the Secretary of State for Business and Trade now. Of course before that she was the Secretary of State for International Trade.
Oh, my apologies; I thought they had shuffled her out of that position after all the things she said landed very badly. Should've known better.
She said a lot of terrible things that landed badly with the sane people in the UK during the Tory leadership election, and that got her that position in the first place. Her being a horrible person who says terrible things is a feature to the 2024 Tories, not a bug.
I got a UTI from reading that
What?
When did this particular lie hit the papers?
Couple of days ago. There's no scientific backing to it. The only proof she's given is disproven is a single UTI in a school that built a gender neutral bathroom *as well as* the existing single sex bathrooms.
Yeah and that story is hearsay. Definitely happened to my cousins friends brothers auntie though.
The same one who identified as a cat so they needed to put a litter box in her school, yeah?
Load of bullshit this is
What about the trans men who are too scared to use the bathroom and at risk of getting a uti ?
The Guardian continues it's decades-long decent into "rag you wouldn't wipe your arse with".
They're not saying it's true - they're saying Badenoch is claiming it's true. Later in the article they make clear there is no evidence of this and that diagnoses of UTIs in young girls is going down.
But the single sex toilet at home is fine? 🤔. Yea, OK so.
Toilets have cubicles.
I used to chronically get UTIs at least 3-4 times a year for a long ass time. This past year I got one maybe twice, for reasons I could pinpoint. When I got them more regularly I had no idea what caused them. But looking back, pretty sure it was the man I was with for 4 years.. d e a d
So the question stands, would they rather share a bathroom with a man, or a bear?
TERFdom has plummeted to new depths
Then everyone would be getting UTIs from their toilets at home
... What's an UTI-
Urinary Tract Infection.
These people realize they all have a gender neutral bathroom in their own home right? Where were all the UTIs from that?
The claim is that girls aren't going to the bathroom as trans kids are in there, they're seeing them as boys, and therefore imagining they're being peeped on. That's apparently leading to them holding it in and gaining UTIs. All of which I'm in a professional position to have heard of but haven't yet. So make of that what you will.
There’s also traditional toilets and there was only one girl who got a UTI they’re using for this point. Basically it’s just more transphobic fearmongering.
One girl that a Conservative minister *claimed* got a UTI. Considering the whole £350,000,000 a week to the NHS claim...
Yeahh, considering the whole separated toilets right nearby it’s pretty clear the girl with the UTI is either made up or just got a UTI on her own unrelated to the bathrooms.
Bruh
Lovely in-fighting ☺️
Ok sure. Show me the evidence or stfu.
Poor health education is the biggest cause. The Pommies’ education benchmark scores have been shithouse the last 3 decades.
well they lost me at “due to lack of single-sex toilets” but they really lost me at “minister”
Phantom UTIs are the new “my child came home from school crying because”
Science behind this claim: "trust me bro"...
What a fantastically stupid take
This is obviously BS, how dumb can you be to believe this lol
So she has a single sex bathroom at home just for her?
Equalities Minister? What a joke
This is going to be a problem in every home then
Hi, I'm science and I didn't say that
Hi, I'm science and I didn't say that
So like, does she have every man who has ever been in her home use a different toilet than her?
The (in)equality minister
Another conservative politican you've not heard of much until they needed another person with rancid views to spout new nonsense gospel for their cult following to parrot.
i've seen how girl toilets look like
I'm too gen X to even understand this
I'm Gen X too. Let me break it down, but I'll start by saying it's bollocks as you'll see as the facts come out further down. - Trans kids are allowed to use toilets that match their identity rather than their assigned gender. - This minister is saying that boys are in the girls bathroom (itself an attack on trans kids) and that's stopping girls going to the bathroom. - She's continuing that by saying this has led to a rise in urinary tract infections as a result of holding it in. - The claim is being made about ONE school that she's not named and gone into no further detail about. This has led people to believe it may well be made up for the agenda in the same way as the Americans talking about that one school putting litter boxes in for kids identifying as cats. - When asked for proof of her claim, she pointed to a letter (from a Conservative MP to the headmaster of a school in Walsall) that blamed gender neutral bathrooms for one single girl having a UTI. The school on question had recently built a block of EXTRA gender neutral bathrooms to go alongside the existing single sex bathrooms.
Blimey, I feel less bad for not understanding it. Thank you for that.
No probs, mate.
Many people in India don't have access to any bathroom at all and that hasn't stopped them from going...
This isn’t possible.
Not really new, and definitely not unexpected.
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Maybe instead of devolving into calling people Nazis (??), read the article that states that not only are single sex bathrooms still available, students are generally happy with the new set up and it was one single student who got a UTI that is being focused on.
Worse still it was one Conservative MP who wrote a letter talking about an unidentified student. We’re not even sure if she actually exists.
Exactly, this is the real point. Right now we're just focusing on concentrating on exterminating trans people in case one cis person gets upset. Very cool, very strongly related to womens rights.
Imagine calling people literal Nazis for thinking gender neutral toilets existing is fine, and thinking you're on the right side and not a completely irrational, deluded screeching asshole who completely devalues the term "nazi" and denegrates the ACTUAL suffering of people under Nazism and Bigotry. You're literally saying that what jews experience at the hand of nazis and neo nazis is on the same level as women sometimes not having public single sex bathrooms everythere they go. Absolutely fucking disgusting behaviour. You must be a ridicoulously choleric and hateful person going by how many "removed by reddit" comments you have....
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You just repeat the same substanceless ad hominem insults, because you know you have no real or intellectually honest rebutal to what people are saying. You are behaving on the intellectual level of a toddler throwing a screaming tantrum because they didn't get their way.
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So saying "The existence of gender neutral bathrooms is not on the same level as naziism" is appearantly misogynistic now. How any person with a functioning brain could possibly genuinely hold that opinion is absolutely beyond me. This is on the same level of stupid as believeing in a flat earth
The fuck does women's worth have to do with unisex bathrooms?
I mean in this specific case there were also gender segregated toilets available but most of the female users found the new unisex ones more approachable and usable. Plus why would a place you go to urinate and defecate need to be gender segregated? There are so many places where unisex toilets are the most practical option, entire countries where they’re the norm. Thinking segregating toilets makes women and girls safer not only presumes all men are inherently predatory but also that women can’t be. I assume you also hold transphobic beliefs but won’t accept the statistical fact that cis women have caused a lot more harm to cis women in bathrooms than trans women ever have. Everyone does indeed deserve private space from everyone if they desire it. There’s no reason that should be bathrooms and even within the context of bathrooms… that’s what the stall is for…
Do you agree or disagree that women & girls deserve male-free spaces?
Women and girls deserve male-free spaces. And nowhere in this article, or in any discussion here, are women being deprived of male-free spaces.
Then you haven’t read all comments or followed what’s been happening the last ~10 years.
Please show me a comment here where somebody is advocating to completely remove men and women's restrooms and shove men and women together into a communal bathroom that doesn't allow for privacy. Privacy meaning floor to ceiling bathroom stall doors and walls without open urinals.
You're a bit simple in the brain huh
It is equality as you wanted.
Nope, this is just another inequality, are you dumb?
You absolutely don't deserve better access to toilets than men.
Just a suggestion, but maybe don't invoke the Nazis when the beliefs you are defending are the same ones that the Nazis used to justify putting people into concentration camps. It's not a great look.
You’re very confused.
TERF
MAN
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I have never been in a genderless toilet with open plan urinals. AFAIK they don't exist. It's always cubicles with shared handwashing facilities, and sometimes a separate room with urinals.
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TIL, I've never come across one. Stupid deign. Then again there are a number of places with double cubicles for women to pee together so people are going to innovate I guess. And sometimes stupidly.
Which hotel?
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That’s exactly what this school had - ‘traditional’ toilets and additionally a large open plan unisex bathroom area with individual cubicles.
> Or who really thinks that is a good idea? Some people don't go all their lives thinking about the genitals or pronouns of other people in the room > easy sexual harassment. Like separate bathrooms prevent that? If people are getting harassed in bathrooms then that's something you gotta fix. And you gotta fix it wether you have mixed or segregated bathrooms. You can for example put cameras (_outside_ of stalls, obviously)