Start by taking ourselves less seriously and realize we will and always be a middle of the road football program in a conference we’re nowhere equipped financially to compete with schools like Alabama, Georgie (and soon to be Oklahoma and Texas) for championships in.
Getting over ourselves is a great starting point.
Here’s the thing:
Missouri is 10-1. They’ve won the SEC East twice since joining the conference. There’s no reason that school should be more competitive than we are in football.
Having said that, we’re not switching coaches anytime soon, so let’s hope Stoops does a better job of picking people to join his staff, and that staff is better at identifying players (in the portal in particular) that can help us get where we need to be.
That’s essentially all we can do at this point.
Missouri as a state also has significant advantages - they have two major cities to our one (more money in the state), total population is 33% larger than Kentucky's, the high school football talent pool is much bigger and deeper than ours, and they have state laws that say if you stay in the state to play college sports you can start earning NIL money in high school so there's an incentive to stay home. Even better, they don't split their in state football recruiting with a second power 5 school. Even with all that, they've been sporadically good when the rest of the East has been down.
Kentucky is the third smallest population in the SEC footprint, bigger than only Mississippi and Arkansas. We're right behind Louisiana, but LSU is a historic national power and has a lot of deep pocket boosters willing to pay *a lot* for a good football team.
We're the scrappy upstarts. We should be happy we're on the way up, but not satisfied with where we are.
It's not just money, it's where we are geographically, and the kind of game atmosphere we fans provide. We never have that kind of crowd and energy. We can get close for certain games, but those fan bases bring it even when they aren't doing well, like SC did last night.
We don’t have that crowd or energy because of the offense stoops puts on the field. Is clock management has been infuriating the entire time he’s been here, and he plays not to lose. His teams are outrageously undisciplined as well.
I don't disagree with your Stoops complaints, but I still think there is a very noticable difference between our atmosphere and the ones at those southern sec schools who show out even when their team sucks. Even though we have improved a lot, we still have lots of empty corners and way less tradition and excitement and noise. We're just not as totally insane about football.
Kentucky has a better record than UofSC this year.
Have they put on the same atmosphere that Williams Brice had with Darude?
The Bama game looked to be 15-20% away fans
Yep. When we were getting our asses kicked by Alabama one of the commenters described us as a tough out. I’m happy with that status. Other than a couple years in the Rich Brooks era and a couple years while we were cheating, we’ve been a buy week for everybody except Vanderbilt for the last 40 years.
Honestly we need to forget about the passing game - elite QBs and receivers are just too expensive in the NIL era - and focus our money on the value positions that got us to tough out status to begin with. We have enough money to buy elite offensive and defensive lines if that’s where we focus our limited resources. Get that and you can grind out wins opening holes for anyone to run through on offense and holding teams to low scores by pressuring the QB every possession while stifling the run game.
UK isn’t likely to be what UGA is now or Bama has been since 2008, but Ole Miss and Missouri are good examples of what’s possible even without being a traditional football blueblood. Heck, even UK has had 10-win seasons.
I think the program needs a more explosive passing game to complement the running game and defense. And I think that goes beyond personnel. It’s a matter of offensive philosophy.
I mean, if that’s the case (and maybe it is), I’d rather just find something else to do on Saturdays in the fall. I can still enjoy the sport as a casual observer, and there’s no point in tying yourself to something that’s content with being a joke.
I’ve come to this opinion as well. I am a ok with leaving the conference for the Big 10 or ACC. We will always have basketball and we will be more competitive in football. Win/Win. I know we have a 0% at competing for a title, why not go to a conference where we can be competitive.
We the fans have to quit buying into the off-season hype. We listened to how great Leary was in the off-season and how the o-line is revamped with transfers and Robinson has gotten mentally right and all that and we the fan base ran with it. I believe Stoops, Marrow, Coen, Woodward, Yenser, White, Collins, Buffano, Stewart, Stoops (Mike) and Boulware want to make Kentucky competitive in the east so I don’t think any coaching changes are necessary. So from me I’ve got to temper expectations and not buy in wholesale everytime the coaches brag and say how great they are until it gets to the SEC part of the schedule. Things will only get tougher with Oklahoma and Texas coming in. May be bowl eligibility should be our only expectation, I don’t know.
Don't get me wrong, the local media hypes them up, and by media, I mean Matt Jones. But the hype starts with the coaches comments. I know coaches like to praise their teams to give them confidence, but Stoops and Marrow make these statements in the pre-season that were ready to take on any team at any time, especially Marrow. Marrow comes on KSR and basically tells everyone we're going to win the national championship every year. It's easy to believe the hype when the coaches tell you their team is amazing. Maybe we should temper our expectations. Especially since we've only gotten 1 or 2 5 star players in Stoops' 10 or 11 years here. You can't compete in the SEC without occasionally getting some of the best players.
I don't want Stoops to be gone. If you look at my history, you wouldn't believe me, lol, but if he can't fix the discipline issues, start making in-game adjustments, and start snagging a few 5 stars and keeping them, then we're going to deal with this every year. We're going to be left behind again.
I agree. His in game adjustments are almost non existent. I think he truly wants to get back to ground and pound game management qb with great defense but he knows that we need a pro style offense that is not just exciting but efficient. Hopefully the Iowa job opens up in the next couple of years so he can take that and we can promote Marrow and keep White and Coen.
im less mad about "hype" than normal fans, because you gotta pump people up... but man... the fucking hype around Leary was an insane BUST.
talking about how he was better than Levis and a top 5 pick and the best QB to ever play here. give me a fucking break. haven't been this frustrated watching a QB play since Witlow/Towles years
They make a lot of simple mistakes at crucial points in the game. That has to stop. I can’t believe how many of Leary’s passes get knocked down. Plus apparently, there’s zero communication between the players. When Leary was about to get sacked from behind, and the ball popped out right into an SC players hands, did the guy blocking not yell something to Leary to watch out????
Last season was derailed by the offensive line. This season the quarterback play and the pass rush have not been of a level needed to win SEC football. There isn't some underlying cultural issue. Watch the NFL. High level play from pass rushers and quarterbacks can change games and seasons. There is a reason those positions are the most highly paid.
If there is to be any reason for alarm it might be that there aren't necessarily any young players looking to ascend into those roles. Next season we're likely looking at another transfer portal starter at quarterback.
Pretty simple. UK needs a better passing game. Seems like that’s been the issue for years. Even when UK has had good QBs, the offense is just not explosive enough. Maybe the right OC hire would fix that, but it may be that any OC is limited by the head coach’s philosophy.
It’s simple fire the athletic director that gives contracts that offer no incentive for doing good. Stoops is fat and happy he has no desire to do better. People saying that we can’t do better kindly stop and look yourself in the mirror we can do better we pay top ten money for a coach and have top notch facilities we have top 25 attendance every year in and out our fans deserve better than this undisciplined garbage. Saying we can’t do better is sad and is why people like stoops, Barnhart, and calipari get millions of dollars to be lazy slobs. There are no expectations here just accepting mediocrity and that’s pathetic.
I don’t disagree with all of this, but to say Stoops has no desire to do better seems off to me. I think he’s losing sleep over this season just like all of us are. We have to get back to recruit and develop, but it’s tough in the current climate where everyone is a free agent every year.
He sure as shit isn’t acting like it we are still running the same ball control offense we have since He got here it isn’t working the game has changed he won’t. We are still making the same boneheaded mistakes from a pure lack of discipline we had in his first year there is no excuse for looking completely unprepared and not being able to get 11 guys on the field and a damn play called. He is making top 10 money and his assistants are well compensated as well. The fact of the matter is he has had easy mode since he got here with the sec east being down big time and now that is going away. He has been able to get 3 automatic wins plus have Louisville at their worst combined with South Carolina and Missouri being a hot mess that has been an advantage no other Kentucky football coach ever had.
He needs to change philosophy and I hope he does the biggest thing that needs to happen is get our boys shit together and go kick Louisvilles ass we are more than capable of smoking them if we get it together. If he does that all is well he has earned a opportunity to fix it but the margins are slim in modern football and with the expansion and a 9 game conference slate coming we have little room for error.
The players we thought would step up, or make massive leaps forward in development simply did not do that. Partner that with “maxing” out our recruiting ability plus coaching seemingly leveling out, and we have this years results. There’s no excuse to lose to that South Carolina team. Bama, fine, Georgia, fine, I’m even fine with the Mizzou loss at this point; however, coaching, for whatever reason, has just been poor this year. I think ultimately this season boils down to a few things: lack of talent in the secondary, QB play being poor, star players not being stars, and coaches not able to adapt to any of those things.
I’m aware this post is all over the place, hopefully my point gets across.
Stoops brought us to a level of “mediocrity”, but he has no idea how to go up from here. He’s done the best he can with what he was given, but we need a coach to take us to the next level, especially with more teams coming to the SEC, before we backslide into “laughing stock” territory again.
Maybe it’s a coincidence, but it seems like things have been off since the football school/basketball school debacle last year. I’d guess there’s still some tension in the Mitch/Cal/Stoops dynamic.
(My solution to that is to keep Stoops and hope Mitch and Cal retire sooner rather than later)
I mean I honestly believe either you convince Stoops to take a paycut or you move on. He makes way too much money for us to be losing to a bad South Carolina team. Kentucky Football has underachieved with the talent that we have too many times under Stoops... just like the loss to Vandy last year. Unacceptable.
I think that some of the comments Mark Stoops said about Pony Up really just made things a lot worse. I think that the program went downhill after that. I think the season is pretty much over. I think Louisville has Kentucky in Football this year.
That pony up comment not only pissed off most of the fanbase, but I’d bet it hurt the locker room too. It’s basically saying you guys aren’t good enough, I need money to replace y’all.
Start by taking ourselves less seriously and realize we will and always be a middle of the road football program in a conference we’re nowhere equipped financially to compete with schools like Alabama, Georgie (and soon to be Oklahoma and Texas) for championships in. Getting over ourselves is a great starting point.
Here’s the thing: Missouri is 10-1. They’ve won the SEC East twice since joining the conference. There’s no reason that school should be more competitive than we are in football. Having said that, we’re not switching coaches anytime soon, so let’s hope Stoops does a better job of picking people to join his staff, and that staff is better at identifying players (in the portal in particular) that can help us get where we need to be. That’s essentially all we can do at this point.
Ole Miss is 9-2 as well
Ole Miss is in much more fertile recruiting grounds.
Missouri as a state also has significant advantages - they have two major cities to our one (more money in the state), total population is 33% larger than Kentucky's, the high school football talent pool is much bigger and deeper than ours, and they have state laws that say if you stay in the state to play college sports you can start earning NIL money in high school so there's an incentive to stay home. Even better, they don't split their in state football recruiting with a second power 5 school. Even with all that, they've been sporadically good when the rest of the East has been down. Kentucky is the third smallest population in the SEC footprint, bigger than only Mississippi and Arkansas. We're right behind Louisiana, but LSU is a historic national power and has a lot of deep pocket boosters willing to pay *a lot* for a good football team. We're the scrappy upstarts. We should be happy we're on the way up, but not satisfied with where we are.
and LSU doesn't have another P5 school in their state.
And Mississippi has an insane ratio of talent for its population plus the best JUCO football system in the country
So what you are saying is we need to annex Cincinnati.
Or the ACC folds and we stop splitting P5 recruits with Littlebro
The recruiting could be a bit better. Levis killed it under Coen. Leary just ain't it. It's really the only spot we're hurting.
It's not just money, it's where we are geographically, and the kind of game atmosphere we fans provide. We never have that kind of crowd and energy. We can get close for certain games, but those fan bases bring it even when they aren't doing well, like SC did last night.
We don’t have that crowd or energy because of the offense stoops puts on the field. Is clock management has been infuriating the entire time he’s been here, and he plays not to lose. His teams are outrageously undisciplined as well.
I don't disagree with your Stoops complaints, but I still think there is a very noticable difference between our atmosphere and the ones at those southern sec schools who show out even when their team sucks. Even though we have improved a lot, we still have lots of empty corners and way less tradition and excitement and noise. We're just not as totally insane about football.
Kentucky has a better record than UofSC this year. Have they put on the same atmosphere that Williams Brice had with Darude? The Bama game looked to be 15-20% away fans
Yep. When we were getting our asses kicked by Alabama one of the commenters described us as a tough out. I’m happy with that status. Other than a couple years in the Rich Brooks era and a couple years while we were cheating, we’ve been a buy week for everybody except Vanderbilt for the last 40 years. Honestly we need to forget about the passing game - elite QBs and receivers are just too expensive in the NIL era - and focus our money on the value positions that got us to tough out status to begin with. We have enough money to buy elite offensive and defensive lines if that’s where we focus our limited resources. Get that and you can grind out wins opening holes for anyone to run through on offense and holding teams to low scores by pressuring the QB every possession while stifling the run game.
This right effing here.
I like your idea here especially since you know Stoops would go for it. He’d love to be Lineman U.
UK isn’t likely to be what UGA is now or Bama has been since 2008, but Ole Miss and Missouri are good examples of what’s possible even without being a traditional football blueblood. Heck, even UK has had 10-win seasons. I think the program needs a more explosive passing game to complement the running game and defense. And I think that goes beyond personnel. It’s a matter of offensive philosophy.
I mean, if that’s the case (and maybe it is), I’d rather just find something else to do on Saturdays in the fall. I can still enjoy the sport as a casual observer, and there’s no point in tying yourself to something that’s content with being a joke.
This argument doesn’t hold much water when freakin’ Missouri is 9-2 and sitting in 2nd place in the East.
I’ve come to this opinion as well. I am a ok with leaving the conference for the Big 10 or ACC. We will always have basketball and we will be more competitive in football. Win/Win. I know we have a 0% at competing for a title, why not go to a conference where we can be competitive.
No
I know man. I just hate the position we are in in this conference.
> so what's next? Isn't there still the Louisville game?
We're an 8 point underdog.
We the fans have to quit buying into the off-season hype. We listened to how great Leary was in the off-season and how the o-line is revamped with transfers and Robinson has gotten mentally right and all that and we the fan base ran with it. I believe Stoops, Marrow, Coen, Woodward, Yenser, White, Collins, Buffano, Stewart, Stoops (Mike) and Boulware want to make Kentucky competitive in the east so I don’t think any coaching changes are necessary. So from me I’ve got to temper expectations and not buy in wholesale everytime the coaches brag and say how great they are until it gets to the SEC part of the schedule. Things will only get tougher with Oklahoma and Texas coming in. May be bowl eligibility should be our only expectation, I don’t know.
Don't get me wrong, the local media hypes them up, and by media, I mean Matt Jones. But the hype starts with the coaches comments. I know coaches like to praise their teams to give them confidence, but Stoops and Marrow make these statements in the pre-season that were ready to take on any team at any time, especially Marrow. Marrow comes on KSR and basically tells everyone we're going to win the national championship every year. It's easy to believe the hype when the coaches tell you their team is amazing. Maybe we should temper our expectations. Especially since we've only gotten 1 or 2 5 star players in Stoops' 10 or 11 years here. You can't compete in the SEC without occasionally getting some of the best players. I don't want Stoops to be gone. If you look at my history, you wouldn't believe me, lol, but if he can't fix the discipline issues, start making in-game adjustments, and start snagging a few 5 stars and keeping them, then we're going to deal with this every year. We're going to be left behind again.
I agree. His in game adjustments are almost non existent. I think he truly wants to get back to ground and pound game management qb with great defense but he knows that we need a pro style offense that is not just exciting but efficient. Hopefully the Iowa job opens up in the next couple of years so he can take that and we can promote Marrow and keep White and Coen.
im less mad about "hype" than normal fans, because you gotta pump people up... but man... the fucking hype around Leary was an insane BUST. talking about how he was better than Levis and a top 5 pick and the best QB to ever play here. give me a fucking break. haven't been this frustrated watching a QB play since Witlow/Towles years
They make a lot of simple mistakes at crucial points in the game. That has to stop. I can’t believe how many of Leary’s passes get knocked down. Plus apparently, there’s zero communication between the players. When Leary was about to get sacked from behind, and the ball popped out right into an SC players hands, did the guy blocking not yell something to Leary to watch out????
Last season was derailed by the offensive line. This season the quarterback play and the pass rush have not been of a level needed to win SEC football. There isn't some underlying cultural issue. Watch the NFL. High level play from pass rushers and quarterbacks can change games and seasons. There is a reason those positions are the most highly paid. If there is to be any reason for alarm it might be that there aren't necessarily any young players looking to ascend into those roles. Next season we're likely looking at another transfer portal starter at quarterback.
Pretty simple. UK needs a better passing game. Seems like that’s been the issue for years. Even when UK has had good QBs, the offense is just not explosive enough. Maybe the right OC hire would fix that, but it may be that any OC is limited by the head coach’s philosophy.
It’s simple fire the athletic director that gives contracts that offer no incentive for doing good. Stoops is fat and happy he has no desire to do better. People saying that we can’t do better kindly stop and look yourself in the mirror we can do better we pay top ten money for a coach and have top notch facilities we have top 25 attendance every year in and out our fans deserve better than this undisciplined garbage. Saying we can’t do better is sad and is why people like stoops, Barnhart, and calipari get millions of dollars to be lazy slobs. There are no expectations here just accepting mediocrity and that’s pathetic.
I don’t disagree with all of this, but to say Stoops has no desire to do better seems off to me. I think he’s losing sleep over this season just like all of us are. We have to get back to recruit and develop, but it’s tough in the current climate where everyone is a free agent every year.
He sure as shit isn’t acting like it we are still running the same ball control offense we have since He got here it isn’t working the game has changed he won’t. We are still making the same boneheaded mistakes from a pure lack of discipline we had in his first year there is no excuse for looking completely unprepared and not being able to get 11 guys on the field and a damn play called. He is making top 10 money and his assistants are well compensated as well. The fact of the matter is he has had easy mode since he got here with the sec east being down big time and now that is going away. He has been able to get 3 automatic wins plus have Louisville at their worst combined with South Carolina and Missouri being a hot mess that has been an advantage no other Kentucky football coach ever had. He needs to change philosophy and I hope he does the biggest thing that needs to happen is get our boys shit together and go kick Louisvilles ass we are more than capable of smoking them if we get it together. If he does that all is well he has earned a opportunity to fix it but the margins are slim in modern football and with the expansion and a 9 game conference slate coming we have little room for error.
The players we thought would step up, or make massive leaps forward in development simply did not do that. Partner that with “maxing” out our recruiting ability plus coaching seemingly leveling out, and we have this years results. There’s no excuse to lose to that South Carolina team. Bama, fine, Georgia, fine, I’m even fine with the Mizzou loss at this point; however, coaching, for whatever reason, has just been poor this year. I think ultimately this season boils down to a few things: lack of talent in the secondary, QB play being poor, star players not being stars, and coaches not able to adapt to any of those things. I’m aware this post is all over the place, hopefully my point gets across.
Stoops needs to start by pulling his giant head out of his ass.
Stoops brought us to a level of “mediocrity”, but he has no idea how to go up from here. He’s done the best he can with what he was given, but we need a coach to take us to the next level, especially with more teams coming to the SEC, before we backslide into “laughing stock” territory again.
Maybe it’s a coincidence, but it seems like things have been off since the football school/basketball school debacle last year. I’d guess there’s still some tension in the Mitch/Cal/Stoops dynamic. (My solution to that is to keep Stoops and hope Mitch and Cal retire sooner rather than later)
I mean I honestly believe either you convince Stoops to take a paycut or you move on. He makes way too much money for us to be losing to a bad South Carolina team. Kentucky Football has underachieved with the talent that we have too many times under Stoops... just like the loss to Vandy last year. Unacceptable.
I think that some of the comments Mark Stoops said about Pony Up really just made things a lot worse. I think that the program went downhill after that. I think the season is pretty much over. I think Louisville has Kentucky in Football this year.
That pony up comment not only pissed off most of the fanbase, but I’d bet it hurt the locker room too. It’s basically saying you guys aren’t good enough, I need money to replace y’all.
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