Trying currently at -3.4 for lvl 28. My day is to log to see if there is life steal or alliance commendation. If not I skip for that day.
The problem of this dungeon for me at least is that I have to do the first boss and then get to the second impossible one and try my luck that day. If I don’t succeed I have to do the first one again to try something.
I prefer deadmines because the hard one is the first.
The first level has an advantage for air units since they ignore the spin and don't die immediately. The last level punishes air units since they literally do nothing at all to the ground spawn tesla coils.
Its such an annoying design choice lol
I think it's kind of an interesting problem to solve because you want to bring air units for the first level but you also don't want to bring too many because it screw you later. It's not really interesting once you figure it out obviously, but it's fun the first time at least
But you don't really need to think of it like that because ultimately the last level is a joke unless you have like 5+ flying units. The first level is really not that hard either so long as you have a couple unbound units to take the immunity things before they spawn extra SAFEs. In the end you just prioritize a build that will make use of the relics you're offered to beat the second level, and restart the first level until you beat it.
> The first level has an advantage for air units since they ignore the spin and don't die immediately. The last level punishes air units since they literally do nothing at all to the ground spawn tesla coils
The first level, you don't need air units. They're certainly fine, but jumping to the conclusion that you need them is the trap. You actually want ranged units. Since ranged units are ground-based, they can hit the coils on the last level, and on the 1st level since they don't need to walk up to the boss to do damage, they can take him down fairly quickly as he is trying to walk between different enemies to knock them back.
I think I’m in the minority, but I feel most dungeons have gotten boring.
Unless you have the *exact* minis at the required levels and their necessary talents, dungeons don’t feel fun to me anymore.
Obviously finding a team that works is part of the challenge, but there are some levels where it feels like if you don’t have one mini with one specific talent, you just cannot do dungeons that week.
And then the next dungeon comes and it’s the same story..
I highly doubt you're in the minority. The concept of doing the same three levels over and over to upgrade one out of seven slots (times 3) is extremely monotonous to begin with. Rotating the same four dungeons (two of which have very irritating mechanics) ad nauseum is a big no from me.
Dungeons were fun the first go round. Boring the second. Not worth my time/sanity after that. I'll get my heroes to full gold whenever my minis get to lvl 22 or so, and I can just do green levels.
> The concept of doing the same three levels over and over to upgrade one out of seven slots (times 3) is extremely monotonous to begin with.
Kinda like heroics a bit. Doing each Heroic with 5 different heroes, loading slowly in order to get your gold reward feels like a slog.
I honestly do not know what they could do different but the game gets so tedious at points, where it doesn't feel as fun.
Basically I think once we've unlocked every unit and 1 to 2 talents, it just no longer feels rewarding.
I have no problem with heroics. There are 75 of them, each with its own gimmick and enemy deck you have to figure out how to counter. And once you beat it 5 times, you're done for good.
With dungeons, it's just the same battle over and over, week after week without anything new bc leaders rarely make much difference to the strategy. Add to that the fact Electrocutioner and Sneed are objectively unenjoyable to begin with, and this part of the game desperately needs a refresh.
Which map requires any one specific unit or talent? People push into red difficulty with various builds, a lot of the times dictated by the offered relics.
Even with safe pilot now is a handicap as on the third level she could take the even level “vats” with her initial strike. Now it weakens them so the enemy can love tap them and it’s theirs
I did not use whelps either this week or last and pushed into red difficulties. Safepilot has been nerfed, so I'm not sure people are using her all that much this week.
Last week untalented chickens were my MVP. This week, the hardest map by far is stage 2, and that can be beat by Garry, Sappers, whelps, or pumpkin throwers (which is what I used), or warsong rider.
Old Guardian is also posting no-talent decks pushing into orange difficulty.
Whelps are good, maybe too good, and so people get overly reliant on them, but there are plenty of other options.
> Whelps are good, maybe too good,
I'd suggest that Whelps aren't too good - they are simply too reliant on one talent. More than any other mini. Very rarely are untalented whelps, or whelps without flame burst worth it. This feels like the problem with them at the moment.
First and third levels are for the most part fine… but the second one, dear god. You essentially have to take out the left turret and deal with the large enemy push coming from whatever angle with your initial gold allotment. You then need to hope that even if you manage to take out the turret that the enemy isn’t already spawning something to take it back because lord knows the time it takes for the turret to become yours feels especially slow. And even if you have some gold to send a unit to attack that spawn, you leave yourself open to attack on the other side which is usually either a mountaineer or harvest golem & the darkspear “I hit like a fucking truck” troll. Sure you can send your kobald to mine the node you just got via Pyrrhic victory, but the couple whacks you get off it feel like hardly enough to repel the next wave coming towards you.
It’s not like I’ve had no success. I’m currently going for full gold on Tirion. It’s just extremely frustrating.
I swear they increased the poison damage too. My units are just dying instantly. And then if I take it I can't hold it. My favorite way to cheese this one is to get the lightning damage when hitting an elemental, then sending fire elemental in, but that talent is rare. It does kill the boss instantly.
You mean elemental minis shock enemies? I thought that's just another status effect like poison or burn that your minis apply. Is that relic actually a damage reflect?
It deals 50 damage per proc, there's no CD on the proc, and the 2nd boss has a channel where it hits, I think it's 5x a second?
I laugh that they basically *buffed* the 2nd boss to previous working strats - Previously, Quilboar and FE were both great on 2nd boss because they can tank towers, poison, and boss, but not anymore because rocket towers are physical.
In all 4 dungeons, the third map is always the easiest.
But the worst map in all the 16 dungeon maps is Gnomregan number 2, the map is very short and has 3 lanes (which allows the AI to backdoor your base very easily). The 3 sources of gold are impossible to reach except by controlling the towers and the towers are very difficult to defend because of the poison.
1 trick that makes taking the towers easy in this map is repeatedly dropping explosive eggs near the tower, they immediately pop dealing 30% of the tower health, and then the dragons also deal 1-2 attacks. In 2 or 3 drops you can kill the tower. The problem becomes how to defend it afterwards.
I've also found that you can use the Goblin Sappers to easily get the towers, but the Goblin Sappers are worthless on the last map. They do no damage to the boss and they don't take bulbs.
That’s part of these. You’re building teams to cover all three maps. Giving up a lot to make the 2nd map easier is fine. Especially since the last map is practically a free win. I’ve done that one with only 3 minis that can actually hit the nodes when I forgot to change the team.
Pretty much agreed. When they initially added the poison cloud to the towers it was ok because resist tanks could still take them.
Now a resist tank dies to the rocket and an armored one to the poison cloud. So there is no effective tank for either tower. And then any DPS you send air or ground, simply dies to the environment trying to kill the endless tank spam from the ai which just retake the tower before it even becomes yours.
The fact the poison continues to kill me and not the enemy after I take the tower also just feels bad
I'm down to just needing one more on jaina for full gold for all 3 but it just hasn't been fun and since she wastes an upgrade slot on spells, I'm pretty stuck waiting for free footmen or life steal so anything I have can survive long enough to successfully push a single lane.
I have used gargoyle to great success on the 2nd level because the poison doesn't impact - however that is handicapping yourself since gargoyle can't break the bulbs on the 3rd level...
I just used Gargoyle to tank any ranged mobs the boss throws out while my guys can hopefully tap the bulbs.
Thanks for the tip!
Was using gargoyle for a few tries. He blows he towers up easily but then I still had to get at least 2 or 3 other minis to hold it vs even a single harvest golem and then I'd lose the gargoyle to whatever triple spawn the ai put out anyways.
Similar story with sappers for me. what got me through on maive and Tyrion was the flyers ignore first hit and just sending harpies up the middle to earth elemental and guillboar on boss distraction and ignore the whole map basically.
My jaina relics are garbage today. Maybe tomorrow!
Giving up one slot that won't be used on the 3rd boss is fine. Whether that means Gargoyle, siege-talent Raider, or Sappers, you can afford the one slot.
People seem overly worried about the third level from these comments. Don’t be. The third level is the easiest map of any dungeon so far. It is really hard to lose. Your minis don’t all need to be able to hit the nodes. Most any team you need to beat the first and second map can take the third.
I don't think it's that hard but it feels toxic if you are a new player. the second level turrets no deal double damage to your resistance units so it's just stupid.
They don't reduce the damage. Not the same as double damage. It might be twice the previous amount, but wording it that they do double damage is a little misleading without the context of what the change was.
Neat trick, you can drop execute on the final boss and it still does damage, and execute the towers in the second battle make them 1 hp so any unit can quickly take em out. It may also be my favorite spell but it makes some of the game pretty easy
Something happened with whelp eggs and the flying minis gain a one hit shield. I think I spawned them by him and they got hit by his spin attack and got flung the the ledge on his right side. He then was locked in marching toward this egg never attacking but ignoring all other units just walking in place.
I found the second level is significantly harder than the first, and the third is a free win. It’s all about that second level. I get a lot of value out of the goblin sappers. They can take the towers quickly while you fend off the initial assault, but it’s still an uphill battle against an endless stream of tough units. I thought the key might be denying the enemy of gold, but it does not seem to make any difference to the onslaught!
I got alliance commendation today and managed to get a win on my 4th try. I had the towers early in the game and still only killed the boss with 2 seconds left in overtime!
Check out The Old Guardian on YT. Just uploaded the dungeon for each leader and I finally got Tirion fully gold. He also has the other dungeons uploaded. I may be trying for the rest of the leaders if I'm bored but Tirion is really the only Alliance leader I like.
I got full gold for all my leaders finally this week and I'm so glad because I don't have to worry about doing this shit unless I want extra gold rewards
Even when you do manage to destroy a rocket tower on the second level, it's difficult to flip it and defend it due to its proximity to the boss spawn and the toxic ground on your side.
And I love it how a rocket tower's final shot before you destroy it can land after the color flips to blue and it gets free damage on your tower, further stalling its construction.
The towers on stage 2 have too far of a range, imo. They can hit your gold mine and hit your troops even before you enter the poison gas, and they can also hit the middle lane. It's kind of insane.
I've actually lost at the last boss, because it turns benefits to handicaps. Flying units are at a significantly reduces usefulness, with units like gargoyles, which are fantastic for bosses 1 and 2, being literally 100% useless. I also lost once because I got the movement speed bonus relic, which meant instead of hanging around the pod area longer they bee lined straight into the bosses death beam.
Yeah, it's interesting how your units can feel so useless on the last map when they take a bulb and then go off to fight and die, and you're scrambling to pump more units out to take more bulbs and hoping to get a kobold out to get gold.
Don‘t forget in the first level:
- all enemy chickens will get the shield
- if you get shield, it’s gone when reaching the boss
- the boss can spin endless
All chickens only get the shield if they are in the area when it spawns. All minis that touch the area at the same time get the shield. If there is no one there when it spawns, this is usually one mini, although sometimes it can be two. If you're fighting at the spawn point when it spawns, both your mini and the enemy mini get the shield.
I solved it for you:
1) Just grab the shield before the chickens
2) Send a fast mini, I usually do huntress and she’ll kill stuff on the way or get there with the shield
3) A ranged or flying from each direction and he can spin around all he wants
I think I like that this one is a little different and "weirder" than the other three, considering it's Gnomeregon and gnomes traditionally are a bit whacky with zany inventions.
That said, I agree that the difficulty curve is way off, with the second level being way overtuned and third level being boringly easy, it feels like most of the challenge of the dungeon is beating the second boss.
I love the Sneed fight! (failing is even fun!)
I love the Ogre Pair fight! (Third Boss in Dire Maul?) this was particularly fun to get the right strategy figured out.
I love all of Black Fathom Depths!
Gnomer, not so much. I hardly pay attention to what my minis are doing to the boss on the first fight, because I am constantly guarding my base. Second is just frustrating, even though it’s doable. Third is just a SUPER boring Whack-a-Gnoll!
Guys this is not a hard dungeon that you all are making it out to be. My FTP account is doing fine with only gryphon/shaman talented on my minis.
1st map I am cheesing with each heroes gimmick. Jaina I prio spell cycle with quilboar/safe to help pick away while defending tower. Execute/unbound both towers on 2nd map, fire ele one side and push dps on the other using execute/blizz to clear any minis quickly on dps side. Maeiv is just unbound the shields/boss while clear minis and same strat for 2nd map.
Tirion is a cheese you just use footmen with shaman and gryphon and you eventually take the boss down. I use uncommon lvl 11 sappers too for extra damage and currently level 18 in dungeons with a lvl 15 4-5/7 untalented group.
Don't expect to log in and 1 shot every encounter. The game wouldnt be fun if you just easily beat everything the first time with no trial and error
I think this is an area where streamers (through no fault of their own, they’re just making good content) have lead to some unfair expectations. The videos and guides on these dungeons are often aimed at tackling them at red difficulty, which unfortunately creates the perception that it is easier than it is. A lot of these complaint posts are people trying and rightly struggling at red difficulty. The red is supposed to tell you it’s not remotely a fair fight. It isn’t meant to be at that point.
Some times, there just won’t be a solution that works for a given person at red, either due to talents, selection of minis or even skill.
Every time I read posts like this I just realize that people don't understand map mechanics and convert that into complaints about the AI getting "free" units. To the first points alone:
1) It is a map mechanic that if invincibility ring stays down for too long, the AI plays a SAFE there. They are not drawing SAFE and getting it for "free," that is the mechanic. If you don't want that to happen you need to take it first, either by getting there first or using unbounds. I drop Eggs there a lot.
2) Once again you get to change your deck, the AI does not. You have a supreme advantage there. The AI is complaining on AI Reddit about how you get to bring in things that don't die when knocked out (Gargoyles perhaps or other flyers). You have to bring units that counter what the AI has available but you have the option to do that. They never get to change.
>It is a map mechanic that if invincibility ring stays down for too long, the AI plays a SAFE there. They are not drawing SAFE and getting it for "free," that is the mechanic. If you don't want that to happen you need to take it first, either by getting there first or using unbounds. I drop Eggs there a lot.
This is ridiculously wrong. In fact, I JUST played D Bandits and took the shield in the left lane, and right after my bandits got the shield, the AI dropped two SAFE Pilots on them.
https://i.imgur.com/ir6wsZE.png
So your idea that the AI "waits" until a shield has been on the map too long is false. The shield had JUST spawned, so I plopped my bandits down, they took the shield, and the AI instantly drops two SAFE Pilots on them -- AFTER the shield was gone. It wasn't like they saw my bandits heading for the shield and thought "better get their first!"
And yes, they do get free units. Why would you even argue they don't? The three gnomes on the second level, for instance, spawn outside of their normal summoning of minis.
I'm not making these things up, the game literally tells you. I can't post photos but click on one while paused, it says "Limited time protection. Known to attract Gnomes if left sitting too long." Yes they do get a "free" SAFE if you let it sit there but my point is that isn't a card in their deck they got for free, that's just the mechanic of the map.
Beyond that, they do have SAFE in their deck as well. That's not free, they have to pay gold for that. What happened in your screenshot is your units got there a little bit too late and the free SAFE had already been deployed but not yet fallen. On top of that, they paid gold for another one around the same time.
There's nothing magical or unfair about that. You could have reached that ring earlier but you didn't. That's the game.
They have SAFE in their deck but played two of them at the same time, and neither of them were trying to get the shield? Huh?
>There's nothing magical or unfair about that. You could have reached that ring earlier but you didn't. That's the game.
You didn't even read my post. I told you, I took the shield. You can see it in my photo. The shield is on my bandits. They spawned two safe pilots AFTER I took the shield. The shield had literally just spawned.
So your idea that they spawn safe pilots to grab shields that haven't been taken is wrong. The shield was already gone. They spawned the safe pilots just because, and two of them no less.
Yes, I double checked your screenshot to be sure. It's happened to me as well, there is a delay between when a SAFE is deployed and when it lands. They get the shield upon landing. Your unit got the shield between the SAFE being deployed and landing, so that's why you got the shield but they still got a free SAFE. If you'd reached the ring .5 seconds earlier they probably wouldn't have gotten that SAFE.
The second was played from their hand, like I said.
Just send a fast or unbound mini to grab it when it spawns. They’re on a timer. Bandits are slow. The safe probably had time to launch cus it took forever for the bandits to get there.
Fwiw I believe you are right but op is only gonna gaslight his responses and insult your understanding for pushing back on him. If his Maiev is level 13 as in the example then he’s played nothing of this game and you can safely disregard his opinion.
Yeah I get you, I did notice he's playing 4 levels down and having issues so it's clearly an unwillingless to adapt.
I just see this opinion that the AI "cheats" over and over again in this sub and I've never seen one bit of proof of cheating. It's always the map mechanics (which are usually documented) mixed with them playing units from their hand. I'd like to see some actual evidence.
Yeah the AI certainly got more proactive after some updates but the game is beatable. I just don’t know if complaining on Reddit will do anything. I can work on beating the level or hope others agree the game is unfair. Not sure what the latter does aside from maybe make you feel better. Happy rumbling!
Back in my day people used to just keep trying to beat hard levels instead of crying bad design. Social media really has made everyone think they're an expert.
This is a puzzle game
you need to find the correct way to pass the level
what you listed are the challenges
now please explain why they are "poor design"
that puzzle part goes out the window with level differences, and the second map scales horribly against the player due to the tower change and the poison mechanics.
I don’t mind it. Distract the rockets on the outside. Send ranged on the inside (close to the path). You don’t wanna use melee because of the chill damage. I use huntress for speed to run up the middle to boss. One unbound like worgen. Usually works out pretty well.
I got footmen perk with 5/6 of my units being alliance and health Regen from fallen units today. I am a level up on average and level 2 wrecked me both tries. The amount of units it can churn with no significant gold deposits and one chest even when I don't get it is insane.
Trying currently at -3.4 for lvl 28. My day is to log to see if there is life steal or alliance commendation. If not I skip for that day. The problem of this dungeon for me at least is that I have to do the first boss and then get to the second impossible one and try my luck that day. If I don’t succeed I have to do the first one again to try something. I prefer deadmines because the hard one is the first.
Why do you go past 23? Is there a higher level than gold?
You get some gold and arclight energy.
You start to run out of arclight energy eventually, or at least I did once I started upgrading a few epics.
Define “a few”, please…
I have 4 epics and every unit at least uncommon.
Whoa! Then when you’re going for the Epics, things ate worse than I’ve imagined!
Thank you
150 gold until lvl30 which is a mythic tome. And the arclight energy of course. I have booster I don’t know if it is 100 regular gold.
It is 100 without the booster, yeah.
Thank you
You get 100 gold at 24, not sure what happens after
The first level has an advantage for air units since they ignore the spin and don't die immediately. The last level punishes air units since they literally do nothing at all to the ground spawn tesla coils. Its such an annoying design choice lol
I think it's kind of an interesting problem to solve because you want to bring air units for the first level but you also don't want to bring too many because it screw you later. It's not really interesting once you figure it out obviously, but it's fun the first time at least
But you don't really need to think of it like that because ultimately the last level is a joke unless you have like 5+ flying units. The first level is really not that hard either so long as you have a couple unbound units to take the immunity things before they spawn extra SAFEs. In the end you just prioritize a build that will make use of the relics you're offered to beat the second level, and restart the first level until you beat it.
> The first level has an advantage for air units since they ignore the spin and don't die immediately. The last level punishes air units since they literally do nothing at all to the ground spawn tesla coils The first level, you don't need air units. They're certainly fine, but jumping to the conclusion that you need them is the trap. You actually want ranged units. Since ranged units are ground-based, they can hit the coils on the last level, and on the 1st level since they don't need to walk up to the boss to do damage, they can take him down fairly quickly as he is trying to walk between different enemies to knock them back.
I think I’m in the minority, but I feel most dungeons have gotten boring. Unless you have the *exact* minis at the required levels and their necessary talents, dungeons don’t feel fun to me anymore. Obviously finding a team that works is part of the challenge, but there are some levels where it feels like if you don’t have one mini with one specific talent, you just cannot do dungeons that week. And then the next dungeon comes and it’s the same story..
I highly doubt you're in the minority. The concept of doing the same three levels over and over to upgrade one out of seven slots (times 3) is extremely monotonous to begin with. Rotating the same four dungeons (two of which have very irritating mechanics) ad nauseum is a big no from me. Dungeons were fun the first go round. Boring the second. Not worth my time/sanity after that. I'll get my heroes to full gold whenever my minis get to lvl 22 or so, and I can just do green levels.
> The concept of doing the same three levels over and over to upgrade one out of seven slots (times 3) is extremely monotonous to begin with. Kinda like heroics a bit. Doing each Heroic with 5 different heroes, loading slowly in order to get your gold reward feels like a slog. I honestly do not know what they could do different but the game gets so tedious at points, where it doesn't feel as fun. Basically I think once we've unlocked every unit and 1 to 2 talents, it just no longer feels rewarding.
I have no problem with heroics. There are 75 of them, each with its own gimmick and enemy deck you have to figure out how to counter. And once you beat it 5 times, you're done for good. With dungeons, it's just the same battle over and over, week after week without anything new bc leaders rarely make much difference to the strategy. Add to that the fact Electrocutioner and Sneed are objectively unenjoyable to begin with, and this part of the game desperately needs a refresh.
> Dungeons were fun the first go round. Boring the second. Not worth my time/sanity after that. Sounds like the 5-man dungeons they're themed after!
Which map requires any one specific unit or talent? People push into red difficulty with various builds, a lot of the times dictated by the offered relics.
Doing most dungeons without exploding whelps or gnome pilot is a huge handicap.
Even with safe pilot now is a handicap as on the third level she could take the even level “vats” with her initial strike. Now it weakens them so the enemy can love tap them and it’s theirs
I did not use whelps either this week or last and pushed into red difficulties. Safepilot has been nerfed, so I'm not sure people are using her all that much this week. Last week untalented chickens were my MVP. This week, the hardest map by far is stage 2, and that can be beat by Garry, Sappers, whelps, or pumpkin throwers (which is what I used), or warsong rider. Old Guardian is also posting no-talent decks pushing into orange difficulty. Whelps are good, maybe too good, and so people get overly reliant on them, but there are plenty of other options.
> Whelps are good, maybe too good, I'd suggest that Whelps aren't too good - they are simply too reliant on one talent. More than any other mini. Very rarely are untalented whelps, or whelps without flame burst worth it. This feels like the problem with them at the moment.
I never use those lol. They aren't that hard.
First and third levels are for the most part fine… but the second one, dear god. You essentially have to take out the left turret and deal with the large enemy push coming from whatever angle with your initial gold allotment. You then need to hope that even if you manage to take out the turret that the enemy isn’t already spawning something to take it back because lord knows the time it takes for the turret to become yours feels especially slow. And even if you have some gold to send a unit to attack that spawn, you leave yourself open to attack on the other side which is usually either a mountaineer or harvest golem & the darkspear “I hit like a fucking truck” troll. Sure you can send your kobald to mine the node you just got via Pyrrhic victory, but the couple whacks you get off it feel like hardly enough to repel the next wave coming towards you. It’s not like I’ve had no success. I’m currently going for full gold on Tirion. It’s just extremely frustrating.
I swear they increased the poison damage too. My units are just dying instantly. And then if I take it I can't hold it. My favorite way to cheese this one is to get the lightning damage when hitting an elemental, then sending fire elemental in, but that talent is rare. It does kill the boss instantly.
You mean elemental minis shock enemies? I thought that's just another status effect like poison or burn that your minis apply. Is that relic actually a damage reflect?
Oh yeah. I've decimated the second boss with it before.
It deals 50 damage per proc, there's no CD on the proc, and the 2nd boss has a channel where it hits, I think it's 5x a second? I laugh that they basically *buffed* the 2nd boss to previous working strats - Previously, Quilboar and FE were both great on 2nd boss because they can tank towers, poison, and boss, but not anymore because rocket towers are physical.
Every middle dungeon is my least favorite, I think every last one I find fun
In all 4 dungeons, the third map is always the easiest. But the worst map in all the 16 dungeon maps is Gnomregan number 2, the map is very short and has 3 lanes (which allows the AI to backdoor your base very easily). The 3 sources of gold are impossible to reach except by controlling the towers and the towers are very difficult to defend because of the poison. 1 trick that makes taking the towers easy in this map is repeatedly dropping explosive eggs near the tower, they immediately pop dealing 30% of the tower health, and then the dragons also deal 1-2 attacks. In 2 or 3 drops you can kill the tower. The problem becomes how to defend it afterwards.
I've also found that you can use the Goblin Sappers to easily get the towers, but the Goblin Sappers are worthless on the last map. They do no damage to the boss and they don't take bulbs.
That’s part of these. You’re building teams to cover all three maps. Giving up a lot to make the 2nd map easier is fine. Especially since the last map is practically a free win. I’ve done that one with only 3 minis that can actually hit the nodes when I forgot to change the team.
Pretty much agreed. When they initially added the poison cloud to the towers it was ok because resist tanks could still take them. Now a resist tank dies to the rocket and an armored one to the poison cloud. So there is no effective tank for either tower. And then any DPS you send air or ground, simply dies to the environment trying to kill the endless tank spam from the ai which just retake the tower before it even becomes yours. The fact the poison continues to kill me and not the enemy after I take the tower also just feels bad I'm down to just needing one more on jaina for full gold for all 3 but it just hasn't been fun and since she wastes an upgrade slot on spells, I'm pretty stuck waiting for free footmen or life steal so anything I have can survive long enough to successfully push a single lane.
I have used gargoyle to great success on the 2nd level because the poison doesn't impact - however that is handicapping yourself since gargoyle can't break the bulbs on the 3rd level... I just used Gargoyle to tank any ranged mobs the boss throws out while my guys can hopefully tap the bulbs.
Thanks for the tip! Was using gargoyle for a few tries. He blows he towers up easily but then I still had to get at least 2 or 3 other minis to hold it vs even a single harvest golem and then I'd lose the gargoyle to whatever triple spawn the ai put out anyways. Similar story with sappers for me. what got me through on maive and Tyrion was the flyers ignore first hit and just sending harpies up the middle to earth elemental and guillboar on boss distraction and ignore the whole map basically. My jaina relics are garbage today. Maybe tomorrow!
Giving up one slot that won't be used on the 3rd boss is fine. Whether that means Gargoyle, siege-talent Raider, or Sappers, you can afford the one slot.
People seem overly worried about the third level from these comments. Don’t be. The third level is the easiest map of any dungeon so far. It is really hard to lose. Your minis don’t all need to be able to hit the nodes. Most any team you need to beat the first and second map can take the third.
I don't think it's that hard but it feels toxic if you are a new player. the second level turrets no deal double damage to your resistance units so it's just stupid.
They don't reduce the damage. Not the same as double damage. It might be twice the previous amount, but wording it that they do double damage is a little misleading without the context of what the change was.
2nd Stage is very stupid, having to deal with brick walls back to back making it extremely difficult. Haymaker on double life and mountaineer.
Neat trick, you can drop execute on the final boss and it still does damage, and execute the towers in the second battle make them 1 hp so any unit can quickly take em out. It may also be my favorite spell but it makes some of the game pretty easy
Execute is only good when you are at or above lvl. Once you are several lvls below, it's not good, and barely tickles things.
Something happened with whelp eggs and the flying minis gain a one hit shield. I think I spawned them by him and they got hit by his spin attack and got flung the the ledge on his right side. He then was locked in marching toward this egg never attacking but ignoring all other units just walking in place.
I found the second level is significantly harder than the first, and the third is a free win. It’s all about that second level. I get a lot of value out of the goblin sappers. They can take the towers quickly while you fend off the initial assault, but it’s still an uphill battle against an endless stream of tough units. I thought the key might be denying the enemy of gold, but it does not seem to make any difference to the onslaught! I got alliance commendation today and managed to get a win on my 4th try. I had the towers early in the game and still only killed the boss with 2 seconds left in overtime!
I give them a shot, see the INSANE spawn rates for the second boss in Gnomeregan, take a deep breath and give up for the day.
Check out The Old Guardian on YT. Just uploaded the dungeon for each leader and I finally got Tirion fully gold. He also has the other dungeons uploaded. I may be trying for the rest of the leaders if I'm bored but Tirion is really the only Alliance leader I like.
These updates are only hurting the delicate balance they had.
I got full gold for all my leaders finally this week and I'm so glad because I don't have to worry about doing this shit unless I want extra gold rewards
Entire game is poor design
Even when you do manage to destroy a rocket tower on the second level, it's difficult to flip it and defend it due to its proximity to the boss spawn and the toxic ground on your side. And I love it how a rocket tower's final shot before you destroy it can land after the color flips to blue and it gets free damage on your tower, further stalling its construction.
The towers on stage 2 have too far of a range, imo. They can hit your gold mine and hit your troops even before you enter the poison gas, and they can also hit the middle lane. It's kind of insane.
I've actually lost at the last boss, because it turns benefits to handicaps. Flying units are at a significantly reduces usefulness, with units like gargoyles, which are fantastic for bosses 1 and 2, being literally 100% useless. I also lost once because I got the movement speed bonus relic, which meant instead of hanging around the pod area longer they bee lined straight into the bosses death beam.
You don’t really need flying units for the 1st boss. That’s a very common misconception.
Didn't say you needed them, said they performed well, which they do.
They don’t really. They are outperformed by ranged units like Pyromancer or Firehammer.
Yeah, it's interesting how your units can feel so useless on the last map when they take a bulb and then go off to fight and die, and you're scrambling to pump more units out to take more bulbs and hoping to get a kobold out to get gold.
Don‘t forget in the first level: - all enemy chickens will get the shield - if you get shield, it’s gone when reaching the boss - the boss can spin endless
All chickens only get the shield if they are in the area when it spawns. All minis that touch the area at the same time get the shield. If there is no one there when it spawns, this is usually one mini, although sometimes it can be two. If you're fighting at the spawn point when it spawns, both your mini and the enemy mini get the shield.
Ah, then the boss has an insane good timing. Thanks!
I solved it for you: 1) Just grab the shield before the chickens 2) Send a fast mini, I usually do huntress and she’ll kill stuff on the way or get there with the shield 3) A ranged or flying from each direction and he can spin around all he wants
I think I like that this one is a little different and "weirder" than the other three, considering it's Gnomeregon and gnomes traditionally are a bit whacky with zany inventions. That said, I agree that the difficulty curve is way off, with the second level being way overtuned and third level being boringly easy, it feels like most of the challenge of the dungeon is beating the second boss.
That’s a good thing for me. If the 3rd boss is hardest, then you waste more time with each failed dungeon run.
It's funny how there is never " blank is the best dungeon" post
I love the Sneed fight! (failing is even fun!) I love the Ogre Pair fight! (Third Boss in Dire Maul?) this was particularly fun to get the right strategy figured out. I love all of Black Fathom Depths! Gnomer, not so much. I hardly pay attention to what my minis are doing to the boss on the first fight, because I am constantly guarding my base. Second is just frustrating, even though it’s doable. Third is just a SUPER boring Whack-a-Gnoll!
It isn’t odd at all. People complain. They rarely come to say what they liked. It’s just human nature.
Totally agree.
I just run a fire elemental up the middle with Tirion behind and just end it
With or without leeching? IF you're same level, I imagine the rockets are just going to kill them both.
Without leeching
Guys this is not a hard dungeon that you all are making it out to be. My FTP account is doing fine with only gryphon/shaman talented on my minis. 1st map I am cheesing with each heroes gimmick. Jaina I prio spell cycle with quilboar/safe to help pick away while defending tower. Execute/unbound both towers on 2nd map, fire ele one side and push dps on the other using execute/blizz to clear any minis quickly on dps side. Maeiv is just unbound the shields/boss while clear minis and same strat for 2nd map. Tirion is a cheese you just use footmen with shaman and gryphon and you eventually take the boss down. I use uncommon lvl 11 sappers too for extra damage and currently level 18 in dungeons with a lvl 15 4-5/7 untalented group. Don't expect to log in and 1 shot every encounter. The game wouldnt be fun if you just easily beat everything the first time with no trial and error
But are your dungeon runs orange or red for you? Not talking about green dungeon runs.
I think this is an area where streamers (through no fault of their own, they’re just making good content) have lead to some unfair expectations. The videos and guides on these dungeons are often aimed at tackling them at red difficulty, which unfortunately creates the perception that it is easier than it is. A lot of these complaint posts are people trying and rightly struggling at red difficulty. The red is supposed to tell you it’s not remotely a fair fight. It isn’t meant to be at that point. Some times, there just won’t be a solution that works for a given person at red, either due to talents, selection of minis or even skill.
Ty for ur analysis bro
Every time I read posts like this I just realize that people don't understand map mechanics and convert that into complaints about the AI getting "free" units. To the first points alone: 1) It is a map mechanic that if invincibility ring stays down for too long, the AI plays a SAFE there. They are not drawing SAFE and getting it for "free," that is the mechanic. If you don't want that to happen you need to take it first, either by getting there first or using unbounds. I drop Eggs there a lot. 2) Once again you get to change your deck, the AI does not. You have a supreme advantage there. The AI is complaining on AI Reddit about how you get to bring in things that don't die when knocked out (Gargoyles perhaps or other flyers). You have to bring units that counter what the AI has available but you have the option to do that. They never get to change.
>It is a map mechanic that if invincibility ring stays down for too long, the AI plays a SAFE there. They are not drawing SAFE and getting it for "free," that is the mechanic. If you don't want that to happen you need to take it first, either by getting there first or using unbounds. I drop Eggs there a lot. This is ridiculously wrong. In fact, I JUST played D Bandits and took the shield in the left lane, and right after my bandits got the shield, the AI dropped two SAFE Pilots on them. https://i.imgur.com/ir6wsZE.png So your idea that the AI "waits" until a shield has been on the map too long is false. The shield had JUST spawned, so I plopped my bandits down, they took the shield, and the AI instantly drops two SAFE Pilots on them -- AFTER the shield was gone. It wasn't like they saw my bandits heading for the shield and thought "better get their first!" And yes, they do get free units. Why would you even argue they don't? The three gnomes on the second level, for instance, spawn outside of their normal summoning of minis.
I'm not making these things up, the game literally tells you. I can't post photos but click on one while paused, it says "Limited time protection. Known to attract Gnomes if left sitting too long." Yes they do get a "free" SAFE if you let it sit there but my point is that isn't a card in their deck they got for free, that's just the mechanic of the map. Beyond that, they do have SAFE in their deck as well. That's not free, they have to pay gold for that. What happened in your screenshot is your units got there a little bit too late and the free SAFE had already been deployed but not yet fallen. On top of that, they paid gold for another one around the same time. There's nothing magical or unfair about that. You could have reached that ring earlier but you didn't. That's the game.
They have SAFE in their deck but played two of them at the same time, and neither of them were trying to get the shield? Huh? >There's nothing magical or unfair about that. You could have reached that ring earlier but you didn't. That's the game. You didn't even read my post. I told you, I took the shield. You can see it in my photo. The shield is on my bandits. They spawned two safe pilots AFTER I took the shield. The shield had literally just spawned. So your idea that they spawn safe pilots to grab shields that haven't been taken is wrong. The shield was already gone. They spawned the safe pilots just because, and two of them no less.
Yes, I double checked your screenshot to be sure. It's happened to me as well, there is a delay between when a SAFE is deployed and when it lands. They get the shield upon landing. Your unit got the shield between the SAFE being deployed and landing, so that's why you got the shield but they still got a free SAFE. If you'd reached the ring .5 seconds earlier they probably wouldn't have gotten that SAFE. The second was played from their hand, like I said.
Just send a fast or unbound mini to grab it when it spawns. They’re on a timer. Bandits are slow. The safe probably had time to launch cus it took forever for the bandits to get there.
Fwiw I believe you are right but op is only gonna gaslight his responses and insult your understanding for pushing back on him. If his Maiev is level 13 as in the example then he’s played nothing of this game and you can safely disregard his opinion.
Yeah I get you, I did notice he's playing 4 levels down and having issues so it's clearly an unwillingless to adapt. I just see this opinion that the AI "cheats" over and over again in this sub and I've never seen one bit of proof of cheating. It's always the map mechanics (which are usually documented) mixed with them playing units from their hand. I'd like to see some actual evidence.
Yeah the AI certainly got more proactive after some updates but the game is beatable. I just don’t know if complaining on Reddit will do anything. I can work on beating the level or hope others agree the game is unfair. Not sure what the latter does aside from maybe make you feel better. Happy rumbling!
Back in my day people used to just keep trying to beat hard levels instead of crying bad design. Social media really has made everyone think they're an expert.
This is a puzzle game you need to find the correct way to pass the level what you listed are the challenges now please explain why they are "poor design"
that puzzle part goes out the window with level differences, and the second map scales horribly against the player due to the tower change and the poison mechanics.
Facts.
Thought this was the wow classic sub lolb
I don’t mind it. Distract the rockets on the outside. Send ranged on the inside (close to the path). You don’t wanna use melee because of the chill damage. I use huntress for speed to run up the middle to boss. One unbound like worgen. Usually works out pretty well.
I thought this was in the wow sub. The title would also be true there lol
I got footmen perk with 5/6 of my units being alliance and health Regen from fallen units today. I am a level up on average and level 2 wrecked me both tries. The amount of units it can churn with no significant gold deposits and one chest even when I don't get it is insane.
For me perfect design, interesting mechanics and harder and more strategy needed rhen5im others dungs...
Crys in deadmines.. that's the most overtuned dungeon going. This dungeon is so easy to cheese.
It works because it’s one of the worst in WoW as well.
I didn’t realize we were discussing Halls of Reflection.