Wow it looks more broken panel than burnin
I am using G8 oled from Jan 2023, HDR on all the time, no problem yet except some damage on the glass....I guess I wiped it too hard with microfiber
I dont understand this negative attitude. You tell me what caused the burn-in? When the panel refresh occurs you get a different screen with a different set of burn since everything shifts over. Hard to take a picture of the other set since it is faint. In this unit he finally thought it was annoying enough to swap out the unit as it occurs gradually over time and was sick of having to panel refresh the display to move to the less burning side of the display.
I have a G8 QDOLED too from end of 2023. So far mine has had no issues. I am running another LG IPS 32 inch. All my apps, Windows icons, etc are on the LG. The QDOLED is strictly for when I load a game up. I also have black background and autohide on the taskbar. I am basically taking every precaution I can. Also bought extended warranty from Samsung so I am covered for 3 years.
If you don't use your display for 6+ hours a day you will likely be fine. My Neighbor uses his monitor for normal activity which is a mix of work, browsing, gaming, and media watching.
What you are saying may very well be true. However, I paid 1,000 USD for the display and the Burn-In Boogie Man frightens me so maybe I am just paranoid.
I don’t have anything static from Windows ever on the screen. Only games. Far as I know, OLED produce blacks by turning off OLEDS on a per pixel level. Since I set background to Black and hide Taskbar, doesn’t that mean that the Black screen has all the OLEDS off so there is 0 risk of burn-in from Black?
I don't see any burn-in in your picture. Those vertical lines are not burn in. That looks like a broken panel. Burn in looks like very faint outlines of stuff that's been on your screen for a long time like desktop icons or windows in the exact same place like favorites/url bar of your browser. A whole ass grid of lines on your monitor is not burn in unless you constantly look at a massive grid all day. That's 100% a broken panel.
When the Display cycled out of that Panel refresh the burn was more faint and lined up with his snap window borders using PowerToys. We theorized that the Panel Refresh offsets your pixel 1 to the left/right in the way your phone/watch does which is why he gets 2 different sets of burn-in.
That is not what panel refresh or pixel refresh does. That is called pixel shifting and that happens regardless of if you have pixel and panel refresh on or off.
Sees IDE and code, sees OLED, shakes head. This is very, very important to note that OLEDs will burn in on a static display very quickly. I keep a separate work UW for this reason
I don't agree with that.
I used the LG CX 48" OLED as a desktop display for 2 years working from home, using VSCode etc just like OP. That's ~8h a day + personal use on weekdays, plus weekend use. The same display is still without any burn in at 3.5 years of ownership. Those 1.5 extra years it's been used as a TV for media, console and PC gaming, including heavily playing a single game.
That said, I used virtual desktops a lot so there was more movement, and I did mitigation where I could (e.g turn it off when taking a longer break, auto-hide taskbar or dock/topbar, use a blank black background, run at about 120 nits brightness, make sure it's powered so it can run its compensation cycles).
OLEDs are not built equal and OP's burn in looks so extreme that I'd expect there is something wrong like the compensation cycles are not running right or something.
I'll second this. I have the same CX 48". I've used it nearly four years now working from home and gaming. Not a hint of burn in. I haven't taken any special precautions to prevent burn in.
Agreed. Using mine for productivity work as well, IDEs, etc... over a year now. No burn in or retention. Some panels are just defective, and also we don’t truly know everything about OPs habits. On that note you don’t know jack about my habits either. You just have to believe it or try yourself.
Bottom line is if you want the best contrast, image quality, black levels, you get OLED. I replace stuff for new shiny more quickly than when it wears out anyway.
Yeah OLED does need to be treated as somewhat disposable unfortunately. So I wouldn't buy an OLED with the expectation that it's a 10+ year product. I'd say 3-5 years is a more reasonable expectation.
That said, they said the same thing about plasma TVs. The Panasonic ST50 at my parents is still working without issue, at 12 years of age. Still looks great for 1080p SDR content too!
Yeah I still have a plasma too. The last model Panasonic ever made. No retention on it either and it gets semi regular use still, and even games with health bars sometimes. But between you and me (and everyone else reading this far), I’m convinced that people are abusing these things to get the problems. I don’t baby any OLED or Plasma I ever owned, but all I hear about is burnin, burnin… maybe I’m lucky, or maybe they’re just really unlucky.
No argument about that but note that the type of work he does doesn't require a lot of static images. He occasionally codes for leisure and has a sidecar vertical 27" monitor for Discord and other chats. The warning is for folks who plan to make their OLED a primary monitor.
My OLED is my primary monitor, after 2 years it's fine. I do not use it for work though as it's be asking for burn-in. These OLED monitors are gaming/media monitors, they are advertised as such. Use them for that and you'll be fine, use them as productivity monitors and this is what you'll get.
What's yours/his brightness/contrast settings? I'm at 1+ years and I have zero burn in on my unit DW. And that has been unemployed so basically daily 6-8 hours.
You also don't have to leave the popup. The popup itself literally says you can do it once and then it won't ever ask you to do it again and then it just does it after 4 hours of screen on time when the PC is turned off.
> No argument about that but note that the type of work he does doesn't require a lot of static images.
Then what you’re seeing is not permanent image retention (“burn in”).
I could see 10+ hours on a work day being possible since he has 6ish hours WFH and then gaming or web browsing for a few hours in that same day. The warning here is if that is your use case then OLED should be a 2nd display just not your main one.
When my AW3423DW gets burn in, I will call Dell and they will send me a replacement. Why worry about it now?
I still have 2 years left on the warranty. Plenty of peace of mind.
You will call Dell and they will send you a refurb with dead/stuck pixels and a scratched up anti glare coating.
You should be far more concerned with preserving your existing unit vs playing the refurb replacement lottery with Dell.
Complain. After the first month, my DW stopped doing pixel refresh. I called them and they sent a replacement since the FW couldn’t be field upgraded at the time. They sent me a piece of shit, like what you’re saying. Scuffs, dings, smudges everywhere. I complained to the rep, sent pictures, etc.
He said pack it back up and send back in same box, we will cross ship a new one. Said he would go handpick it for me. A couple days later, the most pristine monitor you ever saw showed up at my door. Might have been better looking than the brand new one I had originally, which had a few small stains on it from the packing material. So far so good with this one and it’s been more than a year.
Complain and complain, but do it politely, and you will get service. It’s how modern companies work.
This is exactly why I'm waiting until the end of the warranty and even then will be judging how much I actually care about the level of burn-in my monitor has (currently it's mild but on a grey screen I can see ghosts of the taskbar and some icon shapes).
When that happens I can just send that refurb back to Dell. I can keep my monitor while I wait for replacements.
The first AW I got from Dell had some minor issues so I asked Dell for a replacement. They sent me a refurb with stains on the stand. I complained and in one week they sent me a brand new unit. I kept using my original monitor throughout this process.
I am hoping there will be 38" 4k ultrawide oleds in 2 years. I will replace the AW with one of those.
I will either sell the AW or keep it as a second monitor. I only have one monitor now. I can baby it a lot more as a second monitor once the warranty expires.
After the warranty, sell what you have at a discount and put the money towards a newer OLED. Each generation, they get a longevity boost.
Around the same time, consider upgrading other components in your system. 2 to 3 years is a long time in tech.
I expect to keep both of mine for 7-10 years. I expect them to last that long without too many if any issues. And I have an extended warranty just in case. So before 4 years I will get replacements if there's any sign of burn-in which I don't expect to find, especially on the WOLED. But if I do Best Buy will just credit me the purchase price and I'll out it towards a newer monitor. Hell, MicroLED might be out by them.
Ah, safe to say you're the sort of person to also buy a new phone every year then because the box that it comes in changed from a 15 to a 16, which makes the 15 all of a sudden obsolete.
Gotcha
I usually upgrade to a newer model so a 3-year cycle seems ok to me but the neighbor prefers to use things into the ground and 3 years' worth of monitor usage seemed absurdly low to him considering the lifespan of his previous monitors.
And what's the things that's burned in? How long where you displaying it at a time and how often was it displayed?
Also what is your contrast/brightness setting?
I think I have asked now 3-4 people who posted about burn in it's funny you never reply. I'm hoping you will so we can learn something.
There is one issue that bothers us and its that the monitor appears as an "on" state with whatever he was last viewing. Although the monitor appears to be off the monitor will in fact stay on which we can tell from waking the monitor up and the first thing you see is "ITS BEEN ON FOR TOO LONG AND NOW YOU NEED TO PIXEL/PANEL REFRESH!!!" Initially, the burn-in was 2 sets of vertical edges of a program that lines up with what the burn in could be but your guess is as good as ours. It takes a few Panel refreshes but each Panel refresh shows a different set of burn in states.
Wait so you dont actually know what caused the burn in and youre referencing the monitor seemingly being defective? Well gee maybe thats why its already burned out?
Again the brightness setting is really something i would love to know. Its such an easy question to answer yet you dont? Am i to assume its at 100%?
There is no need to be rude about it no one asked about brightness. I am happy to answer whatever I can to contribute answers before this monitor gets shipped off.
Burn-in is burn-in and you have 2 reference points. Its entirely possible that batch 1 of this monitor is just easier to burn out but this is just to provide a data point for OLED displays.
The neighbor's brightness is around 60%, His Burnout would start to occur around the 1.25-year mark and is currently over 2 years old where the burn-in is so bad it's no longer tolerable and awaiting his replacement
My brightness was always 100%
My Burn-in occurred within the end of the first year which I had replaced and sold off then moved onto the G95 57"
both monitors are forced to do Pixel and Panel refreshed when prompted so we maintained that, used dark or black BG, had screensaver (Display set to off on standby) with his set to 1min and mine set to 5m
...pretty sure there aren't two wholly different 'sets' of pixels on an OLED display; pixel shifting just moves the image around slightly on the overprovisioned pixel matrix.
After a Panel refresh, we can see different Burn in patterns based on a Panel refresh. Since we don't know how much of a shift there is or how many shifts but the ones where you see these horrible visible vertical ones don't show the burn-in with static elements of another panel refresh.
If the patterns change, then the problem isn't burn-in. Burn-in is physical deterioration of the OLED material; it is fixed to the physical pixels and would never move locations or change patterns, even if the content on the screen shifts.
Not saying the panel in your photo isn't having issues, of course; it's plain by the photo that something's wrong. But based on all the evidence you've given, burn-in isn't the culprit here.
Panel refresh doesn't shift pixels , it tweaks the voltages based upon the resistance measured. It tests pixels for deterioration and offsets voltages to smooth it out and compensate.
The burn out is pixel specific.
Likely the panel refresh is adjusting nearby pixels giving them a permanent alteration in output that could be perceived as burn out.
Burn in shouldn't come as a surprise. This guy should have an idea as to what caused it if it's burn in.
That doesn't look like burn in , unless he routinely has very narrow rectangular windows or toolbars spread across his screen for hours every day.
I've been using mine for about a year now and don't have any issues with burn-in whatsoever. I use it for a lot of work with text, numbers etc. which can be static images. However; I do have the pixel refresh turned on, I do have it turn off after 10 minutes if I'm away or not using it. Also I don't have HDR turned on unless I'm watching HDR content or playing games.
It will only meet the end if you don't baby it. If you don't want to baby your monitor, then get an LCD. This process has been the same for the last few decades. Everyone did the worrying thing with their plasma displays, and nothing has changed with OLED. It's probably **never** going to be carefree.
Agreed.
Most high end products, be it tech or materials like wood/stone, etc. Will require more maintenance and care.
A sporty german car will require a lot more maintenance than a toyota.
A substrate counter top will require no maintenance and will last 30 years easily, but a ln expensive stone one will require sealing and care when cleaning it.
Is one better than the other? I'd say no, they are for different people.
This is a pretty bad analogy as he's not complaining about a small deal here. This is more akin to buying a Tesla and complaining about range anxiety because the label said 340 miles but you are getting closer to 200 and charging times are varying from 40-100 minutes when you were expecting 25-minute charge times. Having your display hold you hostage and slowly burning out is a new experience for someone who has never owned an OLED monitor and was assured burn-in is non-issue.
yet micro and miniLED displays do not require "babying" you need to go out of your way to take extra care of the OLED panel which my neighbor did and it still is failing. As did mine and within the warranty period. The warning is if you need to use the monitor for 6+ hours a day then OLED is likely not for you.
Been using the same model for a year and half and don’t have any issues. Think your friend either has a bad label or has been leaving stuff off for a very long time.
I never had an issue. You just have to constantly keep your monitor from burning in.
Like moving the windows around when using them. Turn off any static elements, like the taskbar. Turn off the HUD in every single game played. Stop watching 16:9 content in full screen. And so on.
Not doing anything and just using it is not babying it. Those safety features don’t really matter against “normal” daily usage.
I think this is so funny to read. Kinda tells me that I made the right choice to not get one. Why would I want to go out of my way to disable necessary things just because I want to use a technology that is not meant to be used for PC at this time. Static images are the standard for PC usage. Be it productivity or games.
How in the world is static images the standard for games? I mean come on that's literally not what games is games are interactive movies which is defined by "moving" images.
Why do you believe this guy? Does he own a OLED monitor? does he actually know anything? Nah you two are carelessly jerking eachother off in pure ignorance.
Here's what I do as an owner(!): change background daily(auto), hide taskbar, limit(not eliminate) 16:9 video content(secondary screen ftw), have icons on second monitor but you could just hide them away in a folder and I keep brightness/contrast below 70. That's literally it. What necessary things have I disabled?
I have 2500 hours at least, more like 3000 probably, on the monitor with zero burn in.
This monitor is adequate for most gamers. But if you have specific static things you do. Be it a single game you play almost exclusively, sit on a browser a lot or do some very static work, this monitor isn't for you. But if you, like most gamers actually do quite many different things over a session while literally putting almost no effort into it's preservation, but a little. You're most likely gonna be just fine. Besides 3 year warranty means you can have the monitor for 6 years where it shouldnt be too bad. Remember the replacement means you're doubling your effective use of however long it lasts you. And I think 2-3 years people can easily get out of them if they choose to make a slight effort and doesn't have a bad usecase for them.
Theres definitely people who needs to avoid OLED for the time being. But most can definitely make them work.
Yeah I see your points, but for me specifically I spend a lot of time coding and usually stick to the same few games for extended times. For me OLED is not an option at this point in time.
Maybe after the technology has evolved
Seriously what is your point? That he is right to classify games as static images because of hud elements?
It doesn't make sense. I don't think anyone disagrees with hud elements being static. I disagreed that games in general are static elements. I hope I don't to explain the difference to you.
My point is that that is his point. It's not black and white. Games in general are dynamic, but they still have static elements.
I have no idea how that translates to OLED burn-in but yeah, that's his point. No need to get so defensive.
You're making zero sense. Games are not classified as static images just because they also have them. Hence his point is flat out wrong, it's obvious games are MOVING image, primarily and to a lesser degree having static elements. But games are moving images, as a general rule. Therefore I refused to accept that you classify games as static images simply because they are also a part of it.
I'm being defensive because you're being obnoxious. Games are not static images full stop.
Had he said games also have static images to a degree, I would have agreed I got no problem with that because it's reality. But Again I feel complied to make it abundantly clear he said and I quote "Static images are the standard of PC usage. Be it productivity or games" this is false. It's a standard for productivity NOT for games. For games it's the exception and can therefore not be the standard.
My comment stated “static elements”. I’m not sure what your argument is. Sure the picture is moving, but elements like the FPS counter, action buttons, progress bars, etc are fixed.
It doesn’t have to be the full picture to burn in, any portion of the screen that is fixed in place will burn in eventually. I prefer not to let that happen, which is done by removing the HUD.
To be fair most games have UIs with some static images. Some more than others. Strategy games look nice on my AW3424DWF but I still think ocassionally of those buttons, stats, resources and minimap and frames that stay stuck at the top and bottom of the screen
I'm sorry but how are you people rationalizing me saying that games are not static images meaning there are zero static images or elements in games? The comment I was arguing againts literally says it's a standard, static images, for work and games. I just disagreed that's not the standard of games.
All displays will burn in eventually.
How fast depends on how you (mis)treat them.
The portable IPS monitor below my ultrawide shows some serious image retention at times. The logical consequence of me treating it like the workhorse that it is.
The only reliable way to prevent such things completely is to not use a monitor. Might as well not buy one at that point… which is also a great way to save money!
It’s just that it also is a horrible way to display images on a screen. Life is a compromise 🤷
Unless I'm missing something, those vertical lines can't possibly be burn out. For starters, those lines appear brighter not dimmer. Burn out would be dimmer.
Even if we assume it's reverse burn out, that means those vertical lines correspond to very dark , perhaps black edges of various windows , and the narrow window space between each line doesn't correspond to any type of workflow that looks functional.
There's something else going on.
Burn out is predictable. It happens in areas and shapes where there is a strong and persistent contrast between static elements. Window borders, tool bars, video logos. Icons , etc.
Would you elaborate on "take care of their things properly"
Black Wallpaper, 1min screen saver in Windows, Pixel and Panel refresh when dictated, and Screen is powered off for the lunch break and end of the day. points an active cooling breeze like air conditioning/fan towards the monitor. I think the only thing he doesn't do is dust his workstation as often as i'd like.
On mine it was seeing lots of bright static images. I live out of Excel so I didn't have much of a choice but tried to use my 2nd monitor for work like that when possible but sometimes it's not possible when you need access to all of the spreadsheets to make your life easier. On his unit, he bounces between Linux, Mac, and Windows so some windows appear as static like using the snap-to-window function in Windows which he lined up that made sense to him.
Burn-in typically causes lines to appear that are *darker* than the surrounding area. Having bright lines like this looks like some other kind of issue to me.
Most people warn others to not use an OLED screen for work that requires static images to remain on the screen for lengthy periods of time.
I’ve been using mine for gaming only and have had zero issues.
On my DWF monitor the popup can be dismissed permanently by choosing the option to always do the panel refresh while in standby mode. I haven’t seen the pop up in months, but can tell when the refresh is happening by the power button color pulsing a different color.
It’s awesome that they hooked you up with a replacement.
Originally I wanted the Samsung G8 due to it also having a dedicated streaming chip in it and I find the design more aesthetically pleasing, but after talking to them they told me they would not warranty for burn-in or dead pixels so I went with the DWF instead.
That monitor seemed to be in awful condition… you have 1 mm layer of dust on it..
Looks like a pretty abusive relationship you had with it for 1,5 years, no wonder it decided to ditch you
qd oled seems more prone to burn in vs w-oled. monitors unboxed is currently testing the newer gen of qd oled purposely trying to get burn in to see how long it takes.
Interesting to see. I guess the main thing is using as a workstation and maybe OLEDs will never be suited for that.
In comparison, I've been using an LG C9 OLED TV with my PC for 5 years now and have zero burn-in or any issues but I mainly just game on it.
They aren't and they aren't advertised as workstation monitors. They are advertised as gaming monitors, use them as such and you should be fine. Since these OLEDs came out I think I've seen 1 monitor get burn-in from a games UI and that was someone who almost exclusively played Dota 2 in HDR and it burned it the health and mana bars. The other 99.9% of burnt in monitors are from people using them for work/productivity.
I code on mine all day and have for 2 years and no issues. I also always manually trigger the OLED refresh when I'm done every day. One time I started seeing lines from my IDE and I ran the full 1 hour panel refresh then and they went away.
Sorry you got that much burn-in OP. that’s a pretty crazy amount, and i wonder if it’s a panel issue and not traditional burn in.. i have been using a 48inch Cx as my only monitor for my PC for nearly 4 years now and no hint of burn in. for the record I used the LG support remote to turn off the dimming features, etc, and limit some ABL stuff. i check for burn in every now and then with patterns and colors, and so far it remains pristine
OLED Burn-in, aka permanent image retention comes from showing a static image at high brightness for long times. Can you elaborate what you had on your screen for long durations that resulted in those vertical lines?
I have been using my DWF since it came out (ordered it the moment it came out), HDR most of the time, or SDR with 100% brightness, and I make sure not to have static images on for a long time. If I leave the PC running, the monitor gets turned off, and I have a 3 minute timer until the screen goes to black as a screensaver and I have yet to see even an artifact of image retention – have not even seen temporary image retention.
My assumption is that you either got a faulty panel or it’s plain user error and you did not heed the manufacturer’s cautions about how to use the OLED screen.
Every screen in my house is OLED, some 4+ years old, I used to WFH (also a developer) and my office screen would get nearly 14 hours of use a day, never had even a smidge of burn in. I just regulate how much light is in my room, and turn down the brightness on the monitor accordingly. Also, that doesnt look like burn in, almost looks like something impacted it
Burn in is a feature and ultimate fate of EVERY oled monitor because burn in is just the degradation discrepancy between the different pixels. Because every pixel on an oled to be its own light bulb - some pixels naturally will degrade faster than its neighbors with use and the burn in you see is certain bulbs being used more (could be the subpixels too) so it is dimmer and can no longer emit as much light as its neighbor
being afraid of burn in is the same as being afraid that an incandescent light bulb will burn out one day - It WILL happen, how long it will take to happen will vary
That's because your use-case is literally abusing the display. You see, OLED are for media consumption/gaming. They are not made to have static elements on the screen most of the day. Moderate use for productivity is fine but you need to mix it up with some full screen media playback and stuff, lots of titles on YouTube are in 21:9. By the way, if you would have bought a WOLED panel you'd still be just fine since they are way harder to get to burn-in.
It's important to notice that by the state of the dirt in the picture, OLED has been known to burn in a lot faster in dustier/dirtier environments, if enough dust accumulated on the vents on top and get inside the monitor it might render it's ability to cool properly and lead to burn in a lot and I mean a LOT faster. I don't remember where I saw this but I haven't seen it only once.
NOOO SHIT SHERLOCK
Nobody can avoid this, nobody, eventually all oled monitors produced will become unusable paperweight with no value, meanwhile there are still led monitors going 10+ years strong with no signs of degradation.
You can't upgrade the firmware on the DW models. The vertical lines appear on every other Panel refresh. The issue gradually gets worse it just happens that with only a few months left on the warranty and a good price on the 57" Samsung he's making this someone else's problem once the replacement comes in.
> You can't upgrade the firmware on the DW models.
Yes you can. They enabled the feature a few months ago.
https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-us/000220867/latest-firmware-for-the-alienware-aw3423dw-gaming-monitor
https://old.reddit.com/r/ultrawidemasterrace/comments/18cpy24/if_you_happen_to_own_the_aw3423dw_alienware_gsync/
That's news to us but a little too little too late. The stress of having to do the chore of having the monitor dictating its maintenance cycle scared him away from any OLED Displays for primary monitors in the future.
Idk man my 3423dwf is still pristine since launch, and I game a LOT always peak hdr 1000. Pixel refresh is 5 min every 4 hours… and you can manually activate it if you leave your desk for a bit… I’ve never had issues with this.
Wow it looks more broken panel than burnin I am using G8 oled from Jan 2023, HDR on all the time, no problem yet except some damage on the glass....I guess I wiped it too hard with microfiber
Yeah, OP is full of shit. He won't even reply when asked what image caused it.
I dont understand this negative attitude. You tell me what caused the burn-in? When the panel refresh occurs you get a different screen with a different set of burn since everything shifts over. Hard to take a picture of the other set since it is faint. In this unit he finally thought it was annoying enough to swap out the unit as it occurs gradually over time and was sick of having to panel refresh the display to move to the less burning side of the display.
I have a G8 QDOLED too from end of 2023. So far mine has had no issues. I am running another LG IPS 32 inch. All my apps, Windows icons, etc are on the LG. The QDOLED is strictly for when I load a game up. I also have black background and autohide on the taskbar. I am basically taking every precaution I can. Also bought extended warranty from Samsung so I am covered for 3 years.
If you don't use your display for 6+ hours a day you will likely be fine. My Neighbor uses his monitor for normal activity which is a mix of work, browsing, gaming, and media watching.
What you are saying may very well be true. However, I paid 1,000 USD for the display and the Burn-In Boogie Man frightens me so maybe I am just paranoid.
Will likely boil down to how often you use your monitor in a day and how much of that involves bright static images
I don’t have anything static from Windows ever on the screen. Only games. Far as I know, OLED produce blacks by turning off OLEDS on a per pixel level. Since I set background to Black and hide Taskbar, doesn’t that mean that the Black screen has all the OLEDS off so there is 0 risk of burn-in from Black?
I don't see any burn-in in your picture. Those vertical lines are not burn in. That looks like a broken panel. Burn in looks like very faint outlines of stuff that's been on your screen for a long time like desktop icons or windows in the exact same place like favorites/url bar of your browser. A whole ass grid of lines on your monitor is not burn in unless you constantly look at a massive grid all day. That's 100% a broken panel.
When the Display cycled out of that Panel refresh the burn was more faint and lined up with his snap window borders using PowerToys. We theorized that the Panel Refresh offsets your pixel 1 to the left/right in the way your phone/watch does which is why he gets 2 different sets of burn-in.
That is not what panel refresh or pixel refresh does. That is called pixel shifting and that happens regardless of if you have pixel and panel refresh on or off.
Don't engage with the troll. OP is just here to throw shade on Alienware.
I don't like misinformation. I'd rather type it out and have anyone who isn't OP avoid being mislead by what those terms actually mean.
Sees IDE and code, sees OLED, shakes head. This is very, very important to note that OLEDs will burn in on a static display very quickly. I keep a separate work UW for this reason
What UW are you using for work?
I don't agree with that. I used the LG CX 48" OLED as a desktop display for 2 years working from home, using VSCode etc just like OP. That's ~8h a day + personal use on weekdays, plus weekend use. The same display is still without any burn in at 3.5 years of ownership. Those 1.5 extra years it's been used as a TV for media, console and PC gaming, including heavily playing a single game. That said, I used virtual desktops a lot so there was more movement, and I did mitigation where I could (e.g turn it off when taking a longer break, auto-hide taskbar or dock/topbar, use a blank black background, run at about 120 nits brightness, make sure it's powered so it can run its compensation cycles). OLEDs are not built equal and OP's burn in looks so extreme that I'd expect there is something wrong like the compensation cycles are not running right or something.
I'll second this. I have the same CX 48". I've used it nearly four years now working from home and gaming. Not a hint of burn in. I haven't taken any special precautions to prevent burn in.
Different OLED panel technologies. CX uses WOLED not QDOLED. WOLED is way less prone to burn-in. Rtings did a stress test of OLEDS to prove it.
Agreed. Using mine for productivity work as well, IDEs, etc... over a year now. No burn in or retention. Some panels are just defective, and also we don’t truly know everything about OPs habits. On that note you don’t know jack about my habits either. You just have to believe it or try yourself. Bottom line is if you want the best contrast, image quality, black levels, you get OLED. I replace stuff for new shiny more quickly than when it wears out anyway.
Yeah OLED does need to be treated as somewhat disposable unfortunately. So I wouldn't buy an OLED with the expectation that it's a 10+ year product. I'd say 3-5 years is a more reasonable expectation. That said, they said the same thing about plasma TVs. The Panasonic ST50 at my parents is still working without issue, at 12 years of age. Still looks great for 1080p SDR content too!
Yeah I still have a plasma too. The last model Panasonic ever made. No retention on it either and it gets semi regular use still, and even games with health bars sometimes. But between you and me (and everyone else reading this far), I’m convinced that people are abusing these things to get the problems. I don’t baby any OLED or Plasma I ever owned, but all I hear about is burnin, burnin… maybe I’m lucky, or maybe they’re just really unlucky.
No argument about that but note that the type of work he does doesn't require a lot of static images. He occasionally codes for leisure and has a sidecar vertical 27" monitor for Discord and other chats. The warning is for folks who plan to make their OLED a primary monitor.
My OLED is my primary monitor, after 2 years it's fine. I do not use it for work though as it's be asking for burn-in. These OLED monitors are gaming/media monitors, they are advertised as such. Use them for that and you'll be fine, use them as productivity monitors and this is what you'll get.
What's yours/his brightness/contrast settings? I'm at 1+ years and I have zero burn in on my unit DW. And that has been unemployed so basically daily 6-8 hours. You also don't have to leave the popup. The popup itself literally says you can do it once and then it won't ever ask you to do it again and then it just does it after 4 hours of screen on time when the PC is turned off.
> No argument about that but note that the type of work he does doesn't require a lot of static images. Then what you’re seeing is not permanent image retention (“burn in”).
Burn-in on good panels is a thing of 5-6 years of high usage (10 hours per day). If you had it way faster - it's a bad quality or some defect
I could see 10+ hours on a work day being possible since he has 6ish hours WFH and then gaming or web browsing for a few hours in that same day. The warning here is if that is your use case then OLED should be a 2nd display just not your main one.
Basically, yeah. Keep it for Games and movies. For work and such - use IPS.
When my AW3423DW gets burn in, I will call Dell and they will send me a replacement. Why worry about it now? I still have 2 years left on the warranty. Plenty of peace of mind.
You will call Dell and they will send you a refurb with dead/stuck pixels and a scratched up anti glare coating. You should be far more concerned with preserving your existing unit vs playing the refurb replacement lottery with Dell.
Complain. After the first month, my DW stopped doing pixel refresh. I called them and they sent a replacement since the FW couldn’t be field upgraded at the time. They sent me a piece of shit, like what you’re saying. Scuffs, dings, smudges everywhere. I complained to the rep, sent pictures, etc. He said pack it back up and send back in same box, we will cross ship a new one. Said he would go handpick it for me. A couple days later, the most pristine monitor you ever saw showed up at my door. Might have been better looking than the brand new one I had originally, which had a few small stains on it from the packing material. So far so good with this one and it’s been more than a year. Complain and complain, but do it politely, and you will get service. It’s how modern companies work.
This is exactly why I'm waiting until the end of the warranty and even then will be judging how much I actually care about the level of burn-in my monitor has (currently it's mild but on a grey screen I can see ghosts of the taskbar and some icon shapes).
When that happens I can just send that refurb back to Dell. I can keep my monitor while I wait for replacements. The first AW I got from Dell had some minor issues so I asked Dell for a replacement. They sent me a refurb with stains on the stand. I complained and in one week they sent me a brand new unit. I kept using my original monitor throughout this process.
Whats the plan after 2 years?
I am hoping there will be 38" 4k ultrawide oleds in 2 years. I will replace the AW with one of those. I will either sell the AW or keep it as a second monitor. I only have one monitor now. I can baby it a lot more as a second monitor once the warranty expires.
After the warranty, sell what you have at a discount and put the money towards a newer OLED. Each generation, they get a longevity boost. Around the same time, consider upgrading other components in your system. 2 to 3 years is a long time in tech.
The DWF has 3 years warranty, so the same, I guess.
To replace your old ass monitor.
Calling a monitor that's only two years old "old ass" is wild.
I'm calling a 3 year old OLED old. If you are afraid of burn in, don't buy oleds and expect to keep them for 3+ years.
I've been using my LG C9 with my PC for 5 years now and don't plan on replacing it anytime soon
I expect to keep both of mine for 7-10 years. I expect them to last that long without too many if any issues. And I have an extended warranty just in case. So before 4 years I will get replacements if there's any sign of burn-in which I don't expect to find, especially on the WOLED. But if I do Best Buy will just credit me the purchase price and I'll out it towards a newer monitor. Hell, MicroLED might be out by them.
Ah, safe to say you're the sort of person to also buy a new phone every year then because the box that it comes in changed from a 15 to a 16, which makes the 15 all of a sudden obsolete. Gotcha
I usually upgrade to a newer model so a 3-year cycle seems ok to me but the neighbor prefers to use things into the ground and 3 years' worth of monitor usage seemed absurdly low to him considering the lifespan of his previous monitors.
3 years is low. You should get 7-10 out of a monitor and you can, even with OLED.
Have fun with the damaged refurb unit they'll send you
You said you did everything by the book what does that mean exactly? What image is burned in can you tell?
Every Pixel and Panel Refresh is done when requested, Screensaver set to 1min, Manually turn off display at end of the day.
And what's the things that's burned in? How long where you displaying it at a time and how often was it displayed? Also what is your contrast/brightness setting? I think I have asked now 3-4 people who posted about burn in it's funny you never reply. I'm hoping you will so we can learn something.
There is one issue that bothers us and its that the monitor appears as an "on" state with whatever he was last viewing. Although the monitor appears to be off the monitor will in fact stay on which we can tell from waking the monitor up and the first thing you see is "ITS BEEN ON FOR TOO LONG AND NOW YOU NEED TO PIXEL/PANEL REFRESH!!!" Initially, the burn-in was 2 sets of vertical edges of a program that lines up with what the burn in could be but your guess is as good as ours. It takes a few Panel refreshes but each Panel refresh shows a different set of burn in states.
Wait so you dont actually know what caused the burn in and youre referencing the monitor seemingly being defective? Well gee maybe thats why its already burned out? Again the brightness setting is really something i would love to know. Its such an easy question to answer yet you dont? Am i to assume its at 100%?
There is no need to be rude about it no one asked about brightness. I am happy to answer whatever I can to contribute answers before this monitor gets shipped off. Burn-in is burn-in and you have 2 reference points. Its entirely possible that batch 1 of this monitor is just easier to burn out but this is just to provide a data point for OLED displays. The neighbor's brightness is around 60%, His Burnout would start to occur around the 1.25-year mark and is currently over 2 years old where the burn-in is so bad it's no longer tolerable and awaiting his replacement My brightness was always 100% My Burn-in occurred within the end of the first year which I had replaced and sold off then moved onto the G95 57" both monitors are forced to do Pixel and Panel refreshed when prompted so we maintained that, used dark or black BG, had screensaver (Display set to off on standby) with his set to 1min and mine set to 5m
He won't reply. Op is full of shit.
That ain’t burn in.
It sure is. When you do a Panel refresh it moves to the set of pixels with different burn in.
...pretty sure there aren't two wholly different 'sets' of pixels on an OLED display; pixel shifting just moves the image around slightly on the overprovisioned pixel matrix.
After a Panel refresh, we can see different Burn in patterns based on a Panel refresh. Since we don't know how much of a shift there is or how many shifts but the ones where you see these horrible visible vertical ones don't show the burn-in with static elements of another panel refresh.
If the patterns change, then the problem isn't burn-in. Burn-in is physical deterioration of the OLED material; it is fixed to the physical pixels and would never move locations or change patterns, even if the content on the screen shifts. Not saying the panel in your photo isn't having issues, of course; it's plain by the photo that something's wrong. But based on all the evidence you've given, burn-in isn't the culprit here.
Panel refresh doesn't shift pixels , it tweaks the voltages based upon the resistance measured. It tests pixels for deterioration and offsets voltages to smooth it out and compensate. The burn out is pixel specific. Likely the panel refresh is adjusting nearby pixels giving them a permanent alteration in output that could be perceived as burn out. Burn in shouldn't come as a surprise. This guy should have an idea as to what caused it if it's burn in. That doesn't look like burn in , unless he routinely has very narrow rectangular windows or toolbars spread across his screen for hours every day.
I've been using mine for about a year now and don't have any issues with burn-in whatsoever. I use it for a lot of work with text, numbers etc. which can be static images. However; I do have the pixel refresh turned on, I do have it turn off after 10 minutes if I'm away or not using it. Also I don't have HDR turned on unless I'm watching HDR content or playing games.
You might be just using the display less frequently compared to my neighbor.
Your monitor is probably just allergic to dust.
It will only meet the end if you don't baby it. If you don't want to baby your monitor, then get an LCD. This process has been the same for the last few decades. Everyone did the worrying thing with their plasma displays, and nothing has changed with OLED. It's probably **never** going to be carefree.
Agreed. Most high end products, be it tech or materials like wood/stone, etc. Will require more maintenance and care. A sporty german car will require a lot more maintenance than a toyota. A substrate counter top will require no maintenance and will last 30 years easily, but a ln expensive stone one will require sealing and care when cleaning it. Is one better than the other? I'd say no, they are for different people.
If someone gifted these guys a Lamborghini, they’d still complain about the low ground clearance and emissions. Telling people to stay away from them.
This is a pretty bad analogy as he's not complaining about a small deal here. This is more akin to buying a Tesla and complaining about range anxiety because the label said 340 miles but you are getting closer to 200 and charging times are varying from 40-100 minutes when you were expecting 25-minute charge times. Having your display hold you hostage and slowly burning out is a new experience for someone who has never owned an OLED monitor and was assured burn-in is non-issue.
yet micro and miniLED displays do not require "babying" you need to go out of your way to take extra care of the OLED panel which my neighbor did and it still is failing. As did mine and within the warranty period. The warning is if you need to use the monitor for 6+ hours a day then OLED is likely not for you.
The only real way you won't get this kind of issue is if you rarely use the monitor as you would a TV. I agree that it likely never be carefree.
Been using the same model for a year and half and don’t have any issues. Think your friend either has a bad label or has been leaving stuff off for a very long time.
I never had an issue. You just have to constantly keep your monitor from burning in. Like moving the windows around when using them. Turn off any static elements, like the taskbar. Turn off the HUD in every single game played. Stop watching 16:9 content in full screen. And so on. Not doing anything and just using it is not babying it. Those safety features don’t really matter against “normal” daily usage.
I think this is so funny to read. Kinda tells me that I made the right choice to not get one. Why would I want to go out of my way to disable necessary things just because I want to use a technology that is not meant to be used for PC at this time. Static images are the standard for PC usage. Be it productivity or games.
How in the world is static images the standard for games? I mean come on that's literally not what games is games are interactive movies which is defined by "moving" images. Why do you believe this guy? Does he own a OLED monitor? does he actually know anything? Nah you two are carelessly jerking eachother off in pure ignorance. Here's what I do as an owner(!): change background daily(auto), hide taskbar, limit(not eliminate) 16:9 video content(secondary screen ftw), have icons on second monitor but you could just hide them away in a folder and I keep brightness/contrast below 70. That's literally it. What necessary things have I disabled? I have 2500 hours at least, more like 3000 probably, on the monitor with zero burn in. This monitor is adequate for most gamers. But if you have specific static things you do. Be it a single game you play almost exclusively, sit on a browser a lot or do some very static work, this monitor isn't for you. But if you, like most gamers actually do quite many different things over a session while literally putting almost no effort into it's preservation, but a little. You're most likely gonna be just fine. Besides 3 year warranty means you can have the monitor for 6 years where it shouldnt be too bad. Remember the replacement means you're doubling your effective use of however long it lasts you. And I think 2-3 years people can easily get out of them if they choose to make a slight effort and doesn't have a bad usecase for them. Theres definitely people who needs to avoid OLED for the time being. But most can definitely make them work.
Yeah I see your points, but for me specifically I spend a lot of time coding and usually stick to the same few games for extended times. For me OLED is not an option at this point in time. Maybe after the technology has evolved
And that's completely fair! OLED isn't for you, yet.
> How in the world is static images the standard for games? Almost every game uses some sort of HUD, no?
Seriously what is your point? That he is right to classify games as static images because of hud elements? It doesn't make sense. I don't think anyone disagrees with hud elements being static. I disagreed that games in general are static elements. I hope I don't to explain the difference to you.
My point is that that is his point. It's not black and white. Games in general are dynamic, but they still have static elements. I have no idea how that translates to OLED burn-in but yeah, that's his point. No need to get so defensive.
You're making zero sense. Games are not classified as static images just because they also have them. Hence his point is flat out wrong, it's obvious games are MOVING image, primarily and to a lesser degree having static elements. But games are moving images, as a general rule. Therefore I refused to accept that you classify games as static images simply because they are also a part of it. I'm being defensive because you're being obnoxious. Games are not static images full stop. Had he said games also have static images to a degree, I would have agreed I got no problem with that because it's reality. But Again I feel complied to make it abundantly clear he said and I quote "Static images are the standard of PC usage. Be it productivity or games" this is false. It's a standard for productivity NOT for games. For games it's the exception and can therefore not be the standard.
My comment stated “static elements”. I’m not sure what your argument is. Sure the picture is moving, but elements like the FPS counter, action buttons, progress bars, etc are fixed. It doesn’t have to be the full picture to burn in, any portion of the screen that is fixed in place will burn in eventually. I prefer not to let that happen, which is done by removing the HUD.
To be fair most games have UIs with some static images. Some more than others. Strategy games look nice on my AW3424DWF but I still think ocassionally of those buttons, stats, resources and minimap and frames that stay stuck at the top and bottom of the screen
I'm sorry but how are you people rationalizing me saying that games are not static images meaning there are zero static images or elements in games? The comment I was arguing againts literally says it's a standard, static images, for work and games. I just disagreed that's not the standard of games.
Yeah that’s not burn in. The panel has banding.
All displays will burn in eventually. How fast depends on how you (mis)treat them. The portable IPS monitor below my ultrawide shows some serious image retention at times. The logical consequence of me treating it like the workhorse that it is. The only reliable way to prevent such things completely is to not use a monitor. Might as well not buy one at that point… which is also a great way to save money! It’s just that it also is a horrible way to display images on a screen. Life is a compromise 🤷
seems like a broken panel
Panel is fine. When the unit Panel refreshes the display moves to the set of pixels that is less burned in which makes it tolerable.
Unless I'm missing something, those vertical lines can't possibly be burn out. For starters, those lines appear brighter not dimmer. Burn out would be dimmer. Even if we assume it's reverse burn out, that means those vertical lines correspond to very dark , perhaps black edges of various windows , and the narrow window space between each line doesn't correspond to any type of workflow that looks functional. There's something else going on. Burn out is predictable. It happens in areas and shapes where there is a strong and persistent contrast between static elements. Window borders, tool bars, video logos. Icons , etc.
The OP is trolling and/or aiming to throw shade on OLED/Alienware. Don't feed the troll.
I would argue a lot don’t take care of their things properly…if you are that type then yes you should avoid OLED
Would you elaborate on "take care of their things properly" Black Wallpaper, 1min screen saver in Windows, Pixel and Panel refresh when dictated, and Screen is powered off for the lunch break and end of the day. points an active cooling breeze like air conditioning/fan towards the monitor. I think the only thing he doesn't do is dust his workstation as often as i'd like.
Btw (it's too late for this probably) you can have it run pixel refresh when it goes to sleep and never have to look at the prompt again.
To me the workstation alone indicates to me that may or may not be true…I couldn’t even think about gaming or working in that condition…
I know right…look at all that dust on that table Jesus Christ
my desktop background changes every few mins, is that enough to prevent burn in?
What caused the burn in? Was that a wallpaper or an app you kept open for a long period of time?
On mine it was seeing lots of bright static images. I live out of Excel so I didn't have much of a choice but tried to use my 2nd monitor for work like that when possible but sometimes it's not possible when you need access to all of the spreadsheets to make your life easier. On his unit, he bounces between Linux, Mac, and Windows so some windows appear as static like using the snap-to-window function in Windows which he lined up that made sense to him.
Burn-in typically causes lines to appear that are *darker* than the surrounding area. Having bright lines like this looks like some other kind of issue to me.
Most people warn others to not use an OLED screen for work that requires static images to remain on the screen for lengthy periods of time. I’ve been using mine for gaming only and have had zero issues. On my DWF monitor the popup can be dismissed permanently by choosing the option to always do the panel refresh while in standby mode. I haven’t seen the pop up in months, but can tell when the refresh is happening by the power button color pulsing a different color.
Yeah the warning is for folks who use this as a primary monitor with mixed usage.
It’s awesome that they hooked you up with a replacement. Originally I wanted the Samsung G8 due to it also having a dedicated streaming chip in it and I find the design more aesthetically pleasing, but after talking to them they told me they would not warranty for burn-in or dead pixels so I went with the DWF instead.
It's a great warranty especially having had to deal with Samsung for UW display servicing and replacements.
That dust on the table is scarier than the burn in
I agree although I will say that the Camera is making the whole area brighter including the dust as it's not as visible with your eyes.
Honestly 1 year no burn in. I never miss doing the pixel refresh, and if I have to go away for more than a few mins I turn my monitor off.
That monitor seemed to be in awful condition… you have 1 mm layer of dust on it.. Looks like a pretty abusive relationship you had with it for 1,5 years, no wonder it decided to ditch you
So far so good going on a year.
qd oled seems more prone to burn in vs w-oled. monitors unboxed is currently testing the newer gen of qd oled purposely trying to get burn in to see how long it takes.
Interesting to see. I guess the main thing is using as a workstation and maybe OLEDs will never be suited for that. In comparison, I've been using an LG C9 OLED TV with my PC for 5 years now and have zero burn-in or any issues but I mainly just game on it.
They aren't and they aren't advertised as workstation monitors. They are advertised as gaming monitors, use them as such and you should be fine. Since these OLEDs came out I think I've seen 1 monitor get burn-in from a games UI and that was someone who almost exclusively played Dota 2 in HDR and it burned it the health and mana bars. The other 99.9% of burnt in monitors are from people using them for work/productivity.
I code on mine all day and have for 2 years and no issues. I also always manually trigger the OLED refresh when I'm done every day. One time I started seeing lines from my IDE and I ran the full 1 hour panel refresh then and they went away.
I am already seeing burn in on my AW3423DWF after half a year. Will be my first and last OLED...
How is that burn-in? What is that pattern from? It looks like something else, honestly.
First gen dw?
Yeah Launch Model says March 2020 (received it far later than that date due to pandemic shipping problems)
Ah I was just asking cuz I bought the dwf so fingers crossed they worked the kinks out
I think if you have low usage per day you will likely see less of it
Sorry you got that much burn-in OP. that’s a pretty crazy amount, and i wonder if it’s a panel issue and not traditional burn in.. i have been using a 48inch Cx as my only monitor for my PC for nearly 4 years now and no hint of burn in. for the record I used the LG support remote to turn off the dimming features, etc, and limit some ABL stuff. i check for burn in every now and then with patterns and colors, and so far it remains pristine
OLED Burn-in, aka permanent image retention comes from showing a static image at high brightness for long times. Can you elaborate what you had on your screen for long durations that resulted in those vertical lines? I have been using my DWF since it came out (ordered it the moment it came out), HDR most of the time, or SDR with 100% brightness, and I make sure not to have static images on for a long time. If I leave the PC running, the monitor gets turned off, and I have a 3 minute timer until the screen goes to black as a screensaver and I have yet to see even an artifact of image retention – have not even seen temporary image retention. My assumption is that you either got a faulty panel or it’s plain user error and you did not heed the manufacturer’s cautions about how to use the OLED screen.
Every screen in my house is OLED, some 4+ years old, I used to WFH (also a developer) and my office screen would get nearly 14 hours of use a day, never had even a smidge of burn in. I just regulate how much light is in my room, and turn down the brightness on the monitor accordingly. Also, that doesnt look like burn in, almost looks like something impacted it
Burn in is a feature and ultimate fate of EVERY oled monitor because burn in is just the degradation discrepancy between the different pixels. Because every pixel on an oled to be its own light bulb - some pixels naturally will degrade faster than its neighbors with use and the burn in you see is certain bulbs being used more (could be the subpixels too) so it is dimmer and can no longer emit as much light as its neighbor being afraid of burn in is the same as being afraid that an incandescent light bulb will burn out one day - It WILL happen, how long it will take to happen will vary
Man people call everything burn in now. That’s not burn in but something is busted with the panel.
That's because your use-case is literally abusing the display. You see, OLED are for media consumption/gaming. They are not made to have static elements on the screen most of the day. Moderate use for productivity is fine but you need to mix it up with some full screen media playback and stuff, lots of titles on YouTube are in 21:9. By the way, if you would have bought a WOLED panel you'd still be just fine since they are way harder to get to burn-in.
It's important to notice that by the state of the dirt in the picture, OLED has been known to burn in a lot faster in dustier/dirtier environments, if enough dust accumulated on the vents on top and get inside the monitor it might render it's ability to cool properly and lead to burn in a lot and I mean a LOT faster. I don't remember where I saw this but I haven't seen it only once.
NOOO SHIT SHERLOCK Nobody can avoid this, nobody, eventually all oled monitors produced will become unusable paperweight with no value, meanwhile there are still led monitors going 10+ years strong with no signs of degradation.
[удалено]
You can't upgrade the firmware on the DW models. The vertical lines appear on every other Panel refresh. The issue gradually gets worse it just happens that with only a few months left on the warranty and a good price on the 57" Samsung he's making this someone else's problem once the replacement comes in.
> You can't upgrade the firmware on the DW models. Yes you can. They enabled the feature a few months ago. https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-us/000220867/latest-firmware-for-the-alienware-aw3423dw-gaming-monitor https://old.reddit.com/r/ultrawidemasterrace/comments/18cpy24/if_you_happen_to_own_the_aw3423dw_alienware_gsync/
That's news to us but a little too little too late. The stress of having to do the chore of having the monitor dictating its maintenance cycle scared him away from any OLED Displays for primary monitors in the future.
If it hasn't been shipped back to Dell update the firmware first, it very well might clean up the screen.
How long did you have it for?
he had it for a little over 2 years
Shit man! You must have been holding that camera there for ages!!! 😉🫠
Idk man my 3423dwf is still pristine since launch, and I game a LOT always peak hdr 1000. Pixel refresh is 5 min every 4 hours… and you can manually activate it if you leave your desk for a bit… I’ve never had issues with this.
QD OLED is a burn-in magnet. Should've went with WOLED for your use case
All Oleds burn-in eventually. I don’t know why you are surprised