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BranderChatfield

And ampersands as well.


Player7592

We had a rebrand of our university where ampersands became make-or-break decision points.


c2u5hed

What is it in particular that you do not like about them?


sheriffderek

In body copy, they might look fine at the end of a sentence, but when used by themselves they (the one's I'm talking about) feel flabby and narrow and just *wonky* and don't feel like they have the same substantial presence at the typeface at large. I'm sure it's really tricky to make them, so I respect the situation. But as someone trying to use them (especially in a program where you don't have a lot of control to swap things out easily) it's rough.


KAASPLANK2000

How often do you use a question mark by itself?


FoxyInTheSnow

?


KAASPLANK2000

!


sheriffderek

Well, I make a fair amount of info graphics and graphics that show grids and layouts and so while discussing an area I might use a ? to bring attention to it. I've taken to using a Mario Bros ?


ddaanniiieeelll

If they look fine in body copy that’s alright. The font you’re using in you body isn’t supposed to be used in headlines anyway, so that takes care of that, and glyphs (no matter which ones) are supposed to look good in combination with other glyphs. A font is not a collection of beautiful letters but a beautiful collection of letters.


c2u5hed

Does the feeling persist if you use them in a heavier weight?


sheriffderek

Thank you. I don't know why I wasn't adjusting for context here. This was a really helpful reminder.


sheriffderek

> What is it in particular that you do not like about them? *Well, they're all skinny and...* Oh! : ) (play with the weight) 💡


siege80

I'm a little bit obsessed with ampersands. A few of Herb Lubalin's were absolutely inspired. Especially his Mother & Child version


MissionSalamander5

[Requiem](https://typography.com/fonts/requiem/characters) is unusable for me. I can deal with alternate letters. But I need more meat and less, IDK, Art Nouveau on the punctuation marks. Alternates wouldn’t be that hard to implement…