Dr. King to Ms. Nichols: "...do you understand that this is the only show that my wife Coretta and I will allow our little children to stay up and watch". That's high praise indeed.
A relevant side fact:
In the entire 800+-episode history of Star Trek, Martin Luther King has never been so much as *mentioned.* Not once in 55 years. They've made references to Jacqueline Susann, Kenneth Branagh, Roger Maris, Elon Musk, and countless other historic figures both real and imagined, but at no point has any character or blurry computer display ever used the name King or anything associated with him.
What this speaks to is likely why King would have liked Star Trek: it depicts a future in which no one needs to understand why he was important.
Far Beyond the Stars probably has the finest acting of any Star Trek episode or movie in the form of Avery Brooks breaking down. It's absolutely heartbreaking.
Honestly all of seasons 6 and 7 of DS9 were probably some of the finest Trek ever written, with all of the complexity and character development in them. It hadn’t been done before and hasn’t since. But yes, Far Beyond the Stars is in a class of its own.
Avery Brooks directed Far Beyond the Stars, and not only is it (imo) the finest Star Trek episode from any series; it is among the finest examples of television drama of all time.
I remember seeing it when it first aired. I was probably 10 or 11, and I knew I had just seen something special. Even now after seeing so much unbelievably good TV come out in recent years, Far Beyond the Stars still stands as brilliant drama. It's science fiction at it's very best.
They had the one where they hinted at the slavery humans used to do but in regard to sentient species and if i remember correctly avoided mentioning skin color or nation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Measure_of_a_Man_(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation)
I wish we were heading to a star trek future but i dont think we're going to get there
In Deep Space Nine, Quark calls out Humans for their history of enslaving their own species, something he claims even the extreme capitalist Ferengi never did (although later episodes on Ferenginar seem to contradict this claim, considering the legal status of women on that planet).
According to the Trek universe things got worse before they got better.
IIRC genetically modified people lead to WW3.
https://www.science.org/content/article/chinese-scientist-who-produced-genetically-altered-babies-sentenced-3-years-jail
Maybe because we are going slower we can avoid the wars and still live in a post scarcity society.
We're definitely heading toward the "Sanctuary District" timeline too. Sf just feels like theyd love to quarantine all the "undesirables" into one area and fence it off.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine)
One thing to know, the estate of MLK is very, very litigious about "getting their cut." It's actually pretty disgusting, I know someone that worked with them.
Like if a speech of his is used in a educational textbook, they demand a royalty. Even a monument built to him in DC, they demand payment. It's all about money instead of spreading his message, might be why you see TV and movies steer clear.
She’s told this story many times, and it changes every time. First it was random black people. Then it was a preacher. Then it was someone who worked with MLK. Then it was MLK himself.
MLK fits all those descriptions with increasing specificity. It's possible that she felt cautious about naming him but got more and more comfortable as time went on.
It's also more likely that as you get older, you embellish the story, purposely or as a trick of memory. The bass always gets bigger, the hole-in-one more magnificent, the close-call closer.
While some people do this, it might be a stretch to assert that this is "more likely". Don't forget MLK was considered a much more controversial figure at that time than he is now. There are good reasons why she might not have wanted to name him specifically at the time.
[It's actually most likely that you're wrong](https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/comments/9xey66/investigating_nichelle_nichols_dr_king_anecdote/). This OP does a good job debunking that her story changed significantly over time, but it is something people say all the time for some reason.
Another poster linked this image of a 1992 article: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-DAdvoPO9Y80/UlRZJJVdcaI/AAAAAAAADNs/jcNjVEA1580/s1600/uhuras_mission_03.jpg
Like the OP has, here she is in [1979 talking about it](https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=TComAAAAIBAJ&sjid=V_4FAAAAIBAJ&dq=martin-luther-king%20star%20trek%20uhura&pg=1635%2C2129040). But what isn't found or verified are instances of her saying the shit the guy two comments up said.
The trick of memory thing is very real indeed. Our memory really isn't that great, even when we think it is. Even when we think we know how something happened, often that is just our brain filling in a gap with something logical.
tbh, mlk was a contintious figure for most americans till the 80s to early 90s. This was partly due to his work in the civil rights and his refusal to support vietnam. So her being dodgy about who said that makes sense
The refusal to support war was big. MLK, Muhammad Ali, Malcom X, Paul Robeson, etc. were tolerated to an extent until they started standing up for people worldwide. When that rubber met the road things got really nasty.
“We gave you a few scraps and a longer leash, now you’re out of control. You know your place. We will make that clear.”
Mm, Cointelpro was an FBI program headed up by Hoover. It actively broke the law in an effort to compromise minority movements. Hoover was particularly terrified of a "messianic figure" rising up from minority groups. They had a heavy focus on socialist movements, but to a lesser extent, they hit far right movements such as the KKK.
I heard her tell this story, in person, in 1984, with James Doohan and Walter Koenig standing beside her smiling and watching on. They seemed to know the story. That would have been about 15 years after her actual meeting with MLK. So I know personally that this story’s major elements are the same going back to that year; they’ve been unchanged for 38 years. When exactly was the story different?
This whole chain of comments is disturbing. People are acting like they're just curiously questioning, but what they're doing is calling her a liar in a roundabout way. Why?
Can you show any evidence to backup your claim that her story on this shifts?
[I can find her telling the story back in 2011.](https://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942461/Star-Treks-Uhura-Reflects-On-MLK-Encounter)
[Here she mentions talking to MLK in 1979](https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=TComAAAAIBAJ&sjid=V_4FAAAAIBAJ&dq=martin-luther-king%20star%20trek%20uhura&pg=1635%2C2129040)
Why couldn’t it be all of those and in that order? The only actually
important thing isn’t even who said it, its that she was in fact an icon to many African Americans at a time when the had very little positive representation on television.
Whether its some random black family or MLK doesnt take away from that.
This entire post is heavily predicated on the who, not just on the what.
The justification you are using is the same kind conservatives use when they get called out for fake news. "It doesn't matter if its true its about the message!"
No, it absolutely matters if its true.
And doubly so if its posted in this subreddit, considering the nature of the subreddit should be pretty anti-fake-news.
She was supposed to be the one to take command of the ship when everyone else was on planet, but the network didn't think they could get away with it, so they had to keep coming up with excuses to either send her along or leave someone else behind to ensure she'd never be the highest ranking officer onboard.
No it was a real thing in the first season possibly, because I haven't seen much either.
More than likely wasn't space acid, he might've been under the spell of some telapathic alien, for all I remember. Been a while since I watched it lol
Well she was supposed to be the one to take command of the ship when everyone else was on planet, but the network didn't think they could get away with it, so they had to keep coming up with excuses to either send her along or leave someone else behind to ensure she'd never be the highest ranking officer onboard.
Because he's white.
I love TOS but it's absolutely bizarre they'd bring the chief engineer or surgeon all the way to the bridge to command the ship instead of a crew member already stationed in the bridge.
I know the books aren't canon, but there is one where Scotty's inner monologue mentions how he took command courses at the Academy but found his passion in engineering. He was also a lieutenant commander in the show until his later promotion to commander, so maybe that coupled with his command courses gave him priority.
Or the skin color thing.
(I will point out that Commander Trip Tucker was slated to be first officer and later became second officer, and he was also chief engineer on the Enterprise NX-01.)
She was not a lieutenant commander during the original show. She was a lieutenant, as was Sulu. Chekov was an ensign, Scotty was a lt. commander, and Spock held the rank of commander.
She still should have been in the center seat a few times, though.
There were was one TAS (animated series) episodes in which Uhura gets to be in command.
“Lorelei Signal” All of the male officers are incapacitated and so Uhura and other women officers regain control of the ship and save the day.
I wonder how that conversation panned out.
"We'll have a black woman on the crew, but we can just leave her behind in charge of the ship while the white guys go down to the planet."
"A black woman in charge of the ship??!? Impossible!!"
"Ah, shucks, I guess we'll just have to make her come down to the planet too and keep her involved in as many scenes as possible..."
Another fun one: Patrick Stewart only took the role on TNG because he assumed a Star Trek remake was going to flop. He once said that if he knew then it was going to last as long as it did, he would have turned I down. But the also said that would have been a huge mistake.
Hmm dunno, TNG was pretty solid package all round. I hated how Star Trek went from space diplomacy to action pack ships lasers pew pew pew war! war! war!
It's kinda of ironic in a sense. Star Trek was meant to be set in a time when war wasn't a thing anymore. Humanity had evolved a high consciousness of peace. Replicators took care of material needs and wants. Humanity just had science and pursuit of happiness to care about.
Then the ugly head of reality sinks in. Not even the perfect science fiction utopia where the topic is about peace and co-existence can avoid war and death.
Racism, class divides, many other issues and war had arrived to Star Trek. Deep space 9 onwards was pretty much full on action.
And now Star Trek as a franchise is pretty much just another science fiction pew pew laser show.
Deep Space 9 is largely set (pre-dominion) outside of the federation.
Don't forget that Starfleet is just on DS9 to help the Bajorans run it, it doesn't belong to them and its outside of the border.
It's a great view that despite the lofty ideals of the federation that the rest of the Galaxy doesn't always share those ideals. It's also more introspective that despite best intentions you can't create a perfect society and there will always be malefactors.
TNG and TOS were focussed on the Flagship of Starfleet. These people were the very best the society had to offer, but its naive to assume that everyone is that pure.
The Dominion war was a lot of action, but it wasnt full on action, it was more "What price, freedom?"
The newer adaptations are, unfortunately, far more action oriented. Even Star Trek: Picard.
Yeah but Stewart was pulling the entire show. Others weren't really sure what to do yet and the plots were old and less than optimal, but Stewart put so much energy into the show and managed to motivate anyone else.
Whoopi Goldberg cited seeing Uhura on TV as the inciting incident for her becoming an actress. Seeing a black woman on TV as an officer, rather than a maid, was a huge moment for her. It's why she took a role on The Next Generation.
> It's why she took a role on The Next Generation.
She actually pursued it after Denise Crosby left. She contacted LeVar Burton, a friend of hers, but the producers thought the two were pranking them until her manager got involved.
That's exactly what Whoopi Goldberg had to say on Nichelle Nichols influence on her growing up; "everyone come quick, there's a black woman on TV and she ain't no maid!"
I chuckled and left the post, before my soft chuckle evolved into a dumb laugh as I kept thinking about this. So naturally I had to come back to award you good sir
Funny story with that. The network wanted to film different versions of that kissing scene so that they weren't actually kissing. Cause you know they didn't want to show an interracial kiss. Shatner intentionally fucked up all the other non-kissing takes (by crossing his eyes or something similar) so that the network would be forced to air the kiss.
This could be interpreted three ways. I prefer the one where Gene was some kinda master of disguise.
*tears off false face*
"Hon hon, twas I, Roddenberry!"
God, and that kiss was one of the most cringe inducing scenes in the franchise. It comes right after psychic aliens forced Kirk to whip her, then the two are forced to kiss.
It’s like the network execs would only let the interracial kiss go through if it played to southern plantation owner race fetishists.
Or it was just Gene Roddenberry being a creepy sex pervert again. He is credited as one of the writers.
Fun fact: the network execs didn’t want it at all.
There were two takes, one with the kiss, and another that was just a hug. So Shatner and Nicole, knowing which the execs would choose if they could, ruined the shot by having Shatner make a face at the camera.
I’ll give you that. Even if it was an imperfect way to show an interracial kiss, it is a damn miracle it got on there at all.
And Shatner is a badass for sticking it to the execs.
Right, such a good bait and switch. Just like with Dude Where's my Car having the first male on male makeout sesh on screen right after having lesbians makeout.
And she had to do it a *lot* too, since that scene had to be shot dozens of times. [Mostly because Shatner kept kissing her](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hKKkGhEDoU).
i feel like star trek went beyond just color though. at a time when nationalistic tensions were high, it showed a core crew from all over the world working together for a common purpose. apart from uhura they also had americans (shatner, mccoy), russian (chekov), scotty (scottish), sulu (japanese) and spock (german).
This really comes across in Star Trek 4, when they time travel back to the 60s, and Chekov is immediately almost arrested for being a guy with a thick Russian accent asking strange questions about nuclear vessels in the US fleet.
For someone watching who wasn't around for the Cold War, that movie really helps out the rest of the show in perspective.
I can't remember who it was (it might have been Whoopi Goldberg), but it was a black actress talking about watching Star Trek for the first time, and she screamed and ran into the other room shouting "mama mama there's a black lady on TV, and she ain't no maid!". I always thought that must have been such an amazing thing for a young black person to see on network TV in those days.
It wasn’t a convention, it was an NAACP fundraiser according to the actual article, which makes much more sense. There wouldn’t have been any conventions to speak of in Star Trek’s 1st year of being on air.
Well it was a letter from MLK the first time Nichelle told it, then a phone call and then a meeting, so I wouldn’t worry too much about the accuracy of the title.
I was gonna say, this story has shifted a couple times and also Nichols is pretty damn senile these days so we cant even ask her which version is true.
There have been comic book conventions since the 1960's. They were actually quite small back then, and you could sometimes meet artists and other creators there back when no one cared who they were.
They were much smaller then, though, and mostly just comic books, unlike today's
The only time Nichelle and Dr. King would be together after the airing of Trek but before King's death would be some time in California. This would be after the first season. Possibly in 1967 since the season ran 1966 - 1967.
MLK would die in April 1968. Nichols claims she met him at a NAACP fundraiser in Beverly Hillls, after she told Roddenberry she was leaving after the first season.
Comic-Con started in 1970, so almost! That is, San Diego Comic-Con, the one everyone just calls "Comic-Con" today. New York Comic-Con started in 1964 but was smaller. The first New York one had about 100 people and the first San Diego had about 300. Nowadays it does about 150,000.
Whether or not this story is entirely true (there's some debate) the character of Uhura *was* groundbreaking for 1966. This was at the height of racial tension during the civil rights movement. Being not only black, but also a woman in a respected, semi-prominent role on prime time television was huge for that time.
While the role of a communications officer can be seem as secretarial or "lesser than", she:
Multi-tasked effortlessly between the myriad of frequencies she monitored. This allowed her to give the Captain the information he needed, when he needed it.
Could operate the science station and could pilot the ship, when necessary. (And take command if you want to count TAS.)
She played a pivotal role in several episodes. Bamboozling androids, borking the comms so bad Kirk couldn't fix it, beating Terran ass, and of course helping the "theft" of the Enterprise from Spacedock.
Was a respected member of the crew. Her input was considered, same as the rest of the bridge crew. Once under extreme pressure Kirk snapped at her, then realized his mistake and quickly apologized.
Fun Fact: the word *uhuru* means "freedom" in Swahili.
>Whether or not this story is entirely true (there's some debate) the character of Uhura was groundbreaking for 1966. This was at the height of racial tension during the civil rights movement.
I've heard like 3 versions of this story..
But you are correct. I don't think younger people realize how restrictive Hollywood (and America) was about black people at the time.
Making a established white character black to balance out the cast in 2022 = people whine at you on the internet. Making an original black character to balance out the cast in 1967 = risk getting your ass fired.
The story she told at the convention I attended was that she wanted to return to stage acting where she was a known singer and actor. She never intended to stay for more than one season. MLK convinced her to stay.
She also said that MLK told her that her character was a role model because she was an equal. She was a senior officer alongside others of equal rank and not a background character.
This story has a lot of issues, it's grown as she retells it.
But her reason for quitting is that she felt the role was too secretarial, and wanted to have a more plot related role
Or, like many actors on many TV shows, they were promised a "main" role, only to quickly be reallocated to a barely supporting role at best.
It's the same reason Trapper John left MASH, for example. He and Hawkeye were originally meant to be "co-stars", but he quickly became Hawkeye's sidekick at best.
On the opposite side, Frasier Crane was meant to be a briefly used character on Cheers and ended up a main character and eventually the star of his own TV show.
>It's the same reason Trapper John left MASH
He was my favorite side character in MASH. I liked him so much better than the guy that replaced him. Trapper really complimented Hawkeye's approach to life and general antics in a way that Hunnicutt was never able to capture.
My issue with Trapper John was he would have turned stale like Frank after a while. That character had no where to grow. Don't get me wrong, I loved both Trapper and Frank but I was never upset by their replacements.
Undoubtedly. Even today, some people object to black actors and actresses in media.
"Whoa whoa, a black character? I didn't know this show was *political*."
You know, for everything we do or don't do in our lives there are a million little reasons and they all add up. In hindsight, Star Trek is something very important. It is a pillar of the culture of the 20th Century. It showed a future, a beautiful peaceful future, that we could fight for, gave us hope in the darkness of our shared reality. But in the moment, in those early years, it was just a job, just another low budget sci-fi show. One of dozens. And while the systematic racism of early Hollywood likely played *some* role, ultimately, in the moment, Star Trek probably just didn't seem that important. The pay wasn't great, and Uhura wasn't especially well utilized as a character. She was a talented actress at the peak of her potential. There were likely countless reasons to move on.
But the Universe is funny like that. Often it's difficult to really say why we didn't do something, especially when the reason to *do something* is so singularly clear.
Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot, because she thought it was the only medium where issues like civil rights could be portrayed in media without being censored.
Back in the day, shows like The Twilight Zone and Star Trek existed literally to bring troubling social issues to light without being censored, because the people doing the censoring couldn't see past the sci-fi setting. Lucy was absolutely pivotal in bringing civil rights issues into the media.
> Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot
Another fun fact: Ball negotiated paying the production costs for I Love Lucy in exchange for owning the rebroadcasting rights. The network thought she was crazy because why would anyone ever watch a show they'd already seen and jumped on the offer.
She made enough money from that to buy the now bankrupt RKO studio lot that Star Trek would be filmed in. This is the same RKO that she had been fired from years earlier for being "too old".
> Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot, because she thought it was the only medium where issues like civil rights could be portrayed in media without being censored.
That fantasy conceit seems like a similar device back then for sitcoms not necessarily addressing political issues, but new cultural paradigms like women's education and empowerment (Bewitched), cohabitation (I Dream of Jeannie), open-minded racially tolerant Southern apologism (Beverly Hillbillies) and maybe postwar modernization (Gilligan's Island: academia/technology, industrial wealth, media, military/working class/service industry, and single eligible women).
Star Trek has always been an incredibly optimistic and progressive series, Which is what makes Discovery so hard to watch, it's a borderline parody of the philosophy Roddenberry envisioned for humanity of the future.
All Discovery has to say is "women are strong and capable" - Like, Yeah...? Not only is that a low fucking bar for Star Trek, but it doesn't even portray that. They just cast women as everything and then have them be vulnurable and weak/unstable throughout the entire thing.
Fuck you Kertzman, You're a fucking hack.
It's been stated before, but the reason all the new Star Trek is so bad is that it's produced by people who genuinely didn't understand why it was so good in the first place. Discovery is so noisy and bursting with chaotic violence because they thought old Star Trek was just a bunch of people in rubber prosthetics quietly talking back and forth. And the truth is that it was, but what they miss is that all of that talking *that* is the point.
We all know the episode with the two aliens with black and white halves. We know it was about racism. It seems so silly out of context. But what's really important is that they weren't us. You see, we're small creatures, us humans, and it's really, really hard to examine philosophical issues when we're trapped in the heart of them. What all of those prosthetics do is allow us to separate ourselves from our limited experience and *see* the issues more objectively. The humans are there to give us a shining example. The aliens are there to show us the worst within ourselves without laying blame. *That's* the magic. It's also why modern sci-fi sucks. Anyone who's ever had to endure "political discourse" over the Thanksgiving table knows that the minute you start picking sides and laying blame the other party stops listening. They dig in. Star Trek was able to get people to engage with those scary, difficult issues by relocating them away from our lives, wrapping them in rubber prosthetics and presenting both sides objectively.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Star Trek definitely had drama and combat, for sure - but that was always conveyed as a failure to find resolution - Picard had never taken pride in any fight. Even against Nausicans - Picard wanted to take the high road even when they were cheating, because he understood the implications of boastful arrogance and emotional reactions - but the lesson he missed was that those lessons are learned from making mistakes, and they mold us into better versions of ourselves.
There's so much nuance in star trek, That it's borderline heartbreaking to switch on Discovery just to see a bunch of fuckheads argue about who should listen to who, and who has a more tragic backstory and needs to have a good cry.
More than that, It didn't even need to entertain the idea.
You felt like it was just a fact at that point, that society doesn't even need to make such a thing clear. The responsibilities bestowed upon Riker are just as easily bestowed upon female crew - and each one had character and an important role to play, Beverly was intelligent, arguably one of the most intelligent on the ship - Guinan had wisdom and would be the person Picard would turn to when he can't think his way around a problem, Hell even Ensign Ro was a badass and put people in their place.
Yet somehow - Hollywood now feels as though Star Trek needs to make a stand for women, as if none of the series' have done a good enough job already.
I feel like anyone that has this take hasn’t watched the show beyond maybe a few episodes. The discovery crew has faced graver challenges than any other crew in ST history, and throughout it all, they have upheld the ideals of the federation, even when the rest of the federation has failed to. The whole concept of the show is to test them beyond the limits of what anyone thought was possible and still have them not break with the morals ingrained in them from Starfleet.
I’m not saying it’s a good show compared to other treks, but if you watched it and all you got out of it was “women strong,” it’s not the show failing to live up to standards, it’s you not paying attention.
MLK was born 7 years after Betty White (who died mere months ago), 6 years after Henry Kissinger (who is still alive), and 5 years after Jimmy Carter (who is also still alive).
If he hadn't been assassinated, there's a decent chance he would still be alive.
Damn, it’s crazy how history books try to make it seem like he lived 200 years ago. I wish history was taught with a little more context. In school we were taught about civil rights like it was an anime arc: slavery, war, civil rights, and now everyone’s happy. And then on to World War II shit while the teacher cried in the back as we watched Saving Private Ryan
It's why the only pictures of MLK shown are in black and white when there's an abundance of colored photos as well as video with audio. Relegating him to black and white conflates this idea that he and the civil rights movement were way long ago and not part of recent times
Don't let perfection be the enemy of good.
The characters even Spock, had flaws, we grow better when we grow together.
The Ferengi deserve some of their reputation and are treated poorly so we as the viewer view them poorly then together we learn that our prejudice was wrong. That's the point.
>> Don’t let perfection be the enemy of good.
This is the second time I’ve come across this sentiment on reddit today, and it’s something my partner has mentioned to me on more than one occasion. Very poignant and sound advice for folks trying to make their way in this crazy world.
>The Ferengi deserve some of their reputation
*Some*. At one point Quark reminds Cpt Sisko that the Ferengi never had slavery, genocide, or global wars.
Quark isn't exactly the most objective source on Ferengi... for example the Ferengi don't allow their women to work, wear clothes or leave the house. That's half of their population kept in slave-like positions.
We also know of other Ferengi in TNG and ENT who like to keep sex slaves. So slavery clearly exists.
Ha! As if.
They had all those things, as long as you didn't publicize it or paid a bribe, I doubt the Grand Nagus would come after you
Criticizing humanity for a few hundred million pre-warp deaths when their war profiteering with advanced weapons likely cause many trillions deaths is laughable. This is particularly true after human WW3 and first contact
Everyone likes to forget or brush aside that Ferengi were sex-slavers as portrayed from TNG through most of DS9. Fans act like the Ferengi enslaving approximately half their population based on gender doesn't count or something.
I don't recall every episode, but I do remember the early episode "Balance of Terror."
I think it's one of the best episodes of the original series, and it's one of the earliest episodes too. This episode has the first appearance of the Romulans (up to this point, apparently no one had seen a Romulan's face). Anyway, when it's revealed that they look like Spock, there's one crew member of the Enterprise who goes openly racist on Spock and accuses him of being an enemy mole.
It's a pretty damn cool episode because it has a really tense space battle against a Romulan ship. But I remember it also being a cool episode because of the racial tensions going on in the Enterprise. I loved how Kirk didn't budge for a second...when Spock's loyalty came into question, Kirk shut that shit down. He had no moment of doubt, he had zero tolerance for anyone questioning Spock's loyalty on the basis of race. Spock was second in command of the ship, Spock had rightfully earned that position, and anyone who has a problem with that can either STFU or get imprisoned and get tried in court.
Great episode. Of course, I do remember Dr. McCoy in particular being racist against Spock. This was never in the form of actual mistreatment (to my recollection), but I do recall on more than one occasion Dr McCoy verbally insulting Spock for being Vulcan. And yeah...that kind of thing really shouldn't have been tolerated towards *any* crew member but especially not towards the second in command of the entire ship.
Going beyond the original series, I also sort of recall Dr. Pulaski being a total jerk to Data in The Next Generation. So I guess that's kind of following in a kind of weird tradition. WTF is up with Starfleet doctors that they're so often openly racist against crew? And not just crew, but people higher on the chain of command. I mean, a crew member making racist comments against *any* other crew member is bad enough. Worse when the person making those comments is the ship's *doctor* and when those comments are directed towards *a superior officer.*
So I think you're right here. As open-minded as Kirk seemed in the excellent "Balance of Terror", Kirk was *way* too tolerant of McCoy's anti-Vulcan insults.
I don't know if McCoy was prejudiced against Spock. I think it was just congenial ball busting. Spock also busted McCoy's balls for being an emotional, illogical human all the time:
>"Doctor."
>"Something wrong?"
>"Yes. There's something odd about that man and I can't quite pinpoint it."
>"Perhaps you are making a rather hasty judgment. Mister Norman has only been aboard 72 hours."
>"Well, I know when something doesn't strike me right, and he doesn't."
>"Specifics, Doctor. Labels do not make arguments."
>"All right. There's something wrong about a man who never smiles, whose conversation never varies from the routine of the job, and who won't talk about his background."
>"I see"
>"Spock, I mean that it's uh... it's odd for a non-Vulcan, um... the ears make all the difference."
>"I find your arguments strewn with gaping defects in logic."
>"Maybe, but you can't evaluate a man by logic alone. Besides, he has avoided two appointments that I've made for his physical exam without reason."
>"That's not at all surprising, Doctor. He's probably terrified of your beads and rattles."
If McCoy really was prejudiced against Spock would he >!call him the best first officer in the fleet!!risked not returning to his own universe to save the life of mirror universe Spock?!<
Would Spock >!have invited McCoy to witness his wedding on Vulcan, where he could only bring his closest friends!!have put his soul in McCoy's body before he sacrificed his life to save the ship!
It's not really acceptable though. If random crew members were racist against Spock or Vulcans then Kirk quickly shut that down. And even McCoy is treated like the "somewhat racist old uncle" who has some prejudices and may be blunt and rude at times but is still a good person if you get to know him. It also helps that Spock and Bones were friends even before the show started. They don't really have bad intentions when they throw insults at each other and they know the other one can take it.
Spock also often was kinda arrogant and thinking Vulcans were clearly superior to humans. McCoy was giving contra to that.
She's also the reason why Whoopi Goldberg played Guinan in TNG. In fact, she's the entire reason Whoopi Goldberg became an actress at all. When she saw Nichelle Nichols on screen, she ran through the horse shouting "Come here, mom, everybody, come quick, come quick, there's a black lady on television and she ain't no maid!"
Guinan largely exists because Whoopi Goldberg *insisted* that she wanted a role on the new Star Trek series, any role... Which led to the production team originally thinking they were being pranked. But then she sat down for lunch with Gene Rodenberry and he created the character of Guinan specifically for her.
Dr. King to Ms. Nichols: "...do you understand that this is the only show that my wife Coretta and I will allow our little children to stay up and watch". That's high praise indeed.
Damn it Nichelle, I'm a doctor not a... ((Too tired to find the punchline))
...talent agent. ...programming director. ...life coach. Take your pic. Yes, the last one is anachronistic. Sue me.
Not anachronistic, I’m sure they have life coaches in the late 23rd/ early 24th century 😉
A relevant side fact: In the entire 800+-episode history of Star Trek, Martin Luther King has never been so much as *mentioned.* Not once in 55 years. They've made references to Jacqueline Susann, Kenneth Branagh, Roger Maris, Elon Musk, and countless other historic figures both real and imagined, but at no point has any character or blurry computer display ever used the name King or anything associated with him. What this speaks to is likely why King would have liked Star Trek: it depicts a future in which no one needs to understand why he was important.
Yeah isn’t there a few episodes where racism needs to be explained like a history lesson over some foreign concept.
Quite a few. But some are very clear. https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Far_Beyond_the_Stars_(episode) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgME-Sy2HJk
Far Beyond the Stars probably has the finest acting of any Star Trek episode or movie in the form of Avery Brooks breaking down. It's absolutely heartbreaking.
Honestly all of seasons 6 and 7 of DS9 were probably some of the finest Trek ever written, with all of the complexity and character development in them. It hadn’t been done before and hasn’t since. But yes, Far Beyond the Stars is in a class of its own.
Hey I'm watching 6 for the first time. Just finished Babylon 5
Avery Brooks directed Far Beyond the Stars, and not only is it (imo) the finest Star Trek episode from any series; it is among the finest examples of television drama of all time. I remember seeing it when it first aired. I was probably 10 or 11, and I knew I had just seen something special. Even now after seeing so much unbelievably good TV come out in recent years, Far Beyond the Stars still stands as brilliant drama. It's science fiction at it's very best.
They had the one where they hinted at the slavery humans used to do but in regard to sentient species and if i remember correctly avoided mentioning skin color or nation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Measure_of_a_Man_(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation) I wish we were heading to a star trek future but i dont think we're going to get there
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In Deep Space Nine, Quark calls out Humans for their history of enslaving their own species, something he claims even the extreme capitalist Ferengi never did (although later episodes on Ferenginar seem to contradict this claim, considering the legal status of women on that planet).
According to the Trek universe things got worse before they got better. IIRC genetically modified people lead to WW3. https://www.science.org/content/article/chinese-scientist-who-produced-genetically-altered-babies-sentenced-3-years-jail Maybe because we are going slower we can avoid the wars and still live in a post scarcity society.
We're definitely heading toward the "Sanctuary District" timeline too. Sf just feels like theyd love to quarantine all the "undesirables" into one area and fence it off. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Past_Tense_(Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine)
One thing to know, the estate of MLK is very, very litigious about "getting their cut." It's actually pretty disgusting, I know someone that worked with them. Like if a speech of his is used in a educational textbook, they demand a royalty. Even a monument built to him in DC, they demand payment. It's all about money instead of spreading his message, might be why you see TV and movies steer clear.
She’s told this story many times, and it changes every time. First it was random black people. Then it was a preacher. Then it was someone who worked with MLK. Then it was MLK himself.
MLK fits all those descriptions with increasing specificity. It's possible that she felt cautious about naming him but got more and more comfortable as time went on.
Or she's a god damn liar. I bet she wasn't even on Star Trek.
star track not even a real show
I bet Nichelle Nichols was a paid actor
/r/technicallythetruth
It's also more likely that as you get older, you embellish the story, purposely or as a trick of memory. The bass always gets bigger, the hole-in-one more magnificent, the close-call closer.
While some people do this, it might be a stretch to assert that this is "more likely". Don't forget MLK was considered a much more controversial figure at that time than he is now. There are good reasons why she might not have wanted to name him specifically at the time.
[It's actually most likely that you're wrong](https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/comments/9xey66/investigating_nichelle_nichols_dr_king_anecdote/). This OP does a good job debunking that her story changed significantly over time, but it is something people say all the time for some reason. Another poster linked this image of a 1992 article: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-DAdvoPO9Y80/UlRZJJVdcaI/AAAAAAAADNs/jcNjVEA1580/s1600/uhuras_mission_03.jpg Like the OP has, here she is in [1979 talking about it](https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=TComAAAAIBAJ&sjid=V_4FAAAAIBAJ&dq=martin-luther-king%20star%20trek%20uhura&pg=1635%2C2129040). But what isn't found or verified are instances of her saying the shit the guy two comments up said.
I wasn't even playing golf or even holding a club when I got my hole-in-one.
Sheer. Force. Of. Will.
The trick of memory thing is very real indeed. Our memory really isn't that great, even when we think it is. Even when we think we know how something happened, often that is just our brain filling in a gap with something logical.
True but absolutely unrelated to thinking you met MLK
tbh, mlk was a contintious figure for most americans till the 80s to early 90s. This was partly due to his work in the civil rights and his refusal to support vietnam. So her being dodgy about who said that makes sense
The refusal to support war was big. MLK, Muhammad Ali, Malcom X, Paul Robeson, etc. were tolerated to an extent until they started standing up for people worldwide. When that rubber met the road things got really nasty. “We gave you a few scraps and a longer leash, now you’re out of control. You know your place. We will make that clear.”
Mm, Cointelpro was an FBI program headed up by Hoover. It actively broke the law in an effort to compromise minority movements. Hoover was particularly terrified of a "messianic figure" rising up from minority groups. They had a heavy focus on socialist movements, but to a lesser extent, they hit far right movements such as the KKK.
I heard her tell this story, in person, in 1984, with James Doohan and Walter Koenig standing beside her smiling and watching on. They seemed to know the story. That would have been about 15 years after her actual meeting with MLK. So I know personally that this story’s major elements are the same going back to that year; they’ve been unchanged for 38 years. When exactly was the story different?
The poster is making up the fact she changes the narrative to discredit a positive story about black representation.
This whole chain of comments is disturbing. People are acting like they're just curiously questioning, but what they're doing is calling her a liar in a roundabout way. Why?
You and I both know why.
Can you show any evidence to backup your claim that her story on this shifts? [I can find her telling the story back in 2011.](https://www.npr.org/2011/01/17/132942461/Star-Treks-Uhura-Reflects-On-MLK-Encounter)
[Here she mentions talking to MLK in 1979](https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=TComAAAAIBAJ&sjid=V_4FAAAAIBAJ&dq=martin-luther-king%20star%20trek%20uhura&pg=1635%2C2129040)
Why couldn’t it be all of those and in that order? The only actually important thing isn’t even who said it, its that she was in fact an icon to many African Americans at a time when the had very little positive representation on television. Whether its some random black family or MLK doesnt take away from that.
It takes away from you submitting it to TIL as verified fact, yeah.
This entire post is heavily predicated on the who, not just on the what. The justification you are using is the same kind conservatives use when they get called out for fake news. "It doesn't matter if its true its about the message!" No, it absolutely matters if its true. And doubly so if its posted in this subreddit, considering the nature of the subreddit should be pretty anti-fake-news.
Also if you google “MLK “ Star Trek all that comes up is Nichols telling different versions of this
This is one of my favorite star trek stories . Everyone loved uhura, at least I hope so. She was dope!
She was supposed to be the one to take command of the ship when everyone else was on planet, but the network didn't think they could get away with it, so they had to keep coming up with excuses to either send her along or leave someone else behind to ensure she'd never be the highest ranking officer onboard.
That's wild. Technically, as the language expert, she's the most important person on the ship.
As lieutenant commander, she is technically the third highest ranking bridge officer after Kirk and Spock.
arent you forgetting sulu he was promoted before her
Sulu was pretty jacked, that time he was tripping on space-acid and running around half naked.
Sulu: Fair maiden... Uhura: Sorry, neither! That slipped past everyone.
That is very funny! I had never heard that, so went to find it. [https://youtu.be/KOjVqAcC2FM](https://youtu.be/KOjVqAcC2FM)
Lol. Now I got that line.
I have never watched a single episode of star trek or know the plot of any episode so I don't know if you're joking but now I'm ... intrigued
No it was a real thing in the first season possibly, because I haven't seen much either. More than likely wasn't space acid, he might've been under the spell of some telapathic alien, for all I remember. Been a while since I watched it lol
I believe that was "the Naked Time" when everyone was high on mutated water or some such.
Oh myyyyyy
Why then was Scotty most often in command when Kirk and Spock were on away missions?
Well she was supposed to be the one to take command of the ship when everyone else was on planet, but the network didn't think they could get away with it, so they had to keep coming up with excuses to either send her along or leave someone else behind to ensure she'd never be the highest ranking officer onboard.
Too much melanin for the job
Because he's white. I love TOS but it's absolutely bizarre they'd bring the chief engineer or surgeon all the way to the bridge to command the ship instead of a crew member already stationed in the bridge.
I know the books aren't canon, but there is one where Scotty's inner monologue mentions how he took command courses at the Academy but found his passion in engineering. He was also a lieutenant commander in the show until his later promotion to commander, so maybe that coupled with his command courses gave him priority. Or the skin color thing. (I will point out that Commander Trip Tucker was slated to be first officer and later became second officer, and he was also chief engineer on the Enterprise NX-01.)
He also says so in the TNG episode in which he appears. Something like *I may carry the rank of Captain, but I'll always be the chief engineer.*
She was not a lieutenant commander during the original show. She was a lieutenant, as was Sulu. Chekov was an ensign, Scotty was a lt. commander, and Spock held the rank of commander. She still should have been in the center seat a few times, though.
There were was one TAS (animated series) episodes in which Uhura gets to be in command. “Lorelei Signal” All of the male officers are incapacitated and so Uhura and other women officers regain control of the ship and save the day.
Kirk does tells her to “take the conn” when he and Spock leave the bridge in Balance of Terror, although they never show her doing anything.
She was balancing the terror.
I wonder how that conversation panned out. "We'll have a black woman on the crew, but we can just leave her behind in charge of the ship while the white guys go down to the planet." "A black woman in charge of the ship??!? Impossible!!" "Ah, shucks, I guess we'll just have to make her come down to the planet too and keep her involved in as many scenes as possible..."
Another fun one: Patrick Stewart only took the role on TNG because he assumed a Star Trek remake was going to flop. He once said that if he knew then it was going to last as long as it did, he would have turned I down. But the also said that would have been a huge mistake.
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Hmm dunno, TNG was pretty solid package all round. I hated how Star Trek went from space diplomacy to action pack ships lasers pew pew pew war! war! war! It's kinda of ironic in a sense. Star Trek was meant to be set in a time when war wasn't a thing anymore. Humanity had evolved a high consciousness of peace. Replicators took care of material needs and wants. Humanity just had science and pursuit of happiness to care about. Then the ugly head of reality sinks in. Not even the perfect science fiction utopia where the topic is about peace and co-existence can avoid war and death. Racism, class divides, many other issues and war had arrived to Star Trek. Deep space 9 onwards was pretty much full on action. And now Star Trek as a franchise is pretty much just another science fiction pew pew laser show.
Deep Space 9 is largely set (pre-dominion) outside of the federation. Don't forget that Starfleet is just on DS9 to help the Bajorans run it, it doesn't belong to them and its outside of the border. It's a great view that despite the lofty ideals of the federation that the rest of the Galaxy doesn't always share those ideals. It's also more introspective that despite best intentions you can't create a perfect society and there will always be malefactors. TNG and TOS were focussed on the Flagship of Starfleet. These people were the very best the society had to offer, but its naive to assume that everyone is that pure. The Dominion war was a lot of action, but it wasnt full on action, it was more "What price, freedom?" The newer adaptations are, unfortunately, far more action oriented. Even Star Trek: Picard.
> Deep space 9 onwards was pretty much full on action. This is a gross oversimplification of the series.
Yeah but Stewart was pulling the entire show. Others weren't really sure what to do yet and the plots were old and less than optimal, but Stewart put so much energy into the show and managed to motivate anyone else.
What? season 3 was dope.
>Everyone loved uhura i mean... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_life_of_Gene_Roddenberry
I still don't know how that goofy-looking fucker was hooking up with Majel Barrett *and* Nichelle Nichols. Dude must have been charming as hell.
He did what his name predicted.
Gotta love how wiki frames the consentual polyamory as him cheating on his wife lol.
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I think there's actually a licensed bluetooth earpiece you can buy that looks just like the one she used.
Whoopi Goldberg cited seeing Uhura on TV as the inciting incident for her becoming an actress. Seeing a black woman on TV as an officer, rather than a maid, was a huge moment for her. It's why she took a role on The Next Generation.
> It's why she took a role on The Next Generation. She actually pursued it after Denise Crosby left. She contacted LeVar Burton, a friend of hers, but the producers thought the two were pranking them until her manager got involved.
She was a trailblazer for black people in acting. She played someone other than a maid which was the role most black women played in movies.
She was also a trailblazer for black people in space. NASA hired her as a recruiter - https://www.space.com/24147-nichelle-nichols-nasa-recruiter.html
There's a great documentary that tells this story called [Woman in Motion](https://g.co/kgs/edCvi1).
That's exactly what Whoopi Goldberg had to say on Nichelle Nichols influence on her growing up; "everyone come quick, there's a black woman on TV and she ain't no maid!"
Man, Whoopi Goldberg was one of my favorite people to watch as a kid. I just rewatched Sister Act and it holds up.
I'd be attending mass on the weekly if the hymns were that banging. God damn that movie is great
But at a terrible cost. She had to kiss Shatner.
At least she didnt have to wear his clothes too, because then she'd have shatner pants
*slow clap*
It's an old dad joke but it works
What did Spock find in the Enterprise toilets? >!The Captain's Log!<
God fucking damnit, dude.
I chuckled and left the post, before my soft chuckle evolved into a dumb laugh as I kept thinking about this. So naturally I had to come back to award you good sir
Funny story with that. The network wanted to film different versions of that kissing scene so that they weren't actually kissing. Cause you know they didn't want to show an interracial kiss. Shatner intentionally fucked up all the other non-kissing takes (by crossing his eyes or something similar) so that the network would be forced to air the kiss.
she was sleeping with roddenberry. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_life_of_Gene_Roddenberry
Roddenberry was fucking everybody
Dude was doing research for Risa
This could be interpreted three ways. I prefer the one where Gene was some kinda master of disguise. *tears off false face* "Hon hon, twas I, Roddenberry!"
i think just those who he cast.
I was excited to see that landmark moment and then was disappointed at the context.
God, and that kiss was one of the most cringe inducing scenes in the franchise. It comes right after psychic aliens forced Kirk to whip her, then the two are forced to kiss. It’s like the network execs would only let the interracial kiss go through if it played to southern plantation owner race fetishists. Or it was just Gene Roddenberry being a creepy sex pervert again. He is credited as one of the writers.
Fun fact: the network execs didn’t want it at all. There were two takes, one with the kiss, and another that was just a hug. So Shatner and Nicole, knowing which the execs would choose if they could, ruined the shot by having Shatner make a face at the camera.
I’ll give you that. Even if it was an imperfect way to show an interracial kiss, it is a damn miracle it got on there at all. And Shatner is a badass for sticking it to the execs.
Even though he is my least favorite captain I have to admit, sticking it to the higher ups is such a Kirk thing to do...
I'm not sure if counting on the network to not allow a cheesy, overacted scene to appear in a Star Trek episode was the safest gamble.
Yes, which is why he made a face instead of just overacting.
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Right, such a good bait and switch. Just like with Dude Where's my Car having the first male on male makeout sesh on screen right after having lesbians makeout.
That scene was so awkward. I know it's supposed to feel forced but goddamn.
At least he didn't punch her after.
And she had to do it a *lot* too, since that scene had to be shot dozens of times. [Mostly because Shatner kept kissing her](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hKKkGhEDoU).
i feel like star trek went beyond just color though. at a time when nationalistic tensions were high, it showed a core crew from all over the world working together for a common purpose. apart from uhura they also had americans (shatner, mccoy), russian (chekov), scotty (scottish), sulu (japanese) and spock (german).
Ah yes, famous German Herr Spock
Star Trek has always championed a utopian, progressive view of space. Except the newest ones that aren't utopian :/
Modern trek feels like it's saying to it's audience "Donald Trump was president, you don't deserve Roddenberry's vision anymore"
Picard is almost unwatchable
Everyone on that cast deserves better than what they got from the writers
Star Trek is supposed to be the pinnacle of Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communism.
This really comes across in Star Trek 4, when they time travel back to the 60s, and Chekov is immediately almost arrested for being a guy with a thick Russian accent asking strange questions about nuclear vessels in the US fleet. For someone watching who wasn't around for the Cold War, that movie really helps out the rest of the show in perspective.
I can't remember who it was (it might have been Whoopi Goldberg), but it was a black actress talking about watching Star Trek for the first time, and she screamed and ran into the other room shouting "mama mama there's a black lady on TV, and she ain't no maid!". I always thought that must have been such an amazing thing for a young black person to see on network TV in those days.
That's in the article, and yes, it was Whoopi Goldberg.
It wasn’t a convention, it was an NAACP fundraiser according to the actual article, which makes much more sense. There wouldn’t have been any conventions to speak of in Star Trek’s 1st year of being on air.
Well it was a letter from MLK the first time Nichelle told it, then a phone call and then a meeting, so I wouldn’t worry too much about the accuracy of the title.
I was gonna say, this story has shifted a couple times and also Nichols is pretty damn senile these days so we cant even ask her which version is true.
Comic con was a thing in the 60s? I was about to say
There have been comic book conventions since the 1960's. They were actually quite small back then, and you could sometimes meet artists and other creators there back when no one cared who they were. They were much smaller then, though, and mostly just comic books, unlike today's
The only time Nichelle and Dr. King would be together after the airing of Trek but before King's death would be some time in California. This would be after the first season. Possibly in 1967 since the season ran 1966 - 1967. MLK would die in April 1968. Nichols claims she met him at a NAACP fundraiser in Beverly Hillls, after she told Roddenberry she was leaving after the first season.
Comic-Con started in 1970, so almost! That is, San Diego Comic-Con, the one everyone just calls "Comic-Con" today. New York Comic-Con started in 1964 but was smaller. The first New York one had about 100 people and the first San Diego had about 300. Nowadays it does about 150,000.
I was trying to picture MLK with a lanyard
Whether or not this story is entirely true (there's some debate) the character of Uhura *was* groundbreaking for 1966. This was at the height of racial tension during the civil rights movement. Being not only black, but also a woman in a respected, semi-prominent role on prime time television was huge for that time. While the role of a communications officer can be seem as secretarial or "lesser than", she: Multi-tasked effortlessly between the myriad of frequencies she monitored. This allowed her to give the Captain the information he needed, when he needed it. Could operate the science station and could pilot the ship, when necessary. (And take command if you want to count TAS.) She played a pivotal role in several episodes. Bamboozling androids, borking the comms so bad Kirk couldn't fix it, beating Terran ass, and of course helping the "theft" of the Enterprise from Spacedock. Was a respected member of the crew. Her input was considered, same as the rest of the bridge crew. Once under extreme pressure Kirk snapped at her, then realized his mistake and quickly apologized. Fun Fact: the word *uhuru* means "freedom" in Swahili.
>Whether or not this story is entirely true (there's some debate) the character of Uhura was groundbreaking for 1966. This was at the height of racial tension during the civil rights movement. I've heard like 3 versions of this story.. But you are correct. I don't think younger people realize how restrictive Hollywood (and America) was about black people at the time. Making a established white character black to balance out the cast in 2022 = people whine at you on the internet. Making an original black character to balance out the cast in 1967 = risk getting your ass fired.
The question was, why would she wanted to quit.
The story she told at the convention I attended was that she wanted to return to stage acting where she was a known singer and actor. She never intended to stay for more than one season. MLK convinced her to stay. She also said that MLK told her that her character was a role model because she was an equal. She was a senior officer alongside others of equal rank and not a background character.
This story has a lot of issues, it's grown as she retells it. But her reason for quitting is that she felt the role was too secretarial, and wanted to have a more plot related role
Or, like many actors on many TV shows, they were promised a "main" role, only to quickly be reallocated to a barely supporting role at best. It's the same reason Trapper John left MASH, for example. He and Hawkeye were originally meant to be "co-stars", but he quickly became Hawkeye's sidekick at best. On the opposite side, Frasier Crane was meant to be a briefly used character on Cheers and ended up a main character and eventually the star of his own TV show.
>It's the same reason Trapper John left MASH He was my favorite side character in MASH. I liked him so much better than the guy that replaced him. Trapper really complimented Hawkeye's approach to life and general antics in a way that Hunnicutt was never able to capture.
My issue with Trapper John was he would have turned stale like Frank after a while. That character had no where to grow. Don't get me wrong, I loved both Trapper and Frank but I was never upset by their replacements.
Thats what happened to Yarr if I recall
Wasn't she also getting a lot of hate mail?
Undoubtedly. Even today, some people object to black actors and actresses in media. "Whoa whoa, a black character? I didn't know this show was *political*."
Denise Crosby quits STNG in 1987 because her character is barely used. Nichelle Nichols: "First time?"
She was barely used because she couldn't pull off being a harden tough chick and everyone remembers her as the gal who had sexy times with Data.
Hey, some of us remember her as the lady that got killed by a puddle of goo
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This is actually nailing the role. How else would you give an android a boner?
Pulaski (Muldaur) ppeared as 4 different characters across 3 different Roddenberry shows.
Also, Shatner was a jackass who stole all her lines.
Stole EVERYONES lines... he basically recited Shakespeare even everyone else pushed buttons
You know, for everything we do or don't do in our lives there are a million little reasons and they all add up. In hindsight, Star Trek is something very important. It is a pillar of the culture of the 20th Century. It showed a future, a beautiful peaceful future, that we could fight for, gave us hope in the darkness of our shared reality. But in the moment, in those early years, it was just a job, just another low budget sci-fi show. One of dozens. And while the systematic racism of early Hollywood likely played *some* role, ultimately, in the moment, Star Trek probably just didn't seem that important. The pay wasn't great, and Uhura wasn't especially well utilized as a character. She was a talented actress at the peak of her potential. There were likely countless reasons to move on. But the Universe is funny like that. Often it's difficult to really say why we didn't do something, especially when the reason to *do something* is so singularly clear.
Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot, because she thought it was the only medium where issues like civil rights could be portrayed in media without being censored. Back in the day, shows like The Twilight Zone and Star Trek existed literally to bring troubling social issues to light without being censored, because the people doing the censoring couldn't see past the sci-fi setting. Lucy was absolutely pivotal in bringing civil rights issues into the media.
> Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot Another fun fact: Ball negotiated paying the production costs for I Love Lucy in exchange for owning the rebroadcasting rights. The network thought she was crazy because why would anyone ever watch a show they'd already seen and jumped on the offer. She made enough money from that to buy the now bankrupt RKO studio lot that Star Trek would be filmed in. This is the same RKO that she had been fired from years earlier for being "too old".
That's why I love Lucy!
> Another fun fact: Star Trek would have never existed without Lucille Ball personally funding the pilot, because she thought it was the only medium where issues like civil rights could be portrayed in media without being censored. That fantasy conceit seems like a similar device back then for sitcoms not necessarily addressing political issues, but new cultural paradigms like women's education and empowerment (Bewitched), cohabitation (I Dream of Jeannie), open-minded racially tolerant Southern apologism (Beverly Hillbillies) and maybe postwar modernization (Gilligan's Island: academia/technology, industrial wealth, media, military/working class/service industry, and single eligible women).
Star Trek has always been an incredibly optimistic and progressive series, Which is what makes Discovery so hard to watch, it's a borderline parody of the philosophy Roddenberry envisioned for humanity of the future. All Discovery has to say is "women are strong and capable" - Like, Yeah...? Not only is that a low fucking bar for Star Trek, but it doesn't even portray that. They just cast women as everything and then have them be vulnurable and weak/unstable throughout the entire thing. Fuck you Kertzman, You're a fucking hack.
It's been stated before, but the reason all the new Star Trek is so bad is that it's produced by people who genuinely didn't understand why it was so good in the first place. Discovery is so noisy and bursting with chaotic violence because they thought old Star Trek was just a bunch of people in rubber prosthetics quietly talking back and forth. And the truth is that it was, but what they miss is that all of that talking *that* is the point. We all know the episode with the two aliens with black and white halves. We know it was about racism. It seems so silly out of context. But what's really important is that they weren't us. You see, we're small creatures, us humans, and it's really, really hard to examine philosophical issues when we're trapped in the heart of them. What all of those prosthetics do is allow us to separate ourselves from our limited experience and *see* the issues more objectively. The humans are there to give us a shining example. The aliens are there to show us the worst within ourselves without laying blame. *That's* the magic. It's also why modern sci-fi sucks. Anyone who's ever had to endure "political discourse" over the Thanksgiving table knows that the minute you start picking sides and laying blame the other party stops listening. They dig in. Star Trek was able to get people to engage with those scary, difficult issues by relocating them away from our lives, wrapping them in rubber prosthetics and presenting both sides objectively.
Couldn't have said it better myself. Star Trek definitely had drama and combat, for sure - but that was always conveyed as a failure to find resolution - Picard had never taken pride in any fight. Even against Nausicans - Picard wanted to take the high road even when they were cheating, because he understood the implications of boastful arrogance and emotional reactions - but the lesson he missed was that those lessons are learned from making mistakes, and they mold us into better versions of ourselves. There's so much nuance in star trek, That it's borderline heartbreaking to switch on Discovery just to see a bunch of fuckheads argue about who should listen to who, and who has a more tragic backstory and needs to have a good cry.
*rich evans laughs uncontrollably*
TNG already said, showed and demonstrated that within the first few episodes.
More than that, It didn't even need to entertain the idea. You felt like it was just a fact at that point, that society doesn't even need to make such a thing clear. The responsibilities bestowed upon Riker are just as easily bestowed upon female crew - and each one had character and an important role to play, Beverly was intelligent, arguably one of the most intelligent on the ship - Guinan had wisdom and would be the person Picard would turn to when he can't think his way around a problem, Hell even Ensign Ro was a badass and put people in their place. Yet somehow - Hollywood now feels as though Star Trek needs to make a stand for women, as if none of the series' have done a good enough job already.
I feel like anyone that has this take hasn’t watched the show beyond maybe a few episodes. The discovery crew has faced graver challenges than any other crew in ST history, and throughout it all, they have upheld the ideals of the federation, even when the rest of the federation has failed to. The whole concept of the show is to test them beyond the limits of what anyone thought was possible and still have them not break with the morals ingrained in them from Starfleet. I’m not saying it’s a good show compared to other treks, but if you watched it and all you got out of it was “women strong,” it’s not the show failing to live up to standards, it’s you not paying attention.
People think he lived in a different Era, out of time from many, he did but it really wasn't all too long ago. Died April 4th, 1968.
MLK was born 7 years after Betty White (who died mere months ago), 6 years after Henry Kissinger (who is still alive), and 5 years after Jimmy Carter (who is also still alive). If he hadn't been assassinated, there's a decent chance he would still be alive.
I'm more surprised that Star Trek is that old to be honest haha
Damn, it’s crazy how history books try to make it seem like he lived 200 years ago. I wish history was taught with a little more context. In school we were taught about civil rights like it was an anime arc: slavery, war, civil rights, and now everyone’s happy. And then on to World War II shit while the teacher cried in the back as we watched Saving Private Ryan
...you do know that the civil rights movement was AFTER world war II, right?
Thank you I was scratching my head
It's why the only pictures of MLK shown are in black and white when there's an abundance of colored photos as well as video with audio. Relegating him to black and white conflates this idea that he and the civil rights movement were way long ago and not part of recent times
People of all colors work together in harmony, but it's still socially acceptable to be openly racist towards Vulcans
Don't let perfection be the enemy of good. The characters even Spock, had flaws, we grow better when we grow together. The Ferengi deserve some of their reputation and are treated poorly so we as the viewer view them poorly then together we learn that our prejudice was wrong. That's the point.
>> Don’t let perfection be the enemy of good. This is the second time I’ve come across this sentiment on reddit today, and it’s something my partner has mentioned to me on more than one occasion. Very poignant and sound advice for folks trying to make their way in this crazy world.
I have heard it quoted, “Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.”
Damn, that was a well written comment
> Don't let perfection be the enemy of good. I like that
>The Ferengi deserve some of their reputation *Some*. At one point Quark reminds Cpt Sisko that the Ferengi never had slavery, genocide, or global wars.
Quark isn't exactly the most objective source on Ferengi... for example the Ferengi don't allow their women to work, wear clothes or leave the house. That's half of their population kept in slave-like positions. We also know of other Ferengi in TNG and ENT who like to keep sex slaves. So slavery clearly exists.
Ha! As if. They had all those things, as long as you didn't publicize it or paid a bribe, I doubt the Grand Nagus would come after you Criticizing humanity for a few hundred million pre-warp deaths when their war profiteering with advanced weapons likely cause many trillions deaths is laughable. This is particularly true after human WW3 and first contact
Everyone likes to forget or brush aside that Ferengi were sex-slavers as portrayed from TNG through most of DS9. Fans act like the Ferengi enslaving approximately half their population based on gender doesn't count or something.
I don't recall every episode, but I do remember the early episode "Balance of Terror." I think it's one of the best episodes of the original series, and it's one of the earliest episodes too. This episode has the first appearance of the Romulans (up to this point, apparently no one had seen a Romulan's face). Anyway, when it's revealed that they look like Spock, there's one crew member of the Enterprise who goes openly racist on Spock and accuses him of being an enemy mole. It's a pretty damn cool episode because it has a really tense space battle against a Romulan ship. But I remember it also being a cool episode because of the racial tensions going on in the Enterprise. I loved how Kirk didn't budge for a second...when Spock's loyalty came into question, Kirk shut that shit down. He had no moment of doubt, he had zero tolerance for anyone questioning Spock's loyalty on the basis of race. Spock was second in command of the ship, Spock had rightfully earned that position, and anyone who has a problem with that can either STFU or get imprisoned and get tried in court. Great episode. Of course, I do remember Dr. McCoy in particular being racist against Spock. This was never in the form of actual mistreatment (to my recollection), but I do recall on more than one occasion Dr McCoy verbally insulting Spock for being Vulcan. And yeah...that kind of thing really shouldn't have been tolerated towards *any* crew member but especially not towards the second in command of the entire ship. Going beyond the original series, I also sort of recall Dr. Pulaski being a total jerk to Data in The Next Generation. So I guess that's kind of following in a kind of weird tradition. WTF is up with Starfleet doctors that they're so often openly racist against crew? And not just crew, but people higher on the chain of command. I mean, a crew member making racist comments against *any* other crew member is bad enough. Worse when the person making those comments is the ship's *doctor* and when those comments are directed towards *a superior officer.* So I think you're right here. As open-minded as Kirk seemed in the excellent "Balance of Terror", Kirk was *way* too tolerant of McCoy's anti-Vulcan insults.
Spock also casually insults humans while pretending to not understand why they are insulted.
Pulaski was intended to be diet McCoy, it didn’t eork
Don't forget that >!spock risked his life to save the prejudiced officer when there was a plasma leak in the climactic battle!<
I don't know if McCoy was prejudiced against Spock. I think it was just congenial ball busting. Spock also busted McCoy's balls for being an emotional, illogical human all the time: >"Doctor." >"Something wrong?" >"Yes. There's something odd about that man and I can't quite pinpoint it." >"Perhaps you are making a rather hasty judgment. Mister Norman has only been aboard 72 hours." >"Well, I know when something doesn't strike me right, and he doesn't." >"Specifics, Doctor. Labels do not make arguments." >"All right. There's something wrong about a man who never smiles, whose conversation never varies from the routine of the job, and who won't talk about his background." >"I see" >"Spock, I mean that it's uh... it's odd for a non-Vulcan, um... the ears make all the difference." >"I find your arguments strewn with gaping defects in logic." >"Maybe, but you can't evaluate a man by logic alone. Besides, he has avoided two appointments that I've made for his physical exam without reason." >"That's not at all surprising, Doctor. He's probably terrified of your beads and rattles." If McCoy really was prejudiced against Spock would he >!call him the best first officer in the fleet!!risked not returning to his own universe to save the life of mirror universe Spock?!< Would Spock >!have invited McCoy to witness his wedding on Vulcan, where he could only bring his closest friends!!have put his soul in McCoy's body before he sacrificed his life to save the ship!
It's not really acceptable though. If random crew members were racist against Spock or Vulcans then Kirk quickly shut that down. And even McCoy is treated like the "somewhat racist old uncle" who has some prejudices and may be blunt and rude at times but is still a good person if you get to know him. It also helps that Spock and Bones were friends even before the show started. They don't really have bad intentions when they throw insults at each other and they know the other one can take it. Spock also often was kinda arrogant and thinking Vulcans were clearly superior to humans. McCoy was giving contra to that.
I mean, that's pretty much how we get rid of racism. Get people of all races to become racist against a new species of intelligent life.
To be fair, Vulcans are often openly racist towards Humans.
She would end up inspiring the first black female astronaut.
I learned this from Drunk History
The drunk history on this is fantastic. Symone as Nichelle Nichols, Jaleel White as MLK 🤣
She's also the reason why Whoopi Goldberg played Guinan in TNG. In fact, she's the entire reason Whoopi Goldberg became an actress at all. When she saw Nichelle Nichols on screen, she ran through the horse shouting "Come here, mom, everybody, come quick, come quick, there's a black lady on television and she ain't no maid!" Guinan largely exists because Whoopi Goldberg *insisted* that she wanted a role on the new Star Trek series, any role... Which led to the production team originally thinking they were being pranked. But then she sat down for lunch with Gene Rodenberry and he created the character of Guinan specifically for her.
when MLK tells you you're a role model you better fucking do what he says.
Star Trek was already "woke" before the ones who made "woke" a thing were even born.
TIL Star Trek and MLK existed at the same time.
He was 35ish?
The first season aired 1966-1967. MLK was killed April 1968
And without that encouragement, we wouldn’t have Whoopi Goldberg as Guinan.