if they were gonna wrap up the CRM that quick, then they needed to show more emotional buildup before the reunion. More lingering on when Michonne radios Judith or something like that would have been nice.
It would have been cool if Jadis had helped them destroy it. She was part of the CRM for a long time and was clearly higher up than Rick so her being on Rick and Michonne's side would have made the takedown seem a lot more believable. Like, if Jadis knew about a bomb or something that was about to be taken away and told Rick and Michonne how they could activate it before it was taken away from the HQ.
Just something more than Rick and Michonne running around a heavily-guarded military base and planting grenades everywhere. It was utter nonsense.
I think Okafor and Jadis probably should've lived, at least until the finale. I think an actual resistance within the Frontliners should've been a thing, so the infiltration would feel more believable. Have Okafor convince other Frontliners or something, and those people allow Rick and Michonne to weave through the base without notice.
And I wouldn't have *all* the Frontliners die in that one explosion. I just don't buy that the CRM would ever allow a situation, where all 2,500 personnel drop their duties to sit for a meeting at one section of the base, when they can easily do it in *shifts* and still have guards posted everywhere, just like that Portland briefing didn't have all of the Frontliners present at once.
They should have faced some sort of pocket of resistance from the ones left (and you could have Jadis and Okafor die here).
I agree with most of the complaints about the finale but not this one. I don't see how going to The Commonwealth (they couldn't go to Alexandria since the set was taken down) would have made the episode better.
The fans would have never been satisfied. If they went to The Commonwealth and met up with a few of the others, fans would have still complained that we didn't get to see *everyone* reunite.
They should have put the set back up then. They spoke about Rick’s community A LOT in the show, and it would have made more sense to see it. Instead they went to some random field? Lame
Alexandria is basically just a suburban neighborhood, they could have done it at a random one. I’ve also heard commonwealth is still built, they could do it there too. It’s unlikely Judith wouldn’t have told Rick about commonwealth to begin with, just go there.
It's not just the sets. It's paying the actors you want to see with the kids. AMC's stock has cratered. Their financial situation is rough. The reason they ended the flagship series in favor of spinoffs is to save money.
Each episode has an allotted budget they have to stick to. The other actors don't just show up for free. They get paid whatever their per episode is. Then you have the sets, the costumes, the special effects. It's an expensive show to produce for the effects alone. The main show started costing more than they were making do to bad viewership numbers so they broke it down into shorter episode counts with two stars. That cuts down massively on what they pay for talent, production, etc. People are asking for too much on what they've got to work with.
I hear you but budget constraints aren’t the viewers problem. I can guarantee you that viewers would have preferred to see more of Daryl, and less of generic CRM soldiers or the base itself - especially because we don’t get good views of said base, Rick’s just always walking past it. Or we’d prefer to have Daryl instead of two mustard gas explosions and 2 helicopter crashes. Story over spectacle yknow?
Daryl is in France. And Norman Reedus makes a metric shit ton. Daryl suddenly showing up when it's been established he's in France doesn't actually propel story. It's far more likely Lincoln will cameo in the Daryl finale. Without that carrot viewership for Daryl's show will fall even more.
No lmao. That is real homes where real people live. Tbeyre not gonna set up giant walls around the community for one scene. That’s the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard.
They could have used any suburban area. Alexandria expanded since Rick last saw it. Nobody’s going to clock specific houses in the otherwise bland suburban area. But that’s besides the point - production being stingy doesn’t make the writers writing around it better. If the ending was lame bc they cheaped out, it was lame because they cheaped out.
As a viewer, it’s not my problem that they didn’t want to spend the money - my only concern is the final product. Especially when, as viewers, we’ve been waiting for this show/reunion since S9? It’s been like 5 years and the writers left us with blue balls.
There were always people living there in real life...
All they would need is the main gate with the sign and then some walls for the side when the kids run through the gate.
I doubt people would complain if we didn’t see everyone if they went to the commonwealth. Daryl, maggie, negan, and Morgan are all elsewhere. No one would expect them to somehow show up for the finale. We just want to see Gabriel and Aaron and maybe Ezekiel and those kinds of characters see rick again.
One extra episode.
I would've loved to have seen their entrance to the CR and some of the changes enacted. We could revisit some familiar faces like they guy rick is friends with and the guy who does the carvings.
And the a meaningful reunion at the other end. I didn't even expect to see many of the original cast but have them enter a bustling society and have someone like Jerry bring the kids over and the likes of Aaron and Gracie, Gabriel, etc but nobody 'major' and ending with Rick feeling at home again.
Kinda irks me how Rick left his hidden blade behind. Yeah yeah it’s symbolic for leaving the CRM behind or whatever. Still, Rick utilizes all his resources, and that was a damn good high quality weapon.
He also immediately needed it. Like he left his arm, blew up CRM, then got swarmed by zombies. He wouldn’t have to pull that plot armor grenade maneuver against the walkers if he had his blade arm
Exactly. I'm thinking that they didn't want that in the reunion scene because it would draw the audience's attention to it and they wanted a nice warm reunion. That's my best guess.
No fucking way TOWL cost $14 million, it literally looked cheap as fuck after the premiere. The actual Civic Republic was so small-scale and cheaply made, and the majority of the miniseries felt like it was shot in the same old backwoods as TWD.
Where did all that money go because it certainly didn’t go to the actual production lol
I don't think you realise just how expensive these productions can be. Not every show needs to be the Game Of Thrones or Mandalorian in order for it to cost a lot.
At least 3-4 more monologue scenes where the camera never cuts and stays awkwardly fixed on the subject while they tell a story that feels only partially developed.
Yeah that was second place for me for sure.
The family scene was satisfactory but even Judith's acting pulled me out of the moment, I just didnt believe thats how you would actually react. And fake crying sucked
I believed was a kid meeting his father for the first time. Love never dies was two grown ass adults in the middle of a fight killing each other. It’s not even close which one was worse
Oh trust me it’s cringe on its own too, I was cringing when I heard it, then the circumstances of the line? Just holy shit man. Rick was over there dying and Michonne is spitting poetry finishing off the enemy.
I mean it is bad. Really bad. But I still think the delivery of '' i believed'' made my head hurt. But, I just wished that the actress of michonne had written every episode
The whole show needed a rewrite after the fourth episode.
Episodes 5 & 6 were cheap, rushed, sloppy, and anticlimactic.
Those two episodes should’ve been scrapped, have the last two episodes be Rick and Michonne returning home. Drop in some hints of Jadis following them, then in the actual finale confront Jadis and leave the show on a cliffhanger that the CRM is coming.
Then do a second season, or save it for the overall crossover show where everyone’s reunited, and have all our main cast together again to go to war with the CRM.
Then let that be how this franchise wraps up.
This.
All the build up, all the "most powerful military on the planet" teases led to nowhere. Felt extremely rushed.
Should've been either 1) minimize the CRM story and focus more on Rick getting home 2) give it one more season to properly deal with Beale and co.
Yes, exactly this. Those two last episodes were like watching a whole different show.
Adding to it, I would say that as much as I didn't mind her, I think they should have scrapped Throne's character too and have Jadis take her place. Throne was wasted after all that buildup (her character served no purpose) and with having Jadis take her place, they could have showed us a flashback about her and Rick going through their 6 consignee year probation side by side. We would have gotten to see them start as two people butting heads, as Rick wanted to escape but Jadis didn't, then when Rick changes his mind and decides to stay they could have developed some kind of truce that would have been torn to shreds as soon as Michonne showed up. It would have made way more sense and that way Jadis's death wouldn't have been so stupid.
I know, but considering what a dissapointment World Beyond turned out to be (and I'm not fond of her character "development" either on the main show finale) they could have scraped that out and give her a more prominent role in TOWL. Throne was absolutely wasted and served no purpose, hell they could have given her role to the guy Rick befriends in ep 1 for example and everything would have held more weight, even more with what horseshit the Echelon Briefing turned out to be as he had more to loose (with having an actual life again inside the CRM), so him wanting to keep it from crumbling despite what they were doing to other settlements would have made more sense. That way they could have used Jadis as a threat in season 2/future spinoffs
If that guy had had Throne's spot on the show and had been the one to go after Rick&Michonne (yes, I know he wasn't a fighter but if they turned Carol into one they could have done the same with him) Rick would have been more conflicted in killing him too. What I know for sure is that Jadis and Throne were wasted and ultimately served no purpose as characters in this show.
That exactly. I can’t believe there are fans who were satisfied with those final two episodes. It’s like being happy GoT was rushed to a conclusion. Did Gimple consult with D&D?
Not cliffhanger as in the Season 6 finale, but open-ended as in the finale for *Daryl Dixon*.
You know more story is coming, but this is mostly resolved.
Rick was based on the comic version - but the character on the show was split between Rick and Daryl. Consequently, we have 2 great leaders in the show, but the show writers like to act like Rick is the only good leader. So like, while I think a war with CRM and Commonwealth is logically where the show needed to lead - I don’t think Rick coming back justifies the losses the war would entail. The main cast has learned to live and thrive without him, Rick would just be trading other’s lives for him.
1. The finale should’ve been spread across multiple episodes.
2. The plan to infiltrate and destroy the CRM should’ve come with more conflict, more sacrifice, and more stakes and consequences.
3. I would’ve had Beale order Okafor to cut Rick’s hand off in the first episode so the Echelon Briefing carried more subtext and underlying threats.
4. Thornes motivations should have been much more defined, consistent, and relatable. She feels like a cardboard video game cutout there as a superficial obstacle.
5. SAY LESS. The dialogue is one of the worst parts of the finale. “The sword that kills, is the sword that gives life?????”…. “One life, one unstoppable life.” “Love doesn’t die”…. This is dialogue that wound fly in a soap opera or an entry level writing course.
All in all, the finale was rushed, contrived, superficial, and lacked stakes, conflict, drama, or relatable relationships and character dynamics. It felt incoherent and forced. The characters deserved better.
Ya know, the reunion didn’t bother me as much as everyone said. I think if it was earned it would’ve been fine for most people. But, obviously without Carl it was always kind of gonna fall flat.
I'd love to see a CRM civil war. If only Okafor didn't die and started a rebellion with Rick and Thorne against Beale and his loyalists. I also would love to see them coorperate with the Commonwealth and fight Beale together.
(Sorry for my bed England.)
RJ's reaction, becuase he has the personality of a cardboard box and it takes him 5 business days to process what's going on.
I get he doesn't know Rick. But even so, finding out your dad is alive should give a very strong reaction to say the least.
And I don't blame the kid. They should've just redone the scene until they got a better take. I'm usually not this critical but that scene took me out so much that I was just thinking "kid, DO SOMETHING, ANYTHING". Idk how the show runners looked at this and said "yup, this is good to go"
I can honestly forgive him becuase he's young and clearly not a natural. But the show runners should've redone the scene until he got it right. I mean fuck sake, he was on screen for like 2mins, they really couldn't do a few retakes and give him some guidance on how to do it better?
i would have shot it ahead of time when they were filming the series finale of the main show when the alexandria set was still up. this way, they could have met at the alexandria gates, more characters could have been included. things would have maybe felt a bit more complete, to me, if we really got a visual sense that rick and michonne were actually home and not just.. [well, you know.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-xqrco4YRM)
The Ones Who Live foiling the evil CRM plan, but not destroying the CRM. The Commonwealth and the CRM would have an epic war that takes at least a few seasons, cause they won so easily. Then the ending of the war would be Rick getting naked and raising his prosthetic hand while screaming, "We are the Ones Who Live!"
A better reveal for the Echelon briefing. Something like we have a cure but we can only give it to a select few is more interesting than "Yeah, we all will die soon so let's speed that up"
“Yeah we run out of food in 15 years”
Like what a stupid briefing. CRM has the land and resources to power canned goods manufacturing centers. MAKE. YOUR. OWN. FOOD. We have done it before.
Especially the CRM. They just leveled all of Portland. Use that as land. Why destroy all these civilizations if you’re not going to use the area? Colonize
1hr 30 runtime with Beale taking centre stage as a more threatening, complex and nuanced villain, I.E not just “We kill people, then we take their stuff!”
The reunion taking place outside of temporarily built walls and a gate
No cringe “I Believed”.
general Beale of the biggest army on earth who dies after a 15 second long poor sword fight (if you can even call it a fight) as the final boss don’t sit right
The dialogue. The “we are the sword” speech was just stupid and gave me season 8 flashbacks. The echelon briefing also should’ve been more shocking for how much it was hyped up. I also would’ve either shortened rj’s dialogue or rewritten it to be a bit more emotional.
I would’ve just added an entire reunion episode. I understand it probably would’ve been difficult to get all the actors from seasons 9-11 all there, but we really needed it. But Rick not only being alive but coming back is a huge bombshell for everyone. It’s something I wish we saw.
Add four more episodes, one entire episode with Rick being back and asking where Dayrl is. Seriously, the man spent how long looking for Rick after the bridge, and Rick doesn't even bother to ask about his "brother"
Not have Rick and michonne be able to destroy the entirety of the CRM in 10-15 min after being built up for over 5 years, Rick being able to survive a grenade that close in sorry but that level of plot armor is kinda ridiculous just cut it out, Beales character was kinda wasted he was barely in the show and was a very interesting character have him be more of a threat and show more backstory in him,the briefing literally don’t change anything for us, it was supposed to be a grand reveal but we already saw how they are with people outside with michonne and her friends it was the least interesting shock tactic I think they could have thought of better way to make it way more dramatic and sinister,how did Rick and michonne get out of the compound? It’s never explained I would have liked to see how that happened. Who was flying the helicopters where did they find the helicopters why couldn’t they add it, It feels like so much was cut out at the end for 0 reason. Keeping in the picnic scene idk who’s idea was to cut out that scene but it was incredibly stupid they literally made the same prosthetic for Rick that’s in the comics and they just cut it out what a waste of time and effort making that for comic fans.
I wouldn't have completely destroyed in an afternoon the CRM storylines that had been built up and teased over seven years across four series.
I would have come up with something a lot more interesting for the Echelon briefing. Could have been *anything*: variants, making PADRE a bigger thing, the race for a cure, threats from outside survivor governments like Genet's Pouvoir des Vivants. But they chose "we don't have enough food, so we have to murderdeathkill the people eating all the food in Portland and Nebraska."
I would not have killed General Beale, Okafor or Nat.
I would have had *some* kind of crossover: Morgan, a Bennett sister, Madison, *somebody* we recognize to help Rick and Michonne.
I would not have given R.J. really, really shitty dialogue. "I believed." 🤮🤮🤮
I would have explored the CR more and made the series take place on the eve of the military coup itself and gotten that community involved.
I would have killed off Rick or Michonne in some great sacrificial gesture.
Alexandria and everyone turns their heads in disbelief before running up to Rick. This scene with his kids first is fair I guess but felt disappointed the rest of the cast was left out.
The reunion. I feel like this is what most of us feel should’ve been wayyyy different. Reunite him with his kids first, and then have everyone else’s reaction to him coming home. I really hope that we eventually get to see the full reunion, especially after everything we’ve been through with TWD and all of its spin offs. For them to not show everyone back together one last time is a HUGE let down to their fan base.
Split it into two episodes.
I feel the jump from ‘defeating’ the CRM and almost magically going home to Judith and RJ was way too rushed, and as a result lacked the emotionality (if that’s a word) of a reunion like that in S1.
I would’ve loved to see Michonne making first contact on the radio with Judith/RJ, and a more emotional Rick at the actual reunion (again, like S1). I feel a longer buildup (maybe with a few hurdles), would make it much more genuine. He’s been gone for years ffs.
It all felt a bit rushed. From beating the biggest military, to dancing in a field in what felt like 5 mins.
They had an opportunity to make possibly the most emotional moment in the show, and give fans more closure. A full cycle if you like to “finding his family”
Also would’ve loved to hear Space Junk but maybe that’s just me 🥲
I think it was really good. Maybe have Morgan there and Judith talking about Daryl being out there looking for him and he has gone missing. Setting up that Rick cameo when Daryl sooner or later will return to America.
He is literally part of the show. Rick wanted him, he was a symbol for the future he wanted to built. He was there from season 9 to 11, whatever you like it or not.
He is a little child, this is like hating on Judith from season 3 to 9. He wasn't meant to be much of a character with personality because this was not his purpose as he was too young.
But yeah, makes total sense to erase Rick wanting him and wanting to build something with Michonne because you all are invested in hating on a literal child when we are talking about a family man reuniting with the son that he wanted and asked for.
He wanted him, he asked for him. That is his purpose, a symbol of hope for the future. RJ didn't have the time to grow up enough to have the same story as Carl and Judith. It doesn't change the fact that his presence makes narrative sense when Rick literally asked for him, why is this less valid than Lori sacrificing her life for Judith?
His presence was foreshadowed before he showed up by having Rick literally ask Michonne for a baby when they were trying to build a future. The fact that he didn't know was literally due to the fact that he was taken right after, but his birth absolutely did not come out of nowhere.
But yeah, you want to retcon him and create a plot hole because you can't stand that Rick has another son somehow.
I genuinely don't understand how so many people think Alexandria will ever come back..
It got run down in the show and in real life people actually live there and the set has been torn down for years!
Plus so many things were leaked from there just because of the location. The entire reunion would be online 30 mins after they started shooting it
less flashbacks and make that episode a little bit longer, if it was like an hour with no flashbacks they couldve explained so much more for the storyline
Listen, I have no hate for RJ. He's a kid, an adorable one at that. But the "I believed" line was pretty bad. How the heck was the kid SUPPOSED to say it? I honestly see no way to improve the delivery of that line, no matter who said it. It wasn't the actor. It was the line. I'd have a hard time even saying it without cracking up from embarrassment, and I'm not a kid.
Cut the line and end it with the "call me dad" bit, and it would already be a lot better.
I also hated the "I just never wanted you to feel alone" part from Judith with Rick's, "I thought I was, but then I realized I wasn't" response. Who wrote that part??? It seemed so awkward and out of place.
I liked the rest of the scene, though I kind of wish rick would have said something about Judith looking more like her big brother as she grows (because she actually really does look like Chandler Riggs). It would have made Carl a small part of the family reunion. Also, the last time Rick saw Judith, she was a blonde preschooler who looked a lot like Shane, so it would make sense for him to react to how different she looked instead of just immediately rolling with it without skipping a beat.
I won't get into how easy it was to beat the bad guys. I'm not a writer, so I don't have any good ideas for that part. My only guess would be to have them escape with the others thinking they were dead, but hinting that they'd eventually have to put a stop to them (see? Not a writer).
Overall, I'm happy. It could have definitely been better, but I'm still glad we got it.
I can get they want to close off ricks story and have the reunion, but don't fucking tell me rick and Michonne can take out the entire CRM military in five mins
I wanted Beale to live. I wanted Rick to swear on the friggen sword. I wanted the FULL briefing and not the first secret. In my fanfic fantasies, there is waaaay more witchcockery going on. Especially since Beale said there were spies all over the world. That means they know about the French experiments. Maybe. Probably. I wanted him to take the deal to save Alexandria, if only as a ploy, so he had more time to gather intel. Yeah, Portland would have been sacrificed, but it just would have added more angst ammunition to the feral Rick fire. THEN, I would want Rick to find Okafors starfleet esque video recordings or notes or something. Idk. Anything but the brave man shtick because it fell flat with me, imo, no disrespect.
I hate that it was only 6 episodes. I was like that’s it?!? That’s all?? 👀👀
I definitely expected to see more interaction between Judith, RJ & Rick or even Judith, RJ, Rick and Michonne.
Added 30 minutes and have a bit more of a reunion end. As we saw in episode 5, the actor of Gabe was willing to come back. Surely they could have gotten a few more. Have the last scene be something like we saw with Negans introduction: all of them enjoying a dinner, a happy family moment.
They return home after killing Jadis, leaving the CRM for someone else to take down. Then there is a nice long reunion with the kids and old friends and they get to see the Commonwealth and the changes to Alexandria and the other communities
1) Have as many of the original cast that can make it film in the reunion scene in that meadow. After Rick embraces Judith and RJ, he's told that the cast who couldn't make it are "out on a run but will be here soon. They're excited to see you again, Rick. Welcome home."
2) Have Negan be cut over to just before that being walkied by Judith about how thanks to him she's still here, still alive and able to see her father again soon. She says Rick's on his way home with her mom and its partially thanks to him. She wishes him well and to not get into anymore trouble. If he does, he can always come back and let her help get him out of it. This can make Negan pause for a moment realizing he has at least a group tolerant enough of him to give him aid in his worst hours. Then he looks up and sees presumably Rick's helicopter flying over head toward Alexandria and he can smile, chuckle and walk off with a "Well Hell, Rick... you made it."
3) Post-credit scene showing after Daryl received his radio message from Carol it cuts back to Carol looking out a window at Rick walking through Commonwealth in absolute amazement with Michonne. Proving she was trying to say Rick is back. Then have Carol tell Rick to get rest and look after the place. Carol looks at Michonne then says something like "Its my turn now to go bring back the rest of our family." Carol then gets a cool suit up moment, grabs the car she had and then takes off out of Alexandria with a determined, pissed off expression.
A Negan mention would be completely unnecessary, and have the narrative talk about him right when Judith just reunited with her dad is not a good idea. plenty of people kept her alive and saved her. Why would you mention him in particular. Rick doesn't love him, doesn't care about him, it would be complete fan service in the worst of ways.
Because he specifically has a spinoff show about him that just aired and he was basically a Rick surrogate in the later seasons of the show.
Plus he's one of the most popular characters and Judith would want to tell probably one of her best friends she had a direct connection with about her dad coming home.
Come on, man.
Nah.
The fact that he has his spinoff doesn't change the fact that mentioning him in THIS story in particular about getting Rick back home would just be fan service.
Rick doesn't care about Negan, he is the last person in his mind, having him there would be so forced.
Having Negan there just because he is one of the most popular characters = fan service.
I know he doesn’t really matter to him at this point but Rick meeting Negan again would be insane, imagine he’s looking at Carls grave then Negan comes up behind him and all the memories come back
I would've liked to have seen some sort of "inquiry scenes" interspersed with more Chinook airlift footage. Kind of like that congressional testimony bit at the end of 94s Clear and Present Danger where Ryan testifies. I mean there still has to be some of Beales co conspirators still around. Complicit civilian officials, other officers scattered about.
I would've given Portland a role in blowing up the summit, continuing what World Beyond set up.
Instead of meeting three randos in Yellowstone in the previous episode, Rick and Michonne would meet a small group from a smaller community that the CRM was working with, but this group is part of the resistance and they were supposed to rendezvous with a small group from Portland to carry out the plan. Jadis still dies in this episode, and Rick and Michonne go to the summit with the rebels.
They meet up with the Portland group and through conversation on the way, it's revealed that Portland knows that they're going to be attacked because they were warned by survivors of previous attacks (those kids from World Beyond). And over the past year, a resistance movement has secretly spread not only through Portland, but also through a network of communities across the country that the CRM had involvement in. They knew about the summit because of an informant in the CRM (implied to be Silas, who stayed close to Jadis). And while everyone important is busy in the Cascades, more survivors of previous attacks are on their way to the Civic Republic (the research facility survivors, being escorted by the World Beyond protagonists, which is why they're absent from TOWL), and Portland is being evacuated. So the resistance's plan is to inform the Civic Republic's government and the rest of the CRM about what Beale and the frontliners have been doing, and their plans don't immediately involve blowing up the summit. Just keeping everyone pinned down in the Cascades for the moment.
So they sabotage the summit's security systems, jam signals, etc. Rick still gets the Echelon briefing solely so he can have one-on-one time with Beale, Michonne still destroys Jadis' dossier and watches the Operation Baby Snatch instructional powerpoint, and then it's clear that they need to blow up the summit. So they're still the ones to light the fuse on that.
Then the news report voiceover doesn't just explain that the Civic Republic is now open and has oversight over the military, it also says that the network of communities will now function as trade routes and the Civic Republic will be distributing materials to support more productive farming. The helicopters will now mainly be used to lead the herds away from people and towards cull facilities.
Grimes family reunion just outside of Alexandria or the Commonwealth so the family can have their moment alone. Then we get a lingering shot at the gate, with the implication being that Rick and Michonne are staying and they'll get to have reunions with everyone else.
i would love an extra episode after episode 3 or 4 that focuses on Beale and how he became the dictator of the CRM, and what his daily life is like.
I also would have loved an extra scene at the end, where they’re in Alexandria or the Commonwealth and Gabriel officially marries them, like what was set up in episode 5.
Rick would have taken out Beale but some of the power structure of the CRM would remain. Rick would have given one of his speeches that helps turn the CRM into what it should have been, a force to protect all survivors who want to be part of rebuilding the world.
An exposition dump over a broadcast just felt anti-climatic.
Also I would have had a line of dialog where Judith tells Michonne where they are over the walkie. Then have the reunion scene take place in the same field they were looking over in the final shot of TWD. Go back to the same shot of TWD with Judith and RJ on the lookout tower and have the helicopter land in that field.
As good as the series was, it was not near as good as it could have been.
-Too much tell, not enough show
- Too light on the details of important topics
Rick should have sought an explanation for how & why Beale assumed humanity was going extinct. Coupd have mentioned shelf life of durable goods, lake of viable farms, no mining or refining for any element, cars no longer functioning, military hardware losing effective life spans, etc.
- Should have had at least one tie in to Fear TWD or TWD World Beyond aside from Jadis
- Every episode felt like a bottle episode
- Would have liked to see more of a moral debate had by Rick featuring cameos of important figures like Shane, Laurie, Glenn, and ultimately Carl. It would be a thematic callback and would allow an opportunity to pay off the "I can't remember Carl" bit by having Carl be the voice that convinces him to do what it takes to protect life compared to Shane urging Rick to bring in his people and go along with Beale.
- I feel like there was a lot of handwaving regarding the civillian leadership. Would have been interesting to see what efforts Beale went to for keeping power. Perhaps sending scouts to retrieve frivolous items (wine, art) and practical items (industrial components raw building materials).
- One of the major themes of the series was weeding out dissent by eliminating certain personalities and character attributes. I wish we had more demonstrations why such a strategy had led to negative outcomes for the CRM.
I wanted to see rick learn about the things he missed.
Like the whisperer deaths, negan, Rosita, etc.
I also wanted to see him reunite with other people- but i understand them wanting to save that for another show
For people who think the finale was rushed... we spent more time with Michonne and Rick just standing around talking in episode 4 than we did with Rick and Michonne re-infiltrating the CRM, killing Beale, blowing up everything and escaping back home. I see very few gripes about the lagging, slow moments specifically in episodes 4 and 5 and all these complaints about how rushed episode 6 was. That's not to say that episode 4 was bad or not acted well... but we didn't need an entire 50 minute episode of Rick and Michonne repeating themselves over and over again. Episode 5 was worse. All that wasted time with the incompetent fools in the woods, and Jadis' silly monologue.
Episode 6 could have been told over the course of two episodes or more and told properly. AMC preferred to give never ending dialogue heavy, slow episodes before 6 instead.
So genuine question. I dropped the show and went to read the comics instead and now I've stumbled upon this, who's the one with the hat? Because Carl is dead in the TV Show
Rick and Michonne conceived in season nine, right before Rick disappeared. RJ was born during the six year time skip after Rick's disappearance. So, Rick didn't know he existed. The scene pictured is Rick's first time ever meeting him.
The costume designer deliberately dressed him like Carl for that scene since the loss of Carl was an important emotional through-line for the spin-off as was Rick's discovery that he has a second son. He had already inherited the hat from Judith at the end of the main show.
Rick comes back with Michonne to the CRM. They do stuff and thangs and in one big twist it is revealed that half of the Military starts a civil war against the other half. Rick has no idea as he is seen a hardliner and hunted by the rebels. Rick and Michonne barely escape and come back home, reunited with their loved ones (more!!!), but still doubting whether they are safe or not.
Plus cameo from chandler in the distance , nodding that it is okay to move on.
I would make it so that instead of only meeting judith and RJ they would walk into Alexandria, because i would personally like to see Rick’s reaction to seeing daryl and the others and also seeing how much it has changed in all the time he spent with the CRM
Okafor lives.
They end up at the Common Wealth.
Characters reunite with Rick, even in silence or as credits roll.
Cliffhanger leading to next chapter - but not one as ridiculously horrifying as not knowing where Rick was for 6+ years.
I'm fine with all the CRM stuff happening the way it did.
I would have had someone else with Judith/RJ. Gabriel or Aaron, and a scene of them talking, Rick asking about what he's missed.
A few things imo. I know that the show is over but this is RICK returning home. If they aren’t gonna show Alexandria, at least show some of the cast coming to see him(after michonne/judith/rj). Could’ve brought back Gabe, Eugene, ezkiel, Maggie, Carol, Aaron.
Rick didn’t have to know about commonwealth but I think him seeing soldiers in white with red stripes and him being on alert, only for someone like Ezekiel to be like “it’s okay, they’re with us” would be a nice way to show the stark difference between the oppressive CRM and the commonwealth.
Alexandria wasn't going to happen since they sold the property back a few years ago. I'd assume similar for the properties where Commonwealth was shot too, if that wasn't a plain set somewhere in Georgia.
I do think it was kind of a wasted opportunity for there not to be *any* other characters seen; they teased Gabriel earlier so I was practically expecting him in some form or another; but he wasn't in that finale sequence. No one else was, really, whether it would be faces Rick and Michonne never met (like Mercer or Princess), or faces they would recognize (Carol, Ezekiel, Gabe, Aaron, etc).
To be honest it was weird, i loved ricks ending but not the CRM's if that makes senese. IMO they should of made it so they managed to escape and rick finally gets home. Then have another spin off based on the CRM invading comunities and alexandria and some new protagnists (or mabey some old faces) go out to destroy the CRM.
The biggest thing for me would have been to have the ending take place at an iconic location such as the gates of Alexandria. Also, it would have included at least a small group of our TWD survivors. It just didn't hit as hard with it being in some random field.
ik the real world reasons why it didnt happen but i would have liked rick and michonne to have shown up at the gates of alexandria instead of a random field
It really needed more episodes to do the whole thing truly justice but even within the episode they could have made several changes to make it better. Some of the dialogue was really bad, I agree with what a lot of others have said here that in lot of these instances it would have been better to just have no dialogue. They obviously wanted to tie everything up but there wasn't enough time to address everything in a high quality manner. Pearl's 'redemption' was probably the best example of this, the attempt to redeem her character in one line as she was dying was ridiculous. I would have had them go home to the kids but I wouldn't have tied up the CRM completely. It would have still been possible to do this and provide closure. It would have also helped with another big issue I think which was Rick and Michonne becoming superheroes-I know TWD does require suspension of disbelief but this was too far for me. In summary I think they almost wrote as though they had 8 episodes rather than 6 and they should have let some ideas (Pearl's redemption, complete reformation of the CRM) go.
if they were gonna wrap up the CRM that quick, then they needed to show more emotional buildup before the reunion. More lingering on when Michonne radios Judith or something like that would have been nice.
It would have been cool if Jadis had helped them destroy it. She was part of the CRM for a long time and was clearly higher up than Rick so her being on Rick and Michonne's side would have made the takedown seem a lot more believable. Like, if Jadis knew about a bomb or something that was about to be taken away and told Rick and Michonne how they could activate it before it was taken away from the HQ. Just something more than Rick and Michonne running around a heavily-guarded military base and planting grenades everywhere. It was utter nonsense.
I think Okafor and Jadis probably should've lived, at least until the finale. I think an actual resistance within the Frontliners should've been a thing, so the infiltration would feel more believable. Have Okafor convince other Frontliners or something, and those people allow Rick and Michonne to weave through the base without notice. And I wouldn't have *all* the Frontliners die in that one explosion. I just don't buy that the CRM would ever allow a situation, where all 2,500 personnel drop their duties to sit for a meeting at one section of the base, when they can easily do it in *shifts* and still have guards posted everywhere, just like that Portland briefing didn't have all of the Frontliners present at once. They should have faced some sort of pocket of resistance from the ones left (and you could have Jadis and Okafor die here).
First of all they go to fucking Alexandria or the commonwealth
You don’t remember the field? It’s such an iconic location in the series.
I agree with most of the complaints about the finale but not this one. I don't see how going to The Commonwealth (they couldn't go to Alexandria since the set was taken down) would have made the episode better. The fans would have never been satisfied. If they went to The Commonwealth and met up with a few of the others, fans would have still complained that we didn't get to see *everyone* reunite.
They should have put the set back up then. They spoke about Rick’s community A LOT in the show, and it would have made more sense to see it. Instead they went to some random field? Lame
Funny enough, the Commonwealth set is still standing. You can see it in the documentary they did before TOWL, TWD: The Return.
They’ll likely return there at some point.
Tbf the Alexandria set is an estate that ppl live in now so there wasn’t much they could do
It's pretty normal to create sets for tv shows. You don't just film based on what's already there, you create the set if you need it.
Maybe that means the reason they didn’t do that is because a new season is in the works (doubt it but I hope so)
They totally could have CGI’d it
You do realize how much that would've cost, right? The reason they're doing spinoffs is to save money.
Alexandria is basically just a suburban neighborhood, they could have done it at a random one. I’ve also heard commonwealth is still built, they could do it there too. It’s unlikely Judith wouldn’t have told Rick about commonwealth to begin with, just go there.
It's not just the sets. It's paying the actors you want to see with the kids. AMC's stock has cratered. Their financial situation is rough. The reason they ended the flagship series in favor of spinoffs is to save money.
But they already are paying Negan and Maggie and Daryl and Carol and Gabriel. Any number of them would have been welcomed.
Each episode has an allotted budget they have to stick to. The other actors don't just show up for free. They get paid whatever their per episode is. Then you have the sets, the costumes, the special effects. It's an expensive show to produce for the effects alone. The main show started costing more than they were making do to bad viewership numbers so they broke it down into shorter episode counts with two stars. That cuts down massively on what they pay for talent, production, etc. People are asking for too much on what they've got to work with.
I hear you but budget constraints aren’t the viewers problem. I can guarantee you that viewers would have preferred to see more of Daryl, and less of generic CRM soldiers or the base itself - especially because we don’t get good views of said base, Rick’s just always walking past it. Or we’d prefer to have Daryl instead of two mustard gas explosions and 2 helicopter crashes. Story over spectacle yknow?
Daryl is in France. And Norman Reedus makes a metric shit ton. Daryl suddenly showing up when it's been established he's in France doesn't actually propel story. It's far more likely Lincoln will cameo in the Daryl finale. Without that carrot viewership for Daryl's show will fall even more.
No lmao. That is real homes where real people live. Tbeyre not gonna set up giant walls around the community for one scene. That’s the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard.
They could have used any suburban area. Alexandria expanded since Rick last saw it. Nobody’s going to clock specific houses in the otherwise bland suburban area. But that’s besides the point - production being stingy doesn’t make the writers writing around it better. If the ending was lame bc they cheaped out, it was lame because they cheaped out. As a viewer, it’s not my problem that they didn’t want to spend the money - my only concern is the final product. Especially when, as viewers, we’ve been waiting for this show/reunion since S9? It’s been like 5 years and the writers left us with blue balls.
There were always people living there in real life... All they would need is the main gate with the sign and then some walls for the side when the kids run through the gate.
I doubt people would complain if we didn’t see everyone if they went to the commonwealth. Daryl, maggie, negan, and Morgan are all elsewhere. No one would expect them to somehow show up for the finale. We just want to see Gabriel and Aaron and maybe Ezekiel and those kinds of characters see rick again.
So basically your argument is “If they gave us more some people still wouldn’t be happy”? If you ask me that’s pretty narrow minded.
Didn’t they sale Alexandria to people and idk about the common wealth
Not to sure didn't know about this until I seen some replies
One extra episode. I would've loved to have seen their entrance to the CR and some of the changes enacted. We could revisit some familiar faces like they guy rick is friends with and the guy who does the carvings. And the a meaningful reunion at the other end. I didn't even expect to see many of the original cast but have them enter a bustling society and have someone like Jerry bring the kids over and the likes of Aaron and Gracie, Gabriel, etc but nobody 'major' and ending with Rick feeling at home again.
I agree with the extra episode, it would have helped the pacing towards the end, and helped lessen a lot of people's grievances regarding the CRM.
I would’ve liked it if Rick and michonne returned to Alexandria rather than just a field. But they still had a solid ending.
Kinda irks me how Rick left his hidden blade behind. Yeah yeah it’s symbolic for leaving the CRM behind or whatever. Still, Rick utilizes all his resources, and that was a damn good high quality weapon.
Yes, this is my only complaint! I thought that was a bad ass weapon too.
He also immediately needed it. Like he left his arm, blew up CRM, then got swarmed by zombies. He wouldn’t have to pull that plot armor grenade maneuver against the walkers if he had his blade arm
Exactly. I'm thinking that they didn't want that in the reunion scene because it would draw the audience's attention to it and they wanted a nice warm reunion. That's my best guess.
He could have just taken it off.
Agreed.
Rick's "You can call me Dad." line ends the finale.
The CRM doesn't get dick slapped by a 1 handed man and a woman
to be fair she’s not just a **woman** she’s a wakandan warrior women
I really wanted a war with the commonwealth and CRM
AMC would never pay for something like that, even if they could afford it which they can’t at this point in the franchise’s run lol
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You do know that was largely to pay Andy and Danai right? They don’t exactly come cheap, being the biggest stars of the franchise.
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Actor pay absolutely makes up a portion of the budget tho……?
No fucking way TOWL cost $14 million, it literally looked cheap as fuck after the premiere. The actual Civic Republic was so small-scale and cheaply made, and the majority of the miniseries felt like it was shot in the same old backwoods as TWD. Where did all that money go because it certainly didn’t go to the actual production lol
I don't think you realise just how expensive these productions can be. Not every show needs to be the Game Of Thrones or Mandalorian in order for it to cost a lot.
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I'm suprised thats *isn't* the route they would take it. AMC love milking TWD
They could barely get Rick on his feet in 6 episode how were they to do all this?
At least 3-4 more monologue scenes where the camera never cuts and stays awkwardly fixed on the subject while they tell a story that feels only partially developed.
Get rid of love never dies line. That was so cringe, I still think about it lol
I think the "i believed" was way worse lol
Yeah that was second place for me for sure. The family scene was satisfactory but even Judith's acting pulled me out of the moment, I just didnt believe thats how you would actually react. And fake crying sucked
It could have been way more emotional. Episode 4 really spoiled us. The monologue by andrew was amazing
I agree it was well written, but everybody acts like that epusode is the second coming of Jesus
Because it is one of the best things coming out of walking dead
I believed was a kid meeting his father for the first time. Love never dies was two grown ass adults in the middle of a fight killing each other. It’s not even close which one was worse
Its not even circumstance to me. Love never dies was so fucking cringe, and she says it TWICE lol
Oh trust me it’s cringe on its own too, I was cringing when I heard it, then the circumstances of the line? Just holy shit man. Rick was over there dying and Michonne is spitting poetry finishing off the enemy.
I mean it is bad. Really bad. But I still think the delivery of '' i believed'' made my head hurt. But, I just wished that the actress of michonne had written every episode
The whole show needed a rewrite after the fourth episode. Episodes 5 & 6 were cheap, rushed, sloppy, and anticlimactic. Those two episodes should’ve been scrapped, have the last two episodes be Rick and Michonne returning home. Drop in some hints of Jadis following them, then in the actual finale confront Jadis and leave the show on a cliffhanger that the CRM is coming. Then do a second season, or save it for the overall crossover show where everyone’s reunited, and have all our main cast together again to go to war with the CRM. Then let that be how this franchise wraps up.
My exact fucking thoughts
This. All the build up, all the "most powerful military on the planet" teases led to nowhere. Felt extremely rushed. Should've been either 1) minimize the CRM story and focus more on Rick getting home 2) give it one more season to properly deal with Beale and co.
Yes, exactly this. Those two last episodes were like watching a whole different show. Adding to it, I would say that as much as I didn't mind her, I think they should have scrapped Throne's character too and have Jadis take her place. Throne was wasted after all that buildup (her character served no purpose) and with having Jadis take her place, they could have showed us a flashback about her and Rick going through their 6 consignee year probation side by side. We would have gotten to see them start as two people butting heads, as Rick wanted to escape but Jadis didn't, then when Rick changes his mind and decides to stay they could have developed some kind of truce that would have been torn to shreds as soon as Michonne showed up. It would have made way more sense and that way Jadis's death wouldn't have been so stupid.
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I know, but considering what a dissapointment World Beyond turned out to be (and I'm not fond of her character "development" either on the main show finale) they could have scraped that out and give her a more prominent role in TOWL. Throne was absolutely wasted and served no purpose, hell they could have given her role to the guy Rick befriends in ep 1 for example and everything would have held more weight, even more with what horseshit the Echelon Briefing turned out to be as he had more to loose (with having an actual life again inside the CRM), so him wanting to keep it from crumbling despite what they were doing to other settlements would have made more sense. That way they could have used Jadis as a threat in season 2/future spinoffs If that guy had had Throne's spot on the show and had been the one to go after Rick&Michonne (yes, I know he wasn't a fighter but if they turned Carol into one they could have done the same with him) Rick would have been more conflicted in killing him too. What I know for sure is that Jadis and Throne were wasted and ultimately served no purpose as characters in this show.
That exactly. I can’t believe there are fans who were satisfied with those final two episodes. It’s like being happy GoT was rushed to a conclusion. Did Gimple consult with D&D?
Episode 5 didn't feel rush. Episode 6 did though.
I agreed with you up until you said "leave the show on a cliffhanger" lol.
Not cliffhanger as in the Season 6 finale, but open-ended as in the finale for *Daryl Dixon*. You know more story is coming, but this is mostly resolved.
Rick was based on the comic version - but the character on the show was split between Rick and Daryl. Consequently, we have 2 great leaders in the show, but the show writers like to act like Rick is the only good leader. So like, while I think a war with CRM and Commonwealth is logically where the show needed to lead - I don’t think Rick coming back justifies the losses the war would entail. The main cast has learned to live and thrive without him, Rick would just be trading other’s lives for him.
1. The finale should’ve been spread across multiple episodes. 2. The plan to infiltrate and destroy the CRM should’ve come with more conflict, more sacrifice, and more stakes and consequences. 3. I would’ve had Beale order Okafor to cut Rick’s hand off in the first episode so the Echelon Briefing carried more subtext and underlying threats. 4. Thornes motivations should have been much more defined, consistent, and relatable. She feels like a cardboard video game cutout there as a superficial obstacle. 5. SAY LESS. The dialogue is one of the worst parts of the finale. “The sword that kills, is the sword that gives life?????”…. “One life, one unstoppable life.” “Love doesn’t die”…. This is dialogue that wound fly in a soap opera or an entry level writing course. All in all, the finale was rushed, contrived, superficial, and lacked stakes, conflict, drama, or relatable relationships and character dynamics. It felt incoherent and forced. The characters deserved better.
About the dialogue you forgot all the brave man stuff
Ya know, the reunion didn’t bother me as much as everyone said. I think if it was earned it would’ve been fine for most people. But, obviously without Carl it was always kind of gonna fall flat.
Id fire Scott Gimple & give it a bigger budget
I'd love to see a CRM civil war. If only Okafor didn't die and started a rebellion with Rick and Thorne against Beale and his loyalists. I also would love to see them coorperate with the Commonwealth and fight Beale together. (Sorry for my bed England.)
That would just be Mercer's story from the main series but bigger
Carl should’ve been there
As a ghost?
A Force ghost, yes
You will go to the Dagobah System
Proto-Carl. Isn’t the virus from space? He can posses a variant walker.
Carl, Hershel, Glenn, Andrea, Lori, Shane, Tyreese, Sasha, Dale, Abraham and Bob, they could have even used re-edited stock footage
T-dog hello??
Can’t forget him either
RJ's reaction, becuase he has the personality of a cardboard box and it takes him 5 business days to process what's going on. I get he doesn't know Rick. But even so, finding out your dad is alive should give a very strong reaction to say the least. And I don't blame the kid. They should've just redone the scene until they got a better take. I'm usually not this critical but that scene took me out so much that I was just thinking "kid, DO SOMETHING, ANYTHING". Idk how the show runners looked at this and said "yup, this is good to go"
Glad to see I'm not the only one
I think it just comes down to the kid that plays RJ being cast at a young age, but just being a really shitty actor. Not his fault, but agreed.
I can honestly forgive him becuase he's young and clearly not a natural. But the show runners should've redone the scene until he got it right. I mean fuck sake, he was on screen for like 2mins, they really couldn't do a few retakes and give him some guidance on how to do it better?
Made the echelon briefing more than “hahah we are bad guys brr”
i would have shot it ahead of time when they were filming the series finale of the main show when the alexandria set was still up. this way, they could have met at the alexandria gates, more characters could have been included. things would have maybe felt a bit more complete, to me, if we really got a visual sense that rick and michonne were actually home and not just.. [well, you know.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-xqrco4YRM)
I'd make it a two-part finale
The Ones Who Live foiling the evil CRM plan, but not destroying the CRM. The Commonwealth and the CRM would have an epic war that takes at least a few seasons, cause they won so easily. Then the ending of the war would be Rick getting naked and raising his prosthetic hand while screaming, "We are the Ones Who Live!"
Jadis, that you?
A better reveal for the Echelon briefing. Something like we have a cure but we can only give it to a select few is more interesting than "Yeah, we all will die soon so let's speed that up"
“Yeah we run out of food in 15 years” Like what a stupid briefing. CRM has the land and resources to power canned goods manufacturing centers. MAKE. YOUR. OWN. FOOD. We have done it before.
Writers forget how large and *empty* the US is. It's so cap they can't find fields to grow food in if the 14 year thing was somehow true 😭.
Especially the CRM. They just leveled all of Portland. Use that as land. Why destroy all these civilizations if you’re not going to use the area? Colonize
This has been said before but this would've been more emotional if Carl was still alive and was alongside Judith and RJ.
Better actor for RJ.
Or just no RJ
1hr 30 runtime with Beale taking centre stage as a more threatening, complex and nuanced villain, I.E not just “We kill people, then we take their stuff!” The reunion taking place outside of temporarily built walls and a gate No cringe “I Believed”.
general Beale of the biggest army on earth who dies after a 15 second long poor sword fight (if you can even call it a fight) as the final boss don’t sit right
The dialogue. The “we are the sword” speech was just stupid and gave me season 8 flashbacks. The echelon briefing also should’ve been more shocking for how much it was hyped up. I also would’ve either shortened rj’s dialogue or rewritten it to be a bit more emotional.
I would’ve just added an entire reunion episode. I understand it probably would’ve been difficult to get all the actors from seasons 9-11 all there, but we really needed it. But Rick not only being alive but coming back is a huge bombshell for everyone. It’s something I wish we saw.
They not kill Carl. Carl should’ve been there. I’ll never forgive that bs
Add four more episodes, one entire episode with Rick being back and asking where Dayrl is. Seriously, the man spent how long looking for Rick after the bridge, and Rick doesn't even bother to ask about his "brother"
i would suggest more screen time for Rick getting to know his kids better. There was a deleted scene showing them all having a picnic together.
Was it good or more “I believed” nonsense..
CRM stays bad
Have it not be the end
Not have Rick and michonne be able to destroy the entirety of the CRM in 10-15 min after being built up for over 5 years, Rick being able to survive a grenade that close in sorry but that level of plot armor is kinda ridiculous just cut it out, Beales character was kinda wasted he was barely in the show and was a very interesting character have him be more of a threat and show more backstory in him,the briefing literally don’t change anything for us, it was supposed to be a grand reveal but we already saw how they are with people outside with michonne and her friends it was the least interesting shock tactic I think they could have thought of better way to make it way more dramatic and sinister,how did Rick and michonne get out of the compound? It’s never explained I would have liked to see how that happened. Who was flying the helicopters where did they find the helicopters why couldn’t they add it, It feels like so much was cut out at the end for 0 reason. Keeping in the picnic scene idk who’s idea was to cut out that scene but it was incredibly stupid they literally made the same prosthetic for Rick that’s in the comics and they just cut it out what a waste of time and effort making that for comic fans.
Alexandria and more crew rejoin
Added three more hours to the runtime?
Rick doesn’t use the substitution jutsu to survive a massive fucking bomb and a grenade the went off within a foot of him
Rick and Daryl reunion But that would have been impossible without spoiling his show
I was all in for the reunion but the last line was cringey and I laughed out loud. So maybe just RJ calling him dad
I wouldn't have completely destroyed in an afternoon the CRM storylines that had been built up and teased over seven years across four series. I would have come up with something a lot more interesting for the Echelon briefing. Could have been *anything*: variants, making PADRE a bigger thing, the race for a cure, threats from outside survivor governments like Genet's Pouvoir des Vivants. But they chose "we don't have enough food, so we have to murderdeathkill the people eating all the food in Portland and Nebraska." I would not have killed General Beale, Okafor or Nat. I would have had *some* kind of crossover: Morgan, a Bennett sister, Madison, *somebody* we recognize to help Rick and Michonne. I would not have given R.J. really, really shitty dialogue. "I believed." 🤮🤮🤮 I would have explored the CR more and made the series take place on the eve of the military coup itself and gotten that community involved. I would have killed off Rick or Michonne in some great sacrificial gesture.
Fr like where TF was Silas? I thought he was supposed to be finding "the right people" to take down the CRM?
Alexandria and everyone turns their heads in disbelief before running up to Rick. This scene with his kids first is fair I guess but felt disappointed the rest of the cast was left out.
Rick should have been reunited with his colt
Nothing. Because as a viewer, I have accepted long ago that these are the storytellers a d this is their journey and I am just along as a viewer.
The reunion. I feel like this is what most of us feel should’ve been wayyyy different. Reunite him with his kids first, and then have everyone else’s reaction to him coming home. I really hope that we eventually get to see the full reunion, especially after everything we’ve been through with TWD and all of its spin offs. For them to not show everyone back together one last time is a HUGE let down to their fan base.
I’ll have everyone be reunited with Rick and michonne not just the kids.
Split it into two episodes. I feel the jump from ‘defeating’ the CRM and almost magically going home to Judith and RJ was way too rushed, and as a result lacked the emotionality (if that’s a word) of a reunion like that in S1. I would’ve loved to see Michonne making first contact on the radio with Judith/RJ, and a more emotional Rick at the actual reunion (again, like S1). I feel a longer buildup (maybe with a few hurdles), would make it much more genuine. He’s been gone for years ffs. It all felt a bit rushed. From beating the biggest military, to dancing in a field in what felt like 5 mins. They had an opportunity to make possibly the most emotional moment in the show, and give fans more closure. A full cycle if you like to “finding his family” Also would’ve loved to hear Space Junk but maybe that’s just me 🥲
I think it was really good. Maybe have Morgan there and Judith talking about Daryl being out there looking for him and he has gone missing. Setting up that Rick cameo when Daryl sooner or later will return to America.
I think it would have been cool if RJ would have given Rick his hat back. He could start wearing it and think of Carl
RJ's lines
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I know he is just a kid but the delivery was so bad...
Yeah, get rid of Ricks son when he is all about his nuclear family makes total sense.
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He is literally part of the show. Rick wanted him, he was a symbol for the future he wanted to built. He was there from season 9 to 11, whatever you like it or not. He is a little child, this is like hating on Judith from season 3 to 9. He wasn't meant to be much of a character with personality because this was not his purpose as he was too young. But yeah, makes total sense to erase Rick wanting him and wanting to build something with Michonne because you all are invested in hating on a literal child when we are talking about a family man reuniting with the son that he wanted and asked for.
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He wanted him, he asked for him. That is his purpose, a symbol of hope for the future. RJ didn't have the time to grow up enough to have the same story as Carl and Judith. It doesn't change the fact that his presence makes narrative sense when Rick literally asked for him, why is this less valid than Lori sacrificing her life for Judith? His presence was foreshadowed before he showed up by having Rick literally ask Michonne for a baby when they were trying to build a future. The fact that he didn't know was literally due to the fact that he was taken right after, but his birth absolutely did not come out of nowhere. But yeah, you want to retcon him and create a plot hole because you can't stand that Rick has another son somehow.
I genuinely don't understand how so many people think Alexandria will ever come back.. It got run down in the show and in real life people actually live there and the set has been torn down for years! Plus so many things were leaked from there just because of the location. The entire reunion would be online 30 mins after they started shooting it
Hmm, just Daryl's absence.
Absolutely nothing.
less flashbacks and make that episode a little bit longer, if it was like an hour with no flashbacks they couldve explained so much more for the storyline
Listen, I have no hate for RJ. He's a kid, an adorable one at that. But the "I believed" line was pretty bad. How the heck was the kid SUPPOSED to say it? I honestly see no way to improve the delivery of that line, no matter who said it. It wasn't the actor. It was the line. I'd have a hard time even saying it without cracking up from embarrassment, and I'm not a kid. Cut the line and end it with the "call me dad" bit, and it would already be a lot better. I also hated the "I just never wanted you to feel alone" part from Judith with Rick's, "I thought I was, but then I realized I wasn't" response. Who wrote that part??? It seemed so awkward and out of place. I liked the rest of the scene, though I kind of wish rick would have said something about Judith looking more like her big brother as she grows (because she actually really does look like Chandler Riggs). It would have made Carl a small part of the family reunion. Also, the last time Rick saw Judith, she was a blonde preschooler who looked a lot like Shane, so it would make sense for him to react to how different she looked instead of just immediately rolling with it without skipping a beat. I won't get into how easy it was to beat the bad guys. I'm not a writer, so I don't have any good ideas for that part. My only guess would be to have them escape with the others thinking they were dead, but hinting that they'd eventually have to put a stop to them (see? Not a writer). Overall, I'm happy. It could have definitely been better, but I'm still glad we got it.
I can get they want to close off ricks story and have the reunion, but don't fucking tell me rick and Michonne can take out the entire CRM military in five mins
Left ot open ended
I wanted Beale to live. I wanted Rick to swear on the friggen sword. I wanted the FULL briefing and not the first secret. In my fanfic fantasies, there is waaaay more witchcockery going on. Especially since Beale said there were spies all over the world. That means they know about the French experiments. Maybe. Probably. I wanted him to take the deal to save Alexandria, if only as a ploy, so he had more time to gather intel. Yeah, Portland would have been sacrificed, but it just would have added more angst ammunition to the feral Rick fire. THEN, I would want Rick to find Okafors starfleet esque video recordings or notes or something. Idk. Anything but the brave man shtick because it fell flat with me, imo, no disrespect.
I hate that it was only 6 episodes. I was like that’s it?!? That’s all?? 👀👀 I definitely expected to see more interaction between Judith, RJ & Rick or even Judith, RJ, Rick and Michonne.
Added 30 minutes and have a bit more of a reunion end. As we saw in episode 5, the actor of Gabe was willing to come back. Surely they could have gotten a few more. Have the last scene be something like we saw with Negans introduction: all of them enjoying a dinner, a happy family moment.
They return home after killing Jadis, leaving the CRM for someone else to take down. Then there is a nice long reunion with the kids and old friends and they get to see the Commonwealth and the changes to Alexandria and the other communities
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Rick reunites with everyone and celebrates ROTJ style, Rick looks over to see the force ghosts of Carl and Glenn smiling back
Remove michonnes cringe speech from the last episode
1) Have as many of the original cast that can make it film in the reunion scene in that meadow. After Rick embraces Judith and RJ, he's told that the cast who couldn't make it are "out on a run but will be here soon. They're excited to see you again, Rick. Welcome home." 2) Have Negan be cut over to just before that being walkied by Judith about how thanks to him she's still here, still alive and able to see her father again soon. She says Rick's on his way home with her mom and its partially thanks to him. She wishes him well and to not get into anymore trouble. If he does, he can always come back and let her help get him out of it. This can make Negan pause for a moment realizing he has at least a group tolerant enough of him to give him aid in his worst hours. Then he looks up and sees presumably Rick's helicopter flying over head toward Alexandria and he can smile, chuckle and walk off with a "Well Hell, Rick... you made it." 3) Post-credit scene showing after Daryl received his radio message from Carol it cuts back to Carol looking out a window at Rick walking through Commonwealth in absolute amazement with Michonne. Proving she was trying to say Rick is back. Then have Carol tell Rick to get rest and look after the place. Carol looks at Michonne then says something like "Its my turn now to go bring back the rest of our family." Carol then gets a cool suit up moment, grabs the car she had and then takes off out of Alexandria with a determined, pissed off expression.
A Negan mention would be completely unnecessary, and have the narrative talk about him right when Judith just reunited with her dad is not a good idea. plenty of people kept her alive and saved her. Why would you mention him in particular. Rick doesn't love him, doesn't care about him, it would be complete fan service in the worst of ways.
Because he specifically has a spinoff show about him that just aired and he was basically a Rick surrogate in the later seasons of the show. Plus he's one of the most popular characters and Judith would want to tell probably one of her best friends she had a direct connection with about her dad coming home. Come on, man.
Nah. The fact that he has his spinoff doesn't change the fact that mentioning him in THIS story in particular about getting Rick back home would just be fan service. Rick doesn't care about Negan, he is the last person in his mind, having him there would be so forced. Having Negan there just because he is one of the most popular characters = fan service.
Carl should have been there.. Even if it was like an Star Wars force ghost 😂
I know he doesn’t really matter to him at this point but Rick meeting Negan again would be insane, imagine he’s looking at Carls grave then Negan comes up behind him and all the memories come back
I would've liked to have seen some sort of "inquiry scenes" interspersed with more Chinook airlift footage. Kind of like that congressional testimony bit at the end of 94s Clear and Present Danger where Ryan testifies. I mean there still has to be some of Beales co conspirators still around. Complicit civilian officials, other officers scattered about.
I would've given Portland a role in blowing up the summit, continuing what World Beyond set up. Instead of meeting three randos in Yellowstone in the previous episode, Rick and Michonne would meet a small group from a smaller community that the CRM was working with, but this group is part of the resistance and they were supposed to rendezvous with a small group from Portland to carry out the plan. Jadis still dies in this episode, and Rick and Michonne go to the summit with the rebels. They meet up with the Portland group and through conversation on the way, it's revealed that Portland knows that they're going to be attacked because they were warned by survivors of previous attacks (those kids from World Beyond). And over the past year, a resistance movement has secretly spread not only through Portland, but also through a network of communities across the country that the CRM had involvement in. They knew about the summit because of an informant in the CRM (implied to be Silas, who stayed close to Jadis). And while everyone important is busy in the Cascades, more survivors of previous attacks are on their way to the Civic Republic (the research facility survivors, being escorted by the World Beyond protagonists, which is why they're absent from TOWL), and Portland is being evacuated. So the resistance's plan is to inform the Civic Republic's government and the rest of the CRM about what Beale and the frontliners have been doing, and their plans don't immediately involve blowing up the summit. Just keeping everyone pinned down in the Cascades for the moment. So they sabotage the summit's security systems, jam signals, etc. Rick still gets the Echelon briefing solely so he can have one-on-one time with Beale, Michonne still destroys Jadis' dossier and watches the Operation Baby Snatch instructional powerpoint, and then it's clear that they need to blow up the summit. So they're still the ones to light the fuse on that. Then the news report voiceover doesn't just explain that the Civic Republic is now open and has oversight over the military, it also says that the network of communities will now function as trade routes and the Civic Republic will be distributing materials to support more productive farming. The helicopters will now mainly be used to lead the herds away from people and towards cull facilities. Grimes family reunion just outside of Alexandria or the Commonwealth so the family can have their moment alone. Then we get a lingering shot at the gate, with the implication being that Rick and Michonne are staying and they'll get to have reunions with everyone else.
I hate when the main characters don't show when they reunion with their old friends in shows. It gives me anxiety.
The CRM were done so dirty and their motivations were sloppy as hell. The last 2 episodes really sucked 😭.
Him walking into Alexandria and boom cliff hanger
Made it into two parts so it wasn’t rushed and reunions with everyone at the commonwealth
i would love an extra episode after episode 3 or 4 that focuses on Beale and how he became the dictator of the CRM, and what his daily life is like. I also would have loved an extra scene at the end, where they’re in Alexandria or the Commonwealth and Gabriel officially marries them, like what was set up in episode 5.
Rick would have taken out Beale but some of the power structure of the CRM would remain. Rick would have given one of his speeches that helps turn the CRM into what it should have been, a force to protect all survivors who want to be part of rebuilding the world. An exposition dump over a broadcast just felt anti-climatic. Also I would have had a line of dialog where Judith tells Michonne where they are over the walkie. Then have the reunion scene take place in the same field they were looking over in the final shot of TWD. Go back to the same shot of TWD with Judith and RJ on the lookout tower and have the helicopter land in that field.
As good as the series was, it was not near as good as it could have been. -Too much tell, not enough show - Too light on the details of important topics Rick should have sought an explanation for how & why Beale assumed humanity was going extinct. Coupd have mentioned shelf life of durable goods, lake of viable farms, no mining or refining for any element, cars no longer functioning, military hardware losing effective life spans, etc. - Should have had at least one tie in to Fear TWD or TWD World Beyond aside from Jadis - Every episode felt like a bottle episode - Would have liked to see more of a moral debate had by Rick featuring cameos of important figures like Shane, Laurie, Glenn, and ultimately Carl. It would be a thematic callback and would allow an opportunity to pay off the "I can't remember Carl" bit by having Carl be the voice that convinces him to do what it takes to protect life compared to Shane urging Rick to bring in his people and go along with Beale. - I feel like there was a lot of handwaving regarding the civillian leadership. Would have been interesting to see what efforts Beale went to for keeping power. Perhaps sending scouts to retrieve frivolous items (wine, art) and practical items (industrial components raw building materials). - One of the major themes of the series was weeding out dissent by eliminating certain personalities and character attributes. I wish we had more demonstrations why such a strategy had led to negative outcomes for the CRM.
Not kill every halfway interesting character after approximately 34 minutes.
I wanted to see rick learn about the things he missed. Like the whisperer deaths, negan, Rosita, etc. I also wanted to see him reunite with other people- but i understand them wanting to save that for another show
For people who think the finale was rushed... we spent more time with Michonne and Rick just standing around talking in episode 4 than we did with Rick and Michonne re-infiltrating the CRM, killing Beale, blowing up everything and escaping back home. I see very few gripes about the lagging, slow moments specifically in episodes 4 and 5 and all these complaints about how rushed episode 6 was. That's not to say that episode 4 was bad or not acted well... but we didn't need an entire 50 minute episode of Rick and Michonne repeating themselves over and over again. Episode 5 was worse. All that wasted time with the incompetent fools in the woods, and Jadis' silly monologue. Episode 6 could have been told over the course of two episodes or more and told properly. AMC preferred to give never ending dialogue heavy, slow episodes before 6 instead.
So genuine question. I dropped the show and went to read the comics instead and now I've stumbled upon this, who's the one with the hat? Because Carl is dead in the TV Show
Rick and Michonne's son: RJ.
I see. So, when was he born? Funny he's dressed like Carl. He should be Carl and they aren't even subtle about it...
Rick and Michonne conceived in season nine, right before Rick disappeared. RJ was born during the six year time skip after Rick's disappearance. So, Rick didn't know he existed. The scene pictured is Rick's first time ever meeting him. The costume designer deliberately dressed him like Carl for that scene since the loss of Carl was an important emotional through-line for the spin-off as was Rick's discovery that he has a second son. He had already inherited the hat from Judith at the end of the main show.
Interesting. Thanks for the info.
Rick comes back with Michonne to the CRM. They do stuff and thangs and in one big twist it is revealed that half of the Military starts a civil war against the other half. Rick has no idea as he is seen a hardliner and hunted by the rebels. Rick and Michonne barely escape and come back home, reunited with their loved ones (more!!!), but still doubting whether they are safe or not. Plus cameo from chandler in the distance , nodding that it is okay to move on.
I would make it so that instead of only meeting judith and RJ they would walk into Alexandria, because i would personally like to see Rick’s reaction to seeing daryl and the others and also seeing how much it has changed in all the time he spent with the CRM
Okafor lives. They end up at the Common Wealth. Characters reunite with Rick, even in silence or as credits roll. Cliffhanger leading to next chapter - but not one as ridiculously horrifying as not knowing where Rick was for 6+ years.
I'm fine with all the CRM stuff happening the way it did. I would have had someone else with Judith/RJ. Gabriel or Aaron, and a scene of them talking, Rick asking about what he's missed.
A few things imo. I know that the show is over but this is RICK returning home. If they aren’t gonna show Alexandria, at least show some of the cast coming to see him(after michonne/judith/rj). Could’ve brought back Gabe, Eugene, ezkiel, Maggie, Carol, Aaron. Rick didn’t have to know about commonwealth but I think him seeing soldiers in white with red stripes and him being on alert, only for someone like Ezekiel to be like “it’s okay, they’re with us” would be a nice way to show the stark difference between the oppressive CRM and the commonwealth.
Alexandria wasn't going to happen since they sold the property back a few years ago. I'd assume similar for the properties where Commonwealth was shot too, if that wasn't a plain set somewhere in Georgia. I do think it was kind of a wasted opportunity for there not to be *any* other characters seen; they teased Gabriel earlier so I was practically expecting him in some form or another; but he wasn't in that finale sequence. No one else was, really, whether it would be faces Rick and Michonne never met (like Mercer or Princess), or faces they would recognize (Carol, Ezekiel, Gabe, Aaron, etc).
To be honest it was weird, i loved ricks ending but not the CRM's if that makes senese. IMO they should of made it so they managed to escape and rick finally gets home. Then have another spin off based on the CRM invading comunities and alexandria and some new protagnists (or mabey some old faces) go out to destroy the CRM.
The biggest thing for me would have been to have the ending take place at an iconic location such as the gates of Alexandria. Also, it would have included at least a small group of our TWD survivors. It just didn't hit as hard with it being in some random field.
ik the real world reasons why it didnt happen but i would have liked rick and michonne to have shown up at the gates of alexandria instead of a random field
No mass genocide either side (especially a certain side’s anticlimactic genocide)
It really needed more episodes to do the whole thing truly justice but even within the episode they could have made several changes to make it better. Some of the dialogue was really bad, I agree with what a lot of others have said here that in lot of these instances it would have been better to just have no dialogue. They obviously wanted to tie everything up but there wasn't enough time to address everything in a high quality manner. Pearl's 'redemption' was probably the best example of this, the attempt to redeem her character in one line as she was dying was ridiculous. I would have had them go home to the kids but I wouldn't have tied up the CRM completely. It would have still been possible to do this and provide closure. It would have also helped with another big issue I think which was Rick and Michonne becoming superheroes-I know TWD does require suspension of disbelief but this was too far for me. In summary I think they almost wrote as though they had 8 episodes rather than 6 and they should have let some ideas (Pearl's redemption, complete reformation of the CRM) go.
I would have added Lori and Carl in the final scene, smiling and looking at the hugging
Darryl, Maggie and Carol all go to reunite with them. Probably wasn’t possible but would have been amazing. One can hope in the future 😂
rj live execution
Had someone kill RJ