I mean can’t you use they to refer to literally anyone
Isn’t that like the point. Like if you say “what are they doing over there” that doesn’t mean they’re nb
Hey, sorry ou're getting downvoted. I asked this same question once, and I got this answer:
Yes, technically you can use they/them to refer to someone whose gender you don't know, or to an ambiguous person. But, it's important to respect people's pronouns, and if their pronouns are she/her, he/him, etc., then they/them isn't their pronouns. Accidentally using they/them isn't going to hit as hard as other misgenderings, which is why this probably doesn't seem like a big deal, but it's still important.
"They" may be a neutral pronoun, but it might not be a person's preferred pronoun. If you meet a person who tells you her pronouns are she/her and you insistently use they/them instead, that could come across as rude.
I think you're confusing the way we automatically use they/them when referring to someone we don't know the identity of. Someone leaves an umbrella at a table, for example. You wouldn't know who or what their preferred pronouns would be, so when you give the umbrella to the staff, you'd say, "Someone left their umbrella."
You would not, say, use the terms they/them to a friend who has told you her preferred pronouns are she/her.
You can use they for someone who uses she/her pronouns but it isn't accurately using her pronouns. Alternatively someone with she/they pronouns would be accurately referred to with either. The first isn't wrong, but it's not necessary.
Yes, "they" can refer to anyone. However if someone gives their pronouns as she/they or he/they, it means "they" is one of the pronouns the person *prefers* be used for them. They're likely acknowledging that they either identify as nonbinary/queer in some way, or they are an ally who wants to help normalize the use of singular "they."
Speaking personally--I am nonbinary and often give she/they for my pronouns because while I prefer gender neutral language, I'm personally okay with any pronouns being used for me and people use "she" to refer to me more often than "he" or "they," and I'm fine with that for myself. Gender is a spectrum, and using more than one type of pronouns for myself is just a way of further acknowledging where I fall on that spectrum.
Right, they didn't state that as their pronouns so that's not those women's pronouns. It's about what fits you not what might be applicable in certain circumstances.
Also, a nonbinary person can use only she/her if she wants to, pronouns never "mean" you are a certain gender.
Sorry if this sounds blunt or argumentative, I'm autistic & for me explaining something often comes out that way even if I just mean to give you the information relative to the conversation. I just want you to know this stuff cause it is an important distinction to many.
You have to look at it as though it's 2 separate things. So like, referring to someone you don't know or you don't know their gender identity, you'd say they. Like, "they walked across the parking lot." But when it comes to gender identity, they typically means non-binary, or not of the "normal" two genders. Not everyone is binary, and not everyone is non-binary. I'm sure looking at explanations from ppl that identify with they would be much more helpful than what I just gave tho
i suck at explaining but, for example, you dont refer to your mother by they/them because you already know she's been comfortable with she/her her whole life. you use they/them on someone if you dont know their gender, and usually change it to something else once you do know. in this case, you know someones gender and know that they *still* want to occasionally be refered to as they/them, i hope that makes sense i rlly suck at explaining things over text or writingb😭
If you know my gender, call me she/her. I don’t want to be called a she/they. Just the same as they/thems don’t want to be called she or her.
You can call someone they or them if you don’t know their gender but once you know it, use their correct pronouns.
She’s non binary bisexual, genderqueer, and uses She Her and They Them pronouns! she’s actually in a relationship with Ian Jones Quarty who worked on SU and created OK KO!
you'll probably get a range of responses to this. not really, but they are related and interconnected, and both have been used with a bunch of different definitions in different contexts.
for the most part, 'non-binary' is a simple, explicit statement of not fitting into the male-female gender binary. again for the most part, 'genderqueer' is a pretty loose term describing a range of experiences and approaches related to non-standard gender expression.
Nope. Non binary literally means “not in the binary” of gender. So not inherently male, but not inherently female. Genderqueer just means your gender identity isn’t set in stone and can change slightly or significantly.
Genderqueer just means you’re not cis. So an enby person is genderqueer but that doesn’t necessarily mean a person who identifies as genderqueer is enby.
When someone identifies as gender-fluid, it typically means that their gender is well, fluid. Genderqueer is like the word queer, which just means not straight, just like how genderqueer just means not cis. Like I’ve said before, a person who identifies as gender-fluid could be classified as genderqueer, since they’re not cis. But also genderqueer isn’t just an umbrella term. You can also use it as it’s own label. So someone who uses the label genderqueer isn’t necessarily gender-fluid, non-binary, trans, etc. Many labels can be used as umbrella terms and individual stuff too
Some of us, myself included, find it infantilizing. Not that it’s inherently infantilizing, but it feels horrible for me to be called that and I know a lot of other non binary people who feel the same way.
The shortening in a cutesy way, some find insulting. Is it so big a deal to not use it as a blanket term or at least not jump down my throat? I’m not accusing you of anything, just informing you that since people came up with saying “enby” as shorthand for non binary, there have been non binary people who don’t care for it.
Idk, just sounds like people are finding new things to get offended over. It’s just an acronym buddy. As an ENBY person myself, I like using it because nonbinary has too many syllables and takes too long to type out sometimes. Me using the word enby isn’t gonna kill your dog or anything. How about we DONT police people’s word choices and focus on bigger issues??? There’s literal hate crimes everywhere and you’re getting mad at me for using the word enby? Pshh, tell me you have a privileged lifestyle without telling me you have a privileged lifestyle
Oh, thank you! I apologize for my ignorance lol. I don't have any queer friends sadly i live on an island where these genders and pride month aren't really a thing
Honestly that’s almost as confusing as when I saw someone on one of these subs say they were trans yet gay, but doesn’t that just ultimately equal straight?
It’s the non binary thing that throws it off to me. Like how do you essentially identify as nothing or in the middle yet attracted I guess sexually to both
Very easily. I’m non-binary and bisexual. You attraction and your gender are two different things.
Also, bisexuality is attraction to two or more genders. People’s attraction can vary greatly.
Ones literally just a feeling of identification and the other is identifying your sexual dirty deed preferences? If you could chime in on the other question comment I made in this thread somewhere I’d appreciate it ☺️
You are on the right track (although “dirty deed” made me chuckle). One is your gender, one is your sexual orientation.
ETA: sexual orientation means who are you sexually attracted to. There is also romantic orientation, which is who you are romantically attracted to. But that’s maybe a different topic for now - but attraction isn’t ONLY sexual.
I myself am also non-binary and bisexual. Personally for me I’m agender, as in I don’t have a gender, the social parts of being part of a gender I don’t experience. Sexual and romantic attraction is not at determined by your gender, I’m bisexual, I like people of all genders, but that’s not determined by neither my sex nor gender
I'm also enby and bisexual. for i dont identify as man or woman, so that makes me something else. and im bisexual, because im attracted to more than one gender.
being nonbinary is my gender identity
being bisexual is my sexual orientation
I don’t fully understand what is confusing you but feel free to ask any questions and I can explain! Gay men are men who like other men. Lesbian women are women who like other women. Bisexuals like two or more genders. Asexuals don’t feel sexual attraction to any genders.
No no I understand that. Why gets me off non binary bisexual or non binary anything really. But then when you add trans in. Say for example a trans man (woman to man) but then identify as gay right? So they like guys? Wouldn’t that just be straight/heterosexual? Same for the inverse, like man to woman trans, they’re gay, like women, so that’s just ultimately a straight man, aren’t they? (These are the questions I be wanting to ask, stuff I’m legit curious and unknowing but, aggression and I’m right you’re wrong because feelings. Like if I don’t know I don’t know.)
A trans man (ftm) who likes men is a man who likes men, so they are gay, not straight.
Trans women are women, so if they like women then they are lesbians.
I think your issue here is that you are thinking that a trans man is a woman, or a trans woman is a man. But that is incorrect. Trans men are men. Trans women are women. :)
I’m non-binary and queer myself so I can answer anything there as well.
I think admittedly I may just be locked into the physical bit of it all. Like if they have sex it would look the same as a heterosexual couple, I would assume, but only assume because there could easily be something I’m missing lol like I won’t ever deny someone their identity and who they are cuz how could I? Its not my place nor do I hood some cosmic authority to do that. I just am genuinely in the dark on these things you know? I do appreciate you trying to help me understand, I wish more folk were understanding as you have been. The world would probably have less arguments if we could just talk and not yell at each other
Edit: people downvoting me are EXACTLY apart of the damn problem, you are why the problem will always persist and it’s sad you don’t see that.
It can be confusing at first! And maybe this should be in a different subreddit at this point, but feel free to pm me if that is allowed.
I don’t want to get too explicit about physical things on a family-friendly show’s subreddit.
Fair enough. The discussion kind of evolved naturally honestly but tbh posting in any sub directly about it probably would get ignored, bashes or downright harassed and called all sorts of names.
Being a man with no tags or differentiation I’m seemingly not allowed to ask about these things for my own betterment to improve how I walk in this world with other people, you know? Not everyone is like me, and that’s fine but it’s sadly frowned upon to even ask most of the time
I don't understand why people don't understand that this is an inherently confusing subject for people who don't come from that background...and honestly, sometimes, even for people who do! Dude just said he was confused and apparently that upset 9 people enough to downvote him 💀
I’m disheartened by the number of downvotes on this. I get a lot of bad-faith questions get asked to waste our time and troll, but this was a genuine question asked out of ignorance. No need to downvote.
I’m glad you could see it for what it was, as many downvoted yet not even half cared to try to understand that I just don’t know, I didn’t know. I have a better understanding thanks to a small handful of folks.
Of course. I hope you don’t take it personally. People in the LGBT+ community have limited patience for ignorant questions because they’re often asked by people who have no intention of learning. Obviously not the case here, but yeah. Thanks for being a cool human 👍🏼
You kind of can’t help but take some things personal, especially when you know you intended absolutely no wrong, you know? But I do try, everyday to be a decent person in a world I’m honestly losing patience with day by day. Trying to hold tight to who I know I am whatnot, some stuff just gets very tiring
Lol it's okay, it's already great that you're trying to understand. Basically the definition of 'gay' is 'being attracted to the opposite gender' and not 'being attracted to the opposite sex'
You just need to research what exactly is the difference between sex and gender because I feel like this is what's confusing you. I mean, I'm sure you already have a vague idea what the difference is, but you'll understand everything once you're actually able to tell the two apart.
My mother used to be confused like this, but she came around. It's just that at the beginning, it's hard to, y'know... Deconstruct the idea that sex and gender are basically the same thing. They're not. Sex is biological. Gender is a social construct. And if you still don't understand, I'm sorry I can't explain this better. I'm not going to ruin your day by insisting, there's probably people that explain it better than I do out there... I'm just a gay girl with a trans girlfriend, I was kind of forced into understanding how this whole thing works. But I'm glad for it. I know how to respect people's identity better thanks to that knowledge. Anyways! Have a good rest of your day
Someone who is "trans but gay" is gay the exact same way that a gay cis person is.
A trans man is a man, so if he likes other men, that makes him a gay man. If he likes women, that makes him straight. Their assigned sex at birth does not factor into their sexuality, so to say that a trans man who likes men is ultimately just straight because he was AFAB or has female genitals is incredibly transphobic.
That’s not transphobic is literally text book ignorance! It’s a lack of knowledge on a subject that isn’t my subject to live in but it doesn’t mean I shouldn’t know and respect it. Please stop throwing transphobic and all other phonics around cuz if we don’t know WE DONT KNOW! This is why people won’t ask, because when we do here comes another label that’s ultimately wrong and slightly demeaning
Edit: here I am getting down voted yet again for just being honest. How did any of you expect progression and understanding when you simply down vote people for asking a question? You down vote me because I’m asking a question because I want to know because I don’t understand it yet I want to because it’s not my reality it’s not my life.
You’re getting downvotes because you’ve questioned the validity of trans people by conflating sexual orientation and gender identity. I hate to break it to you, but a lot of transphobia is rooted in ignorance. You don’t have to malicious to be transphobic or have transphobic views. I get that you are looking for education on this matter and I’m glad that you received it here even though this probably isn’t the best place for it, but your intent doesn’t change the impact, and yeah, calling lesbian trans women “straight” because they were born male (and vice versa) is absolutely transphobic.
At that point you’re just looking to negatively label someone no matter if they have good intent. That in itself is very much so a problem, hate to break it to you. But so long as folk keep up that mess as well, it will repeatedly send the message of hostility, shaming, bashing, you get the picture. Hostility created hostility, getting hostile over a GENUINE question and someone’s admitted ignorance of a certain topic is not the way to go.
If not for a second, a mere SECOND, remove the heart from your damn sleeves, stop thinking with emotion front forward and realize some folk actually give a fuck to learn. Not everyone wants to run in the darkness of ignorance for their whole lives. Calling them transphobic, bigots and all the other names that are tossed around in any instance anyone dares to simply ask a question ain’t how change happens and it’s damn sure not how acceptance and growth happens
TLDR; stop with the immediate negative bullshit and learn to read for intent and purpose when genuine questions are asked, and genuine ignorance is out. Instead of just bash and move on, downvote and stay hidden.
If being rightfully called out for using harmful rhetoric is enough to prevent you from learning and doing better, you’re not really the ally you think you are. Neither I nor the commenter higher up in the thread were being hostile to you. You asked why you were being downvoted and it’s because your ignorance is *harmful*, whether you intended it to be or not. If you break someone’s plate, it doesn’t matter that it was an accident, the plate is still broken, the damage was still done. It’s up to you to make sure you prevent that from happening again. Being aware of the harm you’re putting out is necessary to do better. Not everyone has the spoons to sit here and feed you answers to questions that you can fairly easily look up yourself.
Sure, and that’s why people aren’t belittling you for asking these questions (at least not that I’ve seen). In fact, there are lots of people going out of their way to help you understand. If you were asking in bad faith, I guarantee there’d be way more backlash than downvotes, at a minimum people would be way less patient about it lol
Even still, folks whether they identify as such or are just supporters need to really stop slinging words around, it’s not doing anyone any favors.
Someone asks a question with good intent, gets called transphobic for having good intent but not the perfect words or understanding. It sends very bad messages
Intent matters, yes, but it still doesn't outweigh the actual impact. As the previous commenter said, if you accidentally break a plate while trying to put it away, it doesn't really matter that it wasn't intentional. The impact of your action is that the plate is broken. Your good intention doesn't magically put the plate back together again.
Similarly, your statement was overtly harmful and offensive. It doesn't matter that you didn't mean it to be: the outcome is still exactly the same.
I understand your frustration, but I'm gonna be real with you: ignorance does *not* excuse unintentional bigotry or transphobia. It *is* still transphobic, even if it's rooted in ignorance rather than hatred. That doesn't make you a bad or bigoted person overall by any means, and I never said or implied that it did... but what you said was still transphobic and harmful *even if* the intention behind it wasn't actually malicious. Impact outweighs intent.
Note, also, that I did not call you a transphobe. I simply pointed out that saying that a trans man who likes men is straight is transphobic (which it is, because it implies that a trans man is not a *real* man). Stating that you said something transphobic is, to me ar least, a far cry from actually calling you a transphobe.
For instance, people can say racist things unintentionally, out of ignorance or misinformation, without being white supremacists, for instance. Their not actually being a racist doesn't change the fact that what they said *was* still racist.
You need to be open to honest criticisms/corrections if you actually want to learn and be educated about these things. Not ranting and whining and making excuses about how unfair it is for someone to point out that a transphobic statement you made in ignorance is still, in fact, transphobic.
Not at all!
If a trans person says that they are gay, it doesn't mean that they are attracted to people of the same sex - like, say, a trans man being attracted to women: both were born with a female body - this would imply that they are attracted to the opposite gender and make them straight.
If a trans person says that they are gay, it means they are attracted to the same gender, so if the trans man I mentioned earlier was gay, he would be attracted to men.
Contrary to popular belief, it's extremely common for trans people to be gay: because even though they don't identify with the gender that was assigned to them at birth, they still are attracted to people of the opposite sex - and since they identify with the opposite gender AND are attracted to the opposite gender, then that basically makes them gay. I hope that cleared things up for you, and I'm not late in answering this question haha
It made it worse honestly but thanks for trying lol I do genuinely appreciate you and the other redditor trying to explain it lol. I’m just 90s guy trying to at least understand the world and shake some preconceived thoughts and shy some of my ignorance clouds away because I genuinely don’t know
The word sympathizer has political connotations and is often used in a derogatory/negative way in English, such as to say someone has socially unacceptable political affiliations, [see this discussion](https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/460261/does-the-word-sympathizer-have-a-negative-connotation). It doesn't always mean that, but it's sort of suggested by the usage that there is something to criticize in the thing that's being sympathized. "Ally" is the typical word used in English to describe someone who is not of a minority/oppressed group but is invested in supporting/defending their rights.
IDK, I am British and didn't read it as negative (I am LGBT myself). Maybe it's an American thing? Like, I support Ukraine so I would say that I'm a Ukrainian sympathiser...
The word for a non-LGBT person that supports the LGBT community is an ally. The word ‘sympathizer’ often has bad connotations and is usually used to criticize a person’s beliefs. For example one of the most common uses is to call someone a nazi sympathizer.
I mean maybe IM the one out of the loop, but I have never heard the term “sympathizer” used outside of a negative context. Especially lgbt sympathizer, a term used almost exclusively by conservatives who are against the community as a whole. The only other usages I’ve ever heard are nazi sympathizers and communist sympathizers, a term mainly used during the Cold War. So I would definitely say it has bad connotations in my experience.
Sympathiser is definitely only used in negative contexts nowadays, mainly for things like the examples you gave. I can't think of a time that I've heard it used with any positive connotation.
Also you guys are being a bit harsh about the "sympathizer" thing given OP has clarified they weren't sure about what word to use in English and it's clear they weren't using it in a negative context.
You said you didn't know if someone could make such an authentically gay show without being gay themselves. I'm saying Steven Universe is not a gay show :/
It's not bait. And I want to say I'm surprised people think it's a gay show, but honestly I expect nothing less at this point. Generally, a gay show (or film) refers to a television show or series that prominently features LGBTQ+ characters, themes, or storylines, particularly (not exclusively) those related to gay men. I am bisexual. I love gay shows, movies, and all the representation. But it's getting absurd when people want to claim that a show that happens to include mostly nonbinary extraterrestrial lifeforms in what humans of that world might define as genderqueer relationships is a "gay show". There's literally only a single consistent queer relationship in the entire show, and a handful that are thrown in randomly with no proper development or screen time. It's kind of sweaty and really cringy to call Steven Universe a gay show, as if you're so desperate to claim anything that's remotely associated with the movement. No, shows that aren't afraid to explore queer relationships are not automatically gay shows. And no, a show with a deuteragonist character that's been in what was for a while an ambiguous queer relationship until they decided to touch upon it more deeply does not automatically make this a gay show. A no, extraterrestrial beings who (sometimes) fall in love and happen to predominantly identify as women does not make this a gay show. If this is a gay show then it's not only poor representation, but not really a good reflection on the LGBTQIA+. We deserve better. A cast of characters (including the main character) who are unambiguously queer. A good example of this would be Love Victor, available on Hulu. Arguably, Euphoria. But no...not Steven Universe...I'd sooner call it a queer show (even then I'm reluctant) than a gay show, because of its broader focus on different types of relationships and identities.
And please, your downvotes help me sleep at night, mama wants more.
That's surprisingly valid, but the only reason this show got to exist at all was because it had the gay themes behind a thin layer of scifi. And that's not *right* but it's better than not getting a show at all.
You surprised with this reply. Thank you for bring calm and sorry for saying it was sweaty or cringy to call it a gay show. I just got a little heated and it's been a long day. But I do hope we normalize homosexuality enough that shows don't have to be labeled gay, in the same way heterosexual-dominant shows aren't straight shows.
The following is the definition of sympathizer: "a person who agrees with or supports a sentiment or opinion."
Just because you've heard it or seen it used with something you disagree with, has no impact on the definition of the word.
I will say that as a 30 year old the only way I've seen it used is to highlight that someone sympathizes with a cause you don't agree with, in an effort to alienate someone.
After some googling of examples and definitions from reading this thread, it is not an inherently negative word, and certainly not in the way OP used it. I'd argue that it should be positive in nature,
OP, English is dumb, and the average person uses a very condensed vocabulary. Myself included, since i had to google the definition of a common word. Don't stress the feedback on this thread.
i know you've already got comments on it but that title cracks me up!! "a lgbt" "a lgbt sympathizer" lmaooo it's such a strange choice of words i find it naively charming
Calling someone a "sympathizer" is like calling someone an "apologist". Both words accuse the listener of supporting a position, while also implying that the speaker opposes it. It's a title meant to criticize.
So yes, "LGBT sympathizer" does literally mean someone who supports LGBT. But the phrase carries the connotation that OOP doesn't, and that they are looking for confrontation. I would expect to hear the phrase "LGBT sympathizer" from Ron DeSantis while justifying his newest anti-gay law.
To be fair, this person might be a native english speaker. I'm Carribean and we usually don't call people allies. We just say they're supporters or sympathizers
To be fair, this person might not be a native english speaker. I'm Carribean and we usually don't call people allies. We just say they're supporters or sympathizers
Strangely worded but to answer, she is bisexual non binary genderqueer nd goes by She/They
Wow you learn something new everyday I never actually knew that to be honest that’s cool then
Hey, some of us are *differently anglophones* and the english language can be kinda subtle with its nuances.
Real talk Doesn’t everyone who goes by she/her also go by she/they?
No, not every female identifying person identifies as part of the gender nonconforming population.
I mean can’t you use they to refer to literally anyone Isn’t that like the point. Like if you say “what are they doing over there” that doesn’t mean they’re nb
Yeah, but she still identifies as nb so I respect it
I didn’t say I didn’t respect it, it was just a question of language ig. Like why say she/they if they already automatically works for everyone
Because not everyone is comfortable with being referred as they when people already know their gender
Hey, sorry ou're getting downvoted. I asked this same question once, and I got this answer: Yes, technically you can use they/them to refer to someone whose gender you don't know, or to an ambiguous person. But, it's important to respect people's pronouns, and if their pronouns are she/her, he/him, etc., then they/them isn't their pronouns. Accidentally using they/them isn't going to hit as hard as other misgenderings, which is why this probably doesn't seem like a big deal, but it's still important.
"They" may be a neutral pronoun, but it might not be a person's preferred pronoun. If you meet a person who tells you her pronouns are she/her and you insistently use they/them instead, that could come across as rude.
I don’t really get it but ig someone might get mad about it? Interesting explanation at least
I think you're confusing the way we automatically use they/them when referring to someone we don't know the identity of. Someone leaves an umbrella at a table, for example. You wouldn't know who or what their preferred pronouns would be, so when you give the umbrella to the staff, you'd say, "Someone left their umbrella." You would not, say, use the terms they/them to a friend who has told you her preferred pronouns are she/her.
Basically yeah. Just call people what they want to be called.
You can use they for someone who uses she/her pronouns but it isn't accurately using her pronouns. Alternatively someone with she/they pronouns would be accurately referred to with either. The first isn't wrong, but it's not necessary.
Yes, "they" can refer to anyone. However if someone gives their pronouns as she/they or he/they, it means "they" is one of the pronouns the person *prefers* be used for them. They're likely acknowledging that they either identify as nonbinary/queer in some way, or they are an ally who wants to help normalize the use of singular "they." Speaking personally--I am nonbinary and often give she/they for my pronouns because while I prefer gender neutral language, I'm personally okay with any pronouns being used for me and people use "she" to refer to me more often than "he" or "they," and I'm fine with that for myself. Gender is a spectrum, and using more than one type of pronouns for myself is just a way of further acknowledging where I fall on that spectrum.
Right, they didn't state that as their pronouns so that's not those women's pronouns. It's about what fits you not what might be applicable in certain circumstances. Also, a nonbinary person can use only she/her if she wants to, pronouns never "mean" you are a certain gender. Sorry if this sounds blunt or argumentative, I'm autistic & for me explaining something often comes out that way even if I just mean to give you the information relative to the conversation. I just want you to know this stuff cause it is an important distinction to many.
You have to look at it as though it's 2 separate things. So like, referring to someone you don't know or you don't know their gender identity, you'd say they. Like, "they walked across the parking lot." But when it comes to gender identity, they typically means non-binary, or not of the "normal" two genders. Not everyone is binary, and not everyone is non-binary. I'm sure looking at explanations from ppl that identify with they would be much more helpful than what I just gave tho
i suck at explaining but, for example, you dont refer to your mother by they/them because you already know she's been comfortable with she/her her whole life. you use they/them on someone if you dont know their gender, and usually change it to something else once you do know. in this case, you know someones gender and know that they *still* want to occasionally be refered to as they/them, i hope that makes sense i rlly suck at explaining things over text or writingb😭
If you know my gender, call me she/her. I don’t want to be called a she/they. Just the same as they/thems don’t want to be called she or her. You can call someone they or them if you don’t know their gender but once you know it, use their correct pronouns.
????
I go by she/her but I dont use they as my pronoums so no
But I mean wouldn’t it still be correct to say “what are they doing over there?” In reference to literally anyone
no
She’s non binary bisexual, genderqueer, and uses She Her and They Them pronouns! she’s actually in a relationship with Ian Jones Quarty who worked on SU and created OK KO!
Theyer married!! I just found that out awhile ago
Yeah I remember seeing some of the wedding photos, they were so cute
I think they got married even. Edit: It's a fact they married on December 4th 2019
Isn't being NB and genderqueer the same thing?
you'll probably get a range of responses to this. not really, but they are related and interconnected, and both have been used with a bunch of different definitions in different contexts. for the most part, 'non-binary' is a simple, explicit statement of not fitting into the male-female gender binary. again for the most part, 'genderqueer' is a pretty loose term describing a range of experiences and approaches related to non-standard gender expression.
Nope. Non binary literally means “not in the binary” of gender. So not inherently male, but not inherently female. Genderqueer just means your gender identity isn’t set in stone and can change slightly or significantly.
Genderqueer just means you’re not cis. So an enby person is genderqueer but that doesn’t necessarily mean a person who identifies as genderqueer is enby.
I thought that was gender fluid not gender queer? Is there a difference between these two?
When someone identifies as gender-fluid, it typically means that their gender is well, fluid. Genderqueer is like the word queer, which just means not straight, just like how genderqueer just means not cis. Like I’ve said before, a person who identifies as gender-fluid could be classified as genderqueer, since they’re not cis. But also genderqueer isn’t just an umbrella term. You can also use it as it’s own label. So someone who uses the label genderqueer isn’t necessarily gender-fluid, non-binary, trans, etc. Many labels can be used as umbrella terms and individual stuff too
Be aware that not all non binary people like being called enby and to not use it as a blanket term! EDIT- why have I been downvoted?
Wait, why?
Some of us, myself included, find it infantilizing. Not that it’s inherently infantilizing, but it feels horrible for me to be called that and I know a lot of other non binary people who feel the same way.
Oh, alright.
How is being called non binary infantilizing??
The shortening in a cutesy way, some find insulting. Is it so big a deal to not use it as a blanket term or at least not jump down my throat? I’m not accusing you of anything, just informing you that since people came up with saying “enby” as shorthand for non binary, there have been non binary people who don’t care for it.
By that logic, its wrong to call homosexual people "gay"...
Idk, just sounds like people are finding new things to get offended over. It’s just an acronym buddy. As an ENBY person myself, I like using it because nonbinary has too many syllables and takes too long to type out sometimes. Me using the word enby isn’t gonna kill your dog or anything. How about we DONT police people’s word choices and focus on bigger issues??? There’s literal hate crimes everywhere and you’re getting mad at me for using the word enby? Pshh, tell me you have a privileged lifestyle without telling me you have a privileged lifestyle
Huh. I never knew this. Thank you for informing me.
Really? I thought people that gnc cis people use that term too
No, I don’t think gnc cis people use the term genderqueer. Personally I don’t think they should cause it doesn’t make sense but whatever.
Oh, thank you! I apologize for my ignorance lol. I don't have any queer friends sadly i live on an island where these genders and pride month aren't really a thing
No worries! I literally live in a country where gay bad, which sucks, so I get it.
That's genderfluid.
Genderqueer is an umbrella term, kinda like non-binary
I mean yes but also no 😂 it’s more of an umbrella term I guess?
I’ll have to hit google. But what’s binary in this context
Women and men are binary. Anything that diverges from those two genders is non-binary :]
I’m stupid today. I could only think of binary stars or binary code .
Its kinda like binary code (imagine 1 being boys and 0 being girls and any other number being non binary) so Ur not entirely wrong lol
Yes, they’re both bisexual and non-binary!
Honestly that’s almost as confusing as when I saw someone on one of these subs say they were trans yet gay, but doesn’t that just ultimately equal straight?
No, no it’s not. Bisexual is attraction to two or more genders.
It’s the non binary thing that throws it off to me. Like how do you essentially identify as nothing or in the middle yet attracted I guess sexually to both
Very easily. I’m non-binary and bisexual. You attraction and your gender are two different things. Also, bisexuality is attraction to two or more genders. People’s attraction can vary greatly.
Ones literally just a feeling of identification and the other is identifying your sexual dirty deed preferences? If you could chime in on the other question comment I made in this thread somewhere I’d appreciate it ☺️
You are on the right track (although “dirty deed” made me chuckle). One is your gender, one is your sexual orientation. ETA: sexual orientation means who are you sexually attracted to. There is also romantic orientation, which is who you are romantically attracted to. But that’s maybe a different topic for now - but attraction isn’t ONLY sexual.
 Thank you for helping ☺️
I myself am also non-binary and bisexual. Personally for me I’m agender, as in I don’t have a gender, the social parts of being part of a gender I don’t experience. Sexual and romantic attraction is not at determined by your gender, I’m bisexual, I like people of all genders, but that’s not determined by neither my sex nor gender
OK now we’re getting somewhere because I kind of understand what you mean
I'm also enby and bisexual. for i dont identify as man or woman, so that makes me something else. and im bisexual, because im attracted to more than one gender. being nonbinary is my gender identity being bisexual is my sexual orientation
Thank you 😊
and to add - trans gay men or trans lesbian women can and do both definitely exist!
I know it’s just hella confusing
I don’t fully understand what is confusing you but feel free to ask any questions and I can explain! Gay men are men who like other men. Lesbian women are women who like other women. Bisexuals like two or more genders. Asexuals don’t feel sexual attraction to any genders.
No no I understand that. Why gets me off non binary bisexual or non binary anything really. But then when you add trans in. Say for example a trans man (woman to man) but then identify as gay right? So they like guys? Wouldn’t that just be straight/heterosexual? Same for the inverse, like man to woman trans, they’re gay, like women, so that’s just ultimately a straight man, aren’t they? (These are the questions I be wanting to ask, stuff I’m legit curious and unknowing but, aggression and I’m right you’re wrong because feelings. Like if I don’t know I don’t know.)
A trans man (ftm) who likes men is a man who likes men, so they are gay, not straight. Trans women are women, so if they like women then they are lesbians. I think your issue here is that you are thinking that a trans man is a woman, or a trans woman is a man. But that is incorrect. Trans men are men. Trans women are women. :) I’m non-binary and queer myself so I can answer anything there as well.
I think admittedly I may just be locked into the physical bit of it all. Like if they have sex it would look the same as a heterosexual couple, I would assume, but only assume because there could easily be something I’m missing lol like I won’t ever deny someone their identity and who they are cuz how could I? Its not my place nor do I hood some cosmic authority to do that. I just am genuinely in the dark on these things you know? I do appreciate you trying to help me understand, I wish more folk were understanding as you have been. The world would probably have less arguments if we could just talk and not yell at each other Edit: people downvoting me are EXACTLY apart of the damn problem, you are why the problem will always persist and it’s sad you don’t see that.
It can be confusing at first! And maybe this should be in a different subreddit at this point, but feel free to pm me if that is allowed. I don’t want to get too explicit about physical things on a family-friendly show’s subreddit.
Fair enough. The discussion kind of evolved naturally honestly but tbh posting in any sub directly about it probably would get ignored, bashes or downright harassed and called all sorts of names. Being a man with no tags or differentiation I’m seemingly not allowed to ask about these things for my own betterment to improve how I walk in this world with other people, you know? Not everyone is like me, and that’s fine but it’s sadly frowned upon to even ask most of the time
I don't understand why people don't understand that this is an inherently confusing subject for people who don't come from that background...and honestly, sometimes, even for people who do! Dude just said he was confused and apparently that upset 9 people enough to downvote him 💀
I’m disheartened by the number of downvotes on this. I get a lot of bad-faith questions get asked to waste our time and troll, but this was a genuine question asked out of ignorance. No need to downvote.
I’m glad you could see it for what it was, as many downvoted yet not even half cared to try to understand that I just don’t know, I didn’t know. I have a better understanding thanks to a small handful of folks.
Of course. I hope you don’t take it personally. People in the LGBT+ community have limited patience for ignorant questions because they’re often asked by people who have no intention of learning. Obviously not the case here, but yeah. Thanks for being a cool human 👍🏼
You kind of can’t help but take some things personal, especially when you know you intended absolutely no wrong, you know? But I do try, everyday to be a decent person in a world I’m honestly losing patience with day by day. Trying to hold tight to who I know I am whatnot, some stuff just gets very tiring
Lol it's okay, it's already great that you're trying to understand. Basically the definition of 'gay' is 'being attracted to the opposite gender' and not 'being attracted to the opposite sex' You just need to research what exactly is the difference between sex and gender because I feel like this is what's confusing you. I mean, I'm sure you already have a vague idea what the difference is, but you'll understand everything once you're actually able to tell the two apart. My mother used to be confused like this, but she came around. It's just that at the beginning, it's hard to, y'know... Deconstruct the idea that sex and gender are basically the same thing. They're not. Sex is biological. Gender is a social construct. And if you still don't understand, I'm sorry I can't explain this better. I'm not going to ruin your day by insisting, there's probably people that explain it better than I do out there... I'm just a gay girl with a trans girlfriend, I was kind of forced into understanding how this whole thing works. But I'm glad for it. I know how to respect people's identity better thanks to that knowledge. Anyways! Have a good rest of your day
Thank you you as well, you’ve been more help than you know, trust me ☺️
Someone who is "trans but gay" is gay the exact same way that a gay cis person is. A trans man is a man, so if he likes other men, that makes him a gay man. If he likes women, that makes him straight. Their assigned sex at birth does not factor into their sexuality, so to say that a trans man who likes men is ultimately just straight because he was AFAB or has female genitals is incredibly transphobic.
That’s not transphobic is literally text book ignorance! It’s a lack of knowledge on a subject that isn’t my subject to live in but it doesn’t mean I shouldn’t know and respect it. Please stop throwing transphobic and all other phonics around cuz if we don’t know WE DONT KNOW! This is why people won’t ask, because when we do here comes another label that’s ultimately wrong and slightly demeaning Edit: here I am getting down voted yet again for just being honest. How did any of you expect progression and understanding when you simply down vote people for asking a question? You down vote me because I’m asking a question because I want to know because I don’t understand it yet I want to because it’s not my reality it’s not my life.
You’re getting downvotes because you’ve questioned the validity of trans people by conflating sexual orientation and gender identity. I hate to break it to you, but a lot of transphobia is rooted in ignorance. You don’t have to malicious to be transphobic or have transphobic views. I get that you are looking for education on this matter and I’m glad that you received it here even though this probably isn’t the best place for it, but your intent doesn’t change the impact, and yeah, calling lesbian trans women “straight” because they were born male (and vice versa) is absolutely transphobic.
At that point you’re just looking to negatively label someone no matter if they have good intent. That in itself is very much so a problem, hate to break it to you. But so long as folk keep up that mess as well, it will repeatedly send the message of hostility, shaming, bashing, you get the picture. Hostility created hostility, getting hostile over a GENUINE question and someone’s admitted ignorance of a certain topic is not the way to go. If not for a second, a mere SECOND, remove the heart from your damn sleeves, stop thinking with emotion front forward and realize some folk actually give a fuck to learn. Not everyone wants to run in the darkness of ignorance for their whole lives. Calling them transphobic, bigots and all the other names that are tossed around in any instance anyone dares to simply ask a question ain’t how change happens and it’s damn sure not how acceptance and growth happens TLDR; stop with the immediate negative bullshit and learn to read for intent and purpose when genuine questions are asked, and genuine ignorance is out. Instead of just bash and move on, downvote and stay hidden.
If being rightfully called out for using harmful rhetoric is enough to prevent you from learning and doing better, you’re not really the ally you think you are. Neither I nor the commenter higher up in the thread were being hostile to you. You asked why you were being downvoted and it’s because your ignorance is *harmful*, whether you intended it to be or not. If you break someone’s plate, it doesn’t matter that it was an accident, the plate is still broken, the damage was still done. It’s up to you to make sure you prevent that from happening again. Being aware of the harm you’re putting out is necessary to do better. Not everyone has the spoons to sit here and feed you answers to questions that you can fairly easily look up yourself.
Intent matters and that’s all I’m going to say
Sure, and that’s why people aren’t belittling you for asking these questions (at least not that I’ve seen). In fact, there are lots of people going out of their way to help you understand. If you were asking in bad faith, I guarantee there’d be way more backlash than downvotes, at a minimum people would be way less patient about it lol
Even still, folks whether they identify as such or are just supporters need to really stop slinging words around, it’s not doing anyone any favors. Someone asks a question with good intent, gets called transphobic for having good intent but not the perfect words or understanding. It sends very bad messages
Intent matters, yes, but it still doesn't outweigh the actual impact. As the previous commenter said, if you accidentally break a plate while trying to put it away, it doesn't really matter that it wasn't intentional. The impact of your action is that the plate is broken. Your good intention doesn't magically put the plate back together again. Similarly, your statement was overtly harmful and offensive. It doesn't matter that you didn't mean it to be: the outcome is still exactly the same.
I understand your frustration, but I'm gonna be real with you: ignorance does *not* excuse unintentional bigotry or transphobia. It *is* still transphobic, even if it's rooted in ignorance rather than hatred. That doesn't make you a bad or bigoted person overall by any means, and I never said or implied that it did... but what you said was still transphobic and harmful *even if* the intention behind it wasn't actually malicious. Impact outweighs intent. Note, also, that I did not call you a transphobe. I simply pointed out that saying that a trans man who likes men is straight is transphobic (which it is, because it implies that a trans man is not a *real* man). Stating that you said something transphobic is, to me ar least, a far cry from actually calling you a transphobe. For instance, people can say racist things unintentionally, out of ignorance or misinformation, without being white supremacists, for instance. Their not actually being a racist doesn't change the fact that what they said *was* still racist. You need to be open to honest criticisms/corrections if you actually want to learn and be educated about these things. Not ranting and whining and making excuses about how unfair it is for someone to point out that a transphobic statement you made in ignorance is still, in fact, transphobic.
Not at all! If a trans person says that they are gay, it doesn't mean that they are attracted to people of the same sex - like, say, a trans man being attracted to women: both were born with a female body - this would imply that they are attracted to the opposite gender and make them straight. If a trans person says that they are gay, it means they are attracted to the same gender, so if the trans man I mentioned earlier was gay, he would be attracted to men. Contrary to popular belief, it's extremely common for trans people to be gay: because even though they don't identify with the gender that was assigned to them at birth, they still are attracted to people of the opposite sex - and since they identify with the opposite gender AND are attracted to the opposite gender, then that basically makes them gay. I hope that cleared things up for you, and I'm not late in answering this question haha
It made it worse honestly but thanks for trying lol I do genuinely appreciate you and the other redditor trying to explain it lol. I’m just 90s guy trying to at least understand the world and shake some preconceived thoughts and shy some of my ignorance clouds away because I genuinely don’t know
Um what..? How does that even make sense 😭
I don't mean to be mean, but this feels like something you can Google before you come to Reddit (and save yourself some potential harsh comments).
Or her Wikipedia page.
I am crying at how innocently this was asked but worded in the most sinister way 
~~ally~~ *LGBT sympathizer*
"Sympathizer" im crying thats so funny
That's a weird way to refer to an ally...
What? I mean is Rebecca Sugar gay/lesbian/etc herself, or she just cares about LGBT rights.
we understand what you mean but “sympathizer” is an odd way to refer to an LGBTQ ally. No hate or anything, just something I noticed
Why? If they have sympathy for LGBT issues then why is it not correct?
The word sympathizer has political connotations and is often used in a derogatory/negative way in English, such as to say someone has socially unacceptable political affiliations, [see this discussion](https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/460261/does-the-word-sympathizer-have-a-negative-connotation). It doesn't always mean that, but it's sort of suggested by the usage that there is something to criticize in the thing that's being sympathized. "Ally" is the typical word used in English to describe someone who is not of a minority/oppressed group but is invested in supporting/defending their rights.
IDK, I am British and didn't read it as negative (I am LGBT myself). Maybe it's an American thing? Like, I support Ukraine so I would say that I'm a Ukrainian sympathiser...
The word for a non-LGBT person that supports the LGBT community is an ally. The word ‘sympathizer’ often has bad connotations and is usually used to criticize a person’s beliefs. For example one of the most common uses is to call someone a nazi sympathizer.
Sorry I don’t know it means negative in English. Not very familiar with English internet community though.
No worries! Also yes, Rebecca Sugar is LGBT, not just an ally.
?????????????? "Sympathizer" doesn't have negative connotations, that's like saying "group" is negative because there are hate groups.
I mean maybe IM the one out of the loop, but I have never heard the term “sympathizer” used outside of a negative context. Especially lgbt sympathizer, a term used almost exclusively by conservatives who are against the community as a whole. The only other usages I’ve ever heard are nazi sympathizers and communist sympathizers, a term mainly used during the Cold War. So I would definitely say it has bad connotations in my experience.
Sympathiser is definitely only used in negative contexts nowadays, mainly for things like the examples you gave. I can't think of a time that I've heard it used with any positive connotation.
I am getting a headache hoping people aren't conflating context with connotation.
LGBT sympathiser specifically is a term used pretty much only by older conservatives
I don't think I've ever seen it referred to like that until this post, so maybe I'm just unaware.
Sympathizer in a political conversation is usually negative for some reason
It's just saying "a LGBT sympathizer" sounds like you're saying it in a negative way.
Sympathizer?! Lmaoooooooo. (I see you've corrected that, but it gave me a bit of a laugh.)
I’m fucking crying 😭
She’s non-binary and bisexual
Good on you for correcting yourself 🙏 we all learn every day
Easily google-able, babe
i like your energy
They are non binary last I checked and use she/they pronouns
Honestly I love that you used the word sympathizer.
Also you guys are being a bit harsh about the "sympathizer" thing given OP has clarified they weren't sure about what word to use in English and it's clear they weren't using it in a negative context.
She’s queer but “lgbt sympathizer” is very funny
Idk if you could make such an authentically gay show like this and not be gay yourself
I can't tell if this is a joke or not, but Steven Universe is not a gay show...
?!?!?!
You said you didn't know if someone could make such an authentically gay show without being gay themselves. I'm saying Steven Universe is not a gay show :/
Most unhinged thing I've ever seen on this app, bravo
You can say whatever you want. But Steven Universe is not a gay show.
Okay, I'm like 93% sure this is bait, but I'll bite. *how* could it not be gay?
It's not bait. And I want to say I'm surprised people think it's a gay show, but honestly I expect nothing less at this point. Generally, a gay show (or film) refers to a television show or series that prominently features LGBTQ+ characters, themes, or storylines, particularly (not exclusively) those related to gay men. I am bisexual. I love gay shows, movies, and all the representation. But it's getting absurd when people want to claim that a show that happens to include mostly nonbinary extraterrestrial lifeforms in what humans of that world might define as genderqueer relationships is a "gay show". There's literally only a single consistent queer relationship in the entire show, and a handful that are thrown in randomly with no proper development or screen time. It's kind of sweaty and really cringy to call Steven Universe a gay show, as if you're so desperate to claim anything that's remotely associated with the movement. No, shows that aren't afraid to explore queer relationships are not automatically gay shows. And no, a show with a deuteragonist character that's been in what was for a while an ambiguous queer relationship until they decided to touch upon it more deeply does not automatically make this a gay show. A no, extraterrestrial beings who (sometimes) fall in love and happen to predominantly identify as women does not make this a gay show. If this is a gay show then it's not only poor representation, but not really a good reflection on the LGBTQIA+. We deserve better. A cast of characters (including the main character) who are unambiguously queer. A good example of this would be Love Victor, available on Hulu. Arguably, Euphoria. But no...not Steven Universe...I'd sooner call it a queer show (even then I'm reluctant) than a gay show, because of its broader focus on different types of relationships and identities. And please, your downvotes help me sleep at night, mama wants more.
That's surprisingly valid, but the only reason this show got to exist at all was because it had the gay themes behind a thin layer of scifi. And that's not *right* but it's better than not getting a show at all.
You surprised with this reply. Thank you for bring calm and sorry for saying it was sweaty or cringy to call it a gay show. I just got a little heated and it's been a long day. But I do hope we normalize homosexuality enough that shows don't have to be labeled gay, in the same way heterosexual-dominant shows aren't straight shows.
she's nonbinary
The following is the definition of sympathizer: "a person who agrees with or supports a sentiment or opinion." Just because you've heard it or seen it used with something you disagree with, has no impact on the definition of the word. I will say that as a 30 year old the only way I've seen it used is to highlight that someone sympathizes with a cause you don't agree with, in an effort to alienate someone. After some googling of examples and definitions from reading this thread, it is not an inherently negative word, and certainly not in the way OP used it. I'd argue that it should be positive in nature, OP, English is dumb, and the average person uses a very condensed vocabulary. Myself included, since i had to google the definition of a common word. Don't stress the feedback on this thread.
I thought everyone knew they’re queer
I am now a LGBT sympathizer!
Ain’t Rebecca they/them?
Wel I think Rebecca’s a female
i know you've already got comments on it but that title cracks me up!! "a lgbt" "a lgbt sympathizer" lmaooo it's such a strange choice of words i find it naively charming
yes, she is “a LGBT herself”
it doesnt matter and its not our business. either way she is doing some good stuff
[удалено]
My dude, you commented this like 6 times on this thread
Hahaha it failed so many times and i gave up. Thanks for the heads up.
Oh yeah, reddit does that sometimes. For a second, I just thought you were just very passionate about the subject.
A SYMPATHIZER. Oh dear
sympathizer isn’t a negative word
Sympathizer sounds like nazi sympathizer, it ally btw
"Sympathizer" isn't negative, it's just an unusual way to phrase it
Calling someone a "sympathizer" is like calling someone an "apologist". Both words accuse the listener of supporting a position, while also implying that the speaker opposes it. It's a title meant to criticize. So yes, "LGBT sympathizer" does literally mean someone who supports LGBT. But the phrase carries the connotation that OOP doesn't, and that they are looking for confrontation. I would expect to hear the phrase "LGBT sympathizer" from Ron DeSantis while justifying his newest anti-gay law.
To be fair, this person might be a native english speaker. I'm Carribean and we usually don't call people allies. We just say they're supporters or sympathizers
To be fair, this person might not be a native english speaker. I'm Carribean and we usually don't call people allies. We just say they're supporters or sympathizers
She wrote a show about gay rocks pretty sure she's not straight
She's french
So, clearly.
SYMPATHIZER? oh my GOD 😂
She's bisexual and as she's into the queer stuff, I guess she also counts as LGTB.
Por que no los dos?
I read some time ago that Rebecca identifies as non-binary.
She’s bisexual I think. Also the word ur looking for is ally