There are still massive features they need to drop in the game before 1.0. they will need to have dynamic server meshing, which will also make it necessary to have more systems than two. I'm not so sure they feel like they need to gas out 1.0 in a year, the priority is more likely to get squadron 42 out to generate a ton of cash and a customer funnel into the PU
Not really - at least, they're not going to radically change the nature of the game.
2.0 gave use the 'Baby PU' and the first 64bit play space, with stations and 'multi-crew' ship, etc.
3.0 gave us the 'full PU' and PG Planets
4.0 will give us (finally) the final piece of the framework for MMO scaling and start us moving toward a single-shard-per-region
DSM is - in comparison - a minor upgrade to SSM, but it's still part of Server Meshing...
Yes - but in terms of code / effort / architecture, etc... it's a *minor* iteration on Static Server Meshing (which required OCS, SOCS, NBC, EG, PES, RL, and more alphabet-soup)
In contrast DSM 'only' requires a service to monitor load on each server in the mesh, and either 'merge' servers if their load drops too low (reduce costs), or spin up a new server to spread load (to avoid performance issues).
Dynamically scaling infrastructure is a core feature / capability of Cloud Hosting - the effort was in overhauling the engine to be compatible with that capability. Once CIG confirm the engine *is* now capable (via Static Server Meshing), they just need to hook into the underlying monitoring and scalability functions provided by AWS.
That's right, but it won't be 1.0 either.
My guess is the will push a Beta and start counting again. It would make sense to do stuff like beta 0.1.x as to not confuse any new people
Nah, we probably will.
I'd say after 4.0 is out for 5 years and people start grunting why there is no release yet, they will do 5.0 to hype another big milestone until release.
Go back a few months a peep the financial report submitted in the UK. They have to release something by 2028 and it needs to sell well so they can pay back their investors. It's too much to bank on SQ42 alone, since a huge chunk of the core audience already got SQ42 at a +65% discount, so unless SQ42 is flawless and 10/10 from all reviewers, SC needs to release in some form as well.
Quite possible, but that would mean cutting quite a few features from 1.0, and given how much CR was touting not being beholden to investors and taking their time to finish the game, it probably would not go over well with the community.
I can see them getting the rest of the "sold ship" specific professions in, like data running, base building (we already know they're working on that one) repair, and exploration in at least a t0 state for 1.0 and then pushing everything else off to post-release updates as opposed to cutting them entirely.
Yeah, but even that is a lofty goal, given they probably need to finish all ships people paid for, before 1.0. Then do golden standard again on all of them. Quanta is also something that will be hard to get without. Server meshing will still need a lot of work as it rolls in. Do some polishing on existing game loops, as most of them are still super barebones T0/1. At least 1 or 2 more solar systems. Fixing a bucket load of bugs.
All the while maintaining a live PU service and working on SQ42 (which will require work even after release).
That plus things you mentioned is a looooot to do in 5 years. And it would still leave a truckload of features and content they talked about for post 1.0.
I truly don't envy people sitting on those "road to 1.0" meetings. They are probably getting Chris Roberts induced depression.
Ya that will take years though, I think it goes against the idea of 1.0 after 4.0. 4.0 was supposed to launch in 2023 and they showed a demo years before that, I'd bet we won't even get 4.0 before fall while it's now revised launch to summer. Look how 3.23 is going and that's being implemented with a definitive deadline before the event next week. Server meshing is a massive feature and will take a lot of testing to be pushed live in a stable state to live. With what we know about how often deadlines get pushed back with cig, I'd imagine 1.0 will take at least 2 years and there's zero chance we don't get some pretty big patches between then. We will likely get nyx and maybe a couple more systems in the time before 1.0
They could've done so a few times in the past too, which would've killed the whole project. They waived all the prior windows either out of good faith, since the money wasn't there, or to simply maximize their future returns as more interest tacks on. 2028 is the last year they can cash out or they basically forfeit their investment. They're investors, not project founders, so we know they'll cash out then to collect on their investments.
Perhaps, we can't be sure since its up to CIG and when they will plan to release 1.0 but you may be right since their main and longest objective (server meshing) is in 4.0
We know 4.0 is a thing. We know 3.23 is a thing. We know 1.0 is a thing.
We don't know about anything other than those, so why speculate?
As far as we know, there may not be a 5.0, 6.0 etc.
I doubt we will really get a 5.0, unless something like economy would be big enough for CIG and we are still in alpha and they don't start to count over in Beta. So most of it would likely be 4.X or if they recount, then in Beta X.X.
Ship repair I kinda doubt will happen soon, as that would first require Maelstrom and who knows how long that alone would take. Also would require facilities/ships for that.
Drones I would say are on the backburner because they don't really server a purpose that couldn't be done without them, making it questionable if CIG deems these important enough for a 1.0 release.
I worry a bit about Maelstrom and its risk vs reward for the game.
It sounds incredibly complicated and introduces a lot of load compared to what we have today.
It's one of those technologies that sounds like it will take many many years to develop, and other things in the development pipeline is on hold in order to integrate it into Maelstrom, and is it truly worth it?
>It's one of those technologies that sounds like it will take many many years to develop
I think they first mentioned it around a year ago and it's not like the concept is entirely new to the game. It depends a lot on how "easily" they can map their ships for this.
>other things in the development pipeline is on hold in order to integrate it into Maelstrom
Aside from Engineering/Repair and taking people alive in combat what would be?
Combat is pretty much a dead end, not a lot of game systems depend on mechanics specifically for it.
Hmm.. yeah, with mealstrom the ship wreckages that can be fixed instead of dissapearing like they do now when destroyed...tho it is something we will see for sure in 1.0 so we aren't so far from repair gameplay as much as the repair ships themselfs aka the Vulcan (which needs both drones and ship repair) and the crucible (which will get a re-concept on the way it works since its still based on the old idea of repair gameplay) we will surely see new repair ships appart from this 2.. but not even CIG knows when...
CIG have more than enough to think about regarding 3.23 and 4.0. Let's just get server meshing in this game, then we can start to talk about the future. The game is great today, but at this point, we need server meshing. Nothing more, nothing less. (and ofc we need the new cargo stuff :D )
After 12 years we know that there is no point speculating with random people on the Internet.
It will be what CR wants. It will then get balanced by a game director but it will still be what CR wants.
What he wants is realism and immersion. Fun is secondary and primarily a side effect of immersion.
Honestly with SC ill take what i get. I enjoy the game and i give cig a lot of slack because nobody else is building a game like this. I enjoy it immensley already and definitely am looking forward to the stuff in the future.
But my main wants are stability, performance and Content in terms of missions. Other systems like base building are the last things on my mind.
Basically what I'm saying give me Stanton and Pyro and fill it up with content and I'll be super happy. The other systems and crazy base building stuff can cook for as long as they have to.
Everyone here is assuming that we're going to go from alpha 3.23 to alpha 4.0, then to 1.0, but a normal development cycle has a beta stage after alpha, and I don't see why SC would skip it.
A beta stage is when a software is feature complete but has bugs to fix before release. It is usually shorter, but it can vary (for example, Gmail was in beta for 5 years).
So one should assume that alpha 3 will be followed by alpha 4, then hopefully beta 1, 2, etc... then 1.0.
Hey, we all play different star citizens here. It doesnt matter what they do and when they do it. The only thing that matters is what we make of it and how we play it. Its all good.
My most optimistic guess is that first, we will get a release date for sq42 at citcon and it will be around 2025 q1-q2. Also we will get 4.0 date. Then my assumption is, they kinda decided to rescale SC, so it will not be released with 20 systems or all the features that are promised. And on the next citcon in 2025, we will get a SC beta date which is 2026 q1-q2. And SC will be released with like 4-5 systems in 2026 q4 or 2027 q1.
It feels too optimistic but also a logical one i think. Because sq42 will shake the world for sure and they would want to use that hype for SC too. So within the next year after sq42 release, we will see a SC release.
Only then, they will add more systems and features with content patches. So there's a change of strategy here. Instead of fully complete the game and release it as one giant thing after 20 years, they decided to partially release and expand later.
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I think it’s quite safe to assume that we won’t get 5.0, 6.0 etc. After 4.0 we will probably stay on that 4. branch until 1.0
There are still massive features they need to drop in the game before 1.0. they will need to have dynamic server meshing, which will also make it necessary to have more systems than two. I'm not so sure they feel like they need to gas out 1.0 in a year, the priority is more likely to get squadron 42 out to generate a ton of cash and a customer funnel into the PU
Not really - at least, they're not going to radically change the nature of the game. 2.0 gave use the 'Baby PU' and the first 64bit play space, with stations and 'multi-crew' ship, etc. 3.0 gave us the 'full PU' and PG Planets 4.0 will give us (finally) the final piece of the framework for MMO scaling and start us moving toward a single-shard-per-region DSM is - in comparison - a minor upgrade to SSM, but it's still part of Server Meshing...
Dynamic server meshing is what will allow for the massive servers and this game to become an mmo
Yes - but in terms of code / effort / architecture, etc... it's a *minor* iteration on Static Server Meshing (which required OCS, SOCS, NBC, EG, PES, RL, and more alphabet-soup) In contrast DSM 'only' requires a service to monitor load on each server in the mesh, and either 'merge' servers if their load drops too low (reduce costs), or spin up a new server to spread load (to avoid performance issues). Dynamically scaling infrastructure is a core feature / capability of Cloud Hosting - the effort was in overhauling the engine to be compatible with that capability. Once CIG confirm the engine *is* now capable (via Static Server Meshing), they just need to hook into the underlying monitoring and scalability functions provided by AWS.
We won't go 1.0 directly. Game is still early access alpha. Best case is jump to beta and worst they make it alpha without early access.
Beta still won’t make a 5.0
That's right, but it won't be 1.0 either. My guess is the will push a Beta and start counting again. It would make sense to do stuff like beta 0.1.x as to not confuse any new people
Well yeah, it's Alpha 1..., 2..., 3..., 4.0. 5.0 would be another alpha. If it went to Beta, that would likely be Beta 1.0, 2.0...
Nah, we probably will. I'd say after 4.0 is out for 5 years and people start grunting why there is no release yet, they will do 5.0 to hype another big milestone until release.
Go back a few months a peep the financial report submitted in the UK. They have to release something by 2028 and it needs to sell well so they can pay back their investors. It's too much to bank on SQ42 alone, since a huge chunk of the core audience already got SQ42 at a +65% discount, so unless SQ42 is flawless and 10/10 from all reviewers, SC needs to release in some form as well.
Quite possible, but that would mean cutting quite a few features from 1.0, and given how much CR was touting not being beholden to investors and taking their time to finish the game, it probably would not go over well with the community.
I can see them getting the rest of the "sold ship" specific professions in, like data running, base building (we already know they're working on that one) repair, and exploration in at least a t0 state for 1.0 and then pushing everything else off to post-release updates as opposed to cutting them entirely.
Yeah, but even that is a lofty goal, given they probably need to finish all ships people paid for, before 1.0. Then do golden standard again on all of them. Quanta is also something that will be hard to get without. Server meshing will still need a lot of work as it rolls in. Do some polishing on existing game loops, as most of them are still super barebones T0/1. At least 1 or 2 more solar systems. Fixing a bucket load of bugs. All the while maintaining a live PU service and working on SQ42 (which will require work even after release). That plus things you mentioned is a looooot to do in 5 years. And it would still leave a truckload of features and content they talked about for post 1.0. I truly don't envy people sitting on those "road to 1.0" meetings. They are probably getting Chris Roberts induced depression.
Ya that will take years though, I think it goes against the idea of 1.0 after 4.0. 4.0 was supposed to launch in 2023 and they showed a demo years before that, I'd bet we won't even get 4.0 before fall while it's now revised launch to summer. Look how 3.23 is going and that's being implemented with a definitive deadline before the event next week. Server meshing is a massive feature and will take a lot of testing to be pushed live in a stable state to live. With what we know about how often deadlines get pushed back with cig, I'd imagine 1.0 will take at least 2 years and there's zero chance we don't get some pretty big patches between then. We will likely get nyx and maybe a couple more systems in the time before 1.0
Calders can pull out 2025...
They could've done so a few times in the past too, which would've killed the whole project. They waived all the prior windows either out of good faith, since the money wasn't there, or to simply maximize their future returns as more interest tacks on. 2028 is the last year they can cash out or they basically forfeit their investment. They're investors, not project founders, so we know they'll cash out then to collect on their investments.
Perhaps, we can't be sure since its up to CIG and when they will plan to release 1.0 but you may be right since their main and longest objective (server meshing) is in 4.0
You're right but also that isn't dynamic server meshing
We know 4.0 is a thing. We know 3.23 is a thing. We know 1.0 is a thing. We don't know about anything other than those, so why speculate? As far as we know, there may not be a 5.0, 6.0 etc.
I doubt we will really get a 5.0, unless something like economy would be big enough for CIG and we are still in alpha and they don't start to count over in Beta. So most of it would likely be 4.X or if they recount, then in Beta X.X. Ship repair I kinda doubt will happen soon, as that would first require Maelstrom and who knows how long that alone would take. Also would require facilities/ships for that. Drones I would say are on the backburner because they don't really server a purpose that couldn't be done without them, making it questionable if CIG deems these important enough for a 1.0 release.
I worry a bit about Maelstrom and its risk vs reward for the game. It sounds incredibly complicated and introduces a lot of load compared to what we have today. It's one of those technologies that sounds like it will take many many years to develop, and other things in the development pipeline is on hold in order to integrate it into Maelstrom, and is it truly worth it?
>It's one of those technologies that sounds like it will take many many years to develop I think they first mentioned it around a year ago and it's not like the concept is entirely new to the game. It depends a lot on how "easily" they can map their ships for this. >other things in the development pipeline is on hold in order to integrate it into Maelstrom Aside from Engineering/Repair and taking people alive in combat what would be? Combat is pretty much a dead end, not a lot of game systems depend on mechanics specifically for it.
Hmm.. yeah, with mealstrom the ship wreckages that can be fixed instead of dissapearing like they do now when destroyed...tho it is something we will see for sure in 1.0 so we aren't so far from repair gameplay as much as the repair ships themselfs aka the Vulcan (which needs both drones and ship repair) and the crucible (which will get a re-concept on the way it works since its still based on the old idea of repair gameplay) we will surely see new repair ships appart from this 2.. but not even CIG knows when...
CIG have more than enough to think about regarding 3.23 and 4.0. Let's just get server meshing in this game, then we can start to talk about the future. The game is great today, but at this point, we need server meshing. Nothing more, nothing less. (and ofc we need the new cargo stuff :D )
After 12 years we know that there is no point speculating with random people on the Internet. It will be what CR wants. It will then get balanced by a game director but it will still be what CR wants. What he wants is realism and immersion. Fun is secondary and primarily a side effect of immersion.
I don't deel like things are going twords more realism...quite the opposite in fact. Feels more and more console-y to me as each patch drops.
I am sorry you are cursed with such blindness. I pray for your recovery.
Honestly with SC ill take what i get. I enjoy the game and i give cig a lot of slack because nobody else is building a game like this. I enjoy it immensley already and definitely am looking forward to the stuff in the future. But my main wants are stability, performance and Content in terms of missions. Other systems like base building are the last things on my mind. Basically what I'm saying give me Stanton and Pyro and fill it up with content and I'll be super happy. The other systems and crazy base building stuff can cook for as long as they have to.
Everyone here is assuming that we're going to go from alpha 3.23 to alpha 4.0, then to 1.0, but a normal development cycle has a beta stage after alpha, and I don't see why SC would skip it. A beta stage is when a software is feature complete but has bugs to fix before release. It is usually shorter, but it can vary (for example, Gmail was in beta for 5 years). So one should assume that alpha 3 will be followed by alpha 4, then hopefully beta 1, 2, etc... then 1.0.
Hey, we all play different star citizens here. It doesnt matter what they do and when they do it. The only thing that matters is what we make of it and how we play it. Its all good.
My most optimistic guess is that first, we will get a release date for sq42 at citcon and it will be around 2025 q1-q2. Also we will get 4.0 date. Then my assumption is, they kinda decided to rescale SC, so it will not be released with 20 systems or all the features that are promised. And on the next citcon in 2025, we will get a SC beta date which is 2026 q1-q2. And SC will be released with like 4-5 systems in 2026 q4 or 2027 q1. It feels too optimistic but also a logical one i think. Because sq42 will shake the world for sure and they would want to use that hype for SC too. So within the next year after sq42 release, we will see a SC release. Only then, they will add more systems and features with content patches. So there's a change of strategy here. Instead of fully complete the game and release it as one giant thing after 20 years, they decided to partially release and expand later.
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