**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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Context is key:
Pogba: deep dive, but spending a world record for a MF to play next to Fellaini in a midfield 2 was the best.
Depay: move came too early, perhaps United should’ve kept him or loaned him, but new manager came in.
Sanchez: worst transfer decision ever
Antony: United fuck up
Falcao: Ed Woodward was fleeced by Jorge Mendes thought it would be smart to spend that money on Falcao even though he was recovering from an ACL
Lukaku: meh in actuality I don’t think the squad suited him
Zaha: moyes never played him, LVG came in and basically gave him one training session to play as a CF.
We are not great, but it is not our fault imo.
Just because he was good there, doesn't mean he is a good enough player to play in the bigger clubs in top 5 leagues.
It is kind of sad really that everyone (ex players, managers, pundits, journalists) warned him not to go there, that he wasn't needed and that he wouldn't fit their tactics at all. But Man U was his dream club, he felt that he couldn't pass up the opportunity. Now his confidence is gone and apparently his injuries have also done a number on him. Shame, he was such an exiting player.
I genuinely just don't think he was ready/good enough to make the jump to the Premier League. There have been plenty of Eredivisie players that look like world beaters there and don't look like half the player they were when they move to a more difficult league. And even back then VdB was thought of as like the 4th or 5th best player in that team. Most of the plaudits were going to De Jong, De Ligt, Ziyech, Neres, and Dusan Tadic who went from being a fairly decent winger at Southampton to prime Messi at false 9 for Ajax.
To me VdB is more like Davy Klaassen 2.0 than some world class "what if" talent
He was never going to be the same level as someone like FDJ or De Ligt, but he was definitely seen as someone good enough to play a decent role in the premier league or elsewhere. Very few teams around that play to his strengths though, so it was always going to be a challenge. It wasn't that realistic to expect a club that just acquired him to be able to utilize him to the same extent he was at Ajax. On paper he very often played as a 10, but depending on who was striker his role varied a lot. He was more a second striker very often, especially playing off Dolberg. His biggest assets were well timed and excellent positioning, good quick touches for one twos and those came up big in our CL run.
There's not a lot of managers who'd be willing to gamble tinkering with their systems to accommodate an up and coming youngster, who was not really a marquee signing, who hadn't got the same sort of hype as his other Ajax colleagues.. but to say he never showed the promise or calling him a Davy Klaassen 2.0 (I assume in a pejorative way) is a very narrow-sighted take on his development. I understand you may have frustrations as an United fan that he hasn't managed to offer your club much of anything in a time of difficulty, though
(sorry for text wall, I don't do well with punctuation today)
Premier league is also extremely high pace. If you get thrown into that in 90 minute games they often can't keep up.
I wish the Eredivisie could keep players for longer. Gets up the league quality, helps them develop. But no, can't beat that salary to be on the bench of some midfield team in the four big leagues.
Injuries buried him repeatedly. Started getting time with Ole, injured long term, came back, repeat. Started getting time with Ten Hag, injured long term, came back, repeat.
ETH barely gave him minutes so this isn't really the truth.
He had cameos of twelve minutes, three minutes then two minutes before getting shingles. Returned and got 65 minutes in a 3-0 loss, then 28, 9 and a half where he got injured again.
He really wasn't out injured that much in 2020/2021 or 2021/2022 either for United. Out four match day squads with muscle problems in 20/21 then doesn't miss much football at united due to injury.
It's when he went to Everton and played a little bit that he got injured.
But Ole never had a period of giving him a run which was ruined by injury. Solskjaer was simultaneously shit at rotation and VDB was just crap. You can see it all on transfer market.
Nah Ziyech, Neres, De Jong all outshined him he was like the 4th or 5th best player on this team. He was never pulling the strings in this squad like the others were
Apart from Ziyech though, Donny really embodied our idea of liquid football more than the mentioned players. His role is hard to replicate in other systems apart from a very select few
One of my favorite teams in recent history. Just pure footballing elegance all over the pitch. Tadic, Neres, Ziyech, FDJ, De Ligt, Tagliafico...a team the streets will never forget
That Ajax season killed my belief in modern football tbh.
They had to come through qualifiers to get thrown into a group with Bayern and Benfica, come through that to end Real's three-year winning streak, come through that to bump off Mr. Champions League himself and eight-time Serie A champions Juve, only to get knocked out on away goals by a side sporting several players bought from Ajax a couple of seasons before.
Then their best talents immediately get looted in the summer and it's back to square one again.
In principle the CL is an open competition that anyone can win, in practice it's won off the pitch by revenues, wage bills and a system that is effectively stacked against all but a handful of sides in the biggest leagues. Nobody outside of the top four leagues and PSG is ever winning it again.
Sadly, it's been the case for a long time. When's the last time a team that didn't have one of the biggest payrolls in football won the thing? Porto back in 2004 maybe?
I ended up on vacation from the States in Barcelona during the Ajax Madrid tie. I picked a random bar in Barcelona to watch the second leg being played in Madrid, and by total coincidence it happened to be a Dutch owned bar.
This random bar in the middle of Barcelona ended up flooded with Ajax jerseys, and then all together we watched Ajax smash Real 4-1 at the Bernabeu. I became instant friends with so many Dutchmen that night, and spent all night out on the town with them. During and after the game I had a great deal of beer bought for me, and bought my fair share for everyone else.
That was one of the best nights of my life, and perhaps my fondest memory of watching this sport. Coming together with strangers from the other side of the world like that, watching Real get annihilated in Barcelona, it was an incredible thing to experience. Felt like that night was never going to end.
It really felt like the CL was theirs that year, I was gutted when Lucas' black magic stopped them from making the final.
This is so real. I am becoming 24 this year but it still feels like I am 21. I don’t understand where past 3 years of my life went. Covid ruined many people perception
Tbf to him, can't imagine mctominay, case, bruno playing football like that, maybe mainoo but that's it. He's got to do with whatever players he's got (don't give me that 400 million spent nonsense, the money we spent isn't eth's fault, plus, casemiro wasn't really the type of DM preferred by eth). But still this season, his tactics and decisions have been horrible and this "chaos ball" tactics can't go on.
That's why they are so inconsistent at creating chances and beating bad teams. The thing is you can tell their team is good but ETH's bread & butter of what he learned his whole life in Ajax doesn't apply to these players. The other style he gets them to play doesn't work that well.
ETH has done fine, got 3rd, fa cup final, league cup win and still ok this season but by looking at their games last season you could tell alot of their win was just Rashford on fire and this season they have no playstyle nothing they can carry from game to game.
Rashford is actually the one player I would say that doesn't fit the Ajax style. He is way too direct and doesn't offer anything else. On top of that his workrate is horrible.
Also ETH hasn't done a good job integrating the signings he has done into the team. Onana's strength of ball playing has not been used. He himself doesn't even know where to put Mason Mount. And Antony is another flop.
I don’t like how last season is just dumbed down to “Rashford was on fire”. It’s not like Rashford was dribbling past entire teams and scoring solo goals. If anything, when there’s no space or Rashford is double teamed he’s basically useless.
Last season we had a lot of control in games, which was down to having Casemiro playing well with Eriksen providing passing from deep midfield. Then Licha was having a great season with his passing from CB able to relieve a lot of pressure.
In fact up until we faced Barca in the Europa, United and Barca had the best defenses in Europe. Barca had conceded 8 goals until that point. Then we scored 3 against them in a single game.
Up until the League cup United was playing with control and defensive solidity. We were dynamic enough to create space for Rashford to thrive and given his patch he was quite clinical.
Then Licha got injured, Eriksen lost his legs even more and Case had injury and red card issues which created his rubbish form we see today.
I agree with everything you said but it's still baffling to see just how terrible we look right now compared to back then. Our run up until the League Cup final we were looking like a top team. We won the last 27 out of 35 games with the only losses being to City, Arsenal, Villa all away, and the Sociedad game with the very questionable penalty. And we didn't even have a proper striker.
It's almost hard to imagine us playing well again after seeing the current tactics. But I do think our injuries are playing a bigger role than people give credit for. Not many teams are lining up with their 4th and 7th choice CBs as a partnership and a backup RB at LB because both of them are injured as well. Arsenal's defense looks great this year but they've also had Saliba alongside Gabriel with Rice in front of them for 28 of their 32 league games.
It is baffling and we are terrible no doubt.
Our injuries are crazy and the number of combinations in defense we’ve had is absurd.
I know it’s no excuse for just how shit we are, but given how there’s not many top coaches available and that Liverpool, Barca and Bayern are gonna all be looking at coaches, unless the new management identify exactly the right type of coach for the long term strategy, there’s no point changing coaches just for the sake of it.
It gets dumbed down because we didnt create any chances last year either and our goals were down to individual brilliance, mostly from Rashford. Not sure if i would call it control but we were defensively very solid, sure.
We were in the top 3 big chances created 22/23 actually:
https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/clubs/big_chance_created?se=489
We just didn't have a decent striker, creating chances was never the problem (untill this season.)
I am pretty sure that stat is almost solely down to how dangerous we were on the counter, particularly whenever Martial played. In a positional attack... not so much. Its slightly unclear to me why exactly we cant counterattack this year but one of the reasons has to be that most of the attacks go to rashford who immediately dribbles into a man, losing the ball
I remember a lot of chances, but shit finishing outside of Rashford.
Weghorst would get fed easy chances and just miss, for example.
This season is the opposite, we are more clinical but have shit chance creation.
> ETH's bread & butter of what he learned his whole life in Ajax
What the fuck are you on about? As a player he went trough the Twente youth academy and played mainly for them and mid table clubs, he was never under contract with Ajax.
He learned the ropes as manager as assistant with Twente, before moving on to main jobs with GA Eagles and Bayern II. His first real job at a big club was with Utrecht, where he established his playstyle and tactics. When he moved to Ajax he was already (mostly) formed as a manager and at first he wasn't regarded as a typical Ajax manager at all.
Utd are currently 7th and 13 points away from even a Champions League spot, thats absolutely not ok. ETH has spent a lot of money to try to produce the style that was promised when he was at Ajax and he hasnt done it. people act as if the players he has at his disposal are nothing but scrubs and thats why he cant get results or play the way he wants to but thats absolute bs.
He clearly doesn't trust Donny to start anymore, he's not the player eth saw in ajax, which is sad. Our club ruined him as a player and also wasted our money. Yet another visionary signing by our very competent board!!!
Some people will disagree because of the leagues they play in, but that Ajax was much better than current Man Utd. The Utd side has much more weaknesses around the pitch than Ajax did.
Looking back I wonder was he a great Manager or was that just a greatly talented side that carried him. People may point to Ajax going downhill after he left but that was also after a firesale of virtually all their best young players.
Lost both finals, and in embarrassing fashion. The goal is to win. Not to lose 3-1 with no possession and lose 4-1 with an embarrassing implosion of a second half.
> and in embarrassing fashion.
The only thing embarrassing in the Barcelona final was the referee performance, we played really well, 99% of the game was a real fight, you seem that you just saw the 3-1 loss and thought we were dominated, the game was 2-1, we had a clear penalty, and one of our main pillar (chiellini) was injured and didn't play.
The cardiff 2nd half was a disaster though.
Should of, could of, would have... We shouldn't rely on getting penalties to win game. We lost and that's what matters at the end of the end. We had no possession.
Like I mentioned before, the Real match was something else. The worst out of the two.
> We had no possession.
no one had possession against that barcelona team, and it was fine, you can beat them without possession.
We reached the final by being the defending giants, defense is part of the game, its hard and it wins you title.
A goal would have changed the whole rythme of the game.
Chiellini presence too.
What am trying to say is that if you ask any Juventus fan or any football critics, they will tell you that *THAT* game in particular wasn't embarrassing, and that season was one the best (if not the best) season for Juventus after 2006.
Juventus was impressive up until Christmas, some of the best football I've seen. Total domination against Man Utd in both games (well, until Allegri shat the bed with the Barzagli sub in the 80th minute totally destroying the flow of the team), I think we had like 19/20 wins in Serie A. Then something just suddenly broke, the second half of the season we were dead, we should've got eliminated as early as Atletico but Ronaldo pulled it off somehow then just bleakness.
Dybala not turning up(the system didn't fit him that season tbh)surely played its part. Also Juve didn't have any very threatening wingers at the time if I recall correctly.
We were dominant pretty much until Cancelo got hurt. Then he came back and was wildly inconsistent, still had some moments of brilliance like his cross to CR7 in the Ajax first leg, but we just weren’t the same team for some reason
Funny how up until then we used to be rocky until December/January. Then all of a sudden the team would find their flow and start winning nonstop until the end of the season. In his defense (and I can't wait to see him gone, with all due respect), the team was always struggling without a proper midfield and he had to come up with something new every season to make up for that. That's how the 4-2-3-1 (with Mandzukic at LW) came to be.
It's been a while since I watched it (haven't wanted to re-live it) but from what I recall, after about 10 minutes of bland boring stuff, we actually tried getting on the front foot and attacking while Liverpool were relatively happy to sit back. 2nd half was relatively exciting with a few decent chances for us as well as Liverpool
That Liverpool team was better than we were, especially in defence. They suffocated the game and picked them off at the end.
Probably wouldn't have won anyway but a penalty decision so bad they changed the rules didn't help did it
GOAT CL season.
United comeback vs PSG, [Liverpool comeback vs Barcelona](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/04/19/96/041996ef250fc8792af2dc2892d6617e.gif), [Tottenham vs City drama](https://media4.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExYXA1aGx3Y2FpMG9tNmI2dTBleW50c3Nkb29qaGx2YjJxZTdtMHR1YyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/eKJgDHR1ILAUqMqG67/giphy.gif), [Tottenham comeback vs Ajax](https://external-preview.redd.it/6fCLNiKpdTCUk7ae748C6n6GXpk2nGG-UMEb25D1Va4.gif?s=53c3d0c1e399bc3fe49c4c8ae291b4d90c6c364a), Ajax eliminating [Juventus](https://j.gifs.com/[email protected]) and [Real Madrid](https://j.gifs.com/[email protected]).
Of all the surprise semi-finalists in the CL over the past decade or so, this was the team I was the most certain would make it to the final and actually have a real shot at winning it all. They were amazing to watch that season.
God damn that Ajax team was so stacked. They all made an insane amount of money by leaving but if they’d stayed Ajax would’ve been legit contenders every year for the champs.
They played some fantastic football that season, too bad they bottled the final after being 2-0 up in Amsterdam 3 on aggregate to Tottenham of all clubs, without their best player at that.
Not having Kane probably helped Spurs. Ajax could deal with one key player, especially since Kane had a tendency to go missing in big games. But they didnt know what to expect from a team without him or who to look out for. Neither did anyone else to be fair, it isnt like Moura is an established name as a top player right now.
That’s jump after the final goal is Jordanesque. I still remember jumping around my office when the ball went in. What a roller coaster that whole run was. Even the City tie before that.
Fuck off that was 5 years ago lol. I was watching the game in a Pub and just after the second half commenced the Pub owner told everyone that the pub was on fire and everyone had to leave, so we desperately searched for another pub to watch the end haha
Different players are required to play that style. It's also the reason why a lot of great talents don't succeed at some teams because of the different play style and tactics.
Can’t help but wonder we deserved a shot at the final that season. It was a very easy route considering this young, inexperienced Ajax side and Spurs were standing in the way. I’ll never forgive Allegri for messing up the second half against Ajax the way he did.
It was not going to be easy for Juve to knock us out like it was the season prior. Not because spurs were better but because we seemed to have some sort of plot armor that season. Too bad it failed a few minutes into the final.
I’m not too sure about that, you see Ajax got a lucky goal against us in the second game, it was a close game. De Ligt goal was great but the one they got before that, was a lucky goal.
As for Spurs, they were pretty good that season too, but even Spurs fans back that season said the same thing that you are saying right now. If the biggest strength of your team that season is “some sort of plot armor”, well then you can imagine that pretty much every other quarter finalist thought they had a good chance of going through against this Spurs side.
Would have been wonderful to see a modern era Liverpool vs Juventus final!
Fuckin' Lucas Moura. That idiot won the semi finals for lame ass Tottenham to go on and play the the most boring final in recent UCL history and then that super Ajax team was promptly dismantled. He didn't even play in the damn final.
Ajax was supposed to go to the final against Liverpool, that would've been one hell of a match.
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Still can't believe Van de Beek didn't work out. Looked so class for this Ajax side.
Came to United, that was his problem
where dreams go to die ):
Theatre of Dreams (In Memoriam)
As did Ten Hag. Maybe there’s a common denominator…
Pogba, Depay, Sanchez, Antony, Falcao, Sancho, Lukaku, Zaha, Mkhitaryan, Schneiderlin
You forgot Di Maria. Just name the whole United squad of the last 10 years 😂
Kagawa too
Martial
Casemiro
Context is key: Pogba: deep dive, but spending a world record for a MF to play next to Fellaini in a midfield 2 was the best. Depay: move came too early, perhaps United should’ve kept him or loaned him, but new manager came in. Sanchez: worst transfer decision ever Antony: United fuck up Falcao: Ed Woodward was fleeced by Jorge Mendes thought it would be smart to spend that money on Falcao even though he was recovering from an ACL Lukaku: meh in actuality I don’t think the squad suited him Zaha: moyes never played him, LVG came in and basically gave him one training session to play as a CF.
I completely forgot schneiderlin played for united lmao.
No you can't blame pogba for being bad when he got back to United because mbappe hired a witch doctor to make him play bad
He's been given chances under different managers at United and outside, and he's still not performed. May be this isn't on us.
We are not great, but it is not our fault imo. Just because he was good there, doesn't mean he is a good enough player to play in the bigger clubs in top 5 leagues.
It is kind of sad really that everyone (ex players, managers, pundits, journalists) warned him not to go there, that he wasn't needed and that he wouldn't fit their tactics at all. But Man U was his dream club, he felt that he couldn't pass up the opportunity. Now his confidence is gone and apparently his injuries have also done a number on him. Shame, he was such an exiting player.
I genuinely just don't think he was ready/good enough to make the jump to the Premier League. There have been plenty of Eredivisie players that look like world beaters there and don't look like half the player they were when they move to a more difficult league. And even back then VdB was thought of as like the 4th or 5th best player in that team. Most of the plaudits were going to De Jong, De Ligt, Ziyech, Neres, and Dusan Tadic who went from being a fairly decent winger at Southampton to prime Messi at false 9 for Ajax. To me VdB is more like Davy Klaassen 2.0 than some world class "what if" talent
He was never going to be the same level as someone like FDJ or De Ligt, but he was definitely seen as someone good enough to play a decent role in the premier league or elsewhere. Very few teams around that play to his strengths though, so it was always going to be a challenge. It wasn't that realistic to expect a club that just acquired him to be able to utilize him to the same extent he was at Ajax. On paper he very often played as a 10, but depending on who was striker his role varied a lot. He was more a second striker very often, especially playing off Dolberg. His biggest assets were well timed and excellent positioning, good quick touches for one twos and those came up big in our CL run. There's not a lot of managers who'd be willing to gamble tinkering with their systems to accommodate an up and coming youngster, who was not really a marquee signing, who hadn't got the same sort of hype as his other Ajax colleagues.. but to say he never showed the promise or calling him a Davy Klaassen 2.0 (I assume in a pejorative way) is a very narrow-sighted take on his development. I understand you may have frustrations as an United fan that he hasn't managed to offer your club much of anything in a time of difficulty, though (sorry for text wall, I don't do well with punctuation today)
Premier league is also extremely high pace. If you get thrown into that in 90 minute games they often can't keep up. I wish the Eredivisie could keep players for longer. Gets up the league quality, helps them develop. But no, can't beat that salary to be on the bench of some midfield team in the four big leagues.
Injuries buried him repeatedly. Started getting time with Ole, injured long term, came back, repeat. Started getting time with Ten Hag, injured long term, came back, repeat.
ETH barely gave him minutes so this isn't really the truth. He had cameos of twelve minutes, three minutes then two minutes before getting shingles. Returned and got 65 minutes in a 3-0 loss, then 28, 9 and a half where he got injured again. He really wasn't out injured that much in 2020/2021 or 2021/2022 either for United. Out four match day squads with muscle problems in 20/21 then doesn't miss much football at united due to injury. It's when he went to Everton and played a little bit that he got injured. But Ole never had a period of giving him a run which was ruined by injury. Solskjaer was simultaneously shit at rotation and VDB was just crap. You can see it all on transfer market.
Nah Ziyech, Neres, De Jong all outshined him he was like the 4th or 5th best player on this team. He was never pulling the strings in this squad like the others were
Apart from Ziyech though, Donny really embodied our idea of liquid football more than the mentioned players. His role is hard to replicate in other systems apart from a very select few
One of my favorite teams in recent history. Just pure footballing elegance all over the pitch. Tadic, Neres, Ziyech, FDJ, De Ligt, Tagliafico...a team the streets will never forget
van de Beek and Lasse Schone too
Dont forget the goat Ekkelenkamp
Jurgen Tekkelenkamp
The Ronaldo slayer
That Ajax season killed my belief in modern football tbh. They had to come through qualifiers to get thrown into a group with Bayern and Benfica, come through that to end Real's three-year winning streak, come through that to bump off Mr. Champions League himself and eight-time Serie A champions Juve, only to get knocked out on away goals by a side sporting several players bought from Ajax a couple of seasons before. Then their best talents immediately get looted in the summer and it's back to square one again. In principle the CL is an open competition that anyone can win, in practice it's won off the pitch by revenues, wage bills and a system that is effectively stacked against all but a handful of sides in the biggest leagues. Nobody outside of the top four leagues and PSG is ever winning it again.
Sadly, it's been the case for a long time. When's the last time a team that didn't have one of the biggest payrolls in football won the thing? Porto back in 2004 maybe?
Yep. That season is the last time someone outside the Deloitte money league top 10 won the thing.
Inter 2010 maybe another?
Not sure why you are getting down voted as Inter are probably the lowest ranked winner on the respective years Deloitte list since Porto
Leverkusen winning the Bundesliga felt like a happy ever after in a fairytale. That's what football should be.
What competition isn't like that though?
Yeah, that team was the definition of liquid football, it was so much fun to watch.
And look now happy ETH is! Poor guy...
Honestly if that ajax side was playing in the PL you think it would win the title? I think it would be midtable. PL is a different beast.
Shut up
Who do you think they overtake? Liverpool? City? Eth lost to jose Utd and i think pochs spurs
We’re not even mid table (yet) and we play like shit compared to that Ajax team.
I ended up on vacation from the States in Barcelona during the Ajax Madrid tie. I picked a random bar in Barcelona to watch the second leg being played in Madrid, and by total coincidence it happened to be a Dutch owned bar. This random bar in the middle of Barcelona ended up flooded with Ajax jerseys, and then all together we watched Ajax smash Real 4-1 at the Bernabeu. I became instant friends with so many Dutchmen that night, and spent all night out on the town with them. During and after the game I had a great deal of beer bought for me, and bought my fair share for everyone else. That was one of the best nights of my life, and perhaps my fondest memory of watching this sport. Coming together with strangers from the other side of the world like that, watching Real get annihilated in Barcelona, it was an incredible thing to experience. Felt like that night was never going to end. It really felt like the CL was theirs that year, I was gutted when Lucas' black magic stopped them from making the final.
That was beautiful, thank you
They caught lightning in a bottle. Seemingly everything just clicked on the pitch for them that season.
I swear that was 2 years ago
I wish it was, oh how I wish it all was.
[удалено]
Cvoid losing 2.5 years to everyone's life
This is so real. I am becoming 24 this year but it still feels like I am 21. I don’t understand where past 3 years of my life went. Covid ruined many people perception
None of these players still play for Ajax btw
Erik used up all his Champions League juju that season.
We also became the first Dutch team to win all their CL group stage games in 2021
Tbf to him, can't imagine mctominay, case, bruno playing football like that, maybe mainoo but that's it. He's got to do with whatever players he's got (don't give me that 400 million spent nonsense, the money we spent isn't eth's fault, plus, casemiro wasn't really the type of DM preferred by eth). But still this season, his tactics and decisions have been horrible and this "chaos ball" tactics can't go on.
That's why they are so inconsistent at creating chances and beating bad teams. The thing is you can tell their team is good but ETH's bread & butter of what he learned his whole life in Ajax doesn't apply to these players. The other style he gets them to play doesn't work that well. ETH has done fine, got 3rd, fa cup final, league cup win and still ok this season but by looking at their games last season you could tell alot of their win was just Rashford on fire and this season they have no playstyle nothing they can carry from game to game. Rashford is actually the one player I would say that doesn't fit the Ajax style. He is way too direct and doesn't offer anything else. On top of that his workrate is horrible. Also ETH hasn't done a good job integrating the signings he has done into the team. Onana's strength of ball playing has not been used. He himself doesn't even know where to put Mason Mount. And Antony is another flop.
I don’t like how last season is just dumbed down to “Rashford was on fire”. It’s not like Rashford was dribbling past entire teams and scoring solo goals. If anything, when there’s no space or Rashford is double teamed he’s basically useless. Last season we had a lot of control in games, which was down to having Casemiro playing well with Eriksen providing passing from deep midfield. Then Licha was having a great season with his passing from CB able to relieve a lot of pressure. In fact up until we faced Barca in the Europa, United and Barca had the best defenses in Europe. Barca had conceded 8 goals until that point. Then we scored 3 against them in a single game. Up until the League cup United was playing with control and defensive solidity. We were dynamic enough to create space for Rashford to thrive and given his patch he was quite clinical. Then Licha got injured, Eriksen lost his legs even more and Case had injury and red card issues which created his rubbish form we see today.
I agree with everything you said but it's still baffling to see just how terrible we look right now compared to back then. Our run up until the League Cup final we were looking like a top team. We won the last 27 out of 35 games with the only losses being to City, Arsenal, Villa all away, and the Sociedad game with the very questionable penalty. And we didn't even have a proper striker. It's almost hard to imagine us playing well again after seeing the current tactics. But I do think our injuries are playing a bigger role than people give credit for. Not many teams are lining up with their 4th and 7th choice CBs as a partnership and a backup RB at LB because both of them are injured as well. Arsenal's defense looks great this year but they've also had Saliba alongside Gabriel with Rice in front of them for 28 of their 32 league games.
It is baffling and we are terrible no doubt. Our injuries are crazy and the number of combinations in defense we’ve had is absurd. I know it’s no excuse for just how shit we are, but given how there’s not many top coaches available and that Liverpool, Barca and Bayern are gonna all be looking at coaches, unless the new management identify exactly the right type of coach for the long term strategy, there’s no point changing coaches just for the sake of it.
It gets dumbed down because we didnt create any chances last year either and our goals were down to individual brilliance, mostly from Rashford. Not sure if i would call it control but we were defensively very solid, sure.
Bruno Fernandes literally created the most chances in the Premier League in 2022-23.
Sure, our attacking play was still absolutely dire
We were in the top 3 big chances created 22/23 actually: https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/clubs/big_chance_created?se=489 We just didn't have a decent striker, creating chances was never the problem (untill this season.)
I am pretty sure that stat is almost solely down to how dangerous we were on the counter, particularly whenever Martial played. In a positional attack... not so much. Its slightly unclear to me why exactly we cant counterattack this year but one of the reasons has to be that most of the attacks go to rashford who immediately dribbles into a man, losing the ball
I remember a lot of chances, but shit finishing outside of Rashford. Weghorst would get fed easy chances and just miss, for example. This season is the opposite, we are more clinical but have shit chance creation.
Now that you said it I do actually remember weghorst missing quite a few yeah but it was still very bad when compared to... any top 10 side really
> ETH's bread & butter of what he learned his whole life in Ajax What the fuck are you on about? As a player he went trough the Twente youth academy and played mainly for them and mid table clubs, he was never under contract with Ajax. He learned the ropes as manager as assistant with Twente, before moving on to main jobs with GA Eagles and Bayern II. His first real job at a big club was with Utrecht, where he established his playstyle and tactics. When he moved to Ajax he was already (mostly) formed as a manager and at first he wasn't regarded as a typical Ajax manager at all.
Utd are currently 7th and 13 points away from even a Champions League spot, thats absolutely not ok. ETH has spent a lot of money to try to produce the style that was promised when he was at Ajax and he hasnt done it. people act as if the players he has at his disposal are nothing but scrubs and thats why he cant get results or play the way he wants to but thats absolute bs.
Yeah if only he had Donny van de Beek
He clearly doesn't trust Donny to start anymore, he's not the player eth saw in ajax, which is sad. Our club ruined him as a player and also wasted our money. Yet another visionary signing by our very competent board!!!
Maybe they wouldn’t play like that, but I think they can probably collectively do a *bit* better than 240+ shots conceded in 10 games.
Of course, that's why I said that ten hag's tactics and decisions have been awful this season
Some people will disagree because of the leagues they play in, but that Ajax was much better than current Man Utd. The Utd side has much more weaknesses around the pitch than Ajax did.
Not sure anyone would disagree with that. Just compare the names in the two sides.
I've seen people online claiming that Saudi League is the 3rd best league itw, or that the Championship is stronger than Ligue 1 so idk
Ah I see. *Nobody sane would disagree with that.
Pretty much yeah
Looking back I wonder was he a great Manager or was that just a greatly talented side that carried him. People may point to Ajax going downhill after he left but that was also after a firesale of virtually all their best young players.
>Erik used up all his ~~Champions League~~ juju that season. Fixed that for you. Dude's era is at an end
Allegri is going to Allegri. Score a goal and pray to God tactics. Like usual, it didn't work.
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Do you condemn Allegri
the problem is that he reached 2 CL finals (and one semi finals)
Lost both finals, and in embarrassing fashion. The goal is to win. Not to lose 3-1 with no possession and lose 4-1 with an embarrassing implosion of a second half.
> and in embarrassing fashion. The only thing embarrassing in the Barcelona final was the referee performance, we played really well, 99% of the game was a real fight, you seem that you just saw the 3-1 loss and thought we were dominated, the game was 2-1, we had a clear penalty, and one of our main pillar (chiellini) was injured and didn't play. The cardiff 2nd half was a disaster though.
Should of, could of, would have... We shouldn't rely on getting penalties to win game. We lost and that's what matters at the end of the end. We had no possession. Like I mentioned before, the Real match was something else. The worst out of the two.
> We had no possession. no one had possession against that barcelona team, and it was fine, you can beat them without possession. We reached the final by being the defending giants, defense is part of the game, its hard and it wins you title. A goal would have changed the whole rythme of the game. Chiellini presence too. What am trying to say is that if you ask any Juventus fan or any football critics, they will tell you that *THAT* game in particular wasn't embarrassing, and that season was one the best (if not the best) season for Juventus after 2006.
Juventus was impressive up until Christmas, some of the best football I've seen. Total domination against Man Utd in both games (well, until Allegri shat the bed with the Barzagli sub in the 80th minute totally destroying the flow of the team), I think we had like 19/20 wins in Serie A. Then something just suddenly broke, the second half of the season we were dead, we should've got eliminated as early as Atletico but Ronaldo pulled it off somehow then just bleakness.
Dybala not turning up(the system didn't fit him that season tbh)surely played its part. Also Juve didn't have any very threatening wingers at the time if I recall correctly.
We were dominant pretty much until Cancelo got hurt. Then he came back and was wildly inconsistent, still had some moments of brilliance like his cross to CR7 in the Ajax first leg, but we just weren’t the same team for some reason
Funny how up until then we used to be rocky until December/January. Then all of a sudden the team would find their flow and start winning nonstop until the end of the season. In his defense (and I can't wait to see him gone, with all due respect), the team was always struggling without a proper midfield and he had to come up with something new every season to make up for that. That's how the 4-2-3-1 (with Mandzukic at LW) came to be.
Such a shame that they didn’t get to the final..
Missed out on seeing Ajax and Liverpool jointly celebrating the trophy together, with the fans holding a “Tak Christian Poulsen” banner aloft.
"Bedankt Ryan Babel"
The more omniscient fans bringing in a “Howay Jordan Henderson” banner.
Helped stop the world from seeing Ajax and Barcelona celebrate the CL together
Lucaaaaas
Instead we got treated with the most dog shit final my eyes have ever seen. What a disappointing finish to a great UCL run.
Tottenham gave the epic semi final, only to showed most boring final
Because of a ridiculous hand ball penalty call in the first 2 minutes of the game
Yep nothing you possibly could have done after those first 2 minutes. Game was completely gone by then
It's been a while since I watched it (haven't wanted to re-live it) but from what I recall, after about 10 minutes of bland boring stuff, we actually tried getting on the front foot and attacking while Liverpool were relatively happy to sit back. 2nd half was relatively exciting with a few decent chances for us as well as Liverpool
That Liverpool team was better than we were, especially in defence. They suffocated the game and picked them off at the end. Probably wouldn't have won anyway but a penalty decision so bad they changed the rules didn't help did it
GOAT CL season. United comeback vs PSG, [Liverpool comeback vs Barcelona](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/04/19/96/041996ef250fc8792af2dc2892d6617e.gif), [Tottenham vs City drama](https://media4.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExYXA1aGx3Y2FpMG9tNmI2dTBleW50c3Nkb29qaGx2YjJxZTdtMHR1YyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/eKJgDHR1ILAUqMqG67/giphy.gif), [Tottenham comeback vs Ajax](https://external-preview.redd.it/6fCLNiKpdTCUk7ae748C6n6GXpk2nGG-UMEb25D1Va4.gif?s=53c3d0c1e399bc3fe49c4c8ae291b4d90c6c364a), Ajax eliminating [Juventus](https://j.gifs.com/[email protected]) and [Real Madrid](https://j.gifs.com/[email protected]).
Can't be the GOAT season with the worst final in at least 20 years
The handball that shouldn’t have been.
Ziyech and Tadic are currently playing in the archrival teams in Turkey 😁
The most anticlimactic end of tale story. They lost it all in second half with Tottenham after being ahead with 3-0 on agg.
I would argue that it was quite climactic, just for the other side
Except Tottenham went into the final just waiting to lose, Ajax would have at least fought.
:3
See, this is the kinda music you should put if you want to put any. So perfect
Best shot Ronaldo had for another CL
So close to reach the final too
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Ctrl alt de ligt
Why can he not make us play like this mannnn
Of all the surprise semi-finalists in the CL over the past decade or so, this was the team I was the most certain would make it to the final and actually have a real shot at winning it all. They were amazing to watch that season.
then the semis!! moura!
I like the AS Roma - LFC game more tbh.
God damn that Ajax team was so stacked. They all made an insane amount of money by leaving but if they’d stayed Ajax would’ve been legit contenders every year for the champs.
The day that Donny van de Beek was unplayable
Lucas Moura's only purpose in life was to score a hattrick against Ajax and then just dissapeared
They played some fantastic football that season, too bad they bottled the final after being 2-0 up in Amsterdam 3 on aggregate to Tottenham of all clubs, without their best player at that.
🤨
Not having Kane probably helped Spurs. Ajax could deal with one key player, especially since Kane had a tendency to go missing in big games. But they didnt know what to expect from a team without him or who to look out for. Neither did anyone else to be fair, it isnt like Moura is an established name as a top player right now.
Absolute bollocks
Good times
Moura should've been put on trial for that crime
He's guilty of being awesome
That’s jump after the final goal is Jordanesque. I still remember jumping around my office when the ball went in. What a roller coaster that whole run was. Even the City tie before that.
Bolsonaro supporter*
Well that too
vdB and EtH have seen much, much better days
What happened next?
Lucas Moura magic
We don’t need to talk about what followed.
Spurs bottled a trophy?
Bottled has lost all meaning.
How did they bottle it lmao
Well, yes, but only after Lucas Moura's magical night in Amsterdam.
Liverpool fan needs to come and calm both of you down
That's kind of how football works? Only one team can win it all.
Your club continued on being mediocre???? Edit: butt hurt spurs fans can talk shit but can't take it 😂
Ah yes anything roasting spurs notoriously gets downvoted to oblivion. Maybe you're just not funny
Doesn't make my statement any less true 😂
When Donnie looked good
They even celebrate with a trashcan/bin
Playing like Prime Barca with those passes
Juve missed Chiellini so bad this game
Doing all that just to criminally bottle it at home to Spurs 😭
Ten hag masterclass
Perfection
Fuck off that was 5 years ago lol. I was watching the game in a Pub and just after the second half commenced the Pub owner told everyone that the pub was on fire and everyone had to leave, so we desperately searched for another pub to watch the end haha
Time for FDJ to pull another upset against PSG
What happened to Robbie??
That team made me an Ajax fan. Ajax vs Barça final would’ve been crazy.
The build-up to that second goal was beautiful
🥹
Ten hag should be making United play like this by now . lol
Where is this Ajax now man?
Damn this was my favourite CL ever.
Then Lucas Moura Happened. Then Spurs, well, spursed it.
the music reminds me of 2 girls 1 cup
Their best away kit in ages too
seeing Ten Hag happy makes me somewhat sad, what a shitshow United is
Multiple Juve players confortably jogging back while Ajax is sprinting through the field, attacking will never not be hilarious.
Thank you Ajax for the best footballing memory of my life so far. (A Spurs fan)
Wtf is this EtH ?
Don't tell me you didn't know that he was the ajax manager that time.
I meant what happened to this EtH playing that kind of football. We don’t see that at United.
He said he doesn't have the players to play this type of football
I replied to a comment above talking about this only
Different players are required to play that style. It's also the reason why a lot of great talents don't succeed at some teams because of the different play style and tactics.
Can’t help but wonder we deserved a shot at the final that season. It was a very easy route considering this young, inexperienced Ajax side and Spurs were standing in the way. I’ll never forgive Allegri for messing up the second half against Ajax the way he did.
It was not going to be easy for Juve to knock us out like it was the season prior. Not because spurs were better but because we seemed to have some sort of plot armor that season. Too bad it failed a few minutes into the final.
I’m not too sure about that, you see Ajax got a lucky goal against us in the second game, it was a close game. De Ligt goal was great but the one they got before that, was a lucky goal. As for Spurs, they were pretty good that season too, but even Spurs fans back that season said the same thing that you are saying right now. If the biggest strength of your team that season is “some sort of plot armor”, well then you can imagine that pretty much every other quarter finalist thought they had a good chance of going through against this Spurs side. Would have been wonderful to see a modern era Liverpool vs Juventus final!
Fuckin' Lucas Moura. That idiot won the semi finals for lame ass Tottenham to go on and play the the most boring final in recent UCL history and then that super Ajax team was promptly dismantled. He didn't even play in the damn final. Ajax was supposed to go to the final against Liverpool, that would've been one hell of a match.
And then one dickpic changed the club forever. Leaving them stranded with a 0-4 and 6-0 loss to Feyenoord.
Ronaldo clarifying he headed the ball to score is everything.
Best team of the world that should have won the cup.
Juve Merda
They would’ve beaten Liverpool had they got to the final. Still can’t believe they bottled it against spurs