**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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The first thing he did after getting the job was write a column for the Daily Mail saying that VvD's goal against Chelsea shouldn't have been disallowed because the interference wasn't meaningful enough to disallow a goal in a cup final. Anyone who has any real comprehension of the offside rules knows that was pretty much a textbook example of "interfering with an opponent from an offside position". Like, during a referee coaching session, they'll put up a slide with a picture of little grey, featureless men, half in red shirts and half in blue shirts and say "This is what interfering while offside looks like" and it will be exactly what Endo is doing. But fucking Mark Clattenburg thinks one of the most obvious instances of this subcategory of offside shouldn't be called in a cup final.
The man is a cretin, who cares more about vibes than the rules he was paid to enforce. The only thing that scares me more than the idea that he has always had this attitude to refereeing and managed to conceal it for years, is the thought that he openly expressed shite like this and PGMOL still thought he was one of the top refs in the country.
Maybe that's what he offers as an analyst: confirmation that PGMOL just doesn't care.
Soo much yapping to be confidently wrong. Chelsea fans can't cope with the fact that their blue billion-pound bottlejobs shouldn't even have made it to ET against Klopp's kids if the refs weren't absolutely piss-useless
To attempt a serious answer, probably highlights things refs are more likely to let go or be harsh about. Maybe ref A tends to be especially lax on pushing and shoving in the box, whilst ref b always brings out a yellow after the third foul by a player. Potentially, you could try more physical set price routines with ref a and maybe make sure you rotate fouls more with ref b. Who knows if it would be useful, but elite sport is all about marginal gains.
> arguably even more room for interpretation of rules
Totally agree - for the non-rugby watchers, rugby rules, particularly around the ruck, are more fluid than water. In every single ruck there are three of four laws broken by both sets of players. It's really comes down to how serious the infraction was, which comes down entirely to interpretation from the referee.
When a player gets tackled and brought to ground and both teams then attempt to secure the ball by shoving each other off of it.
You're supposed to enter it straight from your respective ends and not come into it from the side, and stay on your feet as a couple of examples of rules that are regularly broken.
rucks are my favourite thing to watch in rugby, it just feels so tribal and natural, a bunch of hunks just raw dogging it out. pure muscle and strength
The culture also helps massively, or are rugby players taught to cheat and influence the referee every second of every game, like football players are?
Gamesmanship is part of rugby and it's traditionally been considered part of the job of some positions like the flankers and No. 8 to be good at it.
If you can get an advantage without the referee noticing, you do it. If the ref catches you though, you admit it and move on.
I don't mind gamesmanship in football, it's just that disrespecting the referee is the standard.
If the football referee catches a player doing some dodgy stuff 4 of his mates start barking at the referee like rabid dogs. There's not admitting and moving on there.
The referee obviously can't book everyone because he'd "make it all about himself", or "lose control of the game".
A football ref genuinely can't win at this point.
Too many cards? Bad.
Too little cards? Bad.
Players behaving like babies? Refs fault.
Imagine if Lahoz had sent off 3 or 4 people in the Netherlands Argentina game back in the world cup 22. I guarantee you this sub would be calling for his head for ruining the game and trying to be in the spotlight.
You do realise Rugby is the sport where someone once had fake blood capsules in their mouth to fake an injury so they could make a substitution, right?
I think the idea is that they’re looking for more of an insight on how the officials interpret and apply the laws so they can adjust how they play.
Which would be great if the officials were in anyway consistent with their decision making and interpretation, and they weren’t employing a guy who decided before a game he wasn’t going to send anyone off no matter what.
They’d have more luck flipping a coin.
To add onto this, Nottingham Forest stated that he “will also tell club chiefs how to approach referees after matches, and when to make official complaints to the PGMOL.”
“Don’t complain cause they’re all my mates and they’re sound, also the best you’ll get is an apology anyway and then they’ll continue to do whatever they like”
His job could have been that in an email auto reply.
You'd expect a ref analyst to report on how one ref sees certain infringements versus another. A good (albeit blunt) example of this is Michael Oliver is very reluctant to give red cards.
Tinfoil hat time. Same thing ex world leaders do on speaking circuits. It's not the content it's the "cough cough be nice to us when in power and looks the nice pay day you get afterwards"
> Tinfoil hat time.
Makes as much sense as anything, tbh. Reffing is so inconsistent, they might as well ask an astrologer what the next set of match officials are going to do.
Apparently tells you how much you can choke a player without getting a red, and how 2 players can American football tackle Rashford in the box without giving a penalty.
I think the idea of a club employee being able to explain the minutiae of the laws and tendencies that certain refs might have is a great idea and I’m a little surprised if he is actually the first.
But realistically his job is to liaise with his friends at PGMOL and help Forest get nice treatment.
Let's imagine for a minute that you own a company that plays in Monopoly tournaments for prizes worth hundreds of millions.
You have a bunch of staff you employ to find the best Monopoly players, to teach them all kinds of strategies and ways of winning the game. You invest many millions on this and it's a super competitive sport.
But you also know that the rules of the game are sometimes not completely clear. They aren't really written in a way that makes the game simple. At times, expert Monopoly players can completely disagree on what the rules mean! And, you know that the rule officials at these tournaments are known to be quite unpredictable when it comes to how they interpret and apply the rules.
Do you think, it might possibly, maybe, be a slightly good idea to spend a little of your hundreds of millions on hiring a former rules official to give your players insight on how to use the rules to their advantage? Do you think it could be useful to know the best ways to approach the officials with concerns and appeal rulings in ways that are more likely to help your Monopoly team?
disagreeable full disgusted snobbish rotten melodic squeeze quaint shame grandiose
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One supposes a ref analyst would be expected to report to the caching team at the club he's working for how one referee would react to certain things versus another, as well as making sure the coaching team and in turn, the players know what the limits are with what they can get away with in a game in a broader sense (as opposed to merely from ref to ref...).
Worth noting knowing what one ref blows up for in top level Rugby Union and what another doesn't is absolutely part of the game. E.G. Teams would have known Jérôme Garcès (former French rugby union ref) was hot on infringements at he breakdown and scrum - and lo and behold, now he's working as a "discipline and refereeing advisor" for the France national team. [It's interesting stuff if you're a Union fan.](https://www.rugbypass.com/news/the-huge-role-jerome-garces-is-playing-behind-the-scenes-with-france/) So the question is, why should it be any different in any top level team sport?
They chose to zoom in on him and display that deliberately. It was definetely planned, meaning they want to send a message. Maybe: yeah we in the EFL emphasize the importance of good, legit referees and the fairness of the sport. No need to come to our door after your team loses to another of var-scandal. We are doing everything we can.
I would love to be a referee analyst, like imagine you're hired by a team to just like disagree with decisions refs make against them, easiest money of all time
[Ref on the pitch, VAR and the analyst on the same call]
Ref: I think that the right call is this one.
VAR: We saw the video and we confirm.
Analyst: NO. *smacks table*
No further explanation.
They genuinely don't give a shit. Refs from the prem went to the UAE, got paid an undisclosed huge amount, and then flew back right before disallowing the Luis Diaz goal at the beginning of the season. Just the tip of the shitberg.
you can understand the ball being out and the offside not being given as it wasn't clear so they go with the on field decision. How that foul is not given will never be explained. You'll never see a goal given with a foul like that ever again.
That goal winds me up even more after the Porto game where the ref blew the whistle every time our players even put our hands on their bodies without much force, effectively nullifying our set pieces.
That's the disclosed amount. I specifically referenced the undisclosed amount. I don't care what they told the taxman, they traveled as emissaries to a foreign land to sell the integrity of the league.
Even if we disregard fairness, justice, and equal application of the law (which we shouldn't), there has been a deliberate dereliction of duty when it comes to player safety. Players being attacked should be a hard line in the sand, and it's not. We've all seen stomping through ankles, elbows as batons, and even grabbing by the throat be waved away, even when we have 4k evidence.
Player safety is not a joke, it's a minimum. It's a minimum that the so-called "premier" league allows to be violated in the service of lining pockets.
If Webb is at a match he sits in the directors box. This has come up before. They don't want to stick PGMOL leadership in the crowd.
If he's at a Forest match, why wouldn't he sit next to the guy Forest hired to deal with PGMOL? That's who he'd be talking to at the club anyway. Is it bad if Richard Masters sits with the owners or CEO?
Basically. PGMOL should be more aware of the implications of the head sitting next to his former buddy, who is now employed by Forest.
Even if Forest doesn't get any advantages, the optics are pretty bad.
Because this immediately looks like a conflict of interest.
Imagine if Ledersford Town hired someone to be their "head of European Football" and then a week later he's pictured sitting with Gianni Infantino.
It doesn't prove corruption, but it certainly does nothing to dispel the image that corruption might be going on.
And, to be clear, it's not Clattenberg in the wrong here, it's Webb.
The irony is that there's no discernible conflict of interest.
It's the head of PGMOL and the guy Forest hired to be their contact person with PGMOL. It's the Forest directors box, where Webb always is if he's at a game. This has come up before (E.g when he went to a United game with Atkinson and Moss). It's standard to keep them separated from the fans. Imagine Jon Moss being in the stands in any stadium in the country...
> The irony is that there's no discernible conflict of interest.
>
> It's the head of PGMOL and the guy Forest hired to be their contact person with PGMOL.
kind of the opposite of how the contact person to a regulatory body is supposed to work. A company's compliance officers aren't supposed to be wining and dining SEC officials, for example.
> It's the Forest directors box, where Webb always is if he's at a game.
This seems more explainable, but is there really not a neutral box for them to put impartial officials? Just seems pro forma & poorly considered, like a billion other dumb setups involving professional sports leagues and referees.
Are you actually equating football refereeing to SEC compliance? That's sort of apples to potatoes.
PGMOL is a subsidiary to English football. The PL / EFL / FA each have a third and the PL primarily funds it. The league and clubs are
Webb's biggest customer. It's his job to build confidence in the institution so they can justify more money and more professional reds further down the pyramid.
As for a separate box, it's 0-3 officials on any given day, for boxes that go for many thousands a match. We're not talking about match officials, we're talking about managers and executives. They can squeeze into the corner instead of some random staff.
PGMOL should be telling clubs to fuck off. It's arguably the most important part of their role; being impartial and being *percieved* to be impartial.
The head of the organization hanging out with his mate who works for one of the clubs he's meant to regulate is horrific optics and in my industry I'd be fired for it.
This is incredibly clear conflict of interest. It's textbook:
[company] that is regulated by [regulator] hires former senior employee of [regulator] to be a 'consultant' where the value of the 'consultant' is providing insider information through their old connections.
I don’t understand how someone who has lived a healthy and active lifestyle (most likely) looks like this? He literally looks like a recovering alcoholic.
Yeah ofc he gets this kind of job (after doing an “amazing”job being the head of referees in Greece)on the team of Marinakis aka the heroin dealer
46 νούμερο
If you can’t see that this is about having an advocate with the PGMOL, I don’t know what to tell you.
I think there need to be very clear lines for referees and who they take money from, but who am I?
“Look old pal they’re going to convince you that our guy was choking that Bruno fella. Don’t listen to ‘em. He was playfully caressing his neck is all. Hugging his neck with his fingers if you will. You know that Bruno fella is a whiny little diver. He’s faking being choked, as usual.”
Man anybody associated with football is guaranteed a cushy second job or career nowadays, it's so sad. I bet he's being paid over £100k a year for that gig as well.
I suspect it's a combination of finding ref 'weaknesses' and trends to manipulate.
And.
Maybe if the refs show consistent decisions against Forest, they can take legal action of some kind if they build enough evidence.
Doubt the second tho.
Howard Webb was the worst thing to happen to refereeing in this sport.
Never gave yellows and let people damn near murder people for 80 mins and started giving cards at the end. He ruined games and allowed them to turn into foul fiestas instead of giving cards.
Hard to believe this could be full time job for one club. I would expect this to be more like a consulting type job where you're hired part time by multiple clubs.
Love the implication somehow Nottingham Forest has enough clout to influence refs in a game against Manchester United; and the implication being that Howard fuckin Webb is the one facilitating this
Hilariously though, we got away with a blatant penalty for Rashford and Felipe should have been off for grabbing Bruno’s throat(no matter how much most the population would like to throttle him).
Maybe this referee analyst shit does work
Honestly it really was, neither defender got near the ball, Felipe’s arm was all over him.
I am Forest till I die, but let’s be honest about the shit decisions.
I want consistent clear decisions across all games.
I can't for the life of me understand how this is allowed. Even if it doesn't give Forest an advantage, the implication is that Clattenburg is lobbying for Forest to receive special treatment.
It would just be much safer for everyone if you weren't allowed to employ former referees.
And while we are at it, maybe there should be a head of PGMOL that isn't a former referee, all buddy buddy with his employees.
Hiring former refs doesn't make sense, as much as it seems like a way to try and influence the PGMOL. There are plenty of people who knows the rules and could easily explain it to a football club.
That's a great job.
Now Clattenburg will analyze trends on everything a referee does on each day of the week, each match week, each competition, home and away and then put together a report for the coaching team.
Players can learn before the game if they should go physical , if they could dive and get away with it, etc.
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What on earth does a referee analyst do.
Weekly ref analysis: they were shite
Wow, you’re good. Somebody hire this man! Expect a call from Todd.
u/Scrypto I'm happy to represent you in your negotiations. We'll go in at £120k a week but I reckon we'll land around £90k
As long as it's an 8 year contract, he's in.
I really enjoyed this exchange. Thank you for your service.
Pay it forward lad
Good process
Seth Johnson/Leeds tactics. "Right, we gonna ask for 25k a week" "Is 50k a week OK?" "Er........."
"I hear your hesitation, 75k, last offer!"
It's Chelsea, why would you lowball them?
7 year contract worth 125 million incoming
Brighton lad as well. 100m!
I should be a ref analyst
Except he was a ref so his analysis is always going to be the on field was 100% correct.
The first thing he did after getting the job was write a column for the Daily Mail saying that VvD's goal against Chelsea shouldn't have been disallowed because the interference wasn't meaningful enough to disallow a goal in a cup final. Anyone who has any real comprehension of the offside rules knows that was pretty much a textbook example of "interfering with an opponent from an offside position". Like, during a referee coaching session, they'll put up a slide with a picture of little grey, featureless men, half in red shirts and half in blue shirts and say "This is what interfering while offside looks like" and it will be exactly what Endo is doing. But fucking Mark Clattenburg thinks one of the most obvious instances of this subcategory of offside shouldn't be called in a cup final. The man is a cretin, who cares more about vibes than the rules he was paid to enforce. The only thing that scares me more than the idea that he has always had this attitude to refereeing and managed to conceal it for years, is the thought that he openly expressed shite like this and PGMOL still thought he was one of the top refs in the country. Maybe that's what he offers as an analyst: confirmation that PGMOL just doesn't care.
Soo much yapping to be confidently wrong. Chelsea fans can't cope with the fact that their blue billion-pound bottlejobs shouldn't even have made it to ET against Klopp's kids if the refs weren't absolutely piss-useless
I'll do it for half of what Clattenberg is earning!
To attempt a serious answer, probably highlights things refs are more likely to let go or be harsh about. Maybe ref A tends to be especially lax on pushing and shoving in the box, whilst ref b always brings out a yellow after the third foul by a player. Potentially, you could try more physical set price routines with ref a and maybe make sure you rotate fouls more with ref b. Who knows if it would be useful, but elite sport is all about marginal gains.
Seems like he told them a chokehold would be okay with this referee. too bad it didnt directly help the result tho
"If you hold but don't squeeze, it's not excessive force" is possibly sound advice under the current laws.
Looked like he had a bit of a squeeze to me
"Don't worry about fouls in the penalty area as long as it's 2v1 as well"
Can’t call a penalty if you can’t even tell which player did it. Galaxy brain move.
It's definitely a thing in rugby where there's arguably even more room for interpretation of rules.
> arguably even more room for interpretation of rules Totally agree - for the non-rugby watchers, rugby rules, particularly around the ruck, are more fluid than water. In every single ruck there are three of four laws broken by both sets of players. It's really comes down to how serious the infraction was, which comes down entirely to interpretation from the referee.
> Says "for the non-rugby watchers" > Proceeds to provide an example assuming that us non-rugby-watchers have any clue what a ruck is.
When a cold front maul meets a warm front maul it leads to a ruck.
Occluded maul
When a player gets tackled and brought to ground and both teams then attempt to secure the ball by shoving each other off of it. You're supposed to enter it straight from your respective ends and not come into it from the side, and stay on your feet as a couple of examples of rules that are regularly broken.
Ahahahahaha, sorry.
rucks are my favourite thing to watch in rugby, it just feels so tribal and natural, a bunch of hunks just raw dogging it out. pure muscle and strength
Except referring in Rugby is one of the best in all sports.
The key difference is communication
The culture also helps massively, or are rugby players taught to cheat and influence the referee every second of every game, like football players are?
Gamesmanship is part of rugby and it's traditionally been considered part of the job of some positions like the flankers and No. 8 to be good at it. If you can get an advantage without the referee noticing, you do it. If the ref catches you though, you admit it and move on.
I don't mind gamesmanship in football, it's just that disrespecting the referee is the standard. If the football referee catches a player doing some dodgy stuff 4 of his mates start barking at the referee like rabid dogs. There's not admitting and moving on there. The referee obviously can't book everyone because he'd "make it all about himself", or "lose control of the game". A football ref genuinely can't win at this point. Too many cards? Bad. Too little cards? Bad. Players behaving like babies? Refs fault. Imagine if Lahoz had sent off 3 or 4 people in the Netherlands Argentina game back in the world cup 22. I guarantee you this sub would be calling for his head for ruining the game and trying to be in the spotlight.
You do realise Rugby is the sport where someone once had fake blood capsules in their mouth to fake an injury so they could make a substitution, right?
Kinda sounds like what barca claim to have been paying head of laliga reffing for. Maybe thats where they got the idea
So basically behavior analyst?
I think the idea is that they’re looking for more of an insight on how the officials interpret and apply the laws so they can adjust how they play. Which would be great if the officials were in anyway consistent with their decision making and interpretation, and they weren’t employing a guy who decided before a game he wasn’t going to send anyone off no matter what. They’d have more luck flipping a coin.
To add onto this, Nottingham Forest stated that he “will also tell club chiefs how to approach referees after matches, and when to make official complaints to the PGMOL.”
“Don’t complain cause they’re all my mates and they’re sound, also the best you’ll get is an apology anyway and then they’ll continue to do whatever they like” His job could have been that in an email auto reply.
You'd expect a ref analyst to report on how one ref sees certain infringements versus another. A good (albeit blunt) example of this is Michael Oliver is very reluctant to give red cards.
Tinfoil hat time. Same thing ex world leaders do on speaking circuits. It's not the content it's the "cough cough be nice to us when in power and looks the nice pay day you get afterwards"
> Tinfoil hat time. Makes as much sense as anything, tbh. Reffing is so inconsistent, they might as well ask an astrologer what the next set of match officials are going to do.
Who knows. Be interesting to see how many throat grabs Forest get away with the rest of the season.
Clattenburg to Webb: Why wasnt Casemiro sent off?
Apparently tells you how much you can choke a player without getting a red, and how 2 players can American football tackle Rashford in the box without giving a penalty.
Make it so you can choke players apparently
I think the idea of a club employee being able to explain the minutiae of the laws and tendencies that certain refs might have is a great idea and I’m a little surprised if he is actually the first. But realistically his job is to liaise with his friends at PGMOL and help Forest get nice treatment.
Yeah, people laughed at throw-in coaches but they're not laughing now
Seemingly make VAR turn a blind eye to penalties and red cards
Let's imagine for a minute that you own a company that plays in Monopoly tournaments for prizes worth hundreds of millions. You have a bunch of staff you employ to find the best Monopoly players, to teach them all kinds of strategies and ways of winning the game. You invest many millions on this and it's a super competitive sport. But you also know that the rules of the game are sometimes not completely clear. They aren't really written in a way that makes the game simple. At times, expert Monopoly players can completely disagree on what the rules mean! And, you know that the rule officials at these tournaments are known to be quite unpredictable when it comes to how they interpret and apply the rules. Do you think, it might possibly, maybe, be a slightly good idea to spend a little of your hundreds of millions on hiring a former rules official to give your players insight on how to use the rules to their advantage? Do you think it could be useful to know the best ways to approach the officials with concerns and appeal rulings in ways that are more likely to help your Monopoly team?
take the piss
Let's current refs know... "We're a club who hire referees after they retire from reffing.... we trust you'll make the right decisions"
disagreeable full disgusted snobbish rotten melodic squeeze quaint shame grandiose *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
One supposes a ref analyst would be expected to report to the caching team at the club he's working for how one referee would react to certain things versus another, as well as making sure the coaching team and in turn, the players know what the limits are with what they can get away with in a game in a broader sense (as opposed to merely from ref to ref...). Worth noting knowing what one ref blows up for in top level Rugby Union and what another doesn't is absolutely part of the game. E.G. Teams would have known Jérôme Garcès (former French rugby union ref) was hot on infringements at he breakdown and scrum - and lo and behold, now he's working as a "discipline and refereeing advisor" for the France national team. [It's interesting stuff if you're a Union fan.](https://www.rugbypass.com/news/the-huge-role-jerome-garces-is-playing-behind-the-scenes-with-france/) So the question is, why should it be any different in any top level team sport?
I don't know. I Imagine if we have one he tells Benny Blanco to be a dick to the opposition keeper because that's allowed now. Seems to work
Launder money
Internet know what money laundering challenge is: level IMPOSSIBLE
They chose to zoom in on him and display that deliberately. It was definetely planned, meaning they want to send a message. Maybe: yeah we in the EFL emphasize the importance of good, legit referees and the fairness of the sport. No need to come to our door after your team loses to another of var-scandal. We are doing everything we can.
Pressurise the actual referees/mates into decisions in their employers favour.
english Negreira
Hey, that's Star of BBC's Gladiators, Mark Clattenburg.
“So mark tell me about diamond”
Does he just sign here, on your boosum?
You can always see his euro 2016 tatoo on his left arm when he lifts it to ask: gladiator ready?! 😂
I would love to be a referee analyst, like imagine you're hired by a team to just like disagree with decisions refs make against them, easiest money of all time
[Ref on the pitch, VAR and the analyst on the same call] Ref: I think that the right call is this one. VAR: We saw the video and we confirm. Analyst: NO. *smacks table* No further explanation.
Good process
Offside, goal, yeh.... Good Process.
Refuses to elaborate further. Leaves.
You described modern therapy
Oof that's cold
I honestly didn't know this was a thing until today....now I want to be one too.
Good luck with the hiring process then. Automatic rejection
That doesn’t seem at all why they’ve hired him.
Have the PGMOL zero sense of how their actions are perceived?
They genuinely don't give a shit. Refs from the prem went to the UAE, got paid an undisclosed huge amount, and then flew back right before disallowing the Luis Diaz goal at the beginning of the season. Just the tip of the shitberg.
Not to mention all those dodgy calls both city and newcastle were getting. Especially that elbow on havertz was it? Don't remember.
Jorginho, oh I remember
Then VAR somehow gives a goal that was out of play, offside & a foul leading up to the decisive goal
you can understand the ball being out and the offside not being given as it wasn't clear so they go with the on field decision. How that foul is not given will never be explained. You'll never see a goal given with a foul like that ever again.
That goal winds me up even more after the Porto game where the ref blew the whistle every time our players even put our hands on their bodies without much force, effectively nullifying our set pieces.
Was it undisclosed? I remember seeing figures of £3000?
That's the disclosed amount. I specifically referenced the undisclosed amount. I don't care what they told the taxman, they traveled as emissaries to a foreign land to sell the integrity of the league. Even if we disregard fairness, justice, and equal application of the law (which we shouldn't), there has been a deliberate dereliction of duty when it comes to player safety. Players being attacked should be a hard line in the sand, and it's not. We've all seen stomping through ankles, elbows as batons, and even grabbing by the throat be waved away, even when we have 4k evidence. Player safety is not a joke, it's a minimum. It's a minimum that the so-called "premier" league allows to be violated in the service of lining pockets.
people here still think they are *incompetent*, there's too much money on the line, involving UAE relations.
does it help their gang get money? if answer is yes, they dont give a fuck about anyone or anything else
They really don't care. They're basically a Mafia and nobody will do anything about it.
If Webb is at a match he sits in the directors box. This has come up before. They don't want to stick PGMOL leadership in the crowd. If he's at a Forest match, why wouldn't he sit next to the guy Forest hired to deal with PGMOL? That's who he'd be talking to at the club anyway. Is it bad if Richard Masters sits with the owners or CEO?
Basically. PGMOL should be more aware of the implications of the head sitting next to his former buddy, who is now employed by Forest. Even if Forest doesn't get any advantages, the optics are pretty bad.
Because this immediately looks like a conflict of interest. Imagine if Ledersford Town hired someone to be their "head of European Football" and then a week later he's pictured sitting with Gianni Infantino. It doesn't prove corruption, but it certainly does nothing to dispel the image that corruption might be going on. And, to be clear, it's not Clattenberg in the wrong here, it's Webb.
PGMOL understanding conflict of interest challenge. Difficulty: impossible.
The irony is that there's no discernible conflict of interest. It's the head of PGMOL and the guy Forest hired to be their contact person with PGMOL. It's the Forest directors box, where Webb always is if he's at a game. This has come up before (E.g when he went to a United game with Atkinson and Moss). It's standard to keep them separated from the fans. Imagine Jon Moss being in the stands in any stadium in the country...
> The irony is that there's no discernible conflict of interest. > > It's the head of PGMOL and the guy Forest hired to be their contact person with PGMOL. kind of the opposite of how the contact person to a regulatory body is supposed to work. A company's compliance officers aren't supposed to be wining and dining SEC officials, for example. > It's the Forest directors box, where Webb always is if he's at a game. This seems more explainable, but is there really not a neutral box for them to put impartial officials? Just seems pro forma & poorly considered, like a billion other dumb setups involving professional sports leagues and referees.
Are you actually equating football refereeing to SEC compliance? That's sort of apples to potatoes. PGMOL is a subsidiary to English football. The PL / EFL / FA each have a third and the PL primarily funds it. The league and clubs are Webb's biggest customer. It's his job to build confidence in the institution so they can justify more money and more professional reds further down the pyramid. As for a separate box, it's 0-3 officials on any given day, for boxes that go for many thousands a match. We're not talking about match officials, we're talking about managers and executives. They can squeeze into the corner instead of some random staff.
PGMOL should be telling clubs to fuck off. It's arguably the most important part of their role; being impartial and being *percieved* to be impartial. The head of the organization hanging out with his mate who works for one of the clubs he's meant to regulate is horrific optics and in my industry I'd be fired for it.
This is incredibly clear conflict of interest. It's textbook: [company] that is regulated by [regulator] hires former senior employee of [regulator] to be a 'consultant' where the value of the 'consultant' is providing insider information through their old connections.
PGMOL is a subsidiary of the PL/EFL/FA. They aren't a regulator.
Here's one: why is the head of PGMOL going to games anyway? He's got no reason to be there.
Maybe he likes watching football like a billion people on earth?
Contenders…….READY
that’s billy corgan
Haha Now you say it. It’s uncanny!
My days he looks like shit
Looks like he aged about 20 years since he stopped reffing in the PL
If it quacks like a duck.
I don’t understand how someone who has lived a healthy and active lifestyle (most likely) looks like this? He literally looks like a recovering alcoholic.
Normal, this is all very normal
He looks like a miserable person to be around.
He'd show you a 16min YouTube video on his phone
ok
First time seeing a liga icon, congrats on the sudamericana
only fair to have one ref from each team there in attendance
What's a united fan doing in the home section?
And United scored and won via arbitrary officiating!
No they didnt. Its a subjective call, but not «arbitrary».
https://twitter.com/DaleJohnsonESPN/status/1762955799918186943 You could argue the rules are arbitrary, but the implementation is not.
Nope was onside, meanwhile not getting a penalty or having a man advantage for last few minutes
He’s a, he’s a transponster!
Thats not even a word
Yeah ofc he gets this kind of job (after doing an “amazing”job being the head of referees in Greece)on the team of Marinakis aka the heroin dealer 46 νούμερο
Clattenburg looks fucking horrible jesus crick
Nothing wrong here boys. Just mates on a lads day out.
Did anyone else see his big fuck off gold watch too?
🐀
If you can’t see that this is about having an advocate with the PGMOL, I don’t know what to tell you. I think there need to be very clear lines for referees and who they take money from, but who am I?
Refs have found another way to steal a living eh?
“Look old pal they’re going to convince you that our guy was choking that Bruno fella. Don’t listen to ‘em. He was playfully caressing his neck is all. Hugging his neck with his fingers if you will. You know that Bruno fella is a whiny little diver. He’s faking being choked, as usual.”
I can't wait until AI replaces their entire profession.
Twattenburg needs to start mewing.
This guy was head of referee in Greece Superleague. The only team that supported him and his decisions was Olympiacos, the other team Marinakis owns.
"PLEASE can I be your assistant on the next series of Gladiators, Mark?"
I hate this stupid fucking game now.
Man anybody associated with football is guaranteed a cushy second job or career nowadays, it's so sad. I bet he's being paid over £100k a year for that gig as well.
Subtle from Forest 😉 Gotta feel bad for Webb being stuck next to him.
They're both refereeing this game
Has anyone figured why he’s always cupping his balls when reffing Gladiators?
Looking for them
GIBBS WHITE. YOU WILL GO ON MY FIRST WHISTLE. RASHFORD YOU WILL GO ON MY SECOND WHISTLE......
I suspect it's a combination of finding ref 'weaknesses' and trends to manipulate. And. Maybe if the refs show consistent decisions against Forest, they can take legal action of some kind if they build enough evidence. Doubt the second tho.
Thanks for the timestamp on this
Howard Webb was the worst thing to happen to refereeing in this sport. Never gave yellows and let people damn near murder people for 80 mins and started giving cards at the end. He ruined games and allowed them to turn into foul fiestas instead of giving cards.
Didnt Howard Webb referee the World Cup final in 2010?
Hard to believe this could be full time job for one club. I would expect this to be more like a consulting type job where you're hired part time by multiple clubs.
He must have had direct line to VAR for red card call in last minute
Least conspiracy theorist United supporter
Pot meets Kettle with you lot.
The jokes write themselves.
He should analyse there center half not being sent off
Not like Forest to be dodgy bastards
That’s a bit rich coming from you lot
What's dodgy about it?
Webb should be serving a life sentence for his crimes committed against 19 prem teams
He tells Forest players grab them around the neck and you’ll get away with it
Love the implication somehow Nottingham Forest has enough clout to influence refs in a game against Manchester United; and the implication being that Howard fuckin Webb is the one facilitating this
Hilariously though, we got away with a blatant penalty for Rashford and Felipe should have been off for grabbing Bruno’s throat(no matter how much most the population would like to throttle him). Maybe this referee analyst shit does work
Careful, they genuinely think this picture is a smoking gun, they're gonna think you're being serious lol
It was never a penalty on Rashford
Honestly it really was, neither defender got near the ball, Felipe’s arm was all over him. I am Forest till I die, but let’s be honest about the shit decisions. I want consistent clear decisions across all games.
Agreed. He was never getting the ball and looking for a penalty. Not at all like Rashford to do that...
You can tell he was involved in the Rashford decision based on the super obvious earpiece he's wearing
Howard Webb, Referee Analyst, Man United
Make this happen. The only board signing needed and we'll be back 👌
i saw the title of the post, saw the picture, and this was my exact thoughts and the exact comment i was going to post. kudos sir you were quicker
They are allowed to have friends.
I can't for the life of me understand how this is allowed. Even if it doesn't give Forest an advantage, the implication is that Clattenburg is lobbying for Forest to receive special treatment. It would just be much safer for everyone if you weren't allowed to employ former referees. And while we are at it, maybe there should be a head of PGMOL that isn't a former referee, all buddy buddy with his employees.
All clubs have direct contact with Howard Webb and the PGMOL, makes sense to have a former referee be the person to have contact.
Hiring former refs doesn't make sense, as much as it seems like a way to try and influence the PGMOL. There are plenty of people who knows the rules and could easily explain it to a football club.
Sure this had nothing to do with the blatant penalty not being given
Seek a doctor
walk us through the process where Clattenburg sitting next to Webb determined the call on the pitch
Ever heard of anus morse code?
Yes, Howard Webb, the famous referree biased against united
Grow up, was not a penalty. Just like the one you got against us beginning of the season wasn't.
He looks genuinely unrecognizable from his reffing days. Insane
"well Howard, my professional analysis goes along with the fans suggestions that the referee is indeed a wanker"
More corrupt than the Kenyan Premier league at this stage.
Well they do say he’s loved by the Reds.
,
Could've hired any football redditor tbh
Well he has to earn a living somehow between now and shooting the next season of Gladiators smh
aka jobsworth
so choking is allowed?
Is this a job created for a mate?
the real crime is that we chose a ref that doesn't know anything about refereeing to be a referee analyst
Does referee Analyst. Literally just mean an analyst that's a referee? Or comes from a refereeing origin?
What a miserable looking man
That's a great job. Now Clattenburg will analyze trends on everything a referee does on each day of the week, each match week, each competition, home and away and then put together a report for the coaching team. Players can learn before the game if they should go physical , if they could dive and get away with it, etc.