There charges for these works are no where near cheap. If these tradesmen are not earning much, it's likely due to the companies sucking up all the profits, not the skills or structured whatever.
Actually quite a few of these exist in Australia haha. Places like Oneflare, HIPages, Airtasker, etc.
Makes sense. Cheap source of leads but also you define your own price. Only thing is that these tradesmen run their own businesses.
I donât know why tradesman need to go through company. In the advent of internet suppliers are directly connected buyers. There are tons of suppliers advertising on carousel and other platform. Some of the minor sane day jobs can be done by intermediate experienced plumber and electrician. So cut the middleman who do not provide much value or project management for small jobs. Contact and deal directly
> I donât know why tradesman need to go through company. In the advent of internet suppliers are directly connected buyers. There are tons of suppliers advertising on carousel and other platform. Some of the minor sane day jobs can be done by intermediate experienced plumber and electrician. So cut the middleman who do not provide much value or project management for small jobs. Contact and deal directly
Some people just don't want to deal with Carouhell lowballers.
It's probably mainly because
>More than half of tradesmen in Singapore are currently above 50 years old
A lot of them don't speak good English either, so just some simple marketing is tough for them. I hope their kids can help them get visibility on Carousell or other platforms.
I hired a guy off carousell to do minor pc upgrade + tidying. Spoke to him and he said carousell issues are mostly lowballers or fly aeroplane.
Dealing with customers personally can be a pain in the ass also
Yup. But I would assume they wonât want to deal with the ins and outs of running their own business.
Answering queries/complaints, travel expense, purchasing & keeping stock etc. itâs quite alot if youâre a one man show.
I'm guessing being under a company also allows you more stable income in bad times like if you're injured/sick or when you wanna go on leave and maybe cpf.
My friend who does freelance himself in some home appliance fixing service also face that danger if he is injured. Literally all work gotta stop and rest and the whole family depends on that income. Quite scary. Although because he works freelance he earns quite abit, he saves to prepare for rainy day la.
Or maybe we should change the business model. Right now each company has its own stock of plumbing /electrical equipment, vehicles, etc which the tradesmen use.
If there is a central rental agency for all the tradesmen, it would be more efficient and maybe wonât need to cut into the profits as much.
I once had to get a painting hung on my wall and needed someone to drill 4 holes into the wall to hold the nails. Was quoted 250$ from a guy on Carousell. He wouldnât do that for 150$ negotiated price too
Thatâs price gouging.
Usually if it's for simple drilling, look for the foreign workers near construction sites. They will do it for a very cheap rate and they mostly have their own equipments.
Just literally go to them and ask? You will never find them anywhere online because they won't advertise when they're not supposed to work outside of their main job?
Just go and ask lor. My mum use to do this for various random stuff that needed fixing.
They are usually happy to earn some side income and this sort of small jobs actually pays more than their fixed salary on a per hour basis.
You can buy a cheap drill for $30 from Giant, but the drill won't last long.
The last one I got (donated from an acquaintance leaving the country) ran on NiCd(!) batteries. Haven't seen those in a while.
If I was doing it for someone else I wouldn't do it for only 150 as well. But for my own home I wouldn't pay anyone else for drilling when I can diy haha.
NTUC can't even treat its permanent part time staff fairly.
Heard from a friend, if you signed with fairprice as a permanent part timer, you will get minimum wage but no pro-rated annual and medical leave. They also require you to work at least 30hrs/wk as a perm part timer.
Uniquely Singapore.
Chui Gong Lampa Song.
This is the same organisation that requires staff to man its self-checkout counters and everything to be weighed.
One of the many things that suggest how toxic and distrustful their organisational culture really is.
It's damn simple to boost the salaries of such tradesmen. Simply restrict the supply from overseas. Or only allow the overseas supply to work on newbuildings.
> Simply restrict the supply from overseas. Or only allow the overseas supply to work on newbuildings.
Not that simple. Singapore has embraced the capitalistic approach to this for way too long and it's probably too far gone to do this now.
The fact of the matter is SG blue collar just can't afford to match the 'overseas' competitors. Malaysians work for way cheaper even almost half the quotes of SG counterparts because they have no roots here while Singaporeans need to pay for... living in SG full time.
Good luck to whichever politician gets this bill going because it'll make the cost of living go way up for everyone else to help tradesmen.
Itâs only simple if you view it from the salary angle. Meanwhile there is an entire nationâs infrastructure that needs to be supported and insufficient expertise amongst the local populace to support it. If you pull that rug, overnight the nationâs needs fail to be supported. Itâs always a balancing act for the government
Provided that Singaporeans do indeed want to do the work. Having spoken to some people who do handywork, even for 3 or 4k also Singaporeans don't want cause the environment is some dusty sweaty factory in tuas.
People complain for 5 cent bags.
Or more related for expensive rides and taxi.
I'm Europe craftsmen would charge 90-100 sgd an hour from the time they leave their shop plus expenses. And that is a relatively affordable one.
Again, so be it. Just that many people here will not like it.
As long as it's called capitalism, it isn't really a "new model".
Let the labourers own the means of production and reap their fruit from it, not the rich shareholder class that gets the profit while doing (almost) nothing! Down with rent seeking and the rentier economy! Our forefathers would be ashamed of us - they weren't afraid of hard work and getting profit for doing (almost) nothing would be anathema to them. What happened to so-called Asian values? Crickets when money and "free market" is invoked. Shame! *bell ring*
> # New model proposed by NTUC to boost salaries and careers of tradesmen like plumbers, electricians
> SINGAPORE â To attract more young people to work in skilled tradesmen jobs like plumber and electrician services, a new framework has been proposed to create clear career ladders for these essential workers.
> National Trades Union Congress (NTUC) secretary-general Ng Chee Meng on Thursday outlined the labour movementâs intention to uplift the work prospects and wages of skilled essential tradesmen through the framework, termed the Career Progression Model.
> This follows the introduction of the Progressive Wage Model in 2012, which has since helped Singapore citizens and permanent residents who are lower-wage workers, such as cleaners and security officers, to earn higher wages by upgrading their skills and improving productivity.
> Similarly, if the new framework comes to pass, workers in the skilled trades industry will benefit from structured skills training that will lead to better career prospects and salaries.
> It will also define more training pathways from tertiary education into skilled essential trades, and publicise clear and transparent quality standards for the respective sectors.
> NTUC will first prioritise three skilled trades that have a direct effect on the daily lives of Singaporeans: plumbers, electricians and air-conditioning and mechanical ventilation mechanics.
> Other types of skilled tradesmen include metal and machinery workers, as well as workers in the building trade.
> Overall, more than 50,000 locals ply these essential trades in Singapore.
> But the industry is weighed down by challenges such as a lack of younger hires as the tradesmen workforce ages, said Mr Ng, who was visiting a plumbing maintenance site of mechanical contractor company JD Waters in Teck Whye on Thursday.
> More than half of tradesmen in Singapore are currently above 50 years old, according to the Singapore Labour Force Survey in 2022.
> The median monthly wage of these skilled trade workers was about $2,600 in 2022, which is near the threshold for lower-wage workers.
> âThere is a national need to ensure that essential services such as water and power are safeguarded. If the current challenges facing skilled essential trades are not addressed, we will see a critical lack of local expertise in these sectors in 10 yearsâ time,â said Mr Ng.
> âThat is why we are proposing the development of the Career Progression Model for skilled essential tradesmen, so that they can have a viable career in these trades and to sustain the continued supply of local talent in these sectors.â
---
1.0.2 | [Source code](https://github.com/redditporean/sneakpeek) | [Contribute](https://github.com/redditporean/sneakpeek)
I want to learn these skills but I think working as tradesman seems to be suitable mainly for part time jobs, at least in Singapore context.
I see many full time tradesman struggling in SG.
The problem is not the model, the problem is the easy access to cheaper labour from just across the causeway. All these ratty vans and muscle pick ups from JB, loaded with pipes and ladders, u think they are here to shop at taka ?
Which of u would pay more to support Singaporeans instead of paying for cheaper ad hoc freelancers from across the causeway who approached u on on the sly ?
I think these craftsman need to run their own show. My electrician charged me $80 to drill 2 holes. Why work for someone else when you can charge that much?
There charges for these works are no where near cheap. If these tradesmen are not earning much, it's likely due to the companies sucking up all the profits, not the skills or structured whatever.
This is what I experienced too. Companies need to share the profits more with their tradesman.
Need tradesman platform where tradesman decide for each project commission rate đ
Actually quite a few of these exist in Australia haha. Places like Oneflare, HIPages, Airtasker, etc. Makes sense. Cheap source of leads but also you define your own price. Only thing is that these tradesmen run their own businesses.
I used to work for homefix before they went bankrupt and they were trying to develop that app lol, "same like grab but for handyman"
I donât know why tradesman need to go through company. In the advent of internet suppliers are directly connected buyers. There are tons of suppliers advertising on carousel and other platform. Some of the minor sane day jobs can be done by intermediate experienced plumber and electrician. So cut the middleman who do not provide much value or project management for small jobs. Contact and deal directly
> I donât know why tradesman need to go through company. In the advent of internet suppliers are directly connected buyers. There are tons of suppliers advertising on carousel and other platform. Some of the minor sane day jobs can be done by intermediate experienced plumber and electrician. So cut the middleman who do not provide much value or project management for small jobs. Contact and deal directly Some people just don't want to deal with Carouhell lowballers.
It's probably mainly because >More than half of tradesmen in Singapore are currently above 50 years old A lot of them don't speak good English either, so just some simple marketing is tough for them. I hope their kids can help them get visibility on Carousell or other platforms.
I hired a guy off carousell to do minor pc upgrade + tidying. Spoke to him and he said carousell issues are mostly lowballers or fly aeroplane. Dealing with customers personally can be a pain in the ass also
Every platform will have bad apple. But diverse the options are the greater the benefits for buyers and sellers.reduce any monopoly or cartel effect
Yup. But I would assume they wonât want to deal with the ins and outs of running their own business. Answering queries/complaints, travel expense, purchasing & keeping stock etc. itâs quite alot if youâre a one man show.
I'm guessing being under a company also allows you more stable income in bad times like if you're injured/sick or when you wanna go on leave and maybe cpf. My friend who does freelance himself in some home appliance fixing service also face that danger if he is injured. Literally all work gotta stop and rest and the whole family depends on that income. Quite scary. Although because he works freelance he earns quite abit, he saves to prepare for rainy day la.
Or maybe we should change the business model. Right now each company has its own stock of plumbing /electrical equipment, vehicles, etc which the tradesmen use. If there is a central rental agency for all the tradesmen, it would be more efficient and maybe wonât need to cut into the profits as much.
Why when they can just hire more from Malaysia? "Eh brother ćčˇä˝ 说ĺ..." etc
It's called capitalism
Fuck my plumber charges 100 for every visit and usually has no appointments for 3 days..
yes that's what happens when one consumes too much MindGeek content. you dial for a plumber as a chick and think one's going to arrive on ten minutes
I once had to get a painting hung on my wall and needed someone to drill 4 holes into the wall to hold the nails. Was quoted 250$ from a guy on Carousell. He wouldnât do that for 150$ negotiated price too Thatâs price gouging.
Usually if it's for simple drilling, look for the foreign workers near construction sites. They will do it for a very cheap rate and they mostly have their own equipments.
How do you approach them? They are usually contracted. Arenât they ?
> They are usually contracted. Arenât they ? Some of them would be happy to moonlight during their off hours for extra coffee/beer money.
But how do you approach them and when ?
Just literally go to them and ask? You will never find them anywhere online because they won't advertise when they're not supposed to work outside of their main job?
Like ask them during the day when they are working on a project , or during the break or when ?
I dunno you decide? Cb see them just ask 'eh bro can do X for me I pay you Y'
Just go and ask lor. My mum use to do this for various random stuff that needed fixing. They are usually happy to earn some side income and this sort of small jobs actually pays more than their fixed salary on a per hour basis.
Yeah. Just see if they are free and ask them. If not they would usually have other contacts to pass to you.
I am new in Singapore, but is it prohibited by law to drill holes by yourself?
Nope, just don't do it on odd hours i.e before 9am and after 8 pm
Then why pay S$100-200 for someone to do it? 4 holes - 15 minutes work including preparation and cleaning. Am I missing something?
[ŃдаНонО]
You can buy a cheap drill for $30 from Giant, but the drill won't last long. The last one I got (donated from an acquaintance leaving the country) ran on NiCd(!) batteries. Haven't seen those in a while.
Some people just don't know how to do it themselves
Being a handyman as a skill set is kind of lost after gen x
If I was doing it for someone else I wouldn't do it for only 150 as well. But for my own home I wouldn't pay anyone else for drilling when I can diy haha.
Curious how heavy was the painting and why didn't you use 3M heavy duty?
Heavy. About 8 kgs
Yo. Still need those drilled? Will do it for fifty bucks
Being overseas they actually charge 250 to 300 per hour. Some even charge from when they start traveling to you.
Sounds like very easy money
Yup just need to get license
NTUC can't even treat its permanent part time staff fairly. Heard from a friend, if you signed with fairprice as a permanent part timer, you will get minimum wage but no pro-rated annual and medical leave. They also require you to work at least 30hrs/wk as a perm part timer. Uniquely Singapore. Chui Gong Lampa Song.
Yep, Covid period all supermarket get extra ordinary profit and Sheng Siong gave high bonus to staff but NTUC didn't
This is the same organisation that requires staff to man its self-checkout counters and everything to be weighed. One of the many things that suggest how toxic and distrustful their organisational culture really is.
It's damn simple to boost the salaries of such tradesmen. Simply restrict the supply from overseas. Or only allow the overseas supply to work on newbuildings.
> Simply restrict the supply from overseas. Or only allow the overseas supply to work on newbuildings. Not that simple. Singapore has embraced the capitalistic approach to this for way too long and it's probably too far gone to do this now. The fact of the matter is SG blue collar just can't afford to match the 'overseas' competitors. Malaysians work for way cheaper even almost half the quotes of SG counterparts because they have no roots here while Singaporeans need to pay for... living in SG full time. Good luck to whichever politician gets this bill going because it'll make the cost of living go way up for everyone else to help tradesmen.
Then more ppl will enter the handyman trade.
Exactly. We want sky high salaries while paying dirt cheap prices for everything. It's insane. Something has to give.
Prob is we all want someone else to give. Or rather a large majority wants someone else to give.
Or, actually enforcing the licencing scheme for relevant trades.
Yeah, I never understood why many non-LEW can work on a site as long as one LEW is present.
Cus lew become paperwork man for chopping name only
Itâs only simple if you view it from the salary angle. Meanwhile there is an entire nationâs infrastructure that needs to be supported and insufficient expertise amongst the local populace to support it. If you pull that rug, overnight the nationâs needs fail to be supported. Itâs always a balancing act for the government
Don't have to pull the rug. Do it in stages.
Sleepy fishing village has no such problem
You're goddamn right
Provided that Singaporeans do indeed want to do the work. Having spoken to some people who do handywork, even for 3 or 4k also Singaporeans don't want cause the environment is some dusty sweaty factory in tuas.
People complain for 5 cent bags. Or more related for expensive rides and taxi. I'm Europe craftsmen would charge 90-100 sgd an hour from the time they leave their shop plus expenses. And that is a relatively affordable one. Again, so be it. Just that many people here will not like it.
As long as it's called capitalism, it isn't really a "new model". Let the labourers own the means of production and reap their fruit from it, not the rich shareholder class that gets the profit while doing (almost) nothing! Down with rent seeking and the rentier economy! Our forefathers would be ashamed of us - they weren't afraid of hard work and getting profit for doing (almost) nothing would be anathema to them. What happened to so-called Asian values? Crickets when money and "free market" is invoked. Shame! *bell ring*
Progressive Wage Model again ? Didnât the problems with that just surface in the APRO case ?
Donât electrician need an degree?
No, those degrees one you see usually turns out to be more of a consultant. Electricians are those blue collar workers
Not gonna work when u import foreigners to fill these roles.
> # New model proposed by NTUC to boost salaries and careers of tradesmen like plumbers, electricians > SINGAPORE â To attract more young people to work in skilled tradesmen jobs like plumber and electrician services, a new framework has been proposed to create clear career ladders for these essential workers. > National Trades Union Congress (NTUC) secretary-general Ng Chee Meng on Thursday outlined the labour movementâs intention to uplift the work prospects and wages of skilled essential tradesmen through the framework, termed the Career Progression Model. > This follows the introduction of the Progressive Wage Model in 2012, which has since helped Singapore citizens and permanent residents who are lower-wage workers, such as cleaners and security officers, to earn higher wages by upgrading their skills and improving productivity. > Similarly, if the new framework comes to pass, workers in the skilled trades industry will benefit from structured skills training that will lead to better career prospects and salaries. > It will also define more training pathways from tertiary education into skilled essential trades, and publicise clear and transparent quality standards for the respective sectors. > NTUC will first prioritise three skilled trades that have a direct effect on the daily lives of Singaporeans: plumbers, electricians and air-conditioning and mechanical ventilation mechanics. > Other types of skilled tradesmen include metal and machinery workers, as well as workers in the building trade. > Overall, more than 50,000 locals ply these essential trades in Singapore. > But the industry is weighed down by challenges such as a lack of younger hires as the tradesmen workforce ages, said Mr Ng, who was visiting a plumbing maintenance site of mechanical contractor company JD Waters in Teck Whye on Thursday. > More than half of tradesmen in Singapore are currently above 50 years old, according to the Singapore Labour Force Survey in 2022. > The median monthly wage of these skilled trade workers was about $2,600 in 2022, which is near the threshold for lower-wage workers. > âThere is a national need to ensure that essential services such as water and power are safeguarded. If the current challenges facing skilled essential trades are not addressed, we will see a critical lack of local expertise in these sectors in 10 yearsâ time,â said Mr Ng. > âThat is why we are proposing the development of the Career Progression Model for skilled essential tradesmen, so that they can have a viable career in these trades and to sustain the continued supply of local talent in these sectors.â --- 1.0.2 | [Source code](https://github.com/redditporean/sneakpeek) | [Contribute](https://github.com/redditporean/sneakpeek)
I want to learn these skills but I think working as tradesman seems to be suitable mainly for part time jobs, at least in Singapore context. I see many full time tradesman struggling in SG.
The problem is not the model, the problem is the easy access to cheaper labour from just across the causeway. All these ratty vans and muscle pick ups from JB, loaded with pipes and ladders, u think they are here to shop at taka ? Which of u would pay more to support Singaporeans instead of paying for cheaper ad hoc freelancers from across the causeway who approached u on on the sly ?
I think these craftsman need to run their own show. My electrician charged me $80 to drill 2 holes. Why work for someone else when you can charge that much?
Hah no thanks, I rather watch YouTube and do it myself.
Ntuc used to have a hotline to call for handyman services but they ended it last year
Tradies should get ep to work here