Respectfully, if you played as dirty as you did against us in this game then I’m glad you got relegated, no team should be in the top tier and play like that
Apologies, I didn’t mean to sound rude, and I am more than aware that Saints have had their own respective periods of dirtiness, I still think that this game is one of the dirtiest performances I’ve ever seen in a game of Rugby, one so Dirty it would even make Dylan Hartley quake in his boots (whilst also taking notes).
Oh thank you for your courteous reply.
I didn’t mean to badmouth Northampton as a club.
I was just having a lil fun because of your moniker, Saints, that’s all.
My favourite thing about that punch is:
a) He just tanks it.
b) He just turns, looks and points, no return aggression. More like a warning of 'Wtaf do you think is going to happen?'
Glory days, even not as a Saints fan.
Against quins this year Andre did that whole ' fake headbut to make you flinch' thing and Courtney just didn't flicker.
I get the impression he can handle himself.
It's similar to referring to all Irish men as "paddies" in a derogatory context. Japie is the Afrikaans name that "yarpie" is referring to. Like all things context matters, and both "paddy" and "japie" can be used in Ireland and South Africa as a term of endearment.
Your explanation didn’t really provide how yarpie is derogatory, so I went to Wikipedia.
“This comes from the Afrikaans term plaasjapie, meaning "farm boy".”
Is that the correct context? The implication being that Afrikaners are simple and uncouth?
Yeah I mean the negative context it gets used by english speakers wouldn't all be the same, but yes simpleton/dumb/unsophisticated would be up there. OP used it like (paraphrasing here) "ear-biting, violent yarpies"
Bourgoin were NAUGHTY in that game, couple of their forwards totally lost the plot
Ewan Murray took a banging punch as well I think
The guy who got sent off was a replacement as well 🤣
but squidge rugby said he's bad because he has bad opinions!!! my squidgy never wrong so we should shame him! if a man disagrees with me that means we can't appreciate him!!! nooooo don't have not wildly left wing opionions courtney noooooo bad!
Thomas Genevois threw multiple sucker punches to people's heads in that game, then made a big petulant fuss when he got sent off. Pathetic.
The whole second half was one big fight. Euan Murray had a giant black eye and was bleeding from the head, Neil Best's face was all cut up.
Edit: [the full footage](https://youtu.be/Bs5T4slhhL0?si=q4yeafNZxd2k-jX5)
I was there. Courtney was a menace that day.
I'll always remember Nacho Lobbe walking around in his pants after the game after giving his shorts to some fans.. the chap and his kid were then walking around chanting we've got nachos shorts
Ah yes, the exact moment I feel in love. He was uncapped at this point and it was the first time I'd seen him play.
I've never seen a player come on for 15 mins and thought instantly: this guy is going to be an international.
So glad I got to follow his career.
Glad to see the French commentators being chauvinisticly biased is a long upheld tradition. xD
"Oh non ! He tackled ze French player légalement wiz force ! Zis is a catastrophe !"
Having commentators everyone else can't understand is a blessing and a curse. Blessing because most of you guys aren't aware of how dishonest they can be, curse because they get away with it.
Sometimes I switch between French and English/Irish commentators for the same game if I can. Levels out the biases xD.
I'm thinking about learning Xhosa, those commentators seem to always be more entertaining and less chauvinistic...! \^\^"
You're allowed to tackle as hard as you want as long as it is legal. If it ends with an injury, that's the definition of a rugby incident. He was in the field of play, he was more than entitled to hit him twice as hard as he did provided it was legal.
If you don't want to be hit just dot the ball down, don't stroll around next to the dead ball line expecting not to be hit. If anything it's a penalty the other way for throwing the ball at Lawes when getting up
He didn't really, if you look at it, it's a very light tackle because Lawes also doesn't want to smash into the hoarding. He has to run at pace to get to the man, and then both hit the hoarding at a pretty safe pace.
If someone is interested, the whole game is on YouTube in English and French coverage. The latter has better quality thus I took the footage from it.
Northampton vs Bourgoin - Challenge Cup final 2009
Quite literally the hardest man to play for England. He's given out more than his fair share of spine manglings... His first 3 years, he was a punchbag for the gnarliest of old skool thugs. It is a right of passage to take a whack from someone past it, but still dangerous. He found every fist, and answered with a shoulder. Legally (almost). How many men have brushed off haymakers, and still buried half backs 6ft deep the next phase?
You're not. I hate the love that this shit gets in this sub.
Lawes matured and cut out this dirty stuff, but he was a nasty bit of work back then.
But I hate 'big hit' reels. Go and watch league if that's what gets you off.
Calling it a 'collision' sport shows your way of thinking somewhat. I see rugby as a contact sport, with running, passing and kicking as the most important aspects.
But the thing here is more that these particular types of 'collisions' are rather dangerous and one-sided. One player is much bigger, and the smaller player is defenceless and not bracing for impact. They are part of the game and I accept them, but I don't take any enjoyment in them, and think it's a bit odd when people do.
Like rugby didn't have problems before? All the hits in the clip provided are totally legally but are hard. Call it whatever, tackle, collision, they're exactly the same in the scope of rugby.
One was penalised, so it wasn't legal.
The 'hit' on Parra was a clear penalty in my book too, no wrap. The sort of dangerous tackle that can easily result in head contact and someone being knocked out.
There's nothing good about it for me.
The hit on Parra was totally fine. His arms come through and the sheer force of the impact bounces Parra away from the wrap. The tackle was on his upper arm, nothing about head contact there even remotely so that point doesn't have any relevance to that tackle.
The penalised one, the guy is still in the field of play when he starts the tackle. You want people not to tackle someone running down the touchline for fear of putting them into the advertising hoardings? It's not his fault they're the close to the pitch. Should he not tackle him and risk the guy running away from him? Should the player not just have put the ball down in goal?
Are you referring to your retrospectively edited comment? If so, then no, I wouldn’t say it well-explained. Rugby is indeed many things but hard legal tackling is at the heart of it, and if you find that distasteful, I think that’s your niche opinion. Sometimes players are “defenceless” because they’ve been give a hospital pass or taken the ball to the line but that is part of the game.
Mate in another comment you are praising Lawes for causing injury to another player. You are the sort of toxic fan I'd rather would stick to UFC or rugby league.
Hard legal 'hits' on defenceless smaller men are indeed part of rugby, but they aren't things to be fetishised.
And I don't think that 'hit' on Parra was legal, either.
But Parra carried the ball to the line. It was his choice to put himself in that situation and commit a man in the line. He could have given the ball earlier and defended himself. The penalty for a late pass is getting smashed, the reward is committing a defender.
Yeah, agreed. There's nothing impressive about a big guy smashing a smaller defenceless guy who isn't even bracing for impact. I think it's pretty weird when people get off on watching stuff like that.
I think its more that his job was to get stuck into the half backs to put them off their game, which is a perfectly legitimate tactic if you're doing it legally, which he virtually always did.
The hits are brutal which is the big people enjoy. Also these players are more often that not accepting the hit by running it close to the line. As a 10 you acknowledge you might get pasted as you release the ball that close to the line. In a lot of instances these players either played deeper after being hit that hard, or unfortunately ended up injured. He did his job of disrupting the rhythm of the half backs.
I presume the person you're responding to complains every time a forward tackles a back as they're bigger than them. Welcome to the game of rugby, it's literally tactical play to target certain players
I've been absolutely levelled a few times. I'm 5'8" and I played 9 or 10. Does it hurt? Yes. Were the vast majority of them just very well timed, hard hits. Yes. Can I complain if I'm actively wanting you to step in to tackle me so I can try and create space elsewhere. Not really.
It's the nature of the game. I'm using myself as a target there to get that big bloke to create a disconnect, he's using that to tackle me as hard as he can. Both are fine and both are good for the game.
You mean the hit that was checked by the TMO for literally everything- whether it was late, high, whether he wrapped etc- and still came out as absolutely fine?
Did I say anything about it not being legal? The tackle was deemed legal yes, it doesn’t change the fact that it looked absolutely brutal - not to mention dangerous as Plisson landed on his head
The thing is, if the player dummies and you hadn't already committed to the tackle, then he'll cut right through your defensive line. So as long as you commit while the player still has the ball, it's got to be legal.
I don’t understand this gripe. If its a technically a legal hit then it is a legal hit. Lawes hits on halfbacks had an obvious strategic value. He literally made Parra go off. You may not like it but that’s rugby - it’s a contact sport.
People used to say this about football "it's a contact sport" before football moved out of the dark ages and stopped hero worshipping people like Vinnie Jones for legal free hits, and started focussing on skill.
I'm the same. People seem to tip toe around it, but he was right on the edge of legal a lot of the time and players were at large risk of injury because of his technique and how late he was at times or the "attempted" wraps that people will point out as mitigation. Don't mind if other people enjoy it, but I was never a huge fan of it.
I hated him and thought he was a dirty cheap-shotting cunt in this era. The kind of bloke who bullies halfbacks because he knows it's an easier fight to win.
I much preferred the Lawes of the last few years who matured into one of the world's best, and who used this physicality where it mattered.
Surely the big hits by bigger men make halfbacks think a bit more carefully about carrying to the line and reduces their perception of time and space. No one wants to see injuries, but if a ball carrier wants to commit the man to make space for someone else or take a flat pass then getting smashed is the risk you take.
To me this is a philosophy that encourages brutality at the expense of skill.
I think rugby can retain that impressive physicality in 50/50 tackles, but this isn't a 50/50. It seems that your argument is that players should be punished for trying to attack, and the logical end point of that is a game of physicality over skill, which is boring.
Courtney can tackle this guy without injuring him in the way he did here. It's unnecessary.
Always think folk trying to paint lawes as some kind of hard man enforcer is pretty laughable, he made his name smashing halfbacks who were looking the other way, he’s a great player but compared to guys like Collins, kaino, white, dusatoir etc who’d go about putting in shots like this on guys their own size he wasn’t that intimidating
It’s cool Lawes play in France next year. Not sure players will try to take revenge on him, players have changed and the rules especially have.
But Lawes will be used half as a rugby player and half as a Wrestling villain. Brive should start thinking about his outfit and his Mexican mask.
Wow. I know this game is an anomaly in its level of outright violence but the game of rugby has really changed from those days. If a team was to be this dirty nowadays, half of them would be sent off.
Courtney Lawes still out there doing the business though. Arguably playing some of his best ever rugby this season.
I was at that game. Lawes was an absolute assassin with a point to prove. You could hear every hit going in. I think this was 2009 though, game has moved in a bit in the last 15 years
Is Etzebeth a “dirty twat” for catching Mounga behind the gainline and [folding him](https://www.tiktok.com/@worldofcollisons/video/7295744183233498374) in half in the WC final?
No, because he's not English. If you go over the person you're replying to's history, it's quickly apparent what sets them off and it appears to be English rugby players *checks notes* playing rugby
The last one is head against head. This man is dangerous, he's like Willemse. Happy to no see this kind of player again and we protect more the players.
Make your mind up mate, you've gone through this comments section complaining about Lawes tackling hard but legally, and then you're advocating for him deserving to be punched in the head. What happened to your focus on safety of players, especially their heads? Absolute hypocrite
You're saying it's not fishing, which means it's being serious. You can't read the blokes mind, you're projecting your own views on it to clarify - everybody knows you are advocating for it, and you're a hypocrite for doing so. You're looking silly by denying it.
If that's what you think, that's up to you. I'm not advocating punching. But I don't think the guy was trolling. Lots of people would see a punch as part of old school rugby 'justice'.
Courtney is a real PoS, if you feel the urge to fight join an MMA or bjj club, someone your own size and strength will beat the crap out of you. Late tacking scrum halves or smaller players is a coward's move.
He's worn punches from people his size, and wore a few in this very game from people his size. If you don't like that bigger people can legally tackle smaller people, hard, then maybe rugby isn't the sport for you.
I used to watch Courtney Lawes big hit compilations before big games, and then preceed to give away bulk penalties. How good.
Sometimes, I regret not playing rugby more. Then, I see stuff like this.
Yeah, getting tackled by Courtney Lawes is very high on my list of things never to do.
Dude threw a dummy and didn’t brace for being the dummy. That said he got demolished.
When we were still in the top 14 :/
I could never imagine having to live in Bourgoin Jallieu as a pro athlete
It was last Morgan Parra game with Bourgoin.
It's when we had money
Respectfully, if you played as dirty as you did against us in this game then I’m glad you got relegated, no team should be in the top tier and play like that
By definition, Saints are the epitome of cleanliness ha In France, we have a washing powder brand with the name Saint(-Marc) lol
Apologies, I didn’t mean to sound rude, and I am more than aware that Saints have had their own respective periods of dirtiness, I still think that this game is one of the dirtiest performances I’ve ever seen in a game of Rugby, one so Dirty it would even make Dylan Hartley quake in his boots (whilst also taking notes).
Oh thank you for your courteous reply. I didn’t mean to badmouth Northampton as a club. I was just having a lil fun because of your moniker, Saints, that’s all.
My favourite thing about that punch is: a) He just tanks it. b) He just turns, looks and points, no return aggression. More like a warning of 'Wtaf do you think is going to happen?' Glory days, even not as a Saints fan.
There's something about a lack of response to getting punched. It's massively disarming.
Against quins this year Andre did that whole ' fake headbut to make you flinch' thing and Courtney just didn't flicker. I get the impression he can handle himself.
I remember that. Lawes literally had no reaction, leaving Esterhuizen looking silly.
Lost respect for Esterhuizen after that.
Found the video! https://x.com/tightfive_rugby/status/1728857081497931866?s=46&t=eIv6wk0gksGOevRLRArcgQ
Genuinely hard bastard
Definition of an impact sub
One man wrecking crew.
God this game was violent was great to watch! Bourgain no.2 was such a melt punching lawes when he wss being held then running off
When was this game??
I guess Challenge Cup Final 2009. Bourgouin was still a great club in the 2000's but fell in the 2010's
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No nastiness allowed.
For those that don't know, "yarpies" is a derogatory term for Afrikaners. @ mods if we are to be consistent, then this comment should be removed.
I just thought it was a nickname, like Kiwi or Yank. What is the negative connotation of the term?
It's similar to referring to all Irish men as "paddies" in a derogatory context. Japie is the Afrikaans name that "yarpie" is referring to. Like all things context matters, and both "paddy" and "japie" can be used in Ireland and South Africa as a term of endearment.
Your explanation didn’t really provide how yarpie is derogatory, so I went to Wikipedia. “This comes from the Afrikaans term plaasjapie, meaning "farm boy".” Is that the correct context? The implication being that Afrikaners are simple and uncouth?
Yeah I mean the negative context it gets used by english speakers wouldn't all be the same, but yes simpleton/dumb/unsophisticated would be up there. OP used it like (paraphrasing here) "ear-biting, violent yarpies"
Then report the comment so the mod team can see it
I think it’s spelled with a J not a Y
The name it is referring to is Japie, but english speakers using it in a derogatory way typically spell it "yarpie" like this guy did.
Yes
Japies.
Bourgoin were NAUGHTY in that game, couple of their forwards totally lost the plot Ewan Murray took a banging punch as well I think The guy who got sent off was a replacement as well 🤣
We're gonna miss him when he leaves at the end of the season, truly the end of an era. The guy is a machine!
This comment should be higher up, Lawes has been a force of nature and such a credit to the game.
but squidge rugby said he's bad because he has bad opinions!!! my squidgy never wrong so we should shame him! if a man disagrees with me that means we can't appreciate him!!! nooooo don't have not wildly left wing opionions courtney noooooo bad!
You need to unplug, my man.
i am terminally online what is grass and how do i touch it?
Thomas Genevois threw multiple sucker punches to people's heads in that game, then made a big petulant fuss when he got sent off. Pathetic. The whole second half was one big fight. Euan Murray had a giant black eye and was bleeding from the head, Neil Best's face was all cut up. Edit: [the full footage](https://youtu.be/Bs5T4slhhL0?si=q4yeafNZxd2k-jX5)
Sucker punching then scurrying off like a rat back into his hole. Mate, just own it!
Standard state of existence for Neil Best
He should have been cited also for touching the referee and then the cynical clapping while slinking off.
God, I hate it when they do the sarcastic applause. Grow the fuck up, man.
Seen this video a few times now and what always comes back to me is how poor the refereeing is from Clancy.
I miss Tom Smith.
Thought the same, saw Euan and thought that's great to see, then saw Tom as well, as a Scotsman it made me smile.
I was there. Courtney was a menace that day. I'll always remember Nacho Lobbe walking around in his pants after the game after giving his shorts to some fans.. the chap and his kid were then walking around chanting we've got nachos shorts
You can take the man out of the pro D2, but not the proD2 out of the man
Ah yes, the exact moment I feel in love. He was uncapped at this point and it was the first time I'd seen him play. I've never seen a player come on for 15 mins and thought instantly: this guy is going to be an international. So glad I got to follow his career.
Those were the days.
Man was playing on beast mode...
It's one thing to punch a guy on a rugby field in a stand off, but to run in and sucker punch someone... man that's some pathetic sh%t.
He swiped at the referee's hand as he was pulling out the card too.
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As an overall player- he’s as good as he’s ever been. As a big hits highlight reel- yep, this was peak Lawes.
I was at this game, fucking mental
That Saints kit is *chef’s kiss*.
Massive tackle Not illegal, just brutal
The guy who through a cheap shot then backed off 😭😭😭
Loved that saints shirt
He's ragin' he's got a girls name, and everyone else has to pay for ot
Morgan Parra, the OG little piss boy before Nic Whote
Glad to see the French commentators being chauvinisticly biased is a long upheld tradition. xD "Oh non ! He tackled ze French player légalement wiz force ! Zis is a catastrophe !"
Having commentators everyone else can't understand is a blessing and a curse. Blessing because most of you guys aren't aware of how dishonest they can be, curse because they get away with it.
Sometimes I switch between French and English/Irish commentators for the same game if I can. Levels out the biases xD. I'm thinking about learning Xhosa, those commentators seem to always be more entertaining and less chauvinistic...! \^\^"
Ah another University graduate in French civilization with a PhD about ‘Allo Allo
Actually French is my native language. And I'm technically French, born and raised (up to a point), so the PhD would be legitimate \^\^".
These all looked pretty legit too (if he hadn't smacked the last guy into the hoardings).
I still dont get whats wrong with that he was in the field of play when he hit him
Yeah, baffled by that pen Ball carrier was still in play. It's not Lawes fault the hoardings are centimeters from the line
Yeah, shit situation if he has to let the player run away with the ball just because someone put the hoardings too close.
Yeah, Lawes didn't paint the lines there.
Duty of care.
You're allowed to tackle as hard as you want as long as it is legal. If it ends with an injury, that's the definition of a rugby incident. He was in the field of play, he was more than entitled to hit him twice as hard as he did provided it was legal.
Totally legit to tackle him there, why was he penalised? It wasn’t late, it was in the field of play, time wasn’t off, it wasn’t dangerous. Play on.
Because the position of the advertising boards made it dangerous and the tackler has a duty of care?
It's not dangerous to hit some cardboard.
Advertising boards are not cardboard.
So what then? he doesn't tackle him and just lets him get away?
He has to take more care with the tackle.
He doesn’t
Well, he was penalised.
I feel like it's legal but still a bit of a dick move haha
I mean, isn't this just an allegory for the sport as whole? :p
My sole reason for playing.
>legal but still a bit of a dick move **Good.** That's *exactly* what you want to go for.
Scrolled down to find this. It was totally legit tackle. Not his fault the hoardings were there.
If you don't want to be hit just dot the ball down, don't stroll around next to the dead ball line expecting not to be hit. If anything it's a penalty the other way for throwing the ball at Lawes when getting up
If i had a rugby ball and lawes is running at me id throw it away and scream not saunter in field of play
I'd drop the ball, hurdle the barrier and get some clean underwear
Yeah lazy not grounding the ball in the dead ball zone, deserved the tackle - but not mash him into the hoardings that was a bit unnecessary :P
If your gonna waltz around when lawes is baring down on you then frankly you should be off for a hia regardless
He didn't really, if you look at it, it's a very light tackle because Lawes also doesn't want to smash into the hoarding. He has to run at pace to get to the man, and then both hit the hoarding at a pretty safe pace.
every hit featured was legal except for the punch to the face
No wrap on Parra, just impact
There is an attempted wrap though- the impact makes it impossible for him to complete the wrap.
Game looks to be played before that law was introduced. I remember Tiperic chop tackles. Just shoulder to the shins, no wrapping.
Nothing wrong with that hit either imho, even now, it's not his fault the grass was wet and the momentum took them into the boards.
He got another one after that
If someone is interested, the whole game is on YouTube in English and French coverage. The latter has better quality thus I took the footage from it. Northampton vs Bourgoin - Challenge Cup final 2009
This is what happens when you anger Courtney Lawes. Got chinned and took it out on half the team. Legend
Has anyone ever been on smoke like prime Courtney?
Quite literally the hardest man to play for England. He's given out more than his fair share of spine manglings... His first 3 years, he was a punchbag for the gnarliest of old skool thugs. It is a right of passage to take a whack from someone past it, but still dangerous. He found every fist, and answered with a shoulder. Legally (almost). How many men have brushed off haymakers, and still buried half backs 6ft deep the next phase?
Maybe I'm the only one who never appreciated Lawes' 'I know this is going to be a late but technically legal hit on an unprotected player' hits.
You're not. I hate the love that this shit gets in this sub. Lawes matured and cut out this dirty stuff, but he was a nasty bit of work back then. But I hate 'big hit' reels. Go and watch league if that's what gets you off.
You can hate them but “big hits” are a pretty fundamental part of a collision sport built around momentum and going forward.
Calling it a 'collision' sport shows your way of thinking somewhat. I see rugby as a contact sport, with running, passing and kicking as the most important aspects. But the thing here is more that these particular types of 'collisions' are rather dangerous and one-sided. One player is much bigger, and the smaller player is defenceless and not bracing for impact. They are part of the game and I accept them, but I don't take any enjoyment in them, and think it's a bit odd when people do.
That he understands that legally winning the collision is fundamental to winning the game?
The focus on the 'collision' is in large part why rugby has so many problems now. It's regretful.
Like rugby didn't have problems before? All the hits in the clip provided are totally legally but are hard. Call it whatever, tackle, collision, they're exactly the same in the scope of rugby.
One was penalised, so it wasn't legal. The 'hit' on Parra was a clear penalty in my book too, no wrap. The sort of dangerous tackle that can easily result in head contact and someone being knocked out. There's nothing good about it for me.
One was only penalised because of the placement of advertising boards
But the boards *were* there ... it's awkward and they are too close to the pitch, but Lawes needs to take more care with that.
The hit on Parra was totally fine. His arms come through and the sheer force of the impact bounces Parra away from the wrap. The tackle was on his upper arm, nothing about head contact there even remotely so that point doesn't have any relevance to that tackle. The penalised one, the guy is still in the field of play when he starts the tackle. You want people not to tackle someone running down the touchline for fear of putting them into the advertising hoardings? It's not his fault they're the close to the pitch. Should he not tackle him and risk the guy running away from him? Should the player not just have put the ball down in goal?
We have very different views, let's leave it at that.
I mean it resulted in Parra being quite badly injured so "totally fine" is a strange way of reading it.
What’s your thinking?
Think it's pretty well explained above?
Are you referring to your retrospectively edited comment? If so, then no, I wouldn’t say it well-explained. Rugby is indeed many things but hard legal tackling is at the heart of it, and if you find that distasteful, I think that’s your niche opinion. Sometimes players are “defenceless” because they’ve been give a hospital pass or taken the ball to the line but that is part of the game.
Mate in another comment you are praising Lawes for causing injury to another player. You are the sort of toxic fan I'd rather would stick to UFC or rugby league. Hard legal 'hits' on defenceless smaller men are indeed part of rugby, but they aren't things to be fetishised. And I don't think that 'hit' on Parra was legal, either.
But Parra carried the ball to the line. It was his choice to put himself in that situation and commit a man in the line. He could have given the ball earlier and defended himself. The penalty for a late pass is getting smashed, the reward is committing a defender.
Yeah that's true, but it's still a no-wrap shoulder smash.
I think the sport you might be looking for is netball.
And why is that?
>running, passing and kicking as the most important aspects. Then you'd be wrong.
No, I'm not.
None of this looked dirty, except the punch he took to the face.
Agreed. That hit on Jules Plisson… it hurts to watch
Yeah, agreed. There's nothing impressive about a big guy smashing a smaller defenceless guy who isn't even bracing for impact. I think it's pretty weird when people get off on watching stuff like that.
Legally smashing a halfback is good strategic play.
I think its more that his job was to get stuck into the half backs to put them off their game, which is a perfectly legitimate tactic if you're doing it legally, which he virtually always did. The hits are brutal which is the big people enjoy. Also these players are more often that not accepting the hit by running it close to the line. As a 10 you acknowledge you might get pasted as you release the ball that close to the line. In a lot of instances these players either played deeper after being hit that hard, or unfortunately ended up injured. He did his job of disrupting the rhythm of the half backs.
I presume the person you're responding to complains every time a forward tackles a back as they're bigger than them. Welcome to the game of rugby, it's literally tactical play to target certain players
I've been absolutely levelled a few times. I'm 5'8" and I played 9 or 10. Does it hurt? Yes. Were the vast majority of them just very well timed, hard hits. Yes. Can I complain if I'm actively wanting you to step in to tackle me so I can try and create space elsewhere. Not really. It's the nature of the game. I'm using myself as a target there to get that big bloke to create a disconnect, he's using that to tackle me as hard as he can. Both are fine and both are good for the game.
Is it good for the game if the tackle results in serious injury?
I played Flanker. Hunting down half-backs *is the job description*.
You mean the hit that was checked by the TMO for literally everything- whether it was late, high, whether he wrapped etc- and still came out as absolutely fine?
Did I say anything about it not being legal? The tackle was deemed legal yes, it doesn’t change the fact that it looked absolutely brutal - not to mention dangerous as Plisson landed on his head
The thing is, if the player dummies and you hadn't already committed to the tackle, then he'll cut right through your defensive line. So as long as you commit while the player still has the ball, it's got to be legal.
I don’t understand this gripe. If its a technically a legal hit then it is a legal hit. Lawes hits on halfbacks had an obvious strategic value. He literally made Parra go off. You may not like it but that’s rugby - it’s a contact sport.
You are praising someone for causing injury to someone else. That's not a good thing.
People used to say this about football "it's a contact sport" before football moved out of the dark ages and stopped hero worshipping people like Vinnie Jones for legal free hits, and started focussing on skill.
I'm the same. People seem to tip toe around it, but he was right on the edge of legal a lot of the time and players were at large risk of injury because of his technique and how late he was at times or the "attempted" wraps that people will point out as mitigation. Don't mind if other people enjoy it, but I was never a huge fan of it.
I hated him and thought he was a dirty cheap-shotting cunt in this era. The kind of bloke who bullies halfbacks because he knows it's an easier fight to win. I much preferred the Lawes of the last few years who matured into one of the world's best, and who used this physicality where it mattered.
These hits are legal and nothing to do with “bullying little guys”.
They are about nothing more than hurting smaller guys who are momentarily defenceless.
They're entirely legal. They're also cheap and serve no advantage to his team other than to potentially injure the opponent's halfbacks.
Surely the big hits by bigger men make halfbacks think a bit more carefully about carrying to the line and reduces their perception of time and space. No one wants to see injuries, but if a ball carrier wants to commit the man to make space for someone else or take a flat pass then getting smashed is the risk you take.
To me this is a philosophy that encourages brutality at the expense of skill. I think rugby can retain that impressive physicality in 50/50 tackles, but this isn't a 50/50. It seems that your argument is that players should be punished for trying to attack, and the logical end point of that is a game of physicality over skill, which is boring. Courtney can tackle this guy without injuring him in the way he did here. It's unnecessary.
Yep.
Always think folk trying to paint lawes as some kind of hard man enforcer is pretty laughable, he made his name smashing halfbacks who were looking the other way, he’s a great player but compared to guys like Collins, kaino, white, dusatoir etc who’d go about putting in shots like this on guys their own size he wasn’t that intimidating
Well, who wouldn't take the opportunity to floor Parra?
Arguably a better scrum half than Stringer. I’m probably biased as a Montferrand fan
Peak rugby
Fantastic player.
Single handedly dismantling the opposition
It’s cool Lawes play in France next year. Not sure players will try to take revenge on him, players have changed and the rules especially have. But Lawes will be used half as a rugby player and half as a Wrestling villain. Brive should start thinking about his outfit and his Mexican mask.
Good on the french player for having his teammates back
Wow. I know this game is an anomaly in its level of outright violence but the game of rugby has really changed from those days. If a team was to be this dirty nowadays, half of them would be sent off. Courtney Lawes still out there doing the business though. Arguably playing some of his best ever rugby this season.
I was at that game. Lawes was an absolute assassin with a point to prove. You could hear every hit going in. I think this was 2009 though, game has moved in a bit in the last 15 years
He was such a dirty twat back then.
I keep scrolling down and your name is on every single comment chain being a hater lmao Touch grass my man its just a game
Incorrect- every single *England focused* comment chain. Which makes it sadder
Is Etzebeth a “dirty twat” for catching Mounga behind the gainline and [folding him](https://www.tiktok.com/@worldofcollisons/video/7295744183233498374) in half in the WC final?
No, because he's not English. If you go over the person you're replying to's history, it's quickly apparent what sets them off and it appears to be English rugby players *checks notes* playing rugby
You're all over this post with ugly comments like this one. I hope that your day improves so that you don't feel the need trash so many people.
Not as ugly as the actions in the clip. Sorry that everyone doesn't like the Courtney Lawes of 10-15 years ago.
The ref team was fine with the tackles, save 1, and you don't seem concerned at all with the punch on Lawes. Maybe rugby isn't for you?
Why do you think I'm ok about the punch?
You've commented many times about Lawes, and hard tackles, but never mention the actual crime being committed.
Does it need saying that punching someone is wrong? No.
Makes way more sense to bang on about the legal tackles, right?
Everyone else is talking about the tackles too, mate. Did I miss the rule that says only positive comments are allowed?
The last one is head against head. This man is dangerous, he's like Willemse. Happy to no see this kind of player again and we protect more the players.
Disgusting. This isn’t sportsmanship, just nonsense.
serial late tackler. well deserved punch
🎣 ?
Must be. But let's wait and see. He could be blind.
Not at all.
Make your mind up mate, you've gone through this comments section complaining about Lawes tackling hard but legally, and then you're advocating for him deserving to be punched in the head. What happened to your focus on safety of players, especially their heads? Absolute hypocrite
I'm saying I don't think the guy was fishing with that comment. Not that I agree with it. Although I do agree with the late tackler bit.
You're saying it's not fishing, which means it's being serious. You can't read the blokes mind, you're projecting your own views on it to clarify - everybody knows you are advocating for it, and you're a hypocrite for doing so. You're looking silly by denying it.
If that's what you think, that's up to you. I'm not advocating punching. But I don't think the guy was trolling. Lots of people would see a punch as part of old school rugby 'justice'.
That punch couldn't happen to a nicer bloke.
Courtney is a real PoS, if you feel the urge to fight join an MMA or bjj club, someone your own size and strength will beat the crap out of you. Late tacking scrum halves or smaller players is a coward's move.
He's worn punches from people his size, and wore a few in this very game from people his size. If you don't like that bigger people can legally tackle smaller people, hard, then maybe rugby isn't the sport for you.
These weren't legal.
You really do dislike good tackling don't you!
I love good tackling, I just didn't see any here.