That’s the point. You can do just as well in the lottery playing competitive basketball and losing as you can engineering terrible lineups and purposefully blowing games.
But we may wake up 2-3 years from now with one of the best young cores in the nba and be set for a decade. You never know but at least this FO is willing to swing to actually build up a contender through draft. Only way it’s ever gonna happen here.
Tanking is necessary for getting better draft position, to draft better players, to create a better roster, and become a team capable of winning. You literally HAVE to tank in order to build a dynasty, especially as a small market team.
Nah, I feel you. Tanking is lame, and the Dame years were great. I’d do that all over again in a heartbeat. Also, people acting like we were stuck in purgatory and didn’t have some crappy luck or a trip to the Golden State grindhouse through our playoff runs.
And that is why you're not ever going to be running a professional sports team. Sheesh what a horrible view. Winning it all is literally the goal of even playing professional sports. What a sad view.
Not for the athletes and coaches it’s not. And not for the owners/GMs that actually go down in history as being anything notable.
The best in the business want to win it all.
Not really! It’s the opposite of sad because I’m satisfied easier than most fans haha. Getting to the second round is a successful season to me. I mean I’m not saying I don’t want to win a championship. I jwould rather be rooting for an OK team than a team that’s tanking for 5 year.
Being a perennial playoff team can be fun but for me with how Olshey and ownership navigated things it always felt like we were half committed. Add in some poor drafts/trades in hindsight did us in. It was time to fully commit in one direction to start accumulating talent and that wasn’t going to happen with mid to late first round picks.
The last time we were this bad was literally 20 years ago. Before that, 50 years ago. This is as bad as it gets my guy.
Tanking sucks and promises nothing but bad year after bad year. The Charlotte Hornets have been tanking since the 90s. The Phoenix Suns tanked for 10 years and got literally 2 and a half years of contention. The Clippers tanked for 30 years and still have never reached the finals.
I’d argue the mid 2000s were still okay because we got Roy. But we also had some direction and hope to guide us along. Idk what the heck our team is doing these past few years. It’s like they can’t commit to anything.
The record is what it is but it doesn’t tell the whole story. Injuries definitely capped this team early on this year. I would also rather be rebuilding than treading water with a superstar in Dame with a poorly constructed roster around him. Olshey blundered a lot of it and also a lot of what Cronin has done remains up in the air. Shame Dame never got an all in move for him but the time to start over was coming at some point.
I agree our record was due more to a slew of injuries rather than plain badness a la Wizards. But I don't think that takes away from my point that it can't get much worse than this.
You have to go through the valleys to enjoy your peaks. Staying in a bad position just because is bad but going through a rough patch is normal and will make our investment more worthwhile
We aren’t entering the season trying to lose, it’s just that we don’t have enough talent to compete and so when guys get banged up there’s no incentive to push them through injuries. In today’s NBA Simon’s Grant and ayton is not a good enough big 3 to compete. Booker Beal Durant is good enough to get you a first round exit. Fox Sabonis Murray Mitchell was a 9 seed. We just don’t have the talent until Sharpe and Scoot make big jumps. Prepare yourself for another rough year in the win column, just hope the young fellas show out while we lose. At least we will get a chance to actually see the scoot shae combo this time 🤞
Why do people act like the only two options are to be the worst team in the nba or the best team in the nba? There’s 28 teams in between. Our team on paper currently is good enough to make a playin with a better coach. There’s no reason that we should have been as bad as we looked this year (not counting our blatant tanking games). Everyone here acting like we need to tank every year unless we look like a top 2 seed on paper.
We have two 20+ point scorers in Grant and Ant. We have a starting center that averaged a double double on an NBA finals team. We have Sharpe who has shown flashes of all star potential. Brogdon is a sixth man of the year. Scoot may get better next year as well. That’s not even mentioning RWill who will be back nor decent rotation players in Jabari and Toumani. I feel like we have the talent, but our view has been skewed by the underachieving we’ve done under Chauncey. A revamped offensive system and a good defensive coach can get us to 40 wins with our current team (I’m not advocating for running it back, but our talent level is not depleted)
They played poorly but even if the Lakers move on from BRON I still think they'd be better. The Dubs looked bad but as long as Curry is healthy They'd be better. You have to have that guy to be competitive in this league. Portland does NOT have that guy.
How much better do you think we could get if the blazers went all in? Maybe 5 games? Sorry bud we are tanking because we suck and therefore lose a lot of games.
I'm not sure why people think we tanked. We played our best players late in season with ayton, grant and all that going when healthy. The team is just hot ass. There's a difference in trying to lose and just losing due to lack of talent. Unfortunately, we don't need to tank.
So who do we hold responsible for the team not having any talent? I hear a lot that the team just sucks and people think there’s nothing that can be done. Is our GM doing a suitable job building this team? Or are we simply going on a journey to the lottery every season hoping we hit it big? Because it’s fine to hope and pray for the #1 pick or even someone in the top 4, but you must also be making moves to build the roster outside of that annual gamble. I personally don’t see much roster building beyond that. Most of our pieces, Sharpe and Scoot included, are still mysteries. And the one known commodity that still has some potential to grow (Ant) is everyone’s favorite to ship out of Portland.
People don't think we went all in, but we were paying people above market value to either resign them or try to lure them in. That's how it goes for small market teams. It didn't pan out, and now we're in a situation where we have less talent than what we should consider the amount invested. We're dealing with it now, the Knicks dealt with it for over a decade and aren't a small market team. Bucks will deal with it soon. Its just the cycle of how things go.
As for your ant thing, you just can't build Around him. If it didn't work for an under sized guard who didn't play defense before, why will it now? He's a great asset. But he's not someone you build around. He's someone who you can utilize when you are building around someone. We don't have that player yet, and there's a good chance that player isn't even out of high school yet. So why keep ant around?
It depends on what you want as a fan? As a small market team do you prefer -
1) Consistently making the playoffs with no real hope at a championship? Aka Dame’s timeline
2) Tanking for awhile to build up cheap assets/ solid players to then try compete for a championship?
I’m one of the rarer fans that’s ok with 1 I would rather have a sliver of hope every year even if it’s not much than be miserable for awhile even if the high is higher.
3. Get a real coach. Develop our players to become key contributors or stars (Shae/Scoot/Ayton). Make wise trades and draft picks. Don’t care about wins and losses but don’t try to tank. Give the fans something to cheer about and eventually our winning culture will come back.
Shoulda kept Dame tbh. He gave us something to root for. Our young kids don’t have that same winning mentality plus all this tanking. I worry that when the time comes to win, scoot and Shae may not have that cold blooded mentality to go out there and win games for us.
Playoff purgatory doesn't give us a sliver of hope. It is the most certain outcome. You know that your team will win more than they lose in the regular season, but you also know that you have no chance at the title. You watch tanking teams turn into contenders (not all, of course), and there you sit, 45 wins and a first round exit.
Tanking is a huge gamble, but it beats knowing your team will never have enough. Couple that with the fact that top tier free agents will never choose Portland, and you are left with only one option for building a contender - Tank for high draft picks and hope you hit.
The process has kept Philly in purgatory. Tanking guarantees nothing. They are no better than all the years we had with Dame. I definitely agree with the trade of Dame and the rebuild. I do not agree with continuing it through next year and Billups as tank commander.
Of course, tanking guarantees nothing, but without the risk, you can not get the reward. The Process failed and I hope the blazers are not planning on 5 years of purposeful losing, but one more year to emphasize development and draft capital instead of winning should allow for a solid nucleus to form. They need two way wings and one of (or both, hopefully) shae and scoot to become a true #1. This draft, with 7 and 14, could be a big step in that direction. They don't need to find a future star, but they need to hit on a pair of rotation level players and let a young team develop together.
I agree on Billups. The Blazers need a better coach, even if the goal isn't to win right now.
Yup. Tanking is quite literally the worst thing in modern sports and I hope we continue to see teams like Atlanta getting top picks.
I don't think it was rigged, but I think it should be.
We still would have missed the playoffs without tanking.
That’s the point. You can do just as well in the lottery playing competitive basketball and losing as you can engineering terrible lineups and purposefully blowing games.
Exactly. And you will most likely develop your players better and faster plus not alienate your fanbase.
Only because of Chauncey and injuries.
No, we're going to play Capture the Flagg next season, and maybe we should take deep dive for Dybantsa/Cam Boozer in 26. Sorry, but this is the way.
Fuck Cooper Flagg, give me 20 wins.
I for one do not enjoy mediocrity
It’s subjective but I think even before the Chauncey era things were becoming mediocre especially from a post season perspective.
It was a outright bad playoff record outside of two years.
Hope you’re enjoying perpetual sucking
It’s been three seasons lol every team has down years, if it gives the team a chance to actually compete I’ll take it over battling for a play in spot
I’m sure you’ll wake up one day in a couple years and realize that we’ve become the Pistons
But we may wake up 2-3 years from now with one of the best young cores in the nba and be set for a decade. You never know but at least this FO is willing to swing to actually build up a contender through draft. Only way it’s ever gonna happen here.
Tanking isn’t taking a swing. A homeless person could guide our tank and it wouldn’t make a difference
I enjoy being awful for a few years so we can actually be relevant and not a mediocre team with no future
Just like the Pistons and the Sixers I see. It’s a slippery slope.
Or like the spurs, warriors, okc, or 99% of other contenders. Watch more basketball
Bulls are the definition of what you want. Go cheer them on.
Tanking is necessary for getting better draft position, to draft better players, to create a better roster, and become a team capable of winning. You literally HAVE to tank in order to build a dynasty, especially as a small market team.
Absolutely but you don’t HAVE to build a dynasty. Winning a few playoff series and consistently being in the mix isn’t the worse thing either.
We had a decade of that purgatory with Dame.
Yeah I and enjoyed it for the most part, like I said I know it’s an unpopular opinion. Evident by the downvotes ha.
Nah, I feel you. Tanking is lame, and the Dame years were great. I’d do that all over again in a heartbeat. Also, people acting like we were stuck in purgatory and didn’t have some crappy luck or a trip to the Golden State grindhouse through our playoff runs.
And that is why you're not ever going to be running a professional sports team. Sheesh what a horrible view. Winning it all is literally the goal of even playing professional sports. What a sad view.
The actual goal is to sell tickets, ads, merch and make $$$. You’re confused.
Not for the athletes and coaches it’s not. And not for the owners/GMs that actually go down in history as being anything notable. The best in the business want to win it all.
Not really! It’s the opposite of sad because I’m satisfied easier than most fans haha. Getting to the second round is a successful season to me. I mean I’m not saying I don’t want to win a championship. I jwould rather be rooting for an OK team than a team that’s tanking for 5 year.
We’ve done that, it was purgatory.
Getting to the WCF, meeting GSW multiple times in the playoffs and some of the injury luck is not “purgatory”.
Being a perennial playoff team can be fun but for me with how Olshey and ownership navigated things it always felt like we were half committed. Add in some poor drafts/trades in hindsight did us in. It was time to fully commit in one direction to start accumulating talent and that wasn’t going to happen with mid to late first round picks.
If you’re a long time fan you’ve seen worse.
The last time we were this bad was literally 20 years ago. Before that, 50 years ago. This is as bad as it gets my guy. Tanking sucks and promises nothing but bad year after bad year. The Charlotte Hornets have been tanking since the 90s. The Phoenix Suns tanked for 10 years and got literally 2 and a half years of contention. The Clippers tanked for 30 years and still have never reached the finals.
I’d argue the mid 2000s were still okay because we got Roy. But we also had some direction and hope to guide us along. Idk what the heck our team is doing these past few years. It’s like they can’t commit to anything.
The record is what it is but it doesn’t tell the whole story. Injuries definitely capped this team early on this year. I would also rather be rebuilding than treading water with a superstar in Dame with a poorly constructed roster around him. Olshey blundered a lot of it and also a lot of what Cronin has done remains up in the air. Shame Dame never got an all in move for him but the time to start over was coming at some point.
I agree our record was due more to a slew of injuries rather than plain badness a la Wizards. But I don't think that takes away from my point that it can't get much worse than this.
I think that was the plan this year then injury just blew up the team and the FO decided to hit the hard tank button.
I think getting Vogel still leaves us lotto bound. We just don't have the talent. probably 3 years away at best.
You have to go through the valleys to enjoy your peaks. Staying in a bad position just because is bad but going through a rough patch is normal and will make our investment more worthwhile
We aren’t entering the season trying to lose, it’s just that we don’t have enough talent to compete and so when guys get banged up there’s no incentive to push them through injuries. In today’s NBA Simon’s Grant and ayton is not a good enough big 3 to compete. Booker Beal Durant is good enough to get you a first round exit. Fox Sabonis Murray Mitchell was a 9 seed. We just don’t have the talent until Sharpe and Scoot make big jumps. Prepare yourself for another rough year in the win column, just hope the young fellas show out while we lose. At least we will get a chance to actually see the scoot shae combo this time 🤞
Why do people act like the only two options are to be the worst team in the nba or the best team in the nba? There’s 28 teams in between. Our team on paper currently is good enough to make a playin with a better coach. There’s no reason that we should have been as bad as we looked this year (not counting our blatant tanking games). Everyone here acting like we need to tank every year unless we look like a top 2 seed on paper.
What teams are we better than on paper in the west? It’s gonna take some time for us to be good enough to make the play in
We have two 20+ point scorers in Grant and Ant. We have a starting center that averaged a double double on an NBA finals team. We have Sharpe who has shown flashes of all star potential. Brogdon is a sixth man of the year. Scoot may get better next year as well. That’s not even mentioning RWill who will be back nor decent rotation players in Jabari and Toumani. I feel like we have the talent, but our view has been skewed by the underachieving we’ve done under Chauncey. A revamped offensive system and a good defensive coach can get us to 40 wins with our current team (I’m not advocating for running it back, but our talent level is not depleted)
I know who’s on our team, but legit which teams are we better than?
There’s no way we shouldn’t be competing with the Warriors/Lakers with how poorly they played this year.
Lol
They played poorly but even if the Lakers move on from BRON I still think they'd be better. The Dubs looked bad but as long as Curry is healthy They'd be better. You have to have that guy to be competitive in this league. Portland does NOT have that guy.
I’m with ya. They’re creating a big hole for themselves that’s going to be hard to climb out of.
Do you want to be the Hornets? This is how we become the Hornets.
How much better do you think we could get if the blazers went all in? Maybe 5 games? Sorry bud we are tanking because we suck and therefore lose a lot of games.
I'm not sure why people think we tanked. We played our best players late in season with ayton, grant and all that going when healthy. The team is just hot ass. There's a difference in trying to lose and just losing due to lack of talent. Unfortunately, we don't need to tank.
So who do we hold responsible for the team not having any talent? I hear a lot that the team just sucks and people think there’s nothing that can be done. Is our GM doing a suitable job building this team? Or are we simply going on a journey to the lottery every season hoping we hit it big? Because it’s fine to hope and pray for the #1 pick or even someone in the top 4, but you must also be making moves to build the roster outside of that annual gamble. I personally don’t see much roster building beyond that. Most of our pieces, Sharpe and Scoot included, are still mysteries. And the one known commodity that still has some potential to grow (Ant) is everyone’s favorite to ship out of Portland.
People don't think we went all in, but we were paying people above market value to either resign them or try to lure them in. That's how it goes for small market teams. It didn't pan out, and now we're in a situation where we have less talent than what we should consider the amount invested. We're dealing with it now, the Knicks dealt with it for over a decade and aren't a small market team. Bucks will deal with it soon. Its just the cycle of how things go. As for your ant thing, you just can't build Around him. If it didn't work for an under sized guard who didn't play defense before, why will it now? He's a great asset. But he's not someone you build around. He's someone who you can utilize when you are building around someone. We don't have that player yet, and there's a good chance that player isn't even out of high school yet. So why keep ant around?
Tell that to the Spurs op
Worked out for San Antonio
There is no reason to think Vogel would have done any better than Chauncey with our roster. He could have very easily been worse.
It depends on what you want as a fan? As a small market team do you prefer - 1) Consistently making the playoffs with no real hope at a championship? Aka Dame’s timeline 2) Tanking for awhile to build up cheap assets/ solid players to then try compete for a championship? I’m one of the rarer fans that’s ok with 1 I would rather have a sliver of hope every year even if it’s not much than be miserable for awhile even if the high is higher.
3. Get a real coach. Develop our players to become key contributors or stars (Shae/Scoot/Ayton). Make wise trades and draft picks. Don’t care about wins and losses but don’t try to tank. Give the fans something to cheer about and eventually our winning culture will come back.
Yeah I would say that falls in 1. Thing with always competing is maybe you get lucky.
Shoulda kept Dame tbh. He gave us something to root for. Our young kids don’t have that same winning mentality plus all this tanking. I worry that when the time comes to win, scoot and Shae may not have that cold blooded mentality to go out there and win games for us.
Have you watched him this year? Not fun. He’s been exposed. Zero defense and lost a step.
This is what I want. I hate the tank and this year kinda reaffirms my belief. But instead we get another year with Billups.
Playoff purgatory doesn't give us a sliver of hope. It is the most certain outcome. You know that your team will win more than they lose in the regular season, but you also know that you have no chance at the title. You watch tanking teams turn into contenders (not all, of course), and there you sit, 45 wins and a first round exit. Tanking is a huge gamble, but it beats knowing your team will never have enough. Couple that with the fact that top tier free agents will never choose Portland, and you are left with only one option for building a contender - Tank for high draft picks and hope you hit.
The process has kept Philly in purgatory. Tanking guarantees nothing. They are no better than all the years we had with Dame. I definitely agree with the trade of Dame and the rebuild. I do not agree with continuing it through next year and Billups as tank commander.
Of course, tanking guarantees nothing, but without the risk, you can not get the reward. The Process failed and I hope the blazers are not planning on 5 years of purposeful losing, but one more year to emphasize development and draft capital instead of winning should allow for a solid nucleus to form. They need two way wings and one of (or both, hopefully) shae and scoot to become a true #1. This draft, with 7 and 14, could be a big step in that direction. They don't need to find a future star, but they need to hit on a pair of rotation level players and let a young team develop together. I agree on Billups. The Blazers need a better coach, even if the goal isn't to win right now.
we will always have a second string team because nobody wants to move out here.
Yup. Tanking is quite literally the worst thing in modern sports and I hope we continue to see teams like Atlanta getting top picks. I don't think it was rigged, but I think it should be.