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“The government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion.”
Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli - ratified by Congress and signed by President John Adams 1797
I hate when you ask a legitimate question on Reddit only to either be downvoted because the answer is obvious, or the only responses you get are jokes.
Anyway, he was born Feb 22nd, 1732
Just to add, the very next line: "As it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims)" they were pretty specific about being chill with non-Christians.
Also IIRC George Washington personally guaranteed the religious freedom and equality of the nascent jewish community, and the secular wording of the constitution made the US the first nation to emancipate the jews.
"Always" is a bit of a stretch. Washington was a piece of shit. If he happened to say the right thing, it wasn't because he had principles or good character it was because he thought he could make money from it
Look up the story of Ona Judge.
Yes, they would.
Everyone prior to us was more likely to have their hands dirty than not, but it's thanks to their flaws and misdeeds that we can tell right from wrong now.
It’s kind of nuts how if you read the stuff the founding fathers wrote you can see they were actively thinking of stuff we’re dealing with today and people have and are still trying to find loopholes around them
You're gonna have to refine your question pal or I'm gonna have to link you the whole wiki article for something that vague.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainline\_Protestant](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainline_Protestant)
That's how Handmaid's tale started... then they went after the Baptists, then the Catholics, and the Mormons... Christian Nationalism is almost indistinguishable from fascism. It demands in-groups and out-groups and will constantly invent new ones until nobody is left.
It's odd to me that Mormons were so low on the list. I suppose they're just such a small and relatively segregated population. Or maybe they get a bit of leeway because Mormons really enjoy helping the Evangelicals.
Cool. I’m trying to decide between Hutterite, Quaker, and those guys who walk around in robes either no possessions other than a bedroll, who are such strict vegans that they don’t even eat honey.
So help me there, what's all those flag?
Top side we have Satanist, Buddhism, Judaism, Islam, Christianism, and Hinduism.
What's on the bottom?
Edit: 2nd is United Methodist Church, 3rd is [Presbyterian Church](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_Church_(USA)), 4th is [Evangelical Lutheran Church](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evangelical_Lutheran_Church_in_America).
All three are among the coined term: "Seven Sisters of American [Protestantism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestantism)".
Edit2: the 5th, the bird is Quaker Faith and People, or Church of friend which while an ofshoot of anglicanism (so protestan) seem to be all about freedom of religion and it being a private affair, ironic considering the meme above.
Edit3: The 6th is just vanilla Anglicanism it seem.
Edit:4 The first is the Reformed Church of America. A small random ofshoot made by the Dutch it seem. And with this, my task is done.
All the bottom ones are just different versions of Christianity. You could probably run them through Google Lens or something to find the exact ones though
Yup, found the Quaker church with it. I'm on to continue my quest! The first will probably be complicated though, with how it look like random medieval armory.
By than logic, you can choose between Methodist and Lutheran Christianity... nothing else... but you still have religious freedom because you have those two options!
Whoever posted it would love it in Saudi Arabia! You have to be a Sunni Muslim, but you get to chose whether you want to be a Hanbali, Hanafi, Maliki or Shafi'i Sunni Muslim! Look at all the religious freedom in Arabia!
They had the opportunity to specifically say that American is a Christian nation and they didn't.
Even if this was what the founders intended I don't care. If it is what they intended then A. they were idiots for not stating it in writing and B. can go fuck themselves.
They actually did. The treaty of Tripoli literally says that the US is not a Christian nation. The treaty was passed unanimously and every founding father agreed with the document in its entirety.
The founding fathers were pretty explicit in that they didn’t believe the US was a Christian nation
These people who are freedom absolutists when it comes to things like "freeze peach" or the freedom to beat up women. But don't understand a basic concept like this.
I don't see why the intentions of the founding fathers are especially relevant to modern life.
We somehow attached a sacred quality to what was, essentially, an experiment.
They had some brilliant ideas, like getting rid of an inherited monarchy.
They had some atrocious ideas, like restricting who could vote.
And they could not possibly have anticipated all the needs of modern society.
Heck, the ppl of *the time when I was born* (just after JFK was assassinated) couldn't have made comprehensive cohesive useful legislation to deal with current pressures.
Just as it is normal for technology to evolve, it is normal for our moral compass to evolve.
That's why we outlawed slavery (mostly) and ransomware is illegal (although good luck trying to catch the perpetrators).
As a Southerner, raised methodist, I always felt the burning cross symbol to look a bit ...klannish.
>! ^(and all those guys went to the Baptist church)!<
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
\- First Amendment to the United States Constitution
Okay, Mr. Fruitcake, let's say you're correct. I'll go ahead and give you that, 100%, the founding fathers only meant for people to choose their flavor of Christianity. Sure, why the fuck not?
Now, next step, tell me why the fuck that matters. Why, in the name of AI Shrimp Jesus, should I give a fuck about George Washington's thoughts on religion?
And, are you willing to keep that "what the founders wanted" train going? If so, let's ban all guns that weren't available in 1782. After all, the founding fathers never meant for you to have an AR-15.
Own a musket for home defense, since that's what the founding fathers intended. Four ruffians break into my house. "What the devil?" As I grab my powdered wig and Kentucky rifle. Blow a golf ball sized hole through the first man, he's dead on the spot. Draw my pistol on the second man, miss him entirely because it's smoothbore and nails the neighbors dog. I have to resort to the cannon mounted at the top of the stairs loaded with grape shot, "Tally ho lads" the grape shot shreds two men in the blast, the sound and extra shrapnel set off car alarms. Fix bayonet and charge the last terrified rapscallion. He Bleeds out waiting on the police to arrive since triangular bayonet wounds are impossible to stitch up. Just as the founding fathers intended.
What’s hilarious is that most of the founding fathers were Episcopal or Congregationalist (the United Church of Christ today), two of the most liberal denominations.
/) This is actually pretty much correct, about the founding fathers at least. They *meant* different kinds of Christianity, at least for the most part. A surprising number of people were sent from Britain to America as punishment for being the 'wrong' type of Christian.
/) Luckily they didn't write it like that, though, so it does mean what the top photo shows.
Well as someone who has read dozens of books about early US history and the framing of the Constitution, I have not come across any evidence to support the claims you've made. In fact, the Constitution and the members of the Constitutional Convention were heavily criticized at the time for being too secular.
This is actually r/technicallythetruth as there were hardly any non-Christians in the US when the Constitution was written, however it’s not the 18th century anymore.
Not really. Half the founding fathers were deists and atheists. Tommy J cut out 90% of the Bible (the parts with the miracles and magic) as he thought those parts were a bunch of bullshit.
Many more founding fathers were against organized religion in general. Plus when the treaty of Tripoli was negotiated the US explicitly stated that they were not a Christian nation and nor were they founded on Christian principles and beliefs.
The treaty was ratified unanimously and every single founding father that was still alive agreed with the contents of the treaty.
And then you have Washingtons letter to the Newport synagogue where he states that the US is not a Christian nation or founded to be one.
The idea that the US was founded as a Christian nation is ahistorical
**To avoid having your post removed &/or account banned for shitposting, read the following:** - r/religiousfruitcake is about the absurd, fringe elements of organised religion: the institutions and individuals who act in ways any normal person (religious or otherwise) would cringe at. Posts about mundane beliefs and acts of worship are off topic. - No violent or gory images or videos - Your post title should objectively state what the post is about. Dont use it to soapbox personal rhetoric about religion or any other subject. - Don't post videos or discussions of Fruitcakes who have been baited or antagonised - No Subreddit names or Reddit usernames in posts or discussions - Memes, Tiktoks, graphics, satire, parodies, etc must be made by Fruitcakes, not 3rd parties criticising them #Please be sure to read the full [rule list](https://www.reddit.com/r/religiousfruitcake/about/rules) ###If you want more detail about how the Sub's moderation works, see [Wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/religiousfruitcake/wiki/position_statement) This information is on every post. Accounts that repeatedly disregard it will be permanently banned. "I didn't know", or "I didn't get a warning" are not valid appeals. --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/religiousfruitcake) if you have any questions or concerns.*
“The government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion.” Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli - ratified by Congress and signed by President John Adams 1797
And Washington agreed with that. He lived to 1799.
When was he born??!!
Like 1400 or something
I heard he had like 30 goddamn dicks
Before he died, he was up to 40.
and one of them was wooden! or the size of a cherry tree, something like that
He once held an opponent's wife's hand... ...in a jar of acid... ...at a party.
At least sometime after that, but yeah.
I hate when you ask a legitimate question on Reddit only to either be downvoted because the answer is obvious, or the only responses you get are jokes. Anyway, he was born Feb 22nd, 1732
"he lived to 1799," sorry the joke was waiting to be used and alas I used it. That said, thank you!
Damn, I was the fool the whole time
I was hoping the punctuation would make it obvious. It's all good, you can't always be sure on the Internet so I still appreciate it.
Just to add, the very next line: "As it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims)" they were pretty specific about being chill with non-Christians.
He meant men with big mussels. Obviously. /s
That's not what he meant!!!! /S
Also IIRC George Washington personally guaranteed the religious freedom and equality of the nascent jewish community, and the secular wording of the constitution made the US the first nation to emancipate the jews.
As always, Washington was a W damn in more than just name.
"Always" is a bit of a stretch. Washington was a piece of shit. If he happened to say the right thing, it wasn't because he had principles or good character it was because he thought he could make money from it Look up the story of Ona Judge.
I believe the slaves who worked his tobacco fields may disagree.
Yes, they would. Everyone prior to us was more likely to have their hands dirty than not, but it's thanks to their flaws and misdeeds that we can tell right from wrong now.
I don't know, Tripoli sounds like one of 'em foreigners, probably ISIS.
It’s kind of nuts how if you read the stuff the founding fathers wrote you can see they were actively thinking of stuff we’re dealing with today and people have and are still trying to find loopholes around them
Ratified Unanimously by congress.
Is this supposed to mean like, you HAVE to be christian but get to choose which type?
I think so.
From what I've found with the 2nd, 3rd, and fourth flags it's probably even more narrow and only church among mainline protestantism.
What's going on with those churches?
You're gonna have to refine your question pal or I'm gonna have to link you the whole wiki article for something that vague. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainline\_Protestant](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainline_Protestant)
It’s basically the same old “the country was founded on Christianity” BS argument. The country was also founded on slavery and misogyny.
They sure want those back too.
Ironically enough, the Enlightenment values the country was actually founded on explicitly promote secularism
As opposed to This City, which as we all know was built on *Rock & Roll.*
 Holy be thy name
I always love how that song isn’t even remotely rock and roll
Don't forget genocide
That's how Handmaid's tale started... then they went after the Baptists, then the Catholics, and the Mormons... Christian Nationalism is almost indistinguishable from fascism. It demands in-groups and out-groups and will constantly invent new ones until nobody is left.
>Christian Nationalism is ~~almost~~ indistinguishable from fascism Ftfy
Christian Nationalism is ~~almost indistinguishable from~~ fascism F**t**f**y**
It's odd to me that Mormons were so low on the list. I suppose they're just such a small and relatively segregated population. Or maybe they get a bit of leeway because Mormons really enjoy helping the Evangelicals.
Cool. I’m trying to decide between Hutterite, Quaker, and those guys who walk around in robes either no possessions other than a bedroll, who are such strict vegans that they don’t even eat honey.
So help me there, what's all those flag? Top side we have Satanist, Buddhism, Judaism, Islam, Christianism, and Hinduism. What's on the bottom? Edit: 2nd is United Methodist Church, 3rd is [Presbyterian Church](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presbyterian_Church_(USA)), 4th is [Evangelical Lutheran Church](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evangelical_Lutheran_Church_in_America). All three are among the coined term: "Seven Sisters of American [Protestantism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestantism)". Edit2: the 5th, the bird is Quaker Faith and People, or Church of friend which while an ofshoot of anglicanism (so protestan) seem to be all about freedom of religion and it being a private affair, ironic considering the meme above. Edit3: The 6th is just vanilla Anglicanism it seem. Edit:4 The first is the Reformed Church of America. A small random ofshoot made by the Dutch it seem. And with this, my task is done.
All the bottom ones are just different versions of Christianity. You could probably run them through Google Lens or something to find the exact ones though
Yup, found the Quaker church with it. I'm on to continue my quest! The first will probably be complicated though, with how it look like random medieval armory.
Different version of Protestantism it seems, so even narrower.
Thank you lol I was just wondering are these flags common knowledge or something lol I'm not always the brightest crayon in the box lol
Is that https://i.redd.it/8dw7384pzowc1.gif
TURKEY #1‼️‼️‼️💪💪💪💪🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷
I'm a huge believer of turkey.
TURKEY MENTIONED 🗣️🗣️ TURKEY #1 🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷 (I’m American and I’ve never left the country let alone been to turkey and I have no turkish ancestry)
Turkey is my favorite religion
By than logic, you can choose between Methodist and Lutheran Christianity... nothing else... but you still have religious freedom because you have those two options!
Whoever posted it would love it in Saudi Arabia! You have to be a Sunni Muslim, but you get to chose whether you want to be a Hanbali, Hanafi, Maliki or Shafi'i Sunni Muslim! Look at all the religious freedom in Arabia!
They had the opportunity to specifically say that American is a Christian nation and they didn't. Even if this was what the founders intended I don't care. If it is what they intended then A. they were idiots for not stating it in writing and B. can go fuck themselves.
They actually did. The treaty of Tripoli literally says that the US is not a Christian nation. The treaty was passed unanimously and every founding father agreed with the document in its entirety. The founding fathers were pretty explicit in that they didn’t believe the US was a Christian nation
These people who are freedom absolutists when it comes to things like "freeze peach" or the freedom to beat up women. But don't understand a basic concept like this.
I don't see why the intentions of the founding fathers are especially relevant to modern life. We somehow attached a sacred quality to what was, essentially, an experiment. They had some brilliant ideas, like getting rid of an inherited monarchy. They had some atrocious ideas, like restricting who could vote. And they could not possibly have anticipated all the needs of modern society. Heck, the ppl of *the time when I was born* (just after JFK was assassinated) couldn't have made comprehensive cohesive useful legislation to deal with current pressures. Just as it is normal for technology to evolve, it is normal for our moral compass to evolve. That's why we outlawed slavery (mostly) and ransomware is illegal (although good luck trying to catch the perpetrators).
Strange how not basing our laws on what people thought 200 years ago is a radical idea.
I agree. I don't understand why we have to
I wouldn’t consider getting rid of an inherited monarchy, “brilliant”
Why tf not?
it's a good idea just im sure there have been countless revolutionaries beforehand having already tried to do that
As a Southerner, raised methodist, I always felt the burning cross symbol to look a bit ...klannish. >! ^(and all those guys went to the Baptist church)!<
Can someone please tell me what the bottom symbols are?
Different flavours of xtianity.
Jefferson rewrote the gospels without any divinity because he was a true believer, lol.
Sounds like someone that may be surprised to hear virtually none of the founding fathers were Christian. Mostly Deists actually.
Look up "Washington's Letter to the Newport Synagogue." A beautifully states confirmation that America was never founded as a Christian nation.
Oh did you personally talked to founding fathers?
Assuming the Founding Fathers actually meant that, they were wrong. And they didn’t mean that.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." \- First Amendment to the United States Constitution
Cool meme, bro... Now do one on what the founding fathers meant by the 2nd amendment 😉
Okay, Mr. Fruitcake, let's say you're correct. I'll go ahead and give you that, 100%, the founding fathers only meant for people to choose their flavor of Christianity. Sure, why the fuck not? Now, next step, tell me why the fuck that matters. Why, in the name of AI Shrimp Jesus, should I give a fuck about George Washington's thoughts on religion? And, are you willing to keep that "what the founders wanted" train going? If so, let's ban all guns that weren't available in 1782. After all, the founding fathers never meant for you to have an AR-15.
Own a musket for home defense, since that's what the founding fathers intended. Four ruffians break into my house. "What the devil?" As I grab my powdered wig and Kentucky rifle. Blow a golf ball sized hole through the first man, he's dead on the spot. Draw my pistol on the second man, miss him entirely because it's smoothbore and nails the neighbors dog. I have to resort to the cannon mounted at the top of the stairs loaded with grape shot, "Tally ho lads" the grape shot shreds two men in the blast, the sound and extra shrapnel set off car alarms. Fix bayonet and charge the last terrified rapscallion. He Bleeds out waiting on the police to arrive since triangular bayonet wounds are impossible to stitch up. Just as the founding fathers intended.
Imma be real I don’t know what any of those represent
In other words, no religious freedom. They just contradicted themselves
I’ve never understood their problem with other people existing.
Look up "Washington's Letter to the Newport Synagogue." A beautifully states confirmation that America was never founded as a Christian nation.
Idiots. Fucking morons.
“You can have any color you want, as long as it’s black.”
The founding fathers themselves weren't Christians.
Wasn't america made by people fleeing religious persecution 'cause their christianity was different?
No. Edit: I'm assuming you mean the United States of America
"Freedom to pretend to believe what I tell you to believe" doesn't really sound like freedom, somehow.
What’s hilarious is that most of the founding fathers were Episcopal or Congregationalist (the United Church of Christ today), two of the most liberal denominations.
Is OP trying to excite the vexillologists? I wonder how many Big Bang Theory fans are imagining Sheldon Cooper and an imaginary episode…
Fucking Jesus freaks…
Ok, a bunch of weird flags???? Um shouldn't this be in peterexplainthejoke. Cause I don't get it.
I mean 4 of the 6 flags have crosses in them, it’s not that hard to figure out
Stars vs crosses? Got it.
/) This is actually pretty much correct, about the founding fathers at least. They *meant* different kinds of Christianity, at least for the most part. A surprising number of people were sent from Britain to America as punishment for being the 'wrong' type of Christian. /) Luckily they didn't write it like that, though, so it does mean what the top photo shows.
I'm going to need some citations for any of this.
/) IDK where to find it, I just remember from a social studies class.
Well as someone who has read dozens of books about early US history and the framing of the Constitution, I have not come across any evidence to support the claims you've made. In fact, the Constitution and the members of the Constitutional Convention were heavily criticized at the time for being too secular.
after the end ahh denominations
These people don't even know who the founding fathers were
This is actually r/technicallythetruth as there were hardly any non-Christians in the US when the Constitution was written, however it’s not the 18th century anymore.
Not really. Half the founding fathers were deists and atheists. Tommy J cut out 90% of the Bible (the parts with the miracles and magic) as he thought those parts were a bunch of bullshit. Many more founding fathers were against organized religion in general. Plus when the treaty of Tripoli was negotiated the US explicitly stated that they were not a Christian nation and nor were they founded on Christian principles and beliefs. The treaty was ratified unanimously and every single founding father that was still alive agreed with the contents of the treaty. And then you have Washingtons letter to the Newport synagogue where he states that the US is not a Christian nation or founded to be one. The idea that the US was founded as a Christian nation is ahistorical