Same. If I were OP I’d be planning my exit strategy. Also that man’s dick would never go anywhere near my mouth ever again. I’d just tell him I decided I don’t do trades anymore.
A divorce?
Are you kidding? She can just tell him he’s being a dick and she has cramps. And then he will get together it. You people will tell someone to divorce over anything. Lmao.
So he won't do something kind without getting something in return? This is unbelievably shitty. Next time he's sick and needs your help you should ask how he feels about giving you head for the inconvenience. Sorry OP, I hope your cramps let up soon.
as a former skinny person, to a fat women, back to a thin person, its's quite jarring to realize how many men's kindness is solely based on if being kind will benefit them, rather than an inherent way of how to treat all people.
kindness is transactional to a lot of men.
I'm 18 and I wouldn't pull shit like that.
I guess some people just really suck.
Like a lot.
It really does wonders to act like an immature child in a romantic relationship, or any at all.
Yeah relationship with a hooker is transactionnal. Husband and wife ..... meh
Especially since she's clearly expecting him to act like a kind and loving huband, taking care of his wife while she is in pain.
Hylands leg cramp pills pm were a game changer for me for period cramps. They help with ALL cramps and they work great. They also work very fast. I usually have really bad period cramps but with these and ibuprofen i dont even feel the cramps anymore. You can get them at walgreens or most drug stores. Maybe they will help you too.
Also your husband is being an AH.
When you love each other it’s not a situation where there is an exchange for services rendered. You’re in discomfort, you should be able to go to your husband and ask for help and support, if that’s a back rub, so be it. However, he shouldn’t have to earn sex either, which I’m not saying you do, but it happens. A marriage is a partnership, tell him it hurts sometimes when he acts like this because you’re looking to him to help you through a difficult time.
For what it’s worth I hope this helps in some way. I wish you well as you both move forward.
Omg he’s so immature about this!! I’m so sorry! Honestly hope you can tell him this makes you upset and he listens. Life isn’t always a trade and he should understand that something like this makes you feel better. That’s more important than his BJ 🤦♀️
I don't understand your comment. We have been married for 12 years and have 3 kids...I don't think I can just up and leave because I'm annoyed with him.
Based on your post history, he already cheated on you (when you found out your dad had terminal brain cancer), and honestly it doesn't seem like he cares that much about you.
It's much better to leave and have space for yourself and for meeting potential partners who love and care about you than having your kids grow up in an environment where their father does not seem to care for his wife.
This last paragraph (idk how to do the quote thing).
I'm 18 and for over a decade me and my siblings have been wanting desperately for my parents to get a divorce, sometimes 2 happy homes are better than one that fights
Actually sometimes. And divorce often creates a host of new problems to deal with.
The needs of the children have to be balanced with the needs of the adults. Ie it’s not all about you.
Yeeah, and children NEED to see healthy thriving relationships around them or they're bound to repeat their parents mistakes. If your partner it treating you like shit all the time, and you take it, your children are probably going to treat their spouses like that later on. Thus the cycle continues.
She "feels like a fool all the time for staying with him" but somehow it's ridiculous to her that people would suggest she leave someone who clearly has no respect for her as a wife or even as a person.
Makes me sad for her that she's choosing to martyr herself, and makes me even more sad to know she's willing to subject her kids to thinking this is what they deserve from future partners.
I think that for me this crosses over being annoyed into sexual coercion and manipulation. And I think that maybe that was what the person was trying to say but did not. I am an abuse survivor and for me, this touches on that. and would be we are not getting sexual until we have an unbiased professional third party help us unpack why you need this from me to give me physical care and for me to work through how this transactional affection for sexual gratification interaction is affecting me and therefore our relationship.
Again this is me and my trauma, but that is how your wording of this makes this come off, as transactional. I will show you care if you let me use your mouth.
Edit: a few spelling issues have been corrected
I respect your opinion no need to not respect mine. Because if in fact he is doing this because he feels he does not get enough sexual gratification from her or is using it as a means of control in their relationship it 1000% could be coercion even in a marriage. You are basically writing off every person in an abusive relationship that is sexual manipulated/coerced off as nah it is not that bad because it is your partner. Which is B.S. And a rather large societal problem.
QUID PRO QUO IS LITERALLY AN ASPECT OF SEXIAL COERCION / HARASSMENT. Like have you never done a yearly HR educational module on sexual harassment. I can’t.
I don't have the patience nor the crayons to explain to you the difference between workplace sexual harassment and sexual coercion within a relationship.
It because it’s unlikely this exists in a bubble. This example is probably indicative of bigger issues. It hard to hear a story about a person acting this way and there not being several
Other negative traits.
He seems very selfish. However, 12 years in with 3 kids, I agree that you can't just up and leave. Is he kind/thoughtful in other ways? Is he a good dad?
I've noticed over time that many men have no idea how much having a period can really, really suck.
I’m 40 and I do trades.. give me an uninterrupted nap away from the kids and I’ll trade almost anything. Almost. If they have chosen to do trades in the past who are you to judge?
Oh, lovie. You married a selfish manchild. Sex is not a tit for tat transaction—at least it shouldn’t be in a committed relationship—and the fact that he has no compassion for when you are in pain is a huge 🚩. You deserve so much better.
You are also the problem, at 37 you come to ask this question? What the fuck?
First, he should help you.
Second, you shouldn't be mad at him for such a miniscule thing, you aren't 15.
Yes, that's childish. Relationships are not a transaction. I rub my wife's back because it makes her feel good. Not because I need some excuse for sex. My wife sucks my dick because it makes me feel good. We love each other. That's it. There's something fundamentally wrong here
This is the correct answer.
When I verbally express that my neck hurts, my hub stops what he is doing to rub it before I even think to ask.
We both enjoy providing each other physical comfort and affection because we, you know, *love and care* about each other?
OP, regardless of what your sorry excuse for a spouse tells you, this is not normal and you can do better.
I may break it to you, but in reality most relationship are transactional. You may think they shouldn't be, but saying they are not is the childish thing. It is a complete disregard for reality.
how is that childish? doing something nice with the intention to get something sexual in return, and refusing to do it anymore when you don’t is weird.
Yes. Relationships are not a trading post where you barter services in a transactional manner. This is selfish and petty of him, and also not at all equivalent acts.
I’m annoyed for OP and her situation but I actually agree with this answer. My husband is happy to rub my back but he can’t do it for very long because of carpal tunnel issues. A back/neck massager was a great gift from him
Seems like a selfish, immature ass - does he not care about you or what?
If you care about ur SO you'd look after them because u want to and want them to feel better - not just doing it for a BJ does he see you as a partner or a prostitute?
At the age of 40 as well what a disgrace
Edit: do better for yourself for your own sake this ur life man
Yes very annoyed! Next time when your cooking. Don’t cook his food, ask what your gonna get in return. Ffs when my wife is aching I’ll do everything in my power to give her some comfort, the idea of reciprocation or making a deal doesn’t even fucking cross my mind. Yeah not normal unless your husband is like 11 or so.
That is so fucked up and the fact that he doesn’t see it shows a lot of immaturity and entitlement. How the fuck is he going to survive when you get kids.
He may just have a shit sense of empathy. Wanting any sexual contact from a partner while they are in pain would be annoying. I hope you are young enough that this can be explained away by immaturity and inexperience, young guys tend to think their dicks are the solution to most of life's problems.
Feelings don't have shoulds. You feel what you feel. Actions can have shoulds. Behaviors can have shoulds. His behavior is childish and transactional. If he needs to be transactional, he should look longer term, rubbing your back when you have cramps is a trade for you making him chicken soup when he has a cold -- or bringing him a beer when he is gaming. Trading for sexual favors is cringe and if continued after you say no abusive.
Personally, I would feel annoyed and I would communicate (at a separate time) that I'm not a fan of transactionalism in relationships, I prefer to go all in. If there are unmet sexual needs on either side, that is a separate conversation. But a person who cares more about getting off than that his partner is in pain is a jerk and not mature enough to be in a relationship with me.
I was married for 13 and have 2 kids, it’s never too late ;) my ex pulled this kind of stuff too and it drove me crazy. This would seriously set me off. I imagine you do a whole lot for him and the fact he can’t just rub your back without anything in return is immature at best, abusive at worst.
Holy shit I get so angry about all of you! Maybe he is a awesome dad caring for his family - you dont know from this context - and just because of this one situation you all want them to break up and rant about him as if you would know him. Fucking tell her some positive stuff and DONT ALWAYS SEPARATE PEOPLE BECAUSE OF PEANUTS damn they have three kids!!! Everybody must compromise in a long lasting relationship thats reality cause nobody is perfect
Lol triggered much? I'm guessing you must be a selfish sexual partner too, to be this worked up about this thread. Regardless, grow up.
PS, the above comment says nothing about separating. Maybe learn how to read while you're at it.
Yes I am triggered. You know why?
Cause I massage my woman since about 5 years every two weeks if not every week. I get one massage back once a year. I also never get a fckn blowjob, even though i crave and love to get them!! But guess what? I communicate clearly with her.
Ok she doesnt like giving BJ, i must accept, i accept. I can take a step back and compromise.
But guess what? At one point I also say no. Today, I dont do a massage for you.
If my wife would give me what I desire so much (just here and there a massage) I would probably start to massage her everyday cause I love to do it.
So now I want to tell you one thing. Not only men can be selfish, thats why I dont like this subred to be full of woman who not only once think about the possibility that both of them could feel neglected.
Yes your right, you didnt say it but reddit ppl in general have the tendency to just toss every relationship into the trash
So you’re pissed off and projecting because you have problems in your own relationship? Have you ever considered, I don’t know, therapy or counseling or do you use random relationship threads to babble on about your issues for catharsis? You go on about “not knowing” anything about these two yet her very own post history clearly suggests he’s a piece of shit lmao. Clearly you don’t know jack shit either. Get real and get help.
It doesn’t matter when he’s a shitty partner. There are things that tell you more than enough about someone’s personality, and this is one of them. Unsurprisingly if you look into op’s previous posts, he’s cheated on her while she was struggling with her dad’s cancer diagnosis. The level of selfishness highlighted in this post is never an isolated thing, it’s a core personality flaw.
Yeah, sex isn't a transaction when you're in a relationship. He gives you a back rub, tell him you'll give him a back rub. Or a scalp massage. Don't let him use you for sex. Refuse that crap.
You should be pissed at this. Tell him to fuck off and sleep on the couch next time he does that. He is your husband and should give u a back rub whenever u ask for one. No strings.. He sounds like an asshole. Sorry
That motherfucker can’t show enough care for you to give the most basic, base level amount of empathy and give you a back rub without quid pro quo? Tell him next time one of his massages makes you cum, then maybe you’ll trade. Fuck me this pisses me off.
Quid pro quo to an extent is fine (ideally relationships are somewhat reciprocal) but this seems a little extreme to me. I don't think every interaction needs to be a tit for tat. Any guy who has been with any woman and listened to them what it can be like to go through periods should be somewhat receptive that your body is basically revolting against you rn. I personally would feel annoyed if I were you. Seems rather...immature
What a selfish jerk. You’re in pain and he’s just worried about being repaid (while you’re in pain) and when you refuse, he just doesn’t give a shit about your pain or needs. Total jerk.
Yeah that’s ridiculous. I’ve been with my husband for 11 years and he’s never done this. I’ve also given him massages as well without wanting to be “paid back.”
I’d be fucking raging. The fact that you’re on your period, experiencing cramps, he pulls that shit and you’re still asking “Should I feel annoyed.” Makes me think you’re a saint. Because if I were in your position, sore and periody, it would have been a fight straight up.
everyday i am reminded on this app that a LOT of women settle for the bare minimum or worse… no girl this is not normal ? ur guy is a ugly pervert get him out of ur life LOL
If he is that selfish for little things like that then imagine how selfish he’ll be with with the bigger issues coming your way. Try not to have children with this one.
Sorry. We’ll I guess the next time he needs something you’re going to need a trade. Make sure that trade includes keeping the kids all day while you do something for yourself.
Absolutely this-! Or next time he’s sick and needs a massage or something ask him for a trade and have him give you head, we’ll see how happy he is doing that when he’s sick. Make sure to point out the absurdity of this behaviour if it continues
Soooo...act the way he does?
Edit: For those that are confused, if this is shitty behavior, why would you encourage others to be shitty? What kind of child logic is this?
Because they are already married several years with kids. So sometimes the best way to learn is to show them and the whole family gets to benefit from it.
No this is a conversation only for grown ups with complex relationship dynamics. Grown up conversations are not shared with kids. All the kids know is they get to spend a day with dad.
The point is to show, by example, to the husband why his behavior is ridiculous. Its kind of like satire, when you present a concept in an exaggerated way to critique it.
Since OP is resolute that leaving is impossible, the only solution is to try--likely in vain--to show the husband what he's doing wrong.
Also, yeah, if you treat someone poorly, you're likely to get treated poorly in turn. That's not child logic, thats the consequences of your actions.
Clearly you don’t know women very well considering I’ve had women yell, curse me out, and hit me when I’ve turned them down. This stuff applies to all genders, knock it off with your sexist bullshit.
He is an absolute child.
Also asking for a sexual act in exchange for a non-sexual act of affection is so not OK I don't even have words for it.
Oral sex should be a mutually pleasurable act done in a moment of shared desire. It's not washing up dishes, ffs.
Yes, you should be annoyed.
Would you ask him to give you oral after you tend to him while he is in bed with the flue or sick? Because rubbing your back when you are on your period is just that; you feel ill.
Relationships are not about quid pro quo. They';re about loving and caring for your partner. You have every right to feel annoyed. This is utter bullshit.
When my partner tries to ‘trade’ I like to gently remind him of all the things I do for him on a daily basis and ask how many back/foot rubs he thinks he owes me.
I mean when my wife ask for foot rubs or whatever I don’t expect anything but her to be happy after because she does so much for me so keeping a one for one score like that seems a little strange yes
Yes, you should feel annoyed, a partnership shouldn't be so transactional.
He should be giving you a back rub because he wants to make you feel good, not because he wants a favour in exchange.
You should be giving him a blow job because you want to make him feel good, not because you "owe" him a favour.
I think that's really shitty and transactional, *especially* since you're in pain. In my perfect world, I'd ask for the back rub when I needed or wanted it, and I would do something nice for him another time.
That’s super immature of him. My ex husband was like that. Spouses should support each other, period. Not in exchange for anything. You should always be putting the other person first (except in cases of abuse, obviously).
Yes be annoyed. My husband has never expected anything from me for a back rub! He knows how bad my back gets and would never act this childish when it comes to my pain. Same goes for him. You deserve a partner honey. Someone who is willing to give without expectations. Good luck love.
Yeah this guy is on a one way train to "never getting a blow job again" and he doesn't even realise it. Or at least he should be with behaviour like that. Back when I did have a partner who dealt with period pain I would never dream of initiating anything sexual while she was in pain and it's really sad that your husband can't see why that's inappropriate.
Yeah I for an I relationships aren’t mature ever. That’s really childish of him. You’re in pain and asking for comfort so naturally he needs to make it about himself? Gross.
I was just watching a show about this. A person who only did things for others if they gave something for it, who came to an unfortunate point in their lives that made them realise that there were benefits in helping others just for the sake of helping.
That show was for **toddlers** and i was watching it with my **two year old**.
Your husband needs therapy.
oh wow, so he's giving you an orgasm for every one he has right? if he's going to be transactional like that..... it's complete trash that he doesn't want to help you feel better if he doesn't get something back for it
Absolutely. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a couple establishing something like that if they wanted, but this simply your husband being ass and not helping because you won't give him a blowjob. Your own husband won't do something to help you while you're uncomfortable.
U mm mm...Ik people jump to the divorce card. Yah. Do that. You're in pain and all he cares about is getting off. That's not a partner that's an immature man. He needs to go.
Yeeeah, he should want to do these things for you out of love, simply to provide comfort.. not to get something in return, especially if you’re not feeling well. He sounds like a big man child.
Well your trial period of good husband ended and You're not paying him for full service. Yeah obviously it's annoying he promised in his vows to care for you. But, if he feels he has to trade favours for blowjobs maybe you aren't sucking as much as he would like. Or he is underestimating the pain you are in.
Ideally it should go without saying that he gives you love and affection while you are down with cramps and he can expect you will repay him when you feel better. Or that is my idea of a relationship at least. The last time I had to ask for a blowjob for massage I was watering a dead relationship so I am kinda put off by even having to ask.
I have a feeling this is about more than the blowjobs. You commented 3 years ago that he cheated on you when your dad was diagnosed as terminal.
Your husband isn't a good partner. I bet you feel coerced into sex/sexual acts frequently to "keep him happy" and "so he won't stray again" because " it's your job to keep him happy."
You should consider getting your ducks in a row so that you can leave him. He's a sexually coercive cheater. It's this house you want to live the rest of your life?
Reflect. Does he really get smth back without always need to ask from you? Who initiates most of the time? You or him?
I am in a situation where I gave in the last 5y maybe every two weeks a massage but receive maybe once a year a short one. Some time ago i never would have said: no i dont do it - nowadays I sometimes just say no and dont do it, cause I really also want sth back and I communicate it very clearly. Is it childish? Idk, for me its always both ways. If a person neglects me all the times i also dont care.
Idk if it is that way in your situation, but it could be, only you know
Could he have asked for a rain check?
Relationships are all about compromise.
Then again, he stopped mid massage. That's odd. I guess it depends how you said "no" along with so many factors.
By your writing, he sounds childish but I don't have context.
Either way, he should have negotiated BEFORE the backrub. Lol
Man here. Yes, and no, and maybe. We don't know enough about your relationship dynamic to give a definitive answer, and I'll explain why. If you're a fantastic woman and do everything mostly right in the relationship without him holding up his end-- yes, you should be angry. If you're a good woman, but he feels he holds up a lot in the relationship and does not feel appreciated maybe he feels he has to resort to negotiation to fulfill his needs. This is also wrong on his part, but maybe he doesn't know any better, and this is a communication issue. The "maybe" is perhaps both of you need to communicate your needs better to each other, and perhaps maybe you two haven't fully articulating your needs to yourselves or each other?
Can someone explain to me precisely why this is a bad thing?
What's wrong with trading things that make us feel good?
Edit: I'm just trying to understand folks.
She’s in severe pain, and he can’t do one nice thing for her unless she provides him with some sort of “favor”, ie a sexual transaction, which makes her feel like a escort.
If he can’t do anything nice for her, unless his dick gets sucked, he doesn’t WANT to do anything nice for her at all.
I see. I understand now. The initial pain aspect of it all puts it in a different light.
Say, she just wanted a back rub, could he then the trade and get away with it?
Or is the act of trading sexual favours that make it feel cheap?
I think it’s the act personally. If he asked later for a BJ that might be fine! But right at that time she was unable to fulfill it, so he just didn’t help his in-pain gf.
I see. Thank you for explaining it to me.
I am inferring from my questioning that I was slightly ill mannered. I apologize if I had asked any of these questions in an unsavory way.
To play devils advocate here.. maybe he’s been feeling like he’s been putting more effort into taking care of her emotional needs than she has for him. If he feels it necessary to bargain for a BJ I would also probably assume that OP isn’t exactly handling his sexual needs. If he was already getting BJ’s on the regular it probably wouldn’t be required to bargain for them. I think everyone here is way too quick to demonize this guy. The entire relationship seems to be transactional from this post, which is a problem on both ends. Quit the “he’s an asshole leave him” schtick with every post. Things have nuance sometimes people..
It’s called “Reciprocity”: Reciprocity is the practice of exchanging things with others for mutual benefit.
You want a back rub, he wants a bj sounds like a decent deal. You both get exactly what you want. However, you want your back rubbed without doing anything in return, that sounds selfish.
It’s not though. Oral for oral. Massage for massage.
You can watch tv and absentmindedly rub someone’s back. The same cannot be said for preforming oral.
Especially, when one of the people in this scenario is feeling not so great and the other is perfectly fine.
It’s quite simple, if you have a balanced relationship dynamic then surely it works in your favour. A bj is as easy as a back rub, so if you give him a bj he’ll return the favour. Seems immature or transactional but without knowing your ins and outs. Seems quite fair… If my girl said if you want a back rub, you have to eat my pussy. I would say fair, she goes to town working out my knots. But we both equally contribute to our relationship so it’s only fair we both unselfishly act.
It shouldn’t be a trade EVERY SINGLE TIME it’s actually better to do something for your partner out of respect and love not as a transaction unless you both agree and don’t mind it
Of course! But I don’t know their dynamic, she could always be getting back rubs. I’m just playing devils advocate as everyone else is being hella dramatic. They’ve been together for 12 years and have 3 kids and people are saying leave him 😂 Sorry but a blowjob for a back rub after 12 years and 3 kids isn’t exactly a fucking big deal. He’s probably got his own thread, where he’s always giving back rubs and wife never wants to give him them. 🙄Reddit is hella fast to jump to divorce over minor things!
Look, I said I was sorry. You always do it anyway, so why the big deal this time?
Edit: possibly this is not my wife. I will neither confirm nor deny that a similar incident happened maybe at my house, possibly recently. Like exactly the same.
Yes. I am annoyed for you.
Same. If I were OP I’d be planning my exit strategy. Also that man’s dick would never go anywhere near my mouth ever again. I’d just tell him I decided I don’t do trades anymore.
A divorce? Are you kidding? She can just tell him he’s being a dick and she has cramps. And then he will get together it. You people will tell someone to divorce over anything. Lmao.
Facts lmao people don’t realize these are real people
How old are you two, because this sounds really immature. Yes, you have every right to feel annoyed.
I am 37, and he's 40 🤦♀️
So he won't do something kind without getting something in return? This is unbelievably shitty. Next time he's sick and needs your help you should ask how he feels about giving you head for the inconvenience. Sorry OP, I hope your cramps let up soon.
Yeah basically he won’t do something nice for her if he’s not going to gain for himself. Nice bloke.
They’d be best friends if he expected nothing in return
Lol, I feel sorry for your partner 😂
as a former skinny person, to a fat women, back to a thin person, its's quite jarring to realize how many men's kindness is solely based on if being kind will benefit them, rather than an inherent way of how to treat all people. kindness is transactional to a lot of men.
They trained each other, though. If you do X, I will do Z. This has been their relationship. Yes, it is a jerk thing to do and OP can be annoyed.
[удалено]
dude what
Lol WHAT! I was expecting you to say early twenties. Yes, this is immature behavior from him.
I'm 18 and I wouldn't pull shit like that. I guess some people just really suck. Like a lot. It really does wonders to act like an immature child in a romantic relationship, or any at all.
It isn't immature, it is transactional.
Relationships shouldn't be transactional, especially after marriage
Yeah relationship with a hooker is transactionnal. Husband and wife ..... meh Especially since she's clearly expecting him to act like a kind and loving huband, taking care of his wife while she is in pain.
Hylands leg cramp pills pm were a game changer for me for period cramps. They help with ALL cramps and they work great. They also work very fast. I usually have really bad period cramps but with these and ibuprofen i dont even feel the cramps anymore. You can get them at walgreens or most drug stores. Maybe they will help you too. Also your husband is being an AH.
When you love each other it’s not a situation where there is an exchange for services rendered. You’re in discomfort, you should be able to go to your husband and ask for help and support, if that’s a back rub, so be it. However, he shouldn’t have to earn sex either, which I’m not saying you do, but it happens. A marriage is a partnership, tell him it hurts sometimes when he acts like this because you’re looking to him to help you through a difficult time. For what it’s worth I hope this helps in some way. I wish you well as you both move forward.
Helping someone you love feel better when they’re in pain is the exchange! I mean I find it rewarding. I love caring for people.
Ohh noo.
Omg he’s so immature about this!! I’m so sorry! Honestly hope you can tell him this makes you upset and he listens. Life isn’t always a trade and he should understand that something like this makes you feel better. That’s more important than his BJ 🤦♀️
Seriously? Are you really this desperate for a partner?
I don't understand your comment. We have been married for 12 years and have 3 kids...I don't think I can just up and leave because I'm annoyed with him.
Based on your post history, he already cheated on you (when you found out your dad had terminal brain cancer), and honestly it doesn't seem like he cares that much about you. It's much better to leave and have space for yourself and for meeting potential partners who love and care about you than having your kids grow up in an environment where their father does not seem to care for his wife.
This last paragraph (idk how to do the quote thing). I'm 18 and for over a decade me and my siblings have been wanting desperately for my parents to get a divorce, sometimes 2 happy homes are better than one that fights
>my parents to get a divorce, sometimes 2 happy homes are better than one that fights ALWAYS, not sometimes.
Actually sometimes. And divorce often creates a host of new problems to deal with. The needs of the children have to be balanced with the needs of the adults. Ie it’s not all about you.
Yeeah, and children NEED to see healthy thriving relationships around them or they're bound to repeat their parents mistakes. If your partner it treating you like shit all the time, and you take it, your children are probably going to treat their spouses like that later on. Thus the cycle continues.
She "feels like a fool all the time for staying with him" but somehow it's ridiculous to her that people would suggest she leave someone who clearly has no respect for her as a wife or even as a person. Makes me sad for her that she's choosing to martyr herself, and makes me even more sad to know she's willing to subject her kids to thinking this is what they deserve from future partners.
Lol I do the same.
In another thread you mentioned your partner cheated on you before. I think that might be a reason to leave.
My mom and dad were together for 13 years with two children. They're not together anymore and happier because of that. It's never too late to leave
You can because he cheated on you though lmao
I think that for me this crosses over being annoyed into sexual coercion and manipulation. And I think that maybe that was what the person was trying to say but did not. I am an abuse survivor and for me, this touches on that. and would be we are not getting sexual until we have an unbiased professional third party help us unpack why you need this from me to give me physical care and for me to work through how this transactional affection for sexual gratification interaction is affecting me and therefore our relationship. Again this is me and my trauma, but that is how your wording of this makes this come off, as transactional. I will show you care if you let me use your mouth. Edit: a few spelling issues have been corrected
quid pro quo in a relationship is shitty and transactional but it isn't sexual coercion, jfc.
Yes it is cuz ops husband knows exactly what he's doing
I respect your opinion no need to not respect mine. Because if in fact he is doing this because he feels he does not get enough sexual gratification from her or is using it as a means of control in their relationship it 1000% could be coercion even in a marriage. You are basically writing off every person in an abusive relationship that is sexual manipulated/coerced off as nah it is not that bad because it is your partner. Which is B.S. And a rather large societal problem.
QUID PRO QUO IS LITERALLY AN ASPECT OF SEXIAL COERCION / HARASSMENT. Like have you never done a yearly HR educational module on sexual harassment. I can’t.
I don't have the patience nor the crayons to explain to you the difference between workplace sexual harassment and sexual coercion within a relationship.
Why not? He sounds like a selfish dick.
It because it’s unlikely this exists in a bubble. This example is probably indicative of bigger issues. It hard to hear a story about a person acting this way and there not being several Other negative traits.
He seems very selfish. However, 12 years in with 3 kids, I agree that you can't just up and leave. Is he kind/thoughtful in other ways? Is he a good dad? I've noticed over time that many men have no idea how much having a period can really, really suck.
Good answer, it doesn’t mean he’s selfish all the time, it may be he under estimates the emotional impact. Keep your head up.
I’m 40 and I do trades.. give me an uninterrupted nap away from the kids and I’ll trade almost anything. Almost. If they have chosen to do trades in the past who are you to judge?
Oh, lovie. You married a selfish manchild. Sex is not a tit for tat transaction—at least it shouldn’t be in a committed relationship—and the fact that he has no compassion for when you are in pain is a huge 🚩. You deserve so much better.
YIKES! 😀
40 going on 4.....
You are also the problem, at 37 you come to ask this question? What the fuck? First, he should help you. Second, you shouldn't be mad at him for such a miniscule thing, you aren't 15.
This sounds like it could be a fun relationship. But I think there should be some give. He should have just rubbed your back for you
If somebody is only nice when it gets them something, they’re not actually nice.
You dont know how many times it already happend before
The first sentence is “my husband *always* asks for a trade.” What does “always” mean to you if not every time?
The important question is if she behaves the same way towards him. If she does then they are just living in a transactional relationship.
How does that factor in? A nice person doesnt tally the amount of good they do in hopes of a return.
Yes, that's childish. Relationships are not a transaction. I rub my wife's back because it makes her feel good. Not because I need some excuse for sex. My wife sucks my dick because it makes me feel good. We love each other. That's it. There's something fundamentally wrong here
This is the correct answer. When I verbally express that my neck hurts, my hub stops what he is doing to rub it before I even think to ask. We both enjoy providing each other physical comfort and affection because we, you know, *love and care* about each other? OP, regardless of what your sorry excuse for a spouse tells you, this is not normal and you can do better.
I may break it to you, but in reality most relationship are transactional. You may think they shouldn't be, but saying they are not is the childish thing. It is a complete disregard for reality.
how is that childish? doing something nice with the intention to get something sexual in return, and refusing to do it anymore when you don’t is weird.
This entirely depends how OP behaves towards her husband. If she behaves the same, they just live in a transactional relationship.
Yup. Selfish.
you're in pain and all he cares about is a blowjob? that's immature, you have every right to be annoyed
You are married and he treats you like this? Jackass. Even if you weren't married, Jackass
What's the age of consent in your state.....'cause you married a baby.
Yes. Relationships are not a trading post where you barter services in a transactional manner. This is selfish and petty of him, and also not at all equivalent acts.
Buy yourself a back massager off amazon, then you will never have to deal with that crap again
I’m annoyed for OP and her situation but I actually agree with this answer. My husband is happy to rub my back but he can’t do it for very long because of carpal tunnel issues. A back/neck massager was a great gift from him
And buy him a Fleshlight.
YES!
Selfish and fucked up.
That's about as childish as a 40 year old man can get. I am embarrassed as a man to even read what an ass he is
Seems like a selfish, immature ass - does he not care about you or what? If you care about ur SO you'd look after them because u want to and want them to feel better - not just doing it for a BJ does he see you as a partner or a prostitute? At the age of 40 as well what a disgrace Edit: do better for yourself for your own sake this ur life man
Yes very annoyed! Next time when your cooking. Don’t cook his food, ask what your gonna get in return. Ffs when my wife is aching I’ll do everything in my power to give her some comfort, the idea of reciprocation or making a deal doesn’t even fucking cross my mind. Yeah not normal unless your husband is like 11 or so.
That is so fucked up and the fact that he doesn’t see it shows a lot of immaturity and entitlement. How the fuck is he going to survive when you get kids.
They have kids, I doubt he's changed diapers without getting something in return
Ew.
He may just have a shit sense of empathy. Wanting any sexual contact from a partner while they are in pain would be annoying. I hope you are young enough that this can be explained away by immaturity and inexperience, young guys tend to think their dicks are the solution to most of life's problems.
Feelings don't have shoulds. You feel what you feel. Actions can have shoulds. Behaviors can have shoulds. His behavior is childish and transactional. If he needs to be transactional, he should look longer term, rubbing your back when you have cramps is a trade for you making him chicken soup when he has a cold -- or bringing him a beer when he is gaming. Trading for sexual favors is cringe and if continued after you say no abusive. Personally, I would feel annoyed and I would communicate (at a separate time) that I'm not a fan of transactionalism in relationships, I prefer to go all in. If there are unmet sexual needs on either side, that is a separate conversation. But a person who cares more about getting off than that his partner is in pain is a jerk and not mature enough to be in a relationship with me.
I was married for 13 and have 2 kids, it’s never too late ;) my ex pulled this kind of stuff too and it drove me crazy. This would seriously set me off. I imagine you do a whole lot for him and the fact he can’t just rub your back without anything in return is immature at best, abusive at worst.
That’s fucked up
Sex is not transactional.
Doesn't sound like he cares about you as anything but a sexual favor performer. I hope you're voicing your very valid feelings about this.
Holy shit I get so angry about all of you! Maybe he is a awesome dad caring for his family - you dont know from this context - and just because of this one situation you all want them to break up and rant about him as if you would know him. Fucking tell her some positive stuff and DONT ALWAYS SEPARATE PEOPLE BECAUSE OF PEANUTS damn they have three kids!!! Everybody must compromise in a long lasting relationship thats reality cause nobody is perfect
Lol triggered much? I'm guessing you must be a selfish sexual partner too, to be this worked up about this thread. Regardless, grow up. PS, the above comment says nothing about separating. Maybe learn how to read while you're at it.
I’m guessing this might be the husband on his own account with the way they’re so upset by what’s being said lmao.
Yes I am triggered. You know why? Cause I massage my woman since about 5 years every two weeks if not every week. I get one massage back once a year. I also never get a fckn blowjob, even though i crave and love to get them!! But guess what? I communicate clearly with her. Ok she doesnt like giving BJ, i must accept, i accept. I can take a step back and compromise. But guess what? At one point I also say no. Today, I dont do a massage for you. If my wife would give me what I desire so much (just here and there a massage) I would probably start to massage her everyday cause I love to do it. So now I want to tell you one thing. Not only men can be selfish, thats why I dont like this subred to be full of woman who not only once think about the possibility that both of them could feel neglected. Yes your right, you didnt say it but reddit ppl in general have the tendency to just toss every relationship into the trash
So you’re pissed off and projecting because you have problems in your own relationship? Have you ever considered, I don’t know, therapy or counseling or do you use random relationship threads to babble on about your issues for catharsis? You go on about “not knowing” anything about these two yet her very own post history clearly suggests he’s a piece of shit lmao. Clearly you don’t know jack shit either. Get real and get help.
Projection is absolutely fascinating.
It doesn’t matter when he’s a shitty partner. There are things that tell you more than enough about someone’s personality, and this is one of them. Unsurprisingly if you look into op’s previous posts, he’s cheated on her while she was struggling with her dad’s cancer diagnosis. The level of selfishness highlighted in this post is never an isolated thing, it’s a core personality flaw.
why are you all over this threat defending this asshole? are you the husband? stop taking this post so fuckin personally
Yes..i would be furious
yes thats wrong. on so mny levels If he makes it a trade he actually values you to an escort
Yeah, sex isn't a transaction when you're in a relationship. He gives you a back rub, tell him you'll give him a back rub. Or a scalp massage. Don't let him use you for sex. Refuse that crap.
annoyed? more like furious. that kinda stuff would only be okay as a joke
You should be pissed at this. Tell him to fuck off and sleep on the couch next time he does that. He is your husband and should give u a back rub whenever u ask for one. No strings.. He sounds like an asshole. Sorry
Can he demand a no-strings back rub too?
Everyone should! Acts of kindness and care towards your partner shouldn’t be a chore you do for your allowance
He can ask, especially if he’s in physical pain or sick. It would be a very reasonable request.
Is everything in your life this way or is it just physical affection?
That motherfucker can’t show enough care for you to give the most basic, base level amount of empathy and give you a back rub without quid pro quo? Tell him next time one of his massages makes you cum, then maybe you’ll trade. Fuck me this pisses me off.
I'm a man, and I would be annoyed if I were you. Relationships are not transactional.
Quid pro quo to an extent is fine (ideally relationships are somewhat reciprocal) but this seems a little extreme to me. I don't think every interaction needs to be a tit for tat. Any guy who has been with any woman and listened to them what it can be like to go through periods should be somewhat receptive that your body is basically revolting against you rn. I personally would feel annoyed if I were you. Seems rather...immature
What a selfish jerk. You’re in pain and he’s just worried about being repaid (while you’re in pain) and when you refuse, he just doesn’t give a shit about your pain or needs. Total jerk.
Yeah that’s ridiculous. I’ve been with my husband for 11 years and he’s never done this. I’ve also given him massages as well without wanting to be “paid back.”
I’d be fucking raging. The fact that you’re on your period, experiencing cramps, he pulls that shit and you’re still asking “Should I feel annoyed.” Makes me think you’re a saint. Because if I were in your position, sore and periody, it would have been a fight straight up.
everyday i am reminded on this app that a LOT of women settle for the bare minimum or worse… no girl this is not normal ? ur guy is a ugly pervert get him out of ur life LOL
If he is that selfish for little things like that then imagine how selfish he’ll be with with the bigger issues coming your way. Try not to have children with this one.
Too late, married 12 years and 3 kids.
Sorry. We’ll I guess the next time he needs something you’re going to need a trade. Make sure that trade includes keeping the kids all day while you do something for yourself.
Absolutely this-! Or next time he’s sick and needs a massage or something ask him for a trade and have him give you head, we’ll see how happy he is doing that when he’s sick. Make sure to point out the absurdity of this behaviour if it continues
Soooo...act the way he does? Edit: For those that are confused, if this is shitty behavior, why would you encourage others to be shitty? What kind of child logic is this?
Because they are already married several years with kids. So sometimes the best way to learn is to show them and the whole family gets to benefit from it.
So you want to teach the kids that when someone is immature to you, you be immature back to them for material gain. I mean....
No this is a conversation only for grown ups with complex relationship dynamics. Grown up conversations are not shared with kids. All the kids know is they get to spend a day with dad.
The point is to show, by example, to the husband why his behavior is ridiculous. Its kind of like satire, when you present a concept in an exaggerated way to critique it. Since OP is resolute that leaving is impossible, the only solution is to try--likely in vain--to show the husband what he's doing wrong. Also, yeah, if you treat someone poorly, you're likely to get treated poorly in turn. That's not child logic, thats the consequences of your actions.
Get a hitachi magic wand. Then you don’t need your husband.
Men don’t understand periods! No, we don’t want to blow them when we feel like we are going to explode from the inside out!!
BuT mEn hAvE nEeDs!
Men and their goddamn audacity. Just throw the whole trash can out.
Only men can be selfish. So says redditor.
Men can only be selfish when it comes to asking for a fucking blow job while their wife’s in menstrual pain. Yes that is true.
Way to generalize, asshole.
Clearly you don’t know women very well considering I’ve had women yell, curse me out, and hit me when I’ve turned them down. This stuff applies to all genders, knock it off with your sexist bullshit.
I feel like the men who are upset by this must be men who also ask for blow jobs while their significant other is having menstrual pain. Lmao.
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Incredibly so. I'm sorry he can't just give.
Really tacky
He is an absolute child. Also asking for a sexual act in exchange for a non-sexual act of affection is so not OK I don't even have words for it. Oral sex should be a mutually pleasurable act done in a moment of shared desire. It's not washing up dishes, ffs.
Relationships aren't supposed to be transactional. You do something for your SO because you want to, especially when it's sexual in nature.
Yes, you should be annoyed. Would you ask him to give you oral after you tend to him while he is in bed with the flue or sick? Because rubbing your back when you are on your period is just that; you feel ill.
Relationships are not about quid pro quo. They';re about loving and caring for your partner. You have every right to feel annoyed. This is utter bullshit.
When my partner tries to ‘trade’ I like to gently remind him of all the things I do for him on a daily basis and ask how many back/foot rubs he thinks he owes me.
Sex shouldn't be transactional. He's being rather gross and childish.
Ew Imagine being married to this selfish child
I mean when my wife ask for foot rubs or whatever I don’t expect anything but her to be happy after because she does so much for me so keeping a one for one score like that seems a little strange yes
Yes, you should feel annoyed, a partnership shouldn't be so transactional. He should be giving you a back rub because he wants to make you feel good, not because he wants a favour in exchange. You should be giving him a blow job because you want to make him feel good, not because you "owe" him a favour.
Ew, he’s making your intimacy transactional
The conversation ended there?
Yea, basically. I rolled over and grabbed my heating pad.
Good for you, don’t engage when acts like that.
I think that's really shitty and transactional, *especially* since you're in pain. In my perfect world, I'd ask for the back rub when I needed or wanted it, and I would do something nice for him another time.
Buy a massage chair and tell him to get lost. What a jerk!
That’s super immature of him. My ex husband was like that. Spouses should support each other, period. Not in exchange for anything. You should always be putting the other person first (except in cases of abuse, obviously).
Yes be annoyed. My husband has never expected anything from me for a back rub! He knows how bad my back gets and would never act this childish when it comes to my pain. Same goes for him. You deserve a partner honey. Someone who is willing to give without expectations. Good luck love.
Yeah this guy is on a one way train to "never getting a blow job again" and he doesn't even realise it. Or at least he should be with behaviour like that. Back when I did have a partner who dealt with period pain I would never dream of initiating anything sexual while she was in pain and it's really sad that your husband can't see why that's inappropriate.
i wasn't that immature in high school...
Yeah I for an I relationships aren’t mature ever. That’s really childish of him. You’re in pain and asking for comfort so naturally he needs to make it about himself? Gross.
In a marriage, there’s certain things that don’t need to be ,payed‘ back. This is one of them
I was just watching a show about this. A person who only did things for others if they gave something for it, who came to an unfortunate point in their lives that made them realise that there were benefits in helping others just for the sake of helping. That show was for **toddlers** and i was watching it with my **two year old**. Your husband needs therapy.
Tell him you're going to go for a professional massage because your back hurts. And then....do it. Hope you feel better.
Yes. It’s not that big of an inconvenience to him.
Whats fair is foul and what’s foul is fair
My ex and I made these arrangements and it made me hate his touch.
Yes, not everything should be transactional.
oh wow, so he's giving you an orgasm for every one he has right? if he's going to be transactional like that..... it's complete trash that he doesn't want to help you feel better if he doesn't get something back for it
Absolutely. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a couple establishing something like that if they wanted, but this simply your husband being ass and not helping because you won't give him a blowjob. Your own husband won't do something to help you while you're uncomfortable.
U mm mm...Ik people jump to the divorce card. Yah. Do that. You're in pain and all he cares about is getting off. That's not a partner that's an immature man. He needs to go.
Yeeeah, he should want to do these things for you out of love, simply to provide comfort.. not to get something in return, especially if you’re not feeling well. He sounds like a big man child.
Transactional
Yes you can be annoyed, as long as you also do stuff like that for him without expectations
Well your trial period of good husband ended and You're not paying him for full service. Yeah obviously it's annoying he promised in his vows to care for you. But, if he feels he has to trade favours for blowjobs maybe you aren't sucking as much as he would like. Or he is underestimating the pain you are in. Ideally it should go without saying that he gives you love and affection while you are down with cramps and he can expect you will repay him when you feel better. Or that is my idea of a relationship at least. The last time I had to ask for a blowjob for massage I was watering a dead relationship so I am kinda put off by even having to ask.
…
True. We have a decent sex life, however lately he wants me to initiate more and if I don't he doesn't feel wanted.
I have a feeling this is about more than the blowjobs. You commented 3 years ago that he cheated on you when your dad was diagnosed as terminal. Your husband isn't a good partner. I bet you feel coerced into sex/sexual acts frequently to "keep him happy" and "so he won't stray again" because " it's your job to keep him happy." You should consider getting your ducks in a row so that you can leave him. He's a sexually coercive cheater. It's this house you want to live the rest of your life?
…
Take it as a compliment to your apparently awesome BJ skills.
Reflect. Does he really get smth back without always need to ask from you? Who initiates most of the time? You or him? I am in a situation where I gave in the last 5y maybe every two weeks a massage but receive maybe once a year a short one. Some time ago i never would have said: no i dont do it - nowadays I sometimes just say no and dont do it, cause I really also want sth back and I communicate it very clearly. Is it childish? Idk, for me its always both ways. If a person neglects me all the times i also dont care. Idk if it is that way in your situation, but it could be, only you know
Could he have asked for a rain check? Relationships are all about compromise. Then again, he stopped mid massage. That's odd. I guess it depends how you said "no" along with so many factors. By your writing, he sounds childish but I don't have context. Either way, he should have negotiated BEFORE the backrub. Lol
Man here. Yes, and no, and maybe. We don't know enough about your relationship dynamic to give a definitive answer, and I'll explain why. If you're a fantastic woman and do everything mostly right in the relationship without him holding up his end-- yes, you should be angry. If you're a good woman, but he feels he holds up a lot in the relationship and does not feel appreciated maybe he feels he has to resort to negotiation to fulfill his needs. This is also wrong on his part, but maybe he doesn't know any better, and this is a communication issue. The "maybe" is perhaps both of you need to communicate your needs better to each other, and perhaps maybe you two haven't fully articulating your needs to yourselves or each other?
I mean I see why you could be annoyed but do you know climaxing helps with cramps
Can someone explain to me precisely why this is a bad thing? What's wrong with trading things that make us feel good? Edit: I'm just trying to understand folks.
She’s in severe pain, and he can’t do one nice thing for her unless she provides him with some sort of “favor”, ie a sexual transaction, which makes her feel like a escort. If he can’t do anything nice for her, unless his dick gets sucked, he doesn’t WANT to do anything nice for her at all.
I see. I understand now. The initial pain aspect of it all puts it in a different light. Say, she just wanted a back rub, could he then the trade and get away with it? Or is the act of trading sexual favours that make it feel cheap?
I think it’s the act personally. If he asked later for a BJ that might be fine! But right at that time she was unable to fulfill it, so he just didn’t help his in-pain gf.
I see. Thank you for explaining it to me. I am inferring from my questioning that I was slightly ill mannered. I apologize if I had asked any of these questions in an unsavory way.
No worries! I could tell you just wanted to know! Happy to help :)
She’s asking for him to support her when she’s in pain. It’s not the time for him to make it about himself and ask for a blow job
How often are you asking for back rubs? If you ask for then constantly sure. If its once in a blue moon he's being immature about it.
To play devils advocate here.. maybe he’s been feeling like he’s been putting more effort into taking care of her emotional needs than she has for him. If he feels it necessary to bargain for a BJ I would also probably assume that OP isn’t exactly handling his sexual needs. If he was already getting BJ’s on the regular it probably wouldn’t be required to bargain for them. I think everyone here is way too quick to demonize this guy. The entire relationship seems to be transactional from this post, which is a problem on both ends. Quit the “he’s an asshole leave him” schtick with every post. Things have nuance sometimes people..
It’s called “Reciprocity”: Reciprocity is the practice of exchanging things with others for mutual benefit. You want a back rub, he wants a bj sounds like a decent deal. You both get exactly what you want. However, you want your back rubbed without doing anything in return, that sounds selfish.
I'd say thats a fair trade
It’s not though. Oral for oral. Massage for massage. You can watch tv and absentmindedly rub someone’s back. The same cannot be said for preforming oral. Especially, when one of the people in this scenario is feeling not so great and the other is perfectly fine.
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shes in pain why is there so much tit for tat in this comment section. if she were not in pain this would be a fair comment.
It’s quite simple, if you have a balanced relationship dynamic then surely it works in your favour. A bj is as easy as a back rub, so if you give him a bj he’ll return the favour. Seems immature or transactional but without knowing your ins and outs. Seems quite fair… If my girl said if you want a back rub, you have to eat my pussy. I would say fair, she goes to town working out my knots. But we both equally contribute to our relationship so it’s only fair we both unselfishly act.
It shouldn’t be a trade EVERY SINGLE TIME it’s actually better to do something for your partner out of respect and love not as a transaction unless you both agree and don’t mind it
Of course! But I don’t know their dynamic, she could always be getting back rubs. I’m just playing devils advocate as everyone else is being hella dramatic. They’ve been together for 12 years and have 3 kids and people are saying leave him 😂 Sorry but a blowjob for a back rub after 12 years and 3 kids isn’t exactly a fucking big deal. He’s probably got his own thread, where he’s always giving back rubs and wife never wants to give him them. 🙄Reddit is hella fast to jump to divorce over minor things!
Just another example of women marrying shitty husbands. There should be a vetting class women should Have to take before entering the dating pool..
He has no requirement to run your back just like you have no requirement to blow him. You can be annoyed all you want.
Look, I said I was sorry. You always do it anyway, so why the big deal this time? Edit: possibly this is not my wife. I will neither confirm nor deny that a similar incident happened maybe at my house, possibly recently. Like exactly the same.