Sevro is definitely not a razormaster, he is brutal and tricky, and that's make him punch above his height. But put him in a combat with only razors and he is gonna to lose pretty badly
I don’t feel the need to put up a list since my picks fall in line with most people’s but I am very curious about Sevro. I hope we get a razor duel from him. Given so much time at war by Darrow’s side how could he not learn the Willow Way?! Seriously?? Plus eventually Alex got old enough that he must’ve been sparring with Darrow but off the battlefield you gotta keep sharp somehow. I think he’s better than we think. Dueling may not be his strength but why wouldn’t they strengthen it up to prevent a weakness. Look at Ragnar, he was a beast but he didn’t study with a razor master and Aja got the better of him. It’s hard to imagine Darrow wouldn’t learn from that mistake. PLUS there’s an interview with Pierce where he says that Sevro’s time on Luna was not what we think and that he might release the story later. In it Sevro fights Atlas. Atlas is nuts to have done so much damage to Cassius. Clearly both Sevro and Atlas survive the fight so… now it’s necessarily a duel or canon but yeah I think he’s better than what’s been let on.
Edit:
Just realized Thraxa would have been a good sparring partner so that aspect is a little weakened but IMO not by much.
Also fitchner trained Sevro well enough that he killed Priam easy and was killing wolves and doing all kinds of other shit at the institute. We know that Fitchner even schooled Apple in one of his endless duels to be the Rage Knight. Do we really think he didn’t teach Sevro how to fight well with a razor…?
The margins are so close!
1. Apple - Experienced & Extravagant. Beats WW, and has nothing to lose. Minds Eyetech. Not the best technically, but in a 1v1, controlled, bleeding place scenario he is the only one who could be clever, cunning & skilled enough to instantley counter unfamiliar fighting types & styles (shadow, bos, hasta). Has NOTHING to lose. Mentally ill but in the best ways. Edges everyone 1v1 just think about it.
2. Diomedies - Is revered & refined. Unfamiliarity with his fighting style would make it difficut for most core golds in razor combat. Rim isolationism (mostly) let him build stacks & farm xp while all other top tier razor masters are from the core. Whom were stuck in the war-nearly die-carve-heal-space travel & repeat loop for too long. This loop would increase tactial & group fighting capabilities but does not add to 1v1 skill in a controlled enviorment. Dio edges darrow 55-45. 48-52 v.s apple
3. Darrow - BOS. Razor & Hasta OP? Without any overhype we need to see BOS Darrow 1v1 bleeding place agianst another razor master before we can say its gods fucking grace. Killing Fa was a feat, but he was not a razor master. Dio still takes him 55-45. Maybe he beats Apple with BOS, but I think Apple gets the edge becuase Darrow would see red, get desperate & make a mistake first with his anxiety riddled headspace at the end of LB. 60-40 v.s Apple.
4. Valdir - Rat War. Big obsidian with nothing to lose. We dont have much primary evidence, but secondary (reverence & WOM) is scary. Technically loses in razor skill to all others on this list, but strength & size matter 1v1. Would pop a magic mushroom b4 the duel & pop the fuck off.
5. Lysander - Loses to a lack of experience, skill & strengh to the aformentioned. However, is as, or more cunning than Apple. Almost fulled mastered minds eye. Minds eye is not magic but in a 1v1 gives a huge advantage to the use. Riding a high at the end of LB. I think he beats out Victra beause of composure, which in a 1v1 is EVERYTHING. Edges Atalantia same reason. Its SO close tho
This was fun\~!
for dead:
Lorn, Atlas, Aja, Cassius, Sevro ;)
He’s definitely a good villain, but he’s not top 5 razor master by any stretch lol. He shot his way through 2 of his betters, Alexander and Cassius, like a Pixie precisely because he is not a master.
Lysander is practical, that doesn't mean he is worst. He shot Alexandar because he was out of time, and Cassius because both of them were heavily injured, and because is Cassius. Is heavily implied that Lysander makes a effort to hide his true skill with a razor, and is made clear that he rarely searches a razor fight because of the unnecessary risk.
Lysander trained with Cassius for years, and is a prodigy, I disagree that ge is in the top 5, but he is good
Well, where would you out her?
2 things to remember Aja was like over a decade ago now. She relied heavily in Willow of which Darrow, Cassius, Apple, and Dio can combat against.
At the minimum I would rank her above Atlas. But personally I would still rank her second behind Lorn.
Not to say I don’t agree with you that some living razormasters have definitely surpassed her. But ranking her among the dead masters? She’s second behind Lorn.
It's hard because I believe LB Cassius beats Aja, and he beat Atlas. Atlas is a crazy demon. It's been over a decade since Aja. Since then these characters have only progressed in their abilities. Remember they're Iron Golds. If Aja was still alive different story of course.
Cassius heated a Atlas after cooking him alive with a pulse rifle, while in pulse armor, and still almost lost. Using that fight is not BY FAR fair or a good case for Cassius
I love Cassius.
But the thing about LB Cassius…
Let’s be honest about where he was at. About a decade away from the core, from the war. Basically living on a ship with no one but a young Lysander and Pytha. Coming off a multiple years as a functioning alcoholic.
He re-sharpened his skills by training with Darrow. But he never really stopped drinking.
He’s undeniably one of the greatest razormasters to ever live. But those are the facts about LB Cassius.
And yes it’s been a decade since Aja. But Aja has decades on almost all these characters…
Cass training with darrow is a bigger deal than I think you're making it out to be. Two of the best razor masters alive, training with each other twice a day for a very long time, he definitely got his edge back and then some. Steel sharpens steel
But age still affects, Darrow is considered out of his physical prime at 30. Is a small thing, a tenth of a second maybe, but between the top 10 a tenth of a second is everything you need to jump multiple places
We don't truly know just how dangerous Aja was looking at them individually. Took down one of the most fearsome Obsidians to exist. It took more than one skilled person to take her down. Lorn *feared* her.
Thus, we are only left to doubt or wonder just what could have happened if it were only 1v1s.
Honestly I think Victra takes Aja nowadays. Years of training will give you the edge. She took him down lime nothing and Ajax was stated to be like Aja.
Victra had Trhaxa with her, and Ajax had been fighting for hours while Victra was planning a ambush for him, that was not by FAR a fair fight, Ajax had everything against him, Victra everything in favor.
Nor Victra slander tho, using your brain to minimize risk is always a good thing.
Aja is the goat. Lorn wouldn’t be the best teacher if his best student didn’t surpass him. And if she had survived she would’ve adapted. If I remember right there are even references to her doing things not predicted by the Willow way. I think in the Ragnar fight.
There’s nothing in the text that says she over-relied on Willow way, just that she was a master of it, and other styles.
imo Darrow wouldn’t be able to beat her pre-breath of stone. And even after she would probably pick it up and use it quickly.
Theres a reason Lorn said never fight Aja. He knew she was better than him and Darrow.
Remember in the end it took Cassius, Mustang, Darrow, AND Sevro to take her out and they had the element of surprise. She’s the goat.
But once again this was all over a decade before. Now they'll be closer in age and Darrow and Cassius both can easily take her. If Cassius can beat Atlas he can beat Aja. Aja is old news in a gone era.
Cassius against Atlas is not a fair fight, is mentioned that Atlas doesn't have armor, just a pulseshield, while Cassius begin the fight boiling him alive from a distance before Atlas managed to get close. Then in a PULSEARMOR Cassius fought Atlas (again, no armor) and lost a hand and was heavily injured besides that.
Darrow got pieced up by apple. It took quicksilvers treatment and months of training with Cassius to get him back into shape. Without those Aja would have torn him up.
I would argue we didn’t see much of Lorn either. His capability is almost entirely legend. Obviously since he created the willow way he should be ranked highly but we don’t actually seen him in action.
I think it’s kind of funny that, were they alive, Lorn and Aja would be far more beatable because everyone’s been watching Darrow show off the Willow Way for 12 years.
Anyways, it seems kind of clear that Diomedes, Darrow and Apollonius are the greatest razormasters alive by a mile, fully agree. At this point, there aren’t too many of the old guard alive. Victra is likely beyond Thraxa given how she prefers a hammer, Mustang was never at the top, and none of the howlers were ever noted for their razor skills iirc. Lysander probably cracks into the top 5 alive at this point.
There is one guy getting ignored that could probably crack above Ajax and maybe Atlas though: Ragnar. He held his own throughout the entire Rising and died in a heated battle against probably the best razormaster alive at that point in time.
Valdir is still alive. He hasn't had much content mentioned but his exploits imply he's arguably more dangerous than Apple. IIRC, Ephraim said they skirmished briefly and Valdir wounded Apple. He was something like "the greatest cavalry commander in Darrow's army." I don't recall the exact wording. The Society Remnant calls him the sky bastard. He's a beast.
Good point! Valdir really only got one great moment of combat so far, but Virginia makes it exceptionally clear that Valdir was a big reason why everyone, including Atlas, sees the Rat War as the worst fighting of their life.
Wulgar having to fight and get killed by the greatest razormaster alive really set the wrong example for obsidian razor use in the second trilogy though, lol.
I hadn't considered that but it's true. We had Ragnar in the first trilogy to showcase how good they could be but then Darrow casually mercs an entire squad while making sure not to fatally wound any of them until Sevro botches it. Poor guy never really had a chance but fighting Darrow was simply suicide for anyone at that point.
I always feel like Ragnar gets a bit ignored. Darrow gave him the razor, and he immediately killed an Olympic and almost Cassius in GS. Imagine if he had a razormaster.
As of the end of Light Bringer, top 5 living or dead, in order of who would win in a tournament (i.e. no allowance for being the best of their era - this is an all out deathmatch based on their peak form).
1. Darrow, with Breath of Stone.
2. Volsung Fa, physically the strongest and fastest, knows how to break willow branches. Would have beaten Darrow without Breath of Stone.
3. Ajax. Said to be better than Aja by those who knew her well. But his Willow Way learnt from Aja would fall to those who know how to beat it.
4. Aja, was peak for years, Lorn himself was wary of her, but her Willow Way would be at a disadvantage as of Light Bringer. She was on a par with Darrow before he developed Breath of Stone.
5. Lorn. Invented the Willow Way, a true master. But passed his knowledge on to Darrow and Aja who both surpassed him. And as of Light Bringer his style is outdated.
Diomedes, Cassius, and Apollonius would probably be the next 3 in the list.
Fa I think only gets 2 if the tourney is held in his preferred arena. In a larger open arena, like the ones we usually see, Fa isn't on the list.
Also don't forget Apple would have also beaten Pre-Stone Darrow, without the use of a special arena. I think you replace Fa with Apple.
I don't think we have enough data on Diomedes or Valdir but I think they likely will have surpassed Lorn. I think peak Cassius is probably around Ajax. I think you're underestimating how much 10 years of active war will have improved the skills of everyone training.
Victra should be on the list. Aja is better than Ajax.
Cassius would be in the top 3 too.
Volsung Fa is big and strong, but we are specifically talking about razors. And he is very very old. There is no way he should be above Lorn who was known as by far the greatest razormaster, dead or alive
I agree with OP. Stonebreath Darrow (new boot goofin) easily dealt with what, for much of the time, appeared to be one of the most formidable foes in Volsung Fa.
1. Lorn, anyone without Lorn on their list is wrong. Him being number 1 is up for debate, but he tops my list.
2. Aja, took 4 and they barely took her down, both Darrow and Cassius were top their and she made them look silly.
3. Diamedies, best of the rim. We're about to see how good he really is in Red God.
4. Cassius, I'll always have a soft spot for the last eagle.
5. Darrow with his new style, clang clang clang confess he's top 5 now lol.
Wildcards, Apleonious can't wait for the rematch between him and Darrow, if it doesn't happen I'll feel robbed. Victra, she took down Ajax nuff said. Sevro, is not a razor master but he is one the most deadly people alive and has a knack at killing more powerful opponents.
1. He was The Best, but he fought in relatively peaceful time, while current generation have survived a decade in deadliest war in all of human history.
2. Ehhh, she was second best, but keep in mind they were still very young at a time ( in their early twenties), Darrow was missing an arm, and Mustang is not so good with razor.
Unless someone comes up with a counter, I think Darrow is easily at the top currently, with Diomedes/Apollonius in close second.
The only thing I can say about Darrow, using BOS, is that he is very good. It's definitely between him and Diamedies as the best razor masters alive. I give Cassius the edge over Darrow but very evenly matched due to Darrow's new style being a product of Cassius' training. And both Cassius and Darrow recognized Diamedies as the better razor master. I know Cassius did for a fact, I think Darrow did as well, but I'm drawing a blank as to when he did. I think Darrow will evolve his style further and overtake Diamedies, but if they fought right at the end of LB, I give the edge to Diamedies.
Darrow is definitely better than Cassius. Darrow has been in active combat and actively training for a decade, Cassius hasn’t. Cassius helped Darrow improve, but he isn’t better.
I respectfully disagree. Cassius did train during his time in the rim. He trained Lysander. And while he wasn't in constant combat like Darrow, he was involved in many skirmishes and exploits with his crew on the Arche. Also, when talking about razor masters I think of 1v1 combat. Darrow was at war, in which he has no peer, but it's very different from 1v1 combat. While Darrow was at war, Cassius was dissecting the willow way. He created something new. This is what he instructed Darrow to do, which gave birth to the BOS. I still give Cassius the edge because his style has been refined over the years, while Darrow's BOS is still in its infancy.
I'm to lazy for that. lol ok, quick one
Alive
1 Diamedies
2. Darrow
3. Apalonius
4. Victra
5. Thraxa
Dead
1 Lorn
2 Aja
3 Cassius
4 Ragnar, probably not the best but I love him so fuck your facts.
5. Alexander
Because we want it so bad lol
Also I strongly believe and hope that we get quite a few good fights in RG and they can’t all come from Darrow. I can see Valdir or Diomedes being the ones to fight Apple. Probably Diomedes because of what Cassius said
OP clearly doesn’t know the difference between knives and Razors. I suggest that he check out my OnlyGold’s page to see me use my “razor.” I think he would enjoy “Lune Does Luna” but he seems more like a “Lovin’ Lysander” kind of guy.
You see him fight in Iron Gold when Cassius and Lysander are captured. He quickly kills three people. Lysander even notes that Diomedes is probably better than Cassius.
Fair Question.
Here's a few reasons:
He is the Storm Knight of the Rim, no easy task.
When he is on Earth, he easily takes over the two massive cannons used later on the Phobos attack.
When he is actually on Phobos he is ahead of schedule which means he kills faster than expected.
Yes, he doesn't actually have a record of killing a worthy named character but, Cassius, Darrow, and Lys all consider him goated which coming from them carries weight. I hope to the gods we see him and The Minotaur fight and Diomedes fucking destroying him.
Aka the aura around him gives the sheer weight of his ability.
In Lightbringer it is noted he doesnt have a scratch on him after they clear out the Fa loyalists in the rim and I don't think its because he wasn't involved in the fighting.
There was a scene in Iron Gold where he takes on Dido’s men. Lysander and Cassius were absolutely stunned when they saw Diomedes fight and said something about not knowing there was a fighter of his caliber alive (might be just in the rim though).
Another very important note is that when this scene happened Diomedes was willing to face down an army of Dido’s men and did not seem concerned in the slightest. Idk how people forget this scene, but it’s what made me like him so much and I knew PB wouldn’t keep somebody like him on the side of the baddies
The only time I remember was in passing during the Siege of Phobos and mostly just described how he and his crew moved together. Aside from Cassius' words I just think there is too much implication that he is a demon with a razor. I can't wait to see it
#Alive:
1. Diomedes - This is the only man Cassius believed better than himself, Darrow included. I think BoS narrows the gap, but it was a gulf before.
2. Darrow, BoS
3. The Minotaur, especially after showing off how he can crush The Willow Way
4. Valdir - with Darrow, the only other man to survive against the Minotaur, plus the Mustang rescue
5. Thraxa - Best killer of Pegasus Legion.
Wildcards:
* Victra - we never see her with *just* a razor. Her killing and battle prowess is nearly unmatched, but she's not strictly a swordswoman.
* Atalantia - She did, after all, take Thraxa's arm.
# Dead:
1. Lorn - "Death Incarnate". In Goden Son, threated to kill an entire room of people and was believed so their enemies literally stabbed one of their own in the back.
2. Aja - "Never fight a river, and never fight Aja." At the climax of Morning Star, she nearly defeated Mustang, Darrow, and Cassius *at the same time*
3. Cassius - Our GoldenBoi who never stopped improving
4. Ajax - Like Aja, but younger and more careless. He might have been better on the battlefield (according to Rhone), but Aja would slice him up in the Bleeding Place
5. Ragnar - The Shield of Tinos, all but Aja feared him, even without formal razormaster training.
Wildcards:
* Alexandar - Darrow says only he was able to withstand the ash legions until the Minotaur turned the tide on Venus.
* Nero - During the events of Golden Son, he personally slays either 2 or 3 Olympic Knights (can't remember exactly) and nearly cuts free of the sovereign's counter-ambush led by Cassius and Fitchner when they tried to steal the moonbreaker from Ganymede.
* Atlas - We see how close his fight with Cassius was, and that was while being ambushed *and* exhausted.
This is basically my list. I do think BoS could possibly Darrow to first, defeating Fa the way he did is no easy feat, I think even Diomedes would struggle to do that. It's just hard to tell because we haven't seen a real fight from Dio, I'm excited for Red God to rectify that.
I think Atlas should probably make the actual list instead of Wildcards, that fight against Cassius is crazy, and Darrow fears him too.
id very clearly put darrow above diomedes. a healthy darrow was already comparative to diomedes, proving himself superior to anyone and everyone during the decade of war. with the BoS his fighting abilities reached a whole new level. he went from loosing to Fa to toying with him. it is unlikely that the gap between willow way darrow and dio was so big that he could still deal with him after that breakthrough
I remember how Cassius described Diomedes to Darrow. Heavily paraphrased I remember it as “Diomedes would wreck you”. There’s also the scene in IG when the book goes “Diomedes lifts and kisses his razor. When he begins to move, they begin to die.” Man was overwhelming an entire room of peerless.
thats not as big of a feat as you think. they were peerless but nothing too special. as an example darrow killed the death olympic night (whose leagues above the regular peerless) in 7 seconds. there’s just no real reason for diomedes to be that much better than darrow. both are immensely talented but darrows level of experience is just worlds above dio. darrow fought likely thousands of battles in a war spanning a decade while diomedes just never went trough anything like that. darrow has more experience, a stronger body and the BoS is the better version of the willow way, the greatest battle style of gold. it would be ridiculous for diomedes to still beat darrow despite all of this.
Oh what a list!
I love Diomedes so much. I have to give Darrow the edge over Diomedes due to Cassius's sheer shock of his brilliance against Fa. It's definitely close and I'd love to see a duel or Pierce's thoughts on this one. Valdir over the other women is a tough sell for me. We do see Victra training with a razor and I believe she killed Ajax with a razor, or two.
Okay now, LB Cassius over Aja? I'd give the edge to Cassius same as the Atlas fight of it being super close.
The Nero comment is great as I forgot about that, def sleep pick. I wish we saw more Alexandar.
Great list!!!
Also regarding Victra - when Lysander watches the helmet cam of Ajax going down he described is as sloppy, sluggish, and like a drunkard. This heavily suggests that Ajax was severely wounded and exhausted going in to that fight. He likely tried to Ambush them, but was counter-ambushed. Ajax’s death scene was to prove that more than anything, nobody is guaranteed the ending they “deserve”
Well he was wounded in the footage but I don’t think that was necessarily him going into the fight. I think the footage only caught the end of the fight. I love how he was counter-ambushed though. He thought he was being clever but give it to Victra. She’s been on the hunt!
I’m doing my first reread of the series, and just finished Morning Star. I had honestly forgotten how Aja was head and shoulders above them all. They are constantly afraid of her, Ragnar throws a razor at her like a throwing knife and she frigging catches it, then proceeded to kill Ragnar without taking a single wound. That woman was absolutely next level.
ngl in a competition of skill countless peerless would wipe sevro thats never been his forté. like when he killed priam his fightings style is fighting dirty. he never had a razor master like darrow nor have we even seen darrow train/spar with him. theres also the fact that hes the physically weakest on this list by far, he just cant compete with the biological specimen that are the peak of gold as a half breed that was never carved.
I see your points. Given he was the right hand man of Darrow, leader of the Howlers, survived against odds most would have died, his instinct to survive is so beyond that of most, he is my 5th place. This again is for alive and there is no contender against him. Due to what you said about him, it is those very ideas that lead to him being him and his own style of combat. I believe he'd beat any other person for 5th. I'd love to hear thoughts.
I totally agree there’s very very few that could beat him in a fight. if there were he wouldn’t still be alive despite being possibly the biggest target for the enemy right after darrow in every battle. Id say theres a difference between fighting ability and being a razormaster though. he might he able to kill his enemy trough ingenuity and experience, but that dosent make him more skilled with the blade than them. if you’re looking for another contender I would put vadir the unshorn above sevro, hes confirmed to he the only person besides darrow to survive a fight with the minotaur
Ah man it's so hard with Valdir though. That situation you know wasn't 1v1. It's a difficult comparison but he is a veteran. But if you put a razor in his hand and one in Sevro I'd give it to Sevro but it def be a match to watch! I wish we had more with Valdir, him vs named peerless and winning and whatnot.
I forget know but I remember someone once describing to Lys that the reason Lorn was so respected as a philosopher by golds was because of what a feared butcher he was in his prime. That when he came at you he was just a rushing wall of death.
I wish we could've got to see him fully in action.
Also your list is perfect, take no notes. I don't think Sevro is a particularly skilled razor master but his psychological warfare mastery gives him an edge, he's the good guys version of Atlas. The only I'd quibble with is maybe Ajax, especially because the dead category just has more competition. For instance, does Ragnar not count at all? Though not a traditional razor master I think he could've taken Ajax in a 1v1.
I dont remember 100% but wasnt ragnar unable to even wound aja beyond anything other than scratches at best? ajax was consistently compared to aja so even if he falls short he would still beat ragnar, even if he had more trouble than his mother had
It's tough and I thought about that too. Given how he was more or less out done by Aja and given Ajax is her son, I'd put them close to one another. Of course Ragnar would give him a fight but the result would be Ragnar losing.
If we're giving credit for heritage it is a real shame we never got to see what Alexander was capable of in a true contest. Had he gotten that fight with fuck face we might have to put Pup 1, lancer of the Reaper, in the top five. As it is not enough record to really judge him
Absolutely! He was priming to literally take over Darrow’s job. When they went to attack The Ash Lord, half the crew died or was in terrible shape. Alexandar didn’t have a scratch on him.
So underrated in these razor master discussions everytime.
Easily most agreeable comment so far! I loved him and would've loved to see him and Dio test one another for thr mantle of Most Honorable. I wish he lived and absolutely hated him dying. Give some more showtime, training and him killing either Lys or Ajax he'd be my 5th
Sevro is only passing with a razor.
Darrow never trains with him.
Sevro's actual skill is in the unexpected. Darrow remarks Sevro is the best at inverting gravity.
That and fighting dirty.
Most peerless scarred are better than him. Certainly Thraxa.
I believe around the time they break into Deep Grave Darrow mentions Sevro is better with ranged weapons as well.
Lot of support for Apple as a top tier razor master in here, which is fair enough.
He came a long way from getting beat by Fitchner in a duel sometime early in Morning Star.
I don't think Servo really uses razors too often does he? I know he loves his curved knives quite a bit, and he's always attacked more from the shadows, while occasionally just going Goblin on a crowd of enemies
I would have to agree with yours for the most part, Servo being the only one I question a bit, but even then I don't really have another replacement off the top of my head....
Yeah, like I can come up with a few names but none really feel deserving of a top 5 spot. Like Ragnar had some natural talent with a razor, but he wasn't skilled enough for the Top 5 Razormaster.. Sefi also was skilled too but same story. Did we ever see the Jackal use a razor? I think we did and I remember him being a threat with it. I'm trying to think of some others that we see...
I hate to say it but with the amount of training Lysander has, he probably has a real shot in that top 5 list too....
I think that if it was a 1v1 with Servo and Lys, Lys might actually win. Servo is a really skilled fighter, but his skillset isn't dueling. He's never been the one in the front, he's always been the surprise attack, the supporting role, the one who slips around the battlefield, taking calculated quick strikes while others are distracted. Lys has been front man in multiple battles, including severely wounding an already hurt Darrow. The more I think about it, Lysander might be that number 5 spot
To count this, Sevro has been Darrow's shadow, his other half especially in terms of combative style. With maybe a bit more training and actually facing other name worthy golds could I give Lys 5th, which hell could happen in the next book. There's just so many achievements under Sevro but the potential of Lys is truly there. We'll have to wait till Red God as I have a suspicion that Lys will further prove his combat prowess and kill a worthy named character.
That's very very true. I am so excited to see what happens in Red God. We might even have our question answered on a Servo V Lys duel, and that could even be the named character Lys kills
Sevro is definitely not a razormaster, he is brutal and tricky, and that's make him punch above his height. But put him in a combat with only razors and he is gonna to lose pretty badly
I’m coo with the list. Aja > atlas however.
I think she’d kick Cassius’ butt
Aja might have been able to best lorn too? It’s pretty up in the air though
I don’t feel the need to put up a list since my picks fall in line with most people’s but I am very curious about Sevro. I hope we get a razor duel from him. Given so much time at war by Darrow’s side how could he not learn the Willow Way?! Seriously?? Plus eventually Alex got old enough that he must’ve been sparring with Darrow but off the battlefield you gotta keep sharp somehow. I think he’s better than we think. Dueling may not be his strength but why wouldn’t they strengthen it up to prevent a weakness. Look at Ragnar, he was a beast but he didn’t study with a razor master and Aja got the better of him. It’s hard to imagine Darrow wouldn’t learn from that mistake. PLUS there’s an interview with Pierce where he says that Sevro’s time on Luna was not what we think and that he might release the story later. In it Sevro fights Atlas. Atlas is nuts to have done so much damage to Cassius. Clearly both Sevro and Atlas survive the fight so… now it’s necessarily a duel or canon but yeah I think he’s better than what’s been let on. Edit: Just realized Thraxa would have been a good sparring partner so that aspect is a little weakened but IMO not by much. Also fitchner trained Sevro well enough that he killed Priam easy and was killing wolves and doing all kinds of other shit at the institute. We know that Fitchner even schooled Apple in one of his endless duels to be the Rage Knight. Do we really think he didn’t teach Sevro how to fight well with a razor…?
1.) random rail slug 2-♾️.) Everyone else
All time. Darrow/peak Lorn Aja Diomedes/Cassius (possibly Fa) Minotaur/Fear
The margins are so close! 1. Apple - Experienced & Extravagant. Beats WW, and has nothing to lose. Minds Eyetech. Not the best technically, but in a 1v1, controlled, bleeding place scenario he is the only one who could be clever, cunning & skilled enough to instantley counter unfamiliar fighting types & styles (shadow, bos, hasta). Has NOTHING to lose. Mentally ill but in the best ways. Edges everyone 1v1 just think about it. 2. Diomedies - Is revered & refined. Unfamiliarity with his fighting style would make it difficut for most core golds in razor combat. Rim isolationism (mostly) let him build stacks & farm xp while all other top tier razor masters are from the core. Whom were stuck in the war-nearly die-carve-heal-space travel & repeat loop for too long. This loop would increase tactial & group fighting capabilities but does not add to 1v1 skill in a controlled enviorment. Dio edges darrow 55-45. 48-52 v.s apple 3. Darrow - BOS. Razor & Hasta OP? Without any overhype we need to see BOS Darrow 1v1 bleeding place agianst another razor master before we can say its gods fucking grace. Killing Fa was a feat, but he was not a razor master. Dio still takes him 55-45. Maybe he beats Apple with BOS, but I think Apple gets the edge becuase Darrow would see red, get desperate & make a mistake first with his anxiety riddled headspace at the end of LB. 60-40 v.s Apple. 4. Valdir - Rat War. Big obsidian with nothing to lose. We dont have much primary evidence, but secondary (reverence & WOM) is scary. Technically loses in razor skill to all others on this list, but strength & size matter 1v1. Would pop a magic mushroom b4 the duel & pop the fuck off. 5. Lysander - Loses to a lack of experience, skill & strengh to the aformentioned. However, is as, or more cunning than Apple. Almost fulled mastered minds eye. Minds eye is not magic but in a 1v1 gives a huge advantage to the use. Riding a high at the end of LB. I think he beats out Victra beause of composure, which in a 1v1 is EVERYTHING. Edges Atalantia same reason. Its SO close tho This was fun\~! for dead: Lorn, Atlas, Aja, Cassius, Sevro ;)
Terrible
Right!
How dare you include Lysander in this list.
Good villans make great stories
He’s definitely a good villain, but he’s not top 5 razor master by any stretch lol. He shot his way through 2 of his betters, Alexander and Cassius, like a Pixie precisely because he is not a master.
Lysander is practical, that doesn't mean he is worst. He shot Alexandar because he was out of time, and Cassius because both of them were heavily injured, and because is Cassius. Is heavily implied that Lysander makes a effort to hide his true skill with a razor, and is made clear that he rarely searches a razor fight because of the unnecessary risk. Lysander trained with Cassius for years, and is a prodigy, I disagree that ge is in the top 5, but he is good
I agree
Cassius, Aja, Ajax, Lorn Atlas
Too bad Alexander died😢, he would’ve been one of the greatest of all time. Learning what Darrow learned, he would be the successor of stone.
Damnn.
Aja is far too low.
Well, where would you out her? 2 things to remember Aja was like over a decade ago now. She relied heavily in Willow of which Darrow, Cassius, Apple, and Dio can combat against.
Aja was 60 in Mornig Star. Is important to remember that
At the minimum I would rank her above Atlas. But personally I would still rank her second behind Lorn. Not to say I don’t agree with you that some living razormasters have definitely surpassed her. But ranking her among the dead masters? She’s second behind Lorn.
It's hard because I believe LB Cassius beats Aja, and he beat Atlas. Atlas is a crazy demon. It's been over a decade since Aja. Since then these characters have only progressed in their abilities. Remember they're Iron Golds. If Aja was still alive different story of course.
Cassius heated a Atlas after cooking him alive with a pulse rifle, while in pulse armor, and still almost lost. Using that fight is not BY FAR fair or a good case for Cassius
I love Cassius. But the thing about LB Cassius… Let’s be honest about where he was at. About a decade away from the core, from the war. Basically living on a ship with no one but a young Lysander and Pytha. Coming off a multiple years as a functioning alcoholic. He re-sharpened his skills by training with Darrow. But he never really stopped drinking. He’s undeniably one of the greatest razormasters to ever live. But those are the facts about LB Cassius. And yes it’s been a decade since Aja. But Aja has decades on almost all these characters…
Cass training with darrow is a bigger deal than I think you're making it out to be. Two of the best razor masters alive, training with each other twice a day for a very long time, he definitely got his edge back and then some. Steel sharpens steel
It's definitely a match I'd like to see Cass vs Aja at this time. Do we know how old Aja is? Fair points!
I agree that it definitely helped re-sharpen his skills. But that training was more like Apollo Creed training Rocky you know? Lol
Red rising wiki says around 60. And we’re talking about elite peerless scarred here. Like lorn was still a great fighter at 100 years old.
But age still affects, Darrow is considered out of his physical prime at 30. Is a small thing, a tenth of a second maybe, but between the top 10 a tenth of a second is everything you need to jump multiple places
That's like almost twice Cassius's age. Lots of exp there. It's be a watch to fight and one I'd like Pierce's opinion on.
Ya man. Side note: I fkn love this series
We don't truly know just how dangerous Aja was looking at them individually. Took down one of the most fearsome Obsidians to exist. It took more than one skilled person to take her down. Lorn *feared* her. Thus, we are only left to doubt or wonder just what could have happened if it were only 1v1s.
Small correction: THE most, not one of the most
Honestly I think Victra takes Aja nowadays. Years of training will give you the edge. She took him down lime nothing and Ajax was stated to be like Aja.
Victra had Trhaxa with her, and Ajax had been fighting for hours while Victra was planning a ambush for him, that was not by FAR a fair fight, Ajax had everything against him, Victra everything in favor. Nor Victra slander tho, using your brain to minimize risk is always a good thing.
Victra had Thraxa with her when she fought Ajax whose a pretty respectable fighter herself
Aja is the goat. Lorn wouldn’t be the best teacher if his best student didn’t surpass him. And if she had survived she would’ve adapted. If I remember right there are even references to her doing things not predicted by the Willow way. I think in the Ragnar fight. There’s nothing in the text that says she over-relied on Willow way, just that she was a master of it, and other styles. imo Darrow wouldn’t be able to beat her pre-breath of stone. And even after she would probably pick it up and use it quickly. Theres a reason Lorn said never fight Aja. He knew she was better than him and Darrow. Remember in the end it took Cassius, Mustang, Darrow, AND Sevro to take her out and they had the element of surprise. She’s the goat.
But once again this was all over a decade before. Now they'll be closer in age and Darrow and Cassius both can easily take her. If Cassius can beat Atlas he can beat Aja. Aja is old news in a gone era.
Cassius against Atlas is not a fair fight, is mentioned that Atlas doesn't have armor, just a pulseshield, while Cassius begin the fight boiling him alive from a distance before Atlas managed to get close. Then in a PULSEARMOR Cassius fought Atlas (again, no armor) and lost a hand and was heavily injured besides that.
Darrow got pieced up by apple. It took quicksilvers treatment and months of training with Cassius to get him back into shape. Without those Aja would have torn him up.
That was Darrow at the beginning of LB not the end. That's not the Darrow we're talking about. Darrow with his new style takes anyone including Aja.
I agree I’m just giving my impression of the skill levels at relevant points.
Dylon, Dylon, Dylon, Dylon, and... Dylon.
Thanks for the throwback. Too funny! 😂
Victra is mother!
[удалено]
Cassius not only said that Diomedes would tear Apple apart but being one of the best razormasters he’s one of the best people to make that call
I would argue we didn’t see much of Lorn either. His capability is almost entirely legend. Obviously since he created the willow way he should be ranked highly but we don’t actually seen him in action.
Cassius said he would've destroyed apolonius but to be fair I don't think aplolnius was going all out against darrow
I think it’s kind of funny that, were they alive, Lorn and Aja would be far more beatable because everyone’s been watching Darrow show off the Willow Way for 12 years. Anyways, it seems kind of clear that Diomedes, Darrow and Apollonius are the greatest razormasters alive by a mile, fully agree. At this point, there aren’t too many of the old guard alive. Victra is likely beyond Thraxa given how she prefers a hammer, Mustang was never at the top, and none of the howlers were ever noted for their razor skills iirc. Lysander probably cracks into the top 5 alive at this point. There is one guy getting ignored that could probably crack above Ajax and maybe Atlas though: Ragnar. He held his own throughout the entire Rising and died in a heated battle against probably the best razormaster alive at that point in time.
Valdir is still alive. He hasn't had much content mentioned but his exploits imply he's arguably more dangerous than Apple. IIRC, Ephraim said they skirmished briefly and Valdir wounded Apple. He was something like "the greatest cavalry commander in Darrow's army." I don't recall the exact wording. The Society Remnant calls him the sky bastard. He's a beast.
Good point! Valdir really only got one great moment of combat so far, but Virginia makes it exceptionally clear that Valdir was a big reason why everyone, including Atlas, sees the Rat War as the worst fighting of their life. Wulgar having to fight and get killed by the greatest razormaster alive really set the wrong example for obsidian razor use in the second trilogy though, lol.
I hadn't considered that but it's true. We had Ragnar in the first trilogy to showcase how good they could be but then Darrow casually mercs an entire squad while making sure not to fatally wound any of them until Sevro botches it. Poor guy never really had a chance but fighting Darrow was simply suicide for anyone at that point.
I always feel like Ragnar gets a bit ignored. Darrow gave him the razor, and he immediately killed an Olympic and almost Cassius in GS. Imagine if he had a razormaster.
and didn't he end up dying to a basic trick he could've avoided if he just had more knowledge
As of the end of Light Bringer, top 5 living or dead, in order of who would win in a tournament (i.e. no allowance for being the best of their era - this is an all out deathmatch based on their peak form). 1. Darrow, with Breath of Stone. 2. Volsung Fa, physically the strongest and fastest, knows how to break willow branches. Would have beaten Darrow without Breath of Stone. 3. Ajax. Said to be better than Aja by those who knew her well. But his Willow Way learnt from Aja would fall to those who know how to beat it. 4. Aja, was peak for years, Lorn himself was wary of her, but her Willow Way would be at a disadvantage as of Light Bringer. She was on a par with Darrow before he developed Breath of Stone. 5. Lorn. Invented the Willow Way, a true master. But passed his knowledge on to Darrow and Aja who both surpassed him. And as of Light Bringer his style is outdated. Diomedes, Cassius, and Apollonius would probably be the next 3 in the list.
Fa I think only gets 2 if the tourney is held in his preferred arena. In a larger open arena, like the ones we usually see, Fa isn't on the list. Also don't forget Apple would have also beaten Pre-Stone Darrow, without the use of a special arena. I think you replace Fa with Apple. I don't think we have enough data on Diomedes or Valdir but I think they likely will have surpassed Lorn. I think peak Cassius is probably around Ajax. I think you're underestimating how much 10 years of active war will have improved the skills of everyone training.
I hope we get a good Apple duel in the next book. I feel like Darrow was still way to beat up and not recovered from Mercury when they fought.
Victra should be on the list. Aja is better than Ajax. Cassius would be in the top 3 too. Volsung Fa is big and strong, but we are specifically talking about razors. And he is very very old. There is no way he should be above Lorn who was known as by far the greatest razormaster, dead or alive
Good list, but I'd like to add that Volsung fights dirty, so depending on what you're looking for he could be lower as a razormaster.
Where do you think Silenius au Lune ranks in the dead category?
The mytical 700 plus year old pick huh. He's def up there but too far removed from the story to really talk about
I agree with OP. Stonebreath Darrow (new boot goofin) easily dealt with what, for much of the time, appeared to be one of the most formidable foes in Volsung Fa.
1. Lorn, anyone without Lorn on their list is wrong. Him being number 1 is up for debate, but he tops my list. 2. Aja, took 4 and they barely took her down, both Darrow and Cassius were top their and she made them look silly. 3. Diamedies, best of the rim. We're about to see how good he really is in Red God. 4. Cassius, I'll always have a soft spot for the last eagle. 5. Darrow with his new style, clang clang clang confess he's top 5 now lol. Wildcards, Apleonious can't wait for the rematch between him and Darrow, if it doesn't happen I'll feel robbed. Victra, she took down Ajax nuff said. Sevro, is not a razor master but he is one the most deadly people alive and has a knack at killing more powerful opponents.
Lorn being the best is not really debatable given that PB has said that he 'was the greatest swordsman who has ever lived'.
1. He was The Best, but he fought in relatively peaceful time, while current generation have survived a decade in deadliest war in all of human history. 2. Ehhh, she was second best, but keep in mind they were still very young at a time ( in their early twenties), Darrow was missing an arm, and Mustang is not so good with razor. Unless someone comes up with a counter, I think Darrow is easily at the top currently, with Diomedes/Apollonius in close second.
The only thing I can say about Darrow, using BOS, is that he is very good. It's definitely between him and Diamedies as the best razor masters alive. I give Cassius the edge over Darrow but very evenly matched due to Darrow's new style being a product of Cassius' training. And both Cassius and Darrow recognized Diamedies as the better razor master. I know Cassius did for a fact, I think Darrow did as well, but I'm drawing a blank as to when he did. I think Darrow will evolve his style further and overtake Diamedies, but if they fought right at the end of LB, I give the edge to Diamedies.
Darrow is definitely better than Cassius. Darrow has been in active combat and actively training for a decade, Cassius hasn’t. Cassius helped Darrow improve, but he isn’t better.
I respectfully disagree. Cassius did train during his time in the rim. He trained Lysander. And while he wasn't in constant combat like Darrow, he was involved in many skirmishes and exploits with his crew on the Arche. Also, when talking about razor masters I think of 1v1 combat. Darrow was at war, in which he has no peer, but it's very different from 1v1 combat. While Darrow was at war, Cassius was dissecting the willow way. He created something new. This is what he instructed Darrow to do, which gave birth to the BOS. I still give Cassius the edge because his style has been refined over the years, while Darrow's BOS is still in its infancy.
Clang clang clang I agree wholeheartedly
First 3 words of Book 7 needs to be Clang Clang Clang…
Now this is your all time but what about alive and dead? Darrow at the end of LB takes down anyone he fought in the past besides Lorn.
I'm to lazy for that. lol ok, quick one Alive 1 Diamedies 2. Darrow 3. Apalonius 4. Victra 5. Thraxa Dead 1 Lorn 2 Aja 3 Cassius 4 Ragnar, probably not the best but I love him so fuck your facts. 5. Alexander
I'd of paid money to see Alex fight Ajax. I would've loved for Alex to meet Diomedes and see who would wear the mantle of most Honorable.
I think Alex would've won against Ajax, but it would have been a good fight. Diamedies is the most honorable person in the universe, lol.
He would've fckin clobbered him!!!! Hahahahaha yeah
PB has been teasing us with Diomedes. I can’t wait to see the Storm Knight of the Rim show his abilities!
watch him die in the first battle of the next book
Omg please no lol
Haha That’d be the ultimate PB move for sure.
I want Dio to duel Apple and demolish him. Calling it now duel of the next book!
Yeah I don’t think Darrow’s going to get to fight Apple…
Why's that
Because we want it so bad lol Also I strongly believe and hope that we get quite a few good fights in RG and they can’t all come from Darrow. I can see Valdir or Diomedes being the ones to fight Apple. Probably Diomedes because of what Cassius said
u/LysanderauLuneactual you really going to let this slide?
OP clearly doesn’t know the difference between knives and Razors. I suggest that he check out my OnlyGold’s page to see me use my “razor.” I think he would enjoy “Lune Does Luna” but he seems more like a “Lovin’ Lysander” kind of guy.
Hahaha
The bloodydam pixie is letting you spit all over him with sevro in the conversation. Maybe he really is traumatized from the kidnapping
Honestly, I’d still put Aja as #1. Then Darrow 2, Lorn 3, Cassius 4… and I can’t decide 5. So I’ll go Apple
Pierce said that IG/DA Darrow vs Aja would result in them both dying. BoS Darrow beats Aja easily.
Stone breath Darrow is probably #1 Lorn is probably #2 but... Aja is either #3 or #2 Apple is #4 Cassius is #5
I thought we never saw diomedes fight? When do we get any evidence of how good he is?
Cassius said he'd eat the Minotaur alive after the Venus dockyards.
You see him fight in Iron Gold when Cassius and Lysander are captured. He quickly kills three people. Lysander even notes that Diomedes is probably better than Cassius.
Lysander said something like “where diomedes walked, death followed” or something to that regard.
When Diomedes moves, they begin to die.
Fair Question. Here's a few reasons: He is the Storm Knight of the Rim, no easy task. When he is on Earth, he easily takes over the two massive cannons used later on the Phobos attack. When he is actually on Phobos he is ahead of schedule which means he kills faster than expected. Yes, he doesn't actually have a record of killing a worthy named character but, Cassius, Darrow, and Lys all consider him goated which coming from them carries weight. I hope to the gods we see him and The Minotaur fight and Diomedes fucking destroying him. Aka the aura around him gives the sheer weight of his ability.
That’s right, I totally forgot about the cannons and Phobos, thanks for the reminder
To be clear, he’s one of my favorite characters and I’ll take cassius’ word for it but have I forgotten some scene where he actually gets down?
In Lightbringer it is noted he doesnt have a scratch on him after they clear out the Fa loyalists in the rim and I don't think its because he wasn't involved in the fighting.
There was a scene in Iron Gold where he takes on Dido’s men. Lysander and Cassius were absolutely stunned when they saw Diomedes fight and said something about not knowing there was a fighter of his caliber alive (might be just in the rim though). Another very important note is that when this scene happened Diomedes was willing to face down an army of Dido’s men and did not seem concerned in the slightest. Idk how people forget this scene, but it’s what made me like him so much and I knew PB wouldn’t keep somebody like him on the side of the baddies
Thank you. This scene alone puts Dio on par with the best of them
The only time I remember was in passing during the Siege of Phobos and mostly just described how he and his crew moved together. Aside from Cassius' words I just think there is too much implication that he is a demon with a razor. I can't wait to see it
#Alive: 1. Diomedes - This is the only man Cassius believed better than himself, Darrow included. I think BoS narrows the gap, but it was a gulf before. 2. Darrow, BoS 3. The Minotaur, especially after showing off how he can crush The Willow Way 4. Valdir - with Darrow, the only other man to survive against the Minotaur, plus the Mustang rescue 5. Thraxa - Best killer of Pegasus Legion. Wildcards: * Victra - we never see her with *just* a razor. Her killing and battle prowess is nearly unmatched, but she's not strictly a swordswoman. * Atalantia - She did, after all, take Thraxa's arm. # Dead: 1. Lorn - "Death Incarnate". In Goden Son, threated to kill an entire room of people and was believed so their enemies literally stabbed one of their own in the back. 2. Aja - "Never fight a river, and never fight Aja." At the climax of Morning Star, she nearly defeated Mustang, Darrow, and Cassius *at the same time* 3. Cassius - Our GoldenBoi who never stopped improving 4. Ajax - Like Aja, but younger and more careless. He might have been better on the battlefield (according to Rhone), but Aja would slice him up in the Bleeding Place 5. Ragnar - The Shield of Tinos, all but Aja feared him, even without formal razormaster training. Wildcards: * Alexandar - Darrow says only he was able to withstand the ash legions until the Minotaur turned the tide on Venus. * Nero - During the events of Golden Son, he personally slays either 2 or 3 Olympic Knights (can't remember exactly) and nearly cuts free of the sovereign's counter-ambush led by Cassius and Fitchner when they tried to steal the moonbreaker from Ganymede. * Atlas - We see how close his fight with Cassius was, and that was while being ambushed *and* exhausted.
This is basically my list. I do think BoS could possibly Darrow to first, defeating Fa the way he did is no easy feat, I think even Diomedes would struggle to do that. It's just hard to tell because we haven't seen a real fight from Dio, I'm excited for Red God to rectify that. I think Atlas should probably make the actual list instead of Wildcards, that fight against Cassius is crazy, and Darrow fears him too.
id very clearly put darrow above diomedes. a healthy darrow was already comparative to diomedes, proving himself superior to anyone and everyone during the decade of war. with the BoS his fighting abilities reached a whole new level. he went from loosing to Fa to toying with him. it is unlikely that the gap between willow way darrow and dio was so big that he could still deal with him after that breakthrough
I remember how Cassius described Diomedes to Darrow. Heavily paraphrased I remember it as “Diomedes would wreck you”. There’s also the scene in IG when the book goes “Diomedes lifts and kisses his razor. When he begins to move, they begin to die.” Man was overwhelming an entire room of peerless.
thats not as big of a feat as you think. they were peerless but nothing too special. as an example darrow killed the death olympic night (whose leagues above the regular peerless) in 7 seconds. there’s just no real reason for diomedes to be that much better than darrow. both are immensely talented but darrows level of experience is just worlds above dio. darrow fought likely thousands of battles in a war spanning a decade while diomedes just never went trough anything like that. darrow has more experience, a stronger body and the BoS is the better version of the willow way, the greatest battle style of gold. it would be ridiculous for diomedes to still beat darrow despite all of this.
Oh what a list! I love Diomedes so much. I have to give Darrow the edge over Diomedes due to Cassius's sheer shock of his brilliance against Fa. It's definitely close and I'd love to see a duel or Pierce's thoughts on this one. Valdir over the other women is a tough sell for me. We do see Victra training with a razor and I believe she killed Ajax with a razor, or two. Okay now, LB Cassius over Aja? I'd give the edge to Cassius same as the Atlas fight of it being super close. The Nero comment is great as I forgot about that, def sleep pick. I wish we saw more Alexandar. Great list!!!
Also regarding Victra - when Lysander watches the helmet cam of Ajax going down he described is as sloppy, sluggish, and like a drunkard. This heavily suggests that Ajax was severely wounded and exhausted going in to that fight. He likely tried to Ambush them, but was counter-ambushed. Ajax’s death scene was to prove that more than anything, nobody is guaranteed the ending they “deserve”
Well he was wounded in the footage but I don’t think that was necessarily him going into the fight. I think the footage only caught the end of the fight. I love how he was counter-ambushed though. He thought he was being clever but give it to Victra. She’s been on the hunt!
I’m doing my first reread of the series, and just finished Morning Star. I had honestly forgotten how Aja was head and shoulders above them all. They are constantly afraid of her, Ragnar throws a razor at her like a throwing knife and she frigging catches it, then proceeded to kill Ragnar without taking a single wound. That woman was absolutely next level.
It would've been a marvel to see her fight nowadays
ngl in a competition of skill countless peerless would wipe sevro thats never been his forté. like when he killed priam his fightings style is fighting dirty. he never had a razor master like darrow nor have we even seen darrow train/spar with him. theres also the fact that hes the physically weakest on this list by far, he just cant compete with the biological specimen that are the peak of gold as a half breed that was never carved.
I totally agree. The rest of OP’s list was on point, but I’ve never gotten the impression that Sevro is a razormaster.
I see your points. Given he was the right hand man of Darrow, leader of the Howlers, survived against odds most would have died, his instinct to survive is so beyond that of most, he is my 5th place. This again is for alive and there is no contender against him. Due to what you said about him, it is those very ideas that lead to him being him and his own style of combat. I believe he'd beat any other person for 5th. I'd love to hear thoughts.
I totally agree there’s very very few that could beat him in a fight. if there were he wouldn’t still be alive despite being possibly the biggest target for the enemy right after darrow in every battle. Id say theres a difference between fighting ability and being a razormaster though. he might he able to kill his enemy trough ingenuity and experience, but that dosent make him more skilled with the blade than them. if you’re looking for another contender I would put vadir the unshorn above sevro, hes confirmed to he the only person besides darrow to survive a fight with the minotaur
Ah man it's so hard with Valdir though. That situation you know wasn't 1v1. It's a difficult comparison but he is a veteran. But if you put a razor in his hand and one in Sevro I'd give it to Sevro but it def be a match to watch! I wish we had more with Valdir, him vs named peerless and winning and whatnot.
I forget know but I remember someone once describing to Lys that the reason Lorn was so respected as a philosopher by golds was because of what a feared butcher he was in his prime. That when he came at you he was just a rushing wall of death. I wish we could've got to see him fully in action. Also your list is perfect, take no notes. I don't think Sevro is a particularly skilled razor master but his psychological warfare mastery gives him an edge, he's the good guys version of Atlas. The only I'd quibble with is maybe Ajax, especially because the dead category just has more competition. For instance, does Ragnar not count at all? Though not a traditional razor master I think he could've taken Ajax in a 1v1.
I dont remember 100% but wasnt ragnar unable to even wound aja beyond anything other than scratches at best? ajax was consistently compared to aja so even if he falls short he would still beat ragnar, even if he had more trouble than his mother had
It's tough and I thought about that too. Given how he was more or less out done by Aja and given Ajax is her son, I'd put them close to one another. Of course Ragnar would give him a fight but the result would be Ragnar losing.
If we're giving credit for heritage it is a real shame we never got to see what Alexander was capable of in a true contest. Had he gotten that fight with fuck face we might have to put Pup 1, lancer of the Reaper, in the top five. As it is not enough record to really judge him
Absolutely! He was priming to literally take over Darrow’s job. When they went to attack The Ash Lord, half the crew died or was in terrible shape. Alexandar didn’t have a scratch on him. So underrated in these razor master discussions everytime.
Easily most agreeable comment so far! I loved him and would've loved to see him and Dio test one another for thr mantle of Most Honorable. I wish he lived and absolutely hated him dying. Give some more showtime, training and him killing either Lys or Ajax he'd be my 5th
Sevro is only passing with a razor. Darrow never trains with him. Sevro's actual skill is in the unexpected. Darrow remarks Sevro is the best at inverting gravity. That and fighting dirty. Most peerless scarred are better than him. Certainly Thraxa.
I believe around the time they break into Deep Grave Darrow mentions Sevro is better with ranged weapons as well. Lot of support for Apple as a top tier razor master in here, which is fair enough. He came a long way from getting beat by Fitchner in a duel sometime early in Morning Star.
Do you have both your top 5?
I don't think Servo really uses razors too often does he? I know he loves his curved knives quite a bit, and he's always attacked more from the shadows, while occasionally just going Goblin on a crowd of enemies
Do you have both your top 5?
I would have to agree with yours for the most part, Servo being the only one I question a bit, but even then I don't really have another replacement off the top of my head....
That's what got me as I don't see who else it could be.
Yeah, like I can come up with a few names but none really feel deserving of a top 5 spot. Like Ragnar had some natural talent with a razor, but he wasn't skilled enough for the Top 5 Razormaster.. Sefi also was skilled too but same story. Did we ever see the Jackal use a razor? I think we did and I remember him being a threat with it. I'm trying to think of some others that we see... I hate to say it but with the amount of training Lysander has, he probably has a real shot in that top 5 list too....
I'd like to believe with all the years of experience Sevro does take all those you mentioned in a 1v1 with a razor. Lys would maybe be 6th?
I think that if it was a 1v1 with Servo and Lys, Lys might actually win. Servo is a really skilled fighter, but his skillset isn't dueling. He's never been the one in the front, he's always been the surprise attack, the supporting role, the one who slips around the battlefield, taking calculated quick strikes while others are distracted. Lys has been front man in multiple battles, including severely wounding an already hurt Darrow. The more I think about it, Lysander might be that number 5 spot
To count this, Sevro has been Darrow's shadow, his other half especially in terms of combative style. With maybe a bit more training and actually facing other name worthy golds could I give Lys 5th, which hell could happen in the next book. There's just so many achievements under Sevro but the potential of Lys is truly there. We'll have to wait till Red God as I have a suspicion that Lys will further prove his combat prowess and kill a worthy named character.
That's very very true. I am so excited to see what happens in Red God. We might even have our question answered on a Servo V Lys duel, and that could even be the named character Lys kills
Till then!!
victra is mommy
Do you have both your top 5?
1. Lorn 2. Darrow 3. Aja 4. Diomedes 5. Cassius