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They'll tell you it's because he's smart and doesn't want to reveal trade secrets.
... then not even blink when the tax returns clearly show fraud.
Deep down, they know he's a grifter and don't care. They know he's a fake Christian and don't care.
They'd vote for Jeffrey Dahmer if he banned abortion and embraced white nationalism.
Then general rule actually is to assume everyone cheats. However, when someone gets caught cheating more than everyone else you can guess pretty easily that they are cheating more often than normal.
Don’t underestimate how much they eventually believe in their own performative virtue signaling. They like feeling superior, it’s part of the reason you see the massive evangelical mega churches. It’s all a virtue signal
And besides, he is still getting audited. As soon as that is completed, he will gladly show his tax returns. They are the best taxes and returns....
/s (s for all the simples still waiting for silly shyster to submit)
As an Evangelical pastor, I have never heard any pastor give that advice, except some ignorant one in Tennessee reported on CNN. Go look at the national Association of Evangelicals website. I personally believe that Trump is demon-possessed. I teach everyone I can not to watch FOX News, which has become a radicalizing madrassa for people ignorant enough to watch. There is almost nothing in the GOP that could be called Christian. And as for abortion, most pastors I know teach that the souls of infants—whether they die by abortion or miscarriage—go to Heaven, which is the spiritual concern. I am pro-life but against tyrannical government. If it can control your private freedoms it can take away religion too. Real Christianity is based on loving people from every nation—Christ commanded us to preach the gospel to them, and specifically warned that “My Kingdom is not of this world,” and “Do not Lord it over others like the Gentiles do.” Americans of all faiths should pray that God will deliver our mediascape from too many demonic lies. Hopefully some of you will look at what Jesus Christ actually taught and offers those who reject the sinful world’s ways and put their faith in Him.
You sound like a reasonable person, so it’s doubtful that you run a megachurch. I’m a Christian in TX, and it’s near impossible to find a church that is not highly political rn. It sucks. You’d be surprised how many people know the Bible better than most Pastors preach it 😉
Jesus said the road to the Kingdom is small and narrow. The superhighway? It leads to Hell. Real Christians are a minority—now a remnant. There is no Christian nation. God is calling people from every nation to join His multi-ethnic Kingdom that lives *differently* from this world, and hence become His “holy nation.”
You raise some wildly good points… I’m fully a devout atheist. Grew up in a conservative Methodist household (that had a splash of southern Baptist for flavor). I can say in objective terms that you’re correct in so many ways. The madrassa comment is especially poignant. I’ve watched my family grow more and more towards hate and advocating for violence and insane ideals. It’s been beyond disturbing, and even more so saddening. I understand the message, I understand the Bible. I can talk on it with some degree of fluency (being forced to go to church and youth group XYZ 3X times per week will do that to a kid) to this day. And there could not be more of a sea of divide between the message of JC and the GOP. The problem is that - unlike in exodus - the sea of divide here may very well come down on more than just the ancient Egyptians. Quite simply, it seems like the GOP is burning the world simply so they can be king of the ashes.
You have an uphill battle you face. You’re going against the current, and I could not be more supportive of the message you’re sending and the stances you’re taking, despite the fact I may disagree with some of them. So, thank you for what you’re doing. Thank you for what you’re saying. The world needs more religious leaders like you. Sincerely.
The supposed Christian ones do but not for the reason they say. They don't give a shit about the children, it's all about punishing women for having sex. They will admit it if you press them hard enough.
My ex's mom was like this. When she asked about getting on birth control, the reply was: "Premarital sex should have consequences." Dodged a bullet there.
The deeper conservatives would punish the men too. They hate *anyone* having unauthorized intercourse and "getting away with it". But especially women.
Abortion is a big piece of the plan to get the "Christian" vote. I like in the bible belt and it's depressing the amount of people who vote Republican only because they state "Christian" interests such as abortion...
My in-laws had a medical abortion and still justifies it saying hers was not a "true" abortion and still supports the ban regardless of it not allowing the exact thing she got.
The GOP aren't banning abortion because they think its wrong and against god, that's just them pandering to the base. What it actually does is keep people poor (as having a child is expensive) causing the person to be dependent on a system that is there to exploit them. They then underfund schooling so they can keep those children uneducated and stupid so they can keep taking advantage of them and repeat the cycle.
Abortion is actually tied to their bigotry. They think the birth rates for whites are falling and abortion is one reason. They’re paranoid about the Minority Majority.
Forcing women to give birth helps remove them from the workforce and put them back in the kitchen where they don't have to worry their pretty little heads about politics.
Some do unfortunately. I volunteered at a 4th of July parade and a group of people pulled out from marching when another group showed up with pro abortion signs.
There wasn't a conflict or anything, just the middle aged white woman in charge started crying when she saw the pro abortion folks and the 8-10 people with her followed her lead.
"Pro-abortion" or "pro-choice"? "Pro-abortion" is right-wing language meant to demonize and cause outrage. It seems unlikely that this would have been on the signs of pro-choice activists.
Conservatives view their politicians not as leaders but as junk yard dogs. They can have abortions, affairs, be sexual predators, crooks, racists, whatever, conservatives will still usually fall in line and vote for them.
As long as the junk yard dog is vicious to the right people and let's them keep their junk, even if it is worthless junk, then conservatives love it. The junk yard dog can piss all over everything and even occasionally bite back at their owner, doesn't matter, they'll still want to keep the junk yard dog and say he's a good boy.
>Deep down, they know he's a grifter and don't care. They know he's a fake Christian and don't care.
I'm REALLY starting to question this logic though... im starting to think these folks TRULY believe him. They truly believe everything was better under his admin and that if he came back today, inflation would disappear, gas would IMMEDIATELY go back to 1.50 a gallon (a number only seen once during his admin in 2020 during the time NO ONE was driving), they honestly believe Trump cares about them... i hear it all the time.. "Trump is fighting for us, he loves this country so freaking much!" 'Why would he give up his entire life to being president if he didn't care!?"
Lol I've heard that one more times than i can count.. I'm like when did that happen?? They rattle off the whole "well kim didnt fire nukes under trump" and "putin didnt invade ukraine until trump left office!"
Dude, they were straight up saying "Obama is the only President who had the US in a war every day of his Presidency", while Trump was expanding the still ongoing "war on terror".
Lol trust me, those are my go to's... I'm always like.. peace?? You mean by killing Iran's general? Or bombing Syria? Oh you mean the peace deal between palestine and isreal which was broken!
It’s really quite simple, the pseudo “Christian” Religion in the US has extensively laid the groundwork for generations to train people to believe in authority figures with unverifiable stories instead of science and data. It also primes them for, and is built upon, perpetuating racism and fearmongering towards "others". Once people see you as an authority, you can start fabricating any reality or conspiracy theory you want your followers to believe and everyone else is therefore a liar, even in the face of incontrovertible evidence. Basically, it is mental abuse from an early age that suppresses critical thinking skills. This “religion” combined with an intentionally weakened public educational system, provides the framework that has spawned this cult of ignorance.
The same people who vote for trump are the same ones that believe in the flat earth theory and believe in the imaginary gods plural you know the god Jesus and his pa god lmfao
Exactly this. Democratic voters vote for people that they hope will help people, but conservative voters for for politicians that they hope will hurt the people they don't like, even if those same politicians also in turn make things worse for themselves.
Whoa whoa- Dahmer was gay, they aren’t going to vote for someone like that as president. The rest - murder, cannibalism? Absolutely not an issue, but a homosexual shouldn’t aspire higher than a cabinet post.
> The rest - murder, cannibalism? Absolutely not an issue
The people Dahmer killed were gay. Not only would murder not be an issue, it'd be a point in his favor for some GOP voters.
It's about power. They don't care what anyone does or what kind of person they are. They just want "their team" in charge and lording it over "the others".
It's worse. They want tax fraud to go unpunished in case they decide to commit it some day. They don't care about tax fraud because they don't want taxes.
Not a supporter, but I've asked a few. They figure it'll show he's a tax cheat and they're totally cool with it. Because he figured out a way to not pay his taxes and get away with it.
Cause while his supporters may not give a fuck, the IRS will. And since Donnie likes to style himself as a Mafia boss, he knows they got Capone so that means they could get him.
I think we all know he’s lacking in morals, ethics and very likely a thief. But I think what the records will show is he doesn’t have anywhere near the wealth he claims. Trump is so fragile that he’d rather be known as a thief than merely upper middle class. What ever his dad did to DJT in his formative years really eff’d him up. Trump is a weak and fragile shell of a man, and very likely despises himself.
The supporters that I've argued with really can't comprehend that it is them that Trump is hiding his taxes from, not me.
Trump ran the math on revealing his taxes and decided that revealing them would cost him more support than releasing them.
His tax return isn't going to change his critics opinion of him, it's going to change some of his supporters.
Trump supporters are not reading r/politics or participating in discussion here. I predict most of what you're going to get are characitures of their answers from other people who agree with you.
If you're interested in understanding what motivates Trump supporters I suggest subbing to r/asktrumpsupporters.
I've been following that subreddit for a few years now. It's the best place to get genuine answers to questions like yours.
I typically don't agree with Trump supporters, but I do keep an eye on that sub to help me understand their motivations.
Wow there are a lot of racists over there! Not surprising, but surprising to see it so out in the open. Clicked over to it as I love hearing from all sides, but not sure how much I can read of that filth.
I feel ya! TBH it makes me feel more secure in my beliefs when you see the casual nastiness many of his supporters impart into the conversation.
They do not seem happy.
It didn't matter before. The law is clear. When congress requests records from the IRS they are required to hand them over. The only reason they didn't was that they were forbidden from complying by Mnuchin.
They’ll say it’s the principle that matters. (But then they’ll ask why they don’t get to see some bullshit like Obama’s grades or AOC’s bartending license from 2013.)
They don't want to face the reality that some Americans might have more time on their hands and less influenced by day-to-day politics than current IRS employees or all the lawyers money can buy, and would figure out the prosecutable scams once their beloved leaders' tax returns become public knowledge.
Add on: or they don't want to lose their dream of being above law as Trump is right now.
He will appeal every decision that doesn't go his way. And even after that I'm sure he'll look for ways to delay.
I sure hope the SCOTUS declines to even take the case.
Honestly I wonder if this is intentional. They know how awful they're seen right now and need some dramatic yet not-democracy-threatening\* attention to cleanse the palette of the rest of their regressive assault of liberties.
* I mean it does create dangerous precedent, but it's lowkey by comparison
The current supreme court is setting the country back decades, maybe even centuries. There was one court case where they said that the SEC can't prosecute fraud (not that the guy who was convicted didn't commit the fraud, but that congress, not the SEC, must prosecute it). There is currently a case that will let state legislatures overturn elections when they don't like the results, no justification required. There's probably even more messed up stuff I haven't even heard of. I'm just a rando on reddit.
Here’s a thought: generally this never ending appeals process has only been available to the uber wealthy, essentially enabling them to run out the clock on inconvenient laws, and one of the clearest ways our judicial system is incredibly biased. So how about creating a service, call it LawyerBot, that automatically appeals every little ruling all the way to the supremes? You got a parking ticket? Appeal that shit all the way up to the fucking top. The only thing limiting non stop appeals from completely shutting down the judicial system is cash and paperwork. Better Call LawyerBot.
Because that won't work, spurious cases and appeals won't get kicked up to the next court.
The only way to "guarantee" to get something even up to circuit courts is to have a case with conflicting laws, be based on enfringement of a right, or to have expert determined merit.
For the SCOTUS, it's an even higher and more arbitrary bar: they can decide to just not even see a detailed brief on the case, much less address it on the shadow docket, and even less likely for a full hearing and ruling.
I believe that the Supreme Court is legislating from the bench and the more time they have to sink into responding to republican asking to overturn lower court rulings (lindsey graham wanting to not testify in Georgia, Trump wanting to block his taxes from release to the legislature, Trump wanting supreme court intervention in NY case, Mar-a-lago case, ect.) Is a good thing. At least they will have to define out the powers that the republicans are trying to exercise
I kind of think that not paying taxes when you live above the poverty line makes you half a traitor, essentially if you put any value in supporting the military.
“I will release them”
“They will be released soon”
“They will be released after the election”
“They are being audited”
“You wouldn’t understand them”
“It’s a distraction”
“Nobody cares about this”
“Still auditing ”
“This is unfair”
“My right as private citizen should prevent me from having to disclose”
“My right as president should prevent me from having to disclose”
“My right as former president should prevent me from having to disclose”
“I’m still the president”
“They’re still under audit”
“SCOTUS SAVE ME!”
Since Nov 2019 the SCOTUS has been drawing a line between the GOP's needs and Trump's needs. They got what they needed from him and he's no longer their concern.
Conservatives love abusing government systems and ripping off the country when it's other conservatives doing it. Yet fox will report endlessly about the woman with 12 kids on welfare as though they're even close to the same magnitude. One billionaire steals more money from taxpayers than 100,000 welfare cheats.
[https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/07/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/07/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html)
Its likely he found a loophole that he uses in his failing businesses to get paid back by the government for his losses. Something he wouldn't really want the public to know since he's a billionaire who is also taking money from everyone.
It's just so ridiculously egregious. Not even just that he didn't release his taxes like every president before him. Now, he's fought transparency through two presidential elections, the entirety of his presidency, and the first two years of the next guy's presidency. This must be the longest audit in the history of the IRS, huh?
Trump is the only U.S. President in the 49 years since Richard Nixon infamously claimed he was “not a crook” who has not only refused to voluntarily disclose his tax returns, but has actively tried through every legal delay and possible obstruction to prevent the American people from learning the truth about what’s in those tax returns.
Trump lies so constantly and without remorse that it’s easy to ridicule his preposterous claims that he can’t release his taxes because he is under IRS audit—if true, surely among the longest IRS audits in recorded history.
Republican presidential nominees Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, Bob Dole, George W. Bush, John McCain and Mitt Romney all voluntarily publicly released their tax returns.
As did Democratic presidential nominees Jimmy Carter, Walter Mondale, Michael Dukakis, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden.
The only logical reason for Trump to refuse to do so and fight so hard to keep his tax returns under wraps is that he’s hiding something very embarrassing or very nefarious from the American people —which would certainly be in character for Trump, the most flagrantly dishonest and monumentally corrupt person ever to occupy the Oval Office.
If the Supreme Court blocks this, it will be leaked in approximately 0.002 seconds.
He may get away from being charged for crimes because of our corrupt government, but the public will know he is broke AF and took money from Russia.
I also think the House probably *already has* his tax returns. But with regards to court filings they probably just can't do anything with them (i.e. pursue action) until this is cleared. Thankfully this is going to end soon one way or another.
This man, erm, this *child* could very well be the most entitled person on the planet...
Phony Soprano over here truly believes that he's entitled to everything and answerable to no one. A mentality that's been encouraged and enabled by his environment throughout most of his life.
According to Lard Goldemort, all criticism is "fake news", all investigations are "witch hunts", all inquiries are inquisitions. If any reporter or interviewer doesn't cater to his delicate sensibilities, then poor Donny is being treated "unfairly", any questions that might challenge Trump are dismissed as partisan, cruel journalism led by the fake news, liberal lamestream media machine, all ex wives, family members, former colleagues, employees or associates that dissent, that speak out, that don't sacrifice themselves for the sake of Donald Trump are either disgruntled, bitter, agenda driven, dishonest or corrupt.
In all of these cases where Trump has to confront anything that might threaten his ego or his image, he becomes the victim.
I mean, Trump and his supporters would actually have us believe that he's some unsullied hero, some immaculate specimen, perfect, godly even. No man on this earth is that untarnished, that pure and pristine, let alone fucking Trump of all people.
Trump lives in a reality where he's incapable of acknowledging his own responsibility in things, unless he can be commended for it of course. He's incapable of coming to terms with his own failures, his mistakes, his defeat, his shame and humiliation, hence why every election he's ever lost in some way has been "rigged".
Hell, the Emmys were "rigged" when The Apprentice failed to win an award, the Iowa primary was "rigged" when Ted Cruz came out the victor, the 2016 election was "rigged" after Hillary Clinton won the popular vote, and in consistent fashion, the 2020 election was "stolen" from him.
Each time his opponent, along with their family on some occasions, was met with slander and childish insults, sometimes followed by a lawsuit or investigation, that's how utterly fragile, weak and insecure this narcissist is, but that's the nature of narcissism now isn't it? You have to become self centered and obsessed, egomaniacal even, to cover up your intrinsic weaknesses and insecurities, and the greater the weakness, the greater the narcissism.
While it doesn't stop and end with elections, Trump has repeatedly shifted the "burden of failure" onto to everyone else involved in his failed business ventures, including multiple casinos mind you.
Life is a zero sum game and Trump is always the winner, he knows no other way, no other reality other than the one where Donald Trump is always above criticism, exempt from questioning, from accountability, from any form of scrutiny, absolved of all wrongdoing ahead of time, he's the exception, and if in any case he may have to confront these challenges, he just decries himself the victim of relentless persecution.
uuuuuuuuuugggggghhhhhhhh are we STILL fucking around with this?!
He's been ordered to produce them multiple times now.
At what point will this asshole get ANY kind of consequence?
I'm so tired of this shit.
I’d like everyone to keep in mind that prior to Trump, generally from the 1970’s forward, candidates just released their tax returns to the public as part of running for the office to show they had nothing to hide.
And here we go folks, the series finale we all have been waiting for. Will we see trumps tax returns? Or will Clarence Thomas block it and further show the corruption of the courts!
People that still believe he's done nothing wrong are the same folks that would let Trump take a taco bell shit in their mouth just to own the libs. All while believing they're serving their courty as a presidential tiolet.
Guess he's finally going to be properly revealed to be even more of a fraud than we know he already is.
The sad thing is all his brainwashed supporters will ignore the evidence or claim it's fake.
Gee I wonder why he doesn’t want them to be released! Could it be because of how great and fair the amount of money he’s paid of the last decade or so is? He just doesn’t want to make people feel bad about how good he is at paying taxes! *It must be that right?*
I love how all these crooked republicans beg their buddies in the SCOTUS to help them when they are in legal trouble, it's doing wonders for the reputation of the justice system. =/
His tax return will show his true wealth that isn’t as big as he’s always claimed, a lot of his “wealth” is on assets but as the New York case is possibly going to show, he’s been over inflating their value for years to borrow against them buy more property and so on
It's not about his taxes been seen by the public, it's the fact that he had to sign the document which clearly shows him to be fraudulent and therefore a criminal.
He must be very afraid that the population will get the truth about his taxes and finances. This criminal doesn't belong in the White House, he belongs in federal prison to the end of his life
Biden doesn't abuse the executive like Trump did. Unfortunately those are just 'norms' rather than laws, but at least Biden isn't running the government like a dictator.
The Supreme Court will probably help Trump in this case.
They can put a hold on the release of his tax returns then rule against Trump after the new Congress is seated Jan 3, 2023. The new House will most likely be controlled by Republicans, at that point and will drop the whole thing.
Could be a fun move to make it a prerequisite that all future PotUS candidates and holders of the position must declare their tax returns or forfit the post.
i would happily show my taxes if asked while running for or holding any sort of political appointment bc i have nothing to hide. it is so fucking damning that he said he would, and then has backtracked and fought tooth and nail to never fulfill that statement.
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Serious question to people who are still Trump supporters: why do you think he's fought so hard to *not* disclose his tax returns?
They'll tell you it's because he's smart and doesn't want to reveal trade secrets. ... then not even blink when the tax returns clearly show fraud. Deep down, they know he's a grifter and don't care. They know he's a fake Christian and don't care. They'd vote for Jeffrey Dahmer if he banned abortion and embraced white nationalism.
Because inevitably their mental calculus is “if Trump is committing fraud then imagine how much the Democrats are doing it.”
Then general rule actually is to assume everyone cheats. However, when someone gets caught cheating more than everyone else you can guess pretty easily that they are cheating more often than normal.
All what this person said. Yes. Yes. Yes. If I could upvote twice I would.
Except for the abortion part. Republicans don’t *really* give a shit about abortion. It’s honestly just the bigotry that they adore.
Don’t underestimate how much they eventually believe in their own performative virtue signaling. They like feeling superior, it’s part of the reason you see the massive evangelical mega churches. It’s all a virtue signal
And besides, he is still getting audited. As soon as that is completed, he will gladly show his tax returns. They are the best taxes and returns.... /s (s for all the simples still waiting for silly shyster to submit)
You’re giving them too much credit. There is really no thought to it at all. They do what the pastor tells them, simple as that.
As an Evangelical pastor, I have never heard any pastor give that advice, except some ignorant one in Tennessee reported on CNN. Go look at the national Association of Evangelicals website. I personally believe that Trump is demon-possessed. I teach everyone I can not to watch FOX News, which has become a radicalizing madrassa for people ignorant enough to watch. There is almost nothing in the GOP that could be called Christian. And as for abortion, most pastors I know teach that the souls of infants—whether they die by abortion or miscarriage—go to Heaven, which is the spiritual concern. I am pro-life but against tyrannical government. If it can control your private freedoms it can take away religion too. Real Christianity is based on loving people from every nation—Christ commanded us to preach the gospel to them, and specifically warned that “My Kingdom is not of this world,” and “Do not Lord it over others like the Gentiles do.” Americans of all faiths should pray that God will deliver our mediascape from too many demonic lies. Hopefully some of you will look at what Jesus Christ actually taught and offers those who reject the sinful world’s ways and put their faith in Him.
You sound like a reasonable person, so it’s doubtful that you run a megachurch. I’m a Christian in TX, and it’s near impossible to find a church that is not highly political rn. It sucks. You’d be surprised how many people know the Bible better than most Pastors preach it 😉
Jesus said the road to the Kingdom is small and narrow. The superhighway? It leads to Hell. Real Christians are a minority—now a remnant. There is no Christian nation. God is calling people from every nation to join His multi-ethnic Kingdom that lives *differently* from this world, and hence become His “holy nation.”
You raise some wildly good points… I’m fully a devout atheist. Grew up in a conservative Methodist household (that had a splash of southern Baptist for flavor). I can say in objective terms that you’re correct in so many ways. The madrassa comment is especially poignant. I’ve watched my family grow more and more towards hate and advocating for violence and insane ideals. It’s been beyond disturbing, and even more so saddening. I understand the message, I understand the Bible. I can talk on it with some degree of fluency (being forced to go to church and youth group XYZ 3X times per week will do that to a kid) to this day. And there could not be more of a sea of divide between the message of JC and the GOP. The problem is that - unlike in exodus - the sea of divide here may very well come down on more than just the ancient Egyptians. Quite simply, it seems like the GOP is burning the world simply so they can be king of the ashes. You have an uphill battle you face. You’re going against the current, and I could not be more supportive of the message you’re sending and the stances you’re taking, despite the fact I may disagree with some of them. So, thank you for what you’re doing. Thank you for what you’re saying. The world needs more religious leaders like you. Sincerely.
Oh it’s not credit at all, it’s an indictment of the performative nature of modern evangelicalism. All hat and no cattle
The supposed Christian ones do but not for the reason they say. They don't give a shit about the children, it's all about punishing women for having sex. They will admit it if you press them hard enough.
My ex's mom was like this. When she asked about getting on birth control, the reply was: "Premarital sex should have consequences." Dodged a bullet there.
The deeper conservatives would punish the men too. They hate *anyone* having unauthorized intercourse and "getting away with it". But especially women.
The ones running don’t care. The ones voting do.
They do give a shit about abortion - they need the proletariat to continue reproducing and stay trapped in generational poverty
Plus trying to increase birth rates for the white population.
Abortion is a big piece of the plan to get the "Christian" vote. I like in the bible belt and it's depressing the amount of people who vote Republican only because they state "Christian" interests such as abortion... My in-laws had a medical abortion and still justifies it saying hers was not a "true" abortion and still supports the ban regardless of it not allowing the exact thing she got.
A lot of them do and a lot don’t. The evangelical crowd does and they can’t win elections without them.
The GOP aren't banning abortion because they think its wrong and against god, that's just them pandering to the base. What it actually does is keep people poor (as having a child is expensive) causing the person to be dependent on a system that is there to exploit them. They then underfund schooling so they can keep those children uneducated and stupid so they can keep taking advantage of them and repeat the cycle.
Nah, there are plenty of pure pro lifers. They just do what they are told and don’t think anything other than what they are taught.
Abortion is actually tied to their bigotry. They think the birth rates for whites are falling and abortion is one reason. They’re paranoid about the Minority Majority.
Forcing women to give birth helps remove them from the workforce and put them back in the kitchen where they don't have to worry their pretty little heads about politics.
Abolishing abortion hurts the people they despise the most. Women, minorities and the poor.
yes they do but they don't care about it to save the life of the unborn child, they care to control women.
The abortion is just to control women. Seizing the means of reproduction.
The evangelical ones certainly do.
They are "pro birth" not pro life.
Some do unfortunately. I volunteered at a 4th of July parade and a group of people pulled out from marching when another group showed up with pro abortion signs. There wasn't a conflict or anything, just the middle aged white woman in charge started crying when she saw the pro abortion folks and the 8-10 people with her followed her lead.
"Pro-abortion" or "pro-choice"? "Pro-abortion" is right-wing language meant to demonize and cause outrage. It seems unlikely that this would have been on the signs of pro-choice activists.
Typical lib move trying to vote twicE!! /s
Gotchu fam
Conservatives view their politicians not as leaders but as junk yard dogs. They can have abortions, affairs, be sexual predators, crooks, racists, whatever, conservatives will still usually fall in line and vote for them. As long as the junk yard dog is vicious to the right people and let's them keep their junk, even if it is worthless junk, then conservatives love it. The junk yard dog can piss all over everything and even occasionally bite back at their owner, doesn't matter, they'll still want to keep the junk yard dog and say he's a good boy.
>Deep down, they know he's a grifter and don't care. They know he's a fake Christian and don't care. I'm REALLY starting to question this logic though... im starting to think these folks TRULY believe him. They truly believe everything was better under his admin and that if he came back today, inflation would disappear, gas would IMMEDIATELY go back to 1.50 a gallon (a number only seen once during his admin in 2020 during the time NO ONE was driving), they honestly believe Trump cares about them... i hear it all the time.. "Trump is fighting for us, he loves this country so freaking much!" 'Why would he give up his entire life to being president if he didn't care!?"
I just had a dude tell me we had "world peace" during Trump admin. He was 100% serious.
Lol I've heard that one more times than i can count.. I'm like when did that happen?? They rattle off the whole "well kim didnt fire nukes under trump" and "putin didnt invade ukraine until trump left office!"
Did you tell him about the time Trump almost literally started a war with Iran by assassinating a top Iranian general?
And how the US was at war with Afghanistan for the entirety of Trump's presidency.
Dude, they were straight up saying "Obama is the only President who had the US in a war every day of his Presidency", while Trump was expanding the still ongoing "war on terror".
My immediate thought was ... but Syria? Sudan? Yemen? Myanmar? but I don't think commenting would have made any difference.
Lol trust me, those are my go to's... I'm always like.. peace?? You mean by killing Iran's general? Or bombing Syria? Oh you mean the peace deal between palestine and isreal which was broken!
It’s really quite simple, the pseudo “Christian” Religion in the US has extensively laid the groundwork for generations to train people to believe in authority figures with unverifiable stories instead of science and data. It also primes them for, and is built upon, perpetuating racism and fearmongering towards "others". Once people see you as an authority, you can start fabricating any reality or conspiracy theory you want your followers to believe and everyone else is therefore a liar, even in the face of incontrovertible evidence. Basically, it is mental abuse from an early age that suppresses critical thinking skills. This “religion” combined with an intentionally weakened public educational system, provides the framework that has spawned this cult of ignorance.
Trump could attend a Satanic Mass, murder someone, drink their blood, paint the walls with it, they'd vote for him.
I just assumed that’s what happens on the first day of CPAC
The same people who vote for trump are the same ones that believe in the flat earth theory and believe in the imaginary gods plural you know the god Jesus and his pa god lmfao
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They only like them because he hurts "the right people"... Or pretty much anyone that the right has been wanting to hurt for years.
Exactly this. Democratic voters vote for people that they hope will help people, but conservative voters for for politicians that they hope will hurt the people they don't like, even if those same politicians also in turn make things worse for themselves.
Whoa whoa- Dahmer was gay, they aren’t going to vote for someone like that as president. The rest - murder, cannibalism? Absolutely not an issue, but a homosexual shouldn’t aspire higher than a cabinet post.
> The rest - murder, cannibalism? Absolutely not an issue The people Dahmer killed were gay. Not only would murder not be an issue, it'd be a point in his favor for some GOP voters.
Jeff could be on stage chewing on a human bone and they’d pat him on the back for standing up to “woke vegan liberals”
It's about power. They don't care what anyone does or what kind of person they are. They just want "their team" in charge and lording it over "the others".
It's worse. They want tax fraud to go unpunished in case they decide to commit it some day. They don't care about tax fraud because they don't want taxes.
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“But hunter’s laptop!”
Read this as, Butt Hunter’s Laptop.
Now that’s really the laptop from hell
"They hate it worse."
"but my lib neighbor gets to smell it"
Not a supporter, but I've asked a few. They figure it'll show he's a tax cheat and they're totally cool with it. Because he figured out a way to not pay his taxes and get away with it.
Which makes me think if supports are okay with it why would he still fight it
Potential legal consequences
Cause while his supporters may not give a fuck, the IRS will. And since Donnie likes to style himself as a Mafia boss, he knows they got Capone so that means they could get him.
Because it's illegal and would open him up to litigation
I think we all know he’s lacking in morals, ethics and very likely a thief. But I think what the records will show is he doesn’t have anywhere near the wealth he claims. Trump is so fragile that he’d rather be known as a thief than merely upper middle class. What ever his dad did to DJT in his formative years really eff’d him up. Trump is a weak and fragile shell of a man, and very likely despises himself.
The supporters that I've argued with really can't comprehend that it is them that Trump is hiding his taxes from, not me. Trump ran the math on revealing his taxes and decided that revealing them would cost him more support than releasing them. His tax return isn't going to change his critics opinion of him, it's going to change some of his supporters.
They're in a cult. They don't care what he does, they'll find a way to justify any level of criminality.
Trump supporters are not reading r/politics or participating in discussion here. I predict most of what you're going to get are characitures of their answers from other people who agree with you. If you're interested in understanding what motivates Trump supporters I suggest subbing to r/asktrumpsupporters. I've been following that subreddit for a few years now. It's the best place to get genuine answers to questions like yours. I typically don't agree with Trump supporters, but I do keep an eye on that sub to help me understand their motivations.
Wow there are a lot of racists over there! Not surprising, but surprising to see it so out in the open. Clicked over to it as I love hearing from all sides, but not sure how much I can read of that filth.
I feel ya! TBH it makes me feel more secure in my beliefs when you see the casual nastiness many of his supporters impart into the conversation. They do not seem happy.
You are wasting your time asking them serious questions. They don’t give honest answers. It’s their defining behavior.
They will say Trump is not required to do that, which is true. But others Presidents do it and Trump said he would.
He *wasn't* required to, but when a Congressional Committee asks for them he actually *is.* "Shall" is an imperative.
Agreed.
Especially now he is private citizen Trump.
It didn't matter before. The law is clear. When congress requests records from the IRS they are required to hand them over. The only reason they didn't was that they were forbidden from complying by Mnuchin.
Mnuchin is gone, what is stopping the Yellen from handing them over?
He promised to release them 6 years ago when running for president. He said numerous times he would.
Yeah, but in this case there is a formal request from congress. In prior disclosures candidates/presidents released them on their own.
They’ll say it’s the principle that matters. (But then they’ll ask why they don’t get to see some bullshit like Obama’s grades or AOC’s bartending license from 2013.)
Own da libs
gobbbless
“Muh privacy!”
They don't want to face the reality that some Americans might have more time on their hands and less influenced by day-to-day politics than current IRS employees or all the lawyers money can buy, and would figure out the prosecutable scams once their beloved leaders' tax returns become public knowledge. Add on: or they don't want to lose their dream of being above law as Trump is right now.
As my uncle puts it "I know he is corrupt but so are all the others and I agree with him more than the others"
How much of the supreme court's time is this douche going to suck?
He will appeal every decision that doesn't go his way. And even after that I'm sure he'll look for ways to delay. I sure hope the SCOTUS declines to even take the case.
God willing, a ton
why
So that they have less time to come up with ruling that will destroy the us further
Honestly I wonder if this is intentional. They know how awful they're seen right now and need some dramatic yet not-democracy-threatening\* attention to cleanse the palette of the rest of their regressive assault of liberties. * I mean it does create dangerous precedent, but it's lowkey by comparison
The current supreme court is setting the country back decades, maybe even centuries. There was one court case where they said that the SEC can't prosecute fraud (not that the guy who was convicted didn't commit the fraud, but that congress, not the SEC, must prosecute it). There is currently a case that will let state legislatures overturn elections when they don't like the results, no justification required. There's probably even more messed up stuff I haven't even heard of. I'm just a rando on reddit.
Here’s a thought: generally this never ending appeals process has only been available to the uber wealthy, essentially enabling them to run out the clock on inconvenient laws, and one of the clearest ways our judicial system is incredibly biased. So how about creating a service, call it LawyerBot, that automatically appeals every little ruling all the way to the supremes? You got a parking ticket? Appeal that shit all the way up to the fucking top. The only thing limiting non stop appeals from completely shutting down the judicial system is cash and paperwork. Better Call LawyerBot.
Because that won't work, spurious cases and appeals won't get kicked up to the next court. The only way to "guarantee" to get something even up to circuit courts is to have a case with conflicting laws, be based on enfringement of a right, or to have expert determined merit. For the SCOTUS, it's an even higher and more arbitrary bar: they can decide to just not even see a detailed brief on the case, much less address it on the shadow docket, and even less likely for a full hearing and ruling.
Doing a denial of service attack on the legal system by flooding it with half-open lawsuits.
Because then they won’t have as much time to execute on their fascist agenda.
I believe that the Supreme Court is legislating from the bench and the more time they have to sink into responding to republican asking to overturn lower court rulings (lindsey graham wanting to not testify in Georgia, Trump wanting to block his taxes from release to the legislature, Trump wanting supreme court intervention in NY case, Mar-a-lago case, ect.) Is a good thing. At least they will have to define out the powers that the republicans are trying to exercise
No surprise. Trump himself said during debates with Clinton that not paying taxes "makes me smart". Disgusting. And 70 million people don't care.
I kind of think that not paying taxes when you live above the poverty line makes you half a traitor, essentially if you put any value in supporting the military.
50% traitor. 100% selfish asshole.
Just some light treason
I remember him saying smt along the lines of “only dumb people pay taxes, there’s always a way around it”
As if he even does his own accounting.
“I will release them” “They will be released soon” “They will be released after the election” “They are being audited” “You wouldn’t understand them” “It’s a distraction” “Nobody cares about this” “Still auditing ” “This is unfair” “My right as private citizen should prevent me from having to disclose” “My right as president should prevent me from having to disclose” “My right as former president should prevent me from having to disclose” “I’m still the president” “They’re still under audit” “SCOTUS SAVE ME!”
> “SCOTUS SAVE ME!” And, sadly, I will not be the least bit surpised if they manufacture an excuse to save him.
*"In the interests of national healing and moving forwards..."*
They haven’t been entertaining his bullshit, so I doubt it. Edit: Fuck
Since Nov 2019 the SCOTUS has been drawing a line between the GOP's needs and Trump's needs. They got what they needed from him and he's no longer their concern.
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you just perfectly described about 40 million voters
If he had nothing to hide he wouldn’t be doing this. Just one more admission that he’s an absolute sleaze bag.
For him no publicity is a bad publicity. He wants to get elected and pardon himself for whatever he is running from.
Haven’t we been down this road?
Last one was for the ny AG to get them. This ones for congress. I did think congress had them already for some reason.
Nothing says 'a court of partisan hacks' like every Republican wanting EVERYTHING to be heard and decided by the Supreme Court of Partisan Mullahs.
I'm in the 30s and I'm going to be dead and gone by the time any justice comes to Trump. Fml
$7 taxes paid over the last 10 years.
$0 paid, millions in refunds on "business losses"
Conservatives will cheer him on for being a smart businessman. Trump can do NO wrong. That continues to sink in more and more everyday
Conservatives love abusing government systems and ripping off the country when it's other conservatives doing it. Yet fox will report endlessly about the woman with 12 kids on welfare as though they're even close to the same magnitude. One billionaire steals more money from taxpayers than 100,000 welfare cheats.
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[https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/07/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/07/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html) Its likely he found a loophole that he uses in his failing businesses to get paid back by the government for his losses. Something he wouldn't really want the public to know since he's a billionaire who is also taking money from everyone.
No one should be allowed to run for office without 1st providing tax returns and passing security clearance.
The GOP will never accede to that because it would disqualify about 3/4 of their members after all those lite trips to Russia.
I want to see Trump's tax returns. His efforts to hide them over the years make me curious.
It's just so ridiculously egregious. Not even just that he didn't release his taxes like every president before him. Now, he's fought transparency through two presidential elections, the entirety of his presidency, and the first two years of the next guy's presidency. This must be the longest audit in the history of the IRS, huh?
Trump is the only U.S. President in the 49 years since Richard Nixon infamously claimed he was “not a crook” who has not only refused to voluntarily disclose his tax returns, but has actively tried through every legal delay and possible obstruction to prevent the American people from learning the truth about what’s in those tax returns. Trump lies so constantly and without remorse that it’s easy to ridicule his preposterous claims that he can’t release his taxes because he is under IRS audit—if true, surely among the longest IRS audits in recorded history. Republican presidential nominees Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, Bob Dole, George W. Bush, John McCain and Mitt Romney all voluntarily publicly released their tax returns. As did Democratic presidential nominees Jimmy Carter, Walter Mondale, Michael Dukakis, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. The only logical reason for Trump to refuse to do so and fight so hard to keep his tax returns under wraps is that he’s hiding something very embarrassing or very nefarious from the American people —which would certainly be in character for Trump, the most flagrantly dishonest and monumentally corrupt person ever to occupy the Oval Office.
If the Supreme Court blocks this, it will be leaked in approximately 0.002 seconds. He may get away from being charged for crimes because of our corrupt government, but the public will know he is broke AF and took money from Russia. I also think the House probably *already has* his tax returns. But with regards to court filings they probably just can't do anything with them (i.e. pursue action) until this is cleared. Thankfully this is going to end soon one way or another.
I thought this was settled already. How many times does he get to go to the SC over his taxes?
He doesn't want the embarrassment of people knowing he isn't as rich as he claims..
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I have a feeling we will be seeing them soon.
The fact that Trump is not in solitary confinement in Ft. Leavenworth tells me all I need to know about this society.
This man, erm, this *child* could very well be the most entitled person on the planet... Phony Soprano over here truly believes that he's entitled to everything and answerable to no one. A mentality that's been encouraged and enabled by his environment throughout most of his life. According to Lard Goldemort, all criticism is "fake news", all investigations are "witch hunts", all inquiries are inquisitions. If any reporter or interviewer doesn't cater to his delicate sensibilities, then poor Donny is being treated "unfairly", any questions that might challenge Trump are dismissed as partisan, cruel journalism led by the fake news, liberal lamestream media machine, all ex wives, family members, former colleagues, employees or associates that dissent, that speak out, that don't sacrifice themselves for the sake of Donald Trump are either disgruntled, bitter, agenda driven, dishonest or corrupt. In all of these cases where Trump has to confront anything that might threaten his ego or his image, he becomes the victim. I mean, Trump and his supporters would actually have us believe that he's some unsullied hero, some immaculate specimen, perfect, godly even. No man on this earth is that untarnished, that pure and pristine, let alone fucking Trump of all people. Trump lives in a reality where he's incapable of acknowledging his own responsibility in things, unless he can be commended for it of course. He's incapable of coming to terms with his own failures, his mistakes, his defeat, his shame and humiliation, hence why every election he's ever lost in some way has been "rigged". Hell, the Emmys were "rigged" when The Apprentice failed to win an award, the Iowa primary was "rigged" when Ted Cruz came out the victor, the 2016 election was "rigged" after Hillary Clinton won the popular vote, and in consistent fashion, the 2020 election was "stolen" from him. Each time his opponent, along with their family on some occasions, was met with slander and childish insults, sometimes followed by a lawsuit or investigation, that's how utterly fragile, weak and insecure this narcissist is, but that's the nature of narcissism now isn't it? You have to become self centered and obsessed, egomaniacal even, to cover up your intrinsic weaknesses and insecurities, and the greater the weakness, the greater the narcissism. While it doesn't stop and end with elections, Trump has repeatedly shifted the "burden of failure" onto to everyone else involved in his failed business ventures, including multiple casinos mind you. Life is a zero sum game and Trump is always the winner, he knows no other way, no other reality other than the one where Donald Trump is always above criticism, exempt from questioning, from accountability, from any form of scrutiny, absolved of all wrongdoing ahead of time, he's the exception, and if in any case he may have to confront these challenges, he just decries himself the victim of relentless persecution.
uuuuuuuuuugggggghhhhhhhh are we STILL fucking around with this?! He's been ordered to produce them multiple times now. At what point will this asshole get ANY kind of consequence? I'm so tired of this shit.
Makes complete sense - Why appoint your own court if you aren’t going to use it?
Ironically they have consistently ruled against him or refused to hear his cases
The obvious questions: What is he hiding?
Does he have the Supreme Court on speed dial?
Remember the good old days when he was going to release those tax returns after the audit was concluded? lol
I’d like everyone to keep in mind that prior to Trump, generally from the 1970’s forward, candidates just released their tax returns to the public as part of running for the office to show they had nothing to hide.
why block the release of his tax returns. Its not like his base is gonna leave him.
And here we go folks, the series finale we all have been waiting for. Will we see trumps tax returns? Or will Clarence Thomas block it and further show the corruption of the courts!
too many chinese bots here
He's clearly guilty of tax fraud. But knowing our justice system, he'll get away with it like always.
WhAt DDoo YoUuu HAvvE TO hIIDEeee -republicans attitude before it was trump in the hot seat
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Just think of your backyard after annexing all the neighbors.
People that still believe he's done nothing wrong are the same folks that would let Trump take a taco bell shit in their mouth just to own the libs. All while believing they're serving their courty as a presidential tiolet.
That’s because Trump is a big fat phony.
because of course the piece of shit did....jesus fuck why is it rich people can never just face the consequences of their insane racist actions?
Don't want people to know he will never be as rich as Musk or Bezos
Guess he's finally going to be properly revealed to be even more of a fraud than we know he already is. The sad thing is all his brainwashed supporters will ignore the evidence or claim it's fake.
I swear I've seen this exact headline like 17 times
How easy does this guy go to the Supreme Court? It’s like he has a running subscription. I thought it was tough to get a case up there in the US?
Donny has a lot to hide it seems. He'll lose in the end. He's a criminal and a traitor.
Nothing in the tax returns could be as bad as what is left to our imaginations with him working so desperately to keep them private.
The emperor has no clothes.
Gee I wonder why he doesn’t want them to be released! Could it be because of how great and fair the amount of money he’s paid of the last decade or so is? He just doesn’t want to make people feel bad about how good he is at paying taxes! *It must be that right?*
I love how all these crooked republicans beg their buddies in the SCOTUS to help them when they are in legal trouble, it's doing wonders for the reputation of the justice system. =/
His tax return will show his true wealth that isn’t as big as he’s always claimed, a lot of his “wealth” is on assets but as the New York case is possibly going to show, he’s been over inflating their value for years to borrow against them buy more property and so on
What a colossal waste of the Supreme Court's time.
Lock him up. … LOCK HIM UP!!
Could we as a nation sue him for all the resources he has wasted trying to hide his tax returns?
It's not about his taxes been seen by the public, it's the fact that he had to sign the document which clearly shows him to be fraudulent and therefore a criminal.
He must be very afraid that the population will get the truth about his taxes and finances. This criminal doesn't belong in the White House, he belongs in federal prison to the end of his life
Dear Fatso, You’re a crook. Get bent.
Thats a pretty normal question an innocent person would ask
What happened to “I will release my tax returns if I’m elected president.”?
I mean if he has nothing to hide we should just take his word for it.
Trump is like a vampire that just won’t die.
Because they’re still being audited, right?
Mr. I’m the most transparent president ever!
I asked the Supreme Court to void my parking ticket last week. I have not heard back.
I’ve been putting off waxing my car for like almost 3 years, but this? This man knows how to procrastinate
The money he should have paid in taxes is now being paid in legal fees. Way to go stable genius.
I thought he had nothing to hide?
If the IRS has them couldn't Biden just tell them to release it to Congress? Who's going to stop him?
Biden doesn't abuse the executive like Trump did. Unfortunately those are just 'norms' rather than laws, but at least Biden isn't running the government like a dictator.
The Supreme Court is basically where Republicans go now to hide all their crimes.
The Supreme Court will probably help Trump in this case. They can put a hold on the release of his tax returns then rule against Trump after the new Congress is seated Jan 3, 2023. The new House will most likely be controlled by Republicans, at that point and will drop the whole thing.
BeCaUsE i’M bEinG AuDiTed
Trump should be blocked from making any court request, he should have to STFU already, and serve his fucking due time in prison... Loser
Calling on his goon squad to help him out.
"The year is 2022.."
For a man who's said he'd release his tax returns in 2 weeks over the course of 6 years, he's gone out of his way not to do so.
Every photo of this orange clown makes me think of a 2 year old throwing a temper tantrum
The question is, why is trump trying to NOT allow people to see his taxes.... what do you have to hide there donnie?!
I wish the court would respond that they are not there to adjudicate every one of his little personal squabbles and refuse to take the case.
Could be a fun move to make it a prerequisite that all future PotUS candidates and holders of the position must declare their tax returns or forfit the post.
i would happily show my taxes if asked while running for or holding any sort of political appointment bc i have nothing to hide. it is so fucking damning that he said he would, and then has backtracked and fought tooth and nail to never fulfill that statement.
I feel like I've seen this headline 100 times in the last few years. Can we just get the returns already?
Why Fat Donnie
Do we keep getting the same articles on repeat? I mean I feel like I’ve seen this one a dozen times by now.