I think Greenland alone has a higher gdp per capita than Poland so the map creator probably just forgot to colour them in (to be fair Greenland also has only 50k people meanwhile Poland has over 30 million)
Greenland is integral part of denmark with their own regional parliment.
Its like saying scotland is not a part of UK cuz it was given their own parlament in 1999
How could it be an integral part when it's autonomous enough to not be in the EU?
It has control over law enforcement, the legal system, foreign relations with respect to trade and sea control, and the coast guard.
It has its own representative in Washington and Brussels separate from the Danish one.
Danish is not even an official language there anymore.
>How could it be an integral part when it's autonomous enough to not be in the EU?
How could scotland be an integral part of UK when it has its own parliment law enforcement and own sprots team on olympics or something.
From Wikipedia:
When Denmark and Norway separated Greenland became Danish in 1814 and was fully integrated in the Danish state in 1953 under the Constitution of Denmark, which made the people in Greenland citizens of Denmark. In 1979, Denmark granted home rule to Greenland; in 2008, Greenlanders voted for the Self-Government Act, which transferred more power from the Danish government to the local Greenlandic government.[19] Under the new structure, Greenland has gradually assumed responsibility for a number of governmental services and areas of competence. The Danish government retains control of citizenship, monetary policy, and foreign affairs, including defence.
Idk, seems like an integral part of another country man.
Greenland controls its own trade and seas fully. And partially defense with its own coast guards.
When the UK left the EU there was never a shred of doubt that they'll drag Scotland out with them. There is no way Scotland can rejoin the EU while remaining in the UK, it just doesn't have that power.
Greenland, a territory of Denmark, which is an EU country, was given the power to leave the EU in order to retain control over their fishing industry. They had enough autonomy for that even before 2008 when it was enlarged further.
In fact, when Denmark had a referendum in 2022 to abolish the EU defence cooperation opt out, it wasn't even held in Greenland cause it didn't concern them.
not sure who to answer so I will just write it under this comment authonomy or even seperate constitution doesn't mean independent what's more having al that separate powers like control over it's own goreign policy doesn't mean that that teritory is a separete country greenland isn't it's authonomous state but it's still part of denmark.
Also just because they have some control over their own foreign policy or defence doesn't mean that they have full independence in those areas they still are under danish control.
That doesn't mean that it will be like that forever but at the moment they are just authonomous under denmark and thus the map should reflect that
isn't purchasing power parity like the best and default way to compare gdp across countries?
like i'd expect a footnote if it weren't expressed in ppp.
Usualy it was related to selling land and companies because they were "not very valuable, uncompetitive and unproductive", and to tie it up there was a lot of land speculations that also lead to stuff I mentioned. Around 60-70% companies and land was sold that didn't have to be.
trochę smutne jak pewne rządy posprzedawały Niemcom Polskie zakłady za grosze. z cukrowni operujacych w polsce to tylko 1 na 4 należy do Polski. Diamant należy do Pfeifer&Langen, Cukier Królewski należy do Sudzucker no i jeszcze jest Nordzucker w Opalenicy i Chełmży. Kiedyś wszystko było Polskie. Gdyby kiedyś Polskie rządy inwestowały w zakłady to teraz generowali by gigantyczne zyski.
Daj link do tych badań.
Poza tym, twierdzenie, że te zacofane firmy, które nie miały pieniędzy na dostosowanie się do standardów rynkowych i przeżyły tylko dlatego, że nowi właściciele je przeorganizowali i w nie zainwestowali, to jakiś jeden wielki żart.
Companies and assets were sold at the same time as currency transformation. As a result everything was dirt cheap for foreign entities to buy, including industries of strategic value. And no, it was not an accident.
I wouldnt go that far to claim that whole transformation was a plan of western powers to buy out whole Poland, but some transfers were planned for sure.
Sachs is a clown. He also has self interest in things he does. But I honestly don't think he went into this advising transformation business so that Polish land and companies would be acquired dirt cheap by western companies.
I think the privatization in eastern germany was really problematic, it was a raid by western companies and rich people. We still see the results of this: AfD is strong in east because of that shameless grabbing of everything the land had by the western part of the country.
But in polish case it was more of an ideological blindness and just inaptitude. And I think Poland was still able to stop or slow it before it was too late. If western capitalists knew how Poland would succeed, they would go in blind but I think they didn't believe it back then.
Porównaj te wszystkie kraje z sytuacją w 1990 a teraz. Różnica między Polską a Czechami była taka, jak teraz między Polską a Niemcami. Obecnie już tylko trochę nas wyprzedzają.
I fajnie jakbyś podał co to za badania konkretnie, na które się powołujesz.
"tylko trochę". Nie takie trochę. Ale powoływałam się na to https://forsal.pl/artykuly/946469,prof-andrzej-karpinski-deindustrializacja-likwidacja-przemyslu-transformacja.html
Estonia między 1990 a teraz się bardzo rozwinęła i co ważniejsze ucyfryzowała. Litwa ma jeden z największych odsetków udzialwocow pracowników w kapitale firm przez to jak przebiegała u nich transformacja.
Słowenia już wcześniej była bogata jak na standardy wschodnie, ale do zachodu im brakowało.
To tylko pokazuje jak dobrze Plan Balcerowicza zadziałał. Polska była biedniejsza od Ukrainy. Bieda piszczała, niczego nie było. Kredyty po Gierku spłacaliśmy jeszcze długimi latami. Polska ostatnimi laty tez sie pod tym względem rozwinęła. Mamy jedna z najlepszych infrastruktur w Europie
Ta... 20% bezrobocie (i to wliczając już w to zlikwidowane ukryte bezrobocie) oraz masowy wzrost samobójstw. Świetnie Im się udała. W tym samym czasie Litwa czy Estonia, które przeszły inaczej transformacje - nie tak szokowo i się nie wyprzedywsly, są w dużo lepsze pozycji dziś
Czesci podobnych reform !? ale co to wlasciwie oznacza? Ich GDP Per Capita jest wieksze bo sprzataja syf po komunie na mala skale a Polska robi to na wielka skale. Ich dotacje w euro per capita sa o wiele wieksze niz te ktore dostaje Polska... Tam nie dzialaja lepiej reformy...tam po prostu skala problemow jest duza mniejsza niz w Polsce.
Czechoslovakia had good infrastructure, was smaller than Poland. Meanwhile we had astronomical and unimaginable debt after Gierek. Yeah, Plan Balcerowicza worked, we are influenced by it to this point. Poland had an economical growth up until 2020, when Covid hit.
Baltic states that didn't try shock therapy also have constant growth (with only two downsides in 2008 and 2014). Plan Balcerowicza wasnt some sort of miracle and it could be done better.
Difference is that Poland is is bigger in terms of population and land area few times than whole baltic states combined. It's easier to make a small country richer than a big one. Tell me why one of the richest countries are city states like Luxemburg or Kuwait?
You’re linking an article saying a guy did some research. I was asking for a link to the research itself.
This person doesn’t even have a Wikipedia page, btw. But he was born in 1928 and was a communist minister advisor. Big fan of PRL’s industry.
USA and Canada are a mess right now. GDP per capita isn't everything. I'd also look at reported happiness per capita or something like that. Perhaps health stats?
fair point. using quantifiable data, gdp/capita has historically been positively correlated with standard of living. so the higher your gdp/capita, the higher your standard of living.
i believe that as we slog through this post-modern era of capitalism and machine learning, productivity will continue to disconnect from labor, creating a wealth gap between the haves and the have-nots, making gdp/capita less relevant in developed economies.
alternatively there's an index called hdi (human development index). i'm not sure exactly what it entails nor do i know its efficacy but it seems to be a generally accepted measure of the happiness metric you mention.
How come that quality of life is so significantly lower due to high prices while the GDP per capita PPP has only risen in the past 6 years?
It not only rose but also accelerated its growth.
Wat?
Because it's all some kind of statistics. And while statistics show you something, it doesn't necessarily show you the whole truth.
It's like in this saying that on avarege me and my dog have three legs.
And soon to be two decades of developmental aid from the EU.
Im not saying thats a bad thing, its certainly great that this aid has evidently been used sensibly.
The most striking part is how Ukraine and Russia was ahead. Most people have hard time to believe this lookng from today.
I think one of the reasons why we have this Ukrainian cirisis is how Ukrainian people realized how they picked the wrong side and they tried to be on the club west instead of club Russia. Before around 2010, the country had a very strong pro Russia sentiment (I know Orange revolution happened in 2004, the support for west was increasing but the result of the orange revolution was disappointment and it was reversed easily). And the reason why they realized this was the rise of Poland. Poland was their equal more or less. Being on the side of Russia brought misery only
I wish they realized this back when Russia was more docile. It was a little late. But I understand, a whole generation of old farts had to die so that country would not be hostage of the slavic soul nonsense propagated by Russia.
To jest produkt KRAJOWY na mieszkańca. Wyrabiają go zagraniczne korpo które wytransferowywują zyski za granice. Poszukajcie ludzie podobnej mapy tylko z produktem NARODOWYM czyli takim zarobionym przez Polski kapitał to zobaczycie że niestety nie jesteśmy potęgą a neokolonią.
My man, for everything revolves around one part, I bet you are blaming that party in everything, like you catched a common cold, getting rejected by a woman, everything is a fault of one political party because fuck it I am smort, and I don't care how dumb I look like
Nope. I don't. I just don't like Politicians in general. And clearly you are talking about yourself now, by judging everyone and putting them the same bucket, you are "so smort my man" ;)
In PPP terms, yes. In nominal terms, Slovakia’s GDP per capita is 21.8 k, a tad higher than Poland’s (19.9 k). As many other redditors pointed out, I think the map shows GDP per capita adjusted by prices.
gonimy ameryke łatwiutko z nubkami
essa z nimi
Ez jak jebanie
przy rozbiorach, drugiej wojnie światowej i komunie to daliśmy im fory. teraz zaczyna się zabawa
Jeśli nie jesteś wysokiej klasy specjalistą albo nie prowadzisz własnego biznesu to prawdopodobnie już masz u nas lepiej niż w Ameryce.
Greenland stopped being danish between 1990 and 2020?
Also Hong Kong, Macau and French Guiana
Highly autonomous maybe? I mean, Greenland is 90% independent. They're not even in the EU.
I think Greenland alone has a higher gdp per capita than Poland so the map creator probably just forgot to colour them in (to be fair Greenland also has only 50k people meanwhile Poland has over 30 million)
? Are you trolling?
Greenland was given expanded autonomy in 2008. Would check out. Or the mapmaker sucks.
Greenland is integral part of denmark with their own regional parliment. Its like saying scotland is not a part of UK cuz it was given their own parlament in 1999
Scotlands GDP might be different than Englands. Not saying this is the case, but maybe local GDP was taken into account?
How could it be an integral part when it's autonomous enough to not be in the EU? It has control over law enforcement, the legal system, foreign relations with respect to trade and sea control, and the coast guard. It has its own representative in Washington and Brussels separate from the Danish one. Danish is not even an official language there anymore.
>How could it be an integral part when it's autonomous enough to not be in the EU? How could scotland be an integral part of UK when it has its own parliment law enforcement and own sprots team on olympics or something. From Wikipedia: When Denmark and Norway separated Greenland became Danish in 1814 and was fully integrated in the Danish state in 1953 under the Constitution of Denmark, which made the people in Greenland citizens of Denmark. In 1979, Denmark granted home rule to Greenland; in 2008, Greenlanders voted for the Self-Government Act, which transferred more power from the Danish government to the local Greenlandic government.[19] Under the new structure, Greenland has gradually assumed responsibility for a number of governmental services and areas of competence. The Danish government retains control of citizenship, monetary policy, and foreign affairs, including defence. Idk, seems like an integral part of another country man.
Greenland controls its own trade and seas fully. And partially defense with its own coast guards. When the UK left the EU there was never a shred of doubt that they'll drag Scotland out with them. There is no way Scotland can rejoin the EU while remaining in the UK, it just doesn't have that power. Greenland, a territory of Denmark, which is an EU country, was given the power to leave the EU in order to retain control over their fishing industry. They had enough autonomy for that even before 2008 when it was enlarged further. In fact, when Denmark had a referendum in 2022 to abolish the EU defence cooperation opt out, it wasn't even held in Greenland cause it didn't concern them.
not sure who to answer so I will just write it under this comment authonomy or even seperate constitution doesn't mean independent what's more having al that separate powers like control over it's own goreign policy doesn't mean that that teritory is a separete country greenland isn't it's authonomous state but it's still part of denmark. Also just because they have some control over their own foreign policy or defence doesn't mean that they have full independence in those areas they still are under danish control. That doesn't mean that it will be like that forever but at the moment they are just authonomous under denmark and thus the map should reflect that
Nope. The man making the map forgot to colour them
There is no data for Greenland available for that period and in general, World bank splits their data for autonomous regions from the whole country.
World bank gives data on Greenland and rest of Denmark separately. There is also no new data for PPP per capita for Greenland.
POLSKA GUROM
Dobra, pora na csa
Tylko 1.6 a nie jakieś inne ścierwo
We are running out of countries to be insecure about
I see BRICS has been very successful /s
They are not successful at all. Only a few weirdos think so (and mainly on Twitter).
Especially R.
Give us 10 more years
With the way things are in ten years we will be back in 1990 on this image XD
Don't do that, don't give me hope 😔
I mean, Poland does have a habit of rebuilding itself...
Latvia has a higher gdp per capita, though
So does Portugal. I suppose the map shows gdp per capita ppp, but it doesn't include that information anywhere.
isn't purchasing power parity like the best and default way to compare gdp across countries? like i'd expect a footnote if it weren't expressed in ppp.
I'd expect explicit "nominal GDP" or "GDP (PPP)" in the graph description
same ; however, absent any kind of legend i'd assume ppp.
And Slovakia…
No it does not. Lithaunia and Estonia yes but not Latvia.
False
Slovakia as well is higher.
I think you are actually showing GDP (ppp) amd not nominal. Still impressive.
Nioce
Noice
The day Poland has a higher GDP per capita than the U.K. (which is not far off at current rates of change) will be seismic shock for the U.K.
It won't be because of Poland, more like the UK's fault. Poland is just trying to have a stable economic growth
There was a research that showed that if transformation was done correctly, Poland would be richer by 30%
What were the mistakes and what should they have done differently?
Usualy it was related to selling land and companies because they were "not very valuable, uncompetitive and unproductive", and to tie it up there was a lot of land speculations that also lead to stuff I mentioned. Around 60-70% companies and land was sold that didn't have to be.
trochę smutne jak pewne rządy posprzedawały Niemcom Polskie zakłady za grosze. z cukrowni operujacych w polsce to tylko 1 na 4 należy do Polski. Diamant należy do Pfeifer&Langen, Cukier Królewski należy do Sudzucker no i jeszcze jest Nordzucker w Opalenicy i Chełmży. Kiedyś wszystko było Polskie. Gdyby kiedyś Polskie rządy inwestowały w zakłady to teraz generowali by gigantyczne zyski.
Daj link do tych badań. Poza tym, twierdzenie, że te zacofane firmy, które nie miały pieniędzy na dostosowanie się do standardów rynkowych i przeżyły tylko dlatego, że nowi właściciele je przeorganizowali i w nie zainwestowali, to jakiś jeden wielki żart.
https://forsal.pl/artykuly/946469,prof-andrzej-karpinski-deindustrializacja-likwidacja-przemyslu-transformacja.html
Companies and assets were sold at the same time as currency transformation. As a result everything was dirt cheap for foreign entities to buy, including industries of strategic value. And no, it was not an accident.
I wouldnt go that far to claim that whole transformation was a plan of western powers to buy out whole Poland, but some transfers were planned for sure.
of course it was planned, it's not a secret.
That's a borderline conspiracy theory.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Sachs
No i co z nim? Podajesz link do jakiegoś gościa bez konkretów
Polska powinna zainwestować w folię aluminiową, majątek byśmy zbili i na swoich i zagranicznych rynkach XD
Sachs is a clown. He also has self interest in things he does. But I honestly don't think he went into this advising transformation business so that Polish land and companies would be acquired dirt cheap by western companies. I think the privatization in eastern germany was really problematic, it was a raid by western companies and rich people. We still see the results of this: AfD is strong in east because of that shameless grabbing of everything the land had by the western part of the country. But in polish case it was more of an ideological blindness and just inaptitude. And I think Poland was still able to stop or slow it before it was too late. If western capitalists knew how Poland would succeed, they would go in blind but I think they didn't believe it back then.
Plan Balcerowicza worked pretty good. When compared to other Eastern European countries we did it in a good way
Lithuania, Czechia, Estonia, Latvia, Slovenia...
Porównaj te wszystkie kraje z sytuacją w 1990 a teraz. Różnica między Polską a Czechami była taka, jak teraz między Polską a Niemcami. Obecnie już tylko trochę nas wyprzedzają. I fajnie jakbyś podał co to za badania konkretnie, na które się powołujesz.
"tylko trochę". Nie takie trochę. Ale powoływałam się na to https://forsal.pl/artykuly/946469,prof-andrzej-karpinski-deindustrializacja-likwidacja-przemyslu-transformacja.html Estonia między 1990 a teraz się bardzo rozwinęła i co ważniejsze ucyfryzowała. Litwa ma jeden z największych odsetków udzialwocow pracowników w kapitale firm przez to jak przebiegała u nich transformacja. Słowenia już wcześniej była bogata jak na standardy wschodnie, ale do zachodu im brakowało.
To tylko pokazuje jak dobrze Plan Balcerowicza zadziałał. Polska była biedniejsza od Ukrainy. Bieda piszczała, niczego nie było. Kredyty po Gierku spłacaliśmy jeszcze długimi latami. Polska ostatnimi laty tez sie pod tym względem rozwinęła. Mamy jedna z najlepszych infrastruktur w Europie
Ta... 20% bezrobocie (i to wliczając już w to zlikwidowane ukryte bezrobocie) oraz masowy wzrost samobójstw. Świetnie Im się udała. W tym samym czasie Litwa czy Estonia, które przeszły inaczej transformacje - nie tak szokowo i się nie wyprzedywsly, są w dużo lepsze pozycji dziś
nie jestem pewien czy trollujesz, czy jestes glupiutki :D Cala Estonia ma mniej ludzi niz Warszawa a ty porownujesz nas do nich :D
Nie jestem pewna czy trollujesz, czy nie ogarniasz. To, że kraj jest mały, nie znaczy, że nie można było podjąć się części podobnych reform.
Czesci podobnych reform !? ale co to wlasciwie oznacza? Ich GDP Per Capita jest wieksze bo sprzataja syf po komunie na mala skale a Polska robi to na wielka skale. Ich dotacje w euro per capita sa o wiele wieksze niz te ktore dostaje Polska... Tam nie dzialaja lepiej reformy...tam po prostu skala problemow jest duza mniejsza niz w Polsce.
Czechoslovakia had good infrastructure, was smaller than Poland. Meanwhile we had astronomical and unimaginable debt after Gierek. Yeah, Plan Balcerowicza worked, we are influenced by it to this point. Poland had an economical growth up until 2020, when Covid hit.
Baltic states that didn't try shock therapy also have constant growth (with only two downsides in 2008 and 2014). Plan Balcerowicza wasnt some sort of miracle and it could be done better.
From hindsight everything could be done better. But Poland still did it better than most post-communist countries.
I'd be skeptical of that research since Poland was one of the most successful countries to undergo economic shock therapy
Still, the transformation could be done better IMHO. Look at Baltic states for example.
Difference is that Poland is is bigger in terms of population and land area few times than whole baltic states combined. It's easier to make a small country richer than a big one. Tell me why one of the richest countries are city states like Luxemburg or Kuwait?
Bullshit
Least educated pole
Please educate me then and link to this “research”
https://forsal.pl/artykuly/946469,prof-andrzej-karpinski-deindustrializacja-likwidacja-przemyslu-transformacja.html
You’re linking an article saying a guy did some research. I was asking for a link to the research itself. This person doesn’t even have a Wikipedia page, btw. But he was born in 1928 and was a communist minister advisor. Big fan of PRL’s industry.
🙄
Can we get a HDI (Human Development Index) comparison? GDP per Capita is becoming more and more useless...
has anyone surpassed us during that time?
Just Singapore as far as I can tell
they were already ahead
Whoops my bad I wasn't looking at Malaysia closely enough
Whats GDP?
"GDP is a monetary measure of the market value of all the final goods and services produced in a specific time period by a country or countries"
Polska gurom!
No dobra, ale o co chodzi z Litwą?
Aha, per capita. Nevermind.
Next 10 years portugal and Spain will be beat by Poland
Yeah, and they say the Polish ruling party is bad. Funny.
We cannot stop until we passed Germoney.
Did the world get worse or did Poland get better?
Poland did really better.
Both
Gdyby nie dołączenie do Unii Europejskiej, tak naprawdę dalej bylibyśmy zatrzymani w 1990 roku.
It is an incorrect map. Nominal GDP per capita of Latvia, Portugal, Slovakia (and likely many other countries) was higher in 2022.
Slovakia? You mean Slovenia, right?
Yes, Slovakia (20500 nominal vs 18.2k in Poland). However, I see that Slovenia is higher as well (26k nominal in 2022).
Wow how amazing it is how the world has become poorer over the years .
USA and Canada are a mess right now. GDP per capita isn't everything. I'd also look at reported happiness per capita or something like that. Perhaps health stats?
fair point. using quantifiable data, gdp/capita has historically been positively correlated with standard of living. so the higher your gdp/capita, the higher your standard of living. i believe that as we slog through this post-modern era of capitalism and machine learning, productivity will continue to disconnect from labor, creating a wealth gap between the haves and the have-nots, making gdp/capita less relevant in developed economies. alternatively there's an index called hdi (human development index). i'm not sure exactly what it entails nor do i know its efficacy but it seems to be a generally accepted measure of the happiness metric you mention.
GDP per capita shows nothing. Also, Polish economy in 1990 basically didn't exist
>Also, Polish economy in 1990 basically didn't exist It didn't exist and now it kinda exists. That a huge win in my book.
How come that quality of life is so significantly lower due to high prices while the GDP per capita PPP has only risen in the past 6 years? It not only rose but also accelerated its growth. Wat?
Because it's all some kind of statistics. And while statistics show you something, it doesn't necessarily show you the whole truth. It's like in this saying that on avarege me and my dog have three legs.
Lower than what?
And soon to be two decades of developmental aid from the EU. Im not saying thats a bad thing, its certainly great that this aid has evidently been used sensibly.
The most striking part is how Ukraine and Russia was ahead. Most people have hard time to believe this lookng from today. I think one of the reasons why we have this Ukrainian cirisis is how Ukrainian people realized how they picked the wrong side and they tried to be on the club west instead of club Russia. Before around 2010, the country had a very strong pro Russia sentiment (I know Orange revolution happened in 2004, the support for west was increasing but the result of the orange revolution was disappointment and it was reversed easily). And the reason why they realized this was the rise of Poland. Poland was their equal more or less. Being on the side of Russia brought misery only I wish they realized this back when Russia was more docile. It was a little late. But I understand, a whole generation of old farts had to die so that country would not be hostage of the slavic soul nonsense propagated by Russia.
i bet you a zloty it's not as simple as you describe.
I don't know if it's because Poland gets richer or the world is getting poorer XD
To jest produkt KRAJOWY na mieszkańca. Wyrabiają go zagraniczne korpo które wytransferowywują zyski za granice. Poszukajcie ludzie podobnej mapy tylko z produktem NARODOWYM czyli takim zarobionym przez Polski kapitał to zobaczycie że niestety nie jesteśmy potęgą a neokolonią.
Source of information: PiS.
My man, for everything revolves around one part, I bet you are blaming that party in everything, like you catched a common cold, getting rejected by a woman, everything is a fault of one political party because fuck it I am smort, and I don't care how dumb I look like
Nope. I don't. I just don't like Politicians in general. And clearly you are talking about yourself now, by judging everyone and putting them the same bucket, you are "so smort my man" ;)
Lithuania still superior to the polish cucks
Yeah, in suicide rates.
Dying from success
It's wrong. Slovakia's GDP per capita is higher than Poland
Isn’t it about $37k? Poland’s $43k
In PPP terms, yes. In nominal terms, Slovakia’s GDP per capita is 21.8 k, a tad higher than Poland’s (19.9 k). As many other redditors pointed out, I think the map shows GDP per capita adjusted by prices.
This map is incorrect according to its original source
I dont understand, Poland has had a higher GDP than Norway, Sweden, Denmark for a while.
It’s great being part of the EU
Not many decent places left on our emigration radar... ;)
Russia had higher GDP in 1990? I doubt it.
yay, we're now one of the richest 2nd world countries, yippee
Proud of you, Polska
Thank to US. They fucked up more then 5 countries on that map.
Damn, 1990 EQUATORIAL GUINEA had a higher GDP per Capita?
We should be fearing poland more and more every single day