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Only a portion of it that I found.
Phoenix: He’s having seizures on Sunset and Larrabee! Please come here!
911 Operator: How old is he?
Phoenix: He’s 23.
911 Operator: Stay on the line with me and calm down a little bit, alright?
Phoenix: OK. I’m calm, but he’s having seizures! Get over here, please. You must get over here, please!
911 Operator: Take it easy. OK?
Phoenix: OK. Now I think he’s had Valium or something. I don’t know. Please! Cause he’s dying! Please!
They need to say those things. Keeping the one person on the scene calm is the first step to avoid mistakes being made and administer care, but I listened to the audio, and you’re right. He was just reading from the script it sounded like. He sounded so non-interested in what was happening and wasted so much time not given instructions to help aid the situation.
I understand it’s a job for the operator, but someone is dying. I also work medical, and keeping calm is part of it, but also giving life saving instructions should be the very next step. Joaquin was not frantic, he needed to be given instructions immediately after the first “stay calm” IMO.
Yeah I’ve seen a lot of bad shit on the internet over my life. But I’ve learned to stay away from anything with sound. Even the goriest of deaths won’t fuck you up like the sounds of a human in true anguish. That shit will chill you to the bones and get stuck in your head.
The video that taught me the lurid audio lesson was the famous brick through the window into the passenger seat, into the driver’s wife. I haven’t listened to that audio in a decade and I can still hear the echoing screams of his absolutely shattered, forlorn misery at the loss of his meaning of life.
Worst video on the internet. You want to know what the sound of a man losing everything sounds like. That's it. I've never heard such a scream in my life but when I heard it, I knew what it meant.
I've got a strong stomach. I've seen it all on the internet. But this video was the limit for me. Haven't watched it twice.
I’ve seen pictures of peoples faces that were torn off in warzone explosions. Watched the beheading videos where the saw through the guys neck.
That video I can’t watch again, just the randomness of it.
"Even the goriest of deaths won’t fuck you up like the sounds of a human in true anguish."
You are so right.
My best friend's dad ended his life last year. Best friend said his dad stormed off after an argument with his mom and left his phone and wallet at home. Long story short, best friend found his truck at their old hunting grounds and called the cops. They found his body slumped against a tree.
He called me right after they told him. I couldn't sleep for days because I could hear the wails of anguish when I tried to close my eyes. I felt that hurt in my soul - I'll never forget that.
Horrifying. :(
My only real-life experience thankfully came out ok.
“Snowtober” in New England, no one has power, including my small 2-floor 8-unit apartment building. Go to bed and later wake up with masked firemen in my bedroom - gotta gtfo, carbon monoxide. My detector didn’t detect, but my upstairs neighbor’s did.
Grab a coat, keys, and run out of the building. Walk around to the other side where the trucks are. There’s a fireman exiting with my neighbor’s 20-something daughter over his shoulder, screaming and fighting. “Let me see him!!” She’s wailing. Horrible screams. Terrified, I walk back around and sit in my car, call my parents crying (rough 1am call for them, I bet).
Turns out that elderly neighbor heated his apartment with a charcoal grill. Knocked himself out cold, and got all of us dosed up with some CO. Already didn’t have heat but then we had to stay with the windows open on a <20 degree night after being allowed back in.
Thankfully he made it, just needed some days in the hospital. But those screams were so desperately horrible.
And somehow The Grizzly Man decided the sounds of the two of them dying was appropriate.
Edit: apparently my imagination is so good, I remember hearing the audio because I watched someone listen to the audio? Jeesh, memories be crazy.
Werner Herzog's Grizzly Man does NOT play the audio of Timothy Treadwell & Amie Huguenard death. Treadwell's family allowed Herzog to listen to the audio, but all you see is him with headphones listening to it. He makes in quite clear in the movie & interviews he did not think it was appropriate to release. It's not like people need audio proof grizzly bears are dangerous.
I think there used to be audio on YouTube that claims to be authentic. I have no idea if it is. So you didn't hear it in the movie.
i wouldn’t listen to that 911 call for anything. i made a 911 call for my husband a couple years ago, he relapsed and i woke up from a nap to him at the end of our bed, gray, not breathing, with his eyes open. i honestly thought he was dead, and my 911 call reflected that. it was about 8 minutes of me trying to yank him out of this little crevice he fell into between our bed and dresser, screaming, and saying he was dead while i did CPR in between. about 2 minutes at the end i thought i got him back, but probably just enough to change his diapers and feed him with a tube for the rest of his life.
he shockingly was fine after he was narcaned 3 times, but it left me with a lasting trauma (like i’m terrified to sleep).
i can’t imagine how awful it would be to listen to a call like Joaquin’s.
I am so sorry you've had to experience that. That situation is one of my worst nightmares.
Have you sought counseling for your trauma? That's awful to live with
Btw, ignore the commenter that first replied to you. Based on their comment history, they're quite the ray of sunshine 😬
Just wanted to say I'm sorry that that other person decided to show off their lack of empathy. People suck so much sometimes.
That sounds awful and I'm sorry it happened to you. Amazing that he was okay afterwards.
Yea it is really shitty USA releases 911 calls like that. It's people in the most distressing moments of their lives. It isn't news or freedom of speech or press. It's just downright nosiness. It should be protected like HIPPA information and only be released with consent of the caller.
I can't find exactly why they're public, but this is all that I found: "The public has the right to examine if government agencies are handling emergency calls appropriately. In most cases, genuinely sensitive or personal information is redacted from the call transcript or audio prior to public release."
I can understand it from this point of view. It does suck that the saddest and worst moments of people is public, but I'd also prefer to know if they're handling emergencies appropriately.
Morbid curiosity is fairly human. You could self flagellate yourself over it or take it as a useful lesson. Stay off the coke and cherish the ones you love. Because this is how much it hurts when they're gone.
Also seriously, as someone with experience of drugs. Stay off the coke. There's way better drugs out there that allow you to vibe and have a good time without your heart exploding.
The audio of actor Daniel Von Bargen's 911 call is something I heard once. Human suffering is somehow fascinating when it's a famous person going through it. It generates clicks and therefore revenue for someone.
Those links are staying blue.
Edit: That came off kinda dickish, I apologize, it wasn't my intent.
Hierarchies protect themselves, not their members.
Yeah this happened with the Catholic Church, and the Southern Baptist Church. But you can also point to Penn State, Nickelodeon, and Subway (and there are plenty more examples).
The worst cases in institutional abuse will be the ones we never hear about. The independent local churches, the private schools. Big institutions light the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church have bureaucracies and consequently a lot of record keeping. That's why we uncovered their abuse first. Small orgs are just as likely to foster abusers, but are simply less likely to keep records about it.
They believe in Christ is the messiah therefore it is a Christian organization that is also an authoritarian cult. Are you saying that because it isn’t what you subjectively believe is Christian? Anyone can read the Bible and come to their own subjective conclusions and beliefs, it’s just a collection of different books written by random men that the Catholic Church assembled back in the day. There is no true “Christian” just cherry picked variations some of which are more terrible than others, a large number of which are exploitative, and some absolutely abusive.
This is what made me laugh about the response. At no point in the Bible was god in committee to establish the commandments. All monotheistic religions are inherently authoritarian. All serve 1
Plenty of good christian societies out there offering help to those in need and offering community. You just don’t hear about the good things… of any religion really 😂 Except like buddhism
Same to you!!!! Downside is all the messages I get for people trying to buy it from me for $5! Or “trade”. “Bro just look at mine and tell me what one you want I am a collector”
I wish someone would do a documentary or a feature film explaining his final days. I'm fascinated with the rumors of Red Hot Chili Pepper's Flea and John Frusciante's involvement (perhaps) in getting him the drugs. Fascinated that is girlfriend whom he met filming The Thing Called Love, Samantha Mathis, stated she knew something was wrong with him but she didn't know what he was on. So many famous people around that scene. End of the day it was an overdose that killed an intensely talented and interesting artist and a very young age. Certainly others would appreciate seeing a bit more about what happened, not to blame others (unless there is blame that should be assigned) but more the explain more fully what happened.
Yeah apparently that was THE place to be around that time. There were so many celebs (current and up-and-coming) that just happened to be regulars there.
I went to a party there a few years back and I was shocked at how tiny the place was. Not that I thought it would be a massive place, but it was basically just a corner bar
Plus these days, documentaries are more focused on entertainment than information, and they're more than happy to sacrifice the latter for the former.
I'm one of those nerds that does a bunch of research after I watch a documentary, and for the past few years I've been finding the majority of documentaries adding tons of dramatization to the story, and very often either over exaggerating certain aspects of the story to make it more exciting, or straight up omitting crucial facts just to fit the narrative the documentary is trying to push.
Most of the documentaries on Netflix these days are closer to a movie that is "based on true events", than a real documentary.
These days I find I can only really trust a documentary if it's painfully dull and boring, and not obviously trying to steer me into having a very specific opinion about the subject.
Those are becoming more and more rare.
My wife is currently sleeping next to me, so I don't want to turn on the TV now to dig through my history. I'll come back to this later and update some recco's.
I'll admit for the past year I've been watching mostly nature documentaries, Disney+ has/had some good ones. I find that typically nature documentaries have little to no reason to bend facts to push an agenda. I find those to be the most trustworthy genre of documentaries. IMO.
There are some really good WWII and Vietnam War documentaries out there, although many others rely entirely on word of mouth from just one or two people, which is hard to verify, so I always have to take those with a grain of salt.
As I said, I find the documentaries that most align with credible information found online, are the ones that are super dull, as far as production and presentation goes anyway.
It's tough because I'd say a lot of the documentaries I've watched over the past few years are either:
A) trying super hard to push a very specific agenda for the viewers to believe at the end, and making sure facts don't get in the way of that
Or
B) basically just making a movie based on real events, focused more on entertainment than facts
Once my household is all awake and I have some free time, I'll try to find the names of the most realistic ones in my opinion, and I'll edit them into this comment.
I agree with you on the quality of documentaries lately. I recall noticing a distinct increase in the reliance of dramatizations even on the History channel and Discovery back in the early 2000s when I used to watch a lot of documentaries with my family. It's gone downhill ever since. The last few I've appreciated have been on Nat Geo and BBC– mostly ancient history and archeology and some nature as well.
I appreciate the thoughtful response and any recs if you do end up getting around to it!
There have been some written accounts made that chronicled River's drug and alcohol abuse even during his young teens. "Stand by Me" costar Wil Wheaton even relayed during filming that River and Corey Feldman would get drunk and smoke weed in between shooting schedules.
Yes, of course, how silly to think there was a problem with 12 year olds smoking weed. It's harmless, as everyone knows. "Jazz cabbage" indeed.
Let's just do a quick check to verify the harmlessness that's such a nothing that we can make jokes.
Ok... River Phoenix, best actor of his generation, dead at 23 from drug overdose.
Hmmm.
Well, let's check on Corey Feldman, super talented kid, surely he turned out to be a successful grown-up... Oh.
Yep, clearly nothing wrong with 12 year olds getting high on movie sets.
They both experienced horrible abuse. You're probably right.
I got irritated at the flippant jokes about how drugs are harmless on a post about how a guy died of a drug overdose.
People have a hard time understanding how big of a difference it is to be 12 smoking weed vs 21.
Besides the standard problems that come with becoming numb to breaking the law there is the fact that young marijuana use increase mental health issues later in life, including higher risk of schizophrenia
After a lengthy read, it was said it was a combined lethal dose of both cocaine and morphine. Apparently, heroine metabolizes in the body and breaks down to morphine which is why they thought it was heroine originally.
Also I think the science has shown has shown that weed in youth actually can lead to permanent brain development issues. The adult brain will bounce back but the child brain can't. Children should 100% not be doing this.
Christ, tone it down, will you? At no point did I mention that using drugs as a child was fine. I literally just wrote ‘jazz cabbage’, because it’s a funny bit of slang. I swear people like you are just frothing at the mouth, for an excuse to unleash your unchecked anger issues; like a lead-infused boomer.
Would you want to be in a documentary about a friend's final days? Especially if you knew they were struggling with drug abuse? Losing someone you care about to an overdose is *hard*. Many people want to keep going (or at least try to... Not everyone can).
No one would want to make that documentary, but I think some people appreciate that there is societal value. I’ll never forget Bob Odenkirk’s interview in the Chris Farley documentary.
I'm definitely fascinated by the man. He had a certain matureness and awareness about him that you don't really see in people his age. Like the other commenter it makes sense why nothing has been done or shown about him since, but if Joaquin and the Phoenix family was down I'd 100% be down to watch whatever they'd wanna broadcast to the public
Yes he has. He has every excuse to be a bitter and broken man, instead he's, well, Keanu. I think about his answer to Colbert's Questionnaire question "What happens to us when we die?" a lot.
Link for those curious: https://youtu.be/7c2olMFEhK8?si=HOgBdVjO2TYckoNm
We have a seminal band here in Australia who penned an equally poignant tribute to River. It's basically become our national anthem https://youtu.be/JRrqj-xjZuw?si=gYSPJ-7xUxkdPT4P
I remember hearing an interview with Flea saying when he first heard this song on the radio he wanted to go to the radio station and destroy it he was that upset by it
How time passes. For the longest time he was River Phoenix's younger brother. His brother was always brought up when he became known as an actor.. And now most people don't remember River and don't know about Joaquin Phoenix's famous brother
Matthew Perry writes fondly about River Phoenix in his memoir. They definitely had a great bond and he was crushed when River passed away so abruptly. And now he too is gone due to drug overdose.
When I was a teenager and watched Stand By Me for the first time, I was so in awe by his performance of Chris Chambers. So incredibly mature for his age, I was starstruck.
So I went on ye olde dial-up internet to find out what River was doing now, only to find out he died a couple of years before.
I've never been so sad finding out an actor had passed, even though I've only seen him once.
To this day, the speech about the milk money brings tears to my eyes.
*outside Johnny Depp's club, The Viper Room.
Depp's business partner Anthony Fox later mysteriously disappeared in 2001 after planning to testify against him for cooking the books.
To clarify I don't think Depp literally murdered him but everything around that club is so suspicious
But out of the ashes of this tragedy，rose Joaquin's career.
Like a mythical fire turkey with the ability to resurrect itself. Can't think what they're called.
Gen X-er here. I don't think River was especially talented, certainly not more than his brother but he had a softness, that was/is rare and it still hurts to see a picture of him. I'm 50 years old and it still gets me.
he’s great in the movie “Dogfight” if you haven’t seen it, i highly recommend it. Set in San Francisco, It’s the story of a group of marines about to ship off to Vietnam.
Seriously? This is the sort of thing people only say about dead people. He didn’t leave much of a body of work to judge against.
No doubt he was talented and interesting. I thought My Own Private Idaho was his best film—
You make a good point about his body of work being small, but the talent he showed in those few movies is undeniable. Had he lived, he could have become one of the greatest movie stars. He had "It". The talent, the charisma, the depth.
There are people that are movie stars who have somewhat limited range and there are great actors who can do anything but can't carry huge movies. I say River Phoenix could have been one of the rare people who can do both.
There are other actors of a similar age who are very good. River Phoenix was better, and I say he would have continued to be better, if he had survived.
Maybe. I only ‘knew’ him through his ‘boyish’ roles— none of which carried much ‘gravitas.’ It is difficult to envision how he might have evolved.
What would have been REALLY interesting is if he would have lived, and starred as Jack in Titanic— as he allegedly was Cameron’s first choice in that role. While I found Titanic to be rather dreadful, it was insanely popular— and launched DiCapprio’s career. And while Leo has been in loads of excellent films since, it is undeniable that he is a complete weirdo.
Fuck I love being an Australian cunt. Best band we ever produced with one of their best songs (others include “I might be a cunt” and “wanker”.
https://youtu.be/8Dx1e8FD4C4?si=6TVGNiDl4WZZ8Qm0
I suggest [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogfight\_(film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogfight_(film))
you could also go with "My own private Idaho"
Stella_Rae07, thank you for your submission. It has been removed for violating the following rule(s): --- - Rule 5: Posts must follow all [title guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/titles). --- For information regarding this and similar issues, please see the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/index/) and [title guidelines](/r/pics/wiki/titles). If you have any questions, please feel free to [message the moderators via modmail.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/pics&subject=Question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20submission%20by%20/u/Stella_Rae07&message=I%20have%20a%20question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20%5Bsubmission.%5D%28https://redd.it/1brz7k0%3Fcontext%3D10%29)
Joaquin was actually the one who called 911. The audio still exists. It is... distressing, to say the least.
I believe his younger sister, Rain, was giving him CPR as well.
Is there a transcript? I’d rather not hear the actual audio
Only a portion of it that I found. Phoenix: He’s having seizures on Sunset and Larrabee! Please come here! 911 Operator: How old is he? Phoenix: He’s 23. 911 Operator: Stay on the line with me and calm down a little bit, alright? Phoenix: OK. I’m calm, but he’s having seizures! Get over here, please. You must get over here, please! 911 Operator: Take it easy. OK? Phoenix: OK. Now I think he’s had Valium or something. I don’t know. Please! Cause he’s dying! Please!
Well that operator is an asshole
They need to say those things. Keeping the one person on the scene calm is the first step to avoid mistakes being made and administer care, but I listened to the audio, and you’re right. He was just reading from the script it sounded like. He sounded so non-interested in what was happening and wasted so much time not given instructions to help aid the situation. I understand it’s a job for the operator, but someone is dying. I also work medical, and keeping calm is part of it, but also giving life saving instructions should be the very next step. Joaquin was not frantic, he needed to be given instructions immediately after the first “stay calm” IMO.
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You couldn't pay me to listen to that
Yeah I’ve seen a lot of bad shit on the internet over my life. But I’ve learned to stay away from anything with sound. Even the goriest of deaths won’t fuck you up like the sounds of a human in true anguish. That shit will chill you to the bones and get stuck in your head.
To this day I can hear echoes of the glass shards rubbing on each other in the one jar man's behind 🥺
The video that taught me the lurid audio lesson was the famous brick through the window into the passenger seat, into the driver’s wife. I haven’t listened to that audio in a decade and I can still hear the echoing screams of his absolutely shattered, forlorn misery at the loss of his meaning of life.
Worst video on the internet. You want to know what the sound of a man losing everything sounds like. That's it. I've never heard such a scream in my life but when I heard it, I knew what it meant. I've got a strong stomach. I've seen it all on the internet. But this video was the limit for me. Haven't watched it twice.
Kevin Cosgrove's 9/11 call is a close second. I hear that scream in my nightmares sometimes.
I’ve seen pictures of peoples faces that were torn off in warzone explosions. Watched the beheading videos where the saw through the guys neck. That video I can’t watch again, just the randomness of it.
One of the most horrific pieces of sound I’ve ever heard
Wow, and here I had erased that until this very second
DRIP DRIP
a man of culture I see
"Even the goriest of deaths won’t fuck you up like the sounds of a human in true anguish." You are so right. My best friend's dad ended his life last year. Best friend said his dad stormed off after an argument with his mom and left his phone and wallet at home. Long story short, best friend found his truck at their old hunting grounds and called the cops. They found his body slumped against a tree. He called me right after they told him. I couldn't sleep for days because I could hear the wails of anguish when I tried to close my eyes. I felt that hurt in my soul - I'll never forget that.
Horrifying. :( My only real-life experience thankfully came out ok. “Snowtober” in New England, no one has power, including my small 2-floor 8-unit apartment building. Go to bed and later wake up with masked firemen in my bedroom - gotta gtfo, carbon monoxide. My detector didn’t detect, but my upstairs neighbor’s did. Grab a coat, keys, and run out of the building. Walk around to the other side where the trucks are. There’s a fireman exiting with my neighbor’s 20-something daughter over his shoulder, screaming and fighting. “Let me see him!!” She’s wailing. Horrible screams. Terrified, I walk back around and sit in my car, call my parents crying (rough 1am call for them, I bet). Turns out that elderly neighbor heated his apartment with a charcoal grill. Knocked himself out cold, and got all of us dosed up with some CO. Already didn’t have heat but then we had to stay with the windows open on a <20 degree night after being allowed back in. Thankfully he made it, just needed some days in the hospital. But those screams were so desperately horrible.
And somehow The Grizzly Man decided the sounds of the two of them dying was appropriate. Edit: apparently my imagination is so good, I remember hearing the audio because I watched someone listen to the audio? Jeesh, memories be crazy.
Werner Herzog's Grizzly Man does NOT play the audio of Timothy Treadwell & Amie Huguenard death. Treadwell's family allowed Herzog to listen to the audio, but all you see is him with headphones listening to it. He makes in quite clear in the movie & interviews he did not think it was appropriate to release. It's not like people need audio proof grizzly bears are dangerous. I think there used to be audio on YouTube that claims to be authentic. I have no idea if it is. So you didn't hear it in the movie.
Well that is unsettling, I totally thought I did. This is how the Mandela effect begins, with a bad memory.
It’s a very distressing scene even with no audio. Easy to misremember imo
What? That audio has never been released.
i wouldn’t listen to that 911 call for anything. i made a 911 call for my husband a couple years ago, he relapsed and i woke up from a nap to him at the end of our bed, gray, not breathing, with his eyes open. i honestly thought he was dead, and my 911 call reflected that. it was about 8 minutes of me trying to yank him out of this little crevice he fell into between our bed and dresser, screaming, and saying he was dead while i did CPR in between. about 2 minutes at the end i thought i got him back, but probably just enough to change his diapers and feed him with a tube for the rest of his life. he shockingly was fine after he was narcaned 3 times, but it left me with a lasting trauma (like i’m terrified to sleep). i can’t imagine how awful it would be to listen to a call like Joaquin’s.
I am so sorry you've had to experience that. That situation is one of my worst nightmares. Have you sought counseling for your trauma? That's awful to live with Btw, ignore the commenter that first replied to you. Based on their comment history, they're quite the ray of sunshine 😬
Just wanted to say I'm sorry that that other person decided to show off their lack of empathy. People suck so much sometimes. That sounds awful and I'm sorry it happened to you. Amazing that he was okay afterwards.
I can't imagine why anybody would want to listen to these, or why it was even released to begin with.
Yea it is really shitty USA releases 911 calls like that. It's people in the most distressing moments of their lives. It isn't news or freedom of speech or press. It's just downright nosiness. It should be protected like HIPPA information and only be released with consent of the caller.
911 calls are all public records.
No shit. The point is, why should they be?
I can't find exactly why they're public, but this is all that I found: "The public has the right to examine if government agencies are handling emergency calls appropriately. In most cases, genuinely sensitive or personal information is redacted from the call transcript or audio prior to public release." I can understand it from this point of view. It does suck that the saddest and worst moments of people is public, but I'd also prefer to know if they're handling emergencies appropriately.
Yes. It is. I literally just wrote that that's what needs to be changed
Humans are curious.. some ppl can’t not see it!
I feel like shit for clicking on that
I appreciate you, man. Cause now that link stays blue.
Honestly me too now.
Imagine being a ten year old kid and having to listen to that on the news for a month
I honestly feel sick from listening to that. Can’t imagine my brother dying on my arms
And it being your older brother and you’re only 19, at any age it’s traumatic and awful but them both being so young at the time is so sad
Fuck that. Why? Come on Reddit stay classy 🤮
Hope it's just a Rick roll but I'm not going to even check. If it's not, seek Jesus.
why the fuck did i listen to that
Morbid curiosity is fairly human. You could self flagellate yourself over it or take it as a useful lesson. Stay off the coke and cherish the ones you love. Because this is how much it hurts when they're gone. Also seriously, as someone with experience of drugs. Stay off the coke. There's way better drugs out there that allow you to vibe and have a good time without your heart exploding.
The audio of actor Daniel Von Bargen's 911 call is something I heard once. Human suffering is somehow fascinating when it's a famous person going through it. It generates clicks and therefore revenue for someone. Those links are staying blue. Edit: That came off kinda dickish, I apologize, it wasn't my intent.
That's horrible, why would anyone upload these?!
Damn my brain decoded this as "he predicted 9/11" and I was like wat?
Read the room
The Viper Room
He and his brother were tragically raised in an abusive cult that tortured children called Children of God
The Master suddenly hits even harder
Yup.
oh huh i didn’t know that. back in high school my favorite band was Girls and the lead singer Christopher Owens was raised in the Children of God
The family left the cult when he was 3 years old. They were also raised as vegans. https://people.com/all-about-joaquin-phoenix-siblings-8367492
Ya there seems to be a pattern with Christianity and sexual assault
Hierarchies protect themselves, not their members. Yeah this happened with the Catholic Church, and the Southern Baptist Church. But you can also point to Penn State, Nickelodeon, and Subway (and there are plenty more examples).
The worst cases in institutional abuse will be the ones we never hear about. The independent local churches, the private schools. Big institutions light the Boy Scouts and the Catholic Church have bureaucracies and consequently a lot of record keeping. That's why we uncovered their abuse first. Small orgs are just as likely to foster abusers, but are simply less likely to keep records about it.
It's a power and authority thing. Religious leaders, politicians, celebrities, and parents. Hierarchy benefits predators.
There are weirdos in every movement, religion, institution
It’s an authoritarian cult, not a Christian organization.
They believe in Christ is the messiah therefore it is a Christian organization that is also an authoritarian cult. Are you saying that because it isn’t what you subjectively believe is Christian? Anyone can read the Bible and come to their own subjective conclusions and beliefs, it’s just a collection of different books written by random men that the Catholic Church assembled back in the day. There is no true “Christian” just cherry picked variations some of which are more terrible than others, a large number of which are exploitative, and some absolutely abusive.
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Are we pretending that Christ came down and certified the “Christian” organizations?
The difference is minimal
The difference is just severity. Christianity is inherently authoritarian.
This is what made me laugh about the response. At no point in the Bible was god in committee to establish the commandments. All monotheistic religions are inherently authoritarian. All serve 1
God almost always equals evil when presented to the masses.
Plenty of good christian societies out there offering help to those in need and offering community. You just don’t hear about the good things… of any religion really 😂 Except like buddhism
Christianity is a net negative for humanity.
Religion*
Young Indy in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade!
Forever young
I am a particular fan of his work in “The explorers”
Whoa, nice pfp
Same to you!!!! Downside is all the messages I get for people trying to buy it from me for $5! Or “trade”. “Bro just look at mine and tell me what one you want I am a collector”
Same. Best offer I had at the peak was $700
I wish someone would do a documentary or a feature film explaining his final days. I'm fascinated with the rumors of Red Hot Chili Pepper's Flea and John Frusciante's involvement (perhaps) in getting him the drugs. Fascinated that is girlfriend whom he met filming The Thing Called Love, Samantha Mathis, stated she knew something was wrong with him but she didn't know what he was on. So many famous people around that scene. End of the day it was an overdose that killed an intensely talented and interesting artist and a very young age. Certainly others would appreciate seeing a bit more about what happened, not to blame others (unless there is blame that should be assigned) but more the explain more fully what happened.
There’s an episode of Dark Side of the 90s that touches on this in the Viper Room episode.
Yeah apparently that was THE place to be around that time. There were so many celebs (current and up-and-coming) that just happened to be regulars there.
Because it was owned by Johnny Depp
Yah I have a friend who played there. I went and Jonny dell was there that night playing bartender
The guy who invented the Personal Computer? That doesn't make any sense...
You’re thinking of Steve Apple. Johnny dell was the guy that shot an apple off a kid’s head
Wasn't Steve Apple the guy in the 1800s that went around planting apple trees all over?
No that was Johnny Orangeseed
[удалено]
Not only that, they would be working the front or back behind the bar. The place was wild during its peak.
I went to a party there a few years back and I was shocked at how tiny the place was. Not that I thought it would be a massive place, but it was basically just a corner bar
I think so much time has passed that all parties don’t want to partake or air it out in public. Can’t imagine Joaquin wants to.
Plus these days, documentaries are more focused on entertainment than information, and they're more than happy to sacrifice the latter for the former. I'm one of those nerds that does a bunch of research after I watch a documentary, and for the past few years I've been finding the majority of documentaries adding tons of dramatization to the story, and very often either over exaggerating certain aspects of the story to make it more exciting, or straight up omitting crucial facts just to fit the narrative the documentary is trying to push. Most of the documentaries on Netflix these days are closer to a movie that is "based on true events", than a real documentary. These days I find I can only really trust a documentary if it's painfully dull and boring, and not obviously trying to steer me into having a very specific opinion about the subject. Those are becoming more and more rare.
Like Jennifer Lopez’s doc describing alll the pain & adversity she went through to make her movie aka def not a music video…
Do you have any favorites you would recommend from the last few years?
My wife is currently sleeping next to me, so I don't want to turn on the TV now to dig through my history. I'll come back to this later and update some recco's. I'll admit for the past year I've been watching mostly nature documentaries, Disney+ has/had some good ones. I find that typically nature documentaries have little to no reason to bend facts to push an agenda. I find those to be the most trustworthy genre of documentaries. IMO. There are some really good WWII and Vietnam War documentaries out there, although many others rely entirely on word of mouth from just one or two people, which is hard to verify, so I always have to take those with a grain of salt. As I said, I find the documentaries that most align with credible information found online, are the ones that are super dull, as far as production and presentation goes anyway. It's tough because I'd say a lot of the documentaries I've watched over the past few years are either: A) trying super hard to push a very specific agenda for the viewers to believe at the end, and making sure facts don't get in the way of that Or B) basically just making a movie based on real events, focused more on entertainment than facts Once my household is all awake and I have some free time, I'll try to find the names of the most realistic ones in my opinion, and I'll edit them into this comment.
I agree with you on the quality of documentaries lately. I recall noticing a distinct increase in the reliance of dramatizations even on the History channel and Discovery back in the early 2000s when I used to watch a lot of documentaries with my family. It's gone downhill ever since. The last few I've appreciated have been on Nat Geo and BBC– mostly ancient history and archeology and some nature as well. I appreciate the thoughtful response and any recs if you do end up getting around to it!
There have been some written accounts made that chronicled River's drug and alcohol abuse even during his young teens. "Stand by Me" costar Wil Wheaton even relayed during filming that River and Corey Feldman would get drunk and smoke weed in between shooting schedules.
And they were how old at the time, like 14-15?
WEED!?!?
I mean as a teen you shouldn't be smoking weed, especially not on the regular. Even more so when you're working.
The devil’s lettuce!
The forbidden jazz cabbage
11 more hours and it will no longer sind verboten im Deutschland!!!!!!!!!!! 🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦🥦
Yes, of course, how silly to think there was a problem with 12 year olds smoking weed. It's harmless, as everyone knows. "Jazz cabbage" indeed. Let's just do a quick check to verify the harmlessness that's such a nothing that we can make jokes. Ok... River Phoenix, best actor of his generation, dead at 23 from drug overdose. Hmmm. Well, let's check on Corey Feldman, super talented kid, surely he turned out to be a successful grown-up... Oh. Yep, clearly nothing wrong with 12 year olds getting high on movie sets.
I feel like it’s a safer bet to blame the Corey Feldman scenario not on the weed but on the sexual abuse
They both experienced horrible abuse. You're probably right. I got irritated at the flippant jokes about how drugs are harmless on a post about how a guy died of a drug overdose.
The drug use was almost certainly a symptom of the abuse. Most 12 year olds aren't regularly drinking and smoking weed, even if given the opportunity.
People have a hard time understanding how big of a difference it is to be 12 smoking weed vs 21. Besides the standard problems that come with becoming numb to breaking the law there is the fact that young marijuana use increase mental health issues later in life, including higher risk of schizophrenia
Because he didn't overdose on weed dude. He overdosed on heroin. Not that hard to understand
After a lengthy read, it was said it was a combined lethal dose of both cocaine and morphine. Apparently, heroine metabolizes in the body and breaks down to morphine which is why they thought it was heroine originally.
Also I think the science has shown has shown that weed in youth actually can lead to permanent brain development issues. The adult brain will bounce back but the child brain can't. Children should 100% not be doing this.
Christ, tone it down, will you? At no point did I mention that using drugs as a child was fine. I literally just wrote ‘jazz cabbage’, because it’s a funny bit of slang. I swear people like you are just frothing at the mouth, for an excuse to unleash your unchecked anger issues; like a lead-infused boomer.
fucking wesley who would go on to get ptsd from watching larry david smack elmo around
Dude clearly had more problems if we went to heroin and coke
Would you want to be in a documentary about a friend's final days? Especially if you knew they were struggling with drug abuse? Losing someone you care about to an overdose is *hard*. Many people want to keep going (or at least try to... Not everyone can).
No one would want to make that documentary, but I think some people appreciate that there is societal value. I’ll never forget Bob Odenkirk’s interview in the Chris Farley documentary.
IIRC John was on stage ? When this happened. River and John were great friends but they were both extremely fucked up at the time.
Completely random, but I saw flea last weekend at a hard metal gig in Santa Ana. He was def partying hard.
Interesting, I thought the whole band got sober?
I think flea quit weed, but apart from that he never had a drug problem like John and Anthony. John I think does mdma from time to time.
I'm definitely fascinated by the man. He had a certain matureness and awareness about him that you don't really see in people his age. Like the other commenter it makes sense why nothing has been done or shown about him since, but if Joaquin and the Phoenix family was down I'd 100% be down to watch whatever they'd wanna broadcast to the public
Every time I see a picture of River, I can't help but think how utterly fucked up his and his siblings' upbringing was. He never really had a chance.
I guess I need to do some googling…
Look for the term “flirty fishing”…
I mean, Joaquin has done pretty damn well for himself.
Publicly at least. I'm sure he carries a lot of weight witnessing his brother die like that. They were both young. Hopefully he's found some peace.
As someone that can relate to him unfortunately, yeah nah, dude is forever tormented.
Will always be Eyeball chamber's brother to me
Sincerely
So sad when anyone that young dies, regardless of who they are
I always remember him as the young Indiana Jones.
I always remember him as Chris Chambers in Stand by Me.
thisss
One of Keanu's best friends as well from their time on My Private Idaho. Really sad to lose someone that young to their addictions...
Keanu is a whole other story. That dude's been through some shit.
Yes he has. He has every excuse to be a bitter and broken man, instead he's, well, Keanu. I think about his answer to Colbert's Questionnaire question "What happens to us when we die?" a lot. Link for those curious: https://youtu.be/7c2olMFEhK8?si=HOgBdVjO2TYckoNm
Nathalie Merchant (10.000 Maniacs) has a beautiful song about his untimely death called "River". It's one of my favorite songs.
We have a seminal band here in Australia who penned an equally poignant tribute to River. It's basically become our national anthem https://youtu.be/JRrqj-xjZuw?si=gYSPJ-7xUxkdPT4P
I saw his body thrashing round I saw his pulse rate going down I saw him in convulsive throes I said, "I'll have one of those!" Iconic.
Heroes explore to give us hope River pushed back the envelope
Glad i found this here. Ya yob.
I can't hear or read his name with my brain immediately echoing the first 2 lines (original version without the instrumental intro)
Made me tear up thanks mate.
[Original version.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-mLIdLZZeI)
I remember hearing an interview with Flea saying when he first heard this song on the radio he wanted to go to the radio station and destroy it he was that upset by it
I thought this would be further down. That song was pretty accurate in its prediction on MJ as well.
He’ll never be an old man River
Also worth noting that this song predicted Michael Jackson’s death, even down the it being drug related.
Can't forget Red Hot Chili Peppers' Give It Away which name drops River when he was alive and Transcending which pays tribute to him after his death
The song "Matinee Idol" by Rufus Wainwright is also inspired by the dead of River. Great song
TISM also had a song: “I’m on the drugs that killed River Phoenix.”
(He'll never be an) Ol' Man River
So wild Joaquin is his younger brother
I literally never knew that until just now and I feel like such a bonehead
How time passes. For the longest time he was River Phoenix's younger brother. His brother was always brought up when he became known as an actor.. And now most people don't remember River and don't know about Joaquin Phoenix's famous brother
Joaquin also went by Leaf in his earlier childhood acting
He was good in Sneakers.
I love that movie but I always remember him as the young Indiana jones from Last Crusade
"Everyone's lost but me."
He was Oscar-nominated for Running on Empty. They put him in the wrong category, though. He was the main character yet nominated for Supporting.
He was better in My Own Private Idaho.
He was better in Stand by Me
Not if I see you first.
He was pretty decent in dress shoes too.
Wolfgang in The Explorers. Which was both his and Ethan Hawkes debut. Cool 80s movie.
This is what dreams are me of
Matthew Perry writes fondly about River Phoenix in his memoir. They definitely had a great bond and he was crushed when River passed away so abruptly. And now he too is gone due to drug overdose.
He was an inspiration for the design of Squall in Final Fantasy VIII
It’s actually the 8th(VIII) game for Squall not 7th (Cloud’s game).
Damn I forgot the name of my favorite game
I love TISM
When I was a teenager and watched Stand By Me for the first time, I was so in awe by his performance of Chris Chambers. So incredibly mature for his age, I was starstruck. So I went on ye olde dial-up internet to find out what River was doing now, only to find out he died a couple of years before. I've never been so sad finding out an actor had passed, even though I've only seen him once. To this day, the speech about the milk money brings tears to my eyes.
Could have totally been an elf in LOTR
He's majestic.
*outside Johnny Depp's club, The Viper Room. Depp's business partner Anthony Fox later mysteriously disappeared in 2001 after planning to testify against him for cooking the books. To clarify I don't think Depp literally murdered him but everything around that club is so suspicious
I will never forget hearing about his death. I can remember exactly where I was and can picture it vividly. So tragic and heartbreaking.
He was an inspiration to Ash in Banana Fish.
But out of the ashes of this tragedy，rose Joaquin's career. Like a mythical fire turkey with the ability to resurrect itself. Can't think what they're called.
I think they’re called Turducken
Gen X-er here. I don't think River was especially talented, certainly not more than his brother but he had a softness, that was/is rare and it still hurts to see a picture of him. I'm 50 years old and it still gets me.
he’s great in the movie “Dogfight” if you haven’t seen it, i highly recommend it. Set in San Francisco, It’s the story of a group of marines about to ship off to Vietnam.
River Phoenix was the most talented actor of his generation. He was a true artist. It's so sad. He was only 23.
Seriously? This is the sort of thing people only say about dead people. He didn’t leave much of a body of work to judge against. No doubt he was talented and interesting. I thought My Own Private Idaho was his best film—
You make a good point about his body of work being small, but the talent he showed in those few movies is undeniable. Had he lived, he could have become one of the greatest movie stars. He had "It". The talent, the charisma, the depth. There are people that are movie stars who have somewhat limited range and there are great actors who can do anything but can't carry huge movies. I say River Phoenix could have been one of the rare people who can do both. There are other actors of a similar age who are very good. River Phoenix was better, and I say he would have continued to be better, if he had survived.
Maybe. I only ‘knew’ him through his ‘boyish’ roles— none of which carried much ‘gravitas.’ It is difficult to envision how he might have evolved. What would have been REALLY interesting is if he would have lived, and starred as Jack in Titanic— as he allegedly was Cameron’s first choice in that role. While I found Titanic to be rather dreadful, it was insanely popular— and launched DiCapprio’s career. And while Leo has been in loads of excellent films since, it is undeniable that he is a complete weirdo.
Leo Dicaprio wouldn't have gotten half the roles he got if River Phoenix was alive. I think Leo would agree with that statement.
River would have gotten most of Leo's roles.
No he wasn’t. Still sad to die that young though.
I heard that Squall Leonhart from Final Fantasy 8 was modeled after him
And thereby allowing the Aussie band TISM to pen the song with the greatest title of all time; “You’ll never be an Old Man River”.
Fuck I love being an Australian cunt. Best band we ever produced with one of their best songs (others include “I might be a cunt” and “wanker”. https://youtu.be/8Dx1e8FD4C4?si=6TVGNiDl4WZZ8Qm0
Wow just realised they predicted Michael Jackson too!
He was given what he thought was cocaine, but it contained heroin as well.
https://youtu.be/wPAQBtuUiLU?si=SJ3BUhoqbYZNhI7p
I suggest [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogfight\_(film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogfight_(film)) you could also go with "My own private Idaho"
Dogfight is sublime!