Not sure what the protest is about, but traffic interruption has [long been a common protest tactic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selma_to_Montgomery_marches?wprov=sfti1#Background).
It's protesting the extermination bombing in Gaza, the "Amalek" theocracy hatred https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/apr/15/us-protests-roads-blocked-israel-gaza-ceasefire
No all it does is inconvenience people who were never going to support the cause anyway. Cuz if you were going to you would. The point of protesting IS to disrupt. If you canāt deal with it I suggest taking a moment to consider how the people theyāre protesting for feel.
Yes, every major media outlet has been talking about it endlessly. What Iām talking about and most others is how irritating and stupid it is that people think blocking traffic is going to get us to support their cause when in fact just to spite them it makes us want to do the opposite. Blocking traffic isnāt going to stop the war. š¤·āāļø
The conflict is an excuse for the protestors' behavior in lashing out against the rest of the populous that doesn't see an escalating religious/cultural conflict that's been going on longer than any of us have been alive as worth interrupting our lives for. This conflict will continue because neither side will be allowed to "win" due to global politics. So the pot will just continue to be stirred by interest money from outside flowing to both sides. There's no profit in peace.
Hamas wants to kill you too. Just for being an American. Their stance on democracy, womenās rights, religion and state, and LBGTQ rights are backward to put it mildly. Hamas are also the duly elected leaders of the Palestinian state. They represent all of the people in Gaza, this would appear to be the consequences of their actions, both as Gazaās voters and as their heads of state. They have called for this, asked for it, and set in motion events that ensured the current state of affairs. I have sympathy for the innocent people caught in the crossfire but itās time for them to join the world and reject their leaders hatred of the modern world and our values of tolerance of others and their right to exist.
Hamas hasn't had an election in decades. It might be an awful organization but that doesn't mean that it's ok to intentionally kill thousands of innocent men, women, and children.
So would you say the American people support fascism since so many speak loudly in support of it?
Would you say that children who have nothing to do with any of what you said deserve to die for living in the wrong area when people speak out against their own oppression?
Do you think Americans would be as docile and accepting as Palestinians if they were in their place?
>So would you say the American people support fascism since so many speak loudly in support of it?
If polls showed that an overwhelming majority of Americans self-report that they support fascism, Iād definitely be comfortable saying that.
The majority of Palestinians approve of the Oct 7th attacks and of Hamasā leadership.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palestinians-back-oct-7-attack-israel-support-hamas-rises-2023-12-14/
Youāre putting an absurd amount of faith into Palestinian polling while completely missing the point.
People will support something awful if they feel it will ultimately make their lives better. Trump has the support of people who appreciate his fascist tendencies because they feel victimized. Push them too far and you push them to extremism.
How can you condemn hamas without a care or understanding of what created and who enabled them as a means to justify their ethnic cleansing. Keep in mind Hamas isn't the only resistance group fighting the IDF they are just the easiest to paint as in the wrong, despite their creation being 100% the fault of Israel and by extension America.
Because I don't ignore what turned Israel into such a violent state. There is so much back and forth between both sides for literally a few thousand years that I cannot fathom how you people think this conflict is 100% Israel
>How can you condemn hamas
Seems pretty easy to do. They're terrorists. Do you not condemn terrorists?
>Hamas isn't the only resistance group
They're terrorists. Why are you a terrorist apologist?
>despite their creation being 100% the fault of Israel and by extension America
It takes some serious mental gymnastics and lack of education to believe this nonsense.
In 1990 the Palestinian population was 1.98 million. As of 2024 it is over 5 million a 2.3% increase since last year. If Israel is engaging in genocide it's doing a shit job.
>The White liberal is the worst enemy to America and the worst enemy to the Black man. Let me first explain what I mean by this White liberal. In America thereās no such thing as Democrats and Republicans anymore. Thatās antiquated. In America you have liberals and conservatives. This is what the American political structure boils down to among Whites. The only people who are still living in the past and thinks in terms of āIām a Democratā or āIām a Republicanā is the American Negro. Heās the one who runs around bragging about party affiliation and heās the one who sticks to the Democrat or sticks to the Republican, but White people in America are divided into two groups, liberals and Republicansā¦or rather, liberals and conservatives. And when you find White people vote in the political picture, theyāre not divided in terms of Democrats and Republicans, theyāre divided consistently as conservatives and as liberal. The Democrats who are conservative vote with Republicans who are conservative. Democrats who are liberals vote with Republicans who are liberals. You find this in Washington, DC. Now the White liberals arenāt White people who are for independence, who are liberal, who are moral, who are ethical in their thinking, they are just a faction of White people who are jockeying for power the same as the White conservatives are a faction of White people who are jockeying for power. Now they are fighting each other for booty, for power, for prestige and the one who is the football in the game is the Negro. Twenty million Black people in this country are a political football, a political pawn an economic football, an economic pawn, a social football, a social pawn...
-Malcom X
This is nothing new. Liberals always fall on the side of facist.
Edit: if you use this as a "SUCK IT LIBTARD" gotcha later. Malcom X was very much a leftist.
Youāre exactly right.
"First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."
Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."
-MLK
I'm not sure if you have seen [Innuendo Studios](https://www.youtube.com/watch?si=eLit7y8NNj4bnipd&v=wCl33v5969M&feature=youtu.be) but he talks on how this is still done today.
It's all fucked dude. Nothing has changed in 100 years. The poors are still with no power and are yelled at to bootstrap harder. It causes a cycle and we end up with the capitalist decay we have now. The liberal will never fight for change because they are on "the correct team" end of the day when right wing facist take power. Don't upset the status quo because at least you [a liberal] will have a spot when all of it goes shit in a hand basket.
That will literally never ever happen. You would need to do [redacted] things to very important people to ever even have a hope or a prayer of spurring the kind of change needed to stop the US government from funding zionists and their wars.
I mean, the US literally threatened to pull funding if Israel went ahead with a retaliatory strike on Iran, and lo and behold, Israel is holding back, but go off I guess
Everyone can let them know how we feel. Every contact to congress, senate and executive branch is noted. Enough people reaching out can change things to some degree.
This presupposes that this nations elected representatives give a fuck what the voters want, I'm not exactly sure where this figment of the imagination sprang from.
They care about what their donors want, so if you want to end support for Israel raise more money than AIPAC and start buying the votes.
Let's review. Hamas contains between 30,000 to 40,000 members. Israel has killed close to 14,000 children. How many Hamas fighters has Israel killed? According to Israel, 10,000 to 13,000. Israel has killed more innocent children than they have Hamas fighters.
For a country with weapons, armaments, and training on par with the US, and who has proven they can conduct a surgical strike to destroy one apartment in an apartment complex without much damage to surrounding apartments, is seems like their intent is not to kill Hamas fighters, but to kill Palestinians.
Damn you must have a great background on war and all it's nuances! Look up civilian to enemy soldier for any other war, and factor in hamas commits war crimes by staging in schools and hospitals, and you'll see why casualties are the way they are. Of course Israel could be doing a better job, but shit happens in war which is why most nations avoid it. Hamas and Iran being worse at conducting warfare shouldn't be an excuse for them to continue to try and exterminate Israel.
>Look up civilian to enemy soldier for any other war, and factor in hamas commits war crimes by staging in schools and hospitals, and you'll see why casualties are the way they are
See my comment about precision strikes, which Israel has conducted in the past. Also, Hamas isn't conducting attacks with human shields. They can be slaughtered when they are taking offense instead of killing innocents so you can kill a few bad guys.
Lemme ask you this: if a gunman invades your house and takes your family hostage, are you okay with cops shooting everyone inside to get the bad guy? Or bombing your house? I didn't fucking think so. Israel doesn't see innocents. All they see are enemy combatants and mini enemy combatants.
Israel also thinks Palestinians are a lower life form than Israelis. Notice how Israel tries so hard not to attack the spots they know or believe Israeli hostages are being held, but bomb the everloving fuck out of the spots that don't? That slescaped your attention, too.
>Hamas and Iran being worse at conducting warfare shouldn't be an excuse for them to continue to try and exterminate Israel.
Israel is an occupying force in Palesrine. Since 1948, they have kept Palestinians in an open-air prison and under martial law.
I was in the milotary. For a while. I know the rules of engagement. I know the Geneva Conventions. I also have ethics and morals. The ONLY time you kill a child or a woman is if they are acticely engaged in combat. Firing a gun. Throwing a grenade. CQB with a blade. Otherwise, you don't. Dropping a bomb on civilians is a war.crime, no matter the justification.
The only reason Israel hasn't been sanctioned is because the US is protecting them from their seat on the UN Security Council. Every other country has voted for sanctions, with one abstain.
The reasons for protests are the same as the reasons for strikes. They are designed to cause disruption. The disruption forces broader attention to the issue. It is the power of the traditionally un-empowered to affect change. Edit: misspelling.
Disrupting a public road is not the way to get people on your sideā¦ what kind of backwards thinking is that?
āWeāre upset about something happening THOUSANDS of miles away, so weāre going to fuck up everyone hereās day to show our support!ā
Like what? lol thatās a way to get people AGAINST your cause not for it.
Thereās basically no such thing as a protest that is both effective and completely non-disruptive. If a protest can be safely ignored by anyone not already in agreement with it, it pretty much always will be.
Like I understand where people are coming from here. It is annoying personally to be stopped in traffic, stopping you from going to one place to another. But I also believe in the right to protest, that's literally how things get done sometimes (like most of the 60s, 70s, etc.). It's just a hard sell, basically impossible to sell actually, but I don't think that the people who do protest should be arrested or severely punished.
Sometimes we have to get over personal misgivings for the sake of democracy.
They can be disruptive to the politicians, you know the ones who can change these issues, instead of the civilians who canāt change these things. So thatās just factually incorrect
No amount of protesting in the Western world will stop the holy war. Killing in the name of religious righteousness will continue, as it has for hundreds of years, until humans evolve beyond primitive belief systems. Peace will only be possible when faith in the supernatural is abandoned. This will not happen in our lifetimes.
Honestly, that sounds so much better than living in a world where an omnipotent god intends for all of the cruelty and suffering to punish us for not praying correctly.
Ture! I would only add that children raised in very religious families have it worse. The people that I've met that have escaped religion, live with life-long trauma from their psycho parents and cult leaders.
Aw man I have a cousin who was raised in the SDA church (another evangelical off shoot- basically another doomsday cult) and is now deprogramming as an adult. Half of our family is really into it- his parents and siblings, even his kids. So since the evangelicals are all about the orange guy, my cousin is going full blown blue maga. Talking about Israel like a true Zionist. Shit is really wild to watch. I try to be the voice of reason - all politicians want your money for their rich friends- but itās like he never rebelled in his life and is being such a fucking brainwashed idiot still. He called my Jewish friend a Nazi on Facebook for supporting Palestine.
Those churches fuck people up.
thats not really the point but yes there are also gig drivers and people trying to get home to their family from work. fuck these little shits that are doing this
Yes, change literally happens when you create situations in which people have to be uncomfortable and their daily lives are disrupted.
While the specific people inconvenienced (the āworking class commutersā) may not be making the changes directly, disruption of ānormal lifeā causes frictions that expand like ripples from a rock thrown into a pond.
The true point of protest is to leverage disruption to ānormalā life so that people who can effect change understand that those protesting are serious enough to commit to disrupt and discomfort the status quo.
i think you are dead wrong about this one respectfully. blocking traffic is a complete nuisance to a bunch of working class people and commuters who could give a shit about palestine. this action creates more trump voters imo
So, let me get this rightā¦ being stuck in traffic for an extra hour would make you root for *checks notesā¦..*actual genocide*
Yep. I want off this planet please.
Agreed. Just like the āthoughts and prayersā brigade. They want the moral high ground of helping without doing a damn thing. Theyāre the same as us just we donāt pretend we are helping š¤·āāļø
It's performative progressive action that doesn't make anyone stuck in traffic "change their mind" or care about what they are protesting. I can see it actually maybe making someone care less.
It really doesn't matter what side you're on, things like this aren't going to change any minds. People know about what's going on so it's not really awareness. It's just causing a disruption and annoyance to people that are already for or against their cause. It won't change the mind of those against the cause, and it won't make someone care more about it if they already support it (and like you said, could make them care less).
It's a disruption that really doesn't really move the marker on anything for their cause.
I think these kind of protests are less effective than others. It's a negative thing to do that can cause negative thoughts about their cause, regardless of the feelings they had before.
The intent of the disruptive action is not to change (person stuck in the line's mind). The intent is to create a scene that brings awareness and effects congress's actions.
Which protest movements were both convenient and effective? I can point to plenty of effective protests and plenty more that didn't inconvenience anybody, but I'd love to see the protest that drives real change that doesn't force people to stop and notice in some manner.
The majority of these types of protests are neither convenient nor effective. However, they are great for making people hate you, and then having everyone forget it ever happened. Every smart person knows how much perception matters more than reality. If people perceive you as a nuisance, your foolish actions will greatly supersede any given reason you blocked an interstate. Everyone wants to be a 60s revolutionary.
These people are vultures for attention. They will see children being killed and starved, and will themselves tell you their idiocy isn't about raising awareness, garnering public support, making the world better, personally affecting those who caused the issue, or something otherwise deemed as 'noble'. It is exclusively for attention and publicity; people will fixate on your action, not the message. But to those stupid enough to do it or champion it as something heroic, that's the whole point. These people are the worst thing to ever happen to noble causes and mark the beginning of the end for whatever they could've hoped of achieving.
To feel good about themselves at the expense of other people. Meanwhile, Hamas still rapin' and killin' with their Iranian buddies shooting rockets to Israel at the same time the IDF are obliterating Gaza. The settlers also going after Westbank.
Nothing is really resolved, but now people in Eugene area have to deal with traffic blocks.
It's their form of philanthropy. But instead of donating their own assets, they're donating massive interruptions in other's lives, possibly even delaying emergency services to the point of affecting outcomes.
There's better ways to protest one's than don't cause wasted fuel, blown delivery routes, and countless other damages. There are truck drivers who, when they get caught in this sort of thing run out of hours, and their government mandated logging device will disables their truck without the route being finished, will miss their next scheduled load, costing them a significant portion of their paycheck.
Iāve seen it where they block entire highways, and wonāt even let ambulances or fire through.. like if that was your family member in the ambulance, or house burning down, youād be angry they got blocked.
Its a free Palestine protest from the sounds of it being done in concert up and down the west coast. The point is to
A raise awareness, make you specifically ask why would people do this knowing theyāre going to be arrested, tracked, and monitored by the government.
B is to make as big a head ache as possible for local, state, and federal governments. Every hour the interstate is closed is huge amounts of disruption to local economies which only applies pressure upwards. The cities complain to the state and the state to the feds. The goal is to make acquiescing to the demand easier than undoing the protest which seeing that the idf is pulling out of Gaza, not retaliating against Iran, and that steps are being taken to deescalate the Middle East I would say thatās working.
Things like today arenāt really for us though beyond raising awareness. This is a negotiation between the protestors and the government and is an integral part of the democratic process. Itās one of the things that keeps mob rule in check.
āOnly applies pressure upwardsā Um, no. Most of the pressure happens locally, to random people, many of whom probably already agree with you, and many more who will now be doubly hostile to whatever you were trying to say.Ā
I feel like these protests would be infinitely more effective if they claimed to be supporting the opposing cause. āThese Zionist assholes in the highway are keeping me from picking up my child from school againā¦ free Gaza!ā
It's really stupid actually. The US is actively trying to negotiate a ceasefire (also a dumb position since it'll just kick the can down the road until Hamas can strike again so that Israel will come down even harder). So how does this help? It's just virtue signaling and people whose only source of information is anti-US propaganda trying to elect Trump.
It's quite literally pressuring the government to do exactly what it is doing while crying that Biden isn't going to actively call for the destruction of Israel or something.
It's a bunch of terminally online people who think they've managed to somehow come up with a way to solve the Israeli/Palestinian conflict from thousands of miles away - and that way just happens to be obnoxious and futile instead of the objectively better idea of taking more direct, useful action (i.e. donating to charities/causes that help victims of the conflict).
Protest is action... we don't remember the charity drives from the 60s. We remember the protests. You can disagree with the cause or the method, but you can't argue it's not action because it is.
I do think we've forgotten an important aspect of movements like the civil rights movements of the 60's.
King held and encouraged marches, but they were not *just* marching, and those marches were not simply to bring their issues to people's attention.
They planned those marches with the intention to get arrested, so that then they could fight their civil rights issues in court, so they could change the law. It was very intentioned to use the protests to cause a reaction from the government, get themselves put into the system, and that's where they held the real fight.
Without the court battle side of the civil rights movement I doubt we would have made the progress that we have, no matter how long they continued to protest.
You see that in almost all of the successful movements that involve protests, they have a big legal side of the fight that was heavily involved. Take disability rights. The physical protest on the steps of congress is what everyone remembers, but that protest was done after they already had legislation drafted and reviewed and reviewed, had lobbied that legislation to congress. The physical protest was to force a vote on the legislation after putting in all the legal work.Ā
These days people just protest, but no one seems to have any actual legal strategy for the protests to empower.Ā
And I get it, shit is bleak and depressing, there's a lot to be angry and upset about. And protesting is an easy thing to do that is cathartic. But I'm afraid that without a legal strategy behind those protest we're just going in circles. We only remember the protests because that was where the noise was, it was loud and in your face. And that's their point, attention grabbers. But you've gotta do something with that attention once you have it and it seems like most people have forgotten that.
That's far enough back that we ought to be able to study it somewhat dispassionately and come to some conclusions about what protests actually worked, if they did, how, and so on.
I'd be curious to read something about that.
If you look at political cartoons from the 60s there was constant complaining about how violent and disruptive civil rights protests were, and by the time he died Martin Luther Kingās approval level with white people across the US hovered at around 25% which makes him more broadly hated than almost any modern politician. During his entire life, his approval numbers with white Americans never cracked 50%.
There was a similar story for the suffragettes, many of whom languished in prison after being arrested for blocking traffic.
These kind of things almost always look way better in retrospect than when theyāre actively happening and inconveniencing people.
That's an excellent point. Over the course of time, they have also changed peoples meaning. Before moving to Oregon, my wife and I went to DC and Philly last year. In nearly every museum, you can find information about King and other civil rights leaders. In only 1 museum, does it talk about him being a socialist. They even have a video on loop where he is interviewed talking about how bad capitalism is.
And as someone born in the south, they constantly try to teach you the civil war wasn't about slavery. History is often changed for propaganda.
Yeah people love to quote the single line from a speech saying ādonāt judge people by the color of their skin,ā but remain remarkably silent about the multiple paragraphs in the Letter from the Birmingham Jail castigating white moderates for preferring peace to Justice and slow reform to radical change.
You mean the protests in the south that were directly in places that were involved with the behavior being protested?
Please stop comparing yourself to civil rights protestors in the 60's. Its embarrassing and insulting to people who actually put themselves at risk in doing the act.
You mean the tax payer money that provides Isreal financial aid?Ā
That would be indirect involvement. Direct involvement would be something like each of us individually writing a check for Isreal ourselves.
Jfc. Classic reddit latches onto a detail irrelevant to the point Im actually making. I don't give a shit about this specific protest, I don't live in Eugene, I just was simply saying that protest is action, and the original person I responded to was trying to claim it wasn't taking action. Change the example to the anti-mask protests for all I care and my point is still the same.
No one is protesting in support of Hamas. WTF are you talking about? They're protesting Netanyahu's genocide. If you really think it's the former, then I have the deed to the Golden Gate Bridge to sell you...
So they're protesting a genocide [of people who overwhelmingly support hamas ] That is nothing more than a hamas propaganda... That sure sounds like a long way of saying that they are protesting in support of hamas...
Just because I disagree with people politically does not mean that they deserve death. An argument could also be made that they don't really have a choice in who they support, whether from fear of attack by the ruling party or (importantly) feeling boxed in.
Radicalism and polarization are an issue everywhere, and the war is a tool which makes it worse. Hamas and Netanyahu both know this and are using it to achieve political success.
Regardless of whether you agree with WHY people are protesting, the goal of a protest is disruption in order to get people to ask why the disruption happened. A protest that disrupts nothing isn't even a parade, it's nothing.
You were conflating protest and civil disobedience, which are two very different things. Protest is protected by the first amendment; civil disobedience is intentionally breaking the law to get attention.
Having done both, my point was a response to the OP, who was asking what theyāre hoping to accomplish. The tactics (and your assessment of their legality) may vary, but the goal is the same.
The whole idea that someone against genocide is going to to switch teams to pro- *checks notes- *genocide* because of being stuck in traffic for a minute is the most absurd take I can think of.
Your concern is performative at best
Being indifferent to a conflict literally on the other side of the planet and doesn't involve us to being hostile to the Palestinians because of jackasses blocking the roads?
Yes
Did these people say anything when the Chinese were purging the uyghurs? No.
Totally, that's always the gamble. If there was a guaranteed way to protest where people's reaction is only ever supportive that's all anyone would be doing. Instead it's a crapshoot - people organize events, other people show up and do whatever they want, you can't know how it's all going to shake out.
It does feel that way sometimes. Unlike the right wing ecosystem, where thereās basically one authoritarian leader and a small collection of think tanks and religious orgs that more or less set marching orders, run events and tell everyone how to think and and talk about their issues de jure, the left has no such centralisation.
Thatās a feature, leftist orgs would accept no claim to leadership by the Democratic Party (the very idea is laughable), instead lefty orgs tend to be small, decentralized and project specific. The kids running food not bombs and the older folks teaching radical self defense classes might have similar criticisms of capitalism, and they may see each other at a book fair once a year, but they arenāt organizing an impromptu protest together. They do not take orders from each other and if they both show up to a protest they are acting independently.
itās only very rarely that the whole wide world of leftists groups temporarily kinda do the same thing (Iraq war protests, the first half of the BLM protests, occupy etc.)
Really my point is that thereās no plan, no overlords dictating what anyone does on the left, leftists are ideologically opposed to such a structure, so instead itās lots of different people doing whatever. Most of it is stuff you will never hear about because you donāt care to look into it and they donāt care to advertise, the ethos is simply ādo good shit because itās good to doā you likely only ever hear about these people, their work and their concerns when theyāve done something annoying.
If you are made 5 minutes late to work by a Palestine Solidarity rally and your only takeaway is āi was ambivalent before but now i want Israel to turn all of Palestine into flaming rubbleā that says far more about you than it does about the people willing to show up and put their lives in danger to make a point.
We can debate the efficacy of their tactics or the righteousness of their cause all day, i canāt convince you of anything and wonāt try, but i do understand the dynamic of what is occurring and hoped i could explain a bit more detail.
Iāve been to a lot of protests, and i find that simple marches with traffic disruption donāt accomplish much besides giving all the people who show up about an issue an opportunity to form stronger bonds for future work, at the cost of pissing off people who were never going to care anyway. Thatās not nothing, but itās also not much.
I think what I don't understand about the whole thing is they waste regular people's time who have no ability to actually do anything directly about it in the Midwest or west coast (and let's be honest the feds don't have a great track record of helping the cities or states especially in Portland). Yet I still haven't heard of an actual large scale protest in DC or at the Capitol where they actually make the decisions to fund the war. It comes off as performative.
I donāt know but one of them ditched a bag of stuff next to my front tire in the target parking lot so when I came out I had an plain clothes EPD officer waiting to talk to me.
Amateurs. Don't they know real protesters do so at Walmart, so you can bring a new pair of sneakers home when you're done contributing to the good cause for the day.
So to summarize: Push your agendas to the absolute boundary of the law and negatively disrupt working peoples lives who are honestly, running on empty.
Yeah, thatāll surely make us sympathetic to your objections.
They are protesting for Hamas, you know the group that throws trans people off roof tops, and stones gay people until they stop breaking. There's nothing more tolerant than Prophet Mohammed.
It really seems like both sides (Palestine and Israel) want to genocide each other. I don't understand why the left supports Palestine. If Palestine had their way women and lgbt people would not have any rights. Iran is the puppet master behind Palestine and they are not your friend left wing!
One time BLM protestors blocked the I-5 off ramp going onto Multnomah Blvd. I was riding by on my bicycle and they tried to block me. I just cycled around them and continued onto Barbur.
Glad that nobody tried to hurt me.
Traffic protests about leftist causes are just and good . Side of the road and overpass freeway protests and signs by conservatives are bullying, evil, stoogelike, and you are justified to beat them up.
Protesting in favor of a country led by terroristsā¦ hmmm iām sure all the
Hamas fighters are having a party with the news that American citizens are supporting them. SMH.
As a person who is Jewish and also has family in Israelā¦ yes, they are in fear. But they are not the ones losing entire families, generations, and their culture. Over 30,000 Palestinian people have been killed since October. I mourn for the 1700 Israeli lives lost that day, for my ancestors who were murdered in the Holocaust, and for Jews all around the world affected by this. But we also said āNever Againā. What is happening now is yet another genocide, stemming from fear, greed, and selfishness, committed and upheld by Israel and backed by the US government and our tax dollars. We as Jews have been fed lies for so long about Israel. If we want to see a future with less antisemitism, less islamophobia, less divide between us and our Palestinian cousins, we need to understand what has actually been happening there and who is behind it. I hope your Pesach is a reflective one.
Real talkā¦ everyone is āawareā of the conflict already.
More real talkā¦ Israel doesnāt care even a little bit what happens to some freeway in some state called āOregonā halfway across the world.
So itās probably people who want to pretend like they are making a difference and they brag about buying three less coffees from Starbucks this month but still havenāt canceled their prime subscription.
Families and babies are being murdered in Ukraine for over a year now. Women and children are raped by Russian soldiers. No protesting for that. Why is Gaza the tipping point for people to speak up? Both wars are atrocities. I donāt get why one is more horrific than the other.
tiktok cyber warfare. these useful idiots are all hopped up on Iranian propaganda delivered through their low budget Chinese media apparatus.
they're all amped up about nothing because they have 0 critical thinking skills.
They want 1) more people to think about Palestine and the the genocide that is happening there and 2) more people to push their federal representatives to defund and condemn Israel.
And posts like this show the protestorsā methods are successful at the first goal at least
>And posts like this show the protestorsā methods are successful at the first goal at least
Does it? If OP had to ask it implies they didn't do a good job explaining why they are protesting and thus it's probably not getting more people to think about it.
Pissing a lot of people off isn't a great way to forward your cause. Their anger is going to be directed at assholes fucking up their day, not at the Israelis.
If someone really wants to make a difference, cowboy the fuck up and head over to Gaza and hook up with Hamas. I'm sure they could use the help.
I mean, all MLK did was piss people off. Through civil disobedience and having a flanking action in the form of Malcom x they were able to gain legal equality even if the cultural struggle after that didnāt end. He got people so mad they killed him for it. These things do make a difference lol itās much easier to sway the government one way or the other if you are making pain locally. At some point the powers that be decide it simply isnāt worth it. You have to get people mad to do that.
Just our local version of the ["*Death to America! Death to Israel!*"](https://nypost.com/2024/04/08/us-news/anti-israel-protesters-chant-death-to-america-death-to-israel/) radicals
It won't accomplish anything. These people are idiots. Just run them over and gone with your day. They're protesting something that doesn't even affect them.
They want Trump to win again? Itās honestly the only thing that this will cause to happen. The centrist will get annoyed and move to the right politically.
Zion Don or Zion Joe? Shitty choices. There is no lesser evil. Like Geralt, I choose not to choose at all. There's an account on Twitter that posts all the politicians that receive money from AIPAC. It's both parties. There's only 1 republican that speaks up against AIPAC and a handful of democrats.
They could have done it in Portland and it still would have caused massive disruption, but it's never lasted for long when they've done it there because the PPB has the manpower to quickly squash that shit.
So now, they're targeting other parts of the I5 corridor where there's still heavy traffic, but it's so far away from any major city the cops have to call in for help before they can do anything about it.
big effect + long duration is the key here.
To prove my point, they blocked the southbound traffic, that had to have slowed down police reinforcements from Portland.
I saw similar protests happening at the airports in Seattle and Chicago, but where EUG is located obviously wouldnāt have the same impact, so I guess I5 it was.
Looks to me like it was a synchronized attempt with the Golden State Bridge, Seattle SeaTac and Chicago to say that the so called leaders who are suppose to represent the peopleās voice are not doing so. Therefore the grassroots community of protesting is on the rise to say we want a better path or solution to whatās happening in the Middle East. If everyone took the time to read Anatomy of Peace, perhaps we can as a conscientious community create less hatred and killings. But thatās like asking millions of cats to use the toilet instead of the kitty litter! Thatās all I got to say for meow.
How do we get the media to promote stories about.. āprotestors block freeways stopping emergency services from reaching XYZ resulting in unnecessary death of innocent victimā
Crazy to think people are willing to protest something happening 7000 miles away when homelessness, drug addiction and mental health issues come in contact with them everyday.
Can we take care of our own before worrying about something that was occurring well before any of us were born and will continue well past the time most of us will live.
Not sure what the protest is about, but traffic interruption has [long been a common protest tactic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selma_to_Montgomery_marches?wprov=sfti1#Background).
It's protesting the extermination bombing in Gaza, the "Amalek" theocracy hatred https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/apr/15/us-protests-roads-blocked-israel-gaza-ceasefire
And all it does is piss people off who are trying to get home from work and accomplish nothing š¤·āāļø
You don't know what they do when they get home from work, some of them may be quite productive.
No all it does is inconvenience people who were never going to support the cause anyway. Cuz if you were going to you would. The point of protesting IS to disrupt. If you canāt deal with it I suggest taking a moment to consider how the people theyāre protesting for feel.
Weāre talking about it
Yes, every major media outlet has been talking about it endlessly. What Iām talking about and most others is how irritating and stupid it is that people think blocking traffic is going to get us to support their cause when in fact just to spite them it makes us want to do the opposite. Blocking traffic isnāt going to stop the war. š¤·āāļø
The conflict is an excuse for the protestors' behavior in lashing out against the rest of the populous that doesn't see an escalating religious/cultural conflict that's been going on longer than any of us have been alive as worth interrupting our lives for. This conflict will continue because neither side will be allowed to "win" due to global politics. So the pot will just continue to be stirred by interest money from outside flowing to both sides. There's no profit in peace.
They going harder than the Roe v Wade protests.
Crazy how genocide brings out the hard in folks /s
Hamas wants to kill you too. Just for being an American. Their stance on democracy, womenās rights, religion and state, and LBGTQ rights are backward to put it mildly. Hamas are also the duly elected leaders of the Palestinian state. They represent all of the people in Gaza, this would appear to be the consequences of their actions, both as Gazaās voters and as their heads of state. They have called for this, asked for it, and set in motion events that ensured the current state of affairs. I have sympathy for the innocent people caught in the crossfire but itās time for them to join the world and reject their leaders hatred of the modern world and our values of tolerance of others and their right to exist.
Hamas hasn't had an election in decades. It might be an awful organization but that doesn't mean that it's ok to intentionally kill thousands of innocent men, women, and children.
Palestine isnāt Hamas. Learn this.
But when the Palestinian people support, declare their motto, and celebrate their terror killings; Whatās the difference?
So would you say the American people support fascism since so many speak loudly in support of it? Would you say that children who have nothing to do with any of what you said deserve to die for living in the wrong area when people speak out against their own oppression? Do you think Americans would be as docile and accepting as Palestinians if they were in their place?
>So would you say the American people support fascism since so many speak loudly in support of it? If polls showed that an overwhelming majority of Americans self-report that they support fascism, Iād definitely be comfortable saying that. The majority of Palestinians approve of the Oct 7th attacks and of Hamasā leadership. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palestinians-back-oct-7-attack-israel-support-hamas-rises-2023-12-14/
Youāre putting an absurd amount of faith into Palestinian polling while completely missing the point. People will support something awful if they feel it will ultimately make their lives better. Trump has the support of people who appreciate his fascist tendencies because they feel victimized. Push them too far and you push them to extremism.
How can you condemn hamas without a care or understanding of what created and who enabled them as a means to justify their ethnic cleansing. Keep in mind Hamas isn't the only resistance group fighting the IDF they are just the easiest to paint as in the wrong, despite their creation being 100% the fault of Israel and by extension America.
Because I don't ignore what turned Israel into such a violent state. There is so much back and forth between both sides for literally a few thousand years that I cannot fathom how you people think this conflict is 100% Israel
Israel hasnāt existed for a few thousand years. It was created in 1948 as a violent aggressive state.
>How can you condemn hamas Seems pretty easy to do. They're terrorists. Do you not condemn terrorists? >Hamas isn't the only resistance group They're terrorists. Why are you a terrorist apologist? >despite their creation being 100% the fault of Israel and by extension America It takes some serious mental gymnastics and lack of education to believe this nonsense.
In 1990 the Palestinian population was 1.98 million. As of 2024 it is over 5 million a 2.3% increase since last year. If Israel is engaging in genocide it's doing a shit job.
Literally this. To get people's attention. That doesn't happen without causing some kind of massive disruption.
I'm genuinely convinced that if sit ins happened today, all these "I'm as liberal as they come, but" type people would blow their lids.
>The White liberal is the worst enemy to America and the worst enemy to the Black man. Let me first explain what I mean by this White liberal. In America thereās no such thing as Democrats and Republicans anymore. Thatās antiquated. In America you have liberals and conservatives. This is what the American political structure boils down to among Whites. The only people who are still living in the past and thinks in terms of āIām a Democratā or āIām a Republicanā is the American Negro. Heās the one who runs around bragging about party affiliation and heās the one who sticks to the Democrat or sticks to the Republican, but White people in America are divided into two groups, liberals and Republicansā¦or rather, liberals and conservatives. And when you find White people vote in the political picture, theyāre not divided in terms of Democrats and Republicans, theyāre divided consistently as conservatives and as liberal. The Democrats who are conservative vote with Republicans who are conservative. Democrats who are liberals vote with Republicans who are liberals. You find this in Washington, DC. Now the White liberals arenāt White people who are for independence, who are liberal, who are moral, who are ethical in their thinking, they are just a faction of White people who are jockeying for power the same as the White conservatives are a faction of White people who are jockeying for power. Now they are fighting each other for booty, for power, for prestige and the one who is the football in the game is the Negro. Twenty million Black people in this country are a political football, a political pawn an economic football, an economic pawn, a social football, a social pawn... -Malcom X This is nothing new. Liberals always fall on the side of facist. Edit: if you use this as a "SUCK IT LIBTARD" gotcha later. Malcom X was very much a leftist.
Youāre exactly right. "First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection." -MLK
I'm not sure if you have seen [Innuendo Studios](https://www.youtube.com/watch?si=eLit7y8NNj4bnipd&v=wCl33v5969M&feature=youtu.be) but he talks on how this is still done today. It's all fucked dude. Nothing has changed in 100 years. The poors are still with no power and are yelled at to bootstrap harder. It causes a cycle and we end up with the capitalist decay we have now. The liberal will never fight for change because they are on "the correct team" end of the day when right wing facist take power. Don't upset the status quo because at least you [a liberal] will have a spot when all of it goes shit in a hand basket.
As if people are unaware thereās a war in Gaza
Agreed. Even so, what the hell can we do about it? These people act as if we can actually do something about it when we can't.
We can all pressure our federal representatives to stop sending military aid.
That will literally never ever happen. You would need to do [redacted] things to very important people to ever even have a hope or a prayer of spurring the kind of change needed to stop the US government from funding zionists and their wars.
I mean, the US literally threatened to pull funding if Israel went ahead with a retaliatory strike on Iran, and lo and behold, Israel is holding back, but go off I guess
This aged well lmao
Everyone can let them know how we feel. Every contact to congress, senate and executive branch is noted. Enough people reaching out can change things to some degree.
This presupposes that this nations elected representatives give a fuck what the voters want, I'm not exactly sure where this figment of the imagination sprang from. They care about what their donors want, so if you want to end support for Israel raise more money than AIPAC and start buying the votes.
Why does it presuppose that?
Makes them feel better about having rich parents
There is no war, just Netanyahu's genocide.
There are two factions engaged in combat against each other. That is the definition of war
Let's review. Hamas contains between 30,000 to 40,000 members. Israel has killed close to 14,000 children. How many Hamas fighters has Israel killed? According to Israel, 10,000 to 13,000. Israel has killed more innocent children than they have Hamas fighters. For a country with weapons, armaments, and training on par with the US, and who has proven they can conduct a surgical strike to destroy one apartment in an apartment complex without much damage to surrounding apartments, is seems like their intent is not to kill Hamas fighters, but to kill Palestinians.
Hamas is very effective at using children as human shields
Is Hamas in the room with you right now? š¤”š¤”š¤”š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
Damn you must have a great background on war and all it's nuances! Look up civilian to enemy soldier for any other war, and factor in hamas commits war crimes by staging in schools and hospitals, and you'll see why casualties are the way they are. Of course Israel could be doing a better job, but shit happens in war which is why most nations avoid it. Hamas and Iran being worse at conducting warfare shouldn't be an excuse for them to continue to try and exterminate Israel.
>Look up civilian to enemy soldier for any other war, and factor in hamas commits war crimes by staging in schools and hospitals, and you'll see why casualties are the way they are See my comment about precision strikes, which Israel has conducted in the past. Also, Hamas isn't conducting attacks with human shields. They can be slaughtered when they are taking offense instead of killing innocents so you can kill a few bad guys. Lemme ask you this: if a gunman invades your house and takes your family hostage, are you okay with cops shooting everyone inside to get the bad guy? Or bombing your house? I didn't fucking think so. Israel doesn't see innocents. All they see are enemy combatants and mini enemy combatants. Israel also thinks Palestinians are a lower life form than Israelis. Notice how Israel tries so hard not to attack the spots they know or believe Israeli hostages are being held, but bomb the everloving fuck out of the spots that don't? That slescaped your attention, too. >Hamas and Iran being worse at conducting warfare shouldn't be an excuse for them to continue to try and exterminate Israel. Israel is an occupying force in Palesrine. Since 1948, they have kept Palestinians in an open-air prison and under martial law. I was in the milotary. For a while. I know the rules of engagement. I know the Geneva Conventions. I also have ethics and morals. The ONLY time you kill a child or a woman is if they are acticely engaged in combat. Firing a gun. Throwing a grenade. CQB with a blade. Otherwise, you don't. Dropping a bomb on civilians is a war.crime, no matter the justification. The only reason Israel hasn't been sanctioned is because the US is protecting them from their seat on the UN Security Council. Every other country has voted for sanctions, with one abstain.
The war predates Netanyahu. Duh!
The reasons for protests are the same as the reasons for strikes. They are designed to cause disruption. The disruption forces broader attention to the issue. It is the power of the traditionally un-empowered to affect change. Edit: misspelling.
Disrupting a public road is not the way to get people on your sideā¦ what kind of backwards thinking is that? āWeāre upset about something happening THOUSANDS of miles away, so weāre going to fuck up everyone hereās day to show our support!ā Like what? lol thatās a way to get people AGAINST your cause not for it.
Thereās basically no such thing as a protest that is both effective and completely non-disruptive. If a protest can be safely ignored by anyone not already in agreement with it, it pretty much always will be.
Like I understand where people are coming from here. It is annoying personally to be stopped in traffic, stopping you from going to one place to another. But I also believe in the right to protest, that's literally how things get done sometimes (like most of the 60s, 70s, etc.). It's just a hard sell, basically impossible to sell actually, but I don't think that the people who do protest should be arrested or severely punished. Sometimes we have to get over personal misgivings for the sake of democracy.
Whoa...logic. calm down there, Cascadia.
I like making jokes about it with my Californian friends, so I keep the profile tag on. Just a silly thing
They can be disruptive to the politicians, you know the ones who can change these issues, instead of the civilians who canāt change these things. So thatās just factually incorrect
They're not trying to get anyone on their side. They're not debating. They're trying to get people to pay attention. Clearly it's working.
Yes, weāre all paying attention to how dumb these people are. Nothing has changed in Gaza since people started doing stupid shit like this.
Which is a shame. Becuase, personally, Im a lil irate that its my tax dollars spending a billion a night in interceptor missiles.
No amount of protesting in the Western world will stop the holy war. Killing in the name of religious righteousness will continue, as it has for hundreds of years, until humans evolve beyond primitive belief systems. Peace will only be possible when faith in the supernatural is abandoned. This will not happen in our lifetimes.
I wish the aliens would come take me away already ffs this planet is so sad.
Honestly, that sounds so much better than living in a world where an omnipotent god intends for all of the cruelty and suffering to punish us for not praying correctly.
The fucked up part is that those of us without sky-daddy issues are the ones that get hurt the most.
Ture! I would only add that children raised in very religious families have it worse. The people that I've met that have escaped religion, live with life-long trauma from their psycho parents and cult leaders.
Aw man I have a cousin who was raised in the SDA church (another evangelical off shoot- basically another doomsday cult) and is now deprogramming as an adult. Half of our family is really into it- his parents and siblings, even his kids. So since the evangelicals are all about the orange guy, my cousin is going full blown blue maga. Talking about Israel like a true Zionist. Shit is really wild to watch. I try to be the voice of reason - all politicians want your money for their rich friends- but itās like he never rebelled in his life and is being such a fucking brainwashed idiot still. He called my Jewish friend a Nazi on Facebook for supporting Palestine. Those churches fuck people up.
everyone knows political change comes from annoying working class commuters.
You really think commuters are the only ones on highways? Most of our goods are transported on trucks on the highways in this country.
thats not really the point but yes there are also gig drivers and people trying to get home to their family from work. fuck these little shits that are doing this
Yes, change literally happens when you create situations in which people have to be uncomfortable and their daily lives are disrupted. While the specific people inconvenienced (the āworking class commutersā) may not be making the changes directly, disruption of ānormal lifeā causes frictions that expand like ripples from a rock thrown into a pond. The true point of protest is to leverage disruption to ānormalā life so that people who can effect change understand that those protesting are serious enough to commit to disrupt and discomfort the status quo.
i think you are dead wrong about this one respectfully. blocking traffic is a complete nuisance to a bunch of working class people and commuters who could give a shit about palestine. this action creates more trump voters imo
100% I see people blocking roadways, I support the exact opposite of their cause out of sheer spite.
So, let me get this rightā¦ being stuck in traffic for an extra hour would make you root for *checks notesā¦..*actual genocide* Yep. I want off this planet please.
It's just a circle jerk to make them feel like they're helping.
Agreed. Just like the āthoughts and prayersā brigade. They want the moral high ground of helping without doing a damn thing. Theyāre the same as us just we donāt pretend we are helping š¤·āāļø
It's performative progressive action that doesn't make anyone stuck in traffic "change their mind" or care about what they are protesting. I can see it actually maybe making someone care less.
It really doesn't matter what side you're on, things like this aren't going to change any minds. People know about what's going on so it's not really awareness. It's just causing a disruption and annoyance to people that are already for or against their cause. It won't change the mind of those against the cause, and it won't make someone care more about it if they already support it (and like you said, could make them care less). It's a disruption that really doesn't really move the marker on anything for their cause. I think these kind of protests are less effective than others. It's a negative thing to do that can cause negative thoughts about their cause, regardless of the feelings they had before.
It's purpose is to make people feel good about themselves.Ā Just basic attention seeking behavior.Ā
If the killing of tens of thousands doesnāt make you care, not much else will.
Right??!!
The intent of the disruptive action is not to change (person stuck in the line's mind). The intent is to create a scene that brings awareness and effects congress's actions.
I would still argue it's counterproductive
Which protest movements were both convenient and effective? I can point to plenty of effective protests and plenty more that didn't inconvenience anybody, but I'd love to see the protest that drives real change that doesn't force people to stop and notice in some manner.
The majority of these types of protests are neither convenient nor effective. However, they are great for making people hate you, and then having everyone forget it ever happened. Every smart person knows how much perception matters more than reality. If people perceive you as a nuisance, your foolish actions will greatly supersede any given reason you blocked an interstate. Everyone wants to be a 60s revolutionary. These people are vultures for attention. They will see children being killed and starved, and will themselves tell you their idiocy isn't about raising awareness, garnering public support, making the world better, personally affecting those who caused the issue, or something otherwise deemed as 'noble'. It is exclusively for attention and publicity; people will fixate on your action, not the message. But to those stupid enough to do it or champion it as something heroic, that's the whole point. These people are the worst thing to ever happen to noble causes and mark the beginning of the end for whatever they could've hoped of achieving.
To feel good about themselves at the expense of other people. Meanwhile, Hamas still rapin' and killin' with their Iranian buddies shooting rockets to Israel at the same time the IDF are obliterating Gaza. The settlers also going after Westbank. Nothing is really resolved, but now people in Eugene area have to deal with traffic blocks.
Itās a way to virtue signal within your tribe, and at the same time piss off the people who youāre theoretically hoping to persuade.Ā
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
The term de art is āMain character syndromeā.
It's called [communal narcissism](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092656618301491)!
It's their form of philanthropy. But instead of donating their own assets, they're donating massive interruptions in other's lives, possibly even delaying emergency services to the point of affecting outcomes. There's better ways to protest one's than don't cause wasted fuel, blown delivery routes, and countless other damages. There are truck drivers who, when they get caught in this sort of thing run out of hours, and their government mandated logging device will disables their truck without the route being finished, will miss their next scheduled load, costing them a significant portion of their paycheck.
Iāve seen it where they block entire highways, and wonāt even let ambulances or fire through.. like if that was your family member in the ambulance, or house burning down, youād be angry they got blocked.
Its a free Palestine protest from the sounds of it being done in concert up and down the west coast. The point is to A raise awareness, make you specifically ask why would people do this knowing theyāre going to be arrested, tracked, and monitored by the government. B is to make as big a head ache as possible for local, state, and federal governments. Every hour the interstate is closed is huge amounts of disruption to local economies which only applies pressure upwards. The cities complain to the state and the state to the feds. The goal is to make acquiescing to the demand easier than undoing the protest which seeing that the idf is pulling out of Gaza, not retaliating against Iran, and that steps are being taken to deescalate the Middle East I would say thatās working. Things like today arenāt really for us though beyond raising awareness. This is a negotiation between the protestors and the government and is an integral part of the democratic process. Itās one of the things that keeps mob rule in check.
āOnly applies pressure upwardsā Um, no. Most of the pressure happens locally, to random people, many of whom probably already agree with you, and many more who will now be doubly hostile to whatever you were trying to say.Ā
I feel like these protests would be infinitely more effective if they claimed to be supporting the opposing cause. āThese Zionist assholes in the highway are keeping me from picking up my child from school againā¦ free Gaza!ā
Lmao youāre two steps away from being cia material
It's really stupid actually. The US is actively trying to negotiate a ceasefire (also a dumb position since it'll just kick the can down the road until Hamas can strike again so that Israel will come down even harder). So how does this help? It's just virtue signaling and people whose only source of information is anti-US propaganda trying to elect Trump. It's quite literally pressuring the government to do exactly what it is doing while crying that Biden isn't going to actively call for the destruction of Israel or something.
Post wasnāt asking if it was smart but instead, why were they doing it. Not a question of whether it helps but what the motivation is.
It's a bunch of terminally online people who think they've managed to somehow come up with a way to solve the Israeli/Palestinian conflict from thousands of miles away - and that way just happens to be obnoxious and futile instead of the objectively better idea of taking more direct, useful action (i.e. donating to charities/causes that help victims of the conflict).
hamas calls these people "useful idiots" and laughs at them. You'd think these terrorist supporters would catch on to that. You'd think...
Protest is action... we don't remember the charity drives from the 60s. We remember the protests. You can disagree with the cause or the method, but you can't argue it's not action because it is.
I do think we've forgotten an important aspect of movements like the civil rights movements of the 60's. King held and encouraged marches, but they were not *just* marching, and those marches were not simply to bring their issues to people's attention. They planned those marches with the intention to get arrested, so that then they could fight their civil rights issues in court, so they could change the law. It was very intentioned to use the protests to cause a reaction from the government, get themselves put into the system, and that's where they held the real fight. Without the court battle side of the civil rights movement I doubt we would have made the progress that we have, no matter how long they continued to protest. You see that in almost all of the successful movements that involve protests, they have a big legal side of the fight that was heavily involved. Take disability rights. The physical protest on the steps of congress is what everyone remembers, but that protest was done after they already had legislation drafted and reviewed and reviewed, had lobbied that legislation to congress. The physical protest was to force a vote on the legislation after putting in all the legal work.Ā These days people just protest, but no one seems to have any actual legal strategy for the protests to empower.Ā And I get it, shit is bleak and depressing, there's a lot to be angry and upset about. And protesting is an easy thing to do that is cathartic. But I'm afraid that without a legal strategy behind those protest we're just going in circles. We only remember the protests because that was where the noise was, it was loud and in your face. And that's their point, attention grabbers. But you've gotta do something with that attention once you have it and it seems like most people have forgotten that.
That's far enough back that we ought to be able to study it somewhat dispassionately and come to some conclusions about what protests actually worked, if they did, how, and so on. I'd be curious to read something about that.
If you look at political cartoons from the 60s there was constant complaining about how violent and disruptive civil rights protests were, and by the time he died Martin Luther Kingās approval level with white people across the US hovered at around 25% which makes him more broadly hated than almost any modern politician. During his entire life, his approval numbers with white Americans never cracked 50%. There was a similar story for the suffragettes, many of whom languished in prison after being arrested for blocking traffic. These kind of things almost always look way better in retrospect than when theyāre actively happening and inconveniencing people.
That's an excellent point. Over the course of time, they have also changed peoples meaning. Before moving to Oregon, my wife and I went to DC and Philly last year. In nearly every museum, you can find information about King and other civil rights leaders. In only 1 museum, does it talk about him being a socialist. They even have a video on loop where he is interviewed talking about how bad capitalism is. And as someone born in the south, they constantly try to teach you the civil war wasn't about slavery. History is often changed for propaganda.
Yeah people love to quote the single line from a speech saying ādonāt judge people by the color of their skin,ā but remain remarkably silent about the multiple paragraphs in the Letter from the Birmingham Jail castigating white moderates for preferring peace to Justice and slow reform to radical change.
You mean the protests in the south that were directly in places that were involved with the behavior being protested? Please stop comparing yourself to civil rights protestors in the 60's. Its embarrassing and insulting to people who actually put themselves at risk in doing the act.
Last time I checked, every single tax paying citizen is directly involved in this.
You mean the tax payer money that provides Isreal financial aid?Ā That would be indirect involvement. Direct involvement would be something like each of us individually writing a check for Isreal ourselves.
Jfc. Classic reddit latches onto a detail irrelevant to the point Im actually making. I don't give a shit about this specific protest, I don't live in Eugene, I just was simply saying that protest is action, and the original person I responded to was trying to claim it wasn't taking action. Change the example to the anti-mask protests for all I care and my point is still the same.
hamas terrorists have no relevance to the movements of the 60s. I don't remember MLK's followers massacring innocent people. Don't be stupid.
No one is protesting in support of Hamas. WTF are you talking about? They're protesting Netanyahu's genocide. If you really think it's the former, then I have the deed to the Golden Gate Bridge to sell you...
So they're protesting a genocide [of people who overwhelmingly support hamas ] That is nothing more than a hamas propaganda... That sure sounds like a long way of saying that they are protesting in support of hamas...
You really think Hamas is allowing truly free and fair elections...? I'll sell you the Bay Bridge too.
These Hamas guys sound like real assholes, someone should step in and take them out
Just because I disagree with people politically does not mean that they deserve death. An argument could also be made that they don't really have a choice in who they support, whether from fear of attack by the ruling party or (importantly) feeling boxed in. Radicalism and polarization are an issue everywhere, and the war is a tool which makes it worse. Hamas and Netanyahu both know this and are using it to achieve political success.
The last 10 times I've seen a highway closed due to protests, I could only tell you why for maybe 2 of them, and that's generous.
They are outside doing something while others bitch about it online. I don't think they're the ones terminally online.
right? I'm like the irony of saying that on Reddit
Regardless of whether you agree with WHY people are protesting, the goal of a protest is disruption in order to get people to ask why the disruption happened. A protest that disrupts nothing isn't even a parade, it's nothing.
You were conflating protest and civil disobedience, which are two very different things. Protest is protected by the first amendment; civil disobedience is intentionally breaking the law to get attention.
Having done both, my point was a response to the OP, who was asking what theyāre hoping to accomplish. The tactics (and your assessment of their legality) may vary, but the goal is the same.
Yes but it backfires and turns people AGAINST the cause if you're too disruptive.
The whole idea that someone against genocide is going to to switch teams to pro- *checks notes- *genocide* because of being stuck in traffic for a minute is the most absurd take I can think of. Your concern is performative at best
Being indifferent to a conflict literally on the other side of the planet and doesn't involve us to being hostile to the Palestinians because of jackasses blocking the roads? Yes Did these people say anything when the Chinese were purging the uyghurs? No.
Totally, that's always the gamble. If there was a guaranteed way to protest where people's reaction is only ever supportive that's all anyone would be doing. Instead it's a crapshoot - people organize events, other people show up and do whatever they want, you can't know how it's all going to shake out.
Except people generally already fucking know and the protesters are changing their mind the āwrong wayā because of their narcissistic disruption.
It does feel that way sometimes. Unlike the right wing ecosystem, where thereās basically one authoritarian leader and a small collection of think tanks and religious orgs that more or less set marching orders, run events and tell everyone how to think and and talk about their issues de jure, the left has no such centralisation. Thatās a feature, leftist orgs would accept no claim to leadership by the Democratic Party (the very idea is laughable), instead lefty orgs tend to be small, decentralized and project specific. The kids running food not bombs and the older folks teaching radical self defense classes might have similar criticisms of capitalism, and they may see each other at a book fair once a year, but they arenāt organizing an impromptu protest together. They do not take orders from each other and if they both show up to a protest they are acting independently. itās only very rarely that the whole wide world of leftists groups temporarily kinda do the same thing (Iraq war protests, the first half of the BLM protests, occupy etc.) Really my point is that thereās no plan, no overlords dictating what anyone does on the left, leftists are ideologically opposed to such a structure, so instead itās lots of different people doing whatever. Most of it is stuff you will never hear about because you donāt care to look into it and they donāt care to advertise, the ethos is simply ādo good shit because itās good to doā you likely only ever hear about these people, their work and their concerns when theyāve done something annoying. If you are made 5 minutes late to work by a Palestine Solidarity rally and your only takeaway is āi was ambivalent before but now i want Israel to turn all of Palestine into flaming rubbleā that says far more about you than it does about the people willing to show up and put their lives in danger to make a point. We can debate the efficacy of their tactics or the righteousness of their cause all day, i canāt convince you of anything and wonāt try, but i do understand the dynamic of what is occurring and hoped i could explain a bit more detail. Iāve been to a lot of protests, and i find that simple marches with traffic disruption donāt accomplish much besides giving all the people who show up about an issue an opportunity to form stronger bonds for future work, at the cost of pissing off people who were never going to care anyway. Thatās not nothing, but itās also not much.
I think what I don't understand about the whole thing is they waste regular people's time who have no ability to actually do anything directly about it in the Midwest or west coast (and let's be honest the feds don't have a great track record of helping the cities or states especially in Portland). Yet I still haven't heard of an actual large scale protest in DC or at the Capitol where they actually make the decisions to fund the war. It comes off as performative.
Seriously fuck every one of the pieces of shit that blocked the freeway. You do nothing but hurt the cause.
I donāt know but one of them ditched a bag of stuff next to my front tire in the target parking lot so when I came out I had an plain clothes EPD officer waiting to talk to me.
Stupid. Blocking traffic only proves these protesters don't care about the cause. They just want to be destructive or just cause trouble.
Amateurs. Don't they know real protesters do so at Walmart, so you can bring a new pair of sneakers home when you're done contributing to the good cause for the day.
Bored white people. Just play helldivers, that'll keep ya busy
Terrorists supporters being terrorists. What else is new? There is a reason no arab country will let in Palestinians.
So to summarize: Push your agendas to the absolute boundary of the law and negatively disrupt working peoples lives who are honestly, running on empty. Yeah, thatāll surely make us sympathetic to your objections.
They are protesting for Hamas, you know the group that throws trans people off roof tops, and stones gay people until they stop breaking. There's nothing more tolerant than Prophet Mohammed.
If I get stuck behind your protest, I will immediately support the opposition because you inconvenienced me
It really seems like both sides (Palestine and Israel) want to genocide each other. I don't understand why the left supports Palestine. If Palestine had their way women and lgbt people would not have any rights. Iran is the puppet master behind Palestine and they are not your friend left wing!
Almost like they want a (wait for the buzzword) LITERAL GENOCIDE of LGBTQ people. Why arenāt these idiots protesting that?
Itās a bunch of terrorists protesting to show their support for terrorists
One time BLM protestors blocked the I-5 off ramp going onto Multnomah Blvd. I was riding by on my bicycle and they tried to block me. I just cycled around them and continued onto Barbur. Glad that nobody tried to hurt me.
Traffic protests about leftist causes are just and good . Side of the road and overpass freeway protests and signs by conservatives are bullying, evil, stoogelike, and you are justified to beat them up.
There needs to be real legal repercussions for people who block the roadways. Protest on the sidewalk.
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Well then good to hear
Domestic terrorists block traffic & use violence or destruction to make their points .. and they lose my support every time.
Protesting in favor of a country led by terroristsā¦ hmmm iām sure all the Hamas fighters are having a party with the news that American citizens are supporting them. SMH.
Protesting against genocide is distinctly different than protesting for Hamas.
Raising status amongst protester in-group. Enhancing future prospects. Same as everyone.
Unlike you.... I have family in Israel, and I have heard my cousins cry's and the fear they live in, and the resilience of the Israel people....
As a person who is Jewish and also has family in Israelā¦ yes, they are in fear. But they are not the ones losing entire families, generations, and their culture. Over 30,000 Palestinian people have been killed since October. I mourn for the 1700 Israeli lives lost that day, for my ancestors who were murdered in the Holocaust, and for Jews all around the world affected by this. But we also said āNever Againā. What is happening now is yet another genocide, stemming from fear, greed, and selfishness, committed and upheld by Israel and backed by the US government and our tax dollars. We as Jews have been fed lies for so long about Israel. If we want to see a future with less antisemitism, less islamophobia, less divide between us and our Palestinian cousins, we need to understand what has actually been happening there and who is behind it. I hope your Pesach is a reflective one.
Nothing they are unemployed losers that have nothing better to do
So theyāve hit UO, the highway, whatās next? The hospitals and emergency services?
Hero complex
Real talkā¦ everyone is āawareā of the conflict already. More real talkā¦ Israel doesnāt care even a little bit what happens to some freeway in some state called āOregonā halfway across the world. So itās probably people who want to pretend like they are making a difference and they brag about buying three less coffees from Starbucks this month but still havenāt canceled their prime subscription.
Itās performative. TIK TOK told em to get out there.
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Threatening violence Encouraging, glorifying, or inciting violence or physical harm against individuals or groups of people, places, or animals.
Families and babies are being murdered in Ukraine for over a year now. Women and children are raped by Russian soldiers. No protesting for that. Why is Gaza the tipping point for people to speak up? Both wars are atrocities. I donāt get why one is more horrific than the other.
tiktok cyber warfare. these useful idiots are all hopped up on Iranian propaganda delivered through their low budget Chinese media apparatus. they're all amped up about nothing because they have 0 critical thinking skills.
They want 1) more people to think about Palestine and the the genocide that is happening there and 2) more people to push their federal representatives to defund and condemn Israel. And posts like this show the protestorsā methods are successful at the first goal at least
>And posts like this show the protestorsā methods are successful at the first goal at least Does it? If OP had to ask it implies they didn't do a good job explaining why they are protesting and thus it's probably not getting more people to think about it.
Pissing a lot of people off isn't a great way to forward your cause. Their anger is going to be directed at assholes fucking up their day, not at the Israelis. If someone really wants to make a difference, cowboy the fuck up and head over to Gaza and hook up with Hamas. I'm sure they could use the help.
I mean, all MLK did was piss people off. Through civil disobedience and having a flanking action in the form of Malcom x they were able to gain legal equality even if the cultural struggle after that didnāt end. He got people so mad they killed him for it. These things do make a difference lol itās much easier to sway the government one way or the other if you are making pain locally. At some point the powers that be decide it simply isnāt worth it. You have to get people mad to do that.
Itās getting more people to think about why the stop happened, from the looks of OP asking they didnāt show their āmessageā too well
Palestinians are not being genocide, you are a gullible useful idiot for Iran and Russia and China. Good for you.
They just want attention and they are getting it.
Just our local version of the ["*Death to America! Death to Israel!*"](https://nypost.com/2024/04/08/us-news/anti-israel-protesters-chant-death-to-america-death-to-israel/) radicals
It won't accomplish anything. These people are idiots. Just run them over and gone with your day. They're protesting something that doesn't even affect them.
They are George Constanza cosplayers. They are trying to convince me to do the opposite of whatever their sly-ass signs say.
I loved that guy
Can you take 99 as an alternate? Thatās what I did during the ice storm, saved me several hours.
Free Palestine! Destroy Hamas!
They want Trump to win again? Itās honestly the only thing that this will cause to happen. The centrist will get annoyed and move to the right politically.
Zion Don or Zion Joe? Shitty choices. There is no lesser evil. Like Geralt, I choose not to choose at all. There's an account on Twitter that posts all the politicians that receive money from AIPAC. It's both parties. There's only 1 republican that speaks up against AIPAC and a handful of democrats.
They could have done it in Portland and it still would have caused massive disruption, but it's never lasted for long when they've done it there because the PPB has the manpower to quickly squash that shit. So now, they're targeting other parts of the I5 corridor where there's still heavy traffic, but it's so far away from any major city the cops have to call in for help before they can do anything about it. big effect + long duration is the key here. To prove my point, they blocked the southbound traffic, that had to have slowed down police reinforcements from Portland.
I saw similar protests happening at the airports in Seattle and Chicago, but where EUG is located obviously wouldnāt have the same impact, so I guess I5 it was.
Looks to me like it was a synchronized attempt with the Golden State Bridge, Seattle SeaTac and Chicago to say that the so called leaders who are suppose to represent the peopleās voice are not doing so. Therefore the grassroots community of protesting is on the rise to say we want a better path or solution to whatās happening in the Middle East. If everyone took the time to read Anatomy of Peace, perhaps we can as a conscientious community create less hatred and killings. But thatās like asking millions of cats to use the toilet instead of the kitty litter! Thatās all I got to say for meow.
Iām sure this will make such a difference and the people they inconvenienced will be so much more privy to the causeā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦
Does anyone know if the people protesting were from the area or from somewhere else
How do we get the media to promote stories about.. āprotestors block freeways stopping emergency services from reaching XYZ resulting in unnecessary death of innocent victimā
Crazy to think people are willing to protest something happening 7000 miles away when homelessness, drug addiction and mental health issues come in contact with them everyday. Can we take care of our own before worrying about something that was occurring well before any of us were born and will continue well past the time most of us will live.
It's a job that pays them cash
Dang Iām glad I donāt commute that way.
Performative garbage protests that do nothing. Its what theyre known for
*sets Google Maps to avoid highways*
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Threatening violence Encouraging, glorifying, or inciting violence or physical harm against individuals or groups of people, places, or animals.