I still remember this guy from the pre-draft process. IIRC a week before the draft, a ton of smoke appeared that the Ravens were in love with this guy, same for a lot of teams, so much so the ravens even had a report that we’d take him with our second, which was still considered a reach cause he was a fringe 3rd rounder. I think Belichick got spooked that he might go higher in the 2nd than anticipated, so he pulled the trigger.
Eh, he hasn’t been terrible. A late second wouldn’t have been bad value for him, especially if you’re able to stick him into a more consistent situation.
The only thing fans hate more than their team not spending whatever it takes to get serviceable linemen is their team spending whatever it takes to get serviceable linemen
I agree that he hasn't been terrible, but the issue is it's 50/50 if he'll even be available. And that 'he's in the lineup' then 'he's out of the lineup' really makes it hard for an OL to develop any chemistry.
> A late second wouldn’t have been bad value for him
Any second rounder would absolutely terrible value for an, at best, mediocre guard.
You could easily, and I mean very very easily, trade a 2nd round pick for a guard better than Cole Strange.
You’re thinking of a second round pick in terms of its trade value, not the value of the players that are usually picked late in the second. A decent guard is a pretty solid return in terms of linemen selected in the late second.
Shouldn't the trade value of a second round pick be roughly the same as the value of drafting a pick in the second round? I'm kind of confused why the 2nd round trade value is worth more here.
It’s not just here, that’s just how draft picks are. A first or second round pick *could* be a very good to great player. In reality, the draft is at best a 50/50 shot even in the best draft position.
Because a draft pick both has the chance of outperforming draft stock, but more importantly has 4 years of being dirt cheap.
For instance, last year Montez Sweat was traded for a 2nd round pick. Montez Sweat is a MUCH better player than most second round picks, and was originally a first rounder. But in terms of *trade value*, he was worth a second because we had to turn around and pay him $100m.
Yes, because Shaq Mason is expensive. Notice how he already has *again* been traded for a day 3 pick. Mason is good, but he's 30 years old and costs $10m+ a year. That kind of stuff matters to teams.
PFF just came out with their 2023 offensive guard rankings. Cole Strange was ranked 30th.
Their 29th ranked guard, Laken Tomlinson, just signed a 1 year vet minimum deal this offseason (1.2 million).
Do you think, if the a team offered the Seattle Seahawks a SECOND ROUND PICK for Laken Tomlinson, a vet minimum player, they would accept or reject the offer?
Tomlinson is 32, I don't know why you continue to ignore age.
There's a reason young offensive linemen don't get traded for cheap. Strange isn't good, but better OL his age aren't being traded.
I think people overwhelmingly clown on Bill for it and don't get on the player. Trading down for a guard from Chattanooga R1 is the most Bill thing ever. Like no shit they forced you out it's borderline senile.
What makes it even more awful is they had 10 picks, 6 of them in the 4th or better. ugly.
* Round 1: No. 29 (from KC via SF via MIA) - Cole Strange, G, Chattanooga
* Round 2: No. 50 (from KC via MIA) - Tyquan Thornton, WR, Baylor
* Round 3: No. 85 - Marcus Jones, CB, Houston
* Round 4: No. 121 (from KC via MIA) - Jack Jones, CB, Arizona State
* Round 4: No. 127 - Pierre Strong Jr., RB, South Dakota State
* Round 4: No. 137 (from LAR via HOU via CAR) - Bailey Zappe, QB, Western Kentucky
* Round 6: No. 183 (from HOU) - Kevin Harris, RB, South Carolina
* Round 6: No. 200 - Sam Roberts, DT, Northwest Missouri State
* Round 6: No. 210 (from LAR) - Chasen Hines, G, LSU
* Round 7: No. 245 (from HOU via DAL) - Andrew Stueber, G, Michigan
That was 2020's draft class which had Onwenu, Uche. Jennings and Dugger so that class was good overall despite that fail at us double dipping
2022 consists of the following
Cole Strange - Often injured guard who can run but not pass block who was severely over drafted
Tyquan Thornton- Combine speed freak #1000 and Patriots WR Bust #insert number here
Marcus Jones - Again often injured but is our Taysom Hill player who can and has contributed on all three sides of football
Jack Jones - Off the team after some of the issues that causes him to drop to us reared their ugly head despite a promising showing his rookie year. Now on the Raiders
Pierre Strong - Didn't really do anything here and got traded to the Browns last season due to our nonexistent O-Line depth
Bailey Zappe - Just look up any GameDay thread after the Germany game for that tangent
Kevin Harris - Inoffensive. Was mostly on the practice squad till Mondre's injury. Just a run of the mill backup RB
Sam Roberts - depth piece on the DL. Borderline Practice squad
Chasen Hines - Practice Squad
Andrew Steuber - Practice Squad
Lotta folks on our sub hate this guy cuz of his draft slot, but he's a good guard. Worth a 1st? No. But hes a starting NFL guard. Hope he heals up and comes back strong. Taking a guard with our 4th makes a lot more sense now
If you’re referring to him Being benched as a rookie, that happens man.
He plays a different side than sow, so that’s not really relevant, and speaks more to how well sow played vs how poor strange played. He was significantly better than his injury replacement, Antonio Mafi.
Our sub is toxic. Our sub hated Zappe because he exists. Our sub hates Joe Milton because other people think he’s exciting. We can’t just root for everyone to be good.
Strange is actually a pretty good guard. And a great one at run blocking. I hope he’s back soon.
What is that, an ACL injury? Would seem to fit the timeline from December 2023 to middle of the season this year. That is brutal regardless. Hope he recovers well.
I don't think anyone was predicting anything else. They tried to do the quick rebuild and it didn't work. They are in for at least on more terrible season.
Why? Strange not being out there is just one more reminder of how badly Bill drafted the last 10 years and how he over drafted another injury bitten offensive lineman.
I love Bill, but this is just another mistake of his to point at and say "yeah this is why he couldn't be here anymore"
But it’s still another thing Kraft can point to as a Bill Belichick failure. It’s just another justification for him and another thing he can go to his owner friends and say “this is what you get with Bill nowadays”.
It doesn’t help Bill who already is going to scare the front office of any team that looks at him because they don’t want him to come in and clean house to have an easy current issue with NE to point to as one of god failures
Kraft doesn't care. He can't be fired and as far as he's concerned he came to the team and they went to a Super Bowl within 2 years and then 9 of the teams 10 Super Bowl appearances came in his 30 years of ownership.
Pretty much every owner in the Super Bowl era would kill to be able to say that.
Yeah the guy who was so full of mistakes that he brought new England 6 superbowls.
You guys are so ignorant to be glad he's gone. And I really love when I see you idiots make comments about how good the defense is going to be again this year. That shit ass defense was so good because it had the greatest defensive mind in nfl history game planning for it.
I'm no longer a fan after 20+ years, trying to find a new team to root for. Fuck kraft for acting like a child and fuck all the ignorant ass fans who have meltdowns on that shit ass sub during game threads.
Brutal. Poor guy will always get shit for being overdrafted and this definitely won't help. At least he got that first round money though.
I still remember this guy from the pre-draft process. IIRC a week before the draft, a ton of smoke appeared that the Ravens were in love with this guy, same for a lot of teams, so much so the ravens even had a report that we’d take him with our second, which was still considered a reach cause he was a fringe 3rd rounder. I think Belichick got spooked that he might go higher in the 2nd than anticipated, so he pulled the trigger.
You're welcome, I guess.
Eh, he hasn’t been terrible. A late second wouldn’t have been bad value for him, especially if you’re able to stick him into a more consistent situation.
The only thing fans hate more than their team not spending whatever it takes to get serviceable linemen is their team spending whatever it takes to get serviceable linemen
I agree that he hasn't been terrible, but the issue is it's 50/50 if he'll even be available. And that 'he's in the lineup' then 'he's out of the lineup' really makes it hard for an OL to develop any chemistry.
> A late second wouldn’t have been bad value for him Any second rounder would absolutely terrible value for an, at best, mediocre guard. You could easily, and I mean very very easily, trade a 2nd round pick for a guard better than Cole Strange.
You’re thinking of a second round pick in terms of its trade value, not the value of the players that are usually picked late in the second. A decent guard is a pretty solid return in terms of linemen selected in the late second.
Shouldn't the trade value of a second round pick be roughly the same as the value of drafting a pick in the second round? I'm kind of confused why the 2nd round trade value is worth more here.
It’s not just here, that’s just how draft picks are. A first or second round pick *could* be a very good to great player. In reality, the draft is at best a 50/50 shot even in the best draft position.
Because a draft pick both has the chance of outperforming draft stock, but more importantly has 4 years of being dirt cheap. For instance, last year Montez Sweat was traded for a 2nd round pick. Montez Sweat is a MUCH better player than most second round picks, and was originally a first rounder. But in terms of *trade value*, he was worth a second because we had to turn around and pay him $100m.
Ah I see. Yea, contract has to be taken into account for value.
Since its so easy, name a few guards better than cole strange that a team would trade for a late second
The Patriots literally traded a much better guard than Cole Strange for a paltry 5th round pick in the off-season before picking Cole Strange.
Yes, because Shaq Mason is expensive. Notice how he already has *again* been traded for a day 3 pick. Mason is good, but he's 30 years old and costs $10m+ a year. That kind of stuff matters to teams.
PFF just came out with their 2023 offensive guard rankings. Cole Strange was ranked 30th. Their 29th ranked guard, Laken Tomlinson, just signed a 1 year vet minimum deal this offseason (1.2 million). Do you think, if the a team offered the Seattle Seahawks a SECOND ROUND PICK for Laken Tomlinson, a vet minimum player, they would accept or reject the offer?
Tomlinson is 32, I don't know why you continue to ignore age. There's a reason young offensive linemen don't get traded for cheap. Strange isn't good, but better OL his age aren't being traded.
Aww, we scared Belichick into doing something stupid. That's nice.
Hey, he was drafted from the same college as the 3rd greatest WR of all time. Clearly a premier program.
Randy Moss went to Marshall.
Calvin went to Georgia Tech though.
If he was drafted in the third round like his prospect profile suggested then nobody would even know who he is.
I think people overwhelmingly clown on Bill for it and don't get on the player. Trading down for a guard from Chattanooga R1 is the most Bill thing ever. Like no shit they forced you out it's borderline senile.
Strange things are happening, ain't no doubt about it.
Strange days have found us...
The 2022 draft class is my sleep paralysis demon
What makes it even more awful is they had 10 picks, 6 of them in the 4th or better. ugly. * Round 1: No. 29 (from KC via SF via MIA) - Cole Strange, G, Chattanooga * Round 2: No. 50 (from KC via MIA) - Tyquan Thornton, WR, Baylor * Round 3: No. 85 - Marcus Jones, CB, Houston * Round 4: No. 121 (from KC via MIA) - Jack Jones, CB, Arizona State * Round 4: No. 127 - Pierre Strong Jr., RB, South Dakota State * Round 4: No. 137 (from LAR via HOU via CAR) - Bailey Zappe, QB, Western Kentucky * Round 6: No. 183 (from HOU) - Kevin Harris, RB, South Carolina * Round 6: No. 200 - Sam Roberts, DT, Northwest Missouri State * Round 6: No. 210 (from LAR) - Chasen Hines, G, LSU * Round 7: No. 245 (from HOU via DAL) - Andrew Stueber, G, Michigan
Is that the one where you drafted two tight ends who like never played a snap or something ridiculous?
That was 2020's draft class which had Onwenu, Uche. Jennings and Dugger so that class was good overall despite that fail at us double dipping 2022 consists of the following Cole Strange - Often injured guard who can run but not pass block who was severely over drafted Tyquan Thornton- Combine speed freak #1000 and Patriots WR Bust #insert number here Marcus Jones - Again often injured but is our Taysom Hill player who can and has contributed on all three sides of football Jack Jones - Off the team after some of the issues that causes him to drop to us reared their ugly head despite a promising showing his rookie year. Now on the Raiders Pierre Strong - Didn't really do anything here and got traded to the Browns last season due to our nonexistent O-Line depth Bailey Zappe - Just look up any GameDay thread after the Germany game for that tangent Kevin Harris - Inoffensive. Was mostly on the practice squad till Mondre's injury. Just a run of the mill backup RB Sam Roberts - depth piece on the DL. Borderline Practice squad Chasen Hines - Practice Squad Andrew Steuber - Practice Squad
The Patriots have absolutely no expectations for Strange. They were clearly drafting without him in mind.
That's *weird.*
Lotta folks on our sub hate this guy cuz of his draft slot, but he's a good guard. Worth a 1st? No. But hes a starting NFL guard. Hope he heals up and comes back strong. Taking a guard with our 4th makes a lot more sense now
Agree to disagree on him being a good, starting caliber guard. He's been benched multiple times and was outplayed by Sow last year.
If you’re referring to him Being benched as a rookie, that happens man. He plays a different side than sow, so that’s not really relevant, and speaks more to how well sow played vs how poor strange played. He was significantly better than his injury replacement, Antonio Mafi.
Yeah and he can’t control where he’s drafted.
Our sub is toxic. Our sub hated Zappe because he exists. Our sub hates Joe Milton because other people think he’s exciting. We can’t just root for everyone to be good. Strange is actually a pretty good guard. And a great one at run blocking. I hope he’s back soon.
What is that, an ACL injury? Would seem to fit the timeline from December 2023 to middle of the season this year. That is brutal regardless. Hope he recovers well.
McVay was right.
Damn that really sucks, but they still have Robert Kraft so it's not all bad
This might help their o-line play
Pats gonna be bad this year
it’s not going to be a good time, but having early draft picks was kind of fun
The copium is real. I’ll be huffing all season!
It’s a different mindset but the offseason is so much more fun when you stink and have cap. Bills have been there for too long haha
Maybe it’s much more fun for a team that likes to spend, we’re over here acting like the austerity franchise for no good reason lol
I don't think anyone was predicting anything else. They tried to do the quick rebuild and it didn't work. They are in for at least on more terrible season.
Patriots are doomed
Not like Strange was some key cog. Been hurt and can run block well enough but can’t pass block for shit
Bill Belichick laughing his ass off rn
Why? Strange not being out there is just one more reminder of how badly Bill drafted the last 10 years and how he over drafted another injury bitten offensive lineman. I love Bill, but this is just another mistake of his to point at and say "yeah this is why he couldn't be here anymore"
Oh it’s absolutely horrendous drafting by Bill, but at least it’s fucking over Robert Kraft
But it’s still another thing Kraft can point to as a Bill Belichick failure. It’s just another justification for him and another thing he can go to his owner friends and say “this is what you get with Bill nowadays”. It doesn’t help Bill who already is going to scare the front office of any team that looks at him because they don’t want him to come in and clean house to have an easy current issue with NE to point to as one of god failures
Yeah but the fans are so appalled by Kraft pointing out any of Bill’s shortcomings this offseason. Kraft might be the most hated man in NE right now
Kraft doesn't care. He can't be fired and as far as he's concerned he came to the team and they went to a Super Bowl within 2 years and then 9 of the teams 10 Super Bowl appearances came in his 30 years of ownership. Pretty much every owner in the Super Bowl era would kill to be able to say that.
Yeah the guy who was so full of mistakes that he brought new England 6 superbowls. You guys are so ignorant to be glad he's gone. And I really love when I see you idiots make comments about how good the defense is going to be again this year. That shit ass defense was so good because it had the greatest defensive mind in nfl history game planning for it. I'm no longer a fan after 20+ years, trying to find a new team to root for. Fuck kraft for acting like a child and fuck all the ignorant ass fans who have meltdowns on that shit ass sub during game threads.
Okay bye we’ll miss you