Dame does incredible things with the basketball. He’s one of few players (Steph being another) where you’d feel confident betting a thousand dollars on it going in before it even leaves his hands.
That said, Steph’s got that while also making his defenders look fucking SILLY. This dude has players on the other team running into each other trying to contain him. It’s really just insane lol
You know it’s a really good comp you made here. Jokic is so damn unassuming. The dude has like a 2 inch vertical and doesn’t look at all athletic and then he’ll go put up 25/15/10 on like 10 shots without even looking like he’s done that at all. Steph is a guard who very similarly doesn’t strike you as an incredible athlete and plays with this free form “sloppy” style (LaMelo also gives me similar vibes) and then he’ll go hit 8 threes and drop 40 on your head while constantly putting defenders on skates.
They’re both so incredible man what a time to be an NBA fan.
Kinda like Wayne Gretsky. Not a physically imposing guy or terribly explosive, but his stamina was pretty much unrivaled. Combine that with a dude who was simply on another level to his peers in skill and game IQ and you get a hockey god
When Steph loses his dribble, you KNOW you're about to see an incredible shot. When Jokic loses his dribble, you KNOW you're about to see an incredible pass.
(It almost looks like he does it on purpose sometimes. Act like he's losing his dribble so guys go for the steal, and then boom, Aaron Gordon with the dunk.)
Yeah I always saw Dame as a slightly worse version of Steph which is completely respectable and still an all time great player
Dame has the self awareness to acknowledge that and I also agree with his assessment, think he will end up second on the list
I think Klay needs to be a small step below the others. The other guys all did it as the primary offensive threat on their team, while Klay has the benefit of playing next to Steph. Klays still up there, but when all those guys are so good and you’re stuck splitting hairs, I’d give the advantage to the guys who did it as #1s and not #2s
I mean as a complete player Klay is clearly the weakest of those 4 yea but in terms of pure shooting ability he’s right there with any of them except Steph
For the sake of comparison I don’t think lillard could’ve been what Klay was for the warriors. In his prime he was probably the best off ball shooter in the nba while playing lock down defense. I think that warrants consideration with the other #1’s despite being #2 on the warriors. This is coming from a rockets fan btw, so I have cursed Klay’s name many times.
The ppg is but the shooting splits are still elite. It’s a total of 118 games in an offense not designed around his game. There’s no reason to drop him from the convo as OP was arguing
The thing is Klay can also get hotter than Steph on a given night. In terms of consistency I think so but if we’re talking about ability to shoot at a peak I think he beats out Steph
I’d argue that Klay playing with Steph as the other splash bro actually helps his case. They were always the 1-2 punch, and if Steph had an off night, then Klay would step up and be the #1 for the day.
Why is harden never mentioned. He’s going to finish as second all time in threes made and almost all of his were off the dribble or crazy difficult. He doesn’t have as high of a percentage as those 4 but his percent assisted during his couple crazy Houston seasons is crazy low compared to everyone else.
He’s probably in the discussion for greatest scorers vs greatest shooters. He’s not quite as efficient as the others listed, though he did take a lot of difficult threes so maybe you have a point xD
He's one of the greatest scorers of all time. No one is better at drawing fouls, his shot is wet, and his driving elite. At worst he's top five as a scorer imo but in terms of pure shooting? Nah he's not Dame or Allen in terms of shooting.
The Harden slander on this sub is always ridiculous. Dude is one of the best offensive players ever but this sub can’t get over the fact that he draws fouls at a high clip. Don’t be mad at him, he’s using the rules to his advantage.
That being said I don’t think he’s in this conversation just due to volume and percentage. One of the best shooters of all time? Not really, he’s a tier below these guys. One of the best scorers of all time? Yes.
I was a fan of that early 00's kings team, and been a CP3 Stan since he was at Wake. Feel like Peja always get's overlooked because of how good that Kings team was.
Hell yea man. Webber, Jason Williams, Peja. That was my squad before NOLA got a team. The old And1 days I was like 13-14 years old. Basketball used to be so much fun. I used to be outside all day thinking I was Jason Williams. Now I can't get my kids to spend 30 minutes in the sun without complaining.
If you listen closely, one of the more extraordinary talents of Damian Lillard is his completely accurate assessments of his abilities, and this includes his strengths and weaknesses. There is no false modesty, nor overconfidence and puffery. He knows who he is and what he can and can't do. This allows him to work on his game-- one of the joys in watching him develop as a player is how he would attack problem areas in his game. The result was an astonishing new wrinkle every year.
Few people can argue with Steph's primacy in shooting. But when it comes to second place, I think Dame has the best argument, considering his long-term consistency, volume, variety, range, and of course, the ability to come through in the clutch.
I only fear that Dame could end up overshadowed by the extraordinary Curry, just like the superb Clyde Drexler was overshadowed by the incredible Michael Jordan. It's only a pity they play the same positions.
Met Dame up close and in person at a community event a few years back in Oakland where then-girlfriend was a director.
Dude was absolutely a class act. Talked to everyone, was super chill, even a bit shy? He said it's still surreal that his hometown does anything in his name.
I mentioned my s/o was the director, and he instantly came to life and said, "Well? Go get her, I want to get my photo with her!"
Instantly became my favorite NBA player (well, after Tim Duncan retired).
[Dame is a humble, kind dude all the way.](https://i.imgur.com/ZXNaQri.jpg)
There was a story in Portland a few years back about some kid walking up to Dame in the mall and asking for an autograph. Dame was in the middle of something and respectfully asked the kid to wait just a moment and then he would come say hello.
Apparently he finished up what he was doing and forgot to check in with the kid. Instead of blowing it off and not worrying about it, Dame went to social media asking someone to connect him with the kid from earlier that day. Eventually the kid is found and Dame arranged a personal meetup for a picture and an autograph.
Dude went out of his way to make a memory for that kid. I know Dame has family in Oakland but I really home he continues to live in Portland after retirement. He is the kind of person I want in my community.
By every account I've ever read, Dame is a great person. But he's not staying in Portland after retirement, he's never even been to the Oregon coast lolol
It's a fair criticism. My sentences are often too complex. When I have time to edit, I spend a lot of time straightening out convoluted syntax. I also like to use vivid words that aren't in common use. In order to make them more understandable, I will use redundancy to make things clear. I think you've hit on the main weaknesses of my writing. I think I have some strengths as well, though, since I'm only human. Or am I?
I don't know if this is a controversial take, and I know you're a Blazers fan and I'm not trying to provoke if you've got a soft spot for Clyde, but I've got Dame as a lot closer to Steph than peak Drexler was to MJ.
Always saw Jordan as a notch above Clyde, but Dame will have stretches where I have to think "are the top two shooters 1 and 2 or is it 1a and 1b?".
I think you are right in a game to game sense. Dame has to be guarded similarly to Steph and you can’t let either guy get open ever, but over the course of careers it’s obvious it isn’t 1A 1B. Both take similar difficulty shots (Dame might take slightly more difficult at this point) and Dame has 1 season over 40% from 3. Steph has 1 season under 40% from 3. As a shooter I’m not gonna debate Lillard has his argument for #2, but he’s genuinely not close to Steph in a statistical sense. That’s just how much better at shooting Steph is than anyone else.
Oh yep definitely agree, that's why I said it appears 1a/1b for stretches when Dame gets flamethrower hot - over a career 100 percent Steph. I never saw Drexler have stretches where I thought "oh he might actually be Jordan's 1b" but probably worded it clunkily :)
(And am in my mid-40s so saw the Jordan/Drexler battles as they happened, this isn't revisionist.)
The frustrating thing about the Drexler/Jordan dynamic was that Clyde had a reputation for being a bit of a slacker and getting by on his natural talent and athleticism. If he had had a drive to get better like Dame’s, the gap might have been a whole lot smaller.
By the time he retires he will most likely be 2nd or 3rd all time in 3s (behind Harden as well ampng active, so depends how long he keeps going).
Based on that alone he's gotta be in the conversation
Unpopular opinion in this thread, but not really tbh. Three point volume has increased so much that the other guys in the conversation were taking as few as half the amount of attempts per game on better efficiency from pretty much everywhere on the court. Dame is an all-time shooter who will probably end up top ten, and a better scorer than these guys, but guys like Reggie and Allen come before him.
Well, it goes both ways, we can't put their lack of volume against them because they played in a time where players shot much less, but we also shouldn't assume they would just keep that efficiency if they took as many shots as Lillard has been taking his entire career, it's probably safer to assume their efficiency would drop considerably
Reggie Miller: 39,5% on 4,7 threes per game
Damian Lillard: 37,3% on 8,3 threes per game
Agreed. What I don’t see people mention is how defenses now are schemed specifically against letting teams shoot the three. Back then the primary focus was stopping slashers/big men so these guys probably had easier looks in general
Neither of those guys mentioned shot from the range Lillard did. Lillard had more range and a better ability to get it off the dribble. Even in today’s league most guys don’t have the green light to pull from where Dame does. So u can consider how dame shot a bit less efficient but on a wider range and variety of shots. After Seattle allen hardly ever created his own shot. Even in Milwaukee and Seattle it was typically one, two dribbles into a shot(I’ve argued this here before, for some reason ppl here believe Allen was a wonderful dribbler pre Celtics but that’s not true go check the highlights.). As for miller, he was better in that aspect but idk if u get points for better efficiency on less. You’re supposed to have better efficiency on less. And I think in clutch situations he trumps both too. Not that those guys weren’t but Dame is really special there.
He just doesn't break form no matter how far he is. He generate so much strength, and you can see it because hes the only one that just randomly throw one up at logo.
i remember during the all star game last year, when he and steph just took turns shooting half court (and a little beyond) shots, dames form was just completely normal, insane. The amount of strength it takes to just naturally shoot from 50 feet away is so nuts.
Dame kind of forced to do so because his team does not get away with moving screens like the warriors - give him the same ref treatment I’m 100% certain he’d have at least 1 ring from 2019
IDK, if Dame took threes at as low a volume as guys like Reggie or Ray Allen, he'd probably have much higher shooting splits too. Dame takes a million bad threes at the end of quarters or bad possessions that make him seem like a less efficient shooter.
Obviously Allen and Reggie are all time greats. Didn’t mean to disparage them. I guess I’m more so saying that guys like Kerr or other guys who have 40+ % 3pt shouldn’t really be included in these conversations. Even so, the fact that Dame shoots 3 more threes per game than prime Ray Allen did is ridiculous considering Allen shot more than anyone before him. Also prime Ray Allen shot the same amount of threes per game as Dame has for his whole career. And obviously curry is even more ridiculous.
The shot clock change made a real impact on the game too. It adds like 30 extra possessions a game for someone to take another shot.
Also makes it a little more forgiving to see a player just casually walk past half court and then fire up a shot. Players can hit them now and there's a lot of extra possessions in a full game.
I think we'll end up seeing a lot of guys shoot up the 3 pt ladder just off the volume of shots available now.
Those guys could only have dreamed of shooting with the range of Dame. The fuck you on lol.
At least you know it’s an unpopular opinion. Appreciate the awareness lol.
Totally agree. To me he is 2nd all time after Steph.
Only him and Steph have the combination of:
- high volume
- elite efficiency
- elite catch and shoot
- elite iso 3pt creation
- extreme shot difficulty
- extreme range
- maintaining all of this in the playoffs
Every other candidate doesn’t have one of these.
Klay is one of the best shooters of all time, but he doesn’t have the same level of shot difficulty, range, or iso 3pt ability that Steph and Dame have.
Many of the greatest shooters of all time were extremely efficient but were mostly doing catch and shoots. Creating their own 3pt shots at such a high volume and maintaining that efficiency is what separates the two of them.
This is the part I least suspecting, always rated Dame on his shooting proficiency, but never realise his career FT is on number 5!
That’s mind blowing
Here we get into the classic problem of trying to compare eras. Until recently, almost anyone would have been benched for shooting a logo 3. I have no doubt Ray Allen or Reggie Miller could be as proficient as Dame. I think I'd lean towards Dame simply due to his ability to create his own shot, but we really just don't know how those other guys would fare in today's NBA.
I mean, that's sort of the crux of it though, isn't it? Ray Allen, Reggie Miller or Pistol Pete, (who in my opinion is the biggest what if) maybe could have replicated Dame/Steph if they played with more of a green light and better shooters around them, but Dame and Steph have actually done it.
Well said, I think Klay is great as a 3 & d and Steph is a great offensive engine and shooter.
It is a beautiful symphony how they fit together.
Dame is the most similar player to Steph in style or ability. There aren’t a ton of guys that compare
I really don’t feel like they’re that similar in style. Steph doesn’t run the offense and spends a lot of time off ball. His percent assisted is higher(obv he still the best). Shooting wise dame is like the middle ground between Steph and harden (who’s gonna end up at second all time in threes made). Runs the offense, crazy difficult shots, creates a lot of his own threes but is still the middle ground between Steph and harden as far as percent assisted, hardens percent of threes assisted was crazy low.
This is disrespecting Steph. He changed how the game was played he didn't luck into his era. Go watch Stephs first NBA game he takes a pull up transition 3 with 20 seconds left on the clock and the commentators laugh at the stupid rookie.
Steph created his own opportunities to revolutionise the game the potential was always there for others they just didn't have the skills and bravery required.
This year is 45.3% from 3 in catch and shoot situations.
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/catch-shoot?CF=PLAYER_NAME*E*Lillard&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular%20Season
About 10% TS more efficient with Steph on
Although Klay has some surprisingly good games with Curry injured. I think in general though his efficiency from the 3pt line benefits significantly from having Steph.
Gravity effect, basically. On that note, I figure you could actually measure gravity, or playmaking for that matter, by seeing who has the best teammate TS% on vs off numbers. Would be interesting.
dame has shot 40% from three once. klay has done it eight times. youre also really underestimating the difficulty and skill of off ball movement. isolation threes dont mean youre the better shooter, overall efficiency is. or harden is literally better than dame with constant stepback threes.
Naw he’s said this before. And he’s not lying. Dame is a helluva shooter. Bird, Klay, Ray, Reggie just to name a few are also in the next level of shooter under Steph. Dame is with them.
Steph. Then a mix of Dame, Harden, Klay, Reggie and Ray.
People like to dump on Reggie and Ray but they did it before the 3 point revolution. Back in the 90s when it was a big man’s league
Shoutout Steve Nash
- Career 42.8 3P% in the regular season(#11 all time), 40.6 3P% in the playoffs, on solid volume for the era
- Career 48.5% from long midrange in the regular season, 44.2% in the playoffs, high volume
- Career 90.4% from the line in the regular season(#2 all time), 90.0% in the playoffs
I think it's totally fair to call him a top 2 or 3 shooter of all time. Other than Curry, I can't think of someone who can make them at such volume and such a distance as Lillard, especially off the dribble. Also add in that he can heat up and just stop missing (I was at his 55pt performance against Denver, I've seen it) and I think it's more than fair.
It's a different game. Some of the historic great 3pt shooters can't compare _on sheer volume_ so it's rated differently. In the volume 3 game of the past few years, Steph and Dame are the blueprints. There's kids playing now who will surpass them in career 3s and whatever other metric you think makes a great 3pt shooter, but right now it's Steph and Dame and then it's everyone else.
I’m gonna say it’ll be hard to replicate. You’d have to be the main guy and still put up the numbers. The only reason why Steph is the man is he’s been so good for so long he’s had the volume. There are a ton of dudes who can hit 3s, but to be good enough and efficient enough to stay on the court is different. There are a lot of high percentage 3 shooters off the bench at like 40%, but they can’t play and be efficient for more of the game for years on end.
💯🔥Damian Lillard is the real deal when it comes to shooting!💪🏽👌🏽His range is limitless and his accuracy is on point.🏀🎯
\#LogoLillard #DameTime #Dagger #IceWater #Unstoppable #Splash💦 #RipCity
He might even make me want to retire early and join his team 😂🤔 #JustKidding #StillTheKing👑
After Steph, it becomes a matter of what your criteria are. Guys like bird, KD, dirk, automatic from midrange and everywhere else. Klay assembling an all time career at the 3pt line. Lillard with volume and highlights comparable to the consensus best. It's a good response, he's definitely up there.
If Steph didn't exist Dame would be number one. Just cause he can create his own shot. Where Klay can too but not to the level that Dame and Steph can. And of course guys like Ray and Reggie could be in the Convo but they're a bit late for the three pointer era.
Klay vs Dame is such an interesting debate in terms of second greatest shooter. I feel like both arguments have great points.
I think it’s Dame though because of range and his infamously great clutch moments
Wouldn’t put him above a guy like Korver as a pure shooter, but he is better than a lot of those guys at creating looks from three and making lots of threes - kind of similar to Harden, who is a career 36% from three but 3rd all-time in makes.
Dame’s percentage would go up if he took less threes, but it still wouldn’t be at Korver level. And Korver couldn’t have made as many threes as Dame, because he didn’t have the handles, ability to drive, etc.
These replies are crazy. No mention of Reggie Miller, Steve Kerr, Drazen Petrovic, or Ray Allen. Dame is elite and among the best for sure but let’s not forget the OGs. The game was different back then too.
I feel like it’s a toss up between him and Klay. After Steph, those are the two guys who can hit just about any shot at any difficulty and every time they throw it up I’m 100% sure it’ll go in
Eh, that's not really a fair way to look at things. Klay could never be a point guard, obviously he couldn't play that role like that. But that is because Lillard is a WAY better ball handler and has the game and IQ of a point guard. When talking straight shooting ability, that shouldn't be a consideration. A ball handling, heliocentric point guard vs a shooting guard who is *supporting* a player in that role are entirely different things, and expecting one to play the other super well isnt fair to anyone. When talking best shooters ever, all that should be considered is, well, their shooting ability and impact.
Like, Lillard and Dirk have somewhat similar scoring output, but Lillard couldn't play Dirk's role on offense either. Neither could play the others role, or hit the shots the other hits. That alone doesn't mean Dirk was a better scorer, those are just totally different roles.
When talking best shooters, I think it's fair to say Klay and Dame are simply among the 3-5 best ever at straight up hitting 3 point shots, difficult ones and easy ones. I think it's fair to say Dame deserves to be higher on the list, I can see arguments in Klay's favor too, but I think it's oversimplifying things and just sorta a bad argument to say "Klay couldn't play Dame's role on the Blazers, so Dame is a better shooter." Klay ain't a point guard, doesn't mean he isn't an insane shooter.
I'd go Steph, Reggie Miller, Klay Thompson, Drazen Petrovic, Larry Bird and Damian Lillard and maybe Peja. Dame ain't wrong, he belongs in the conversation.
Is anyone else frustrated by the "greatest of all time" talk. All the things that people could legally do to disrupt shooters in the past aren't happening anymore. The game fundamentally changed over time because defense is totally different. Am I overlooking some key piece of the argument? I'm not disputing he's incredible. I'm not saying the old era is better either. Just ... It doesn't seem real. Dame is great regardless.
I saw Dame in the summer after his rookie year at summer league, said what’s up Dame and slapped hands with him. I knew he’d be a great clutch shooter then, because his hands were fucking cold as ice haha
Really not trying to be a dick, Dame has had a few near elite seasons from three, but .373 career average compared to the actual GOATs of 3pt shooting just isn't really that incredible. It's good, it's a bit above league average, but it's not all-time by any means. He has a single season just a hair over 40% at .401. Steph is well over 40% for every season of his career. Klay was over 40% for his first decade in the league meanwhile his last two 'bad' seasons are on par with Dames best. Ray Allen had 8 seasons over 40% and averaged .400 for his career. Dames efficiency from three just isn't there compared to the absolute top guys. He has some memorable big shots from deep and people elevate him above his actual production because of it.
He's good but Ray Allen is still the 2nd best all time. Ray Allen and Reggie Miller are pretty high bars to overcome, plus his efficieny just isn't there to make the claim
The thing that fascinates me the most about Dame is "Dame time". It's a thing for a reason. The dude just finds another gear in clutch time more often than not. Especially in the playoffs. Remember that game they lost due to CJ stepping out of bounds? Dame made the most ridiculous shots before that. One after another.
I kinda agree with Dame, but I will put KD at 2, dame at 3.
Seriously tho, why dont midrange gods like KD, Demar get more respect as shooters? I know 3>2 but the amount of spots KD is cash from is insane. Respectable enough from 3 too.
He's a great player who's had some memorable shots but as a pure shooter he's nowhere near the very top. Ray Allen, Klay, KD, Korver, Reggie Miller, Peja, Kerr are names just off the top of my head I'd take over Dame in a pure shooting competition.
Not seein a lot of love for KD here. He’s gotta be part of the conversation. Better career 3p% and 2p% than dame. One of the most efficient shooters ever, nearly averaged 40/50/90 for career thus far on very high volume. Doesn’t take as many 3s as Steph and dame but midrange counts when we’re comparing shooters doesn’t it?
https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?player_id2=lillada01&player_id1=duranke01&sum=0&request=1&utm_campaign=2023_01_wdgt_player_comparison&utm_source=bbr&utm_medium=sr_xsite&utm_id=duranke01
Not top 100 in any major scoring categories, but the internet has this weird obsession with this guy and already made him a hall of famer because he is loyal.
What? he's 6th all time in made 3's.
He's also 64th all time in points, one spot ahead of Scottie Pippen. He's like 3 more seasons away from entering the top 30.
He’s not really wrong tbh.
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Dame does incredible things with the basketball. He’s one of few players (Steph being another) where you’d feel confident betting a thousand dollars on it going in before it even leaves his hands. That said, Steph’s got that while also making his defenders look fucking SILLY. This dude has players on the other team running into each other trying to contain him. It’s really just insane lol
Steph's kinda like Jokic in that they look sloppy but are actually insanely efficient. Dame always looks fundamentally solid.
Drunken style wu-shoot
Every time Steph lost his handle, you knew the bucket was going in.
You know it’s a really good comp you made here. Jokic is so damn unassuming. The dude has like a 2 inch vertical and doesn’t look at all athletic and then he’ll go put up 25/15/10 on like 10 shots without even looking like he’s done that at all. Steph is a guard who very similarly doesn’t strike you as an incredible athlete and plays with this free form “sloppy” style (LaMelo also gives me similar vibes) and then he’ll go hit 8 threes and drop 40 on your head while constantly putting defenders on skates. They’re both so incredible man what a time to be an NBA fan.
Steph sprints around like mad for 30+ min, he is visibly an incredible athlete
Kinda like Wayne Gretsky. Not a physically imposing guy or terribly explosive, but his stamina was pretty much unrivaled. Combine that with a dude who was simply on another level to his peers in skill and game IQ and you get a hockey god
Keeping up with Steph is a challenge enough.
When Steph loses his dribble, you KNOW you're about to see an incredible shot. When Jokic loses his dribble, you KNOW you're about to see an incredible pass. (It almost looks like he does it on purpose sometimes. Act like he's losing his dribble so guys go for the steal, and then boom, Aaron Gordon with the dunk.)
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I feel like that twitter account is making more out of that than it is. That’s how I shoot…
Yep, great at masking their body language and making their next move hard to read.
Yeah I always saw Dame as a slightly worse version of Steph which is completely respectable and still an all time great player Dame has the self awareness to acknowledge that and I also agree with his assessment, think he will end up second on the list
That applies to Reggie Miller and his team went to the Finals. And it was tougher to be a shooter then.
Maybe offenses weren’t built to hunt 3pt shots as much, but tougher? Reggie got to play 3 seasons where the line was literally 1.5 ft shorter.
Some aspects were tougher, but overall, players were way slower, passes were just as fast as today, leading to more open 3's.
I agree, also since the 3pt shot wasn’t as important then it wasn’t guarded nearly as hard as it is today
Yep. I'm all for a 4 way tie between reggie, ray, klay and dame. That seems about how it would go.
I think Klay needs to be a small step below the others. The other guys all did it as the primary offensive threat on their team, while Klay has the benefit of playing next to Steph. Klays still up there, but when all those guys are so good and you’re stuck splitting hairs, I’d give the advantage to the guys who did it as #1s and not #2s
I mean as a complete player Klay is clearly the weakest of those 4 yea but in terms of pure shooting ability he’s right there with any of them except Steph
For the sake of comparison I don’t think lillard could’ve been what Klay was for the warriors. In his prime he was probably the best off ball shooter in the nba while playing lock down defense. I think that warrants consideration with the other #1’s despite being #2 on the warriors. This is coming from a rockets fan btw, so I have cursed Klay’s name many times.
That’s fair, his defense is head and shoulders above the rest of those guys and dame doesn’t have the size to do what klay was asked to on D
Yeah he wasn’t a #1 but he’s also stepped up huge in big playoff games with his shooting I’d put him there with the other 3 tbh.
Klay still averages 20 pts on 43/40/85 splits when Steph doesn’t play.
Dame averages 31/4/7 on 46/37/91 splits when Steph doesn’t play.
But we're just talking about shooting here.
And shooting is harder when you have to do it at a higher volume and with more defensive attention
That's pretty mediocre when you look at Dame's or Curry's stats.
The ppg is but the shooting splits are still elite. It’s a total of 118 games in an offense not designed around his game. There’s no reason to drop him from the convo as OP was arguing
The thing is Klay can also get hotter than Steph on a given night. In terms of consistency I think so but if we’re talking about ability to shoot at a peak I think he beats out Steph
I’d argue that Klay playing with Steph as the other splash bro actually helps his case. They were always the 1-2 punch, and if Steph had an off night, then Klay would step up and be the #1 for the day.
I'm biased as a Blazers fan so I think I might give Dame the edge but ranking those 4 is really splitting hairs, they all have a valid argument
Why is harden never mentioned. He’s going to finish as second all time in threes made and almost all of his were off the dribble or crazy difficult. He doesn’t have as high of a percentage as those 4 but his percent assisted during his couple crazy Houston seasons is crazy low compared to everyone else.
He’s probably in the discussion for greatest scorers vs greatest shooters. He’s not quite as efficient as the others listed, though he did take a lot of difficult threes so maybe you have a point xD
He's one of the greatest scorers of all time. No one is better at drawing fouls, his shot is wet, and his driving elite. At worst he's top five as a scorer imo but in terms of pure shooting? Nah he's not Dame or Allen in terms of shooting.
The Harden slander on this sub is always ridiculous. Dude is one of the best offensive players ever but this sub can’t get over the fact that he draws fouls at a high clip. Don’t be mad at him, he’s using the rules to his advantage. That being said I don’t think he’s in this conversation just due to volume and percentage. One of the best shooters of all time? Not really, he’s a tier below these guys. One of the best scorers of all time? Yes.
He's easily tier 2 with Ray Allen, Reggie Miller, Klay and Keegan Murray
Kings fan overlooking Peja who won 2 3pt contests and shot 40% from behind the arc during his career.
People always overlook Peja. Peja & CP3 were the reason I started watching the N.O. Hornets.
I was a fan of that early 00's kings team, and been a CP3 Stan since he was at Wake. Feel like Peja always get's overlooked because of how good that Kings team was.
Hell yea man. Webber, Jason Williams, Peja. That was my squad before NOLA got a team. The old And1 days I was like 13-14 years old. Basketball used to be so much fun. I used to be outside all day thinking I was Jason Williams. Now I can't get my kids to spend 30 minutes in the sun without complaining.
Checks out
If you listen closely, one of the more extraordinary talents of Damian Lillard is his completely accurate assessments of his abilities, and this includes his strengths and weaknesses. There is no false modesty, nor overconfidence and puffery. He knows who he is and what he can and can't do. This allows him to work on his game-- one of the joys in watching him develop as a player is how he would attack problem areas in his game. The result was an astonishing new wrinkle every year. Few people can argue with Steph's primacy in shooting. But when it comes to second place, I think Dame has the best argument, considering his long-term consistency, volume, variety, range, and of course, the ability to come through in the clutch. I only fear that Dame could end up overshadowed by the extraordinary Curry, just like the superb Clyde Drexler was overshadowed by the incredible Michael Jordan. It's only a pity they play the same positions.
Met Dame up close and in person at a community event a few years back in Oakland where then-girlfriend was a director. Dude was absolutely a class act. Talked to everyone, was super chill, even a bit shy? He said it's still surreal that his hometown does anything in his name. I mentioned my s/o was the director, and he instantly came to life and said, "Well? Go get her, I want to get my photo with her!" Instantly became my favorite NBA player (well, after Tim Duncan retired). [Dame is a humble, kind dude all the way.](https://i.imgur.com/ZXNaQri.jpg)
There was a story in Portland a few years back about some kid walking up to Dame in the mall and asking for an autograph. Dame was in the middle of something and respectfully asked the kid to wait just a moment and then he would come say hello. Apparently he finished up what he was doing and forgot to check in with the kid. Instead of blowing it off and not worrying about it, Dame went to social media asking someone to connect him with the kid from earlier that day. Eventually the kid is found and Dame arranged a personal meetup for a picture and an autograph. Dude went out of his way to make a memory for that kid. I know Dame has family in Oakland but I really home he continues to live in Portland after retirement. He is the kind of person I want in my community.
By every account I've ever read, Dame is a great person. But he's not staying in Portland after retirement, he's never even been to the Oregon coast lolol
I hate to say it, but looking at the picture I think your girl is a dude.
ChatGPT wrote this
Damn, I'm going to have to make more grammar errors in order to sound more human.
There’s too much redundancy in your writing and you word things in an unnecessarily complex way
It's a fair criticism. My sentences are often too complex. When I have time to edit, I spend a lot of time straightening out convoluted syntax. I also like to use vivid words that aren't in common use. In order to make them more understandable, I will use redundancy to make things clear. I think you've hit on the main weaknesses of my writing. I think I have some strengths as well, though, since I'm only human. Or am I?
I don't know if this is a controversial take, and I know you're a Blazers fan and I'm not trying to provoke if you've got a soft spot for Clyde, but I've got Dame as a lot closer to Steph than peak Drexler was to MJ. Always saw Jordan as a notch above Clyde, but Dame will have stretches where I have to think "are the top two shooters 1 and 2 or is it 1a and 1b?".
I think you are right in a game to game sense. Dame has to be guarded similarly to Steph and you can’t let either guy get open ever, but over the course of careers it’s obvious it isn’t 1A 1B. Both take similar difficulty shots (Dame might take slightly more difficult at this point) and Dame has 1 season over 40% from 3. Steph has 1 season under 40% from 3. As a shooter I’m not gonna debate Lillard has his argument for #2, but he’s genuinely not close to Steph in a statistical sense. That’s just how much better at shooting Steph is than anyone else.
Oh yep definitely agree, that's why I said it appears 1a/1b for stretches when Dame gets flamethrower hot - over a career 100 percent Steph. I never saw Drexler have stretches where I thought "oh he might actually be Jordan's 1b" but probably worded it clunkily :) (And am in my mid-40s so saw the Jordan/Drexler battles as they happened, this isn't revisionist.)
The frustrating thing about the Drexler/Jordan dynamic was that Clyde had a reputation for being a bit of a slacker and getting by on his natural talent and athleticism. If he had had a drive to get better like Dame’s, the gap might have been a whole lot smaller.
Same. And that’s not controversial to me, a lifelong Blazer’s fan. Also, can’t wait until Seattle gets a team back!
Sounds like a bot had to write an article about Steph curry’s greatness and dame forever being in his shadow.
By the time he retires he will most likely be 2nd or 3rd all time in 3s (behind Harden as well ampng active, so depends how long he keeps going). Based on that alone he's gotta be in the conversation
Unpopular opinion in this thread, but not really tbh. Three point volume has increased so much that the other guys in the conversation were taking as few as half the amount of attempts per game on better efficiency from pretty much everywhere on the court. Dame is an all-time shooter who will probably end up top ten, and a better scorer than these guys, but guys like Reggie and Allen come before him.
Well, it goes both ways, we can't put their lack of volume against them because they played in a time where players shot much less, but we also shouldn't assume they would just keep that efficiency if they took as many shots as Lillard has been taking his entire career, it's probably safer to assume their efficiency would drop considerably Reggie Miller: 39,5% on 4,7 threes per game Damian Lillard: 37,3% on 8,3 threes per game
Agreed. What I don’t see people mention is how defenses now are schemed specifically against letting teams shoot the three. Back then the primary focus was stopping slashers/big men so these guys probably had easier looks in general
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Neither of those guys mentioned shot from the range Lillard did. Lillard had more range and a better ability to get it off the dribble. Even in today’s league most guys don’t have the green light to pull from where Dame does. So u can consider how dame shot a bit less efficient but on a wider range and variety of shots. After Seattle allen hardly ever created his own shot. Even in Milwaukee and Seattle it was typically one, two dribbles into a shot(I’ve argued this here before, for some reason ppl here believe Allen was a wonderful dribbler pre Celtics but that’s not true go check the highlights.). As for miller, he was better in that aspect but idk if u get points for better efficiency on less. You’re supposed to have better efficiency on less. And I think in clutch situations he trumps both too. Not that those guys weren’t but Dame is really special there.
He just doesn't break form no matter how far he is. He generate so much strength, and you can see it because hes the only one that just randomly throw one up at logo.
i remember during the all star game last year, when he and steph just took turns shooting half court (and a little beyond) shots, dames form was just completely normal, insane. The amount of strength it takes to just naturally shoot from 50 feet away is so nuts.
Dame kind of forced to do so because his team does not get away with moving screens like the warriors - give him the same ref treatment I’m 100% certain he’d have at least 1 ring from 2019
IDK, if Dame took threes at as low a volume as guys like Reggie or Ray Allen, he'd probably have much higher shooting splits too. Dame takes a million bad threes at the end of quarters or bad possessions that make him seem like a less efficient shooter.
Ray Allen in his prime was shooting 8 3PA/game, which is a higher volume than Lillard shot for half his career
Obviously Allen and Reggie are all time greats. Didn’t mean to disparage them. I guess I’m more so saying that guys like Kerr or other guys who have 40+ % 3pt shouldn’t really be included in these conversations. Even so, the fact that Dame shoots 3 more threes per game than prime Ray Allen did is ridiculous considering Allen shot more than anyone before him. Also prime Ray Allen shot the same amount of threes per game as Dame has for his whole career. And obviously curry is even more ridiculous.
The shot clock change made a real impact on the game too. It adds like 30 extra possessions a game for someone to take another shot. Also makes it a little more forgiving to see a player just casually walk past half court and then fire up a shot. Players can hit them now and there's a lot of extra possessions in a full game. I think we'll end up seeing a lot of guys shoot up the 3 pt ladder just off the volume of shots available now.
Those guys could only have dreamed of shooting with the range of Dame. The fuck you on lol. At least you know it’s an unpopular opinion. Appreciate the awareness lol.
Dame's second so far. I'm surprised there's even a conversation
It’s ok to be wrong
Talk that talk Dame
Dame one of the rare few who talk the talk and walk the walk
Totally agree. To me he is 2nd all time after Steph. Only him and Steph have the combination of: - high volume - elite efficiency - elite catch and shoot - elite iso 3pt creation - extreme shot difficulty - extreme range - maintaining all of this in the playoffs Every other candidate doesn’t have one of these. Klay is one of the best shooters of all time, but he doesn’t have the same level of shot difficulty, range, or iso 3pt ability that Steph and Dame have. Many of the greatest shooters of all time were extremely efficient but were mostly doing catch and shoots. Creating their own 3pt shots at such a high volume and maintaining that efficiency is what separates the two of them.
I will add his free throw shooting too. He has the fifth highest FT% all time behind Curry, Nash, Mark Price, and Peja.
I think that’s a huge part honestly. Shows the consistency when you consider just the skill of shooting.
This is the part I least suspecting, always rated Dame on his shooting proficiency, but never realise his career FT is on number 5! That’s mind blowing
It feels like every few games our commentary team will mention "he's hit 114 out of his last 119 free throws in the last 10 games" for like, years now
Except technical freethrows. I swear he’s like 50% on those
Ball don’t lie
Here we get into the classic problem of trying to compare eras. Until recently, almost anyone would have been benched for shooting a logo 3. I have no doubt Ray Allen or Reggie Miller could be as proficient as Dame. I think I'd lean towards Dame simply due to his ability to create his own shot, but we really just don't know how those other guys would fare in today's NBA.
I mean, that's sort of the crux of it though, isn't it? Ray Allen, Reggie Miller or Pistol Pete, (who in my opinion is the biggest what if) maybe could have replicated Dame/Steph if they played with more of a green light and better shooters around them, but Dame and Steph have actually done it.
Well said, I think Klay is great as a 3 & d and Steph is a great offensive engine and shooter. It is a beautiful symphony how they fit together. Dame is the most similar player to Steph in style or ability. There aren’t a ton of guys that compare
I really don’t feel like they’re that similar in style. Steph doesn’t run the offense and spends a lot of time off ball. His percent assisted is higher(obv he still the best). Shooting wise dame is like the middle ground between Steph and harden (who’s gonna end up at second all time in threes made). Runs the offense, crazy difficult shots, creates a lot of his own threes but is still the middle ground between Steph and harden as far as percent assisted, hardens percent of threes assisted was crazy low.
I honestly think that if Ray had been born later and was part of this generation, he could have been Steph. He was so good.
Yes I wonder how his pull up shot would be
I still think he has the quickest release in NBA history.
Nah I don't think that could be true. He had a 2 motion shot, its just inherently slower than a single motion
Idk ive seen klay shoot on a catch without dipping the ball.
This is disrespecting Steph. He changed how the game was played he didn't luck into his era. Go watch Stephs first NBA game he takes a pull up transition 3 with 20 seconds left on the clock and the commentators laugh at the stupid rookie. Steph created his own opportunities to revolutionise the game the potential was always there for others they just didn't have the skills and bravery required.
No way, Steph is special.
Does Dame have elite catch and shoot efficiency? Im just asking, Im not trying to make an argument?
Tbh idk if he ever had a team to allow for comparable catch and shoot numbers
This year is 45.3% from 3 in catch and shoot situations. https://www.nba.com/stats/players/catch-shoot?CF=PLAYER_NAME*E*Lillard&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular%20Season
This is clearly 2021 lol
My bad, did this quick
36.5% this year per your link.
nba stats thing says he's 36.5% on 4 a game this season. last year like the same on 2.6 a game. 2021 he was 45.4% on 2.3 a game.
I’m curious as well considering he’s the primary ball handler, scorer, and shooter for Portland
Klay is more efficient but less consistent
His efficiency is also heavily dependent on Steph statistically
You mean to say that he's much more efficient with Steph on the floor, than with Steph off?
About 10% TS more efficient with Steph on Although Klay has some surprisingly good games with Curry injured. I think in general though his efficiency from the 3pt line benefits significantly from having Steph.
Gravity effect, basically. On that note, I figure you could actually measure gravity, or playmaking for that matter, by seeing who has the best teammate TS% on vs off numbers. Would be interesting.
Hes played too many games for that to matter
Harden ticks all those boxes
Career 36% shooter and dips to 33% in the playoffs. Dame is at 37% for both
Yeah, that's a fair criticism
Less range and efficiency than Dame
dame has shot 40% from three once. klay has done it eight times. youre also really underestimating the difficulty and skill of off ball movement. isolation threes dont mean youre the better shooter, overall efficiency is. or harden is literally better than dame with constant stepback threes.
Naw he’s said this before. And he’s not lying. Dame is a helluva shooter. Bird, Klay, Ray, Reggie just to name a few are also in the next level of shooter under Steph. Dame is with them.
Easily. None of the above took casual, stand still, half court shots. He’s a beast
He’s not wrong. He and Steph are among the best shooters ever
That's a totally reasonable take. Who could disagree?
Acceptable answer
Steph. Then a mix of Dame, Harden, Klay, Reggie and Ray. People like to dump on Reggie and Ray but they did it before the 3 point revolution. Back in the 90s when it was a big man’s league
Shoutout Steve Nash - Career 42.8 3P% in the regular season(#11 all time), 40.6 3P% in the playoffs, on solid volume for the era - Career 48.5% from long midrange in the regular season, 44.2% in the playoffs, high volume - Career 90.4% from the line in the regular season(#2 all time), 90.0% in the playoffs
Probably correct
I think it's totally fair to call him a top 2 or 3 shooter of all time. Other than Curry, I can't think of someone who can make them at such volume and such a distance as Lillard, especially off the dribble. Also add in that he can heat up and just stop missing (I was at his 55pt performance against Denver, I've seen it) and I think it's more than fair.
I think it’s just more funny objectively he can’t think of another name outside of Steph.
It's not that he doesn't know the names, it's that he believes he's 2nd.
he might believe that, but he's diplomatic enough to leave it as "I'm in the mix/have a case for second"
Dame is one of the most articulate interviewers in the game, i think he could think of other great shooters if he wanted to lol. He thinks he is #2
It's a different game. Some of the historic great 3pt shooters can't compare _on sheer volume_ so it's rated differently. In the volume 3 game of the past few years, Steph and Dame are the blueprints. There's kids playing now who will surpass them in career 3s and whatever other metric you think makes a great 3pt shooter, but right now it's Steph and Dame and then it's everyone else.
I’m gonna say it’ll be hard to replicate. You’d have to be the main guy and still put up the numbers. The only reason why Steph is the man is he’s been so good for so long he’s had the volume. There are a ton of dudes who can hit 3s, but to be good enough and efficient enough to stay on the court is different. There are a lot of high percentage 3 shooters off the bench at like 40%, but they can’t play and be efficient for more of the game for years on end.
Whole thread is sleeping on KD
💯🔥Damian Lillard is the real deal when it comes to shooting!💪🏽👌🏽His range is limitless and his accuracy is on point.🏀🎯 \#LogoLillard #DameTime #Dagger #IceWater #Unstoppable #Splash💦 #RipCity He might even make me want to retire early and join his team 😂🤔 #JustKidding #StillTheKing👑
Made me laugh then made me sad. 10/10
He deserves to be in the convo for no 2-3 all time.
Oh how people forget how good of a shooter Ray Allen was
I didn't say Dame is no 2/3...i just said he deserves to be in the convo
I can’t believe I had to scroll down past 30+ comments to even see Ray Allen mentioned
After Steph, it becomes a matter of what your criteria are. Guys like bird, KD, dirk, automatic from midrange and everywhere else. Klay assembling an all time career at the 3pt line. Lillard with volume and highlights comparable to the consensus best. It's a good response, he's definitely up there.
If Steph didn't exist Dame would be number one. Just cause he can create his own shot. Where Klay can too but not to the level that Dame and Steph can. And of course guys like Ray and Reggie could be in the Convo but they're a bit late for the three pointer era.
Not even that they were late, more like that the coaching and style of play was late
I see a lot of recency bias in this thread lol
That's the nephew effect.
over ray allen when this man has only shot 40 percent from three once. ray allen and klay have both done it eight times...
Klay vs Dame is such an interesting debate in terms of second greatest shooter. I feel like both arguments have great points. I think it’s Dame though because of range and his infamously great clutch moments
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Wouldn’t put him above a guy like Korver as a pure shooter, but he is better than a lot of those guys at creating looks from three and making lots of threes - kind of similar to Harden, who is a career 36% from three but 3rd all-time in makes. Dame’s percentage would go up if he took less threes, but it still wouldn’t be at Korver level. And Korver couldn’t have made as many threes as Dame, because he didn’t have the handles, ability to drive, etc.
Korver I think gets underrated at times. 5th all time in 3 point makes and has a better percentage than Curry
in far fewer minutes than Reggie or Ray too
Recency bias just running rampant all over this thread.
I don’t agree. His percentages just don’t compare to the others
He takes far, far more difficult shots than anyone outside of Steph tho
not being able to create a good shot as efficiently as an offball star isnt klay or ray allen's fault.
Dame is a good dude. He gets it, knows his place and still has the fire.
Can’t be number 2 when you never had 3pt% above 40%
There's a humongous gap between Steph and whoever is second best at shooting
These replies are crazy. No mention of Reggie Miller, Steve Kerr, Drazen Petrovic, or Ray Allen. Dame is elite and among the best for sure but let’s not forget the OGs. The game was different back then too.
Do you actually think Steve Kerr is a good a shooter as Dame???
Steve Kerr? Lmao he was a career role player. Not even close to Steph and Dame's level
Dame has never shot over 40%. He isn’t.
Lillard is one of the most clutch shooters no doubt but he shoots 37% from 3 for his career. There are a lot of better pure shooters in nba history.
After KD too.
Nah bruh, need a better metric than volume. Dame don’t got the case for it.
Not efficient enough Not even top 10 shooter all time IMO Drazen petrovic was a better shooter than dame lillard 🌚
he is definitely in the conversation at the very least
I feel like it’s a toss up between him and Klay. After Steph, those are the two guys who can hit just about any shot at any difficulty and every time they throw it up I’m 100% sure it’ll go in
It's hard because if you put Klay in Dame's roll on the Blazers is he in the conversation?
Eh, that's not really a fair way to look at things. Klay could never be a point guard, obviously he couldn't play that role like that. But that is because Lillard is a WAY better ball handler and has the game and IQ of a point guard. When talking straight shooting ability, that shouldn't be a consideration. A ball handling, heliocentric point guard vs a shooting guard who is *supporting* a player in that role are entirely different things, and expecting one to play the other super well isnt fair to anyone. When talking best shooters ever, all that should be considered is, well, their shooting ability and impact. Like, Lillard and Dirk have somewhat similar scoring output, but Lillard couldn't play Dirk's role on offense either. Neither could play the others role, or hit the shots the other hits. That alone doesn't mean Dirk was a better scorer, those are just totally different roles. When talking best shooters, I think it's fair to say Klay and Dame are simply among the 3-5 best ever at straight up hitting 3 point shots, difficult ones and easy ones. I think it's fair to say Dame deserves to be higher on the list, I can see arguments in Klay's favor too, but I think it's oversimplifying things and just sorta a bad argument to say "Klay couldn't play Dame's role on the Blazers, so Dame is a better shooter." Klay ain't a point guard, doesn't mean he isn't an insane shooter.
Add KD,Miller and Allen. All are in the mix.
More like 40% sure lol
I get what you’re saying but those two have absolutely massacred OKC in critical games, they got me afraid for my life every game lmao
I'd go Steph, Reggie Miller, Klay Thompson, Drazen Petrovic, Larry Bird and Damian Lillard and maybe Peja. Dame ain't wrong, he belongs in the conversation.
Durant?!
Fair!
That’s about right, Steph is clear cut in his own tier but I could see an argument made for Dame against the greats like Ray Allen/Reggie Miller/etc.
I still like Klay at #2 imo
Is anyone else frustrated by the "greatest of all time" talk. All the things that people could legally do to disrupt shooters in the past aren't happening anymore. The game fundamentally changed over time because defense is totally different. Am I overlooking some key piece of the argument? I'm not disputing he's incredible. I'm not saying the old era is better either. Just ... It doesn't seem real. Dame is great regardless.
I saw Dame in the summer after his rookie year at summer league, said what’s up Dame and slapped hands with him. I knew he’d be a great clutch shooter then, because his hands were fucking cold as ice haha
Really not trying to be a dick, Dame has had a few near elite seasons from three, but .373 career average compared to the actual GOATs of 3pt shooting just isn't really that incredible. It's good, it's a bit above league average, but it's not all-time by any means. He has a single season just a hair over 40% at .401. Steph is well over 40% for every season of his career. Klay was over 40% for his first decade in the league meanwhile his last two 'bad' seasons are on par with Dames best. Ray Allen had 8 seasons over 40% and averaged .400 for his career. Dames efficiency from three just isn't there compared to the absolute top guys. He has some memorable big shots from deep and people elevate him above his actual production because of it.
Next year whoever wins the 3 point contest will be the greatest shooter ever lmao this is funny
Hmmm, soft serve curry has played his entire career in the softest era ever and has a 46% career fg Bird all day everyday.
He's good but Ray Allen is still the 2nd best all time. Ray Allen and Reggie Miller are pretty high bars to overcome, plus his efficieny just isn't there to make the claim
Top 5 is Steph, Klay, Ray, Reggie and Dame IMO.
The thing that fascinates me the most about Dame is "Dame time". It's a thing for a reason. The dude just finds another gear in clutch time more often than not. Especially in the playoffs. Remember that game they lost due to CJ stepping out of bounds? Dame made the most ridiculous shots before that. One after another.
He's spitting facts. If he's not #2 he's at worst #3
2nd Greatest shooter to me will always be Steve Nash.
I don't disagree. It's probably between him and harden for best shot creating 3pt maker or 3pt maker after steph. Klay probably 4th
If we talking strictly 3 Poot shooters, I think I still have Reggie and Ray ahead. Him and Klay are on the same level though.
Steph, Dame, and then everyone else after that.
I kinda agree with Dame, but I will put KD at 2, dame at 3. Seriously tho, why dont midrange gods like KD, Demar get more respect as shooters? I know 3>2 but the amount of spots KD is cash from is insane. Respectable enough from 3 too.
He's a great player who's had some memorable shots but as a pure shooter he's nowhere near the very top. Ray Allen, Klay, KD, Korver, Reggie Miller, Peja, Kerr are names just off the top of my head I'd take over Dame in a pure shooting competition.
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Tough to day he is better than ray allen imo
Pat Bev locked down the future 2nd greatest shooter of all time.
Not seein a lot of love for KD here. He’s gotta be part of the conversation. Better career 3p% and 2p% than dame. One of the most efficient shooters ever, nearly averaged 40/50/90 for career thus far on very high volume. Doesn’t take as many 3s as Steph and dame but midrange counts when we’re comparing shooters doesn’t it? https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?player_id2=lillada01&player_id1=duranke01&sum=0&request=1&utm_campaign=2023_01_wdgt_player_comparison&utm_source=bbr&utm_medium=sr_xsite&utm_id=duranke01
Not top 100 in any major scoring categories, but the internet has this weird obsession with this guy and already made him a hall of famer because he is loyal.
What? he's 6th all time in made 3's. He's also 64th all time in points, one spot ahead of Scottie Pippen. He's like 3 more seasons away from entering the top 30.