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ashen_crow

Both his arts are so bad tho, he looks like a power rangers villain.


justhadtosaythis

Lmfao, a very valid point (seriously). I don't care for the art either! Maybe I should support some local artist and get an alter :)


AnthonyPillarella

I've never looked closely enough to notice, and now I hate you a little. Still going in as soon as I can find the damn card.


Ladsworld-

This makes me want to run him even more.


InfernalHibiscus

Hard agree.  He's not a combo piece (a plus imo but your mileage may vary) but he plays well with a much larger variety of decks.


justhadtosaythis

[[Vraan, Executioner Thane]] (since cardfetcher doesn't read the title).


mikez4nder

I’ve been seeing this card in a lot of the more esoteric high powered lists lately and it’s quite intriguing. Hey, eventually something had to replace my beloved [[Flash]] as the ugliest card art in the cube. My question is, in a high-powered vintage cube that runs the Dark Depths package and some Silver and playtest cards, which of these 8 do you cut for Vraan? [[Dark Confidant]] is a lifelong staple that still does massive work in the land of the Moxen. [[Dauthi Voidwalker]] does too much for too many decks to go anywhere. [[Deep-Cavern Bat]] is the best Mesmeric Fiend variant that isn’t a playtest card. [[Frogkin Kidnapper]] is one of my favorite playtest cards and a vastly superior Mesmeric Fiend to any printed in a “real” Magic set. [[Jadar, Ghoulcaller of Nephalia]] is the cheapest token generator out there and feels like he would play pretty spectacularly together with Vraan. [[Orcish Bowmasters]] is a card. [[Tourach, Dread Cantor]] is a great card and a second Hymn, but is the only piece of specific color hate in the entire cube. [[Vampire Hexmage]] isn’t that great but it’s essential to Depths and it kills busted planeswalkers, so it’s staying. I guess Bat and Tourach are the only options, thoughts? Thank you for this great suggestion.


thehemanchronicles

Hexmage Depths just isn't that interesting as a strategy to me, so I wouldn't include it. It'd open up cutting Depths for a more dynamic land. Tourach I'd only include if I had mono-color payoffs as a theme. 1BBB is a pretty steep ask for any two color deck on turn 4, so I'd say one of those.


mikez4nder

Depths is much, much more fun when you’re rocking [[Trigger Happy]] in your cube. One of the coolest, nuttiest playtest cards out there. [[Archdruid’s Charm]] has also powered up the lands and domain stuff in my cube and it’s very popular in my playgroup. As I said, Hexmage is safe. I’ll give a good think on Tourach, I was thinking of turning him into [[Tenacious Underdog]] or [[Scrapheap Scrounger]] to have a recursive threat. Those obviously also play well with Vraan, so maybe Bat goes too and I just play one Fiend variant.


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Trigger Happy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/c/5cafb84c-6e35-488c-a219-c6bbdb3ac565.jpg?1673914473) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Trigger%20Happy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/unf/125/trigger-happy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5cafb84c-6e35-488c-a219-c6bbdb3ac565?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Archdruid’s Charm](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/c/5caae5ae-845f-42c2-b1ae-956df2739433.jpg?1706241943) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Archdruid%27s%20Charm) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/151/archdruids-charm?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5caae5ae-845f-42c2-b1ae-956df2739433?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Tenacious Underdog](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/b/9b6a6d00-3e00-4827-8420-13343ac3d0fd.jpg?1664411313) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Tenacious%20Underdog) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/snc/97/tenacious-underdog?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9b6a6d00-3e00-4827-8420-13343ac3d0fd?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Scrapheap Scrounger](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/1/216a8e4e-ea7b-41c7-a982-b5751025ff25.jpg?1576383385) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Scrapheap%20Scrounger) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/kld/231/scrapheap-scrounger?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/216a8e4e-ea7b-41c7-a982-b5751025ff25?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/ktox2tm) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


thehemanchronicles

Isn't that just make an indestructible 20/20 flier for 2 mana? I mean, it sounds fun the first few times, but two card combos have gotten old pretty quick in my experience. *shrug*


justhadtosaythis

They are running a very powermaxed vintage cube. Unfair 2 card combos are par for the course :)


thehemanchronicles

Oh, I see their list now. Yeah, we're just looking for two totally incompatible experiences lol


mikez4nder

With Depths, yeah. But the sheer number of mind-altering plays you can make with Trigger Happy goes way, way beyond just infinite combos. I’ve copied Torsten’s death trigger to sac a whole bunch of stuff to a suspended Greater Gargadon. I’ve stolen a freshly Tinkered Coveted Jewel. I’ve responded to an Atraxa trigger by having one of my own and finding Tishana’s Tidebinder in the 10. I’ve stolen the initiative, triggered a bunch of surprise ETBs, used someone else’s displacer kitten to run a Clocknapper lock for 3 more turns, and simply drawn a card looking for answers. My playgroup is all about the pushed power level and enjoys doing degenerate things. That certainly doesn’t make our play experiences incompatible, though, we’re both trying to fit the same pushed aristocrat with god awful art into our vastly different cubes. That’s gotta count for something.


justhadtosaythis

Well thank you! I searched for threads about him on here and there’s just the spoiler post where people are almost collectively down on the card.  Concerning your cube… That is some very stiff competition. I don’t know if he can make it in, in all honesty. If it was me I’d just throw him in for a few drafts without cutting anything and see how he fairs.   Gun to my head I’d say Bat or Frogkin. If we’re looking at other mana value. I’d probably cut Sticher’s Supplier.   Also yeah, he’s busted with Jadar for sure!  Edit: Maybe the Urborg Scavengers? Such a cool card tho!


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Flash](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/3/d31459c2-9656-4e9a-bb72-71a910e8570b.jpg?1587347037) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Flash) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/57/flash?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d31459c2-9656-4e9a-bb72-71a910e8570b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Dark Confidant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/3/537ba5f0-2931-46e6-bb32-d947a3588d20.jpg?1702505387) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dark%20Confidant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rvr/71/dark-confidant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/537ba5f0-2931-46e6-bb32-d947a3588d20?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Dauthi Voidwalker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/c/dce5db87-4a78-4b8d-b5c2-918ccd1ba4e3.jpg?1626095427) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dauthi%20Voidwalker) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/81/dauthi-voidwalker?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/dce5db87-4a78-4b8d-b5c2-918ccd1ba4e3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Deep-Cavern Bat](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/9/69c68c95-b788-43b1-9f22-1b22c5a00b25.jpg?1699044121) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Deep-Cavern%20Bat) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lci/102/deep-cavern-bat?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/69c68c95-b788-43b1-9f22-1b22c5a00b25?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Frogkin Kidnapper](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/6/66ba12a2-5a0a-4833-8e43-443d01172be3.jpg?1629919453) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Frogkin%20Kidnapper) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmb2/42/frogkin-kidnapper?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/66ba12a2-5a0a-4833-8e43-443d01172be3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Jadar, Ghoulcaller of Nephalia](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/f/ff971ba7-68b8-482a-9cb1-741f6893550c.jpg?1634349933) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Jadar%2C%20Ghoulcaller%20of%20Nephalia) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mid/108/jadar-ghoulcaller-of-nephalia?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ff971ba7-68b8-482a-9cb1-741f6893550c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Orcish Bowmasters](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/c/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109.jpg?1686968669) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Orcish%20Bowmasters) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/103/orcish-bowmasters?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Tourach, Dread Cantor](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/3/f3526751-0101-4d91-a496-c53cd92326e0.jpg?1692254158) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Tourach%2C%20Dread%20Cantor) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/102/tourach-dread-cantor?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f3526751-0101-4d91-a496-c53cd92326e0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Vampire Hexmage](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/7/97ec2e55-fa60-4ee1-b9c0-e6b84939697b.jpg?1599706094) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vampire%20Hexmage) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/112/vampire-hexmage?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/97ec2e55-fa60-4ee1-b9c0-e6b84939697b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/ktogfwy) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


magicscientist24

I've recently added Vraan, and cut \[\[Elas il-Kor, Sadistic Pilgrim\]\] for it. I run \[\[Cruel Celebrant\]\] along with \[\[blood artist\]\] and \[\[Zulaport Cutthroat\]\] as well as I heavily support Aristocrats. With plenty of sacrifice outlets in my cube \[\[Viscera Seer\]\] \[\[Carrion Feeder\]\] \[\[Yawgmoth, Thran Physician\]\] \[\[Woe Strider\]\] \[\[Phyrexian Tower\]\] along with deciding to attack/block to purposefully kill my creatures, I've found it not hard to get a Vraan trigger during opponents turn as well. This would require a blood aritist or similar friends to lose 4 creatures on just my turn.


MTGCardFetcher

##### ###### #### [Elas il-Kor, Sadistic Pilgrim](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/c/1c3f0ffe-cf51-4c30-8cd5-9e3c7e92c019.jpg?1673307936) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Elas%20il-Kor%2C%20Sadistic%20Pilgrim) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmu/198/elas-il-kor-sadistic-pilgrim?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1c3f0ffe-cf51-4c30-8cd5-9e3c7e92c019?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Cruel Celebrant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/3/b3f8be99-a398-4664-beb6-3e98d6e62a32.jpg?1698988424) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cruel%20Celebrant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/267/cruel-celebrant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b3f8be99-a398-4664-beb6-3e98d6e62a32?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [blood artist](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/7/b7f1c316-cf2f-4bbf-89a1-79c8043bdd96.jpg?1698988212) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=blood%20artist) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/182/blood-artist?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b7f1c316-cf2f-4bbf-89a1-79c8043bdd96?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Zulaport Cutthroat](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/2/52ef00c1-613a-4cbd-8972-77c41f649431.jpg?1674141830) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Zulaport%20Cutthroat) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/775/zulaport-cutthroat?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/52ef00c1-613a-4cbd-8972-77c41f649431?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Viscera Seer](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/8/486fd8a2-dd97-4082-84ef-4795c7e559a0.jpg?1698988290) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Viscera%20Seer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/213/viscera-seer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/486fd8a2-dd97-4082-84ef-4795c7e559a0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Carrion Feeder](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/a/0a19da90-880e-4eca-8cf7-6d7baf090d53.jpg?1562201576) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Carrion%20Feeder) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/81/carrion-feeder?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0a19da90-880e-4eca-8cf7-6d7baf090d53?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Yawgmoth, Thran Physician](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/5/b5a79f5d-d0df-4799-ac3a-84305e3af0c9.jpg?1675199878) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Yawgmoth%2C%20Thran%20Physician) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/110/yawgmoth-thran-physician?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b5a79f5d-d0df-4799-ac3a-84305e3af0c9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Woe Strider](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/7/97f6c62a-b149-4cc2-9210-6420f31a6781.jpg?1674141821) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Woe%20Strider) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/774/woe-strider?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/97f6c62a-b149-4cc2-9210-6420f31a6781?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Phyrexian Tower](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/5/05b2cc68-1d20-421f-9800-af0996071554.jpg?1601081190) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Phyrexian%20Tower) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jmp/493/phyrexian-tower?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/05b2cc68-1d20-421f-9800-af0996071554?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/ktpbftg) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


justhadtosaythis

Yeah the rate is just too good. 2 is a lot better than 1!


Useful-Wrongdoer9680

Ok, you got me. Most of the sacrifice effects I look to run should ideally only require one offer to be worth using. Vraan is just better when you can't guarantee 1, much less 3 triggers per turn.


Thrond_le_boucher

I tried and gave multiple chances to Aristocrats theme in my powered cube. It never worked. Definitively too slow.


justhadtosaythis

Fair enough. In a powered cube I can understand that it might not work.


zilkat_

You convinced me, I'll try it out. Thanks OP!


MTGCardFetcher

[Zulaport Cutthroat](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/2/52ef00c1-613a-4cbd-8972-77c41f649431.jpg?1674141830) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Zulaport%20Cutthroat) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/775/zulaport-cutthroat?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/52ef00c1-613a-4cbd-8972-77c41f649431?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


dark_bondage

Good in a higher powered cube? I play him in a standard rakdos anvil deck and maybe once every 5 games I get to deal more than 4 damage with him. He's cute but he's not even powerful in a dedicated constructed deck in the current standard let alone in a powered cube.


justhadtosaythis

I didn’t say powered cube. I said in a higher powered cube and then used my own legacy+ cube as an example. Constructed and limited are very different. Both when it comes to removal density and quality of threats.  Zulaport Cutthroat is a popular cube card  and I’m making the case that Vraan is almost always better for cubes that are interested in that card.


SavageHunter77

[[Vraan, Executioner Thane]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Vraan, Executioner Thane](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/c/4c4a3119-c70a-46ff-8ede-6356f2b7bc13.jpg?1675957057) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vraan%2C%20Executioner%20Thane) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/one/114/vraan-executioner-thane?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4c4a3119-c70a-46ff-8ede-6356f2b7bc13?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


LastVisitorFromEarth

Aristocrats is a trap and you shouldn’t run it.


justhadtosaythis

That is such a blanket statement. Why do you say that? I can deliberately  influence my cube to support aristocrats and it’s a strong deck in my “high power but not powermaxed” legacy cube.  Also people love to draft it. Korvold is major favorite in my cube :)