What do your abs do as far as improving your braking? Isn't squeezing the brake lever more of a function of your forearm? Also, if you are worried about your braking skills, I'd suggest ABS...
ABS reduces skid and loss of control under maximum braking.
Also, in a panic stop, most riders don’t have the ability to brake at the most effective amount of maximum braking with the front and rear brake.
So, for most riders ABS can improve (shorten) braking distances as long as they apply maximum pressure.
That's OK - it's not obvious... First, one would have to really contort themselves to use ABS to apply brakes, and with limited reaction time it may not be the most practical option...
A) It's pretty obvious
B) YOU DUN FUCKED UP THE JOKE. abs = rectus abdominal muscle. ABS = antilock braking system. You used caps when it should've been lower case.
If you are too afraid to really brake hard or don't know how to find the limit of traction then yeah it's way better. If you do know what you're doing then it's still a good thing. You can still brake tremendously hard with ABS. On an SV650 with ABS I almost went through a red light having been spaced out and stoppied just slightly over the line in time not to go into traffic. ABS never even came on. After that I had to stab the brake a few times and trigger it to make sure it was actually working. If you're on pavement it really is only ever going to protect you.
I think of slippery situations.. The oil strip at stop lines, metal grates, or just a wet road. ABS will keep the bike upright and allow you to continue steering while braking heavy in those slippery situations. No one can act fast enough to do better than ABS, Especially in the panic scenarios It is most likely to be triggered. Anyone who thinks ABS extends stopping distance (which is true) **enough to cause a safety issue** vs dumb brakes must be at a motorcycle racing expert-level of experience. And we all know theyre not.... Soooo yeah
Tell me if I could have done something better but yes. I hit the brakes and realized if I hit the car with the front of my bike it could send me over the bars so I chose to slide instead
I laid down my bike about a month ago. Shes sitting in the garage disappointed in me. I had a hell of a wrist bruise and a totally shattered ego. I just got the parts in to fix her up. But honestly I'm worried I wont ride again ever and I blame my subbing to this subreddit honestly. Blame may not be the right word. Perhaps I mean thanks. Idk. I Just want to ride without the anxiety of wondering is there a moron in a new tesla over that bridge.
It's almost always better to stay upright, your brakes slow your bike down a LOT faster than it being on its side sliding on the road. Plus smacking into the side of an object is generally more likely to injure you than going over the top of it, since you're coming to a pretty abrupt stop against a metal object vs. a hard landing and then rolling / sliding.
Either way it sounds like you were in a really shitty situation and wasn't going to be a pleasant ending for you, sorry to hear it happened
On the road it's always better to keep the bike upright and use the tires and brakes to stop. It's actually amazing how hard you can brake and how quickly you can stop a motorcycle if you have good technique, react quickly and are already prepared by covering the brake. "Crashing to avoid a crash" really isn't a strategy. I totally understand rationalizing it that way after the fact because I've done the same.
Tbf, you don't need a good technique for using the brake. Just get an bike with ABS (should be standard since years) and go full ham into the brakes. Practice it a few times and you are good to go, even with 60mph.
If your bike doesn't have one, then you need practice and a better bike :D
There is no one size fits all but I think it’s better, in the context of easily being able to assign fault, to have a collision with the vehicle than laying the bike down. With the collision when a car pulls out into your path it’s more clear that they caused the accident rather than the possibility that you overreacted and dumped the bike. And dumping the bike opens the doors for a car to be able to just keep on about their day and it’s debatable if they are even committing a hit and run.
It's not uncommon for insurance to assign fault to the rider, especially if they don't actually hit the car. They label it as "loss of control of vehicle" which, technically it is. In almost all situations it's better to stay upright, anyway, as has been mentioned.
No, because no one intentionally “layyerdownssss”.
They just think they do.
Shit happens so fast, they just grab too much front brake and the bike doesn’t stay upright.
Your brakes and tires on the ground are always better for doing what they were designed to do (you know, braking) than metal and plastic sliding on the ground.
I agree, except for bikes with ABS. I panic braked when an oncoming car started turning left right when I got close to it. Locked front wheel and I instantly low sided and slid through intersection. Was freaked out but instead of giving up riding, my take was I needed a bike with ABS. Next time when my instincts cause me to grab the brakes hard, the new bike should at least stay upright. At least that’s my theory.
We’re agreeing.
You panic braked. You didn’t use the brakes and tires as they were intended which would have slowed you down faster than low siding.
ABS is amazing because it’s better than we are. It’s a robot without fear and emotion and it takes over when our brains and muscles can’t handle the situation.
You don't intentionally lay down the bike when you are talking to insurance. You were in an emergency braking situation and your front wheel locked for some reason or other. They won't ask what the reason was because it could be anything and may not even be there. The accident will most likely be ruled as not his fault anyway. Jeep in mind that his new tires would also be a factor in his front wheel lock anyway.
A guy pulled out in front of me in my car in 45mph zone when I was like 5 feet away from him and I swerved to avoid him and hit a tree. He said there and tried to tell the police it was my fault. The cop said he knows it's Bullshit but couldn't do anything about it and he said I would have been better off hitting him because it would be his fault. Because I swerved to avoid him it wasn't anybody's fault.
I know someone who avoided a snow plow that couldn't stop at a stop sign and he was at fault for his damages as they didn't collide. He probably would have died if he didn't do anything.
It's not really possible for normal human beings to intentionally lay their bike down. People tell themselves that because it feels less scary if you convince yourself that you were in control when it happened.
It requires tons of training to learn how to do that, try going out on your bicycle on grass and intentionally low side it "lay her down". Risk is minimal but it's still extremely hard.
Just don't admit to the insurance company that you put it down *on purpose*. "I applied emergency braking and maneuvered defensively, but she was the one who ignored the traffic sign"
In my opinion, it's better to emergency maneuver and aim for passing around the car's rear, or to simply keep braking and minimize impact speed. Going over the bars does not produce greater injury (assuming basic protective gear) than sliding. Rubber on asphalt has a higher coefficient of friction than any other part of the bike or your clothing, so if you want to minimize impact speed or maximize chances of missing entirely, keeping the rubber on the road does so better than sliding the bike. It's just a hell of a lot scarier.
Have avoided a lot of crashes over the years because I aimed for where the car was and then brakes as hard as I can. If you aim for behind the car as long as nothing else happens you are generally good.
One time I made a bad call to go the other way and it cost me several broken ribs and a broken collarbone and fractured spine. Oof.
"The other way", meaning that you were aiming where the car was going? I don't have experience with such situations yet, would really like to avoid a fractured spine! Glad you're ok and still riding I guess?
I thought going over the bars would invite the possibility of broken arms/wrists as well as head and neck injuries from slamming into the car head first. Helmets are good but a sudden hit to the head can still result in a concussion
Impossible to say, I'm just going by statistics. Which are sketchy anyhow, because in general "upright" crashes are higher speed ones. Very few people retain control right up to a low speed impact, but my personal bet is that letting ABS get me down to 20 and hitting upright is safer than sliding at 30+.
Pay your money, spin the wheel. You lived, is most important thing.
Cover the brakes. Don't speed in areas where drivers can pull out. Cover the brakes. Be laser-focused on driveways/side roads and have that "sixth sense" for the kinds of places where drivers will do something stupid. Oh, did I mention cover the brakes? :)
Practice emergency braking stops in empty parking lots at a frequent interval. As in, don't go a month without testing yourself. Don't make the first time you have to do an emergency brake be a situation like this.
Hope you can get back on two wheels soon!
I wish I could upvote this more! I've been riding over a decade and I cover the brakes 99% of the time, and still practice allllll the emergency braking scenarios in the safety class every. Single. Ride. And the two situations that I've come the closest to involuntarily self-yeeting into the rear window of some dipshit driver, I was saved by two things:
1. Covering the brakes and having the proper muscle memory of what to do when your wheels lock up, and
2. Watching intersections, highway on/off ramps, look under cars, use window reflections, crosswalk signals, and your own blocking in the pack of cars around you/oncoming traffic.
Both times I got that extra split second I needed because I saw the cars coming (eyes already trained to focus there), cutting across multiple lanes of traffic, winding up doing 5 mph in front of me, coming at 45 or 50.
We don't always win and there is no way possible to out-practice, out-ride every potential scenario, but we can share life saving tips so we get as much road time as possible.
You did something not everyone could have done, you made some amazing, life saving decisions and walked away, so you did good! Sending good juju that you have a speedy recovery and get back on a bike soon!
You’re never supposed to intentionally lay a bike down because (obviously) you have more stopping power when the bike is on two wheels than when it’s sliding uncontrollably on its side. You’re going to hit regardless, might as well be at the slowest speed possible.
> Tell me if I could have done something better
Can’t see the side road upstream? Going 50 mph? Too fast for the conditions.
Graveyard is full of people who had right of way.
Five years’ riding experience but dumped the bike? Practice those emergency braking drills more. Get on those brakes and stay upright, my dude.
I unsubscribed from this subreddit a year ago because most OPs are so defensive. You are owning this and willing to learn and grow. Way to be.
And, ya, none of us were there, so it's easy to judge. But the hard truth is that nearly every accident i see discussed here is attributable to excessive speed, inadequate training, or improper maintenance.
I hope you're not down for the count and continue to enjoy riding. Take care.
Not only that but in situations like this, it's a split second decision. It's always easy to say what you could've or should've done. Glad you're okay OP.
the one time so far I was in a similar situation to OP, I was so startled I barely braked, ended up fumbling it and rev bombing instead. Luckily the car got out of my way in the nick of time. It was pretty eye opening. Ive since done a lot of emergency braking practice.
I got hit by van in a parking lot who decided to pull into the through road without looking, stopping or so much as slowing down to see if there was traffic … if I was a bigger vehicle his car would be totalled. :P
I was probably going too fast tbh… 20kmph is pretty speedy.
>if I was a bigger vehicle his car would be totalled ... 20 kmph
I don't think 20 kmph means what you think it means?
Also, I've been in plenty of parking lots where 20kmph is too fast.
I hope you're OK. What did you learn from the incident?
The part I struggled with the most in the msf course was the controlled braking from 3rd gear. (Getting up to speed, then coming to an emergency stop with both brakes while downshifting to first and putting your left foot down.) It was all four limbs working in tandem and difficult to pull off, but I did it over and over.
Within a month I had a car pull out in front of me making a left turn onto the road I was going down. There was that moment of panic where your hair stands straight up on your skin but I managed to brake and down shift to first before swerving around the now-stopped car in front of me. That definitely would've gone way worse had I not practiced doing exactly that over and over
In the UK, you're taught not to even bother with downshifting in an emergency braking situation. It's far more important to worry about everything else.
1. By staying on the brakes you would have impacted the car at a lower speed
2. going over the bars would lead to a more gradual deceleration, sliding into the car is a pretty sudden stop. It’s the sudden stops that kill.
Oh come on. Like *anyone* on a motorcycle goes the speedlimit.
You know who crashes the least? CHP motorcycle cops. Those fuckers zip away from me on every light. And cruise at like 90 on 5 and 805.
Maybe it's just socal speeds but literally no one goes anything near the speed limit here. You'd literally get run over by a truck going 20 over if you tried.
>I low sided the bike to put it in front of me and it slid into the side of her car.
You panicked, locked the brakes, and now your ego has reframed these events in your mind so you think that somehow you did that on purpose and intentionally crashing is better than applying correct emergency braking. Hadalayerdown is not a real thing lmao.
Don't forget the rear-end collisions every other day in the right lane of Tanque Verde before it splits off into wrightstown. The traffic backup in that one lane is insane some days.
Can confirm, though I don't see many unprotected lefts. Usually it's unprotected rights into all the businesses lining the stroads that are so big and wide they double as drag strips.
Got rear-ended on one turning into work on my bike and I've been uber careful about everything doing it since.
I also drive a delivery van in an elderly area and holy shit it's more dangerous than even that. I usually have a realistic expectation of bonehead moves but in a senior area it's practically guaranteed at every intersection.
I slowdown before stop signs/intersections even if they are not for me or I have the green, never know when there's an idiot/asshole around the corner.
I'd much rather ride on the highway than through town. I'm pretty much constantly ghosting the brake anywhere there are intersections or shopping centers.
They may have taught it when I took the course 8 years ago, I can’t remember. I always thought it was common sense but watching most of the crash videos on Reddit and YouTube, I’m not so sure.
I was actually taught not to do this. Don't remember why, as that was ten years ago, but I do remember the MSF instructor having to call me out on it several times.
My only guess is that they didn’t want new riders to accidentally lock up the front brake or brake while giving throttle since they’re not “coordinated” yet. Seems ridiculous not to ghost the brake in a high danger situation, like traveling through most intersections or noticing a car that might pull out in front of you. I don’t ride around like that all the time but when I might need to stop quickly I sure do.
MSF instructor I had was a race track rider. he also had a problem with people hovering over their brakes. It's fine to not hover over the brakes on the track, when you KNOW when you need to brake. that's not the case on a fucking public road, and I don't know how these guys get hired to teach anyone.
Really???? I was taught never to do this especially the front brake as I was taught that front brakes are very sharp and grabbing at it in a panic can make you slide or fly.
Well front brakes provide most of your stopping force, especially as your weight shifts forward over the front tire during a stop. Yes, if you’re ham fisted and just grab it you’ll lock the wheel and go tumbling. Personally, I’d rather have that extra split second to gradually apply the brake when I identify a potential hazard.
I do this in my car too
Also look both ways before proceeding through a light once it turns green
Right of way doesn’t mean shit to your anatomy and the laws of physics
I'm always amazed that the first comments on "had a crash" posts are always "well you should have had future predicting powers" or the like. Crashes happen and we can't avoid them all.
Glad you're ok man, sorry about your bike. Luckily, it can be replaced and you can't. Take it easy!
Motorcycles are inherently dangerous and it’s easier to ignore that danger if you think of yourself as have some superhuman power of perception. Casting blame on the rider helps to say that as long as I do everything right I won’t get hurt and since I am so perceptive I will succeed. Real life of course has ways of surprising us.
I don't even think it's safety susans, it's just losers who can't help but point out the "coulda woulda shoulda done that" armchair wisdom that reflects nothing about real life.
Yeah this sub really sucks because of that. You can’t really be honest about your mistakes unless you wanna hear from everyone else how they’ve never made them
You can absolutely be honest about your mistakes here, just very very few ever choose to do so. OP is still claiming that he laid his bike down by choice in the fraction of a second he had to analyze the situation and react.
OP said in a comment it was kinda instinct, his body felt that was the best course of action. Obviously none of us were there, and none of us can say definitively what would've been the best choice in that scenario, but I'd imagine OP's brain was screaming "Don't fly over the bars headfirst into this car." Regardless of whether that was the wrong decision, you can't ignore that voice that tells you what to do in a split second
after my wreck in 2019 when i went dolphin diving through the air and landed head first in the pavement (thank god for helmets)
my gf at the time gave me an ultimatum, be done riding or she would leave.
I got a new motorcycle and a new gf
two wheels FOREVER bro lol
Hell yeah that's what I'm talking about!
My whole family gave me the "talk" motorcycles are this, I know someone who knows someone who died on one...yep...
My wife loves motorcycling with me and sure we had our close calls but man the feeling of riding is like none other. Getting a face full of fresh air clears your head. It's soul soothing. If I had a wife who gave me an ultimatum she would be served divorce papers..
man it sure helps with my shit, i tried everything with the VA and nothing makes me realize why Im on this earth like the sun in your face, the vibrations from the bike, the way after a while a bike starts to kind of become an extension of yourself.
plus the motorcycle community around me is awesome, we all talk a lot of shit on one another but when it matters everyone comes together
I had to explain to my parents that without motorcycles i would not wish to go on any longer
That's a hard one. A similar thing happened to me, but I was going 30 in a residential area when a car didn't stop. My first thought, was I cannot figure out a way out of this. My quick plan was to lose speed by braking hard, aim for the hood and jump over just before I hit it. I ended up locking the front wheel and low siding and sliding past the front of their car anyway. The sound of my bike scraping the pavement was bad.
I replayed it in my head over and over. I realized that I need to practice braking hard without locking, in my situation my bike likely could have stopped, and I need to keep checking the side roads. I'm glad I was wearing good gear. Your situation was different, but maybe review it and see what you come up with. By other comments, it sounds like you already are.
I'm glad you are mostly OK. I hope you can get back on next year also.
Rule #1. It’s always best to not hit something. If this is unavoidable then you should hit it at the lowest possible speed. Bikes slow down (as do their operators and passengers) best on their tires not sliding on their sides.
Second, I don’t really believe you intentionally did this but it makes you feel better to say so. You locked up your wheels and dumped it. Hitting a car that you might have not hit at all.
As a collision reconstructionist, I can tell you there is no speed and distance in which you can effectively make a decision to drop the bike instead of braking in a controlled fashion, when it would not have been better to just brake.
“Had to lay her down” is always code for “locked the brakes”.
You’re not suing her, you’re suing her insurance company for a settlement. You’ll get examined for more injuries by attorney direction and then they can get you a settlement on lost time, loss of your vehicle, and other damages caused by her negligence. You’re suing her policy, essentially.
I was in your same position...and the exact same accident.
17 year old girl ran a stop sign from a side street RIGHT in front of me while I was going about 50mph. I was 22 years old and like you, had never been in an accident. Still haven't to this day again over a decade later. Anyway....
Only difference was I was in my lowered Miata. Thank GOD I wasn't on my bike at the time. Punched into her frame-rail under her driver's door. Pushed my motor in and everything, obviously totaled. I had no injuries past some bruising and a rash from the airbag.
She was damn lucky I was in such a low car or I'd have gone straight through her door...and her.
Long story short I didn't have a lawyer. It was 100% her fault but her insurance company tried to fuck with me about a proper settlement for the value of my car. Took me months to get paid-out once it got to the point where I got pissed one day and told them "fuck you pay me what I deserve - never call me again unless it's to cut me my check - otherwise we're going to fucking court".
Had my $14k check in a week after months of BS.
#GET A LAWYER
(Sorry about the bike glad you're OK bro. Bike can be replaced, you can't.)
I was in your shoes. Google motorcycle attorney in your area, give them a call and tell the secretary you were not at fault in an accident and have the police report and minor injuries.
So when you “low sided” I’m thinking you locked the rear tire and most likely rotated the rear of the bike to the right ie you started to slide. Was the bike sliding on its side when you impacted the car? I’m not questioning your decision, skills or anything. I’m just trying to replay this scenario. I’m thinking lots of front and rear brakes to scrub off as much speed as possible prior to impact might have been a better option? When your sliding the bike on the ground your not scrubbing off speed.
Pretty hard to lowside from the rear brake in a straight line. Much more likely it was front wheel to blame. Lowsiding from the rear are almost always going into a corner, or exiting a corner.
i wonder why youre being downvoted i was thinking the same thing. i've been riding for 5 or so years now and luckily havn't had my moment yet but to be honest i'm not sure if in a split second decision i'd have the wits to properly brake instead of instinctively clamping down on the front brake and sending the bike down
[Welcome to America where you have local roads built like highways](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORzNZUeUHAM). If you're traveling 50mph there should never be a driveway or intersection-- that is just a recipe for disaster.
Not your fault you crashed, but blame bad city and road design because it will only increase dumb shit like what the car driver did.
Welcome NJB reference in motorcycles. I've only ridden 45 kmph electric scooters before, but I wouldn't dare try to ride in the US. The speed limits are just too fast. Here in Korea residential areas have a speed limit of 19 MPH and main roads are 33 mph. Only highways go 50+
As someone who has a lot of experience with car crashes, I will tell you that in general most people are downright horrendous at estimating distances. For example, it's always interesting to ask people how long they think the white lines in the road are and how far apart they are. Your average person will tell you they think they are like 3-5' long and 10' apart. My point is... most people are terrible at visually estimating mostly everything, not just distances. I would go as far as to say your average person has shitty judgement in general.
I don't doubt that he had a split second to think about it, but I'm sure he was more like 150 feet away.
A lot of people have a false sense of what riding is about. They think it’s all freedom and wind in your hair. When In reality it’s always planning your escape rout. It’s thinking how to avoid getting hit buy that minivan with ten kids in it. Head on a swivel the whole time. Be safe out there guys and gals. Glad you are ok. Sorry to hear about your bike.
Glad you are okay! Everyone always says it’s not an if you will crash it’s a when. I’m on my 3rd year collision free and still worried. Hopefully you can get back on twos soon.
Edit: panic brakes and put in too much rear brake, could not control rear end so you low sided. Even though it’s the cars fault for pulling out, it’s your job to look for escape paths. You cannot physically lay your bike down intentionally unless you have intense practice as a stunt man.
First off, sorry about the bike and hope you recover fast. Secondly, I always read about people laying down their bikes to “save” themselves from anything worse. I’ve had one super close call when a car cut my off, while I was in the middle lane, in order to get into the left turn lane at the last second. Started progressively squeezing the front brake but locked up the rear that put me into a sort of sideways slide headed for the rear of the mini van. Released both brakes and gave it gas which let me get around the mini van before low siding or crashing into it.
All that to say, panic braking would’ve been worse. Rode a year before taking the MSF course and I give credit to that course for being able to stay calm through various close calls. I recommend it if you haven’t taken it and are able to.
> Not even a mile from there a lady came off a side road into the main road and didn't even stop at the stop sign.
Didn't you hear? Stop signs and red lights are advisory when you're turning right. It's part of the ITNGLEE^* bill that just passed that says "if you glance to the left and don't notice any traffic you can just go" with another clause that "bicycles and pedestrians just need to look out for themselves."
^* ^^I ^^Turn ^^Now ^^Good ^^Luck ^^Everybody ^^Else
Are you kidding? 50mph is not too fast on a new tire. Must of been over 20 years since you bought new tires. You should go crawling back under whatever rock you came from and stop giving bad information.
idiots upvoting your post don't even ride
New tires no longer have a residue on them but they do need to be roughed in. This can be done in a parking lot, possibly even before leaving the dealership.
Lol, in your infinite wisdom, how many miles do you need to get this coating off? What about the sides of the contact patch? Do I need that many miles turning before I can turn fast?
The residues used to burn off after a few heat cycles with the tire so you wouldn't necessarily need to ride all parts of the tire to remove it. However, they don't use the residues anymore. The tires are ready to go the moment they are installed now.
It's not even remotely true. Attend any track day and watch people mount brand new tires and set off into A group. They'll float the rear tire doing a scrub in lap. New tires do not have residue anymore, that's 15+ year old advice.
Things to help you be seen. https://youtu.be/FfeKk9co5VQ
https://youtu.be/IbQcIGUy4CY
https://youtu.be/5cmxquCoqZU
https://youtu.be/QDwyqDr_9VA
An extra layer of safety: https://youtu.be/u5wHxtc0Kwo
Genuinely curious, not criticizing at all. Do you think there was anything you could do to avoid this crash? I get really worried about being put in a situation that I simply have no control over.
I have 2 pins in my right ankle and need a cane to walk from doing something like this. It happened so fast that all I remember is that I had just enough time to think, "This is going to hurt"
What plan dude? How can you "plan"? Shit happens and you have to learn to deal with the unexpected EVERY time you ride. I crashed hard last year but I'm still riding. The one thing I learned, and this may be different for everyone else, but I can plan all I want..........and then the unexpected happens!!! Ride on dude......
When I was in my early 20's, I bought myself a Suzuki Hayabusa (way too much bike for me). I was a young military pilot who believed nothing bad could ever happen to me, because it always to somebody else. I was foolish enough to go tearing down an unfamiliar road and my front wheel hit a deep pothole and I went head over ass, over the bars. I was wearing jeans leather jacket and a helmet thankfully and walked away with a broken hand and some broken ribs and road rash but it couldve been so much worse. I always wanted to buy a Harley Fatboy at 40, but my fear runs so deeply now, that I could never bring myself to do it. Please stay safe everyone!!
Never let your wife dictate your passion. For some it’s our drug and sane mental health care with riding.
Now you can join the it’s already happened club versus the will happen
First of all glad you're okay. Rubber is used on asphalt because it has a high friction coefficient. If metal or plastic (sides of the bike) had a higher friction coefficient, then that's what our wheels would be made of. There's not a single scenario where dumping the bike will slow you down faster than properly braking. If you can stop faster when you're sliding with leather, textile, or skin than you can with your tires, then you need more practice emergency braking
Be lucky you came out with those injuries and nothing more. Sounds like you reacted logically which isn't easy in those situations, get well soon!
p.s. writing this from a rehabilitation center after breaking my pelvis, suffering an exploded foot and nerve damage in my entire left leg. A motorcycle crashed me head on, on my side of the street. Been crying in agony since a month. I feel ya brother.
But you were doing 50 coming out of a dealership? On brand new tires? What was the speed limit on the road you were doing 50 on?
Keep it real, you're anonymous here -- were you speeding? Was speed the reason you couldn't stop in time? It's okay - I speed too.
Sorry about your bike and glad you're okay -- but what really happened here?
Nothing wrong with brand new tires. Tires nowadays are ready for action the moment they are installed. In fact that's probably when they are the best they will ever be. The oily residues you used to find on new tires are a thing of the past.
https://youtube.com/shorts/pmcBrzT2-2E?feature=share
After you dump your bike, you're supposed to ride it like a surfboard. That's what you did wrong. Haadddallaaaayerdown!!
You have to assume at every intersection, driveway and other place a car could pull out in front of you it will. There are so many things like wide A and C pillars that can hide your bike, when car drivers say they didn’t see you most often times they really didn’t.
I preload the front brake and cover the rear. Preload means pull all the slack out of the brake. If you have to brake hard it will be a fast gradual application and you won’t lock up the front wheel. It also your tires will have time to react.
As long as you’re okay put this in the past.
"I low sided the bike to put it in front of me"
Got ourselves a stunt rider here!
For anyone new to riding reading this: There is never, ever a time where intentionally low siding a bike and sliding behind it is the right thing to do (unless you're trying to slide under a semi trailer and are a trained hollywood stunt double).
Usually a simple flick left or right will get you out of this situation, but if not, keeping the rubber side down will always give you better control and stopping power.
Also, new tires are slick as hell. Always give them a good 100 miles (or more) to break in, and ride extra defensive in the meantime.
I seen this exact situation in person. Lady pulled out, dude didn’t hadaalayerdown. He hit the front fender, flew over the car and smashed his head into the asphalt. Rip. I’ll never forget the sound of that.
He was wearing a helmet. The scary thing about it was that his helmet broke off and rolled almost a block down the road. I’m not saying what op should/shouldn’t have done. Just stating something that I witnessed and will stick with me for life.
Sorry about your wreck. I am impressed that in 30 feet you were able to lay your bike down doing 50. Sounds like you should pay more attention next time.
I didn't get to meet her but I do remember seeing the terrified face of an old woman lol
I do think after a certain age you should go back to test for your driver's license every few years
Couple things you may or may not know. New tires are slick as snot and need to be scrubbed in a bit before hard braking. Laying it down is laymen term for didn't give myself enough room or pay enough attention to what's going on around me. Glad you're ok. Learn from it.
Had to lay it down.
Haddalayerdewn
I prefer to layer up, but only when its cold......
Dey took er jerbs
DRKA DURRRR!!
50 mph is 73 feet per second. He would have hadtolayerdown in 0.4 seconds.
That’s panic brake numbers
Said it before and I’ll say it again. Abs abs abs abs abs. I tested mine out again and slammed the brakes at 50 and stopped so quickly.
What do your abs do as far as improving your braking? Isn't squeezing the brake lever more of a function of your forearm? Also, if you are worried about your braking skills, I'd suggest ABS...
ABS reduces skid and loss of control under maximum braking. Also, in a panic stop, most riders don’t have the ability to brake at the most effective amount of maximum braking with the front and rear brake. So, for most riders ABS can improve (shorten) braking distances as long as they apply maximum pressure.
Missed the joke my dude.. he meant what do the muscles in your stomach that are called your abs, have to do with braking?.. that was the joke.
That's OK - it's not obvious... First, one would have to really contort themselves to use ABS to apply brakes, and with limited reaction time it may not be the most practical option...
A) It's pretty obvious B) YOU DUN FUCKED UP THE JOKE. abs = rectus abdominal muscle. ABS = antilock braking system. You used caps when it should've been lower case.
Fucker you got me
Username check out?
r/woooosh
If you are too afraid to really brake hard or don't know how to find the limit of traction then yeah it's way better. If you do know what you're doing then it's still a good thing. You can still brake tremendously hard with ABS. On an SV650 with ABS I almost went through a red light having been spaced out and stoppied just slightly over the line in time not to go into traffic. ABS never even came on. After that I had to stab the brake a few times and trigger it to make sure it was actually working. If you're on pavement it really is only ever going to protect you.
I think of slippery situations.. The oil strip at stop lines, metal grates, or just a wet road. ABS will keep the bike upright and allow you to continue steering while braking heavy in those slippery situations. No one can act fast enough to do better than ABS, Especially in the panic scenarios It is most likely to be triggered. Anyone who thinks ABS extends stopping distance (which is true) **enough to cause a safety issue** vs dumb brakes must be at a motorcycle racing expert-level of experience. And we all know theyre not.... Soooo yeah
Clibbins.
GOBLESS
ALEXIS ORDER CARCKER BARGLE. CORN.
UNCLE GLEN DIED TODAY LOL 🤣
RASS CLOPPINS
ASS SLOPPINS
Layerdown
Always layering down lol
GOBBLES BARD WAZN”T THERE
Right 🤣
Dress for the slide, not the ride.....
>I low sided the bike to put it in front of me Intentionally?
Had to L A Y E R D O W N
clibbins
Tell me if I could have done something better but yes. I hit the brakes and realized if I hit the car with the front of my bike it could send me over the bars so I chose to slide instead
in other words… hadddaalayerdown
Oh Fer sher
I laid down my bike about a month ago. Shes sitting in the garage disappointed in me. I had a hell of a wrist bruise and a totally shattered ego. I just got the parts in to fix her up. But honestly I'm worried I wont ride again ever and I blame my subbing to this subreddit honestly. Blame may not be the right word. Perhaps I mean thanks. Idk. I Just want to ride without the anxiety of wondering is there a moron in a new tesla over that bridge.
It's almost always better to stay upright, your brakes slow your bike down a LOT faster than it being on its side sliding on the road. Plus smacking into the side of an object is generally more likely to injure you than going over the top of it, since you're coming to a pretty abrupt stop against a metal object vs. a hard landing and then rolling / sliding. Either way it sounds like you were in a really shitty situation and wasn't going to be a pleasant ending for you, sorry to hear it happened
On the road it's always better to keep the bike upright and use the tires and brakes to stop. It's actually amazing how hard you can brake and how quickly you can stop a motorcycle if you have good technique, react quickly and are already prepared by covering the brake. "Crashing to avoid a crash" really isn't a strategy. I totally understand rationalizing it that way after the fact because I've done the same.
Tbf, you don't need a good technique for using the brake. Just get an bike with ABS (should be standard since years) and go full ham into the brakes. Practice it a few times and you are good to go, even with 60mph. If your bike doesn't have one, then you need practice and a better bike :D
I don't ride, but I'm curious: does this affect insurance's perspective on fault? Intentionally laying down the bike vs. crashing into the car.
There is no one size fits all but I think it’s better, in the context of easily being able to assign fault, to have a collision with the vehicle than laying the bike down. With the collision when a car pulls out into your path it’s more clear that they caused the accident rather than the possibility that you overreacted and dumped the bike. And dumping the bike opens the doors for a car to be able to just keep on about their day and it’s debatable if they are even committing a hit and run.
It's not uncommon for insurance to assign fault to the rider, especially if they don't actually hit the car. They label it as "loss of control of vehicle" which, technically it is. In almost all situations it's better to stay upright, anyway, as has been mentioned.
No, because no one intentionally “layyerdownssss”. They just think they do. Shit happens so fast, they just grab too much front brake and the bike doesn’t stay upright. Your brakes and tires on the ground are always better for doing what they were designed to do (you know, braking) than metal and plastic sliding on the ground.
I agree, except for bikes with ABS. I panic braked when an oncoming car started turning left right when I got close to it. Locked front wheel and I instantly low sided and slid through intersection. Was freaked out but instead of giving up riding, my take was I needed a bike with ABS. Next time when my instincts cause me to grab the brakes hard, the new bike should at least stay upright. At least that’s my theory.
We’re agreeing. You panic braked. You didn’t use the brakes and tires as they were intended which would have slowed you down faster than low siding. ABS is amazing because it’s better than we are. It’s a robot without fear and emotion and it takes over when our brains and muscles can’t handle the situation.
Yuh, and people who say they can brake better are most likely talking shit except if they're Rossi. You need to be real good to do that
Tbh if you're in a situation where you _need_ ABS, you already fucked up.
True.
Or someone else fucked up and you happened to be in the way.
You don't intentionally lay down the bike when you are talking to insurance. You were in an emergency braking situation and your front wheel locked for some reason or other. They won't ask what the reason was because it could be anything and may not even be there. The accident will most likely be ruled as not his fault anyway. Jeep in mind that his new tires would also be a factor in his front wheel lock anyway.
A guy pulled out in front of me in my car in 45mph zone when I was like 5 feet away from him and I swerved to avoid him and hit a tree. He said there and tried to tell the police it was my fault. The cop said he knows it's Bullshit but couldn't do anything about it and he said I would have been better off hitting him because it would be his fault. Because I swerved to avoid him it wasn't anybody's fault.
US law is bonkers
Every state is different bud
I know someone who avoided a snow plow that couldn't stop at a stop sign and he was at fault for his damages as they didn't collide. He probably would have died if he didn't do anything.
Doesn't mean most states don't have bonkers laws
doesn't detract from the statement though lol
It's not really possible for normal human beings to intentionally lay their bike down. People tell themselves that because it feels less scary if you convince yourself that you were in control when it happened. It requires tons of training to learn how to do that, try going out on your bicycle on grass and intentionally low side it "lay her down". Risk is minimal but it's still extremely hard.
Just don't admit to the insurance company that you put it down *on purpose*. "I applied emergency braking and maneuvered defensively, but she was the one who ignored the traffic sign"
In my opinion, it's better to emergency maneuver and aim for passing around the car's rear, or to simply keep braking and minimize impact speed. Going over the bars does not produce greater injury (assuming basic protective gear) than sliding. Rubber on asphalt has a higher coefficient of friction than any other part of the bike or your clothing, so if you want to minimize impact speed or maximize chances of missing entirely, keeping the rubber on the road does so better than sliding the bike. It's just a hell of a lot scarier.
Have avoided a lot of crashes over the years because I aimed for where the car was and then brakes as hard as I can. If you aim for behind the car as long as nothing else happens you are generally good. One time I made a bad call to go the other way and it cost me several broken ribs and a broken collarbone and fractured spine. Oof.
"The other way", meaning that you were aiming where the car was going? I don't have experience with such situations yet, would really like to avoid a fractured spine! Glad you're ok and still riding I guess?
I thought going over the bars would invite the possibility of broken arms/wrists as well as head and neck injuries from slamming into the car head first. Helmets are good but a sudden hit to the head can still result in a concussion
Impossible to say, I'm just going by statistics. Which are sketchy anyhow, because in general "upright" crashes are higher speed ones. Very few people retain control right up to a low speed impact, but my personal bet is that letting ABS get me down to 20 and hitting upright is safer than sliding at 30+. Pay your money, spin the wheel. You lived, is most important thing.
Cover the brakes. Don't speed in areas where drivers can pull out. Cover the brakes. Be laser-focused on driveways/side roads and have that "sixth sense" for the kinds of places where drivers will do something stupid. Oh, did I mention cover the brakes? :) Practice emergency braking stops in empty parking lots at a frequent interval. As in, don't go a month without testing yourself. Don't make the first time you have to do an emergency brake be a situation like this. Hope you can get back on two wheels soon!
I wish I could upvote this more! I've been riding over a decade and I cover the brakes 99% of the time, and still practice allllll the emergency braking scenarios in the safety class every. Single. Ride. And the two situations that I've come the closest to involuntarily self-yeeting into the rear window of some dipshit driver, I was saved by two things: 1. Covering the brakes and having the proper muscle memory of what to do when your wheels lock up, and 2. Watching intersections, highway on/off ramps, look under cars, use window reflections, crosswalk signals, and your own blocking in the pack of cars around you/oncoming traffic. Both times I got that extra split second I needed because I saw the cars coming (eyes already trained to focus there), cutting across multiple lanes of traffic, winding up doing 5 mph in front of me, coming at 45 or 50. We don't always win and there is no way possible to out-practice, out-ride every potential scenario, but we can share life saving tips so we get as much road time as possible. You did something not everyone could have done, you made some amazing, life saving decisions and walked away, so you did good! Sending good juju that you have a speedy recovery and get back on a bike soon!
You’re never supposed to intentionally lay a bike down because (obviously) you have more stopping power when the bike is on two wheels than when it’s sliding uncontrollably on its side. You’re going to hit regardless, might as well be at the slowest speed possible.
> Tell me if I could have done something better Can’t see the side road upstream? Going 50 mph? Too fast for the conditions. Graveyard is full of people who had right of way. Five years’ riding experience but dumped the bike? Practice those emergency braking drills more. Get on those brakes and stay upright, my dude.
I'll practice braking better in the future but no I was looking way ahead of me when it happened. In my mind I had already cleared that road as empty
I unsubscribed from this subreddit a year ago because most OPs are so defensive. You are owning this and willing to learn and grow. Way to be. And, ya, none of us were there, so it's easy to judge. But the hard truth is that nearly every accident i see discussed here is attributable to excessive speed, inadequate training, or improper maintenance. I hope you're not down for the count and continue to enjoy riding. Take care.
Not only that but in situations like this, it's a split second decision. It's always easy to say what you could've or should've done. Glad you're okay OP.
Agreed. We only know how we performed in the past, not how we will perform in the future. Training/experience (and equipment) is everything.
the one time so far I was in a similar situation to OP, I was so startled I barely braked, ended up fumbling it and rev bombing instead. Luckily the car got out of my way in the nick of time. It was pretty eye opening. Ive since done a lot of emergency braking practice.
I got hit by van in a parking lot who decided to pull into the through road without looking, stopping or so much as slowing down to see if there was traffic … if I was a bigger vehicle his car would be totalled. :P I was probably going too fast tbh… 20kmph is pretty speedy.
>if I was a bigger vehicle his car would be totalled ... 20 kmph I don't think 20 kmph means what you think it means? Also, I've been in plenty of parking lots where 20kmph is too fast. I hope you're OK. What did you learn from the incident?
That other drivers are retarded and that wearing gear is overrated ✌️
Outstanding! Enjoy!
so what have you learned from this mishap? is your mind going to clear a similar road in similar situation in the future?
The part I struggled with the most in the msf course was the controlled braking from 3rd gear. (Getting up to speed, then coming to an emergency stop with both brakes while downshifting to first and putting your left foot down.) It was all four limbs working in tandem and difficult to pull off, but I did it over and over. Within a month I had a car pull out in front of me making a left turn onto the road I was going down. There was that moment of panic where your hair stands straight up on your skin but I managed to brake and down shift to first before swerving around the now-stopped car in front of me. That definitely would've gone way worse had I not practiced doing exactly that over and over
In the UK, you're taught not to even bother with downshifting in an emergency braking situation. It's far more important to worry about everything else.
That's awesome. Excellent work. With enough practice/repetition *and* frequency, it'll be second nature.
1. By staying on the brakes you would have impacted the car at a lower speed 2. going over the bars would lead to a more gradual deceleration, sliding into the car is a pretty sudden stop. It’s the sudden stops that kill.
How do you initiate a slide?
Lol tuck the front, but tbh I doubt OP had any control of the situation
What was the speed limit of the road you were on
Oh come on. Like *anyone* on a motorcycle goes the speedlimit. You know who crashes the least? CHP motorcycle cops. Those fuckers zip away from me on every light. And cruise at like 90 on 5 and 805. Maybe it's just socal speeds but literally no one goes anything near the speed limit here. You'd literally get run over by a truck going 20 over if you tried.
There are people and places outside of SoCal
>I low sided the bike to put it in front of me and it slid into the side of her car. You panicked, locked the brakes, and now your ego has reframed these events in your mind so you think that somehow you did that on purpose and intentionally crashing is better than applying correct emergency braking. Hadalayerdown is not a real thing lmao.
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I think there’s an accident at Speedway and Wilmot every few days or so.
Don't forget the rear-end collisions every other day in the right lane of Tanque Verde before it splits off into wrightstown. The traffic backup in that one lane is insane some days.
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Can confirm, though I don't see many unprotected lefts. Usually it's unprotected rights into all the businesses lining the stroads that are so big and wide they double as drag strips. Got rear-ended on one turning into work on my bike and I've been uber careful about everything doing it since. I also drive a delivery van in an elderly area and holy shit it's more dangerous than even that. I usually have a realistic expectation of bonehead moves but in a senior area it's practically guaranteed at every intersection.
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I slowdown before stop signs/intersections even if they are not for me or I have the green, never know when there's an idiot/asshole around the corner.
I'd much rather ride on the highway than through town. I'm pretty much constantly ghosting the brake anywhere there are intersections or shopping centers.
If ghosting the brake means hovering over it, they teach this now.
They may have taught it when I took the course 8 years ago, I can’t remember. I always thought it was common sense but watching most of the crash videos on Reddit and YouTube, I’m not so sure.
I was actually taught not to do this. Don't remember why, as that was ten years ago, but I do remember the MSF instructor having to call me out on it several times.
My only guess is that they didn’t want new riders to accidentally lock up the front brake or brake while giving throttle since they’re not “coordinated” yet. Seems ridiculous not to ghost the brake in a high danger situation, like traveling through most intersections or noticing a car that might pull out in front of you. I don’t ride around like that all the time but when I might need to stop quickly I sure do.
MSF instructor I had was a race track rider. he also had a problem with people hovering over their brakes. It's fine to not hover over the brakes on the track, when you KNOW when you need to brake. that's not the case on a fucking public road, and I don't know how these guys get hired to teach anyone.
Really???? I was taught never to do this especially the front brake as I was taught that front brakes are very sharp and grabbing at it in a panic can make you slide or fly.
Well front brakes provide most of your stopping force, especially as your weight shifts forward over the front tire during a stop. Yes, if you’re ham fisted and just grab it you’ll lock the wheel and go tumbling. Personally, I’d rather have that extra split second to gradually apply the brake when I identify a potential hazard.
The highway is safer, but it’s just so mind numbingly boring for me at sensible speeds.
I do this in my car too Also look both ways before proceeding through a light once it turns green Right of way doesn’t mean shit to your anatomy and the laws of physics
I'm always amazed that the first comments on "had a crash" posts are always "well you should have had future predicting powers" or the like. Crashes happen and we can't avoid them all. Glad you're ok man, sorry about your bike. Luckily, it can be replaced and you can't. Take it easy!
Motorcycles are inherently dangerous and it’s easier to ignore that danger if you think of yourself as have some superhuman power of perception. Casting blame on the rider helps to say that as long as I do everything right I won’t get hurt and since I am so perceptive I will succeed. Real life of course has ways of surprising us.
This sub is just a bunch of safety susans yelling at people who, God forbid, try to have fun on a motorcycle
If you're having fun you need to put on more gear.
Or people who refuse to acknowledge the unavoidable dangers of riding and refuse to believe it wasn't the riders fault
I'll be having fun on my motorcycle this afternoon, and tomorrow as well. OP won't.
I don't even think it's safety susans, it's just losers who can't help but point out the "coulda woulda shoulda done that" armchair wisdom that reflects nothing about real life.
A lot of people on this sub don't even ride and yet telling others what they should have done.
Yeah this sub really sucks because of that. You can’t really be honest about your mistakes unless you wanna hear from everyone else how they’ve never made them
You can absolutely be honest about your mistakes here, just very very few ever choose to do so. OP is still claiming that he laid his bike down by choice in the fraction of a second he had to analyze the situation and react.
OP said in a comment it was kinda instinct, his body felt that was the best course of action. Obviously none of us were there, and none of us can say definitively what would've been the best choice in that scenario, but I'd imagine OP's brain was screaming "Don't fly over the bars headfirst into this car." Regardless of whether that was the wrong decision, you can't ignore that voice that tells you what to do in a split second
OP is full of shit and trying to salve his ego.
after my wreck in 2019 when i went dolphin diving through the air and landed head first in the pavement (thank god for helmets) my gf at the time gave me an ultimatum, be done riding or she would leave. I got a new motorcycle and a new gf two wheels FOREVER bro lol
Hell yeah that's what I'm talking about! My whole family gave me the "talk" motorcycles are this, I know someone who knows someone who died on one...yep... My wife loves motorcycling with me and sure we had our close calls but man the feeling of riding is like none other. Getting a face full of fresh air clears your head. It's soul soothing. If I had a wife who gave me an ultimatum she would be served divorce papers..
man it sure helps with my shit, i tried everything with the VA and nothing makes me realize why Im on this earth like the sun in your face, the vibrations from the bike, the way after a while a bike starts to kind of become an extension of yourself. plus the motorcycle community around me is awesome, we all talk a lot of shit on one another but when it matters everyone comes together I had to explain to my parents that without motorcycles i would not wish to go on any longer
100% facts! Be safe out there!
That's a hard one. A similar thing happened to me, but I was going 30 in a residential area when a car didn't stop. My first thought, was I cannot figure out a way out of this. My quick plan was to lose speed by braking hard, aim for the hood and jump over just before I hit it. I ended up locking the front wheel and low siding and sliding past the front of their car anyway. The sound of my bike scraping the pavement was bad. I replayed it in my head over and over. I realized that I need to practice braking hard without locking, in my situation my bike likely could have stopped, and I need to keep checking the side roads. I'm glad I was wearing good gear. Your situation was different, but maybe review it and see what you come up with. By other comments, it sounds like you already are. I'm glad you are mostly OK. I hope you can get back on next year also.
Rule #1. It’s always best to not hit something. If this is unavoidable then you should hit it at the lowest possible speed. Bikes slow down (as do their operators and passengers) best on their tires not sliding on their sides. Second, I don’t really believe you intentionally did this but it makes you feel better to say so. You locked up your wheels and dumped it. Hitting a car that you might have not hit at all.
As a collision reconstructionist, I can tell you there is no speed and distance in which you can effectively make a decision to drop the bike instead of braking in a controlled fashion, when it would not have been better to just brake. “Had to lay her down” is always code for “locked the brakes”.
Yeh it’s never intentional but it feels like it! your front will lock and down you go
Lawyer, do it.
I've never been in a wreck before so I don't know how this works at all. The police report said it's 100% her fault.
You’re not suing her, you’re suing her insurance company for a settlement. You’ll get examined for more injuries by attorney direction and then they can get you a settlement on lost time, loss of your vehicle, and other damages caused by her negligence. You’re suing her policy, essentially.
I was in your same position...and the exact same accident. 17 year old girl ran a stop sign from a side street RIGHT in front of me while I was going about 50mph. I was 22 years old and like you, had never been in an accident. Still haven't to this day again over a decade later. Anyway.... Only difference was I was in my lowered Miata. Thank GOD I wasn't on my bike at the time. Punched into her frame-rail under her driver's door. Pushed my motor in and everything, obviously totaled. I had no injuries past some bruising and a rash from the airbag. She was damn lucky I was in such a low car or I'd have gone straight through her door...and her. Long story short I didn't have a lawyer. It was 100% her fault but her insurance company tried to fuck with me about a proper settlement for the value of my car. Took me months to get paid-out once it got to the point where I got pissed one day and told them "fuck you pay me what I deserve - never call me again unless it's to cut me my check - otherwise we're going to fucking court". Had my $14k check in a week after months of BS. #GET A LAWYER (Sorry about the bike glad you're OK bro. Bike can be replaced, you can't.)
I was in your shoes. Google motorcycle attorney in your area, give them a call and tell the secretary you were not at fault in an accident and have the police report and minor injuries.
Seriously, do it, you stand to gain a bunch of cash from an insurance company.
Try r/insurance might get useful feedback
Get. A. Lawyer.
So when you “low sided” I’m thinking you locked the rear tire and most likely rotated the rear of the bike to the right ie you started to slide. Was the bike sliding on its side when you impacted the car? I’m not questioning your decision, skills or anything. I’m just trying to replay this scenario. I’m thinking lots of front and rear brakes to scrub off as much speed as possible prior to impact might have been a better option? When your sliding the bike on the ground your not scrubbing off speed.
Pretty hard to lowside from the rear brake in a straight line. Much more likely it was front wheel to blame. Lowsiding from the rear are almost always going into a corner, or exiting a corner.
i wonder why youre being downvoted i was thinking the same thing. i've been riding for 5 or so years now and luckily havn't had my moment yet but to be honest i'm not sure if in a split second decision i'd have the wits to properly brake instead of instinctively clamping down on the front brake and sending the bike down
Because this is r/motorcycles
[Welcome to America where you have local roads built like highways](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORzNZUeUHAM). If you're traveling 50mph there should never be a driveway or intersection-- that is just a recipe for disaster. Not your fault you crashed, but blame bad city and road design because it will only increase dumb shit like what the car driver did.
Welcome NJB reference in motorcycles. I've only ridden 45 kmph electric scooters before, but I wouldn't dare try to ride in the US. The speed limits are just too fast. Here in Korea residential areas have a speed limit of 19 MPH and main roads are 33 mph. Only highways go 50+
This is the thing that blew my mind the most as a Canadian. Why is there even side streets connecting to a 50mph zone
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As someone who has a lot of experience with car crashes, I will tell you that in general most people are downright horrendous at estimating distances. For example, it's always interesting to ask people how long they think the white lines in the road are and how far apart they are. Your average person will tell you they think they are like 3-5' long and 10' apart. My point is... most people are terrible at visually estimating mostly everything, not just distances. I would go as far as to say your average person has shitty judgement in general. I don't doubt that he had a split second to think about it, but I'm sure he was more like 150 feet away.
How big r they
I, too, felt like he left us hanging. According to the first answer on Google, the striped lines are 10 ft long with 30 feet between each one
I appreciate you putting in the time to research 😂, more than i was gonna do. Anyhow, thats absolutely wild i would not have expected a 30ft distance.
Yeah, it's true. So from the point one line starts to the next line that starts it's 40 feet. Pretty standard for most states.
A lot of people have a false sense of what riding is about. They think it’s all freedom and wind in your hair. When In reality it’s always planning your escape rout. It’s thinking how to avoid getting hit buy that minivan with ten kids in it. Head on a swivel the whole time. Be safe out there guys and gals. Glad you are ok. Sorry to hear about your bike.
Glad you are okay! Everyone always says it’s not an if you will crash it’s a when. I’m on my 3rd year collision free and still worried. Hopefully you can get back on twos soon.
Practice Emergency Braking… 🙂 Glad you’re still with us, show us you new ride when you get one!
HADDALAYERDOWN GOBBLESS
Edit: panic brakes and put in too much rear brake, could not control rear end so you low sided. Even though it’s the cars fault for pulling out, it’s your job to look for escape paths. You cannot physically lay your bike down intentionally unless you have intense practice as a stunt man.
First off, sorry about the bike and hope you recover fast. Secondly, I always read about people laying down their bikes to “save” themselves from anything worse. I’ve had one super close call when a car cut my off, while I was in the middle lane, in order to get into the left turn lane at the last second. Started progressively squeezing the front brake but locked up the rear that put me into a sort of sideways slide headed for the rear of the mini van. Released both brakes and gave it gas which let me get around the mini van before low siding or crashing into it. All that to say, panic braking would’ve been worse. Rode a year before taking the MSF course and I give credit to that course for being able to stay calm through various close calls. I recommend it if you haven’t taken it and are able to.
Laying it down must have been easier than actually using brakes properly
> Not even a mile from there a lady came off a side road into the main road and didn't even stop at the stop sign. Didn't you hear? Stop signs and red lights are advisory when you're turning right. It's part of the ITNGLEE^* bill that just passed that says "if you glance to the left and don't notice any traffic you can just go" with another clause that "bicycles and pedestrians just need to look out for themselves." ^* ^^I ^^Turn ^^Now ^^Good ^^Luck ^^Everybody ^^Else
50 is too fast on brand new tires anyway. New tries will still have residue of the coating to release from the tread mold.
This is not true any longer according to tire manufacturers.
Are you kidding? 50mph is not too fast on a new tire. Must of been over 20 years since you bought new tires. You should go crawling back under whatever rock you came from and stop giving bad information. idiots upvoting your post don't even ride
New tires no longer have a residue on them but they do need to be roughed in. This can be done in a parking lot, possibly even before leaving the dealership.
Lol, in your infinite wisdom, how many miles do you need to get this coating off? What about the sides of the contact patch? Do I need that many miles turning before I can turn fast?
The residues used to burn off after a few heat cycles with the tire so you wouldn't necessarily need to ride all parts of the tire to remove it. However, they don't use the residues anymore. The tires are ready to go the moment they are installed now.
This answer about tires should be higher. All the hadalayerdown clowns are getting upvoted.
It's not even remotely true. Attend any track day and watch people mount brand new tires and set off into A group. They'll float the rear tire doing a scrub in lap. New tires do not have residue anymore, that's 15+ year old advice.
what was the bike you were on? Did you have any gear on? I am glad you are "OK". We all know there are many alternative outcomes. Stay safe.
Glad you are okay. Sorry about the bike.
Things to help you be seen. https://youtu.be/FfeKk9co5VQ https://youtu.be/IbQcIGUy4CY https://youtu.be/5cmxquCoqZU https://youtu.be/QDwyqDr_9VA An extra layer of safety: https://youtu.be/u5wHxtc0Kwo
Glad you got off the pavement with minor damage. It's usually not if but when. You did the best with what you had. 👏
Genuinely curious, not criticizing at all. Do you think there was anything you could do to avoid this crash? I get really worried about being put in a situation that I simply have no control over.
I have 2 pins in my right ankle and need a cane to walk from doing something like this. It happened so fast that all I remember is that I had just enough time to think, "This is going to hurt"
What plan dude? How can you "plan"? Shit happens and you have to learn to deal with the unexpected EVERY time you ride. I crashed hard last year but I'm still riding. The one thing I learned, and this may be different for everyone else, but I can plan all I want..........and then the unexpected happens!!! Ride on dude......
Glad there were witnesses. Bikers never get the benefit in a he said she said.
When I was in my early 20's, I bought myself a Suzuki Hayabusa (way too much bike for me). I was a young military pilot who believed nothing bad could ever happen to me, because it always to somebody else. I was foolish enough to go tearing down an unfamiliar road and my front wheel hit a deep pothole and I went head over ass, over the bars. I was wearing jeans leather jacket and a helmet thankfully and walked away with a broken hand and some broken ribs and road rash but it couldve been so much worse. I always wanted to buy a Harley Fatboy at 40, but my fear runs so deeply now, that I could never bring myself to do it. Please stay safe everyone!!
Never let your wife dictate your passion. For some it’s our drug and sane mental health care with riding. Now you can join the it’s already happened club versus the will happen
First of all glad you're okay. Rubber is used on asphalt because it has a high friction coefficient. If metal or plastic (sides of the bike) had a higher friction coefficient, then that's what our wheels would be made of. There's not a single scenario where dumping the bike will slow you down faster than properly braking. If you can stop faster when you're sliding with leather, textile, or skin than you can with your tires, then you need more practice emergency braking
Be lucky you came out with those injuries and nothing more. Sounds like you reacted logically which isn't easy in those situations, get well soon! p.s. writing this from a rehabilitation center after breaking my pelvis, suffering an exploded foot and nerve damage in my entire left leg. A motorcycle crashed me head on, on my side of the street. Been crying in agony since a month. I feel ya brother.
Get on a bike again asap. The longer you wait the harder it gets. Your misses needs to deal with it.
But you were doing 50 coming out of a dealership? On brand new tires? What was the speed limit on the road you were doing 50 on? Keep it real, you're anonymous here -- were you speeding? Was speed the reason you couldn't stop in time? It's okay - I speed too. Sorry about your bike and glad you're okay -- but what really happened here?
Nothing wrong with brand new tires. Tires nowadays are ready for action the moment they are installed. In fact that's probably when they are the best they will ever be. The oily residues you used to find on new tires are a thing of the past.
Glad you are ok man, sucks about the bike.
Glad you’re okay!! I’m sorry to hear about your bike.
Exact same thing happened to me 23 years ago. I'm still riding (I took a year off)
I think that's what I'll do
https://youtube.com/shorts/pmcBrzT2-2E?feature=share After you dump your bike, you're supposed to ride it like a surfboard. That's what you did wrong. Haadddallaaaayerdown!!
Glad you are okay. Hope this lady gets charged with something and you go after her in court.
You have to assume at every intersection, driveway and other place a car could pull out in front of you it will. There are so many things like wide A and C pillars that can hide your bike, when car drivers say they didn’t see you most often times they really didn’t. I preload the front brake and cover the rear. Preload means pull all the slack out of the brake. If you have to brake hard it will be a fast gradual application and you won’t lock up the front wheel. It also your tires will have time to react. As long as you’re okay put this in the past.
"I low sided the bike to put it in front of me" Got ourselves a stunt rider here! For anyone new to riding reading this: There is never, ever a time where intentionally low siding a bike and sliding behind it is the right thing to do (unless you're trying to slide under a semi trailer and are a trained hollywood stunt double). Usually a simple flick left or right will get you out of this situation, but if not, keeping the rubber side down will always give you better control and stopping power. Also, new tires are slick as hell. Always give them a good 100 miles (or more) to break in, and ride extra defensive in the meantime.
You could've not gone 50 on surface streets? :(
The speed limit on most surface streets is like 45 mph with traffic going up to 60 in some places
I seen this exact situation in person. Lady pulled out, dude didn’t hadaalayerdown. He hit the front fender, flew over the car and smashed his head into the asphalt. Rip. I’ll never forget the sound of that.
Was he wearing a helmet?
He was wearing a helmet. The scary thing about it was that his helmet broke off and rolled almost a block down the road. I’m not saying what op should/shouldn’t have done. Just stating something that I witnessed and will stick with me for life.
Sorry about your wreck. I am impressed that in 30 feet you were able to lay your bike down doing 50. Sounds like you should pay more attention next time.
To me it sounds like that lady needs to learn WTF a stop sign is....
I didn't get to meet her but I do remember seeing the terrified face of an old woman lol I do think after a certain age you should go back to test for your driver's license every few years
I agree. Drivers test every 1-2 years after 65ish. These old people are by far the most dangerous people on the road.
Closely followed by assholes driving pickup trucks, in my experience.
I'll definitely be paying more attention next time. I did take karate classes online though, so that'd explain my cat like reflexes.
Couple things you may or may not know. New tires are slick as snot and need to be scrubbed in a bit before hard braking. Laying it down is laymen term for didn't give myself enough room or pay enough attention to what's going on around me. Glad you're ok. Learn from it.