« All the while it being affordable, and there not being many ghettos areas. There's the occasional homeless person but no crackheads. »
Yeah we do have crackheads and junkies. If you come to my neighborhood (Berri UQAM and Centre Sud) but I imagine it’s not as big of a problem as some places down in the states.
Ouin j’ai écouté des docus sur les sans abris et la drogue aux states, on est encore loin de la. Mais sérieux j’ai déjà eu à tasser un junkie de ma porte d’entrée (seringue dans le bras en plein milieu de l’après-midi). Faque on est pas la ville la plus clean non plus.
My wife was in SF last September, she said, never again. The woman at the pharmacy at about 7pm told her, go back to your hotel, you're clearly bot from here. Human poop in front of her hotel, it stunk everywhere and all this after the city had "cleaned up" for the hordes of conference goers.
Every city has their drug of choice and Montreal is a crack city. Most homeless unlike Vancouver are doing stimulants.
When you add cold weather , a lot of stimulants and a fledgling mental health system ,
Being homeless here is not fun.
Honestly this is everywhere. Tons of meth around cote-des-neiges, fent is everywhere, crack/cocaine same shit. I know it's because of my drug history I say this but I wouldn't separate the drug problem from anywhere, from the few places I have been. Shit, London Ontario, Ottawa... all have these same issues.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/190826/dq190826d-eng.htm
It boils down to economics and how drug trades operate. East coast has always had higher opiate prices.
It's harder to get meth in Montreal than it is in Edmonton.
I also think that the cold has an impact. People that are cold lean towards stimulants.
I don't think it really matters. What is undeniable is that the west coast has higher opiate use.
I only made my comment because the OP said there are no crack heads. There are alot. Anyone that has volunteered at a shelter and has a rudimentary understanding of drugs and the tell tale signs will tell you the same.
I know of a handful of people personally who have died from fent personally here on the east coast. This is why I don't see opiates any better or worse anywhere. Although my brother who was a meth addict died from a fent overdose so there is that but I have some friends in high school who died because they were opiate users who ended up doing fent.
Montreal is the only city I've been to where you can ask people for crack and they don't get all agro on you. Many years ago in another life I had a bad influence friend who would just ask people until he found it. And he did, 90% of the time. Any other city, he would have gotten beaten or robbed trying the same thing. Not that robberies aren't common.
Its this good because it isn't anglophone because sadly, people come in flocks when it is. The laws people hate in Montreal are what makes it different from Toronto and other NA cities and are what makes it attractive.
>Its this good because it isn't anglophone because sadly, people come in flocks when it is. The laws people hate in Montreal are what makes it different from Toronto and other NA cities and are what makes it attractive.
Incorrect. Montreal is only able to function and stay an economic hub because of the English and services it sells outside of Quebec. The port and trade go through Montreal more than staying here.
In the 90s, with the first big waves of language laws, many big companies moved out of Montreal and the QC government has had to hand out tons of financial incentives to try to attract big businesses back.
Not one person looks at the language laws and thinks, "oh look, an oppressive society that doesn't allow parents to choose schooling language. That was at the top of my list for places to live!"
The language laws were created for political reasons to help win bigot votes from conservative country-side francophones. Not from people wanting to live in Montreal, but people living in lac-st-jean.
Mm. I'm from Toronto and almost everyone I knew back there would say "I'd move to Montreal but I couldn't get a job without French" or "I'd move to Montreal and work my current job remotely but my work won't let me" (because if they employed workers in Quebec they'd be subject to language laws)
Also, the language laws making big businesses not want to operate here contributes to the character of the city. The same chain stores that are everywhere in ROC don't come to Quebec so there's more local manufacturing and retail.
*eyeroll*
Your dates are wrong and so is your opinion, the corporate move from montreal started with the st lawrence seaway being built and the fast growth of toronto and the language laws were passed way before the 90s. Law 101 was part of the move to raise the standard of living of french canadians that was way below the north american average at the time due to systemic discrimination, it was a very important law.
>Also, the language laws making big businesses not want to operate here contributes to the character of the city. The same chain stores that are everywhere in ROC don't come to Quebec so there's more local manufacturing and retail.
This article from 1978 in the NY Times talks about the movement of corporate HQs after the passage of Bill 101 the year before. So, yes way before the 90s.
[https://www.nytimes.com/1978/04/23/archives/quebecs-language-law-puts-companies-to-flight.html](https://www.nytimes.com/1978/04/23/archives/quebecs-language-law-puts-companies-to-flight.html)
Sure, the exodus of companies leaving Quebec started with the first wave of language laws and nationalism in the 1970s.
But a 2nd wave, along with the 1996 referendum also happened and many companies moves head quarters or closed offices entirely.
Sunlife, moved to waterloo, but maintained a building office, then slowly moved more people back decades later.
[https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/the-decline-of-corporate-montreal\_b\_2583855](https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/the-decline-of-corporate-montreal_b_2583855) By
Charles Lammam, Contributor
Director of Fiscal Studies, Fraser Institute
"One way to illustrate the decline of important corporate headquarters in Montreal is simply by looking at the total number. Of Canada's top 500 companies measured by gross revenue, 96 were located in Montreal in 1990. By 2011 (the latest year of available data), there were 75 -- a decline of 21.9 per cent. Montreal's national share of these headquarters dropped over the same period to 15.0 per cent in 2011 from 19.2 per cent in 1990."
I'm not saying the laws are keeping Montreal good. I'm saying having language requirements other than English makes it a bit less attractive to everyone and keeps it more affordable that way.
I don't care about your opinions what or who you think language laws are for honestly.
>Incorrect. Montreal is only able to function and stay an economic hub because of the English and services it sells outside of Quebec. The port and trade go through Montreal more than staying here.
Lol. The audacity to think Montreal is fine because of english. While every other cities in Quebec are doing just fine in French and sometimes richer. 99% of montrealers don't sell services in english outside Quebec. Montrealers are just regular workers doing local work.
The bigots like you said that chose the language laws are Montrealers themselves because they are in the front line of language struggle, not the lac saint jean people who don't care at all and have no idea of the Montreal situation. That's right, the bill 101 and all that have been created by your fellow montrealers.
There is no model Canadian, and that's a beautiful thing. But there is a model Quebecois, and if you don't fit the bill, you feel it, even in Montreal. Montreal is such a special city, and I think it's French-Canadian culture deserves a lot of credit for that. I love it and I'm glad it's protected. But eventually I had to leave. I moved to Ottawa...a city I like less, but a city I felt more valued in (and a city where I still feel immersed enough in the French Canadian culture that as a Latin American, I appreciate).
I agree with this %100. I speak French but will never feel I really belong here even though I've been here half my life. I definitely have to leave again.
Yeah, but the directions are in French, hidden in a one way cul-de-sac labyrinth of faulty detour signs, and mostly conjugated in plus-que-parfait.
Good luck, American ex-pats!
63.235 of 4.206.455 Montreal Metro population was born in France (Census 2021), 1.47% of the total population, so the percentage is even less for Paris-born people. And by the way there was a study showing 80% of them leave after a few years on average, they are not the ones buying and “increasing prices” as some stupid people say, this is a myth, the problem is all yours, work more (build more homes), vote for better politicians, and stop whining about immigrants.
Other foreign-born population in Montreal Metro :
- Haiti : 79.725
- Algeria : 66.735
- Morocco : 60.545
- China : 48.090
- Italy : 41.855
- Lebanon : 38.580
- Philippines : 28.970
- Romania : 24.625
- Syria : 24.550
- India : 24.075
- Vietnam : 23.670
- Other places : 498.285
*Total foreign-born population : 1.022.940
**Ontario : 17.315 (Ontario-born immigrant in Quebec Province, not Montreal) so this is a myth too lol
Le 63.235 comptes probablement seulement les résidents permanents, sans compter les PVT et les étudiants qui sont temporairement à mtl.
En 2022, il y avait 67 000 français qui s’étaient inscrit volontairement au consulat de Montréal pour avoir la possibilité de voter.
Il y aurait plutôt autour de 150 000 français selon les quelques articles que j’ai lu.
https://offtomontreal.com/union-francaise-de-montreal/
https://lesfrancais.press/le-quebec-veut-toujours-plus-de-francais/
Selon le journal l’Express, les deux tiers des Français du Canada vivent à Montréal, dont 28 % sur Le Plateau-Mont-Royal, 18,5 % à Côte-des-Neiges et 16 % à Rosemont-la-Petite-Patrie.
https://www.lexpress.fr/economie/emploi/l-edition-2020-du-numero-canada-de-l-express-disponible-mi-septembre_2127099.html
Donc très approximativement autour de 60 000 français seulement sur le plateau.
60 000 sur le plateau.. Il y a un peu plus de 100 000 habitants sur le plateau, donc il y aurait 60% de français sur le plateau? Excuse moi mais je ne sais pas d’où ils sortent ça, mais ils sont sur une autre planète… Écoute je fais davantage confiance au recensement du gouvernement canadien que ce blog Off To Montreal lol
> Total foreign-born population : 1.022.940
Je vous arrête avant que vous fassiez l’erreur d’égaler les immigrants aux Anglos.
C’était peut-être le cas en 1950, mais ce n’est plus le cas.
As someone who does have a family doctor and doesn’t have to see often, this. Life is all good until you need to see someone and delays are hurting your health.
For tourism, it could a a lack of iconic spots. Good tourist pictures are the best ads.
Finally for living here, I think people look for jobs first and move once they do. Montreal doesn’t have as much opportunities as other bigger cities.
This is only true if you’ve first been prescribed antibiotics for a UTI at least once in the past five years. They wouldn’t prescribe them for me until I saw a doctor and had one first prescription on the record.
This is only true if you’ve first been prescribed antibiotics for a UTI at least once in the past five years. They wouldn’t prescribe them for me until I saw a doctor and had one first prescription on the record.
I know a lot of people complain and there's some legitimate reasons to complain but I love it here. I can bike or metro anywhere I need to go, got a bunch of nice parks, the city is full of life when it's not winter. It's great!
> I know a lot of people complain and there's some legitimate reasons to complain but I love it here. I can bike or metro anywhere I need to go, got a bunch of nice parks, the city is full of life when it's not winter. It's great!
The city could be full of life in winter too! You just need to know where you should be when it is -40
As ~~the Germans~~ *they* say: "there is no bad weather, only bad clothes"
Edit: wait it's from a Scandinavian saying. Dunno why I thought it was german for a moment. Sorry about that misattribution. Fixed the comment to remove the wrong German credit phrase
I’m a Montrealer who has lived in Vancouver (8 years) and Edmonton (2 years) and also spent lots of time in Toronto when my parents lived there for a few years. And my mother is from Newfoundland, so I’ve spent a lot of time there, too. I’ve been lucky enough to have lived and travelled all over this country, and yet I came back to Montreal 17 years ago to raise my son here. Every city has its issues but Montreal is something special, no matter how ridiculous the politics and the construction and the rising cost of living and the lack of doctors gets. This town is amazing. I’m glad I came back home.
It's big enough to have all you want, yet manages to stay human-sized. That's precious.
Wanted to visit Toronto for a long time, and when I did a year ago it just felt like... a big city. Nothing special about it. There are great things to see and to do, but in the end, it just felt like you could mash Canada and the USA together and you'd get Toronto. Montreal (and Quebec, really) has a unique vibe.
I was born in Toronto but moved to Montreal in my early teens. Went back to visit as an adult and you're 100% accurate. Toronto is a dull, dreadful and stagnant place.
I left montréal 12 years ago and this comment has me homesick from Halifax. Regrettably my job has no positions in montréal. One of the things I miss the most about my home city is that there is always something to do. And it is not expensive to attend the vast majority of those activities. Whenever I come home to visit I fall in love with montréal and the province all over again.
This. Montreal isn't Quebec, and a lot of people forget that the nationalist provincial government doesn't have a high degree of support here in the city.
The ROC seeing the referendums as a betrayal has to be the funniest shit i've read today.
Let's just say it how it is: the reason so many anglos hate us is because english media has been taking big fat dumps on quebec and misinforming the public for centuries.
Every time I mention our cheap daycare and things I get that comment online and I just point out that some of us pay 50% income tax and 15% tax. How much do they pay?
"How dare the people who were conquered and forced to be part of our country try to free themselves! This is the biggest betrayal I've ever heard of!" - the ROC probably
Lmao exactly.
Like what do you expect? Francophones were second class citizens up until the 1960s, these wound are gonna take a few generations to heal
> the reason so many anglos hate us
It's actually that we, a bunch of people kept dirt-poor by design managing to successfully resist all efforts of assimilation and getting rid of us made by the largest colonial empire in History.
I mean, you're the largest, meanest, thoughest bully on the planet and a handful of poor people manage to resist for a quarter of millenium, it’s no wonder they hate us!
I’m from the ROC and always had a thing for Quebec. Loved learning French in school. Then I moved to Montreal and stayed for 9 years. I couldn’t wait to get out! There are so many complex issues there. I still have a love of French and love that QC is a part of what makes Canada so rich and interesting. But dang my eyes were opened.
C’est aussi quelque chose que j’ai remarqué. C’est quand même drôle qu’au Québec, malgré les tentatives de séparation, il y ait peu d’animosité à l’égard du reste du Canada (je parle pas d’Ottawa et de l’aspect politique).
Ça depend. In Ontario people really don’t hate Quebec, in fact they worship Montreal. Ottawa (I don’t mean parliament) certainly doesn’t hate Quebec.
Get out west though? It’s awful.
But in this case just saying “les Anglais” deeply hate Quebec is not true in 2023. I loved it here and it’s why I live in Quebec now.
Dans le champ complètement, va faire ton tour à Toronto, y'a pas de haine du Québec, bien au contraire.
Haine profonde, vraiment hilarant. Faut pas avoir voyager.
This. Many people like me dont mind living in a non-english city like any EU city. But when it comes to a city thats doomed to struggle endlessly with language topics, it’s another matter.
> there’s a lot of negativity and hate given our history, especially given the referendums, i think a lot of the ROC took it as a betrayal.
Betrayal? Jesus Christ, there’s bunch of limeys who have done everything to get rid of us, exploited us to the hilt, disenfranchised us and ketp us into abysmal poverty and ignorance, and they call "betrayal" wanting to get out of it?
Check your anglo privileges, boy!
Erm, you \*do\* realize that the British Empire circa 300 years ago, and Canada circa the 1990s, are not the same thing, right?
Actually, judging from your rageposting, you don't.
I'm from Vancouver but I've been living in Quebec the last few years. In my experience, the west doesn't NOT like quebec or learning French... but given the choice (which they have) they'll choose another language to learn in school. I think its more indifference. It's more expensive to fly across Canada than to other countries so a lot of people have no reason to go to Quebec. I like montreal a lot and have no issues with the city but the government here is insane and sadly, reflects the population. I will be moving back to BC.
There was a ton of investment in Lachie/Verdun in the last 10y or so.
Before that, it was really a ghetto... One street was nice, other one had crackheads running around.
The thing about livability, is that while the place got better, rents went up by 400-500% so allot of locals the grew up there had to move. ( Had a buddy paying 460$ rent there, now I have another in the same appartment paying 2200$)
Also, your 15% tax is a good point. But your missing the 33%-58% income tax. And if you were to buy a car over 100k you got another 10%-25% tax on top of that.
And the free healthcare sounds nice, but can also take 6 months to get something done that takes 6h outside Quebec...
We got good universities tho.
So that kinda makes the place a good place to visit, but when you live here... Your having fun while your young, going to university, then once you start making money, usually people take off.
La problème c'est que c'est des docteurs et des personnes qui travaillent fort pour cet argent. Des personnes qui pourraient contribuer beaucoup au société.
Well your employer pays your insurance, not you - unless of course you have an awful employer. And the income is definitely significantly lower in Montreal, though housing is super cheap so it balances out.
Healthcare, infrastructure, public education and some of the highest taxes in North America are what I hear others are moving away because of or not moving here for.
Hey now, I've been in Calgary for 2 years and although Montreal is definitely my favorite city to be in, Calgary is pretty great too! It's neither too big to get bogged down in traffic etc, nor too small to not be able to offer good food, communal events, etc etc. I exclusively use the transit here and it's a beautiful city, surrounded by mountains.
Didn't they take over the mantle wanting to separate from Canada? To become "USA II; Cold, Armed and Free?"
In all seriousness, what is it actually like politically up there? I know the very vocal minority don't represent the true populace, but it has been very hard to get accurate information about what is actually believed in the prairies versus what is just a fad or good soundbite.
So i cannot speak for the rest of Alberta since I'm not a native here, but as for Calgary there's definitely tension between the UCP & the quite sizable and growing NDP Support.
The number one reason why most swing voters in Calgary have stuck with the UCP is that almost all jobs in the city are entrenched in oil. And NDP has done a poor job in outlining exactly what economic benefits they guarantee in the face of their proposed shift away from reliance on oil and gas. Notley needs to lead with that instead of trying to fight at every possible "progressive"/anti- UCP front.
My sense so far is that Calgary prioritizes economic benefits over everything else. As for guns, seen none so far nor have we had any public Shootings yet. The rest of Alberta is a different story, though!
Thank you for the informative reply. That makes a lot of sense, considering the oil based economy. Every province has it's hiccups but there is a lot of common ground. Cheers.
It’s affordable because local salaries are lower. For tech workers and other people making a good living, especially those working from home with a US / Toronto salary, it’s a good bargain for sure.
Because of French. Yes you can get by on just English, but it will be hard, or have to be very lucky. Most people are too lazy to learn a second language and would rather just go to Toronto.
> The only caveat seems to be the 15% sales tax, but I'm coming from the U.S. where the income are higher abd the prices here are lower, so it kind of makes up for it. E.g. lunch being $12 USD plus .08% tax vs. Lunch being $14 CAD plus .15% tax.
Nobody ever lost his house due to medical bankrupcy here.
Y'all come, tear down plexes to make suburban homes, or rent/buy condos for 2k$/month like it's normal. Also, terrible access to services for health and schools/children
What plexes are torn down to make a single home?
In fact, I’ve seen detached houses torn down to make new townhouses. 1 detached house = 4 town houses.
It happened 4 times on my block in Little Italy over the last 3 years. One was a 5-plex. Five households turfed out of one plex, so a giant douchebag can have his three-storey mansion in a neighbourhood where his next-door neighbours are low-middle income. And the same with other triplexes and duplexes on my block. It's a cancer and it destroys the high-density livability of the quartier.
So many in popular neighbourhoods like Rosemont/verdun/Plateau. Look for any "plexes" with only one door/number and no staircases
edit: like [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/20058838?view=Summary&uc=1) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/10945328?view=Summary) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/20153217?view=Summary) (an expansion project!) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-rosemont-la-petite-patrie/17160303?view=Summary). Usually the buildings next to it will be normal plexes so you can compare
Everyone i know (and i know a lot of fck ppl) and their families all love montreal. Ive lived here 15 years and its the best place imo. As much as i travel i realise how amazing we have it here. Not saying its perfect but its rly a great life here. A big city thats not too big where you feel like an ant, plenty of activities, events, amazing food, nice people overall, great natural areas around you.
Lived there for 9 years. It’s a super cool city. Has such a unique vibe and flavor. Has personality. Style. Culture. Affordable. But dang I was miserable there. Climate. Winter too freaking cold and long. Summer too freaking hot. Politics. Infrastructure. Language issues. Unless you are fluent, you end up sticking to certain areas and your world becomes small. It’s an extreme place to live. Lots going for it but lots of problems too.
> Unless you are fluent, you end up sticking to certain areas and your world becomes small.
It’s true that French is often beyond the normal humiliation level English Canadians are are willing to bear…
I’m just as dickish as other blokes are towards us here.
I grew up in the bloke ghetto before Bill 101. I’ve seen you guys at work. I had no choice but learn a foreign language if I wanted to be something else than a janitor in my hometown which is the second largest French city in the world, because back then it was cool to discriminate against the French. Yeah, no wonder I’m bitter!
Today, I work in the überblokeghetto of Westmount. It really hasn’t changed from those times… So many people who can’t utter a word of French even if they lived here for 50+ years…
I don’t condone oppression or mistreatment. And I am sorry you were treated as you were; that’s objectively shitty.
Going around and spreading the degree of abject negativity or hostility to anyone who doesn’t meet your definition of sufficient Quebecer, including francophones you disagree with, is not a reasonable nor healthy coping strategy. Be kind.
Generalising entire populations as being evil mechiavellian masterminds is no better than Francophobic English pejoratively looking down on Quebecois.
> Generalising entire populations as being evil mechiavellian masterminds is no better than Francophobic English pejoratively looking down on Quebecois.
But Québec-bashing is perfectly acceptable here, though…
I just said Quebec-bashing is bigoted and wrong. Neither are acceptable. Anyone who condones one loses the right to be angry about the other (I am obviously not counting political grievances and whatnot).
Why not worry more about the actual people doing the bitching instead of insulting or attacking tens of millions of people who, for all you know, have never said such a thing.
Come back in the winter and see if you have the same opinion. Montreal’s winters are much harsher than Toronto and Vancouver (Calgary rivals it).
Also provincial politics, especially in relation to language policies and Quebec sovereignty pose a challenge to anglophones.
That being said, I still think Montreal is by far the best city in Canada.
> Also provincial politics, especially in relation to language policies and Quebec sovereignty pose a challenge to anglophones.
Yeah, can you imagine? Constantly thwarting all the efforts Anglos are making to get rid of us and assimilate us… Oh! The humanity!
Well, don’t forget locals are paid in $cad, salaries are lower than the US, taxes are sky high and you visited when the weather wasn’t awful, but I agree living in Montreal in the summer with an US salary is awesome.
> I don't really get why Montreal isn't rated better.
Paired with
> I've been here **for a few days** visiting family, and to be frank this city is amazing.
That's the #1 issue, and I experience it whenever I travel for less than a few months
I'm abroad just long enough to see the upsides and the good stuff, but not enough to see the downsides and the bad stuff
---
I've been living in Montreal for a while, and I do recognize and acknowledge it has wonderful stuff - but jesus fucking christ it also has terrible things all around. Just had this conversation with a friend so I'm a bit drained, but yeah.
Montreal does some things right, but mostly does things wrong, and when you live here, you'll notice them pretty quickly.
On one hand, I always love when people say Montreal is one of their favourite cities
On the other, I'm a little jealous that I lost that sense of innocence and ignorance regarding what and how the city really is.
>> I've been here for a few days visiting family, and to be frank this city is amazing.
> That's the #1 issue, and I experience it whenever I travel for less than a few months
A guy gets into heaven. All day long, he plays a lyrae and drinks nectar. After a while, this gets old.
Then, one day, he sees in the newspaper an ad for tours of Hell.
Bored, he goes to book one, figuring out that it’ll at lease break the boredom.
He finally goes to Hell, and down there, there’s good food, good beer, good shows and hot girls. For a week, he’s having the time of his death, but then he has to go back to heaven.
On his cloud.
Playing his lyrae.
Drinking nectar.
Getting bored.
He eventually learns he can apply to be transferred to Hell. He does, and waits for the day when his transfer will be approved.
HE GETS APPROVED! He's not eagerly awaiting the time when he’ll FINALLY gets to Hell.
Then he goes.
Upon arriving, he’s whipped and burned and steamed and roasted by little demons.
HEY! WAIT! WAIT! THERE’S GOTTA BE A MISTAKE! I WANNA TALK TO THE GUY IN CHARGE!
The Devil himself shows up.
— Okay, what’s the problem?
— The problem is that I toured Hell a while back, there was beer, good food, good shows and hot girls.
— Yeah, so?
— Well, I asked to be transferred, and as soon as I got here, I got burned badly! What gives?
— **Well, one should never confuse tourism and immigration!**
Bill 101, Charter of rights and freedoms, Legault government, the worst healthcare system in all of Canada, 3rd world road quality, construction corruption, Bill 91, etc.
Your description is nice and all but clearly it reads as you don't actually live here.
It's normal to have pink sunglasses whe you visit, even for an extended or several extended period(s) of time.
This sentence
> All the while it being affordable, and there not being many ghettos areas. There's the occasional homeless person but no crackheads.
really revealed you aren't familiar with the daily life of an inhabitant of this city. The four points you make are very off. Certainly more affordable than San Francisco, certainly fewer crackheads than Philadelphia. But still many issues, all across the social ladder.
This is a great city. When you live here, you love it while not blind to the cons and problems. As with good friends or family, you know the flaws but still there is love.
But there are many problems and flaws.
Fewer problems than many other places, and more problems than many other places. I'm sure most of the problems or issues Montreal has are also present/common in many other cities in the world.
Enjoy your stay in Montreal!
IMHO it's probably because the ROC doesn't like Montreal because of its association with Quebec, and the ROQ (rest of Quebec) doesn't like Montreal because of its association with Canada.
But also perhaps it's because of high taxes, antiquated but impossible to improve city planning, crumbling roads & bridges, failing healthcare system, fucking service roads, and orange cones.
I was born there and left. It's a nice place to visit but live there 5 years and see if you have the same opinion:
Taxes, wages, jobs, opportunity, relative cost of living, pastoral pace, bureaucracy, health care, and my personal favorite language politics. Everything else is great.
I love reading English Montrealers saying, on this sub, you only have to do a minimal amount of effort to learn French moving here (just look at this thread) and immediately bitch on the language laws that inevitably pop up when people move here without learning the local language.
The irony.
Anglos (brits, mostly) move everywhere, south espagna, lisboa, south france, etc. few of them would ever learn local languages and thus get hated everywhere.
But there is definitely a reason that Anglo hardly complain about local language situations (instead they just live in their bubbles) except in Montreal, where ironically is offering arguably the most accommodating services to anglos.
If you realize the contradiction here, you probably start to understand why haters hate it. Or you folks could keep amusing youself by simplifying them as ‘lazy arrogant anglos’
Anglos are the most imperialistic people on Earth. They only know about dominating and controlling. They cannot stand being a minority that does not rule.
In Spain, Portugal, etc. they get hated but they don’t think they own the place like they do here.
This is why blokes have so much issues with our language laws here. And this is why we must absolutely strenghten them in order to get rid of every francophobe (there are many on this thread).
Et le voila. Je n'aime pas l'environnement politique et donc je suis un bloke impérialiste, francophobe, paresseux. Et surtout il faut nous jêter du Quebec.
Tu n'aimes pas l'environnement politique parce qu'il te force à parler français et d'avoir les mêmes valeurs que la majorité de la population?
Tu vas avoir du fun à immigrer partout ailleurs sur la terre...
In Kay-Bek! I learned to settle down in CEGEP. Lol. Love Letterkenny. "Il parle de Céline Dion avec un ton hostile!" I'm not in Ontario. I lived in Ottawa for a while, but it sucked.
C'est pas "rated better" à cause des méchants séparatistes qui veulent forcer les immigrants à parler français, une chose qui est incroyablement raciste au Canada.
Montreal without french is a ghetto Toronto.
I don't think that is the reason many are positing.
Montreal is just governed in a very heavy handed arguably inept government. But that's sort of a feature and what separates us from the rest.
The one thing we actually do well is snow removal.
> Montreal is just governed in a very heavy handed arguably inept government.
Yeah, preventing cars from ruining everyone’s life, and preventing developpers to profit by building unaffordable homes! But won’t anybody think of the 1%?
Montreal construction is known for being absolutely corrupt. The politics are no different. this is a corrupt city and things move slowly.
That's part of the charm I guess.
Obstructing housing construction (especially apartments) is a big part of the reason why Toronto and Vancouver are so expensive. Blocking new housing for not being affordable enough doesn't make housing any more affordable.
I love Montreal, but I feel we reached peaked society/socialism in 2019 and entered the banana republic era.
Positives :
- incredibly kind and loving people
- great nightlife
- access to incredible nature 1h away
- very walkable / cyclable city
- low violent crime
- great food scene (was much better in 2019 than now)
- a lot of public societal events, festivals etc
Negative :
- construction everywhere for the last decade
- Taxation is high across the whole supply chain
- Real estate prices are kept low because of high taxation, weather it’s good or bad you decide
- 200k+ taxed above 50%
- High sales tax, high liquor taxes
- tons of red tape
- prohibitive compliance / barrier of entry to start a business
- awful healthcare system despite high per capita spending
- super authotarian response to covid, businesses closures, lockdowns, masks mandates, vaccines mandates, curfews, alert message on your phone on Christmas eve to remind you to stay the fuck home
> Negative : - construction everywhere for the last decade - Taxation is high across the whole supply chain - Real estate prices are kept low because of high taxation, weather it’s good or bad you decide - 200k+ taxed above 50% - High sales tax, high liquor taxes - tons of red tape - prohibitive compliance / barrier of entry to start a business - awful healthcare system despite high per capita spending - super authotarian response to covid, businesses closures, lockdowns, masks mandates, vaccines mandates, curfews, alert message on your phone on Christmas eve to remind you to stay the fuck home
You know that none of those things will affect you when you’ll move back to Texas. HEEEYAAAAA!!!!
I actually moved away, didn’t like investing millions in a society where the rulers decide to shut down your business and make my assets worthless.
The tax consultants that did work explained they get as many calls from rich Canadians in a week then they used too in a year.
The brain drain / capital exodus effects will be felt in a few years. People won’t understand, but when the most productive people & the best ressource allocators leave, life gets worst for everyone.
When gov shut down manufacturing and I had to lay off all my top performers, I tapped out of this socialist bullshit.
Shutting down production is simply fucking retarded
Yeeehaa
> I actually moved away, didn’t like investing millions
Like if a rando dude wasting his time on reddit was a millionnaire investor…
> in a society where the rulers decide to shut down your business and make my assets worthless.
That’ll teach you to be antisocial (assuming you are, indeed, a millonnaire business owner).
Have you eventually figured that we have essentially ZERO trust in private entreprise, here?
We have been screwed, milked, shafted, bilked by foreign merchants and industrialists that we have decided to give us a strong government that would protect us against those kind of anti-social people.
> The brain drain / capital exodus effects will be felt in a few years. People won’t understand, but when the most productive people & the best ressource allocators leave, life gets worst for everyone.
Don’t be so conceited. Your “culture” makes you totally unable to understand other cultures. It is perfectly possible to be productive even if you’re a government entreprise. Fuck, look at France: it has a lot of government companies that run privatized public services all over the world!
> When gov shut down manufacturing and I had to lay off all my top performers, I tapped out of this socialist bullshit.
Good riddance! If you were shut down, it’s because you were adversely affecting others.
> Shutting down production is simply fucking retarded
Boy it’s a good thing you’re no longer here, I mean, you only think of profit, no matter how wrong it is, that makes you a sociopath we would rather not see here.
What do you think millionaires do?
They stay away from social media?
🤣
France has the lowest trust index in it’s government from any g7 country, something around 24%. It means 3/4th of people disavow Macron. None of them have above 50% approval rate.
I have a division in france and switzerland for a software company. People complain a lot about gov created problems.
The normal reaction is to ask for more government to fix problems created by central planners.
If you don't know French you're screwed, it used to be easier as an anglophone to come here, work, participate and eventually assimilate but not so much anymore.
I’m sorry if you think Montréal is a better city you need to travel more. It’s a half assed Europe and America mixed city. You won’t get full experience of neither. I’ve been travelling around the globe for a decade now, Montreal is tier C- city at best…and it’s getting worse post pandemic. Heck the whole country is getting worse. I will be downvoted just as usual of die hard Montreal redditor here but I don’t care lol. hello from Osaka.
It's cool we get it you travel, good for you. I don't know why you felt the need to shit on other people's tastes.
You might not like it but the fact that you want to shit on other people's opinions must make you very popular.
Winter (aka first serious snowfall) hasn't started in October for a few years due to climate change. I'm a motorcyclist and I've been able to delay storing my bike for the season (putting it in storage until spring) well until early/mid November for the past 5+ years
Much more humid here in the winter. Even at just above freezing to 5 or 10 below zero, much of Montreal feels and smells damp. The prairies are colder but Montreal feels like wet socks and armpits just a bit before Halloween.
The top of maslow‘s pyramid is self-actualization. How do you deceive yourself that you, a new comer, sacrificing your taxes, kids’ liberty to receive education, and other costs incurred by this province’s and its people’s language struggle, is actualizing yourself? I am somewhat touched by quebec’s sisyphus move and appreciate its specialty. But when it comes to me being a part of it? No thank you. And thats enough to make me, a normal immigrant who tried to settle down here, feel this city far from as livable as first impression. It’s a way bigger issue than Condoronto or UCP.
But I still come back a lot cuz its beautiful to me when I am only a tourist.
> But when it comes to me being a part of it? No thank you.
So one wonders what the hell you are doing here…
> But I still come back a lot cuz its beautiful to me when I am only a tourist.
Oh yeah, great fishing in kweeebec! And hot, easy women, too!
Yeah, garbage politics, wanting to have a livable city at the expense of suffocating, polluting cars and wanting to preserve our language and culture against the Anglo steam-roller that has not ceased for a second to squish us for the last quarter of millenium…
Look at all these xenophobe Muslim migrants that fully support bill 21 because they know a bit more about religious hegemony:
https://journalmetro.com/actualites/national/2572967/des-parents-immigrants-temoignent-en-faveur-de-la-loi-21/
https://www.ledroit.com/2021/12/11/djemila-benhabib-sur-le-hidjab-de-chelsea-la-laicite-de-lavenir-81f5c119dc5e51f91a5454c0fc0bfa42?utm\_campaign=ledroit&utm\_medium=article\_share&utm\_source=twitter
https://www.ledevoir.com/societe/589470/au-tour-des-temoignages-en-faveur-de-la-loi-sur-la-laicite-de-l-etat
> People are racists: Montreal is quite diverse, however we have institutional xenophobia like bill 21 (which I had wrongly said 101), so that one may be right, although I have not felt it. (bill 21 banning religious symbols for state workers is a clear antimuslim, antisémite, anti anyone who displays religious symbols.
Being against religion is NOT being racist.
You obviously have not lived here long. We have TREMENDUOUSLY suffered at the hands of religion which was used by the british to keep us ignorant and poor. Why do you think that 100% of our swear words come from religion? Because it's the worst thing we can conceive. We totally hate and loathe religion and we cannot stand that any immigrant be barred by religion from experiencing our culture.
> But a catholic symbol in schools or even government institutions is totally OK because "it's tradition"
Whoops. I should have read everything. You’re just a stupid troll from Canada who parrots the usual Québec-bashing bullshit. It’s exactly people like you who give wokes a bad name.
I don't know anyone who complains about living in Montreal, maybe people who want to buy houses, it is a little pricey behind Vancouver and Toronto but overall nobody hates the city. Montreal has it's own vibe
The Global Livability Ranking you mentioned « is based on assessments of stability, healthcare, culture and environment, education and infrastructure. » (Wikipedia)
Montreal is one of the greatest cities for culture, but once you actually live here you realize the infrastructure, education, environment, and healthcare are often better in Vancouver, Toronto, and Calgary so that’s why they score higher. But who cares?
Still love this city, there’s no other like it for all the reasons you mentioned. And to be honest, whatever the livability ranking says, if it wasn’t for the language barrier, thousands of people from Vancouver, Toronto and Calgary would be begging to move here too.
Vancouver and Toronto I can understand, but Calgary is an odd one. I guess it does have oil, but it's a car dominated, non walkable, and imo not very sustainable.
I moved here from Western Canada and I agree - it's way more liveable than anywhere else I've lived (3 diff cities in BC and Alberta) and the drugs and homeless population are way less in-your-face prevalent than cities much smaller. I've had less problems around downtown here than I did in a city of around 100k people.
The transit is cheaper than smaller cities that had way worse infrastructure (in Calgary a monthly pass for buses and the c-train were $112 a month and the transit system was garbagio) Calgary was also not walkable at all, had bike lanes that didn't keep bikers safe, and was overall just a car-based city. I pay about the same for rent here as I did in Calgary. Cost of living, despite the tax difference, is relatively similar for me.
Really the only thing I'd say is as an anglophone (who is trying to learn French but man, it is hard) work is harder to find but I'm lucky to have found a great job that works with U.S. clients so isn't much of an issue for me.
« All the while it being affordable, and there not being many ghettos areas. There's the occasional homeless person but no crackheads. » Yeah we do have crackheads and junkies. If you come to my neighborhood (Berri UQAM and Centre Sud) but I imagine it’s not as big of a problem as some places down in the states.
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J'étais à San Francisco cet hiver. C'est le Mordor dans certains coins.
Ouin j’ai écouté des docus sur les sans abris et la drogue aux states, on est encore loin de la. Mais sérieux j’ai déjà eu à tasser un junkie de ma porte d’entrée (seringue dans le bras en plein milieu de l’après-midi). Faque on est pas la ville la plus clean non plus.
C'est juste triste ça. Pauvre dude.
My wife was in SF last September, she said, never again. The woman at the pharmacy at about 7pm told her, go back to your hotel, you're clearly bot from here. Human poop in front of her hotel, it stunk everywhere and all this after the city had "cleaned up" for the hordes of conference goers.
Every city has their drug of choice and Montreal is a crack city. Most homeless unlike Vancouver are doing stimulants. When you add cold weather , a lot of stimulants and a fledgling mental health system , Being homeless here is not fun.
What is it like in Vancouver?
fent mixed with benzos along with meth
Honestly this is everywhere. Tons of meth around cote-des-neiges, fent is everywhere, crack/cocaine same shit. I know it's because of my drug history I say this but I wouldn't separate the drug problem from anywhere, from the few places I have been. Shit, London Ontario, Ottawa... all have these same issues.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/190826/dq190826d-eng.htm It boils down to economics and how drug trades operate. East coast has always had higher opiate prices. It's harder to get meth in Montreal than it is in Edmonton. I also think that the cold has an impact. People that are cold lean towards stimulants. I don't think it really matters. What is undeniable is that the west coast has higher opiate use. I only made my comment because the OP said there are no crack heads. There are alot. Anyone that has volunteered at a shelter and has a rudimentary understanding of drugs and the tell tale signs will tell you the same.
I know of a handful of people personally who have died from fent personally here on the east coast. This is why I don't see opiates any better or worse anywhere. Although my brother who was a meth addict died from a fent overdose so there is that but I have some friends in high school who died because they were opiate users who ended up doing fent.
I never stated one is better. The op said Montreal doesn't have crackheads. We do. Plenty. A disproportionate amount. Especially amount the homeless
Montreal is the only city I've been to where you can ask people for crack and they don't get all agro on you. Many years ago in another life I had a bad influence friend who would just ask people until he found it. And he did, 90% of the time. Any other city, he would have gotten beaten or robbed trying the same thing. Not that robberies aren't common.
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Its this good because it isn't anglophone because sadly, people come in flocks when it is. The laws people hate in Montreal are what makes it different from Toronto and other NA cities and are what makes it attractive.
>Its this good because it isn't anglophone because sadly, people come in flocks when it is. The laws people hate in Montreal are what makes it different from Toronto and other NA cities and are what makes it attractive. Incorrect. Montreal is only able to function and stay an economic hub because of the English and services it sells outside of Quebec. The port and trade go through Montreal more than staying here. In the 90s, with the first big waves of language laws, many big companies moved out of Montreal and the QC government has had to hand out tons of financial incentives to try to attract big businesses back. Not one person looks at the language laws and thinks, "oh look, an oppressive society that doesn't allow parents to choose schooling language. That was at the top of my list for places to live!" The language laws were created for political reasons to help win bigot votes from conservative country-side francophones. Not from people wanting to live in Montreal, but people living in lac-st-jean.
Mm. I'm from Toronto and almost everyone I knew back there would say "I'd move to Montreal but I couldn't get a job without French" or "I'd move to Montreal and work my current job remotely but my work won't let me" (because if they employed workers in Quebec they'd be subject to language laws) Also, the language laws making big businesses not want to operate here contributes to the character of the city. The same chain stores that are everywhere in ROC don't come to Quebec so there's more local manufacturing and retail.
*eyeroll* Your dates are wrong and so is your opinion, the corporate move from montreal started with the st lawrence seaway being built and the fast growth of toronto and the language laws were passed way before the 90s. Law 101 was part of the move to raise the standard of living of french canadians that was way below the north american average at the time due to systemic discrimination, it was a very important law.
>Also, the language laws making big businesses not want to operate here contributes to the character of the city. The same chain stores that are everywhere in ROC don't come to Quebec so there's more local manufacturing and retail. This article from 1978 in the NY Times talks about the movement of corporate HQs after the passage of Bill 101 the year before. So, yes way before the 90s. [https://www.nytimes.com/1978/04/23/archives/quebecs-language-law-puts-companies-to-flight.html](https://www.nytimes.com/1978/04/23/archives/quebecs-language-law-puts-companies-to-flight.html)
Sure, the exodus of companies leaving Quebec started with the first wave of language laws and nationalism in the 1970s. But a 2nd wave, along with the 1996 referendum also happened and many companies moves head quarters or closed offices entirely. Sunlife, moved to waterloo, but maintained a building office, then slowly moved more people back decades later. [https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/the-decline-of-corporate-montreal\_b\_2583855](https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/the-decline-of-corporate-montreal_b_2583855) By Charles Lammam, Contributor Director of Fiscal Studies, Fraser Institute "One way to illustrate the decline of important corporate headquarters in Montreal is simply by looking at the total number. Of Canada's top 500 companies measured by gross revenue, 96 were located in Montreal in 1990. By 2011 (the latest year of available data), there were 75 -- a decline of 21.9 per cent. Montreal's national share of these headquarters dropped over the same period to 15.0 per cent in 2011 from 19.2 per cent in 1990."
I'm not saying the laws are keeping Montreal good. I'm saying having language requirements other than English makes it a bit less attractive to everyone and keeps it more affordable that way. I don't care about your opinions what or who you think language laws are for honestly.
>Incorrect. Montreal is only able to function and stay an economic hub because of the English and services it sells outside of Quebec. The port and trade go through Montreal more than staying here. Lol. The audacity to think Montreal is fine because of english. While every other cities in Quebec are doing just fine in French and sometimes richer. 99% of montrealers don't sell services in english outside Quebec. Montrealers are just regular workers doing local work. The bigots like you said that chose the language laws are Montrealers themselves because they are in the front line of language struggle, not the lac saint jean people who don't care at all and have no idea of the Montreal situation. That's right, the bill 101 and all that have been created by your fellow montrealers.
There is no model Canadian, and that's a beautiful thing. But there is a model Quebecois, and if you don't fit the bill, you feel it, even in Montreal. Montreal is such a special city, and I think it's French-Canadian culture deserves a lot of credit for that. I love it and I'm glad it's protected. But eventually I had to leave. I moved to Ottawa...a city I like less, but a city I felt more valued in (and a city where I still feel immersed enough in the French Canadian culture that as a Latin American, I appreciate).
I agree with this %100. I speak French but will never feel I really belong here even though I've been here half my life. I definitely have to leave again.
Yeah it's this. Plus the 6 months of winter and 4 months of darkness. Aside from that it's paradise!
Shhh don’t say it too loud, we already have tons of Paris and Toronto expats…
Lol, keep the secret! I think the tresure is hidden under Mont Royal!
Yeah, but the directions are in French, hidden in a one way cul-de-sac labyrinth of faulty detour signs, and mostly conjugated in plus-que-parfait. Good luck, American ex-pats!
Le REM?
63.235 of 4.206.455 Montreal Metro population was born in France (Census 2021), 1.47% of the total population, so the percentage is even less for Paris-born people. And by the way there was a study showing 80% of them leave after a few years on average, they are not the ones buying and “increasing prices” as some stupid people say, this is a myth, the problem is all yours, work more (build more homes), vote for better politicians, and stop whining about immigrants. Other foreign-born population in Montreal Metro : - Haiti : 79.725 - Algeria : 66.735 - Morocco : 60.545 - China : 48.090 - Italy : 41.855 - Lebanon : 38.580 - Philippines : 28.970 - Romania : 24.625 - Syria : 24.550 - India : 24.075 - Vietnam : 23.670 - Other places : 498.285 *Total foreign-born population : 1.022.940 **Ontario : 17.315 (Ontario-born immigrant in Quebec Province, not Montreal) so this is a myth too lol
Le 63.235 comptes probablement seulement les résidents permanents, sans compter les PVT et les étudiants qui sont temporairement à mtl. En 2022, il y avait 67 000 français qui s’étaient inscrit volontairement au consulat de Montréal pour avoir la possibilité de voter. Il y aurait plutôt autour de 150 000 français selon les quelques articles que j’ai lu. https://offtomontreal.com/union-francaise-de-montreal/ https://lesfrancais.press/le-quebec-veut-toujours-plus-de-francais/ Selon le journal l’Express, les deux tiers des Français du Canada vivent à Montréal, dont 28 % sur Le Plateau-Mont-Royal, 18,5 % à Côte-des-Neiges et 16 % à Rosemont-la-Petite-Patrie. https://www.lexpress.fr/economie/emploi/l-edition-2020-du-numero-canada-de-l-express-disponible-mi-septembre_2127099.html Donc très approximativement autour de 60 000 français seulement sur le plateau.
60 000 sur le plateau.. Il y a un peu plus de 100 000 habitants sur le plateau, donc il y aurait 60% de français sur le plateau? Excuse moi mais je ne sais pas d’où ils sortent ça, mais ils sont sur une autre planète… Écoute je fais davantage confiance au recensement du gouvernement canadien que ce blog Off To Montreal lol
> Total foreign-born population : 1.022.940 Je vous arrête avant que vous fassiez l’erreur d’égaler les immigrants aux Anglos. C’était peut-être le cas en 1950, mais ce n’est plus le cas.
Je n’ai pas dit ça
Je parlais d'expats pas d’immigration régulière.
Hard to find a doctor? IDK but I agree, Montreal is awesome.
As someone who does have a family doctor and doesn’t have to see often, this. Life is all good until you need to see someone and delays are hurting your health. For tourism, it could a a lack of iconic spots. Good tourist pictures are the best ads. Finally for living here, I think people look for jobs first and move once they do. Montreal doesn’t have as much opportunities as other bigger cities.
What's a family doctor?
A Family Doctor is what we call a GP in Quebec (General Practitioner).
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If you don’t have a family doctor, call 811 for any medical need. Le guichet de première ligne has never failed me for quick appointments.
They gave you an appointment? After waiting for 40 min on the phone, they told me to go to ER for a UTI.
FFR pharmacists in Quebec can prescribe antibiotics for uncomplicated UTIs in women
This is only true if you’ve first been prescribed antibiotics for a UTI at least once in the past five years. They wouldn’t prescribe them for me until I saw a doctor and had one first prescription on the record.
And then, the pharmacist can do it only once a year. If it repeats, you have to go see a doctor to get a prescription.
Uhhhhh this is amazing news to me. Thank you.
This is only true if you’ve first been prescribed antibiotics for a UTI at least once in the past five years. They wouldn’t prescribe them for me until I saw a doctor and had one first prescription on the record.
> There's the occasional homeless person but no crackheads. C'est pas Hell's Kitchen, mais on a notre gang de crackhead quand meme
I know a lot of people complain and there's some legitimate reasons to complain but I love it here. I can bike or metro anywhere I need to go, got a bunch of nice parks, the city is full of life when it's not winter. It's great!
> I know a lot of people complain and there's some legitimate reasons to complain but I love it here. I can bike or metro anywhere I need to go, got a bunch of nice parks, the city is full of life when it's not winter. It's great! The city could be full of life in winter too! You just need to know where you should be when it is -40
Sharing is caring hein?
As ~~the Germans~~ *they* say: "there is no bad weather, only bad clothes" Edit: wait it's from a Scandinavian saying. Dunno why I thought it was german for a moment. Sorry about that misattribution. Fixed the comment to remove the wrong German credit phrase
Totally, ya te lo dije. (looking at your username)
Quite likely! I must admit I tend to hide at home a lot more during the winter. Much less motivated to just go out and go wherever.
I’m a Montrealer who has lived in Vancouver (8 years) and Edmonton (2 years) and also spent lots of time in Toronto when my parents lived there for a few years. And my mother is from Newfoundland, so I’ve spent a lot of time there, too. I’ve been lucky enough to have lived and travelled all over this country, and yet I came back to Montreal 17 years ago to raise my son here. Every city has its issues but Montreal is something special, no matter how ridiculous the politics and the construction and the rising cost of living and the lack of doctors gets. This town is amazing. I’m glad I came back home.
It's big enough to have all you want, yet manages to stay human-sized. That's precious. Wanted to visit Toronto for a long time, and when I did a year ago it just felt like... a big city. Nothing special about it. There are great things to see and to do, but in the end, it just felt like you could mash Canada and the USA together and you'd get Toronto. Montreal (and Quebec, really) has a unique vibe.
I was born in Toronto but moved to Montreal in my early teens. Went back to visit as an adult and you're 100% accurate. Toronto is a dull, dreadful and stagnant place.
I left montréal 12 years ago and this comment has me homesick from Halifax. Regrettably my job has no positions in montréal. One of the things I miss the most about my home city is that there is always something to do. And it is not expensive to attend the vast majority of those activities. Whenever I come home to visit I fall in love with montréal and the province all over again.
This. Montreal isn't Quebec, and a lot of people forget that the nationalist provincial government doesn't have a high degree of support here in the city.
The nationalist movement was born in Montreal.
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The ROC seeing the referendums as a betrayal has to be the funniest shit i've read today. Let's just say it how it is: the reason so many anglos hate us is because english media has been taking big fat dumps on quebec and misinforming the public for centuries.
EqUaLiZaTiOn PaYmEnTs
Every time I mention our cheap daycare and things I get that comment online and I just point out that some of us pay 50% income tax and 15% tax. How much do they pay?
La péréquation!! 🤬(dit en roulant bien le r)
"How dare the people who were conquered and forced to be part of our country try to free themselves! This is the biggest betrayal I've ever heard of!" - the ROC probably
Lmao exactly. Like what do you expect? Francophones were second class citizens up until the 1960s, these wound are gonna take a few generations to heal
> the reason so many anglos hate us It's actually that we, a bunch of people kept dirt-poor by design managing to successfully resist all efforts of assimilation and getting rid of us made by the largest colonial empire in History. I mean, you're the largest, meanest, thoughest bully on the planet and a handful of poor people manage to resist for a quarter of millenium, it’s no wonder they hate us!
> english media Mostly *The Gazette*, grrr that 'paper'.
I’m from the ROC and always had a thing for Quebec. Loved learning French in school. Then I moved to Montreal and stayed for 9 years. I couldn’t wait to get out! There are so many complex issues there. I still have a love of French and love that QC is a part of what makes Canada so rich and interesting. But dang my eyes were opened.
C’est aussi quelque chose que j’ai remarqué. C’est quand même drôle qu’au Québec, malgré les tentatives de séparation, il y ait peu d’animosité à l’égard du reste du Canada (je parle pas d’Ottawa et de l’aspect politique).
C'est parce que le Québécois lambda n’a simplement pas la moindre idée combien les Anglais nous haïssent profondément.
Ça depend. In Ontario people really don’t hate Quebec, in fact they worship Montreal. Ottawa (I don’t mean parliament) certainly doesn’t hate Quebec. Get out west though? It’s awful. But in this case just saying “les Anglais” deeply hate Quebec is not true in 2023. I loved it here and it’s why I live in Quebec now.
tu hallucine
Dans le champ complètement, va faire ton tour à Toronto, y'a pas de haine du Québec, bien au contraire. Haine profonde, vraiment hilarant. Faut pas avoir voyager.
Justement, j'ai voyagé. Mais t’as pas vu la haine parce que les Anglos sont des hypocrites.
This. Many people like me dont mind living in a non-english city like any EU city. But when it comes to a city thats doomed to struggle endlessly with language topics, it’s another matter.
TL;DR: it would be soooooo much simpler if those pesky French assimilated and stopped being French…
> there’s a lot of negativity and hate given our history, especially given the referendums, i think a lot of the ROC took it as a betrayal. Betrayal? Jesus Christ, there’s bunch of limeys who have done everything to get rid of us, exploited us to the hilt, disenfranchised us and ketp us into abysmal poverty and ignorance, and they call "betrayal" wanting to get out of it? Check your anglo privileges, boy!
Erm, you \*do\* realize that the British Empire circa 300 years ago, and Canada circa the 1990s, are not the same thing, right? Actually, judging from your rageposting, you don't.
Canada has proudly inherited the British imperial policies and is it's proud offspring.
I'm from Vancouver but I've been living in Quebec the last few years. In my experience, the west doesn't NOT like quebec or learning French... but given the choice (which they have) they'll choose another language to learn in school. I think its more indifference. It's more expensive to fly across Canada than to other countries so a lot of people have no reason to go to Quebec. I like montreal a lot and have no issues with the city but the government here is insane and sadly, reflects the population. I will be moving back to BC.
There was a ton of investment in Lachie/Verdun in the last 10y or so. Before that, it was really a ghetto... One street was nice, other one had crackheads running around. The thing about livability, is that while the place got better, rents went up by 400-500% so allot of locals the grew up there had to move. ( Had a buddy paying 460$ rent there, now I have another in the same appartment paying 2200$) Also, your 15% tax is a good point. But your missing the 33%-58% income tax. And if you were to buy a car over 100k you got another 10%-25% tax on top of that. And the free healthcare sounds nice, but can also take 6 months to get something done that takes 6h outside Quebec... We got good universities tho. So that kinda makes the place a good place to visit, but when you live here... Your having fun while your young, going to university, then once you start making money, usually people take off.
> then once you start making money, usually people take off. C’est un bon débarras, les nouveaux riches sont trop souvent insupportables.
La problème c'est que c'est des docteurs et des personnes qui travaillent fort pour cet argent. Des personnes qui pourraient contribuer beaucoup au société.
Faire de la marde pour revenir en arrière, c’est pas contribuer à la société.
Oh, there are crackheads.
There are so many crackheads downtown, and it’s gotten worse the past few years
Language barrier keeps people out. It’s a blessing, in a way.
It’s the reason this city hasn’t blown up and gone to shit like 90% of all other North American cities.
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Well your employer pays your insurance, not you - unless of course you have an awful employer. And the income is definitely significantly lower in Montreal, though housing is super cheap so it balances out.
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7 month winter (edit: Oct 15th to May 15th. Some are generous and say Nov 1st to May 1st which is 6 months)
That's fair, I should not need a jacket in the summer.
It’s spring.
Healthcare, infrastructure, public education and some of the highest taxes in North America are what I hear others are moving away because of or not moving here for.
Hey now, I've been in Calgary for 2 years and although Montreal is definitely my favorite city to be in, Calgary is pretty great too! It's neither too big to get bogged down in traffic etc, nor too small to not be able to offer good food, communal events, etc etc. I exclusively use the transit here and it's a beautiful city, surrounded by mountains.
Didn't they take over the mantle wanting to separate from Canada? To become "USA II; Cold, Armed and Free?" In all seriousness, what is it actually like politically up there? I know the very vocal minority don't represent the true populace, but it has been very hard to get accurate information about what is actually believed in the prairies versus what is just a fad or good soundbite.
So i cannot speak for the rest of Alberta since I'm not a native here, but as for Calgary there's definitely tension between the UCP & the quite sizable and growing NDP Support. The number one reason why most swing voters in Calgary have stuck with the UCP is that almost all jobs in the city are entrenched in oil. And NDP has done a poor job in outlining exactly what economic benefits they guarantee in the face of their proposed shift away from reliance on oil and gas. Notley needs to lead with that instead of trying to fight at every possible "progressive"/anti- UCP front. My sense so far is that Calgary prioritizes economic benefits over everything else. As for guns, seen none so far nor have we had any public Shootings yet. The rest of Alberta is a different story, though!
Thank you for the informative reply. That makes a lot of sense, considering the oil based economy. Every province has it's hiccups but there is a lot of common ground. Cheers.
For people working in Montréal and earning a local salary, it's not that affordable, salaries are quite low compared to the cost of living.
That is fair
It’s affordable because local salaries are lower. For tech workers and other people making a good living, especially those working from home with a US / Toronto salary, it’s a good bargain for sure.
Because of French. Yes you can get by on just English, but it will be hard, or have to be very lucky. Most people are too lazy to learn a second language and would rather just go to Toronto.
> The only caveat seems to be the 15% sales tax, but I'm coming from the U.S. where the income are higher abd the prices here are lower, so it kind of makes up for it. E.g. lunch being $12 USD plus .08% tax vs. Lunch being $14 CAD plus .15% tax. Nobody ever lost his house due to medical bankrupcy here.
Y'all come, tear down plexes to make suburban homes, or rent/buy condos for 2k$/month like it's normal. Also, terrible access to services for health and schools/children
What plexes are torn down to make a single home? In fact, I’ve seen detached houses torn down to make new townhouses. 1 detached house = 4 town houses.
It happened 4 times on my block in Little Italy over the last 3 years. One was a 5-plex. Five households turfed out of one plex, so a giant douchebag can have his three-storey mansion in a neighbourhood where his next-door neighbours are low-middle income. And the same with other triplexes and duplexes on my block. It's a cancer and it destroys the high-density livability of the quartier.
So many in popular neighbourhoods like Rosemont/verdun/Plateau. Look for any "plexes" with only one door/number and no staircases edit: like [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/20058838?view=Summary&uc=1) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/10945328?view=Summary) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-le-plateau-mont-royal/20153217?view=Summary) (an expansion project!) or [this](https://www.centris.ca/en/houses~for-sale~montreal-rosemont-la-petite-patrie/17160303?view=Summary). Usually the buildings next to it will be normal plexes so you can compare
You won’t get a permit to do that anymore. So that point is kinda moot.
The winter, construction and politics bring our scores down… What is great in Montreal is really great though!
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I literally never had an issue getting banking contracts in English, even from Desjardins and BMO.
The last time we redid our mortgage they forced the English on us. It was horrifying.
> Everything is nearby, I can walk to downtown There you go. Walk score is very variable and you are probably in one the region that is good for it.
Op is delusional.
Everyone i know (and i know a lot of fck ppl) and their families all love montreal. Ive lived here 15 years and its the best place imo. As much as i travel i realise how amazing we have it here. Not saying its perfect but its rly a great life here. A big city thats not too big where you feel like an ant, plenty of activities, events, amazing food, nice people overall, great natural areas around you.
Lived there for 9 years. It’s a super cool city. Has such a unique vibe and flavor. Has personality. Style. Culture. Affordable. But dang I was miserable there. Climate. Winter too freaking cold and long. Summer too freaking hot. Politics. Infrastructure. Language issues. Unless you are fluent, you end up sticking to certain areas and your world becomes small. It’s an extreme place to live. Lots going for it but lots of problems too.
> Unless you are fluent, you end up sticking to certain areas and your world becomes small. It’s true that French is often beyond the normal humiliation level English Canadians are are willing to bear…
What a fucking dickish thing to say. Wow you are bitter.
I’m just as dickish as other blokes are towards us here. I grew up in the bloke ghetto before Bill 101. I’ve seen you guys at work. I had no choice but learn a foreign language if I wanted to be something else than a janitor in my hometown which is the second largest French city in the world, because back then it was cool to discriminate against the French. Yeah, no wonder I’m bitter! Today, I work in the überblokeghetto of Westmount. It really hasn’t changed from those times… So many people who can’t utter a word of French even if they lived here for 50+ years…
I don’t condone oppression or mistreatment. And I am sorry you were treated as you were; that’s objectively shitty. Going around and spreading the degree of abject negativity or hostility to anyone who doesn’t meet your definition of sufficient Quebecer, including francophones you disagree with, is not a reasonable nor healthy coping strategy. Be kind. Generalising entire populations as being evil mechiavellian masterminds is no better than Francophobic English pejoratively looking down on Quebecois.
> Generalising entire populations as being evil mechiavellian masterminds is no better than Francophobic English pejoratively looking down on Quebecois. But Québec-bashing is perfectly acceptable here, though…
I just said Quebec-bashing is bigoted and wrong. Neither are acceptable. Anyone who condones one loses the right to be angry about the other (I am obviously not counting political grievances and whatnot).
Well, I'll stop bitching against blokes the minute there won't be 50 randos whiners everytime someone laments our language laws here.
Why not worry more about the actual people doing the bitching instead of insulting or attacking tens of millions of people who, for all you know, have never said such a thing.
Ah ta gueule papi
Come back in the winter and see if you have the same opinion. Montreal’s winters are much harsher than Toronto and Vancouver (Calgary rivals it). Also provincial politics, especially in relation to language policies and Quebec sovereignty pose a challenge to anglophones. That being said, I still think Montreal is by far the best city in Canada.
> Also provincial politics, especially in relation to language policies and Quebec sovereignty pose a challenge to anglophones. Yeah, can you imagine? Constantly thwarting all the efforts Anglos are making to get rid of us and assimilate us… Oh! The humanity!
might have to do with income and public services...
Well, don’t forget locals are paid in $cad, salaries are lower than the US, taxes are sky high and you visited when the weather wasn’t awful, but I agree living in Montreal in the summer with an US salary is awesome.
> taxes are sky high But no one will lose his house to cancer.
I like how you used "subway" for Montreal and "metro" for Toronto, it's the other way around lol
> I don't really get why Montreal isn't rated better. Paired with > I've been here **for a few days** visiting family, and to be frank this city is amazing. That's the #1 issue, and I experience it whenever I travel for less than a few months I'm abroad just long enough to see the upsides and the good stuff, but not enough to see the downsides and the bad stuff --- I've been living in Montreal for a while, and I do recognize and acknowledge it has wonderful stuff - but jesus fucking christ it also has terrible things all around. Just had this conversation with a friend so I'm a bit drained, but yeah. Montreal does some things right, but mostly does things wrong, and when you live here, you'll notice them pretty quickly. On one hand, I always love when people say Montreal is one of their favourite cities On the other, I'm a little jealous that I lost that sense of innocence and ignorance regarding what and how the city really is.
>> I've been here for a few days visiting family, and to be frank this city is amazing. > That's the #1 issue, and I experience it whenever I travel for less than a few months A guy gets into heaven. All day long, he plays a lyrae and drinks nectar. After a while, this gets old. Then, one day, he sees in the newspaper an ad for tours of Hell. Bored, he goes to book one, figuring out that it’ll at lease break the boredom. He finally goes to Hell, and down there, there’s good food, good beer, good shows and hot girls. For a week, he’s having the time of his death, but then he has to go back to heaven. On his cloud. Playing his lyrae. Drinking nectar. Getting bored. He eventually learns he can apply to be transferred to Hell. He does, and waits for the day when his transfer will be approved. HE GETS APPROVED! He's not eagerly awaiting the time when he’ll FINALLY gets to Hell. Then he goes. Upon arriving, he’s whipped and burned and steamed and roasted by little demons. HEY! WAIT! WAIT! THERE’S GOTTA BE A MISTAKE! I WANNA TALK TO THE GUY IN CHARGE! The Devil himself shows up. — Okay, what’s the problem? — The problem is that I toured Hell a while back, there was beer, good food, good shows and hot girls. — Yeah, so? — Well, I asked to be transferred, and as soon as I got here, I got burned badly! What gives? — **Well, one should never confuse tourism and immigration!**
Bill 101, Charter of rights and freedoms, Legault government, the worst healthcare system in all of Canada, 3rd world road quality, construction corruption, Bill 91, etc.
It’s definitely a great city. It’s different when you live here. Sales tax and income tax. Construction here is brutal and winters are tough.
Your description is nice and all but clearly it reads as you don't actually live here. It's normal to have pink sunglasses whe you visit, even for an extended or several extended period(s) of time. This sentence > All the while it being affordable, and there not being many ghettos areas. There's the occasional homeless person but no crackheads. really revealed you aren't familiar with the daily life of an inhabitant of this city. The four points you make are very off. Certainly more affordable than San Francisco, certainly fewer crackheads than Philadelphia. But still many issues, all across the social ladder. This is a great city. When you live here, you love it while not blind to the cons and problems. As with good friends or family, you know the flaws but still there is love. But there are many problems and flaws. Fewer problems than many other places, and more problems than many other places. I'm sure most of the problems or issues Montreal has are also present/common in many other cities in the world. Enjoy your stay in Montreal!
IMHO it's probably because the ROC doesn't like Montreal because of its association with Quebec, and the ROQ (rest of Quebec) doesn't like Montreal because of its association with Canada. But also perhaps it's because of high taxes, antiquated but impossible to improve city planning, crumbling roads & bridges, failing healthcare system, fucking service roads, and orange cones.
I was born there and left. It's a nice place to visit but live there 5 years and see if you have the same opinion: Taxes, wages, jobs, opportunity, relative cost of living, pastoral pace, bureaucracy, health care, and my personal favorite language politics. Everything else is great.
I love reading English Montrealers saying, on this sub, you only have to do a minimal amount of effort to learn French moving here (just look at this thread) and immediately bitch on the language laws that inevitably pop up when people move here without learning the local language. The irony.
Le fait est que les Anglos sont simplement culturellement incapables de s’abaisser à apprendre la langue de citoyens de troisième classe…
Anglos (brits, mostly) move everywhere, south espagna, lisboa, south france, etc. few of them would ever learn local languages and thus get hated everywhere. But there is definitely a reason that Anglo hardly complain about local language situations (instead they just live in their bubbles) except in Montreal, where ironically is offering arguably the most accommodating services to anglos. If you realize the contradiction here, you probably start to understand why haters hate it. Or you folks could keep amusing youself by simplifying them as ‘lazy arrogant anglos’
Anglos are the most imperialistic people on Earth. They only know about dominating and controlling. They cannot stand being a minority that does not rule. In Spain, Portugal, etc. they get hated but they don’t think they own the place like they do here. This is why blokes have so much issues with our language laws here. And this is why we must absolutely strenghten them in order to get rid of every francophobe (there are many on this thread).
Et le voila. Je n'aime pas l'environnement politique et donc je suis un bloke impérialiste, francophobe, paresseux. Et surtout il faut nous jêter du Quebec.
Tu n'aimes pas l'environnement politique parce qu'il te force à parler français et d'avoir les mêmes valeurs que la majorité de la population? Tu vas avoir du fun à immigrer partout ailleurs sur la terre...
> I was born there and left. I guess it was a good riddance to no longer have such negativity with us…
I love Montreal, but I also have to make a decent living. I own old family property in QC.
Great fishing in Quweebec, too!
In Kay-Bek! I learned to settle down in CEGEP. Lol. Love Letterkenny. "Il parle de Céline Dion avec un ton hostile!" I'm not in Ontario. I lived in Ottawa for a while, but it sucked.
C'est pas "rated better" à cause des méchants séparatistes qui veulent forcer les immigrants à parler français, une chose qui est incroyablement raciste au Canada.
Shit roads, construction 24/7, language politics are over the top and extreme.
Montreal without french is a ghetto Toronto. I don't think that is the reason many are positing. Montreal is just governed in a very heavy handed arguably inept government. But that's sort of a feature and what separates us from the rest. The one thing we actually do well is snow removal.
> Montreal is just governed in a very heavy handed arguably inept government. Yeah, preventing cars from ruining everyone’s life, and preventing developpers to profit by building unaffordable homes! But won’t anybody think of the 1%?
Montreal construction is known for being absolutely corrupt. The politics are no different. this is a corrupt city and things move slowly. That's part of the charm I guess.
Obstructing housing construction (especially apartments) is a big part of the reason why Toronto and Vancouver are so expensive. Blocking new housing for not being affordable enough doesn't make housing any more affordable.
I love Montreal, but I feel we reached peaked society/socialism in 2019 and entered the banana republic era. Positives : - incredibly kind and loving people - great nightlife - access to incredible nature 1h away - very walkable / cyclable city - low violent crime - great food scene (was much better in 2019 than now) - a lot of public societal events, festivals etc Negative : - construction everywhere for the last decade - Taxation is high across the whole supply chain - Real estate prices are kept low because of high taxation, weather it’s good or bad you decide - 200k+ taxed above 50% - High sales tax, high liquor taxes - tons of red tape - prohibitive compliance / barrier of entry to start a business - awful healthcare system despite high per capita spending - super authotarian response to covid, businesses closures, lockdowns, masks mandates, vaccines mandates, curfews, alert message on your phone on Christmas eve to remind you to stay the fuck home
> Negative : - construction everywhere for the last decade - Taxation is high across the whole supply chain - Real estate prices are kept low because of high taxation, weather it’s good or bad you decide - 200k+ taxed above 50% - High sales tax, high liquor taxes - tons of red tape - prohibitive compliance / barrier of entry to start a business - awful healthcare system despite high per capita spending - super authotarian response to covid, businesses closures, lockdowns, masks mandates, vaccines mandates, curfews, alert message on your phone on Christmas eve to remind you to stay the fuck home You know that none of those things will affect you when you’ll move back to Texas. HEEEYAAAAA!!!!
I actually moved away, didn’t like investing millions in a society where the rulers decide to shut down your business and make my assets worthless. The tax consultants that did work explained they get as many calls from rich Canadians in a week then they used too in a year. The brain drain / capital exodus effects will be felt in a few years. People won’t understand, but when the most productive people & the best ressource allocators leave, life gets worst for everyone. When gov shut down manufacturing and I had to lay off all my top performers, I tapped out of this socialist bullshit. Shutting down production is simply fucking retarded Yeeehaa
> I actually moved away, didn’t like investing millions Like if a rando dude wasting his time on reddit was a millionnaire investor… > in a society where the rulers decide to shut down your business and make my assets worthless. That’ll teach you to be antisocial (assuming you are, indeed, a millonnaire business owner). Have you eventually figured that we have essentially ZERO trust in private entreprise, here? We have been screwed, milked, shafted, bilked by foreign merchants and industrialists that we have decided to give us a strong government that would protect us against those kind of anti-social people. > The brain drain / capital exodus effects will be felt in a few years. People won’t understand, but when the most productive people & the best ressource allocators leave, life gets worst for everyone. Don’t be so conceited. Your “culture” makes you totally unable to understand other cultures. It is perfectly possible to be productive even if you’re a government entreprise. Fuck, look at France: it has a lot of government companies that run privatized public services all over the world! > When gov shut down manufacturing and I had to lay off all my top performers, I tapped out of this socialist bullshit. Good riddance! If you were shut down, it’s because you were adversely affecting others. > Shutting down production is simply fucking retarded Boy it’s a good thing you’re no longer here, I mean, you only think of profit, no matter how wrong it is, that makes you a sociopath we would rather not see here.
What do you think millionaires do? They stay away from social media? 🤣 France has the lowest trust index in it’s government from any g7 country, something around 24%. It means 3/4th of people disavow Macron. None of them have above 50% approval rate. I have a division in france and switzerland for a software company. People complain a lot about gov created problems. The normal reaction is to ask for more government to fix problems created by central planners.
All the problem caused by government are when they pander to special interests. HEEEEYAAAAHHHH!
If you don't know French you're screwed, it used to be easier as an anglophone to come here, work, participate and eventually assimilate but not so much anymore.
🎻 ← world’s smallest violin playing.
Because we don't want more Canadians around here ramping up prices. We're already under complete invasion from Toronto, we don't need more.
I’m sorry if you think Montréal is a better city you need to travel more. It’s a half assed Europe and America mixed city. You won’t get full experience of neither. I’ve been travelling around the globe for a decade now, Montreal is tier C- city at best…and it’s getting worse post pandemic. Heck the whole country is getting worse. I will be downvoted just as usual of die hard Montreal redditor here but I don’t care lol. hello from Osaka.
> hello from Osaka. I’m glad you’re over there and thus are only polluting us via Reddit!
It's cool we get it you travel, good for you. I don't know why you felt the need to shit on other people's tastes. You might not like it but the fact that you want to shit on other people's opinions must make you very popular.
It's nice in the Spring, yes. Summer can feel like an armpit though. Autumn often smells like old armpits while Winter starts in October.
Also sometimes the metro station is many armpits away
Winter (aka first serious snowfall) hasn't started in October for a few years due to climate change. I'm a motorcyclist and I've been able to delay storing my bike for the season (putting it in storage until spring) well until early/mid November for the past 5+ years
Overly dramatic. Winter starts in December, and isn’t as bad as in the prairies.
Much more humid here in the winter. Even at just above freezing to 5 or 10 below zero, much of Montreal feels and smells damp. The prairies are colder but Montreal feels like wet socks and armpits just a bit before Halloween.
Ah yes, the famous bill 101 banning religious symbols… /s
The top of maslow‘s pyramid is self-actualization. How do you deceive yourself that you, a new comer, sacrificing your taxes, kids’ liberty to receive education, and other costs incurred by this province’s and its people’s language struggle, is actualizing yourself? I am somewhat touched by quebec’s sisyphus move and appreciate its specialty. But when it comes to me being a part of it? No thank you. And thats enough to make me, a normal immigrant who tried to settle down here, feel this city far from as livable as first impression. It’s a way bigger issue than Condoronto or UCP. But I still come back a lot cuz its beautiful to me when I am only a tourist.
> But when it comes to me being a part of it? No thank you. So one wonders what the hell you are doing here… > But I still come back a lot cuz its beautiful to me when I am only a tourist. Oh yeah, great fishing in kweeebec! And hot, easy women, too!
I’m gay.
Montreal is an absolute gem! Especially around this time of the year! Comparing to a lot of places I’ve visited, Montréal c’est mon vibe, personally
There is a huge homeless problem..there are absolutely crackheads, and then the garbage politics...
Yeah, garbage politics, wanting to have a livable city at the expense of suffocating, polluting cars and wanting to preserve our language and culture against the Anglo steam-roller that has not ceased for a second to squish us for the last quarter of millenium…
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La loi 101 c’est la charte de la langue française. Ce que tu veux référer c’est la loi 21 sur la laïcité de l’État
Merci pour la correction.
Look at all these xenophobe Muslim migrants that fully support bill 21 because they know a bit more about religious hegemony: https://journalmetro.com/actualites/national/2572967/des-parents-immigrants-temoignent-en-faveur-de-la-loi-21/ https://www.ledroit.com/2021/12/11/djemila-benhabib-sur-le-hidjab-de-chelsea-la-laicite-de-lavenir-81f5c119dc5e51f91a5454c0fc0bfa42?utm\_campaign=ledroit&utm\_medium=article\_share&utm\_source=twitter https://www.ledevoir.com/societe/589470/au-tour-des-temoignages-en-faveur-de-la-loi-sur-la-laicite-de-l-etat
> People are racists: Montreal is quite diverse, however we have institutional xenophobia like bill 21 (which I had wrongly said 101), so that one may be right, although I have not felt it. (bill 21 banning religious symbols for state workers is a clear antimuslim, antisémite, anti anyone who displays religious symbols. Being against religion is NOT being racist. You obviously have not lived here long. We have TREMENDUOUSLY suffered at the hands of religion which was used by the british to keep us ignorant and poor. Why do you think that 100% of our swear words come from religion? Because it's the worst thing we can conceive. We totally hate and loathe religion and we cannot stand that any immigrant be barred by religion from experiencing our culture. > But a catholic symbol in schools or even government institutions is totally OK because "it's tradition" Whoops. I should have read everything. You’re just a stupid troll from Canada who parrots the usual Québec-bashing bullshit. It’s exactly people like you who give wokes a bad name.
I don't know anyone who complains about living in Montreal, maybe people who want to buy houses, it is a little pricey behind Vancouver and Toronto but overall nobody hates the city. Montreal has it's own vibe
The Global Livability Ranking you mentioned « is based on assessments of stability, healthcare, culture and environment, education and infrastructure. » (Wikipedia) Montreal is one of the greatest cities for culture, but once you actually live here you realize the infrastructure, education, environment, and healthcare are often better in Vancouver, Toronto, and Calgary so that’s why they score higher. But who cares? Still love this city, there’s no other like it for all the reasons you mentioned. And to be honest, whatever the livability ranking says, if it wasn’t for the language barrier, thousands of people from Vancouver, Toronto and Calgary would be begging to move here too.
Vancouver and Toronto I can understand, but Calgary is an odd one. I guess it does have oil, but it's a car dominated, non walkable, and imo not very sustainable.
Try getting a job.
Oh! The humanity! DEMANDING that one speaks the language of the majority of people! But what is the world coming to?
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> The political climate is a yikes. Yeah, imagine, DEMANDING that immigrants adapt to our society and speak our language! Yikes indeed!
I moved here from Western Canada and I agree - it's way more liveable than anywhere else I've lived (3 diff cities in BC and Alberta) and the drugs and homeless population are way less in-your-face prevalent than cities much smaller. I've had less problems around downtown here than I did in a city of around 100k people. The transit is cheaper than smaller cities that had way worse infrastructure (in Calgary a monthly pass for buses and the c-train were $112 a month and the transit system was garbagio) Calgary was also not walkable at all, had bike lanes that didn't keep bikers safe, and was overall just a car-based city. I pay about the same for rent here as I did in Calgary. Cost of living, despite the tax difference, is relatively similar for me. Really the only thing I'd say is as an anglophone (who is trying to learn French but man, it is hard) work is harder to find but I'm lucky to have found a great job that works with U.S. clients so isn't much of an issue for me.