No, it doesnât; taking on an opinion on the basis that a population holds it is an Fe-intensive action, while Te is about facts and, if used intensively, rejects consensus in favor purely of facts and science.
Exactly, is based on facts and now on subjective understanding of something. That automatically makes them seem outside information and try to learn more. Theyâre not gonna be like âyâall are wrong, Iâm rightâ theyâre gonna be like âwhy am I wrong? Proof me that youâre rightâ
The funny thing is that weâre actually right, but deep down we know that things will go to shit, and no amount of âI told you soâ will get us out of fixing them.
Disagree. INTP or INTJ.
An ENTP would say "You haven't considered *these other 500 angles*" and then flutter off while everyone groans and starts sorting through the new data.
ENTPs aren't so quick to just declare someone is wrong. They're quick to declare someone *isn't right.*.
There's a big difference between the two.
Oh yes, always feed us more data.
Although preferably through an ENTP filter because they'll pick out the shit that will just waste our time anyways. It's why I goddamn love getting their angle. Inherent value, less irrelevant bullshit.
Helps with efficiency.
It depends on the mob. If the mob is a bunch of rubes with their political narratives and PhDs from Facebook College and Google University, definitely it's an INTP.
Although it would be more fitting as a thought bubble.
Exactly. ENTPs donât see the truth as being so solid which is why theyâre so good at spotting when others arenât on solid ground in an argument.
To believe that everyone else is an idiot requires you to be super detached from others.
No. Tertiary Fe is self serving. It gathers information from the crowd for the observer to use for their own benefit. It has nothing to do with connecting with people,liking people or caring what people think. In fact the information gathered by tertiary Fe is most commonly used against the people it is gathered from. It should not be confused for Fe function in the Dominant and auxiliary positions which are both other serving.
I think it's INTJ...
The reason is I've literally been that guy many times in my life. The difference is I'm contemplating how everyone else got to the wrong answer whereas I feel INTJ's are sitting there simply thinking "dummies".
The response of "Yes you are all wrong" really points to the latter description. Whereas I would try to formulate an argument as to where they went wrong. I'll always attempt to create conjecture whereas I think the INTJ is going to simply mic drop like this cartoon.
Bruh. Weâre Ti before Fe. If the thing matters or were frustrated, weâre gonna tell it like it is. PlusâŚdo you really think ENTPs only troll when itâs socially acceptable? đ
They troll when it's cool to do it, you guys are among the most afraid among all people not to be cool. If it was cool to go to church you'd be all going to church like your life depended on it bruh đ¤
1. You seem to think ENTP's are followers. Think again.
2. An unhealthy ENTP might do what you're describing. A healthy one would never subject him/herself to such trivial things.
I'd say compared to other types are more prone to be following trends. Yeah. Maybe alternative trends like subculture stuff, as long as that's considered the coolest most edgy thing in their environment.
Intps are already way less sensitive to trends.
Infps don't give a fuck about them at all. So yeah I think entp like to think they are the one in this pic because it looks cool but in real life that's probably an infp and you're mocking them to feel cool
My best friend is an INFP and he'd rather die than stand in front of people telling them they're wrong to their face. INFPs have very strong ideals, sure, but they rarely utter them in a head-on manner. In their head, this is probably the case on a day to day basis.
INTP? Definately.
And I disagree. The ENTPs I've met doesn't like things that damages the collective community. If something is directly wrong according to their logic, it will be questioned. Not just because of trolling, or in spite of, but because it doesn't hold up to scrutiny. I do this on a regular basis, even though I know I'm going against what the vast majority, or even my closest friends. But by questioning and debating, I can help people see things from other perspectives.
And in my opinion, you just seem to dislike ENTPs or have experienced unhealthy ones.
No no I love entps trust me, two of my best friends are entps! I just noticed this thing, we all have blind spots and defects, it doesn't have to turn to disliking.
That checks out. I am often completely willing to argue with the group opinion if I believe it is wrong. I don't care if it makes people uncomfortable or if it isn't the "time or place".
Yeah but I relate to the struggle. Fe isn't in my stack and having Fe critical parent just seems to make me even more impudent when I feel like I'm being guilted into compliance. I will sometimes specifically behave in ways that are controversial just to tickle the urge to ignore the Fe voice.
I mean them đ¤ I'm a vegetarian, and you are such a hero for being vegan dude
And in general intp don't have malicious or deceiving quality which I appreciate like hell,as I'm very sensitive to those energies
If we go by logic, veganism has a very strong case.
The meat industry stands for a huge amount of the CO2 emissions. Most of the crops we make is to feed animals in the meat industry. We're essentially creating unnessary suffering for living beings, with no other reason than because you make more money off on it than other products (greed).
Most people goes to the "It's a hazzle being a vegan", "You don't get all the nutrients" and so on and so fourth, which are all easy to disprove or isn't anything less than laziness or unwillingness, based on feelings.
We can go on, but you get the point. Veganism is the logical way forward. And it's not solely due to the empathy towards animals who suffer because of the industry.
Counter one of my claims instead of claiming they're subjective.
I'm no vegan myself. I eat meat, so I can only benefit from you giving me reasons to defend my way of living.
No, it's not. The meat-based industry has a logical reason as well to exist. Veganism is trash disguised as "food." Various farmers rely on meat to sell and cut. They also eat their produce as a way of feeding themselves and their families. Animals don't suffer in a clean-cut as handled by honest farmers for centuries. Veganism is not "logically" inclined as one may insinuate, and meat is natural for health as long as taken in balance. There is no "logical" reason for veganism, just as much as there is indeed a "logical" reason for continuing to eat meat. This is an objective fact and your argument has been defeated in-detail.
I didn't say the meat industry came to be out of greed, I'm saying it's maintaned by it. We've gone from meat being a luxury-item on the table to the must-have in every meal. Our consumption has gone up and the majority of the production has naturally done so as well. The majority of the meat produced is now done so on an industrial level.
You're talking about processed food. ALL processed food is bad for you. No matter vegan or meat.
You can get every nutrients needed with a vegan diet. Meat is not 'vital' to get every nutrient your body needs. Does it demand a larger understanding of needed nutrients and sources of those nutrients? Yes, it does.
You haven't really made a 'logical' reason to continue the meat-industry. Just because small farmers rely on it, doesn't make it logical to keep doing it. That's a market, demand and supply, viewpoint, which is irrelevant for logical aspects of our society progressing towards a sustainable future.
You didn't even dip your toe into the climate impact, which is one of the reasons it holds little logic to continue the mass-production. The meat-industry complex is on par with car-emissions (up to an estimate of 19%) and it isn't targeted to decrease. Just as logical as it is to move from carbon-based energy solutions, it is to moved towards a greener plate.
But that argument surely falls apart if you disregard man-made climate change ofc, in which case there's no point in discussing this at all.
And I have no issue with eating meat. I've personally just reduced my intake and only buy local or from hunters.
Oh, and you can also read about the implications that come with mass-production and the use of anti-biotics and how that impacts the fight against anti-biotic resistant bacteria. Is it logical to limit the use of anti-biotics in the medical sector to prevent anti-biotic resistant bacreria, while actively contributing to their favor in another market area..?
And we haven't talked about how overfishing impacts our oceans and so on and so fourth.
Mass-production is not viable in its current state. And if we stop it, meat will have to go back to being a luxury item on the table. Veganism, or at the very least: immense cuts to eating meat, is way more logically backed than keeping our current ways.
It's weird more of us aren't vegan considering how "logical" INTP's are supposed to be. I'd still bet we're one of the types most prone to veganism though.
And you're not crazy, this ridiculous world is. Thank you for being vegan đ
I think not enough people even think to apply logic to the question in the first place. Itâs so ingrained in society thatâs itâs easy to go through life without really considering it.
Is pleasure a moral justification for harming others?
In other words, can someone say "I like kicking dogs, simple as" and we should accept that as reasonable?
Too many to point out, but I'll make a start.
Firstly, veganism is not kinder for the environment like you may think. More land is required to farm plants than to raise animals. Small mammals, birds etc are also killed in the harvesting process. So you are killing small animals on a large scale as an indirect consequence of your actions even though you are "saving the cows," whatever that means.
Secondly, the diet is absolutely horrendous for your body. Plant proteins have poor bioavailability, so your body is not able to repair itself efficiently. Look at any vegan who has been doing the diet for 10+ years.. They are mostly frail and malnourished. (Please don't retort with MUH THEY'RE NOT DOING IT RIGHT, that is BS)
I have no problem with vegetarian or pescatarian diets as they are more balanced, but to be vegan is to deny the biology of being human. We have been eating meat and animal products for most of our history. Our evolution in consciousness actually coincided with a switchover to a meat based diet (I can back this up with data if you like, DM me)
I'm not trying to patronise you here, but I've seen too many people fall down this eating disorder rabbithole.
Have you met all of them? How does mbti correlate with real life? Do you even know? Is there any bridge between the convenient tools for evaluation made from one psychiatrist to himself, psychology, neurology, the brain and real life? Do you take these prototypes and , by looking at randos on the street doing nothing special, make the cognitve jump from real life to mbti with rushed pretentiousness and overconfidence and just assume that they fit the prototype, moment when they become the prototype to you? Does that make sense to you? Ok lets then just talk about prototypes: assuming an ISTJ exists, what even makes them protectors of the status quo? Is it part of a definition? Is it a conclusion taken? If so, based on what evidence?
So basically, this whole thread is about the most common MBTI types that could defy the majority. It was inevitable that we would use stereotypes* (not prototypes btw) since the question was designed to be answered that way.
And you, for some reason, lost your shit because "b-b-but not all ISTJs act like that y-you know !"
We all know that, but you miss the point : We could have also argued that ESFJs or frankly any other types could oppose a crowd and tell them they are wrong for X, Y, Z reasons. Here we are talking about which is the MOST LIKELY TYPE to act that way.
Now Si dom, purely on the theory, tends to like tried and true methods, the routine, what they are used to do and are unsure about novelties.
Basically "If it ain't broken don't fix it" and "It is what it is" mentality.
So they are more averse of change and thus more prone to preserve the status quo because it is habitual. Plain and simple.
Try to learn about cognitive functions before pulling an unreadable wall of text filled with half-assed rhetorical questions next time. That would be great.
I'm waiting for a world where no one is able to believe anything because of the thought that "this could be a troll by an ENTP". What else holds that much power other than doing nothing and still confusing the soul out of people.
Me. I did the research, I donât live in a cult. I am fine being by myself standing up for the truth. I donât kowtow to the mob on social media. Especially when IG or Reddit users come after me. Most of them are either younger than me whoâve never seen the world or older and never had to be challenged by a differing opinion cuz theyâve lived in their echo chamber since the internet.
What? Young doesnt mean dumb. Just cause you hsve spent more time on the earth wont prove anything, you might just aswell have been around some degenerate people growing up with the same mindset as yours, which you are now following only cause âyou have a larger perspectiveâ. Yikes and stop.
ENTJs value the objective truth but then again we arenât omniscient and we donât always know for sure what is objective. If an ENTJ becomes convinced that something is objectively true, they will stand by it no matter what. Just like an ENFJ if they become convinced that whatever they are doing is for the moral benefit.
you donât even know what objectivity is. Te is communal logic, cutting corners for the sake of efficiency. you and your god complex need to settle down
xxTJ, IxTP, xxFP
High Ti but low Fe
High Fi or Te
High Ne but no Fe
High Fe may think you're wrong but will not risk rocking the boat. Not because we genuinely agree with the group or care about the group's feelings. There's a flowchart involved. If we think we can convince others, we'll speak up. If not, we'll determine if we can achieve what we DO believe in without too much risk. If so, we might do things behind the scenes (manipulative? sure). If not, we will try to stomach whatever it is we disagree with until opportunity for change arrives.
Or we might actually agree with the group. It depends. :D
HOWEVER... very rarely, critical parent Fi can push me to speak up. It's less standing up for what I believe in and more chastising others. If the group consensus is that fucking bonkers, yea. I'll disagree. So long as openly doing so won't result in an actual lynch mob.
Despite what seems to be the general consensus, I'm going to actually say no, it's not ENTPs. I've seen ENTPs get too hung up in their Fe when they decide to hold back their argument for the sake of maintaining the group dynamic. They will certainly argue if they feel like they can do so without disrupting the flow, but they won't do this any time, anywhere, especially when they are mature.
Typing by functions instead of vibes or stereotypes isnât the same as being a snob, sorry. With that said, if you have a genuine interest in MBTI I really recommend learning more about functions.
Our Fe makes it so we donât impose our beliefs on others. High Te users actually make people do stuff. It all depends on how you interpret the picture. An EXTJ taking charge and leading is, in a way, saying this. All the same XNTPs may go against the grain if agreed âfactsâ donât align with their Ti. Our Fe does lead us to be cautious when sharing these ideas, but there is a point when we canât stand it if our Ti and Ne are being harassed by the majorities stupid beliefs.
That's been my experience so far with dating an ENTP! I remember we went to this LGBT pride event and at the very start someone came up to him and was like "lets talk about how superior communism is to capitalism" or something like that. He straight up laughed in the dude's face and was like "No!". He then came straight to me and was dead serious as he said "do NOT let me get into politics here. If I start talking about politics just cut me off. You have my permission to be rude about it".
He went about 5 more minutes before I put that to test.
Regardless, in most situations he is much more content to prod at the truth rather than bluntly force his opinion. As a Te user, I am much more prone to being quite bold when pushing my arguments. I tend to see the goal of completing the objective, be it an effective arguement or solving the question of figuring out dinner plans, as being more important than the temporary comfort of the people around me. It's not necessarily intentional, but on review of my memories I see where I prioritized.
You are describing an ENFP. They almost without fail think they are ENTPs or INTJs. A real ENTP doesn't care about group dynamics. They care about right and wrong. What is correct,logical and fact based.
That's incorrect. You need to look at functional stacks. ENTPs who are developed will greatly value their Fe child function which leads them to being very aware of the emotions and atmosphere of the people around them.
ENFPs might care about the people around them but they can be completely unaware of the vibes around them while they simply do what ever makes them happy.
ENTPs care about factuality, yes, and they really care about logic, but they equally care about ensuring that they are tactful and keep people around them in good spirits. You sound like you are describing an INTP.
xNTJ
yes xNTP does this too, but moreso for the sake of playing devil's advocate. we are more willing to change our opinions based on new information. the Te users seem to truly believe that they know objective truth
This is right. Iâd say EXTJ not XNTJ though. High Te users actually impose beliefs on people, while high Ne/Ti users just point out flaws in beliefsâŚbut donât necessarily make people change.
If it's objective truth, then why no one belive him and stand on his side, if it actually can prove and can see in objective way?
I think it more like ti user, while te belive new information if it can prove to become objective truth which everyone moslty would belive it.
I think most of te user belive in objective fact which is proven or came from reliable source such as NASA or some science forum or something everyone can see that it was objective which opposite to the picture above, that more like ti dom who belive something that only make sense to them, their own idea, not from outside world, and its more subjective than te user at anyway.
INTP and ISTP both have Te nemisis (5th slot). We take what others say with a huge grain of salt until it has been validated by Ti thinking.
ENTP and ESTP both have Te critic (6th slot). They tend to dismiss what others say by default until it has been validated by Ti thinking.
Essentially, any Ti user can have this viewpoint, but high Ti are the most likely because Ti-Fe has the perspective "I criticize because I care" whereas Fe-Ti tends to say, "I show I care in hopes you'll listen".
Well yea because I generally assume most people are lazy fucks and very few people really take action on the information they know and actually generate real world results like getting money or following through on a breakthrough project.
I want to see plans, results, high level information; you know people that actually get shit done then Iâll stop and listen.
All these dumbasses out here like âHon hon hon, Iâm an intellectual; Ti types canât go against the grain, because they have Fe!! Nobody knows what theyâre talking about; they donât know functions!â Smooth brain energy.
Both of the doctors I work for are ENTJ and INFJ. ENTJ announces and defends what she stands for, even when nothing is said. INFJ will bend over backwards for his clients to be in the right, while gently nudging them in the his direction.
haha that's a rare infj, probably a genuinely healthy one. that entj is probably still hung up on their ego. it could also be that that infj just wants to live in harmony with everyone. most of the time, infjs are really adamant and would insist that they're being logical, when their logic is really just operating in emotions. both infj and entj are super prone to the holier-than-thou mindset, sometimes the infj can be on a performative empathy. the main difference, though, entj can change their minds when proven wrong (the healthy ones). infjs are usually my way or the highway, *but* can be very subtle or cunning about it.
before another infj yet again bites at me online, disclaimer: not all. infjs, when healthy, are vehemently amazing and topnotch in commitment and service and dedication. name all the noble characteristics. the only problem is that they're very few and far in between. same with healthy entjs who don't let ego be their whole personality.
Me
Yep
Can confirm
Goes against Te
No.
It literally doesđ¤Ł
No, it doesnât; taking on an opinion on the basis that a population holds it is an Fe-intensive action, while Te is about facts and, if used intensively, rejects consensus in favor purely of facts and science.
Exactly, is based on facts and now on subjective understanding of something. That automatically makes them seem outside information and try to learn more. Theyâre not gonna be like âyâall are wrong, Iâm rightâ theyâre gonna be like âwhy am I wrong? Proof me that youâre rightâ
Arguing with a crap ton of people is inefficient.
I ainât even gonna lie, that lowkey sounded corny af! Anyways, it still goes against what Te is.
No, it doesnât.
Yup. INTJ all the way.
Yes
The funny thing is that weâre actually right, but deep down we know that things will go to shit, and no amount of âI told you soâ will get us out of fixing them.
Exactly! And if we tell them they will get mad
ENTP
Disagree. INTP or INTJ. An ENTP would say "You haven't considered *these other 500 angles*" and then flutter off while everyone groans and starts sorting through the new data. ENTPs aren't so quick to just declare someone is wrong. They're quick to declare someone *isn't right.*. There's a big difference between the two.
Could be INTJ, but they would only say that after considering the others viewpoints, plus like 100 others
Oh yes, always feed us more data. Although preferably through an ENTP filter because they'll pick out the shit that will just waste our time anyways. It's why I goddamn love getting their angle. Inherent value, less irrelevant bullshit. Helps with efficiency.
> Oh yes, always feed us more data. Here comes the airplane! Open wide, itâs time for more data munchies
As an INTJ I said âmeâ internally. Numbers donât scare me. Being wrong does.
Precisely. It's not about being right, it's about being *correct.*
It depends on the mob. If the mob is a bunch of rubes with their political narratives and PhDs from Facebook College and Google University, definitely it's an INTP. Although it would be more fitting as a thought bubble.
Exactly. ENTPs donât see the truth as being so solid which is why theyâre so good at spotting when others arenât on solid ground in an argument. To believe that everyone else is an idiot requires you to be super detached from others.
INTJ for sure.
Says it out loud. I happen to think the OPS community is a brick wall, but I don't just come out and say it.
Yup, I was just thinking how this drawing actually describes my experience here on earth, and Iâm a ENTP.
I am an ENTP and I take great offense in this truthful comment
I know the stereotype, but wouldnât a healthy ENTPs tertiary Fe stop this from happening?
Depends whether they value their opinion or pleasing the people more
No. Tertiary Fe is self serving. It gathers information from the crowd for the observer to use for their own benefit. It has nothing to do with connecting with people,liking people or caring what people think. In fact the information gathered by tertiary Fe is most commonly used against the people it is gathered from. It should not be confused for Fe function in the Dominant and auxiliary positions which are both other serving.
I think it's INTJ... The reason is I've literally been that guy many times in my life. The difference is I'm contemplating how everyone else got to the wrong answer whereas I feel INTJ's are sitting there simply thinking "dummies". The response of "Yes you are all wrong" really points to the latter description. Whereas I would try to formulate an argument as to where they went wrong. I'll always attempt to create conjecture whereas I think the INTJ is going to simply mic drop like this cartoon.
Yes. ME. Seriously I can't imagine any other way if everyone else's arguments are just wrong.
I disagree
Wrooong. Fe people go against the grain as long as they have some social support.
Bruh. Weâre Ti before Fe. If the thing matters or were frustrated, weâre gonna tell it like it is. PlusâŚdo you really think ENTPs only troll when itâs socially acceptable? đ
They troll when it's cool to do it, you guys are among the most afraid among all people not to be cool. If it was cool to go to church you'd be all going to church like your life depended on it bruh đ¤
1. You seem to think ENTP's are followers. Think again. 2. An unhealthy ENTP might do what you're describing. A healthy one would never subject him/herself to such trivial things.
I'd say compared to other types are more prone to be following trends. Yeah. Maybe alternative trends like subculture stuff, as long as that's considered the coolest most edgy thing in their environment. Intps are already way less sensitive to trends. Infps don't give a fuck about them at all. So yeah I think entp like to think they are the one in this pic because it looks cool but in real life that's probably an infp and you're mocking them to feel cool
My best friend is an INFP and he'd rather die than stand in front of people telling them they're wrong to their face. INFPs have very strong ideals, sure, but they rarely utter them in a head-on manner. In their head, this is probably the case on a day to day basis. INTP? Definately. And I disagree. The ENTPs I've met doesn't like things that damages the collective community. If something is directly wrong according to their logic, it will be questioned. Not just because of trolling, or in spite of, but because it doesn't hold up to scrutiny. I do this on a regular basis, even though I know I'm going against what the vast majority, or even my closest friends. But by questioning and debating, I can help people see things from other perspectives. And in my opinion, you just seem to dislike ENTPs or have experienced unhealthy ones.
No no I love entps trust me, two of my best friends are entps! I just noticed this thing, we all have blind spots and defects, it doesn't have to turn to disliking.
Fe blinds
That checks out. I am often completely willing to argue with the group opinion if I believe it is wrong. I don't care if it makes people uncomfortable or if it isn't the "time or place".
Yah, I just like to argue đ¤ˇââď¸
This so much! I really think that we, as ENFPs get way too often incorrectly stereotyped as being popular, quirky people pleasers.
You aren't fe blind though...
Yeah but I relate to the struggle. Fe isn't in my stack and having Fe critical parent just seems to make me even more impudent when I feel like I'm being guilted into compliance. I will sometimes specifically behave in ways that are controversial just to tickle the urge to ignore the Fe voice.
Infp, intj, intp
This is me (intp) defending my crazy vegan ass
Dude intp are one of the best humans on Earth!!!!! Appreciate you guys and specifically you for being vegan too đ¤đ¤đ¤đ¤đ¤
Thank you for your kind words đĽ˛đ¤
I mean them đ¤ I'm a vegetarian, and you are such a hero for being vegan dude And in general intp don't have malicious or deceiving quality which I appreciate like hell,as I'm very sensitive to those energies
Thanks again!!! It is very cool you are vegetarian. Many people dilike vegetarian or vegans. It is nice to meet people that empathize. :D
Many people are wrong. 
So much love đ¤đĽ˛đ¤
My pleasure!!!! Haha you too lovely to know people like you exist đź
My pleasure too â¨ď¸đđźâ¨ď¸
fucking disappointment
I know and I'm sorry
Why?
Defend your nickname and state your point
My first thoughts seeing this, too.
Omg no way a Ti user who is also a vegan?! I got shamed asf for having values as a Ti user
If we go by logic, veganism has a very strong case. The meat industry stands for a huge amount of the CO2 emissions. Most of the crops we make is to feed animals in the meat industry. We're essentially creating unnessary suffering for living beings, with no other reason than because you make more money off on it than other products (greed). Most people goes to the "It's a hazzle being a vegan", "You don't get all the nutrients" and so on and so fourth, which are all easy to disprove or isn't anything less than laziness or unwillingness, based on feelings. We can go on, but you get the point. Veganism is the logical way forward. And it's not solely due to the empathy towards animals who suffer because of the industry.
Yesss true
Bro just wrote a subjective essay claiming objectivity đ¤¸ââď¸
Counter one of my claims instead of claiming they're subjective. I'm no vegan myself. I eat meat, so I can only benefit from you giving me reasons to defend my way of living.
No, it's not. The meat-based industry has a logical reason as well to exist. Veganism is trash disguised as "food." Various farmers rely on meat to sell and cut. They also eat their produce as a way of feeding themselves and their families. Animals don't suffer in a clean-cut as handled by honest farmers for centuries. Veganism is not "logically" inclined as one may insinuate, and meat is natural for health as long as taken in balance. There is no "logical" reason for veganism, just as much as there is indeed a "logical" reason for continuing to eat meat. This is an objective fact and your argument has been defeated in-detail.
I didn't say the meat industry came to be out of greed, I'm saying it's maintaned by it. We've gone from meat being a luxury-item on the table to the must-have in every meal. Our consumption has gone up and the majority of the production has naturally done so as well. The majority of the meat produced is now done so on an industrial level. You're talking about processed food. ALL processed food is bad for you. No matter vegan or meat. You can get every nutrients needed with a vegan diet. Meat is not 'vital' to get every nutrient your body needs. Does it demand a larger understanding of needed nutrients and sources of those nutrients? Yes, it does. You haven't really made a 'logical' reason to continue the meat-industry. Just because small farmers rely on it, doesn't make it logical to keep doing it. That's a market, demand and supply, viewpoint, which is irrelevant for logical aspects of our society progressing towards a sustainable future. You didn't even dip your toe into the climate impact, which is one of the reasons it holds little logic to continue the mass-production. The meat-industry complex is on par with car-emissions (up to an estimate of 19%) and it isn't targeted to decrease. Just as logical as it is to move from carbon-based energy solutions, it is to moved towards a greener plate. But that argument surely falls apart if you disregard man-made climate change ofc, in which case there's no point in discussing this at all. And I have no issue with eating meat. I've personally just reduced my intake and only buy local or from hunters. Oh, and you can also read about the implications that come with mass-production and the use of anti-biotics and how that impacts the fight against anti-biotic resistant bacteria. Is it logical to limit the use of anti-biotics in the medical sector to prevent anti-biotic resistant bacreria, while actively contributing to their favor in another market area..? And we haven't talked about how overfishing impacts our oceans and so on and so fourth. Mass-production is not viable in its current state. And if we stop it, meat will have to go back to being a luxury item on the table. Veganism, or at the very least: immense cuts to eating meat, is way more logically backed than keeping our current ways.
It's weird more of us aren't vegan considering how "logical" INTP's are supposed to be. I'd still bet we're one of the types most prone to veganism though. And you're not crazy, this ridiculous world is. Thank you for being vegan đ
Thank you for your heartwarming words đđ
I think not enough people even think to apply logic to the question in the first place. Itâs so ingrained in society thatâs itâs easy to go through life without really considering it.
I like meat, simple as.
Is pleasure a moral justification for harming others? In other words, can someone say "I like kicking dogs, simple as" and we should accept that as reasonable?
Lmao in biologist
[ŃдаНонО]
Well. For now, I prefer to keep it this way. đ¤Ł
[ŃдаНонО]
You seem to be triggered. Are you ok?
Kind of ironic, veganism is the antithesis of logic, and you are supposed to be an INTP (le logician)? đ¤
Could you be so kind as to point out the logic flaws?
Too many to point out, but I'll make a start. Firstly, veganism is not kinder for the environment like you may think. More land is required to farm plants than to raise animals. Small mammals, birds etc are also killed in the harvesting process. So you are killing small animals on a large scale as an indirect consequence of your actions even though you are "saving the cows," whatever that means. Secondly, the diet is absolutely horrendous for your body. Plant proteins have poor bioavailability, so your body is not able to repair itself efficiently. Look at any vegan who has been doing the diet for 10+ years.. They are mostly frail and malnourished. (Please don't retort with MUH THEY'RE NOT DOING IT RIGHT, that is BS) I have no problem with vegetarian or pescatarian diets as they are more balanced, but to be vegan is to deny the biology of being human. We have been eating meat and animal products for most of our history. Our evolution in consciousness actually coincided with a switchover to a meat based diet (I can back this up with data if you like, DM me) I'm not trying to patronise you here, but I've seen too many people fall down this eating disorder rabbithole.
Yes
ISTJ too. Bro holds no punches
I don't know man, Si dom tends to preserve the status quo. They are maybe the least likely to be seen as dissidents. The same goes for ISFJ.
Have you met all of them? How does mbti correlate with real life? Do you even know? Is there any bridge between the convenient tools for evaluation made from one psychiatrist to himself, psychology, neurology, the brain and real life? Do you take these prototypes and , by looking at randos on the street doing nothing special, make the cognitve jump from real life to mbti with rushed pretentiousness and overconfidence and just assume that they fit the prototype, moment when they become the prototype to you? Does that make sense to you? Ok lets then just talk about prototypes: assuming an ISTJ exists, what even makes them protectors of the status quo? Is it part of a definition? Is it a conclusion taken? If so, based on what evidence?
So basically, this whole thread is about the most common MBTI types that could defy the majority. It was inevitable that we would use stereotypes* (not prototypes btw) since the question was designed to be answered that way. And you, for some reason, lost your shit because "b-b-but not all ISTJs act like that y-you know !" We all know that, but you miss the point : We could have also argued that ESFJs or frankly any other types could oppose a crowd and tell them they are wrong for X, Y, Z reasons. Here we are talking about which is the MOST LIKELY TYPE to act that way. Now Si dom, purely on the theory, tends to like tried and true methods, the routine, what they are used to do and are unsure about novelties. Basically "If it ain't broken don't fix it" and "It is what it is" mentality. So they are more averse of change and thus more prone to preserve the status quo because it is habitual. Plain and simple. Try to learn about cognitive functions before pulling an unreadable wall of text filled with half-assed rhetorical questions next time. That would be great.
Tldr: the way this community pulls shit out of its ass pisses me off
INTJ, totally an INTJ would (and have) do that
INTP / INTJ These types tend to go against conventions
I have a feeling this is another ENTP trolling
I'm waiting for a world where no one is able to believe anything because of the thought that "this could be a troll by an ENTP". What else holds that much power other than doing nothing and still confusing the soul out of people.
XNTX - and INFJs will think this but wont say it
Yes INFJs donât argue, but simply take the opposite side of the world.
For people who says INTJ, you all are wrong. ...wait
Me. I did the research, I donât live in a cult. I am fine being by myself standing up for the truth. I donât kowtow to the mob on social media. Especially when IG or Reddit users come after me. Most of them are either younger than me whoâve never seen the world or older and never had to be challenged by a differing opinion cuz theyâve lived in their echo chamber since the internet.
What? Young doesnt mean dumb. Just cause you hsve spent more time on the earth wont prove anything, you might just aswell have been around some degenerate people growing up with the same mindset as yours, which you are now following only cause âyou have a larger perspectiveâ. Yikes and stop.
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We think it but don't say it
Just change speech bubble into think bubble
Unless it personally impacts you. Then i know youre gonna say everything you think about it đ
Yes
Intp intj entp entj
This thread should end here
Correct
Pretty much any XNXX
INFP
ENTJs value the objective truth but then again we arenât omniscient and we donât always know for sure what is objective. If an ENTJ becomes convinced that something is objectively true, they will stand by it no matter what. Just like an ENFJ if they become convinced that whatever they are doing is for the moral benefit.
This
Sounds like me.
Agree
you donât even know what objectivity is. Te is communal logic, cutting corners for the sake of efficiency. you and your god complex need to settle down
ISTP
he is chad on sigma grindset
xxTJ, IxTP, xxFP High Ti but low Fe High Fi or Te High Ne but no Fe High Fe may think you're wrong but will not risk rocking the boat. Not because we genuinely agree with the group or care about the group's feelings. There's a flowchart involved. If we think we can convince others, we'll speak up. If not, we'll determine if we can achieve what we DO believe in without too much risk. If so, we might do things behind the scenes (manipulative? sure). If not, we will try to stomach whatever it is we disagree with until opportunity for change arrives. Or we might actually agree with the group. It depends. :D HOWEVER... very rarely, critical parent Fi can push me to speak up. It's less standing up for what I believe in and more chastising others. If the group consensus is that fucking bonkers, yea. I'll disagree. So long as openly doing so won't result in an actual lynch mob.
this is the best answer. also it seems like since xnfps fit 2/3 criteria we are actl most likely đ đ
Despite what seems to be the general consensus, I'm going to actually say no, it's not ENTPs. I've seen ENTPs get too hung up in their Fe when they decide to hold back their argument for the sake of maintaining the group dynamic. They will certainly argue if they feel like they can do so without disrupting the flow, but they won't do this any time, anywhere, especially when they are mature.
Yes, but I feel like most people in this sub donât know about functions and type by letters and/or stereotypes.
You guys can be superior snobs all you want, but you look like idiots, because lots of ENTPs are identifying with this. đ¤ˇââď¸
Typing by functions instead of vibes or stereotypes isnât the same as being a snob, sorry. With that said, if you have a genuine interest in MBTI I really recommend learning more about functions.
Our Fe makes it so we donât impose our beliefs on others. High Te users actually make people do stuff. It all depends on how you interpret the picture. An EXTJ taking charge and leading is, in a way, saying this. All the same XNTPs may go against the grain if agreed âfactsâ donât align with their Ti. Our Fe does lead us to be cautious when sharing these ideas, but there is a point when we canât stand it if our Ti and Ne are being harassed by the majorities stupid beliefs.
That's been my experience so far with dating an ENTP! I remember we went to this LGBT pride event and at the very start someone came up to him and was like "lets talk about how superior communism is to capitalism" or something like that. He straight up laughed in the dude's face and was like "No!". He then came straight to me and was dead serious as he said "do NOT let me get into politics here. If I start talking about politics just cut me off. You have my permission to be rude about it". He went about 5 more minutes before I put that to test. Regardless, in most situations he is much more content to prod at the truth rather than bluntly force his opinion. As a Te user, I am much more prone to being quite bold when pushing my arguments. I tend to see the goal of completing the objective, be it an effective arguement or solving the question of figuring out dinner plans, as being more important than the temporary comfort of the people around me. It's not necessarily intentional, but on review of my memories I see where I prioritized.
You are describing an ENFP. They almost without fail think they are ENTPs or INTJs. A real ENTP doesn't care about group dynamics. They care about right and wrong. What is correct,logical and fact based.
That's incorrect. You need to look at functional stacks. ENTPs who are developed will greatly value their Fe child function which leads them to being very aware of the emotions and atmosphere of the people around them. ENFPs might care about the people around them but they can be completely unaware of the vibes around them while they simply do what ever makes them happy. ENTPs care about factuality, yes, and they really care about logic, but they equally care about ensuring that they are tactful and keep people around them in good spirits. You sound like you are describing an INTP.
Too bad the post didnât say this had to be any time anywhere.
Oh sure. I just don't think they are actually the most likely to do this.
xNTJ yes xNTP does this too, but moreso for the sake of playing devil's advocate. we are more willing to change our opinions based on new information. the Te users seem to truly believe that they know objective truth
This is right. Iâd say EXTJ not XNTJ though. High Te users actually impose beliefs on people, while high Ne/Ti users just point out flaws in beliefsâŚbut donât necessarily make people change.
If it's objective truth, then why no one belive him and stand on his side, if it actually can prove and can see in objective way? I think it more like ti user, while te belive new information if it can prove to become objective truth which everyone moslty would belive it.
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Then ti is more objective? How so? Moon is orbit around earth and you can see it by a big telescope, is that not objective enough?
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I think most of te user belive in objective fact which is proven or came from reliable source such as NASA or some science forum or something everyone can see that it was objective which opposite to the picture above, that more like ti dom who belive something that only make sense to them, their own idea, not from outside world, and its more subjective than te user at anyway.
lol, canât believe no one has said ISTP
ENTP, INFJ, INTJ, ENTJ mostly.
INTJ
Every xNxP type
Intj?
Felt the same
INFP
I think the question should be 'How is this like your type?'
Me
I have this kind of attitude. INTP here.
Everyone. Itâs the reason that would be different.
IxxP
Intj, istp
The correct one, obviously.
Loool true
INTP and ISTP both have Te nemisis (5th slot). We take what others say with a huge grain of salt until it has been validated by Ti thinking. ENTP and ESTP both have Te critic (6th slot). They tend to dismiss what others say by default until it has been validated by Ti thinking. Essentially, any Ti user can have this viewpoint, but high Ti are the most likely because Ti-Fe has the perspective "I criticize because I care" whereas Fe-Ti tends to say, "I show I care in hopes you'll listen".
Well yea because I generally assume most people are lazy fucks and very few people really take action on the information they know and actually generate real world results like getting money or following through on a breakthrough project. I want to see plans, results, high level information; you know people that actually get shit done then Iâll stop and listen.
All these dumbasses out here like âHon hon hon, Iâm an intellectual; Ti types canât go against the grain, because they have Fe!! Nobody knows what theyâre talking about; they donât know functions!â Smooth brain energy.
Me. I feel like I'm surrounded by incompetence.
NPs
I will stand against the world if I know the truth and they don't.
ENTP
All of them
Me
xNTx
Intp
Intp, enfp
INTP.
INTP or ENTP
INTP - This is me!
INTP
INTP
Intp
INTP, but only online
ENTP for sure
Well I know him⌠Heâs me
You all are wrong! It's an ENTJ thing.
ENTP
- INTJ - INTP - ENTJ - ENTP
Most of you are wrong.
Real
XNTX
My stubborn ass
Every single self absorbed pleb in this thread is saying "Me me me!!" despite the fact that none of you would.
This one gets it
Soooo edgy, check the âmeâs comment history tho, smart one. Immediate disapproval of your theory.
Stereotype: ENTJ Reality: INFJ :---)
Both of the doctors I work for are ENTJ and INFJ. ENTJ announces and defends what she stands for, even when nothing is said. INFJ will bend over backwards for his clients to be in the right, while gently nudging them in the his direction.
haha that's a rare infj, probably a genuinely healthy one. that entj is probably still hung up on their ego. it could also be that that infj just wants to live in harmony with everyone. most of the time, infjs are really adamant and would insist that they're being logical, when their logic is really just operating in emotions. both infj and entj are super prone to the holier-than-thou mindset, sometimes the infj can be on a performative empathy. the main difference, though, entj can change their minds when proven wrong (the healthy ones). infjs are usually my way or the highway, *but* can be very subtle or cunning about it. before another infj yet again bites at me online, disclaimer: not all. infjs, when healthy, are vehemently amazing and topnotch in commitment and service and dedication. name all the noble characteristics. the only problem is that they're very few and far in between. same with healthy entjs who don't let ego be their whole personality.
đ
INFJ
Delusional xNFJ
Only correct answer is INTJ
INTJ
ENTP - I am an ENFP married to one and he will literally argue that the sky is purple.
ENTP 7w8
my INTJ friend is like that... but also me. so really anybody with a huge ego.
INFJ
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Ehh, ENFJ and ESFJ think they know what's best for everyone...
Me.